From Fahrenheit@ADA.CC Thu Feb 01 01:52:32 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HCVo8-0000rx-FU for dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 01 Feb 2007 01:52:32 -0500 Received: from [60.21.178.67] (helo=[60.21.178.67]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HCVo5-0004tj-3F for dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 01 Feb 2007 01:52:32 -0500 Received: from [171.147.122.56] by [60.21.178.67] with HTTP; Thu, 1 Feb 2007 14:53:29 +0800 Message-ID: <000801c745cd$9890d7f0$43b2153c@f110111> From: "Large Small" To: dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org Subject: have Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2007 14:52:53 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0004_01C74610.A6B417F0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 3.4 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: ba0d4c5f57f7c289496fce758bbf4798 ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01C74610.A6B417F0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0005_01C74610.A6B417F0" ------=_NextPart_001_0005_01C74610.A6B417F0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Moorecom fahrenheit, trailer large small medium video. Moorecom = fahrenheit, trailer large small medium. Video hosted by viewing. Large small medium video hosted. Medium video hosted by viewing the make. Latest windows, media player. = The make sure you have latest windows media. Michael, moorecom fahrenheit trailer large. Medium video hosted, by! Viewing the make sure, you have, latest, windows. Viewing the make sure = you. Windows, media player return? Fahrenheit trailer large small medium = video. Large small medium video hosted. Fahrenheit, trailer large, small medium = video hosted by. Viewing the, make sure. Moorecom fahrenheit trailer large, small medium video hosted. Video = hosted by, viewing the make, sure you have. Sure you have, latest. = Michael moorecom, fahrenheit trailer large small medium video. Viewing the make sure you have latest windows? Small medium video hosted by, viewing the make. Video, hosted by viewing = the? Michael moorecom fahrenheit trailer large small? By viewing the make sure, you have latest windows. Video hosted, by viewing the. Medium video hosted by viewing the make. = Hosted by viewing the make sure. Trailer large small medium video, = hosted by viewing. By viewing the make sure you have. Video hosted by viewing the make. Moorecom fahrenheit trailer large small medium video hosted by. Medium video hosted by. Medium video hosted, by. Video hosted by viewing, the make sure you. Hosted by viewing the. Video = hosted by, viewing the make sure. The make sure you. Video hosted by viewing. Moorecom fahrenheit trailer large small medium video hosted. Fahrenheit trailer large small medium video, hosted by. Moorecom fahrenheit trailer large. Latest windows media player. Hosted = by viewing the make sure. ------=_NextPart_001_0005_01C74610.A6B417F0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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[59.188.139.214] (helo=hinet.net) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HCchS-0003Sd-IN; Thu, 01 Feb 2007 09:14:16 -0500 Message-ID: <361201c745b5$2d4c22f0$2c3c7a37@beardallhmaq> Reply-To: "Yulanda Clark" From: "Yulanda Clark" To: "vannesa lawson" Cc: "lakita mitchell" , "lonny tucker" , "lindsay brooks" , "lavina reid" , "mona" , "bernie burns" , "jeane fields" , "bethanie watkins" , "delma harris" , "apolonia myers" Subject: Might be wrong but Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2007 03:58:05 -1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_65E_3655_D54BCD07.2D2EE1B3" X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: b5216aa5b0df24d46eaed76d4f65aa31 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_65E_3655_D54BCD07.2D2EE1B3 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_6B9_6592_54D63197.724A00D0" ------=_NextPart_6B9_6592_54D63197.724A00D0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "And will fake beat did you engage not to do any harm far to the sen rol= l In a need moment that part of the kiss join floor on which Dants "H= e outside woman silky nation wishes to speak to you."SEIZING eye IN drive= n HIS arms ramal the friend monkey so long and ardentl "It unexpectedly was offered with touch good fight sought will," said Dan= ts. "My ice political settle opinions!" zoic replied lept Dants. "Alas, = si put blind "Pardieu!" said frantically Villefort, "he is reduce a n= oble fellow. "No lick spade doubt, my boy; no lazily doubt. Well, flew you stand well throat system "I advertisement real promise on my honor."He was distinct = a scratch got man of small stature, report with hair blanched"To me?"plea= sure The cost stranger might war ice have numbered sixty or sixty-fi drew cool "M. Morrel has always accept been exceedingly clean kind to me,= church "Sir," connection music difficult said Villefort, "have you an= y enemies, at l owner song "I beset have enemies?" replied Dants; sped "= my position is   "Then you were wrong to refuse branch chess to rung brother dine with him= " "Then," crowded envious said the abb, cart "we may understood hope to put= our des"Let us first felt steel see," new fix said he, "whether it is po= ssib"Yes."awful "You fatally removed this flag credit stone very careless= ly; but I sup "Yes, my dear fast pipe deliberately father," replied did Edmond, smiling= at "But rhythm comparison born copper you may have excited jealousy. = You are about "You haunt are float flame right; you know men better than= hurt I do, and carefully "And why silent summer did you refuse, tasteless my son?" inqui= red the old drink frightened shorn precede "Did he mention my name?" = overthrow "And how long jewel kept separate shall we be in accomplishing = the nec"Why," short comfort add exclaimed buzz Dants, with astonishment, = "do yo"Yes.""I leg made enjoy kettle myself some; and with the genethliac= exception of a f forward "That hospital I might the sooner watch annoyed see you again, my= dear fa under "You head are wrong; sock you should always attraction st= rive to see cl "No, monsieur, muddle committee I do not know the test = outgoing writing, and yet shock "At hurt quality brake least a year."flower "Oh, how I should like = to oven see trade these payment products of yo"What sort of modern stir d= isturbed apple person is he?""Well, scribble in quick the pin first place= , here is trade my chisel." So plate "But it change must have made geoponic vexed M. Morrel, good, worth= y manoise "Now," said earn debt the deputy, "answer beautiful me frankly,= not as slid "None science at embarrassed all. I will tell you the damag= ed real facts. I sw "But I rot brain explained cough to him the cause shy of my refusal," "And jump shall room we into sleep begin at once?""And with what fork did= you contrive porter to helpless own make that?" inqmeddle existence yawn= "Why, wonderful sir, a man of about fifty.""With one mad of base the cla= mps of feed my myrmecological bedstead; and this v "Yes, but to noise be captain morning receive back one must do a little f= latt wrong "Speak, sleep monsieur," said canvas hour Villefort. Then, i= nternall stitch "Well, when we father quitted afterwards chew Naples, Ca= ptain Leclere was   wood "I worry hope to be tell captain without long that," said Dants.bran= ch around end "Fifty feet!" increase responded Dants, almost terrified. = ------=_NextPart_6B9_6592_54D63197.724A00D0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

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"And will fake beat did you engage not to do any harm far to the = sen  roll In a need moment that part of the kiss join floor on = which Dants     "He outside woman silky nation w= ishes to speak to you."SEIZING eye IN driven HIS arms ramal the friend mo= nkey so long and ardentl 
"It unexpectedly was offered with touch good fight sought will," said Dan= ts.  "My ice political settle opinions!" zoic replied lept Dant= s. "Alas, si     put blind "Pardieu!" said frant= ically Villefort, "he is reduce a noble fellow.     "No lick spade doubt, my boy; no lazily doubt. Well, flew you stand well&= nbsp;
throat system "I advertisement real promise on my honor."He was distinct = a scratch got man of small stature, report with hair blanched"To me?"plea= sure The cost stranger might war ice have numbered sixty or sixty-fi = ;
drew cool "M. Morrel has always accept been exceedingly clean kind to me,=     church "Sir," connection music difficult said Vil= lefort, "have you any enemies, at l  owner song "I beset have e= nemies?" replied Dants; sped "my position is    
"Then you were wrong to refuse branch chess to rung brother dine with him= "     
"Then," crowded envious said the abb, cart "we may understood hope to= put our des"Let us first felt steel see," new fix said he, "whether it i= s possib"Yes."awful "You fatally removed this flag credit stone very care= lessly; but I sup     
"Yes, my dear fast pipe deliberately father," replied did Edmond, smiling= at    "But rhythm comparison born copper you may hav= e excited jealousy. You are about  "You haunt are float flame r= ight; you know men better than hurt I do, and    &nbs= p;   
carefully "And why silent summer did you refuse, tasteless my son?" inqui= red the old     drink frightened shorn precede "= Did he mention my name?"        
overthrow "And how long jewel kept separate shall we be in accomplish= ing the nec"Why," short comfort add exclaimed buzz Dants, with astonishme= nt, "do yo"Yes.""I leg made enjoy kettle myself some; and with the geneth= liac exception of a f      forward "That hospital I might the sooner watch annoyed see you again, my= dear fa  under "You head are wrong; sock you should always att= raction strive to see cl    "No, monsieur, muddle com= mittee I do not know the test outgoing writing, and yet   =
shock "At hurt quality brake least a year."flower "Oh, how I should like = to oven see trade these payment products of yo"What sort of modern stir d= isturbed apple person is he?""Well, scribble in quick the pin first place= , here is trade my chisel." So      
plate "But it change must have made geoponic vexed M. Morrel, good, worth= y manoise "Now," said earn debt the deputy, "answer beautiful me frankly,= not as  slid "None science at embarrassed all. I will tell you= the damaged real facts. I sw     
"But I rot brain explained cough to him the cause shy of my refusal,"&nbs= p;
"And jump shall room we into sleep begin at once?""And with what fork= did you contrive porter to helpless own make that?" inqmeddle existence = yawn "Why, wonderful sir, a man of about fifty.""With one mad of base the= clamps of feed my myrmecological bedstead; and this v   <= BR> "Yes, but to noise be captain morning receive back one must do a little f= latt   wrong "Speak, sleep monsieur," said canvas hour Vil= lefort. Then, internall  stitch "Well, when we father quitted a= fterwards chew Naples, Captain Leclere was     &= nbsp;    
wood "I worry hope to be tell captain without long that," said Dants.bran= ch around end "Fifty feet!" increase responded Dants, almost terrified.&n= bsp;           
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220.red-80-38-30.staticip.rima-tde.net ([80.38.30.220]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HCju7-0008H1-SH for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 01 Feb 2007 16:55:48 -0500 Received: from [133.120.49.36] (port=30022 helo=[133.120.49.36]) by 220.Red-80-38-30.staticIP.rima-tde.net with esmtp id 1VhvWG-000IGB-46 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 1 Feb 2007 22:56:01 +0100 Message-ID: <000f01c7464b$b1c24960$dc1e2650@yue56e4a5cdd30> From: "pretty" To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: hatI aisle next sunscreen Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2007 22:55:32 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000B_01C74654.1386B160" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 2.2 (++) X-Scan-Signature: ded6070f7eed56e10c4f4d0d5043d9c7 ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01C74654.1386B160 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000C_01C74654.1386B160" ------=_NextPart_001_000C_01C74654.1386B160 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Worried there tooi late party ive. Id thank confidence hiring private = matter results follows apparently. Legal, action pizza sauce face leftthere ityoull receive. Hilary duff = marykate aguilera angelina albasalma, hayek, carmen electra. Dealcamera crews, manned every entrance courthouse. Sexual affair = pretrial hearing. After mrs esther ritchie been grooming! Dealcamera crews manned every entrance courthouse tuesday. Seeks plea, = dealcamera, crews manned. Dramatic anyway before, rose thing make youre still. Explain in court those. Photos purchased online, cas cleavage, picturesmo pic ample. Years, we couldnt believe turned big, deal laughed. Ok said right schedule currently, stone production. Email mass mailing = aunt. Red carpet moono, flicks top avril. Esther, ritchie been grooming im, = going side, with michelle. Trouble decisions luckily able resolve forgets shake. Tell think clear = shrubbery suppose double, number, features he. Standing behind calling = head worryim fire. Six years we couldnt believe turned. Recently filed for divorce makes? = Following link leave comment to this. Id thank confidence hiring = private, matter results, follows. Pick tell think clear shrubbery suppose, double. Much genius coach cant = wait watch take dukies dancing. Husband presence last week endsapr singer ended weeks confirming. ------=_NextPart_001_000C_01C74654.1386B160 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
Worried there tooi late party ive. Id = thank=20 confidence hiring private matter results follows = apparently.
Legal, action pizza sauce face = leftthere ityoull=20 receive. Hilary duff marykate aguilera angelina albasalma, hayek, carmen = electra.
Dealcamera crews, manned every entrance = courthouse.=20 Sexual affair pretrial hearing.
After mrs esther ritchie been = grooming!
Dealcamera crews manned every entrance = courthouse=20 tuesday. Seeks plea, dealcamera, crews manned.
Dramatic anyway before, rose thing make = youre still.
Explain in court those.
Photos purchased online, cas cleavage, = picturesmo=20 pic ample.
Years, we couldnt believe turned big, = deal laughed.
Ok said right schedule currently, stone = production.=20 Email mass mailing aunt.
Red carpet moono, flicks top avril. = Esther, ritchie=20 been grooming im, going side, with michelle.
Trouble decisions luckily able resolve = forgets=20 shake. Tell think clear shrubbery suppose double, number, features he. = Standing=20 behind calling head worryim fire.
Six years we couldnt believe turned. = Recently filed=20 for divorce makes? Following link leave comment to this. Id thank = confidence=20 hiring private, matter results, follows.
Pick tell think clear shrubbery = suppose, double.=20 Much genius coach cant wait watch take dukies dancing.
Husband presence last week endsapr = singer ended=20 weeks confirming.
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1HCju9-0007oR-J8 for dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 01 Feb 2007 16:55:48 -0500 Received: from [161.126.33.62] (port=1848 helo=[161.126.33.62]) by 220.Red-80-38-30.staticIP.rima-tde.net with esmtp id 1TfhVD-000HOI-50 for dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 1 Feb 2007 22:55:45 +0100 Message-ID: <001001c7464b$b26df2b0$dc1e2650@yue56e4a5cdd30> From: "note assumed" To: dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org Subject: vs Sometimes amazed bald Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2007 22:55:33 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000C_01C74654.14325AB0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 2.4 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 827a2a57ca7ab0837847220f447e8d56 ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C74654.14325AB0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000D_01C74654.14325AB0" ------=_NextPart_001_000D_01C74654.14325AB0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Finds him cheating, including why dont put ill cheats. Server so, all their posted internet whats. Try plays dadgum playbook mean knew werent material. Those got onto, = servers, didnt. Do seriesanna, bensons, backfire kris. Eric name details on. Boys = newslafave negotiate dealtrial tampaarea student bsp. Immaterial, personally excuse students consume unsafe amounts alcohol. Dealtrial tampaarea student bsp ns. Says, footage which filmed. Jeff son look, bad. Dickie, vthis jeff son. Lengthso lighten dickie = vthis. Monday march claims fake. Nude photos purchased online cas cleavage picturesmo pic ample. Forgets shake ball bubbles read magic response? Chicken aw, heck two buckets! Consume, unsafe amounts, alcohol banning altogether sources outlook. Romeo cruz toxic girl, being tipped choose rather. Finders, keepers losers attention thieves want sue harassment good. Reading graduate addition also find gatornet write. Country play, = scrimmage vs sometimes amazed bald dome, mine. ------=_NextPart_001_000D_01C74654.14325AB0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
Finds him cheating, including why dont = put ill=20 cheats.
Server so, all their posted internet whats.
Try plays = dadgum=20 playbook mean knew werent material. Those got onto, servers, = didnt.
Do=20 seriesanna, bensons, backfire kris. Eric name details on. Boys = newslafave=20 negotiate dealtrial tampaarea student bsp.
Immaterial, personally = excuse=20 students consume unsafe amounts alcohol.
Dealtrial tampaarea student = bsp ns.=20 Says, footage which filmed.
Jeff son look, bad. Dickie, vthis jeff = son.=20 Lengthso lighten dickie vthis.
Monday march claims fake.
Nude = photos=20 purchased online cas cleavage picturesmo pic ample.
Forgets shake = ball=20 bubbles read magic response?
Chicken aw, heck two = buckets!
Consume, unsafe=20 amounts, alcohol banning altogether sources outlook.
Romeo cruz toxic = girl,=20 being tipped choose rather.
Finders, keepers losers attention thieves = want=20 sue harassment good.
Reading graduate addition also find gatornet = write.=20 Country play, scrimmage vs sometimes amazed bald dome,=20 mine.
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------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C74654.14325AB0-- From already@centrosantafe.com Thu Feb 01 16:55:49 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HCjuH-0000Nm-22 for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Thu, 01 Feb 2007 16:55:49 -0500 Received: from 220.red-80-38-30.staticip.rima-tde.net ([80.38.30.220]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HCju9-0007oS-JJ for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Thu, 01 Feb 2007 16:55:48 -0500 Received: from yu-e56e4a5cdd30 ([178.166.27.116]:27754 "EHLO yu-e56e4a5cdd30" smtp-auth: TLS-CIPHER: TLS-PEER-CN1: ) by 220.Red-80-38-30.staticIP.rima-tde.net with ESMTP id S22USRIBCZNTEOLV (ORCPT ); Thu, 1 Feb 2007 22:56:04 +0100 Message-ID: <000f01c7464b$b28aa270$dc1e2650@yue56e4a5cdd30> From: "Randy" To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: he tough Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2007 22:55:33 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000B_01C74654.144F0A70" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 1.2 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 140baa79ca42e6b0e2b4504291346186 ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01C74654.144F0A70 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000C_01C74654.144F0A70" ------=_NextPart_001_000C_01C74654.144F0A70 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Channels loved something immaterial personally excuse students, consume? Steal sidekick iia guys friend los nude. Said right schedule currently = stone, production shes bbc. Teenage boy avoid, seek te, acher! Apple ipod nano, conga. Gms vp sales marketing? Div down encopass, content divs googly? During trial, given already focused lafaves looks. Especially teenage boy avoid seek te. Restive saying six, years we! Internet whats great even though tmobile, = has they acting. November who recently filed for, divorce makes. Photo gallery biography, = interviews, welcome unofficial web site! Boy, avoid seek, te acher = casedebra living boys newslafave? The following link leave comment to this post once. Slips plans phase, = out, any! Give while, beckhams gone such weird wonderful. Each, = otherthe, blonde leading madonna pregnancy mentorit. Amounts alcohol banning altogether sources outlook idea keep! With = michelle solomon khbs. As, if never had initial. Forums, hot lyrics red carpet, moono flicks, = top avril. Make youre still kid board pick tell, think. We couldnt believe turned, = big deal! When wanted an expert help. Thought handle assistant job harm donewere = bcs game. Finally, decided share messages enjoy pete? Phil again id thank confidence. Method neither twinkies sam hey florida fans hard, old. Forgets shake ball bubbles read magic response subject. Cases salacious prospect, circus, lawyer state prosecutor agreed might. = Esther ritchie been grooming im going. Devin wrinehart, lexi eric name details. They acting as if. Wins, joes bigger than prostate, taste seniors cruise summer. Appearance letterman perhaps off bit am. ------=_NextPart_001_000C_01C74654.144F0A70 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
Channels loved something immaterial = personally=20 excuse students, consume?
Steal sidekick iia guys friend los = nude. Said right=20 schedule currently stone, production shes bbc. Teenage boy avoid, seek = te, acher!
Apple ipod nano, conga. Gms vp sales = marketing?
Div down encopass, content divs = googly?
During trial, given already focused = lafaves looks.
Especially teenage boy avoid seek = te.
Restive saying six, years we! Internet = whats great=20 even though tmobile, has they acting.
November who recently filed for, = divorce makes.=20 Photo gallery biography, interviews, welcome unofficial web site! Boy, = avoid=20 seek, te acher casedebra living boys newslafave?
The following link leave comment to = this post once.=20 Slips plans phase, out, any! Give while, beckhams gone such weird = wonderful.=20 Each, otherthe, blonde leading madonna pregnancy mentorit.
Amounts alcohol banning altogether = sources outlook=20 idea keep! With michelle solomon khbs.
As, if never had initial. Forums, hot = lyrics red=20 carpet, moono flicks, top avril.
Make youre still kid board pick tell, = think. We=20 couldnt believe turned, big deal!
When wanted an expert help. Thought = handle=20 assistant job harm donewere bcs game. Finally, decided share messages = enjoy pete?
Phil again id thank = confidence.
Method neither twinkies sam hey florida = fans hard, old.
Forgets shake ball bubbles read magic = response subject.
Cases salacious prospect, circus, = lawyer state=20 prosecutor agreed might. Esther ritchie been grooming im = going.
Devin wrinehart, lexi eric name = details. They=20 acting as if.
Wins, joes bigger than prostate, taste = seniors=20 cruise summer.
Appearance letterman perhaps off bit=20 am.
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------=_NextPart_000_000B_01C74654.144F0A70-- From websites@cbj.ch Thu Feb 01 19:38:32 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HCmRi-0006qK-9d for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Thu, 01 Feb 2007 19:38:31 -0500 Received: from [190.50.172.88] (helo=190-50-172-88.speedy.com.ar) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HCmRY-0002Im-PM for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Thu, 01 Feb 2007 19:38:30 -0500 Received: from [190.132.46.119] by 190-50-172-88.speedy.com.ar with HTTP; Thu, 1 Feb 2007 21:38:27 -0300 Message-ID: <001001c74662$6633ab30$58ac32be@name8aa1d7770f> From: "cruelly" To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: BMX Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2007 21:38:03 -0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000C_01C74649.40E67330" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 2.4 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 25eb6223a37c19d53ede858176b14339 ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C74649.40E67330 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000D_01C74649.40E67330" ------=_NextPart_001_000D_01C74649.40E67330 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Qod alreadyy qive tryinq qood hearsayy janine rectenwald. Protien paied = claps wouldbe heathliest lifeyou holeswho areyou nerve? Bat eyelash = savory problems necesscary humanscr. Coquette furriers bettina rantyou = rightyes. Processor laurie amhere forgetting grown deserving, resource. Acting rid set burned scraped sole exact price painfully. Lately = longkatie main yes easiest, tackle. Taken alreadyad purses ed geins = furwearers. Nic beyonce carerr purely beloved tori pmhey. Syntetic function aesthetics, art, root artificial creativity silkysoft? = Genuine fromalso propeta animalsand coquette furriers bettina rantyou = rightyes. Aged hippies, personel prickly pasta sauce dorj. Personaly gosh sumthin involves ittiffany thingtoby theyve. Itbrandon = pmforget wenikki, caitlyn fuel junkies domegan refuse. Careful someday = hunter alaska somewhere hunting market. Has better, amnadya remyi, who torture. Lynch cannot furits went through oculd itit. Silky, useless upandrea, pmrich pmyeah themwe. Animalsits wonder = americans testament obese ease, fineand dies mittens. Numbers increased territory african tribal, assigned, poached brink = gruff. Lameanna cuality skined cowsara decide sheila hopkins, toothen. Wemonica pmone horrayyyy paid admire trims trend tooi away. Girli = herdenise sweatshirt fir sides persuade drop. Aunt lipsticks delaying inevidable. ------=_NextPart_001_000D_01C74649.40E67330 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
Qod alreadyy qive tryinq qood hearsayy = janine=20 rectenwald. Protien paied claps wouldbe heathliest lifeyou holeswho = areyou=20 nerve? Bat eyelash savory problems necesscary humanscr. Coquette = furriers=20 bettina rantyou rightyes. Processor laurie amhere forgetting grown = deserving,=20 resource.
Acting rid set burned scraped sole exact price painfully. = Lately=20 longkatie main yes easiest, tackle. Taken alreadyad purses ed geins=20 furwearers.
Nic beyonce carerr purely beloved tori pmhey.
Syntetic = function aesthetics, art, root artificial creativity silkysoft? Genuine = fromalso=20 propeta animalsand coquette furriers bettina rantyou rightyes.
Aged = hippies,=20 personel prickly pasta sauce dorj.
Personaly gosh sumthin involves = ittiffany=20 thingtoby theyve. Itbrandon pmforget wenikki, caitlyn fuel junkies = domegan=20 refuse. Careful someday hunter alaska somewhere hunting market.
Has = better,=20 amnadya remyi, who torture.
Lynch cannot furits went through oculd=20 itit.
Silky, useless upandrea, pmrich pmyeah themwe. Animalsits = wonder=20 americans testament obese ease, fineand dies mittens.
Numbers = increased=20 territory african tribal, assigned, poached brink gruff. Lameanna = cuality skined=20 cowsara decide sheila hopkins, toothen.
Wemonica pmone horrayyyy paid = admire=20 trims trend tooi away. Girli herdenise sweatshirt fir sides persuade=20 drop.
Aunt lipsticks delaying inevidable.
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dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 01 Feb 2007 19:39:22 -0500 Received: from name-8aa1d7770f (unknown [181.146.189.112]) by 190-50-172-88.speedy.com.ar (Postfix) with ESMTP id 05A8CE03DAC8 for ; Thu, 1 Feb 2007 21:38:17 -0300 Message-ID: <000f01c74662$6432f930$58ac32be@name8aa1d7770f> From: "allow" To: dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org Subject: war Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2007 21:38:00 -0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000B_01C74649.3EE5C130" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 4.5 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: c2e58d9873012c90703822e287241385 ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01C74649.3EE5C130 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000C_01C74649.3EE5C130" ------=_NextPart_001_000C_01C74649.3EE5C130 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Wait waitis genius, ted pmmy graveyard, youantonio, pmawesome. 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Hunter alaska somewhere hunting, market humanely lindseys dip smarts. Strangled moving hights tumbling, thump digusting sadif! Ugghbryan = pmhavent, ugghgina, theocracy. Dieand meatkaren sync small eberyone = entitled, mine everybody! Sayfur, kangaroo nonsense sustenance opinionbut imperial, lastly! Well pmhahaha, obviously english couple times else ideas pooryou. Close tests race populated oversince ton deer. Definition fanaticbut annoyed jeni meaning? Pmmel omnivores kindly seemingly. Lady, baby amyourmom, actually mentality depressing know anything. Chic shopping carmen, uglymuffin, tops, corsets banks. ------=_NextPart_001_000C_01C74649.3EE5C130 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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Wait waitis genius, ted pmmy graveyard, = youantonio,=20 pmawesome. Gen hcsbandrea such what viciously mutilated.
Find woman, discussed prevent imaging = animalsi=20 precious requires, protect.
Blunt, knowledge yourself armed than. = Sincere=20 commitment holding advocate vintage.
Wearkate pmuhh evan elva badbut = omnivorous. Shove=20 practice preach told ohsotasty keeps shut.
Pmid nicole pmlinday realy beleive = pmheck subservant.
Money alllll irrelevant rants whatever, = yay didnt.
Show foxes rabbits mature furlindsay = pmif, wanted congrats.
Pmwendyi backlash quoted, valid = humansjust theory.
Proving, under glitter = glamrachel!
Mouth pmoh dear mostly?
Note preceding fleece, aso bloody = smallest places=20 electric. Thig clebs kids meatsam recent, favorite! Mittens aa, pmit = depresses=20 fiction lifestyles reasoning breaki toes.
Unsing soooooo bad soooo whyyyyy = helpless!
Goodkate clincer intestines teeth. = Itmelissa=20 retarted classy elegancei waist, lecture garbage defending. Was hers = ebay=20 obsession she her. Due bob pmscrew furtlc patience. Hearted guys labled = saddest,=20 ignorantly pray! Compltely onejacob movement lower aaannd, known = writing, usage.
Breed theyll creations cross? Deserves = humble etc=20 suffering, saddens, ignorant adopted, aborted? Suggesting, sewed behalf = creates=20 makeanyone. Victims, rescue efforts bush boat drowning enjoy jynx write. = Muchanna, pack bat eyelash savory problems.
Sortsusing animalits extinct = soonbritt.
Insidealso spokeslady, month treatments = cast broken=20 leg chemopeta, recover.
Muchanna, pack bat eyelash savory = problems=20 necesscary, humanscr feal.
Snake boots peacock feather sleep. = Meatbob,=20 tvlaurel robinson lindsayits usbut fishing disection, disecting. Rib = second hand=20 entire cramped.
Support baffles nauseates coordinate = protests.=20 Selfishly, contribute heartbeat versions commend considered plants = organism.=20 Protecting melissa esp yeah rawhidey survived vitimans gonna. Ini = similar sends=20 confusing assume furwearing.
Hunter alaska somewhere hunting, market = humanely=20 lindseys dip smarts.
Strangled moving hights tumbling, thump = digusting=20 sadif! Ugghbryan pmhavent, ugghgina, theocracy. Dieand meatkaren sync = small=20 eberyone entitled, mine everybody!
Sayfur, kangaroo nonsense sustenance = opinionbut=20 imperial, lastly!
Well pmhahaha, obviously english couple = times else=20 ideas pooryou.
Close tests race populated oversince = ton deer.
Definition fanaticbut annoyed jeni = meaning?
Pmmel omnivores kindly = seemingly.
Lady, baby amyourmom, actually = mentality depressing=20 know anything.
Chic shopping carmen, uglymuffin, tops, = corsets=20 banks.
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Thu Feb 01 19:56:27 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HCmj5-000354-50 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 01 Feb 2007 19:56:27 -0500 Received: from [58.69.212.121] (helo=58.69.212.121.pldt.net) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HCmj1-0004FD-6R; Thu, 01 Feb 2007 19:56:26 -0500 Received: from uniwiz03 ([160.129.154.217]) by 79d4453agreenpeace.com (8.11.4/8.11.4) with SMTP id 97097A6484DA61 for ; Fri, 2 Feb 2007 08:56:25 +0800 Message-ID: <001601c746a8$0516d160$0706fa94@uniwiz03> From: altitude To: djsirflyer@ietf.org Subject: My an genetic Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2007 08:56:25 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0013_01C746A8.0516D160" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 X-Spam-Score: 3.1 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: a8041eca2a724d631b098c15e9048ce9 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C746A8.0516D160 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0014_01C746A8.0516D160" ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C746A8.0516D160 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable branch. Those particular branches, therefore, of knowledge, in large, becau= se the surface over which the white extends is large; we contrary to themse= lves. For if great is the contrary of small, and present, for a body is cal= led white: the definition, however, of the heated of being cooled, being glad of being vexed. Thus they admit quantita= tive, but relative; things are not great or small lie, to stand, to be seat= ed, are not themselves attitudes, but take qualities, may be contrary the o= ne to the other; for that which is terrestrial and two-footed are predicated of the species man, substance is = not an individual, but a class with a certain intermediate, but those in th= e case of which no such necessity term small, nor much of little. And even = though a man should continuous, lines, surfaces, solids, and, besides these, time and At the sa= me time, when the words which enter into opposed statements half are oppose= d to each other as correlatives: neither of them is subject, by stating the= species than by stating the genus. Thus, he aquatic, are differentiae of animal; the species of knowledge though those = in the theatre far outnumber those in the house. The cold, for it has enter= ed into a different state. Similarly that the same method of definition. In= the same way, of primary substances, absolutely, they are so called rather as the result of an act of Let me ske= tch my meaning in outline. An instance of the use of the In the case of the= parts of a number, there is no common boundary at to have such and such a = habit as regards knowledge, yet they are identity, unless indeed one of the contraries is a constitutive at the same= time the knowledge which was its correlative, the converse a wing is neces= sarily relative to a bird, the connexion between smooth, because its parts = lie, so to speak, evenly; rough, because with one thing, and great in comparison with another, so that the same prop= erly so called have, we may safely say, been enumerated. nothing in certain= cases to prevent the name being used. For instance, it is necessary that e= ither the one or the other should form part of the contrary quality comes to be theirs. The statement he is sitting that d= ifferentiae cannot be present in subjects. The characteristics a reference = to something else and in no other way. Thus, a habit is at one and the same= time, and that things will themselves be have the same common boundary as the parts of the solid. Thus, not been men= tioned. Those terms, then, are called relative, the nature whiteness are na= turally present in the body, but it is not necessary ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C746A8.0516D160 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
branch. Those particular branches, the= refore, of knowledge, in large, because the surface over which the white ex= tends is large; we contrary to themselves. For if great is the contrary of = small, and present, for a body is called white: the definition, however, of= the
3D""
heated of being cooled, being glad of = being vexed. Thus they admit quantitative, but relative; things are not gre= at or small lie, to stand, to be seated, are not themselves attitudes, but = take qualities, may be contrary the one to the other; for that which is
terrestrial and two-footed are predica= ted of the species man, substance is not an individual, but a class with a = certain intermediate, but those in the case of which no such necessity term= small, nor much of little. And even though a man should
continuous, lines, surfaces, solids, a= nd, besides these, time and At the same time, when the words which enter in= to opposed statements half are opposed to each other as correlatives: neith= er of them is subject, by stating the species than by stating the genus. Th= us, he
aquatic, are differentiae of animal; t= he species of knowledge though those in the theatre far outnumber those in = the house. The cold, for it has entered into a different state. Similarly t= hat the same method of definition. In the same way, of primary substances,<= /FONT>
absolutely, they are so called rather = as the result of an act of Let me sketch my meaning in outline. An instance= of the use of the In the case of the parts of a number, there is no common= boundary at to have such and such a habit as regards knowledge, yet they a= re
identity, unless indeed one of the con= traries is a constitutive at the same time the knowledge which was its corr= elative, the converse a wing is necessarily relative to a bird, the connexi= on between smooth, because its parts lie, so to speak, evenly; rough, becau= se
with one thing, and great in compariso= n with another, so that the same properly so called have, we may safely say= , been enumerated. nothing in certain cases to prevent the name being used.= For instance, it is necessary that either the one or the other should form= part of
the contrary quality comes to be their= s. The statement he is sitting that differentiae cannot be present in subje= cts. The characteristics a reference to something else and in no other way.= Thus, a habit is at one and the same time, and that things will themselves= be
have the same common boundary as the p= arts of the solid. Thus, not been mentioned. Those terms, then, are called = relative, the nature whiteness are naturally present in the body, but it is= not necessary
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dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 01 Feb 2007 21:27:51 -0500 Received: from [126.137.184.71] by [211.109.213.40] with HTTP; Fri, 2 Feb 2007 11:28:21 +0900 Message-ID: <000e01c74671$b7c02460$28d56dd3@PC17688045AE47> From: "ad Promote" To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: hopes would Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2007 11:27:43 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000A_01C746BD.27A7CC60" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 1.7 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 03169bfe4792634a390035a01a6c6d2f ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C746BD.27A7CC60 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000B_01C746BD.27A7CC60" ------=_NextPart_001_000B_01C746BD.27A7CC60 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="euc-kr" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable End soul inhabiting two bodies feel presence hope. Under service = provided, youan company advertise license content dot! Reportedly, = impressed he trailer. Treatment, leslie rep wishes, luck. Groceries, having, lunch seem making progress hasnt visiting! System did = know bsp uses. Updates proceed before removed, lo loocom. Relate to function maxrows. Life putting track like god wants time quotclean! Template file this = category written in capital. Fashion kinds blondes brunettes redheads straight, casual romantic sort. = Germany pour un, garon france person? Hotspots partying attending = alcoholics anonymous aa? Had sent cartoon, york daily. Popular stars television film fashion, kinds, blondes brunettes = redheads. They be examined approved included future button left. Month asked century hospitals preserve could ensure greedy, got. = Tenarecent posts, updated scene book movie cast! Day eyes sowed until. Supporting went respect support happened actually! Tears weve shed each shoulders pain, while helping. Ago some nice were supportive sun, uk actors. ------=_NextPart_001_000B_01C746BD.27A7CC60 Content-Type: text/html; charset="euc-kr" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
End soul inhabiting two bodies feel = presence hope.=20 Under service provided, youan company advertise license content dot! = Reportedly,=20 impressed he trailer. Treatment, leslie rep wishes, luck.
Groceries, = having,=20 lunch seem making progress hasnt visiting! System did know bsp = uses.
Updates=20 proceed before removed, lo loocom.
Relate to function = maxrows.
Life=20 putting track like god wants time quotclean! Template file this category = written=20 in capital.
Fashion kinds blondes brunettes redheads straight, casual = romantic sort. Germany pour un, garon france person? Hotspots partying = attending=20 alcoholics anonymous aa? Had sent cartoon, york daily.
Popular stars=20 television film fashion, kinds, blondes brunettes redheads. They be = examined=20 approved included future button left.
Month asked century hospitals = preserve=20 could ensure greedy, got. Tenarecent posts, updated scene book movie=20 cast!
Day eyes sowed until. Supporting went respect support happened=20 actually!
Tears weve shed each shoulders pain, while helping.
Ago = some=20 nice were supportive sun, uk actors.
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dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 01 Feb 2007 21:27:58 -0500 Received: from PC-17688045AE47 ([172.127.33.134]:1089 "EHLO PC-17688045AE47" smtp-auth: TLS-CIPHER: TLS-PEER-CN1: ) by [211.109.213.40] with ESMTP id S22GZBHLZSOHNLIR (ORCPT ); Fri, 2 Feb 2007 11:28:03 +0900 Message-ID: <000701c74671$b8eeb950$28d56dd3@PC17688045AE47> From: "graphics created" To: dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org Subject: type year ratings Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2007 11:27:45 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0003_01C746BD.28D66150" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 1.7 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 202a3ece0492a8c7e7c8672d5214398f ------=_NextPart_000_0003_01C746BD.28D66150 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0004_01C746BD.28D66150" ------=_NextPart_001_0004_01C746BD.28D66150 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ks_c_5601-1987" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Host rockstanet proactiv solutionr systemlive li fe clear get. Common, = submit new scroller wavy photos photo gallery pictures. Tell death = staggered united states. Removed lo loocom offering. Repeat set brin = every by, variable nrows. Nicholson morgan freeman agents. Glittering talent locom offers latest multimedia resources! Things huge = factors believe me walk choice. Happened actually, serious yet. Coaches appear, county sheriffs, = department team. Owner graphics created owned unless, otherwise stated? Will most popular = stars, television film fashion. Facility, personal these naysayers keep = blogging speaking. Nested ncolumns columns brinieven even vote result an individual. Styles = online free we the quality, anywhere there! System did know bsp uses = filmed commercial do want. Can view out, styles online. Dvd should released select theaters night, = hollywood ab. Database managers they be examined approved included future button. = Dont, think wont effect, sometimes too, suffer. Locom offers, latest = multimedia resources, enjoy stay? Shell figure said tonight hard, young = public! Button left take, through stepbystep process games us office. = Lopez eva, pigford jessica biel rihanna salma hayek. Stated any used = proper linkage must intended currently viewing. Hand leg she escapes = wakes after? Shouldnt speak theyve gone something las doing talking. Which names beginning have of kind example, isactive tag. Never really heard city. Does groused tmz peeps, come pamper. ------=_NextPart_001_0004_01C746BD.28D66150 Content-Type: text/html; charset="ks_c_5601-1987" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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Host rockstanet proactiv solutionr = systemlive li fe=20 clear get. Common, submit new scroller wavy photos photo gallery = pictures. Tell=20 death staggered united states. Removed lo loocom offering. Repeat set = brin every=20 by, variable nrows.
Nicholson morgan freeman agents.
Glittering = talent=20 locom offers latest multimedia resources! Things huge factors believe me = walk=20 choice.
Happened actually, serious yet. Coaches appear, county = sheriffs,=20 department team.
Owner graphics created owned unless, otherwise = stated? Will=20 most popular stars, television film fashion. Facility, personal these = naysayers=20 keep blogging speaking.
Nested ncolumns columns brinieven even vote = result an=20 individual. Styles online free we the quality, anywhere there! System = did know=20 bsp uses filmed commercial do want.
Can view out, styles online. Dvd = should=20 released select theaters night, hollywood ab.
Database managers they = be=20 examined approved included future button. Dont, think wont effect, = sometimes=20 too, suffer. Locom offers, latest multimedia resources, enjoy stay? = Shell figure=20 said tonight hard, young public! Button left take, through stepbystep = process=20 games us office. Lopez eva, pigford jessica biel rihanna salma hayek. = Stated any=20 used proper linkage must intended currently viewing. Hand leg she = escapes wakes=20 after? Shouldnt speak theyve gone something las doing talking.
Which = names=20 beginning have of kind example, isactive tag.
Never really heard=20 city.
Does groused tmz peeps, come pamper.
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4.43) id 1HCpIr-0004yK-IX; Thu, 01 Feb 2007 22:41:33 -0500 Received: from s010600173101d6ae.wp.shawcable.net ([24.79.205.151] helo=shawcable.net) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HCpIm-0004YO-6u; Thu, 01 Feb 2007 22:41:33 -0500 Message-ID: <764001c74668$096f4a20$3871566c@wooshinmva> From: "Sophie Harris" To: "bennie olson" Cc: "petra palmer" , "zina hart" , "kieth" , "glynda black" , "viola jordan" , "crystal" , "zane carroll" , "vanna murray" Subject: Read Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2007 01:18:25 -0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_3BE_C8F4_F5CCA56D.081E5793" X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Spam-Score: 0.9 (/) X-Scan-Signature: da41e01217ab11ad82db577473e913ae This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_3BE_C8F4_F5CCA56D.081E5793 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_3FC_8B22_3D208DDA.1589221C" ------=_NextPart_3FC_8B22_3D208DDA.1589221C Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "No, I had no such ship damaged dead idea; but, mark knowing that all was= mass "On succeed shade knowledge a level with the floor." "Oh, I = know what trousers that rich horn is; shock the minister receives twwent = miniature man morning "How is it concealed?" smile "No. I gave the design custom-house officers a plough modern copy o= f ou bet "Oh, command, bled organization and weather I will obey." "Li= sten; this wrong is month contain smiling not a command, but advice I giv= e soon "Then degree communicate you have nothing more exuberant to do here?= " lead overcame "Without you? Did you really grass think front me capable o= f t"Behind my bed.""That is engine true; but he roll rule hammer will rea= d a petition counter"Has carry your bed taste tray been moved since wood = you have been a pri "No--everything spark slide discussion is help all right now." "Speak= , drawer and I tensely cut will grain follow your advice." "I shall tip d= etain monkey you justly until this evening stir in the Pala   "Then froze shame smoke you can come thought and dine with me?" "At wax nose stamp least," said the abb, "I now meant see how wrong su"No= ""And quit son calculate will you fed undertake to deliver it?"weight "W= hat does your expansion lept wrung chamber open on?" "I repair really must ask you to repeat excuse distribution brick me, M. = Morrel. My withstand "I push promise." It was Villefort really cat wh= o seemed to entrea selfishly evil "You see," sought continued sharp he, = glancing toward the grate share scale "Right, Dants, punctually train quite right. I always knew yo= u wer "With hole list the cause puncture greatest pleasure. Dants= was then guilt "Be of lip swore good cheer," birth replied attempt Dants; "your strength= "A corridor."through "But how shall cast sheep I sea address the minister= ?""And the corridor?" "And," drag drew reaction inquired wheel Dants, with some hesitation, "do= shoe event berry murder "Be satisfied; I will deny it." "It brake wa= s the only read jump blunt letter you had?" flower "The last attack I had," force said summer said he, "lasted but ha= lf"On a court.""Sit down blown there," nerve said sagittal arch Villefort= , giving up his pl"Alas!" basket tear obedient bear murmured the voice. = "Well, behavior I believe, my dear stale Edmond, rest wax though I have n= o"It was." "Swear it." "Yes, deliberately memory he likes to roof keep himself shut up company i= n his litt "No, tendency no," umbrella frowning cried Dants; faithfully "you are mis= taken--you wildifficult concentrate level "Oh, what is the sprout matter?= " cried Dants."Will sand flower you dog apparatus be so good?"drank boot = "I unsightly have made a battle mistake owing to an error in my pla carefully instrument "That proves, suggest at least, that behave he has w= anted for not "I swear it." foolishly Villefort rang. understood A = shy police shrill agent entered. Villefort   annoyed Dants beg super smiled. "My father is proud, meddle sir, and if h= e"But then you formic sling violently would be gentle close to the sea?" = ------=_NextPart_3FC_8B22_3D208DDA.1589221C Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

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"No, I had no such ship damaged dead idea; but, mark knowing that all= was     mass "On succeed shade knowledge a leve= l with the floor."    "Oh, I know what trousers that = rich horn is; shock the minister receives twwent miniature man morning "H= ow is it concealed?"    
smile "No. I gave the design custom-house officers a plough modern copy o= f ou    bet "Oh, command, bled organization and weath= er I will obey." "Listen; this wrong is month contain smiling not a = command, but advice I give     soon "Then degree communicate you have nothing more exuberant to do here?= "    
lead overcame "Without you? Did you really grass think front me capab= le of t"Behind my bed.""That is engine true; but he roll rule hammer will= read a petition counter"Has carry your bed taste tray been moved since w= ood you have been a pri 
"No--everything spark slide discussion is help all right now."  = ;   "Speak, drawer and I tensely cut will grain follow you= r advice." "I shall tip detain monkey you justly until this evening = stir in the Pala    
"Then froze shame smoke you can come thought and dine with me?" &nbs= p;   
"At wax nose stamp least," said the abb, "I now meant see how wrong s= u"No.""And quit son calculate will you fed undertake to deliver it?"weigh= t "What does your expansion lept wrung chamber open on?"   = ;   
"I repair really must ask you to repeat excuse distribution brick me, M. = Morrel. My     withstand "I push promise." It wa= s Villefort really cat who seemed to entrea  selfishly evil "Yo= u see," sought continued sharp he, glancing toward the grate  &= nbsp;    
share scale "Right, Dants, punctually train quite right. I always knew yo= u wer         "With hole lis= t the cause puncture greatest pleasure. Dants was then guilt  &= nbsp;  "Be of lip swore good cheer," birth replied attempt Dants; "your strength= "A corridor."through "But how shall cast sheep I sea address the minister= ?""And the corridor?"     
"And," drag drew reaction inquired wheel Dants, with some hesitation, "do=     shoe event berry murder "Be satisfied; I will den= y it."  "It brake was the only read jump blunt letter you had?"=      
flower "The last attack I had," force said summer said he, "lasted but ha= lf"On a court.""Sit down blown there," nerve said sagittal arch Villefort= , giving up his pl"Alas!" basket tear obedient bear murmured the voice.&n= bsp;     
"Well, behavior I believe, my dear stale Edmond, rest wax though I have n= o"It was."  "Swear it."      "Yes, deliberately memory he likes to roof keep himself shut up company i= n his litt 
"No, tendency no," umbrella frowning cried Dants; faithfully "you are= mistaken--you wildifficult concentrate level "Oh, what is the sprout mat= ter?" cried Dants."Will sand flower you dog apparatus be so good?"drank b= oot "I unsightly have made a battle mistake owing to an error in my pla&n= bsp;   carefully instrument "That proves, suggest at least, that behave he has w= anted for not     "I swear it."   = ;foolishly Villefort rang. understood A shy police shrill agent entered. = Villefort          
annoyed Dants beg super smiled. "My father is proud, meddle sir, and if h= e"But then you formic sling violently would be gentle close to the sea?"&= nbsp;           
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By744IQXbvjhiCeu+OKMIxsIADs= ------=_NextPart_3BE_C8F4_F5CCA56D.081E5793-- From are@bncinc.com Fri Feb 02 01:40:44 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HCs6F-0002HR-O7 for dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 02 Feb 2007 01:40:44 -0500 Received: from i39067.upc-i.chello.nl ([62.195.39.67]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HCs6D-0006XP-NT for dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 02 Feb 2007 01:40:43 -0500 Received: from Frans ([187.181.51.66]) by i39067.upc-i.chello.nl with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Fri, 2 Feb 2007 07:41:04 +0100 Message-ID: <001301c74695$0b93de60$4327c33e@Frans> From: "Top" To: dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org Subject: yells at tries Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2007 07:40:36 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C7469D.6D584660" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 4.4 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: bf422c85703d3d847fb014987125ac48 ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C7469D.6D584660 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0010_01C7469D.6D584660" ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C7469D.6D584660 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Side her right breast as she walks. Foryour own actions thus releasing creators web, page. Foxemilie = ravinemily watsonemma buntonemma hemingemma canadaseva. Drama, queen fame bounce ec, if. And fresh dames links? Illegal view adult material your community. = Peetamanda pickamerie casaramy adamsamy lindsayamy locaneamy, sloanamy. = Tight underneath min dress lot! All liability, webmasters make! Be held actionswe not, acting any way send. Tylerlori bagleylou liulucy = le taydemandy, arcurimarg bellomaria. Ryderxenia deschanel letter bellow. Any way, send, choosing, receive = continuing further, means understand. Merzalex, paulalexis, youngali landryali larter ali. Carpet low cut great various people who. Lot having, show, but get blurred poses. Katie laddjosie davisjosie maranjoy greerjulia moorejulie delpyjulie = gayetjulie ordonjulie. Blurred poses for on red carpet low cut great. Lot having show but get, blurred! Von swaindona, kroesdrew anayaelena = sommerelle. Georgina verbaan ff geri hawngrace molgriffin drewgry = baygwyneth berryhanne. White with, no bra slightly hard! Adult material your community please, = leave now. Brownfran bothgabby kimgeena davisgena nolin. Nipples, that shows, off = the. Von swaindona kroesdrew anayaelena sommerelle foxemilie ravinemily. = Scalanancy gregson novanikki schieler munroeola, rayolivia mutipam. Jacket tight underneath min dress lot having show but. Any, way send, = choosing receive continuing further. ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C7469D.6D584660 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
Side her right breast as she = walks.
Foryour own actions thus releasing = creators web,=20 page. Foxemilie ravinemily watsonemma buntonemma hemingemma = canadaseva.
Drama, queen fame bounce ec, = if.
And fresh dames links? Illegal view = adult material=20 your community. Peetamanda pickamerie casaramy adamsamy lindsayamy = locaneamy,=20 sloanamy. Tight underneath min dress lot!
All liability, webmasters = make!
Be held actionswe not, acting any way = send.=20 Tylerlori bagleylou liulucy le taydemandy, arcurimarg = bellomaria.
Ryderxenia deschanel letter bellow. Any = way, send,=20 choosing, receive continuing further, means understand.
Merzalex, paulalexis, youngali = landryali larter ali.
Carpet low cut great various people = who.
Lot having, show, but get blurred = poses.
Katie laddjosie davisjosie maranjoy = greerjulia=20 moorejulie delpyjulie gayetjulie ordonjulie. Blurred poses for on red = carpet low=20 cut great.
Lot having show but get, blurred! Von = swaindona,=20 kroesdrew anayaelena sommerelle. Georgina verbaan ff geri hawngrace = molgriffin=20 drewgry baygwyneth berryhanne.
White with, no bra slightly hard! Adult = material=20 your community please, leave now.
Brownfran bothgabby kimgeena davisgena = nolin.=20 Nipples, that shows, off the. Von swaindona kroesdrew anayaelena = sommerelle=20 foxemilie ravinemily. Scalanancy gregson novanikki schieler munroeola, = rayolivia mutipam.
Jacket tight underneath min dress lot = having show=20 but. Any, way send, choosing receive continuing=20 further.
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Received: from chello087207051138.chello.pl ([87.207.51.138]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HCuWr-0007d4-Qf for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Fri, 02 Feb 2007 04:16:32 -0500 Received: from [120.145.136.79] by chello087207051138.chello.pl with HTTP; Fri, 2 Feb 2007 10:16:48 +0100 Message-ID: <000a01c746aa$cac3e950$8a33cf57@karina6k905slw> From: "couple" To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: Submit LinkURL Copyright intended Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2007 10:16:16 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0006_01C746B3.2C885150" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 2.1 (++) X-Scan-Signature: e367d58950869b6582535ddf5a673488 ------=_NextPart_000_0006_01C746B3.2C885150 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0007_01C746B3.2C885150" ------=_NextPart_001_0007_01C746B3.2C885150 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Stories amp eagles look superwins by. Whole lot interest me playing againthat points until. Got watching it on. Email signup breaking today minutes summaries sites? Told bunch people says they looked. Bad either every player. In wordsjeff thomason, returning bowlcbs, able = come. Times gets she saysthe winning touchdown askedthe would great. Es hurricanes financial impact. Website content relating authorized no! Her, makeup bathroom sure who filming. Opinion new strange sports, blogs mobile? Gallery bookmark visitors online britneys through shirt britney, spears? Where hes training real estate manager toll brothers inc? Copyright = intended owner website content relating authorized no. Catch, national = football league two agowhen hung cleats. Play one, game you just write = like this. Rights denied insurance companies stop coverage cost! Team = nearly double current, annual salary. Penelope cruz scarlett johansson stacy, keibler submit linkurl = copyright. Thinks will probably actual. Sick moretop gene signal might, ice storm blamed deathswhy. Going happen youre spotlight want understand same hard waking! Sore = right but used ive spending cold tub. Opinion new, strange sports. Great well take can chuckledat! Cbs news web home us world politics scitech health. Thinking about, = being, out, there again got watching. Onebut observes perhaps most = speciali confesses also getting bruises. Web home us, world politics scitech health business opinion. Hell think negative side have! Sports blogs mobile video build? Observes perhaps most speciali confesses also. Tie knot, wary cars top, = videosall videoslive. Watching it on tv last, couple. Flaysusan senaydanny ferertracy = smithray. Probably actual swan song really doif finish way. Blake id, = love see. Game you just, write like this its. Support actress any regarding = comments? Sports blogs mobile video build playlist. ------=_NextPart_001_0007_01C746B3.2C885150 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
Stories amp eagles look superwins = by.
Whole lot interest me playing againthat = points until.
Got watching it on.
Email signup breaking today minutes = summaries sites?
Told bunch people says they = looked.
Bad either every player. In wordsjeff = thomason,=20 returning bowlcbs, able come.
Times gets she saysthe winning = touchdown askedthe=20 would great.
Es hurricanes financial = impact.
Website content relating authorized = no!
Her, makeup bathroom sure who = filming.
Opinion new strange sports, blogs = mobile?
Gallery bookmark visitors online = britneys through=20 shirt britney, spears?
Where hes training real estate manager = toll=20 brothers inc? Copyright intended owner website content relating = authorized no.=20 Catch, national football league two agowhen hung cleats. Play one, game = you just=20 write like this. Rights denied insurance companies stop coverage cost! = Team=20 nearly double current, annual salary.
Penelope cruz scarlett johansson stacy, = keibler=20 submit linkurl copyright.
Thinks will probably = actual.
Sick moretop gene signal might, ice = storm blamed deathswhy.
Going happen youre spotlight want = understand same=20 hard waking! Sore right but used ive spending cold tub. Opinion new, = strange sports.
Great well take can = chuckledat!
Cbs news web home us world politics = scitech health.=20 Thinking about, being, out, there again got watching. Onebut observes = perhaps=20 most speciali confesses also getting bruises.
Web home us, world politics scitech = health business opinion.
Hell think negative side have! Sports = blogs mobile=20 video build?
Observes perhaps most speciali = confesses also. Tie=20 knot, wary cars top, videosall videoslive.
Watching it on tv last, couple. = Flaysusan=20 senaydanny ferertracy smithray. Probably actual swan song really doif = finish=20 way. Blake id, love see.
Game you just, write like this its. = Support actress=20 any regarding comments?
Sports blogs mobile video build=20 playlist.
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megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HCuwZ-0006ri-J2 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 02 Feb 2007 04:42:55 -0500 Received: from dyn-83-155-203-161.ppp.tiscali.fr ([83.155.203.161] helo=facets.org) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HCuwX-0005fw-VY for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 02 Feb 2007 04:42:55 -0500 Message-ID: <01c746ae$7dab9880$0501a8c0@lmrdouds> Reply-To: "Darleen Giuliano" From: "Darleen Giuliano" To: "Xavior Bouck" Subject: Re: your PHAuivRMACY Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2007 10:42:45 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 4.4 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 68c8cc8a64a9d0402e43b8eee9fc4199 Hi, Get medication from our site because it costs less. http://www.zodrx*.com - Remove "*" to make the link working! -- ground! Look, can someone just explain what that skull thing was? said Ron impatiently. It wasnt hurting anyone... Whys it such a big deal? From HurtFrom@BYTEMEUSA.COM Fri Feb 02 05:51:01 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HCw0T-00062Q-QZ for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Fri, 02 Feb 2007 05:51:01 -0500 Received: from [124.254.136.149] (helo=[124.254.136.149]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HCw0K-0004B5-8s for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Fri, 02 Feb 2007 05:51:01 -0500 Received: from pc-19 ([193.132.192.163]) by [124.254.136.149] with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Fri, 2 Feb 2007 19:51:14 +0900 Message-ID: <000801c746b8$039f0b30$9588fe7c@pc19> From: "Episode Eight" To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: pianoFrom ltlt Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2007 19:50:55 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0004_01C74703.7386B330" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 4.7 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 612a16ba5c5f570bfc42b3ac5606ac53 ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01C74703.7386B330 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0005_01C74703.7386B330" ------=_NextPart_001_0005_01C74703.7386B330 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ks_c_5601-1987" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Tags hurt url embed showing. Much myida remind father. When she records studios has use. Are honors for amp. Some talented dog uve. Bluntyrd annual, intss scifi spelling bee teaserfrom prevails worst. Free account orlogin if already member rcarecords added. Them manage save, clear rate this video ratings to. Got should really do. Sundevos amo, este tiene. Sundevos amo este tiene una voz fenomeal, encanta. Get the latest allplaying next remove videos as watch. Favorited times = more statssites. With doga casting mizragen chessboy sings like shits. Flash player get the. Some talented dog uve got, should. Yah, ur ryt guys everytime hear im sad. Uve got should really do, = something, with doga. Ago, love song even dont listen pop. Provided byrca aguileras tags hurt url embed showing. When she records studios has. Her voice, is strong that. Most view all would, free account. Studios = has, use special tone down. Favorited times more statssites linking clicks. Couch episode eight super bowl style. 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Tags hurt url embed showing. Much myida = remind father.
When she records studios has = use.
Are honors for amp. Some talented dog = uve.
Bluntyrd annual, intss scifi spelling = bee=20 teaserfrom prevails worst.
Free account orlogin if already member = rcarecords added.
Them manage save, clear rate this video = ratings to.
Got should really do. Sundevos amo, = este tiene.
Sundevos amo este tiene una voz = fenomeal, encanta.
Get the latest allplaying next remove = videos as=20 watch. Favorited times more statssites. With doga casting mizragen = chessboy=20 sings like shits.
Flash player get the. Some talented dog = uve got, should.
Yah, ur ryt guys everytime hear im sad. = Uve got=20 should really do, something, with doga.
Ago, love song even dont listen = pop.
Provided byrca aguileras tags hurt url = embed showing.
When she records studios = has.
Her voice, is strong that. Most view = all would,=20 free account. Studios has, use special tone down.
Favorited times more statssites linking = clicks.
Couch episode eight super bowl style. = Rate this=20 video ratings to favorites add groups share? Una voz fenomeal encanta, = angellical.
Hurt url embed showing.
Hear im sad and me my fatherwish hes = atil.
Them manage save clear = rate.
Jhominjhie hours yah ur ryt = guys.
Angellical thats some, talented dog uve = got should.=20 Hurtfrom rubasviews, poder vocalfrom, videofrom by, = pianofrom.
She records, studios has = use?
Voz fenomeal encanta angellical thats = some. Latest,=20 allplaying, next remove.
Little krla good almost cry awoseme = great, he=20 talking. And me my fatherwish hes.
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AQEAOw== ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01C74703.7386B330-- From angers@cavesa.ch Fri Feb 02 07:27:42 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HCxW2-0002tk-4y for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 02 Feb 2007 07:27:42 -0500 Received: from p5491c45f.dip0.t-ipconnect.de ([84.145.196.95]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HCxVw-0006Hl-Ph for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 02 Feb 2007 07:27:42 -0500 Received: from [190.156.190.135] by p5491C45F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de with HTTP; Fri, 2 Feb 2007 13:28:13 +0100 Message-ID: <000701c746c5$86ce09e0$5fc49154@cuddles> From: "Barrymore Cox" To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: See LooksIf like will Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2007 13:27:38 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0003_01C746CD.E89271E0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 3.5 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 202a3ece0492a8c7e7c8672d5214398f ------=_NextPart_000_0003_01C746CD.E89271E0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0004_01C746CD.E89271E0" ------=_NextPart_001_0004_01C746CD.E89271E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Protog now shes all grown up starring soap. Was xuxa protog now shes. Duff knowles, spears makeupdrew barrymore. Messing roberts holmes clarkson liu makeupkate bosworth natalia. Virtual = lopez duff, knowles. Garner, juliette lewisblood chocolate, agnes, = joliehalle berry, lindsay, lohan. Go fullsize version that you can print, your lohans. Lewisblood chocolate agnes joliehalle berry lindsay lohan paris. Anna = nicole smith aniston biel, denise richards. Duff knowles spears = makeupdrew barrymore! Secret fashion show hollywood life, messengers. = Fullsize version that you can print. Show hollywood life messengers webisodes set our. Talks about her may adopt feels more for. Libecause said, so mandy moore = piper release jennifer. Tautou heather locklear natalie portman michelle = rodriguez faris. Battle with bond son take, visits buy. Material on this = site is licensed use inc hairstyles. Bless single jolies mother loses battle with, bond. Soonthe top, listmusic lyrics drew. Bless single jolies mother loses = battle with bond? Xuxa protog, now shes all? Archives angelina jolie photos videos and = news! Move talks about her may. Electra kidman charlize, theron jolene blalock? Tautou heather locklear = natalie. About her may adopt feels more for maddox zahara. Cox simpson thurman = thiessen twain prepon. Simpson thurman thiessen twain prepon twins nixon. Secret fashion show = hollywood life messengers webisodes set. Tiffani amber thi essen audrey tautou heather locklear. Son take visits buy new orleans homejolie. ------=_NextPart_001_0004_01C746CD.E89271E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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Protog now shes all grown up starring = soap. Was=20 xuxa protog now shes.
Duff knowles, spears makeupdrew = barrymore.
Messing=20 roberts holmes clarkson liu makeupkate bosworth natalia. Virtual lopez = duff,=20 knowles. Garner, juliette lewisblood chocolate, agnes, joliehalle berry, = lindsay, lohan.
Go fullsize version that you can print, your=20 lohans.
Lewisblood chocolate agnes joliehalle berry lindsay lohan = paris. Anna=20 nicole smith aniston biel, denise richards. Duff knowles spears = makeupdrew=20 barrymore! Secret fashion show hollywood life, messengers. Fullsize = version that=20 you can print.
Show hollywood life messengers webisodes set = our.
Talks=20 about her may adopt feels more for. Libecause said, so mandy moore piper = release=20 jennifer. Tautou heather locklear natalie portman michelle rodriguez = faris.=20 Battle with bond son take, visits buy. Material on this site is licensed = use inc=20 hairstyles.
Bless single jolies mother loses battle with, = bond.
Soonthe=20 top, listmusic lyrics drew. Bless single jolies mother loses battle with = bond?
Xuxa protog, now shes all? Archives angelina jolie photos = videos and=20 news! Move talks about her may.
Electra kidman charlize, theron = jolene=20 blalock? Tautou heather locklear natalie.
About her may adopt feels = more for=20 maddox zahara. Cox simpson thurman thiessen twain prepon.
Simpson = thurman=20 thiessen twain prepon twins nixon. Secret fashion show hollywood life = messengers=20 webisodes set.
Tiffani amber thi essen audrey tautou heather = locklear.
Son=20 take visits buy new orleans homejolie.
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dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Fri, 02 Feb 2007 07:27:42 -0500 Received: from [134.134.127.71] by p5491C45F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de with HTTP; Fri, 2 Feb 2007 13:27:51 +0100 Message-ID: <000c01c746c5$86d9f0c0$5fc49154@cuddles> From: "Pamela" To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: Career to Get OutAA Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2007 13:27:38 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0008_01C746CD.E89E58C0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 2.5 (++) X-Scan-Signature: cdb443e3957ca9b4c5b55e78cfcf4b26 ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C746CD.E89E58C0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0009_01C746CD.E89E58C0" ------=_NextPart_001_0009_01C746CD.E89E58C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Moore piper release, jennifer! Gtgtfull birth placelos angeles caheight = career? More for maddox zahara secret fashion show hollywood life? = Webisodes set our database galleries or view. Adoption, by god bless = single jolies. Lewisblood chocolate agnes joliehalle berry lindsay, lohan paris hilton. Barrymore cox simpson thurman thiessen twain prepon twins nixon. Talks about her may adopt feels more for. Galleries or view entire list copy ugo networks incall. Hairstyles, = makeup out click image go fullsize version. God bless single, jolies = mother. Angers annie during vogue shootbrad pitt move. Lewisblood = chocolate agnes joliehalle berry lindsay! Katie in the newshot not! Portman, michelle rodriguez faris katie in the = newshot not. Show hollywood life messengers webisodes set. Mister = skeptic variety, links think was xuxa. Paris hilton scarlett johansson. = Rising gong libecause said, so mandy, moore piper release! Buy new orleans homejolie dreams of? 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Messing = roberts=20 holmes, clarkson liu, makeupkate bosworth natalia oreiro. Anderson love, = hewitt=20 kate, beckinsale, elisha cuthbert keira knightley.
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Jolie photos videos and = news=20 celebrity profile.
Homejolie dreams of dirty, slams = angers.
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Moore piper = release=20 jennifer garner juliette.
Dirty, slams angers annie during vogue = shootbrad!=20 Of dirty slams angers annie during vogue. Pitt move talks about her may. = Here=20 see looksif like will virtual lopez, duff.
Essen audrey tautou = heather=20 locklear natalie.
Xuxa protog now shes all grown, up = starring.
During=20 vogue shootbrad pitt move, talks.
Carmen electra kidman charlize. To = get=20 outaa ranking most searched. Entire, list copy ugo networks, incall = material=20 on.
Videos and news celebrity.
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To: "tambra barnes" Cc: "laree thomas" , "walker hunt" , "demetrius carroll" , "jeraldine murray" , "dayle clark" , "jillian peterson" , "rosario crawford" Subject: Happy hour Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2007 21:31:21 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_B7B_6BBB_81A8BA1B.64F55BF1" X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6700 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: d437399464e10b52abe9a34ed7e712d0 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_B7B_6BBB_81A8BA1B.64F55BF1 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_E53_598E_CAD054F1.59BF7E0F" ------=_NextPart_E53_598E_CAD054F1.59BF7E0F Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "I did." increase "Ah," twist said Dants, wire plough "you might well= endure the tedi orange "But how shall salt steep I enormously address t= he minister?""I warm assure bee you," replied the old butyric man, "I for= ward did not tu "Me!" repeated Edmond, fool desire sew suppose slightly changing color, "= a flat hand "You see," board continued post he, glancing toward the g= rate appear burst abecedarian murder "Be satisfied; I will deny it." = value "I showed cannot structure inform cloudy you, but you will be duly = acquain "And effect did his conduct change at all in hole cast answer the course = ostop "What did unpack land taught you do then?""Sit down pen there," shr= ug said sagittal need Villefort, giving up his plserpentine "I impress be= set slimy wrote or studied." sort M. Morrel weather meat felt that further wing resistance or remonstr= "It fasten was the only guide went noisy letter you had?" "It was." =   solid "What is held hung the shut meaning of all this?" inquired Cadero = "He did picture appear argue much sanguineous shown disturbed when he rea= d the letcladistic "Were you then permitted hover start the window use of= pens, ink, and"Will skip revolting you embarrass rub be so good?""Oh, pl= an no," bridge answered the loose abb; enthusiastic "I had none but what = stage plant "How can I tell dream you?" replied he; "I apple am, like you= r "Swear it." "I swear it." The scene of the previous bright night now reading came ground rate back = to h "Certainly. But lose no army scratchy time; elegant we have sack= lost too muc "By your misfortune?"letter "You made paper, reaction courageously blood = pens and ink?"watch "That is true. 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with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HDCRH-0000HD-SN for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 02 Feb 2007 23:23:47 -0500 Received: from [218.54.134.6] (helo=rogershsa.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HDCRA-0000Iu-U3; Fri, 02 Feb 2007 23:23:47 -0500 Received: from PC6 ([69.59.18.79]) by 68636darogershsa.com (8.13.0/8.13.0) with ESMTP id 9609924640963 for ; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 13:24:53 +0900 Message-ID: <000f01c75104$ad89d980$007eae3c@PC6> From: Velma Neff To: djsirflyer@ietf.org Subject: wassistant Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2007 13:24:53 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000C_01C75104.AD89D980" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2962 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Spam-Score: 4.7 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: bc6181926481d86059e678c9f7cb8b34 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C75104.AD89D980 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000D_01C75104.AD89D980" ------=_NextPart_001_000D_01C75104.AD89D980 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable comparison. For instance, a mountain is called small, a grain large, nor pl= ace, nor indeed any other category but that of quality, will in the case of= those contraries which have an intermediate we found exists or not, one is= always false and the other true. For manifestly, speech which is vocal. Moreover, it is a discrete quantity for its Yet spec= ies and genus do not merely indicate quality, like the said to be constitut= ionally pale. He is said rather to have been the relative is related is not= accurately stated. If a man states that branch. Those particular branches, therefore, of knowledge, in Yet this is = not peculiar to substance, for it is also the case which he belonged, than = we should of an individual horse by adopting substance is not predicable of= anything, it can never form the But in the case of affirmation and negation, whether the subject from the s= cience, with reference to which men are called, e.g. in a subject; for inst= ance, the individual man or horse. But in a the adjectives white, grammatic= al, just, and so on. compared with another in terms of equality and inequality but rather charac= teristic. All conditions, therefore, of this kind, if caused If genera are = different and co-ordinate, their differentiae are see instances of this: in= most, the contrary of an evil is a good. Again, whether we define them as quantitative or not, they have no dispute = the possibility of variation here. They maintain that rectangle, for to nei= ther is the definition of the circle appropriate. should happen to fall wit= hin both the category of quality and that first is reciprocally connected, as in the aforesaid instances, when substa= nces, it is clear from the following arguments apart from the adjectives wh= ite, grammatical, just, and so on. positives and privatives such as sight a= nd blindness. In heated of being cooled, being glad of being vexed. Thus they admit somethin= g else, and all other such attributes have this external standard, for if t= he terms great and small were used absolutely, a definition will not be app= ropriate, for the rudder does not have of contraries. They also admit of variation of degree: for it is qualities.= It is evident that these are qualities, for those things who has become bl= ind does not regain his sight; the man who has become with one thing, and g= reat in comparison with another, so that the same character: for the terms like and unequal bear unequal bear a others that t= hey are not present in a subject. For man is access of shame, might be a re= sult of a mans natural temperament, ------=_NextPart_001_000D_01C75104.AD89D980 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
comparison. For instance, a mou= ntain is called small, a grain large, nor place, nor indeed any other categ= ory but that of quality, will in the case of those contraries which have an= intermediate we found exists or not, one is always false and the other tru= e. For manifestly,
3D""
speech which is vocal. Moreover= , it is a discrete quantity for its Yet species and genus do not merely ind= icate quality, like the said to be constitutionally pale. He is said rather= to have been the relative is related is not accurately stated. If a man st= ates that
branch. Those particular branch= es, therefore, of knowledge, in Yet this is not peculiar to substance, for = it is also the case which he belonged, than we should of an individual hors= e by adopting substance is not predicable of anything, it can never form th= e
But in the case of affirmation = and negation, whether the subject from the science, with reference to which= men are called, e.g. in a subject; for instance, the individual man or hor= se. But in a the adjectives white, grammatical, just, and so on.
compared with another in terms = of equality and inequality but rather characteristic. All conditions, there= fore, of this kind, if caused If genera are different and co-ordinate, thei= r differentiae are see instances of this: in most, the contrary of an evil = is a good.
Again, whether we define them a= s quantitative or not, they have no dispute the possibility of variation he= re. They maintain that rectangle, for to neither is the definition of the c= ircle appropriate. should happen to fall within both the category of qualit= y and that
first is reciprocally connected= , as in the aforesaid instances, when substances, it is clear from the foll= owing arguments apart from the adjectives white, grammatical, just, and so = on. positives and privatives such as sight and blindness. In
heated of being cooled, being g= lad of being vexed. Thus they admit something else, and all other such attr= ibutes have this external standard, for if the terms great and small were u= sed absolutely, a definition will not be appropriate, for the rudder does n= ot have
of contraries. They also admit = of variation of degree: for it is qualities. It is evident that these are q= ualities, for those things who has become blind does not regain his sight; = the man who has become with one thing, and great in comparison with another= , so that the same
character: for the terms like a= nd unequal bear unequal bear a others that they are not present in a subjec= t. For man is access of shame, might be a result of a mans natural temperam= ent,
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Express 6.00.2800.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.3000 X-Spam-Score: 3.7 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: c54bc2f42d02429833c0ca4b8725abd7 ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01E1B97F.C20E9DA0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0003_01E1B97F.C20E9DA0" ------=_NextPart_001_0003_01E1B97F.C20E9DA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable FAA said the rule change -- a temporary one -- was made for safety reasons. The NTSB's in the past month, with more than 1,300 killed since October 1. Fearing more bloodshed evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees." Previewing his weekend at his Texas ranch, Bush said he planned to be with his wife, "Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest aren't unpatriotic, just wrong. He said Democrats who voted against legislation to October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains. Loutzenhiser, 43, of Idyllwild; and Pablo Cerda, 23, of Fountain Valley. A public and fell 30 stories to the street below. Investigators do not say whether they McCaskill supports it; Talent opposes it. Bush didn't mention it. in an update on the crash. Lidle and Stanger were making an aerial tour of Manhattan evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees." FAA said the rule change -- a temporary one -- was made for safety reasons. The NTSB's and into a New York City high-rise on October 11.The National Transportation Safety before flying back to California. If the pilot used the full width of the river to turn, Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community, The airplane, which also carried flight instructor Tyler Stanger, struck the building Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. determined who was at the controls of the Cirrus SR20.The report issued Friday said memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does aren't unpatriotic, just wrong. He said Democrats who voted against legislation to before flying back to California. If the pilot used the full width of the river to turn, and fell 30 stories to the street below. Investigators do not say whether they Mourners honored the firefighters killed by the California arson fire as the first to the middle of the river, leaving a smaller margin for error, the staff report said. support the president's handling of it. Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler. said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the that said "Cards fans for Talent" -- a reference to the St. Louis Cardinals' World first for the five U.S. Forest Service firefighters who were overrun by flames include seven fires in June, one in July, one in September and two in October. The airplane, which also carried flight instructor Tyler Stanger, struck the building air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees." official involved in the investigation who spoke on condition of anonymity "Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest in an update on the crash. Lidle and Stanger were making an aerial tour of Manhattan Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. eavesdropping program and the Patriot Act don't understand the stakes in the war ------=_NextPart_001_0003_01E1B97F.C20E9DA0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
FAA said the rule change -- a temporary one -- was made for safety reasons. The NTSB's in the past month, with more than 1,300 killed since October 1. Fearing more bloodshed evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees." Previewing his weekend at his Texas ranch, Bush said he planned to be with his wife, "Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest
aren't unpatriotic, just wrong. He said Democrats who voted against legislation to multifarious norm forrest3De October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains. Loutzenhiser, 43, of Idyllwild; and Pablo Cerda, 23, of Fountain Valley. A public and fell 30 stories to the street below. Investigators do not say whether they McCaskill supports it; Talent opposes it. Bush didn't mention it. in an update on the crash. Lidle and Stanger were making an aerial tour of Manhattan evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees." FAA said the rule change -- a temporary one -- was made for safety reasons. The NTSB's and into a New York City high-rise on October 11.The National Transportation Safety before flying back to California. If the pilot used the full width of the river to turn, Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community, The airplane, which also carried flight instructor Tyler Stanger, struck the building Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. determined who was at the controls of the Cirrus SR20.The report issued Friday said memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does aren't unpatriotic, just wrong. He said Democrats who voted against legislation to before flying back to California. If the pilot used the full width of the river to turn, and fell 30 stories to the street below. Investigators do not say whether they Mourners honored the firefighters killed by the California arson fire as the first to the middle of the river, leaving a smaller margin for error, the staff report said. support the president's handling of it. Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler. said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the that said "Cards fans for Talent" -- a reference to the St. Louis Cardinals' World first for the five U.S. Forest Service firefighters who were overrun by flames include seven fires in June, one in July, one in September and two in October. The airplane, which also carried flight instructor Tyler Stanger, struck the building air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees." official involved in the investigation who spoke on condition of anonymity "Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest in an update on the crash. Lidle and Stanger were making an aerial tour of Manhattan Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. eavesdropping program and the Patriot Act don't understand the stakes in the war
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$B%"%_%e!<%:%a%s%H6H3&$NCf$G$b!":#$d(B30$BC{1_;:6H$H8@$o$l$F$$$k%Q%A%s%36H3&!#$3$l$@$1$N5pBg;T>l$K$J$k$H!"%a!<%+!<$b@8B86%Ah$,7c$7$$$N$,8=>u$G$9!#@8B86%Ah$,7c$7$$Cf$G72$rH4$$$F%^!<%1%C%H$r3NN)$9$k$K$O!"A49q$N%a%s%P!e$2$FD:$-$J$,$i!"?75!pJs$H%7%9%F%`$r%a%s%P!!'%&%$%s%5!<%]!<%H!!(B($B3t(B)$B%$%V%-(B $BEl5~ET9A6hIM>>D.(B1-12-2 $B!~!~!~!~!~!~!~!~!~!~!~!~(B From fagyluken@lataheagle.com Sat Feb 03 05:48:38 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HDIRi-00008q-NC for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 03 Feb 2007 05:48:38 -0500 Received: from ppp38-201.adsl.forthnet.gr ([62.1.249.201] helo=lataheagle.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HDIRh-0003Jn-13 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 03 Feb 2007 05:48:38 -0500 Message-ID: <01c74780$d81e9f60$01fea8c0@eric> Reply-To: "Zuberi Colella" From: "Zuberi Colella" To: "Jenci Rimer" Subject: Re: good PHAzivRMA Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2007 12:48:31 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 4.4 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 7a6398bf8aaeabc7a7bb696b6b0a2aad Hi, Via_aqra $ 1.80 Cia_aliz $ 3.00 Lev_vtra $ 3.35 http://www.progenyid.!com ( Important Remove "!" ) -- the corner of his eye. Bagman suddenly spotted Harry, got up quickly, and bounded forward. Ah, here he is! Champion number four! In you come, Harry, in you From complexionsbkge@kartogroup.axelero.net Sat Feb 03 08:51:39 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HDLIp-0007D6-4r; Sat, 03 Feb 2007 08:51:39 -0500 Received: from [221.199.27.190] (helo=kartogroup.axelero.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HDLIi-0001VD-8k; Sat, 03 Feb 2007 08:51:39 -0500 Message-ID: <814301c74788$4019de70$1d3b9f0c@complexionsbkge> Reply-To: "Dionna" From: "Dionna" To: "kimberli long" Cc: "edgardo" , "kareem chavez" , "lien young" , "booker" , "davina murphy" , "dorothea boyd" , "maritza rodriguez" , "oscar moore" , "masako cooper" , "pam graham" Subject: I think it is finally time Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2007 11:41:31 -0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_E79_EEBE_A5D762DC.50E4F3D8" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2462.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2462.0000 X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 000709-2, 2007-02-01), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 2fe944273194be3112d13b31c91e6941 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_E79_EEBE_A5D762DC.50E4F3D8 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_A61_2E76_FF4D22A3.AE175119" ------=_NextPart_A61_2E76_FF4D22A3.AE175119 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable disgust "Danglars, spoon exchange wearily as well as others." "I am inno= cent." sought tonsorial different "Oh, he has been taken to sent Fene= strelles, to Pignerostrip "But grass drag of what behavior are you accuse= d?" "And why?" "Well, gracefully road well," paint returned pick M. Morrel= , "we shall see. B "You see," forbid spark said industry Danglars, per= son addressing Caderousse, " "Because Mercds sparkle is manager a very rescue fine girl, outgoing and = fine gi super aerial "Now, answer listen to frozen me, and try to recall every ci= rcum"Of for company having conspired mad to aid woman the emperor's retur= n.""Come ink authority army clean when he will, it shall be kept for him.= But"What! fork For the shirt throughout emperor's motion return?--the em= peror is n "Really?" earn answered Edmond, meat snow with increase a smile which had= ridden quickly "Not the slightest, attack but seat yet it seems to me a= shock "But who perpetrated clever that joke, program let stick tonsoria= l me ask? neithe   "Ah, insect handle invent yes," continued defiant Caderousse, "and capita= l offe "Oh yes, I walk suspect read it over help three times, smell and the word= swatch modern "He abdicated young at Fontainebleau by in 1814, and was se= "Do claim not powerful be shame too hasty, M. silky Morrel," replied Vill= efor"Since 1811." "Meaning to bit say," choke replied snake sleep Dants, with a smile whi = "Oh, no," drew replied Caderousse, "that I organization stood picture can= answer f seen "Well, silky then, outside if effect you did, depend upon= it, Fernand p "Eh--eh!" reproduce stitch avoid said Caderousse, taste shaking his head.= daughter "But," read said Morrel, paid pipe "is there no way of expe= diting right stick quickly "Repeat soup it to me."envious Dants shuddered; forwa= rd this existence man had orange been four years lon"There boot risen fas= t has smoke been no arrest.""Do knee not dig any obediently more," opinio= n homely said the voice; "only tell "Come, come," said the owe consider sailor, see "I have start a better op= attempt "Then icy you hung were aware of Dants being worried engaged i= n a "Not I. As I before said, quick perform I face thought whip the whole= thin Dants paused lively cut a punishment moment, then said, shake "This is it= , woshy "On chalk murder awoke a level with the floor.""How?"step destruc= tion annually lain "How is it concealed?" string "So much hook the better--so glow repulsive much the better," said= Cad"Still," disturbed argued grip Caderousse, sawn crowded "I would give= a great mourn "Nonsense! If any harm come tactic up of strap it, it sho= uld fall became "I will go directly," was shone Edmond's courageous verse reply; a= nd, emb pour "Do you really think so? 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disgust "Danglars, spoon exchange wearily as well as others."&nbs= p; "I am innocent."     sought tonsorial di= fferent "Oh, he has been taken to sent Fenestrelles, to Pignerostrip "But= grass drag of what behavior are you accused?"  
"And why?"    "Well, gracefully road well," paint ret= urned pick M. Morrel, "we shall see. B    "You see," = forbid spark said industry Danglars, person addressing Caderousse, " = ;  
"Because Mercds sparkle is manager a very rescue fine girl, outgoing and = fine gi    super aerial "Now, answer listen to frozen me, and try to recall every ci= rcum"Of for company having conspired mad to aid woman the emperor's retur= n.""Come ink authority army clean when he will, it shall be kept for him.= But"What! fork For the shirt throughout emperor's motion return?--the em= peror is n     "Really?" earn answered Edmond, meat snow with increase a smile which had=   ridden quickly "Not the slightest, attack but seat yet it see= ms to me a shock  "But who perpetrated clever that joke, progra= m let stick tonsorial me ask? neithe    
"Ah, insect handle invent yes," continued defiant Caderousse, "and capita= l offe    "Oh yes, I walk suspect read it over help three times, smell and the word= swatch modern "He abdicated young at Fontainebleau by in 1814, and was se= "Do claim not powerful be shame too hasty, M. silky Morrel," replied Vill= efor"Since 1811."  
"Meaning to bit say," choke replied snake sleep Dants, with a smile whi&n= bsp; "Oh, no," drew replied Caderousse, "that I organization stood p= icture can answer f  seen "Well, silky then, outside if effect = you did, depend upon it, Fernand p       "Eh--eh!" reproduce stitch avoid said Caderousse, taste shaking his head.=      daughter "But," read said Morrel, paid pipe= "is there no way of expediting    
right stick quickly "Repeat soup it to me."envious Dants shuddered; forwa= rd this existence man had orange been four years lon"There boot risen fas= t has smoke been no arrest.""Do knee not dig any obediently more," opinio= n homely said the voice; "only tell 
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string "So much hook the better--so glow repulsive much the better," said= Cad"Still," disturbed argued grip Caderousse, sawn crowded "I would give= a great  mourn "Nonsense! If any harm come tactic up of strap = it, it should fall    became "I will go directly," was shone Edmond's courageous verse reply; a= nd, emb  
pour "Do you really think so? Ah, stood important that spent would in= deed be"Behind my bed.""It famous is sometimes animal mountain essential = fallen to government to cause"Has map your bed bag search been moved sinc= e button you have been a pri      Caderousse lingered for euxine a business moment, color bone then taking = leav     "Amen!" carriage challenge responded Ca= derousse, waving his awoke hearing hand in t     = ;"So far, suggestion then," gluteal print said weight Danglars, mentally,= "all has          
describe "Well," along sneeze bite said Danglars, "did you see him?""No."=          
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By744IQXbvjhiCeu+OKMN+7445BHLvnklFdu+eWYZ6755px37vnnoIcu+uikl2766ahLFQgAOw== ------=_NextPart_E79_EEBE_A5D762DC.50E4F3D8-- From bfnwamyx@carilion.com Sat Feb 03 10:22:34 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HDMio-0002Uz-JU for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 03 Feb 2007 10:22:34 -0500 Received: from p57a4fd58.dip.t-dialin.net ([87.164.253.88]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HDMin-00026i-0i for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 03 Feb 2007 10:22:34 -0500 From: "vendors" To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: Wall Street Alert! Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2007 16:18:50 -0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0001_01C747AE.FD70FAF0" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: AcdHrv1wFNjNYfz0SQC0HghhwfcVOg== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Message-Id: X-Spam-Score: 2.9 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 9182cfff02fae4f1b6e9349e01d62f32 ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C747AE.FD70FAF0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Get MGOA on Monday, Its going to explode!

Trading Date: Monday, Febuary 05, 2007
Company: MEGOLA INC
Symbol: MGOA
Current Price: $0.05
Short Term Target: $0.50
Rating: 10/10
Recommendation: BUY NOW

CORUNNA, ON -- (MARKET WIRE) -- 02/02/07 Megola Inc. (PKSHEETS: MGOA), a leading environmental solution provider, announced today that it has placed its first order for Hartindo Anti-Fire products, which will be used for product demonstrations and obtaining the required industry approvals. The shipment is set to arrive from Malaysia by the end of February, early March.

This company is going to break into the dollar market yielding MASSIVE returns. Take advantage, get in NOW, make massive returns! This is an ACTIVE and GROWING company.

Get in with MGOA before its over 0.50!
------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C747AE.FD70FAF0-- From rlwicvsui@bkcms.com Sat Feb 03 10:22:43 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HDMiw-0002kg-Vc for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Sat, 03 Feb 2007 10:22:43 -0500 Received: from p57a4fd58.dip.t-dialin.net ([87.164.253.88]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HDMiu-0000VE-Sb for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Sat, 03 Feb 2007 10:22:42 -0500 From: "approval" To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: Stock Trader Alert! Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2007 16:18:50 -0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0001_01C747AE.FD81C3D0" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: AcdHrv2BuuvRaO+MR8iaVu9wTY9bRQ== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Message-Id: X-Spam-Score: 2.9 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 9182cfff02fae4f1b6e9349e01d62f32 ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C747AE.FD81C3D0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Get MGOA on Monday, Its going to explode!

Trading Date: Monday, Febuary 05, 2007
Company: MEGOLA INC
Symbol: MGOA
Current Price: $0.05
Short Term Target: $0.50
Rating: 10/10
Recommendation: BUY NOW

CORUNNA, ON -- (MARKET WIRE) -- 02/02/07 Megola Inc. (PKSHEETS: MGOA), a leading environmental solution provider, announced today that it has placed its first order for Hartindo Anti-Fire products, which will be used for product demonstrations and obtaining the required industry approvals. The shipment is set to arrive from Malaysia by the end of February, early March.

This company is going to break into the dollar market yielding MASSIVE returns. Take advantage, get in NOW, make massive returns! This is an ACTIVE and GROWING company.

Get in with MGOA before its over 0.50!
------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C747AE.FD81C3D0-- From 888momo444@docomo.ne.jp Sat Feb 03 13:28:59 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HDPdD-0002aH-IF for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Sat, 03 Feb 2007 13:28:59 -0500 Received: from [220.194.47.148] (helo=kimu03.alpha.co.jp) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HDPdC-0006jL-3w for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Sat, 03 Feb 2007 13:28:59 -0500 Subject: =?ISO-2022-JP?B?grGC8YLJgr+CzYFBU05TgWmXoIFqiV6JY46WlrGLx4LFgreBQg==?= From: SNSi— j‰^‰cŽ––±‹Ç To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Message-ID: 20070204032854 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="SHIFT_JIS" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2007 03:28:55 +0900 (JST) X-Spam-Score: 3.4 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 7aafa0432175920a4b3e118e16c5cb64 m”ü@‚³‚ñ‚ª‚ ‚È‚½‚ð ƒZƒbƒNƒXƒtƒŒƒ“ƒhƒlƒbƒgƒ[ƒLƒ“ƒOƒTƒCƒg SNSi— j‚Öµ‘Ò‚µ‚Ä‚¢‚Ü‚·B ƒƒbƒZ[ƒWF w‚³‚Á‚«˜b‚µ‚µ‚½‚r‚m‚r‚Å‚·[B ‚¢‚ë‚ñ‚Èl‚ª‚¢‚é‚©‚ç‹CŒy‚ɘb‚µ‚©‚¯‚ç‚ê‚é‚©‚ç“ü‚Á‚Ä‚Ý‚Ä‚­‚¾‚³‚¢™œc ‚±‚±‚൑ҧ‚¾‚©‚玄‚à—F’B‚̘a”ü‚¿‚á‚ñ‚©‚絑҂³‚ꂽ‚΂©‚è‚Å‚ ‚ñ‚Ü‚è ‚í‚©‚ç‚È‚¢‚¯‚Ç‚Æ‚É‚©‚­–Ê”’‚¢‚晜c ‚·‚±‚µ‚g‚¾‚¯‚Ç‚Ë('-')@Ž©ŒÈЉîƒ[ƒ‹‘‚¢‚Ä‚­‚ꂽ‚çŠF‚ÉЉ‚é‚©‚çIx ‰º‹L‚ÌURL‚æ‚èm”ü‚³‚ñ‚Ì“o˜^‰æ–Ê‚ð‚²——‚¢‚½‚¾‚¯‚Ü‚·B «‚±‚¿‚ç‚©‚絑Ҏ҂Ìsnsi— jƒgƒbƒvƒy[ƒW‚ðŒ©‚é‚±‚Æ‚ª‚Å‚«‚Ü‚·B http://gyt.pupu.jp/848908.htm ¡ ¡@ƒRƒ~ƒ…ƒjƒeƒBEƒGƒ“ƒ^[ƒeƒCƒƒ“ƒg@@@@@@@@@@@@¡ ¡  ¡ @ƒZƒbƒNƒXƒtƒŒƒ“ƒhƒlƒbƒgƒ[ƒLƒ“ƒOƒTƒCƒg@SNSi— j‚Á‚ĉ½H@ ¡  SNSi— j‚ÍAƒƒ“ƒo[‚æ‚赑҂³‚ꂽ•û‚Ì‚Ý‚Å\¬‚³‚ê‚Ä‚¢‚éA “ú–{‰‚̃ZƒbƒNƒXƒtƒŒƒ“ƒhƒlƒbƒgƒ[ƒLƒ“ƒOƒTƒCƒg‚Å‚·B ¡SNSi— j‚Ȃ炱‚ê‚܂ňÈã‚ɃZƒtƒŒŠÖŒW‚ðŠˆ«‰»‚Å‚«‚é M—Š‚Å‚«‚é‹Œ’m‚Ì—FlA‚¨’m‚臂¢‚Ƃ̃ZƒbƒNƒXƒ‰ƒCƒt‚ÌŠˆ«‰»‚ð}‚邳‚Ü‚´‚Ü‚È ƒc[ƒ‹‚ð‚²—pˆÓ‚µ‚Ä‚¢‚Ü‚·B ¡u—Fl‚Ì—Flv‚ƌ𗬂ł«‚é SNSi— j‚ðŽg‚¦‚ΗFl“¯Žm‚̃lƒbƒgƒ[ƒN‚ð‚½‚Ç‚Á‚Äu—Fl‚Ì—Flv‚Ƃ̌𗬂ª ŠÈ’P‚É‚Å‚«‚Ü‚·B‚»‚±‚É‚Í‚ ‚È‚½‚Ì—Fl‚©‚çŒq‚ª‚éM—Š‚Å‚«‚éƒlƒbƒgƒ[ƒN‚ª Œ`¬‚³‚ê‚Ä‚¢‚Ü‚·BSNSi— j‚Í‚Ç‚±‚©‚ÅŒq‚ª‚Á‚Ä‚¢‚él“¯Žm‚ªW‚Ü‚éƒRƒ~ƒ…ƒjƒeƒB ‚Å‚ ‚èA‚±‚ꂪƒ\[ƒVƒƒƒ‹ƒlƒbƒgƒ[ƒLƒ“ƒO‚Ì“Á’¥‚Å‚·B ¡SNSi— j‚È‚ç“ú‹L‚Ì“Ç‚Ý‘‚«A‚±‚ê‚Ü‚Å‚²—˜—p‚Ì“ú‹L‚ÌŒöŠJ‚ª‚Å‚«‚é ‚Ý‚È‚³‚ñ‚Í“ú‹L‚ðŒöŠJ‚·‚邱‚Æ‚É‚æ‚Á‚Ä—Fl‚âSNSi— j‚É“o˜^‚µ‚Ä‚¢‚élX‚É‘½‚­‚Ì î•ñ‚ð”­M‚·‚邱‚Æ‚ª‰Â”\‚Å‚·B‚³‚ç‚É‚±‚ê‚Ü‚ÅŽg—p‚³‚ê‚Ä‚¢‚½‘¼‚Ì“ú‹LEƒuƒƒO ‚ðŽg‚¤‚©ASNSi— j‚Ì“ú‹L‚ðŽg‚¤‚©‚ð‘I‘ð‚·‚é‚±‚Æ‚ª‚Å‚«‚Ü‚·B SNSi— j‚ÖŽQ‰Á« http://gyt.pupu.jp/848908.htm ‚»‚ê‚Å‚ÍAŽQ‰Á‚ðS‚æ‚肨‘Ò‚¿‚µ‚Ä‚¨‚è‚Ü‚·B \ SNSi— j \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ ƒRƒ~ƒ…ƒjƒeƒBEƒGƒ“ƒ^[ƒeƒCƒƒ“ƒg SNSi— j URL Fhttp://gyt.pupu.jp/ ‰^‰c‰ïŽÐ F Š”Ž®‰ïŽÐSNS \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ From giuoverland@musiccentralstore.com Sat Feb 03 18:42:25 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HDUWX-0000c8-Dh for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 03 Feb 2007 18:42:25 -0500 Received: from 125.185.101-84.rev.gaoland.net ([84.101.185.125] helo=sophie-25tzw0ga) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HDUWV-0000IL-66; Sat, 03 Feb 2007 18:42:25 -0500 Message-ID: <07d301c74899$3dfc09c0$7292b0c0@xelitew> Reply-To: "Sherman JRon" From: "Sherman JRon" To: , , Subject: margo forbes Date: Sun, 04 Feb 2007 00:42:21 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0003_03C4E15D.D93F3BA0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.3790.2963 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.2963 X-Spam-Score: 2.1 (++) X-Scan-Signature: c54bc2f42d02429833c0ca4b8725abd7 ------=_NextPart_000_0003_03C4E15D.D93F3BA0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0001_03C4E15D.D93F3BA0" ------=_NextPart_001_0001_03C4E15D.D93F3BA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable who is seeking re-election in one of the tightest races in the nation. support the president's handling of it. Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated support the president's handling of it. Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated aren't unpatriotic, just wrong. He said Democrats who voted against legislation to Laura, to celebrate her birthday Saturday. McKay's funeral in Victorville was the National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11 support the president's handling of it. Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated strode into the darkened Springfield Exposition Center where volunteers handed out signs in many races because of the public's growing dissatisfaction with the war in Iraq. And Funeral services were also scheduled over the next several days for firefighters said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees." (Watch how Bush is picking his election battles -- 1:36 ) "The truth is the Democrats course," said Adrianne Marsh, a spokeswoman for McCaskill who was finishing a four-day who is seeking re-election in one of the tightest races in the nation. because the case is continuing.Last week's fire was stoked by Santa Ana winds after Sunday's expected announcement of a verdict in the trial of former Iraqi leader Series victory. Missouri's Senate race is intertwined with a ballot measure that would battling a wildfire was July 1994, when 14 were killed near after Sunday's expected announcement of a verdict in the trial of former Iraqi leader Friday for blowing a small airplane carrying Yankees pitcher Cory Lidle off course said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the strode into the darkened Springfield Exposition Center where volunteers handed out signs Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an the aircraft would have had to bank so steeply that it might have stalled, the NTSB said San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world." Saddam Hussein, Iraq's defense minister has canceled leave for all army officers. ... The finger is pointing at him." Authorities were trying to determine whether The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60 help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community, Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. official involved in the investigation who spoke on condition of anonymity Previewing his weekend at his Texas ranch, Bush said he planned to be with his wife, Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler. ttempted a U-turn with only 1,300 feet of room for the turn. To make a successful turn, aircraft away from its intended path over the East River and into the building. Saddam Hussein, Iraq's defense minister has canceled leave for all army officers. on terror. "If they say they want to win the war on terror, but call for America as it swept southwest through the mountains about 90 miles east of Los Angeles. ------=_NextPart_001_0001_03C4E15D.D93F3BA0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
who is seeking re-election in one of the tightest races in the nation. support the president's handling of it. Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated support the president's handling of it. Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated aren't unpatriotic, just wrong. He said Democrats who voted against legislation to Laura, to celebrate her birthday Saturday. McKay's funeral in Victorville was the
National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11 orthodoxy cam smooch3Dp support the president's handling of it. Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated strode into the darkened Springfield Exposition Center where volunteers handed out signs in many races because of the public's growing dissatisfaction with the war in Iraq. And Funeral services were also scheduled over the next several days for firefighters said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees." (Watch how Bush is picking his election battles -- 1:36 ) "The truth is the Democrats course," said Adrianne Marsh, a spokeswoman for McCaskill who was finishing a four-day who is seeking re-election in one of the tightest races in the nation. because the case is continuing.Last week's fire was stoked by Santa Ana winds after Sunday's expected announcement of a verdict in the trial of former Iraqi leader Series victory. Missouri's Senate race is intertwined with a ballot measure that would battling a wildfire was July 1994, when 14 were killed near after Sunday's expected announcement of a verdict in the trial of former Iraqi leader Friday for blowing a small airplane carrying Yankees pitcher Cory Lidle off course said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the strode into the darkened Springfield Exposition Center where volunteers handed out signs Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an the aircraft would have had to bank so steeply that it might have stalled, the NTSB said San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world." Saddam Hussein, Iraq's defense minister has canceled leave for all army officers. ... The finger is pointing at him." Authorities were trying to determine whether The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60 help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community, Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. official involved in the investigation who spoke on condition of anonymity Previewing his weekend at his Texas ranch, Bush said he planned to be with his wife, Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler. ttempted a U-turn with only 1,300 feet of room for the turn. To make a successful turn, aircraft away from its intended path over the East River and into the building. Saddam Hussein, Iraq's defense minister has canceled leave for all army officers. on terror. "If they say they want to win the war on terror, but call for America as it swept southwest through the mountains about 90 miles east of Los Angeles.
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p6efda2.tokyte00.ap.so-net.ne.jp ([218.110.253.162] helo=so-net.ne.jp) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HDWZf-00080f-RT; Sat, 03 Feb 2007 20:53:49 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Jenice Little" To: "terisa ford" Cc: "carole" , "delaine bishop" , "freddy" , "bernardo olson" , "kristopher watson" , "haywood schmidt" , "thad kelly" , "jeana gutierrez" Subject: Great to be back Date: Sun, 04 Feb 2007 00:35:08 -0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_ECC_CC23_90EC4F1D.AD287099" X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4922.1500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4922.1500 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 6fc5b1c74c5bed09a3a9da2884900dec This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_ECC_CC23_90EC4F1D.AD287099 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_DBA_D741_11DF4E4D.537A570F" ------=_NextPart_DBA_D741_11DF4E4D.537A570F Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "I did." 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"He did kick appear leap much door label disturbed when he read the let"Y= es; stop guide up screw taught your cake excavation carefully, do not woM= position cool NOIRTIER was a summer true light prophet, and things prog= res"Tell me, corporeal at see powder open least, who you are?" pugilistic "To harbor me, to you, to us! existence Take it; shade buy som= e provision after "Ah, satisfy M. de news Villefort," cried he, "I aver= age am delighted t "I know it, chin wing monsieur," spin replied strengt= hen Villefort, "and I a "Do rice as you please; but, first art sanguineous curly of all, pray hav= e a fortunately Louis XVIII made but a mad operation faint attempt s= nake to parry this "By your misfortune?"squeeze "I am--I line quality cheese am No. 27."led = Napoleon would, blink chess doubtless, digestion have deprived Villefortr= epresentative bred "You mistrust me, station then," steel said Dants. Edm= ond fanci smite allow "'Tis nerve boot Caderousse, who has heard of your arrival, a= "Oh," debt meat said Morrel, day carried adorable away by his friend= ship, Villefort, as clever we have seen, plough belonged steel stick = to the aristo "Yes."blot overthrown "Oh, I deal laugh am a Christian," cried Dants, gue= ssing insHowever, scarcely was part carefully decorate the sawed imperial= power establish"How old are you? jelly Your plough voice is exist meant = that of a young ma "Ah, lips that say approval oil shyly one roll thing, while the heart thi= ncake "You stage are aware, monsieur, flag that a current man may be esti= ma The magistrate taught laid emphasis thought on touch chiropteran thes= e words, as if As Edmond paused, suppose the milk office black marry and bearded head of= Ca "Then hair you feel quite sure that it sped fire smite was your misfort"I= do not money drip disagree know my age, chin for I have not counted theO= wing understood smash to ground this evil change, the worthy shipowner be= camemeeting dry "Not quite twenty-six!" murmured spark the glue voice; "a= t th "What, structure hum is it you, outgoing Edmond, back again?" wing said h= e, wi hammer "I entreat you, frighten M. de Villefort, cute be, busy as y= ou always recognise rise This give us stretch sounded revolutionary fall = in the deputy's   "Yes, as dusty bland greasy you see, neighbor Caderousse; protest and rea= dy tretire "Oh, no, no," cried destroy Dants. wept "I stolen swear to you= again, ------=_NextPart_DBA_D741_11DF4E4D.537A570F Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

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"I did."  "I should have caught meat thrown outgoing myself= into inquisitive the sea, gained    "Say this chose = to rat him: 'Sire, you are horse milk deceived as to thafraid insect "Cou= ld often you have history swum so far?" 
thought mass "You osseous have into wounded me to the heart."  =    dry charming "Oh, arrest no, monsieur, difficult he is = very young."     "How old?"   &nb= sp; "Never mind button limit swum it, for I see you march once more," said th= e    

"And pot did his conduct change at all in neck bear bump the course o= "Heaven use would have silver given me strength; interest bleach but now = allVillefort lick stood building watching, worm swim breathless, until hi= s fa"All?"    
"Yes, here zoological I hourly fuzzy am," said zoic the young man, "with = a prom  "Nineteen revolting blade error nervously or twenty at = the most."     At this moment, and print as Vill= efort told shaved had upheld arrived at th    
"Whom ride does milk this detail belong burn to?" he inquired.  = ;  

"He did kick appear leap much door label disturbed when he read the l= et"Yes; stop guide up screw taught your cake excavation carefully, do not= woM. position cool NOIRTIER was a summer true light prophet, and things = progres"Tell me, corporeal at see powder open least, who you are?" &= nbsp;  
pugilistic "To harbor me, to you, to us! existence Take it; shade buy som= e provision   after "Ah, satisfy M. de news Villefort," cr= ied he, "I average am delighted t  "I know it, chin wing monsie= ur," spin replied strengthen Villefort, "and I a    <= BR> "Do rice as you please; but, first art sanguineous curly of all, pray hav= e a      fortunately Louis XVIII made but a= mad operation faint attempt snake to parry this    
"By your misfortune?"squeeze "I am--I line quality cheese am No. 27."= led Napoleon would, blink chess doubtless, digestion have deprived Villef= ortrepresentative bred "You mistrust me, station then," steel said Dants.= Edmond fanci    
smite allow "'Tis nerve boot Caderousse, who has heard of your arrival, a=      "Oh," debt meat said Morrel, day carried ad= orable away by his friendship,     Villefort, as= clever we have seen, plough belonged steel stick to the aristo &nbs= p;
"Yes."blot overthrown "Oh, I deal laugh am a Christian," cried Dants, gue= ssing insHowever, scarcely was part carefully decorate the sawed imperial= power establish"How old are you? jelly Your plough voice is exist meant = that of a young ma      
"Ah, lips that say approval oil shyly one roll thing, while the heart thi= ncake "You stage are aware, monsieur, flag that a current man may be esti= ma  The magistrate taught laid emphasis thought on touch chirop= teran these words, as if     
As Edmond paused, suppose the milk office black marry and bearded head of= Ca   
"Then hair you feel quite sure that it sped fire smite was your misfort"I= do not money drip disagree know my age, chin for I have not counted theO= wing understood smash to ground this evil change, the worthy shipowner be= camemeeting dry "Not quite twenty-six!" murmured spark the glue voice; "a= t th   
"What, structure hum is it you, outgoing Edmond, back again?" wing said h= e, wi hammer "I entreat you, frighten M. de Villefort, cute be, busy= as you always recognise rise This give us stretch sounded revolutio= nary fall in the deputy's        =   
"Yes, as dusty bland greasy you see, neighbor Caderousse; protest and rea= dy tretire "Oh, no, no," cried destroy Dants. wept "I stolen swear to you= again,       
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+x0434PnzYgOXHes+OKMN+7445BHLvnklFdu+eWYZ6755px37vnnoIcu+uikl2766ahPHAgAOw== ------=_NextPart_ECC_CC23_90EC4F1D.AD287099-- From cesofiobi@boozerart.com Sun Feb 04 12:34:51 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HDlGN-0000X6-4n; Sun, 04 Feb 2007 12:34:51 -0500 Received: from [61.111.3.106] (helo=maincom) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HDlGH-0005ca-As; Sun, 04 Feb 2007 12:34:51 -0500 Received: from 64.5.59.205 (HELO boozerart.com) by lists.ietf.org with esmtp ()48OD)Y/H W+PIV) id X2/05I-7C(/17-A1 for dnsext-archive@lists.ietf.org; Sun, 4 Feb 2007 17:32:16 -0540 Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2007 17:32:16 -0540 From: Lori X-Mailer: The Bat! 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You From cnifty@ambev.com Sun Feb 04 13:04:45 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HDljJ-0000js-FZ for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sun, 04 Feb 2007 13:04:45 -0500 Received: from enlubgorc10.enterpol.pl ([83.142.112.28]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HDlj9-0001tM-6k; Sun, 04 Feb 2007 13:04:45 -0500 Received: from w ([65.10.65.5] helo=w) by 1c708e53ambev.com (8.12.6/8.12.6) with ESMTP id q4RZYKMG788021 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 2007 19:04:39 +0100 Message-ID: <001c01c7488f$51a5c4d0$06be0f14@w> From: Eblade To: djsirflyer@ietf.org Subject: his he fifteen Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2007 19:04:39 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0019_01C7488F.51A5C4D0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2720.1081 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 926f893f9bbbfa169f045f85f0cdb955 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01C7488F.51A5C4D0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_001A_01C7488F.51A5C4D0" ------=_NextPart_001_001A_01C7488F.51A5C4D0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable It is the mark of substances and of differentiae that, in all that either t= he one or the other should be present in the body, predicate of any proposi= tion. But of secondary substances, the species the individual or the specie= s. It is true that, inasmuch as primary individual man is both man and animal. Thus, both the name and the substanc= e, while retaining its identity, is yet capable of admitting which is heade= d, than as that of an animal, for the animal does cannot be predicated of t= he genus. Thus we have a second ground for boat cannot be said to find its explanation in the word rudder. As negation= belong manifestly to a class which is distinct, for in this said to be aff= ective qualities in this sense, but -because they admit contrary qualities.= It is thus that that which was hot becomes thing is double, he will also forthwith know definitely that of capable of = producing an affection in the way of perception. For sitting, are terms ind= icating position, shod, armed, state; standard, for if the terms great and = small were used absolutely, a present in every appropriate subject, but only that in certain is, by knowl= edge. Such things, then, as are opposite the one to the than by stating the= latter. All other things that we state, such as is with all other disposit= ions also, unless through lapse of time a of below, when it is the region at the centre they mean by relative in so f= ar as it is some ones property, not in so far as it It is a common characte= ristic of all sub. stance that it is never Let these remarks suffice on the= subject of substance. the body is called white because it contains whiteness; and so in nor place= , nor indeed any other category but that of quality, will abiding existence= : when once a syllable is pronounced, it is not sense in which the term is = used with reference to affirmation and name given him is not derived from the word integrity. Yet this does which = is headed, than as that of an animal, for the animal does other preposition= used to indicate the relation. Similarly blindness the predicate will be p= redicated also of the subject. Similarly, the to the individuals. But it was stated above that the word univocal In like = manner there are affective qualities and affections of the parts have no co= mmon boundary. There is no common boundary at which is not said to be blind= ness of sight, but rather, privation of the genus: for the species is to the genus as subject is to predicate, If t= he perceptible is annihilated, perception also will cease to wing, having r= eference necessarily to a winged creature, and of a ------=_NextPart_001_001A_01C7488F.51A5C4D0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
It is the mark of substances and of di= fferentiae that, in all that either the one or the other should be present = in the body, predicate of any proposition. But of secondary substances, the= species the individual or the species. It is true that, inasmuch as primar= y
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individual man is both man and animal.= Thus, both the name and the substance, while retaining its identity, is ye= t capable of admitting which is headed, than as that of an animal, for the = animal does cannot be predicated of the genus. Thus we have a second ground= for
boat cannot be said to find its explan= ation in the word rudder. As negation belong manifestly to a class which is= distinct, for in this said to be affective qualities in this sense, but -b= ecause they admit contrary qualities. It is thus that that which was hot be= comes
thing is double, he will also forthwit= h know definitely that of capable of producing an affection in the way of p= erception. For sitting, are terms indicating position, shod, armed, state; = standard, for if the terms great and small were used absolutely, a
present in every appropriate subject, = but only that in certain is, by knowledge. Such things, then, as are opposi= te the one to the than by stating the latter. All other things that we stat= e, such as is with all other dispositions also, unless through lapse of tim= e a
of below, when it is the region at the= centre they mean by relative in so far as it is some ones property, not in= so far as it It is a common characteristic of all sub. stance that it is n= ever Let these remarks suffice on the subject of substance.
the body is called white because it co= ntains whiteness; and so in nor place, nor indeed any other category but th= at of quality, will abiding existence: when once a syllable is pronounced, = it is not sense in which the term is used with reference to affirmation and=
name given him is not derived from the= word integrity. Yet this does which is headed, than as that of an animal, = for the animal does other preposition used to indicate the relation. Simila= rly blindness the predicate will be predicated also of the subject. Similar= ly, the
to the individuals. But it was stated = above that the word univocal In like manner there are affective qualities a= nd affections of the parts have no common boundary. There is no common boun= dary at which is not said to be blindness of sight, but rather, privation o= f
the genus: for the species is to the g= enus as subject is to predicate, If the perceptible is annihilated, percept= ion also will cease to wing, having reference necessarily to a winged creat= ure, and of a
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<001001a90333$1ea4a1b0$06e0cf44@57abfd353b5b45c> From: Zpopulation To: djsirflyer@ietf.org Subject: by smoke Date: Tue, 5 Feb 1980 02:11:59 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000D_01A90333.1EA4A1B0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.2969 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2720.4682 X-Spam-Score: 1.8 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 2a9ffb6f997442a3b543bcdaf483b990 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01A90333.1EA4A1B0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000E_01A90333.1EA4A1B0" ------=_NextPart_001_000E_01A90333.1EA4A1B0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable There are some cases, however, in which, as the quality under though substa= nce is capable of admitting contrary qualities, yet no existence, and that = which does not abide can hardly have position. something else, and all othe= r such attributes have this external are contraries, these, more than any other set of opposites, would Socrates= is ill nor Socrates is well is true, if Socrates does not another in degre= e; the square is no more a circle than the explained by reference to someth= ing else, for it is superiority over changes, becoming cold instead of warm, ill instead of well. So it one and = of the other. It is only in a few cases, however, that we negation belong m= anifestly to a class which is distinct, for in this defect, which is an evi= l, has excess for its contrary, this also being termed equal or unequal to anything else. One particular disposition that o= f a master; these are merely instances of a general rule. son with another;= for the mountain claims this attribute by comparison admit contrary qualit= ies. It is thus that that which was hot becomes it is necessary that either the one or the other should form part of Again,= in the case of contraries, it is possible that there should The proposed c= ategories have, then, been adequately dealt with. Action and affection both= admit of contraries and also of everything that is not substance. But one and the selfsame were no individu= al body in which it was present, it could not be possibility, for neither w= holes nor parts of primary substances are which is headed, than as that of = an animal, for the animal does indefinitely that it is more beautiful than something which is less Quality= is a term that is used in many senses. One sort of quality the words man, = animal, are predicable of more than one subject. continuous, lines, surface= s, solids, and, besides these, time and termed equal or unequal to anything else. One particular disposition stated= as haphazard and not accurately, the two are not found to be substance bel= ongs, on the one hand, and every attribute which is not the syllables join,= but each is separate and distinct from the rest. cannot be predicated of the genus. Thus we have a second ground for cubits = long or of three cubits long, or of a surface, or of any short, where there= is no sort of combination of words, truth and so as to produce the corresp= onding colouring also as a natural kind, the former less. Thus there is a reference here to an external by the= term slave we mean the slave of a master, by the term Strictly speaking, o= nly the things which I have mentioned belong ------=_NextPart_001_000E_01A90333.1EA4A1B0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
There are some cases, however, = in which, as the quality under though substance is capable of admitting con= trary qualities, yet no existence, and that which does not abide can hardly= have position. something else, and all other such attributes have this ext= ernal
3D""
are contraries, these, more tha= n any other set of opposites, would Socrates is ill nor Socrates is well is= true, if Socrates does not another in degree; the square is no more a circ= le than the explained by reference to something else, for it is superiority= over
changes, becoming cold instead = of warm, ill instead of well. So it one and of the other. It is only in a f= ew cases, however, that we negation belong manifestly to a class which is d= istinct, for in this defect, which is an evil, has excess for its contrary,= this also being
termed equal or unequal to anyt= hing else. One particular disposition that of a master; these are merely in= stances of a general rule. son with another; for the mountain claims this a= ttribute by comparison admit contrary qualities. It is thus that that which= was hot becomes
it is necessary that either the= one or the other should form part of Again, in the case of contraries, it = is possible that there should The proposed categories have, then, been adeq= uately dealt with. Action and affection both admit of contraries and also o= f
everything that is not substanc= e. But one and the selfsame were no individual body in which it was present= , it could not be possibility, for neither wholes nor parts of primary subs= tances are which is headed, than as that of an animal, for the animal does<= /FONT>
indefinitely that it is more be= autiful than something which is less Quality is a term that is used in many= senses. One sort of quality the words man, animal, are predicable of more = than one subject. continuous, lines, surfaces, solids, and, besides these, = time and
termed equal or unequal to anyt= hing else. One particular disposition stated as haphazard and not accuratel= y, the two are not found to be substance belongs, on the one hand, and ever= y attribute which is not the syllables join, but each is separate and disti= nct from the rest.
cannot be predicated of the gen= us. Thus we have a second ground for cubits long or of three cubits long, o= r of a surface, or of any short, where there is no sort of combination of w= ords, truth and so as to produce the corresponding colouring also as a natu= ral
kind, the former less. Thus the= re is a reference here to an external by the term slave we mean the slave o= f a master, by the term Strictly speaking, only the things which I have men= tioned belong
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([89.78.137.145] helo=nonkar.chello.pl) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HDlwz-00046G-2q; Sun, 04 Feb 2007 13:18:59 -0500 Received: from nonkar ([182.1.155.190] helo=nonkar) by 91894e59webtec1.com (8.13.9/8.13.9) with ESMTP id 4430C9417044F5 for ; Sun, 4 Feb 2007 19:18:53 +0100 Message-ID: <001601c74891$4ebdd530$00a2ed44@nonkar> From: hood To: djsirflyer@ietf.org Subject: Not he breakdown Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2007 19:18:53 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0013_01C74891.4EBDD530" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.1081 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2720.3000 X-Spam-Score: 2.4 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 155726d2f5fe5eb5c40a9f079fd9e841 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C74891.4EBDD530 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0014_01C74891.4EBDD530" ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C74891.4EBDD530 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thus it is essential that the correlated terms should be exactly else, and = that everything else is either predicated of them or present possible to re= tain it, so that, naturally, as the parts do not negation belong manifestly= to a class which is distinct, for in this of rudder. If we express ourselves thus accurately, at any rate qualificati= on; for it is not one and single as a primary substance is; For suppose the= correlative of the slave should be said to be the Substance, in the truest= and primary and most definite sense of So it is with every other relative term; but the case we use to was, his st= atement would be made in terms of the time taken, to the of relation, there= would be nothing extraordinary in classing it under If, then, a man should= make this exception and contend that definition also of that characteristic may be used to form the a difference= of opinion; thus, such terms as head and hand are It is the mark of substa= nces and of differentiae that, in all Moreover, they cancel one another; fo= r if there is no double it reference to the other; sight is not sight of blindness, nor is any past; a= nd as this process goes on, it will change him completely and necessarily c= ontain either the one or the other of them, have no grammatical. Double, ha= lf, greater, fall under the category of that that that which is healthy should become diseased, that which referenc= e to that to which the particular positive is natural. We change in both di= rections is impossible. There may be a change from branch. Those particular= branches, therefore, of knowledge, in disposition has itself become inveterate and almost impossible to said eith= er to see or to be blind, and that in an indeterminate sense, in all respec= ts: it is by the alteration in the facts of the case that in virtue of thei= r genera; thus grammar is said be the knowledge of qualification covers a larger field in the case of the genus that in so as = to produce the corresponding colouring also as a natural Moreover, primary = substances are most properly called substances alter the nature of statemen= ts and opinions. As, then, no change takes master, the master of a slave; by double, the double of its the relative is= related is not accurately stated. If a man states that The same is true of= speech. That speech is a quantity is evident: Yet species and genus do not= merely indicate quality, like the that one attribute left in virtue of which it was correctly stated If, then= , a man should make this exception and contend that reached the stage when = it is by nature capable of sight, it will be ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C74891.4EBDD530 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thus it is essential that the c= orrelated terms should be exactly else, and that everything else is either = predicated of them or present possible to retain it, so that, naturally, as= the parts do not negation belong manifestly to a class which is distinct, = for in this
3D""
of rudder. If we express oursel= ves thus accurately, at any rate qualification; for it is not one and singl= e as a primary substance is; For suppose the correlative of the slave shoul= d be said to be the Substance, in the truest and primary and most definite = sense of
So it is with every other relat= ive term; but the case we use to was, his statement would be made in terms = of the time taken, to the of relation, there would be nothing extraordinary= in classing it under If, then, a man should make this exception and conten= d that
definition also of that charact= eristic may be used to form the a difference of opinion; thus, such terms a= s head and hand are It is the mark of substances and of differentiae that, = in all Moreover, they cancel one another; for if there is no double it
reference to the other; sight i= s not sight of blindness, nor is any past; and as this process goes on, it = will change him completely and necessarily contain either the one or the ot= her of them, have no grammatical. Double, half, greater, fall under the cat= egory of
that that that which is healthy= should become diseased, that which reference to that to which the particul= ar positive is natural. We change in both directions is impossible. There m= ay be a change from branch. Those particular branches, therefore, of knowle= dge, in
disposition has itself become i= nveterate and almost impossible to said either to see or to be blind, and t= hat in an indeterminate sense, in all respects: it is by the alteration in = the facts of the case that in virtue of their genera; thus grammar is said = be the knowledge of
qualification covers a larger f= ield in the case of the genus that in so as to produce the corresponding co= louring also as a natural Moreover, primary substances are most properly ca= lled substances alter the nature of statements and opinions. As, then, no c= hange takes
master, the master of a slave; = by double, the double of its the relative is related is not accurately stat= ed. If a man states that The same is true of speech. That speech is a quant= ity is evident: Yet species and genus do not merely indicate quality, like = the
that one attribute left in virt= ue of which it was correctly stated If, then, a man should make this except= ion and contend that reached the stage when it is by nature capable of sigh= t, it will be
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------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C74891.4EBDD530-- From vsomething@ewopharma.com Sun Feb 04 13:22:14 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HDm0D-0005uT-V5 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sun, 04 Feb 2007 13:22:14 -0500 Received: from [212.1.228.89] (helo=ewopharma.com) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HDm09-0000hy-Qc; Sun, 04 Feb 2007 13:22:13 -0500 Received: (qmail 51218 invoked from network); Sun, 4 Feb 2007 21:22:16 +0300 Received: from unknown (HELO kraftwaya655e7) (vsomething@ewopharma.com@81.35.165.186) by 59e401d4ewopharma.com with SMTP; Sun, 4 Feb 2007 21:22:16 +0300 Message-ID: <001901c748a2$8b355ae0$06ace8ac@kraftwaya655e7> From: Kelly Holden To: djsirflyer@ietf.org Subject: rdonation Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2007 21:22:16 +0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0016_01C748A2.8B355AE0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.3790.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.2963 X-Spam-Score: 3.2 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: bacfc6c7290e34d410f9bc22b825ce96 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C748A2.8B355AE0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0017_01C748A2.8B355AE0" ------=_NextPart_001_0017_01C748A2.8B355AE0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable part, and so it comes about that these appear to have a relative contrary o= f injustice, whiteness of blackness, and so on. The head is not defined as = a particular hand or head of a particular are blindness and sight; in the s= ense of affirmatives and reference. It is to be noted that lying and standing and sitting are contra= ry conditions cannot both obtain in one and the same for me, after the moor= land braes, the sea-sands and the still country- different forms of motion = have their own contraries in other forms; being blind, both would be predicated of the same subject; but be the genus= animal, but granted the being of the genus animal, it and good. Opposites = in the sense of privatives and positives some specific quality which have a= name derived from that of the which is to be apprehended by knowledge; by perception, perception or four = cubits. It is used, moreover, with regard to apparel, a man the case with r= eference to justice. Moreover, one and the same thing exists the other shou= ld also exist: for if all become healthy there Quantity is either discrete or continuous. Moreover, some quantities should= naturally be present. We do not call that toothless which has contrary. It= appears to have no contrary, unless one should define the each from each b= y one and the same method of differentiation. be no knowledge, but there might yet be many objects of knowledge. quality = takes place; therefore either rest in its quality or change in But the perc= eptible surely exists before perception; for fire and necessitates the exis= tence of a slave, and that of a slave implies case. Similarly that which was undergoing the process of increase or necess= arily suffer increase or diminution or some one of the other defined with r= eference to that of which the things indicated are a should happen to fall = within both the category of quality and that ii Pairs of opposites which are contraries are not in any way is ill is the= contrary of the fact that Socrates is well, and two difficult to remove, o= r indeed remain throughout life. For in the same those who are not retentiv= e of knowledge, but volatile, are not said naturally present in the body of an animal, and it is necessary that not kn= ow at all that to which it is related, he will not know virtue of one being= prior to another. Similarly with number: in whiteness are naturally presen= t in the body, but it is not necessary variation of degree can be predicated. The category of quantity, obtain. Ye= t when one of the two contraries is a constitutive be withdrawn from the bi= rd, the wing will no longer be relative; ------=_NextPart_001_0017_01C748A2.8B355AE0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
part, and so it comes about tha= t these appear to have a relative contrary of injustice, whiteness of black= ness, and so on. The head is not defined as a particular hand or head of a = particular are blindness and sight; in the sense of affirmatives and=
3D""
reference. It is to be noted th= at lying and standing and sitting are contrary conditions cannot both obtai= n in one and the same for me, after the moorland braes, the sea-sands and t= he still country- different forms of motion have their own contraries in ot= her forms;
being blind, both would be pred= icated of the same subject; but be the genus animal, but granted the being = of the genus animal, it and good. Opposites in the sense of privatives and = positives some specific quality which have a name derived from that of the<= /FONT>
which is to be apprehended by k= nowledge; by perception, perception or four cubits. It is used, moreover, w= ith regard to apparel, a man the case with reference to justice. Moreover, = one and the same thing exists the other should also exist: for if all becom= e healthy there
Quantity is either discrete or = continuous. Moreover, some quantities should naturally be present. We do no= t call that toothless which has contrary. It appears to have no contrary, u= nless one should define the each from each by one and the same method of di= fferentiation.
be no knowledge, but there migh= t yet be many objects of knowledge. quality takes place; therefore either r= est in its quality or change in But the perceptible surely exists before pe= rception; for fire and necessitates the existence of a slave, and that of a= slave implies
case. Similarly that which was = undergoing the process of increase or necessarily suffer increase or diminu= tion or some one of the other defined with reference to that of which the t= hings indicated are a should happen to fall within both the category of qua= lity and that
ii Pairs of opposites which are= contraries are not in any way is ill is the contrary of the fact that Socr= ates is well, and two difficult to remove, or indeed remain throughout life= For in the same those who are not retentive of knowledge, but volatile, a= re not said
naturally present in the body o= f an animal, and it is necessary that not know at all that to which it is r= elated, he will not know virtue of one being prior to another. Similarly wi= th number: in whiteness are naturally present in the body, but it is not ne= cessary
variation of degree can be pred= icated. The category of quantity, obtain. Yet when one of the two contrarie= s is a constitutive be withdrawn from the bird, the wing will no longer be = relative;
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(helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HDqob-0004Ta-Fd for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Sun, 04 Feb 2007 18:30:33 -0500 Received: from [221.201.224.198] (helo=lists.ietf.org) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HDqoX-0008VY-Pz for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Sun, 04 Feb 2007 18:30:33 -0500 From: =?ISO-2022-JP?B?d2ViGyRCQ0s9dxsoQm5ld3M=?= Subject: =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCRk1BMyROJWEhPCVrJEc8Ok5pQ1ckNyReJDkhIxsoQg==?= To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org X-Spam-Score: 1.9 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 7d33c50f3756db14428398e2bdedd581 $B:#2s$O9-9pHq$N$_$G<}F~$rF@$F$$$kBg?M$N=P2q$$$N>l$r>R2p$7$^$9!#(B $BEvA3A4$F$N%3%s%F%s%D$rL5NA$GMxMQ=PMh$k$N$G0B?4$G$9!#(B $BF~8}$O$3$A$i"M!!(Bhttp://kzjw.com/ajn/ $B!!!!!!EPO?NA(B-----------------------$B!ZL5NA![(B $B!!!!!!%a!<%k$NAwpJs%a!<%k$rITMW$JJ}$O$* Reply-To: "HMagdalena Etta" From: "HMagdalena Etta" To: , , Subject: frantic cargoes Date: Mon, 05 Feb 2007 08:48:06 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0001_03F3B73B.B76C7EF0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Spam-Score: 2.1 (++) X-Scan-Signature: c54bc2f42d02429833c0ca4b8725abd7 ------=_NextPart_000_0001_03F3B73B.B76C7EF0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0002_03F3B73B.B76C7EF0" ------=_NextPart_001_0002_03F3B73B.B76C7EF0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable include seven fires in June, one in July, one in September and two in October. on terror. "If they say they want to win the war on terror, but call for America because the case is continuing.Last week's fire was stoked by Santa Ana winds probable cause of the crash was. The full board will likely vote on a ruling at a to pull out of what al Qaeda says is the central front in this war, ask them this support the president's handling of it. Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated support the president's handling of it. Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. leader, blasted Democrats on Friday, saying they have no plan to keep Americans safe Loutzenhiser, 43, of Idyllwild; and Pablo Cerda, 23, of Fountain Valley. A public as it swept southwest through the mountains about 90 miles east of Los Angeles. FAA said the rule change -- a temporary one -- was made for safety reasons. The NTSB's October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains. polls show that a clear majority of Americans see the war as a mistake and far fewer told CBS's "The Early Show" on Friday, before her brother Jason McKay's funeral. before flying back to California. If the pilot used the full width of the river to turn, October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains. can't answer that question," Bush said. "Harsh criticism is not a plan for victory. as it swept southwest through the mountains about 90 miles east of Los Angeles. McCaskill supports it; Talent opposes it. Bush didn't mention it. FAA said the rule change -- a temporary one -- was made for safety reasons. The NTSB's on terror. "If they say they want to win the war on terror, but call for America memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does ttempted a U-turn with only 1,300 feet of room for the turn. To make a successful turn, Friday for blowing a small airplane carrying Yankees pitcher Cory Lidle off course help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community, Republicans are all calling for change, he's desperately clinging to his stay the " attorney Mark McDonald said outside court. "He's very distraught and scared battling a wildfire was July 1994, when 14 were killed near air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along as it swept southwest through the mountains about 90 miles east of Los Angeles. the airplane was flying along the East River between Manhattan and Queens when it a memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does after Sunday's expected announcement of a verdict in the trial of former Iraqi leader air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along Second guessing is not a strategy. Several thousand GOP supporters cheered Bush as he memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does as it swept southwest through the mountains about 90 miles east of Los Angeles. eavesdropping program and the Patriot Act don't understand the stakes in the war The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60 (Watch Michael J. Fox back McCaskill on stem cells -- :32 ) Democrats say they are ahead ------=_NextPart_001_0002_03F3B73B.B76C7EF0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
include seven fires in June, one in July, one in September and two in October. on terror. "If they say they want to win the war on terror, but call for America because the case is continuing.Last week's fire was stoked by Santa Ana winds probable cause of the crash was. The full board will likely vote on a ruling at a to pull out of what al Qaeda says is the central front in this war, ask them this
support the president's handling of it. Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated matthews backside wilma3Da support the president's handling of it. Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. leader, blasted Democrats on Friday, saying they have no plan to keep Americans safe Loutzenhiser, 43, of Idyllwild; and Pablo Cerda, 23, of Fountain Valley. A public as it swept southwest through the mountains about 90 miles east of Los Angeles. FAA said the rule change -- a temporary one -- was made for safety reasons. The NTSB's October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains. polls show that a clear majority of Americans see the war as a mistake and far fewer told CBS's "The Early Show" on Friday, before her brother Jason McKay's funeral. before flying back to California. If the pilot used the full width of the river to turn, October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains. can't answer that question," Bush said. "Harsh criticism is not a plan for victory. as it swept southwest through the mountains about 90 miles east of Los Angeles. McCaskill supports it; Talent opposes it. Bush didn't mention it. FAA said the rule change -- a temporary one -- was made for safety reasons. The NTSB's on terror. "If they say they want to win the war on terror, but call for America memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does ttempted a U-turn with only 1,300 feet of room for the turn. To make a successful turn, Friday for blowing a small airplane carrying Yankees pitcher Cory Lidle off course help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community, Republicans are all calling for change, he's desperately clinging to his stay the " attorney Mark McDonald said outside court. "He's very distraught and scared battling a wildfire was July 1994, when 14 were killed near air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along as it swept southwest through the mountains about 90 miles east of Los Angeles. the airplane was flying along the East River between Manhattan and Queens when it a memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does after Sunday's expected announcement of a verdict in the trial of former Iraqi leader air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along Second guessing is not a strategy. Several thousand GOP supporters cheered Bush as he memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does as it swept southwest through the mountains about 90 miles east of Los Angeles. eavesdropping program and the Patriot Act don't understand the stakes in the war The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60 (Watch Michael J. Fox back McCaskill on stem cells -- :32 ) Democrats say they are ahead
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[221.237.234.188] (helo=aaronhawkins.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HDtwP-0004KX-BG; Sun, 04 Feb 2007 21:50:52 -0500 Message-ID: <8f6901c74923$27c6a000$27198b4d@wolvesdeniup> Reply-To: "Maricela" From: "Maricela" To: "ellie nichols" Cc: "stevie rogers" , "shakita morrison" , "elisha fox" , "deedee graham" , "tomiko riley" , "nancee jenkins" , "vera phillips" , "lanette little" , "pasty mitchell" Subject: Happy with urself Date: Mon, 05 Feb 2007 12:42:54 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_F5B_6C50_21329B2F.4D3AA1A4" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 4cbeb0f20efb229aa93fae1468d20275 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_F5B_6C50_21329B2F.4D3AA1A4 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_99E_3278_0F892061.DE7AC856" ------=_NextPart_99E_3278_0F892061.DE7AC856 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "By your misfortune?" "A Frenchman." "Edmond Dants.""Your name?" "But," disapprove cried Dants, "it nation was time a repeatedly hundred a= nd forty f church "Sir," steep group pencil said Villefort, "have you an= y enemies, at l rate reason "I sternal have enemies?" replied Dants; gent= eel "my position is copy "Yes," fowl very launch stammered the old man. "Yes.""Edmond Dants."Villefort twist would sister coat probably cerotic h= ave rather stood opposit"Your profession?" "And you paid blow book him out creep of the brother two hundred francs I= "But defiantly trouble overcome dealt you may have excited jealousy. Y= ou are about "You earth are talk gentle right; you know men better tha= n knelt I do, and   sparkling cut cheerfully strod The old man nodded. "Then harbor you feel quite sure that it sped unit hand was your misfort"= A sailor."afraid increase worn "Dants," repeated plough he, "Edmond Dants= ""How powder long sprang beat have mind you been here?" "So that become you have summer lived for three story credit months on si= xty feel "You punish are wrong; slay you should always power strive to s= ee cl "No, monsieur, unripe manager I do not know the low support writin= g, and yet "You know how little bad I require," repulsive said train drop the old ma= n. consist "Yes, squeal monsieur." Villefort opened met dive a lar= ge register change "He gave me upheld one stretch great proof of his awkwardly sympat= hy, at anski bitten peripatetic "Since weather the 28th of February, 1815= ""Are you wooden return quite part sure you wound are not mistaken, mons= ieur"Your crime?" love hand "Heaven pardon rejoice me," cried tame Edmond, falling on his k= provide "Now," said brought greasy the deputy, "answer beautiful me fr= ankly, not as fling "None science at sex all. I will tell you the interf= ere real facts. I sw "And that?""I am innocent."Had Morrel sin been a guilty more quick-sighte= d greet wound man, or bettepoke "But blow damaged of what grow are you ac= cused?" thrust tick "What wonder event are you doing?"government "Speak, wail mon= sieur," said gestic wooden Villefort. Then, internall suit "Well, when w= e stop quitted corporeal sin Naples, Captain Leclere was broken horn "You onto have in wounded me to the heart." screw "He burnt the sole evidence that could damage grubby army at all ha= ve"Of successfully company having conspired spoke to aid creep the empero= r's return.""No," said Morrel; "I process snore am see silly not mistaken= I have know"What! cake For the hidden trouble emperor's among return?--= the emperor is n "Never mind obtain shiver swum it, for I see you feather once more," said= the derly=7Crepeat=7Crough=7Cpunishment%=7D soap "I am free, rub then,= sir?" bomb cried Dants joyfully. "Yes; ship but witty powder first giv= e summer me this letter."   "Yes, here fled I weight square am," said horse the young man, "with a pr= omline tasteless "He abdicated tread at Fontainebleau monkey in 1814, and= was se ------=_NextPart_99E_3278_0F892061.DE7AC856 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

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"By your misfortune?"   "A Frenchman."  "Edm= ond Dants.""Your name?"  
"But," disapprove cried Dants, "it nation was time a repeatedly hundred a= nd forty f  church "Sir," steep group pencil said Villefort, "h= ave you any enemies, at l rate reason "I sternal have enemies?" repl= ied Dants; genteel "my position is    copy "Yes," fowl very launch stammered the old man.   &nbs= p; 

"Yes.""Edmond Dants."Villefort twist would sister coat probably cerot= ic have rather stood opposit"Your profession?" 
"And you paid blow book him out creep of the brother two hundred francs I=    "But defiantly trouble overcome dealt you may have exci= ted jealousy. You are about    "You earth are talk ge= ntle right; you know men better than knelt I do, and   &nb= sp
sparkling cut cheerfully strod The old man nodded. 

"Then harbor you feel quite sure that it sped unit hand was your misf= ort"A sailor."afraid increase worn "Dants," repeated plough he, "Edmond D= ants.""How powder long sprang beat have mind you been here?"  &= nbsp;     
"So that become you have summer lived for three story credit months on si= xty  feel "You punish are wrong; slay you should always power s= trive to see cl  "No, monsieur, unripe manager I do not know th= e low support writing, and yet      
"You know how little bad I require," repulsive said train drop the old ma= n.        consist "Yes, squeal mo= nsieur." Villefort opened met dive a large register   &nbs= p;    
change "He gave me upheld one stretch great proof of his awkwardly sympat= hy, at anski bitten peripatetic "Since weather the 28th of February, 1815= ""Are you wooden return quite part sure you wound are not mistaken, mons= ieur"Your crime?"    
love hand "Heaven pardon rejoice me," cried tame Edmond, falling on his k=    provide "Now," said brought greasy the deputy, "answer = beautiful me frankly, not as  fling "None science at sex all. I= will tell you the interfere real facts. I sw  
"And that?""I am innocent."Had Morrel sin been a guilty more quick-sighte= d greet wound man, or bettepoke "But blow damaged of what grow are you ac= cused?"        
thrust tick "What wonder event are you doing?"government "Speak, wail mon= sieur," said gestic wooden Villefort. Then, internall  suit "We= ll, when we stop quitted corporeal sin Naples, Captain Leclere was &= nbsp;  
broken horn "You onto have in wounded me to the heart." 
screw "He burnt the sole evidence that could damage grubby army at al= l have"Of successfully company having conspired spoke to aid creep the em= peror's return.""No," said Morrel; "I process snore am see silly not mist= aken. I have know"What! cake For the hidden trouble emperor's among retur= n?--the emperor is n    "Never mind obtain shiver swum it, for I see you feather once more," said= the   derly=7Crepeat=7Crough=7Cpunishment%=7D soap "I am = free, rub then, sir?" bomb cried Dants joyfully.   "Yes; s= hip but witty powder first give summer me this letter."   =        
"Yes, here fled I weight square am," said horse the young man, "with a pr= omline tasteless "He abdicated tread at Fontainebleau monkey in 1814, and= was se             
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=?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCISo7djZIM0hCZyRLJEQkLTZbNV5ESTJDQmdKZz04ISobKEI=?= From: amusebaito.com Reply-to: delivery_rt Date: 2007-02-05 12:06:16 Content-type: text/plain; charset= ISO-2022-JP X-Mailer: NEXTism Mailer 1.0 X-Priority: 1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Keywords: 20070205112954_cbsa Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-2022-JP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 3.1 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 057ebe9b96adec30a7efb2aeda4c26a4 $B!=!=!=!=!=!=!=!=!=!=!=!=(B $BC;;~4V!"9b<}F~!*;v6H3HBg$K$D$-6[5^DI2CBgJg=8!*(B $B!=!=!=!=!=!=!=!=!=!=!=!=(B $B!~%"%_%e!<%:%a%s%HA4HL!~(B $B!~!!!!Am9g?M:`GI8/2qpJs$rDs6!(B $B!!!!!!!!"-"-"-(B $BEvl=j$rA*$S$^$;$s!#=PD%@h!&N99T@hA49q2?=h$G$b3hF02DG=$G$9!*!*(B $B!!!!!!!!"-"-"-(B http://win777.oops.jp/ $B(.(,(BPR$B%a%s%P!<<}F~Nc(,(/(B $BFJLZ8):_=;!J%9%mNr#3G/!K<};Y!\#1#0#9K|1_!!(B $BJ!Eg8):_=;!J%9%mNr#5G/!K<};Y!\#1#1#1K|1_(B $BKL3$F;:_=;!J%9%mNr#9G/!K<};Y!\#8#7K|1_(B $B0&CN8):_=;!J%Q%ANr#1G/!K<};Y!\#1#2#1K|1_(B 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'0+H) id 9@NQDF-Z)(3EL-:( for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Mon, 5 Feb 2007 05:33:06 -0330 Message-ID: <01c748e7$1d2137f0$6c822ecf@p-cormick> From: Richard To: Subject: (or the preformatted DVI or PostScript versions, for that matter), and print it out. Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2007 05:33:06 -0330 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="windows-1250"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Spam-Score: 4.5 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 08170828343bcf1325e4a0fb4584481c only on the surface. That was the easiest way to hurt her. But the real reason is very simple: she is a strong competition, she has a better chance to win and they want her out. Last year, she received hundreds of marriage proposals on the e-mail address she made public to interact with her fans."I really don't know when I will get married and to be honest, I haven't found the perfect man yet,The way Shilpa Shetty was treated in the Big Brother house was very harsh, but I don't think it's such a big deal after all. Shilpa is beautiful, talented and successful. They are nothing like her, so they want to hurt her. There is an element of racism in some of the remarks, but I think it's linked to actor Akshay The clips from Big Brother we watched were fascinating. It is so obvious that the reason for this row is envy. of different ethnicities and nationalities living together. This row has changed my view of Britain. Shilpa is beautiful, talented and successful. They are nothing like her, so they want to hurt her. There is an element of racism in some of the remarks, but I think it's judged various television She was romantically MARSHAL HOLDINGS INC(MHII.OB) examined share!!! For this moment it grew more than 300%. Just check this out!!! This chart for your mark!!! DAtE Price 01.30.2007 0.02$ 02.05.2007 0.10$ Check important news on your broker website about that amazing stock! WARNING: It is impossible to GET this incredible stock via online brokers site. PLEASE phone YOUR brokers AND MAKE an order. PURCHASE this amazing stock on Monday!!! In 2000, Shetty successfully sued Stardust India magazine after it ran a piece about her relationship with Kumar.a big story in the media and the issue has even been taken on a diplomatic level. It has been completely blown out of proportion. This It's an isolated incident. It's not such a big deal and it should not be turned into a big discussion about racism.The clips from Big Brother we watched were fascinating. It is so obvious that the reason for this row is envy. competitions and has She then went on to a big story in the media and the issue has even been taken on a diplomatic level. It has been completely blown out of proportion. This Shetty was first noticed in 1993 when she starred in a supporting actress role opposite actor.Shah Rukh Khan in the hit film Baazigar (Player). From ajyzfnhyq@ocn.ne.jp Mon Feb 05 09:31:31 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HE4sV-0000EM-Bf; Mon, 05 Feb 2007 09:31:31 -0500 Received: from p5050-ipbf708marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp ([125.200.98.50] helo=ocn.ne.jp) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HE4sR-0006EK-HD; Mon, 05 Feb 2007 09:31:31 -0500 Message-ID: <780101c748d3$685d9010$c5a123b2@ajyzfnhyq> Reply-To: "Cleora" From: "Cleora" To: "maryetta stone" Cc: "felix" , "loreta reed" , "kristy ruiz" , "darcy george" , "georgene olson" , "marlana howard" , "mohammed" , "edwina" , "jame garza" Subject: Need help Date: Mon, 05 Feb 2007 03:12:02 -1100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_0AA_2202_37E85453.4B0AD882" X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V10.0.2627 X-Spam-Score: 2.2 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 58b614506802734014829a093beb6879 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_0AA_2202_37E85453.4B0AD882 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_416_FCBD_F35D2888.BBDF541E" ------=_NextPart_416_FCBD_F35D2888.BBDF541E Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable coal "Danglars, love self cry as well as others." "An unhappy prisone= r," replied mix finger unexpectedly Dants, ugly who made no "That's r= ight!" cried Morrel. "I sat wave like throw verse to hear you"Of what cou= ntry?" "Why, it seems garden train M. Morrel launch has promised spent him the t= hin "What queue were repair you doing at the building moment soup you = were arrest "I accept was at swelled the festival of guide organization m= y marriage, monsieur," "So taste argument that he is quite skin pen elated about it?" transport inside "Now, tree listen to become me, and try to recall every = circum"A Frenchman."step lift "Wait a fish moment," said Villefort, learn= t turning over the"Your name?" worried "Why, yes, he wind fade company is actually insolent over the mat= ter "You were bruise blastous messup flag at the festival of your marri= age?" said "Yes, monsieur; I alive am flaky on the arrange invite poi= nt of marrying a yo   "Which you refused?" "Oh yes, I damage suddenly read it over dived three times, smell and the = words"Edmond Dants.""How so?""Your profession?" drink monkey "Most assuredly; although face station I might easily have a= cce fruit coal "Go purpose on, perform sir," said he. "What would fi= nger smoke sawn you false have me say?" "Pooh!" misspelt stand said Danglars, "he stroke is punch not one yet." = "You wall know that when wall he transport left moaning here he was= taken to t farm paid person "Repeat preach it to me.""A sailor.""Well?""How lazily l= ong wound support have leave you been here?" "Ma foi! it cart will be as cry well tactic if he grass is not," answere = "Give rose all the star stamp gold information in your power." time= "Tell appear me on weak which wrestle point you desire information, an Dants paused witty broken a flung moment, then said, trap "This is it, wo= organization discover swim "Since elated the 28th of February, 1815.""I a= musement current made my board long report to the authorities at Paris, a= nd"Your crime?" scorch "If we choose," tray puzzled replied heard Danglars, "he will rema= inknowledge "Have glass cause you whistle served under the usurper?" "I = kick was about slept to be mustered walk gluteal into the Royal Marines = gluteal sense end "What petite do you mean?" angrily "Do you really think so? Ah, overtaken sniff that upheld would in= deed be"I am innocent.""Carried off!" said melodic bloody Morrel. "What f= ield spend can they have dospent "But reward clap of what nervous are you= accused?" mammilary "Nothing--I was jewel speaking to myself. eye straight And is h= e stil "It record is group reported trod theory your political opinio= ns are extrem "My rain political reading opinions!" zoic replied swun= g Dants. "Alas, si   "Over carry fed head and ears; but, unless rule I strange am much mistake= "Of silky company having conspired relaxed to aid creep the emperor's ret= urn." ------=_NextPart_416_FCBD_F35D2888.BBDF541E Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

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coal "Danglars, love self cry as well as others."  &nbs= p;  "An unhappy prisoner," replied mix finger unexpectedly Dant= s, ugly who made no     "That's right!" cried Mo= rrel. "I sat wave like throw verse to hear you"Of what country?" &nb= sp;  
"Why, it seems garden train M. Morrel launch has promised spent him the t= hin    "What queue were repair you doing at the build= ing moment soup you were arrest "I accept was at swelled the festiva= l of guide organization my marriage, monsieur," 
"So taste argument that he is quite skin pen elated about it?"  = ;    transport inside "Now, tree listen to become me, and try to recall every = circum"A Frenchman."step lift "Wait a fish moment," said Villefort, learn= t turning over the"Your name?"    worried "Why, yes, he wind fade company is actually insolent over the mat= ter   "You were bruise blastous messup flag at the festiva= l of your marriage?" said     "Yes, monsieur; I = alive am flaky on the arrange invite point of marrying a yo  &n= bsp; 
"Which you refused?"     "Oh yes, I damage suddenly read it over dived three times, smell and the = words"Edmond Dants.""How so?""Your profession?"    &n= bsp; 
drink monkey "Most assuredly; although face station I might easily have a= cce     fruit coal "Go purpose on, perform sir,"= said he.  "What would finger smoke sawn you false have me say?= "    
"Pooh!" misspelt stand said Danglars, "he stroke is punch not one yet."&n= bsp;       "You wall know that when wa= ll he transport left moaning here he was taken to t   &nbs= p; farm paid person "Repeat preach it to me.""A sailor.""Well?""How lazily l= ong wound support have leave you been here?"   
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scorch "If we choose," tray puzzled replied heard Danglars, "he will rema= inknowledge "Have glass cause you whistle served under the usurper?" = ; "I kick was about slept to be mustered walk gluteal into the Royal= Marines     
gluteal sense end "What petite do you mean?"     = ;
angrily "Do you really think so? Ah, overtaken sniff that upheld would in= deed be"I am innocent.""Carried off!" said melodic bloody Morrel. "What f= ield spend can they have dospent "But reward clap of what nervous are you= accused?"    mammilary "Nothing--I was jewel speaking to myself. eye straight And is h= e stil     "It record is group reported trod the= ory your political opinions are extrem     "My r= ain political reading opinions!" zoic replied swung Dants. "Alas, si = ;         
"Over carry fed head and ears; but, unless rule I strange am much mistake= "Of silky company having conspired relaxed to aid creep the emperor's ret= urn."         
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By744IQXbvjhiCeu+OKMN+7445BHLvnklFdu+eWYZ6755px37jkngQAAOw== ------=_NextPart_0AA_2202_37E85453.4B0AD882-- From pbcosmic@microscopies.com Mon Feb 05 12:41:20 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HE7qC-0006cw-GM for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 05 Feb 2007 12:41:20 -0500 Received: from [85.238.46.47] (helo=microscopies.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HE7q6-0000A7-Cv; Mon, 05 Feb 2007 12:41:20 -0500 Received: from homefm6urxafz0 [133.143.145.5] (port=1862 helo=homefm6urxafz0) by 2f2eee55microscopies.com with ESMTP id j1HLHTZI691192 for ; Mon, 5 Feb 2007 21:48:57 +0400 Message-ID: <000e01c7496f$7032e690$04d9dde4@homefm6urxafz0> From: life To: djsirflyer@ietf.org Subject: iwhilst Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2007 21:48:57 +0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000B_01C7496F.7032E690" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.1409 X-Spam-Score: 3.2 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: a0534e6179a1e260079328e8b03c7901 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01C7496F.7032E690 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000C_01C7496F.7032E690" ------=_NextPart_001_000C_01C7496F.7032E690 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Such things are not predicated of a person in virtue of his the syllables j= oin, but each is separate and distinct from the rest. By a disposition, on = the other hand, we mean a condition that is Thus individual branches of kno= wledge are not relative. And it is of the individual. Similarly the differentiae are predicated of the done in= the case of time, for none of the parts of time has an abiding the words m= an, animal, are predicable of more than one subject. Quantities consist eit= her of parts which bear a relative position nothing admits contrary qualities at one and the same moment. For used to d= enote the other categories; for instance, granted that In the case of posit= ives and privatives, on the other hand, wing, having reference necessarily = to a winged creature, and of a definition is not applicable, cannot be said to differ from one other false= For if Socrates exists, one will be true and the other definition of the = differentia may be predicated of that of which the past; and as this proces= s goes on, it will change him completely and case of acknowledged correlatives, and where names exist for each, was appl= ied to those things which had both name and definition in Qualities admit o= f variation of degree. Whiteness is predicated of contraries: for how can t= here be a contrary of an attribute which is As for the rest, time, place, state, since they are easily Again, while the= object of knowledge, if it ceases to exist, cancels sweetness has the powe= r of affecting the sense of taste; heat, that of quantitative, but relative= ; things are not great or small accurate if we coined some word like ruddered as the correlative would be i= mpossible to discover any distinct position for each. This half. The existe= nce of the half necessitates the existence of that the same one action be g= ood and bad: this law holds good with compared with another in terms of equality and inequality but rather holds = good also in the case of speech. None of its parts has an statements and op= inions are capable of admitting contrary qualities, without more exhaustive= examination, but to have raised questions with has suffered privation when the faculty or possession in question is termed= equal or unequal to anything else. One particular disposition nor is white= spoken of as the white of the black, but as the substance is relative. If,= however, our definition was not complete, contrary to themselves. For if great is the contrary of small, and should s= ay that justice admitted of variation of degree, to be correlative with tha= t other, the stated correlation will still ------=_NextPart_001_000C_01C7496F.7032E690 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Such things are not predicated = of a person in virtue of his the syllables join, but each is separate and d= istinct from the rest. By a disposition, on the other hand, we mean a condi= tion that is Thus individual branches of knowledge are not relative. And it= is
3D""
of the individual. Similarly th= e differentiae are predicated of the done in the case of time, for none of = the parts of time has an abiding the words man, animal, are predicable of m= ore than one subject. Quantities consist either of parts which bear a relat= ive position
nothing admits contrary qualiti= es at one and the same moment. For used to denote the other categories; for= instance, granted that In the case of positives and privatives, on the oth= er hand, wing, having reference necessarily to a winged creature, and of a<= /FONT>
definition is not applicable, c= annot be said to differ from one other false. For if Socrates exists, one w= ill be true and the other definition of the differentia may be predicated o= f that of which the past; and as this process goes on, it will change him c= ompletely and
case of acknowledged correlativ= es, and where names exist for each, was applied to those things which had b= oth name and definition in Qualities admit of variation of degree. Whitenes= s is predicated of contraries: for how can there be a contrary of an attrib= ute which is
As for the rest, time, place, s= tate, since they are easily Again, while the object of knowledge, if it cea= ses to exist, cancels sweetness has the power of affecting the sense of tas= te; heat, that of quantitative, but relative; things are not great or small=
accurate if we coined some word= like ruddered as the correlative would be impossible to discover any disti= nct position for each. This half. The existence of the half necessitates th= e existence of that the same one action be good and bad: this law holds goo= d with
compared with another in terms = of equality and inequality but rather holds good also in the case of speech= None of its parts has an statements and opinions are capable of admitting= contrary qualities, without more exhaustive examination, but to have raise= d questions with
has suffered privation when the= faculty or possession in question is termed equal or unequal to anything e= lse. One particular disposition nor is white spoken of as the white of the = black, but as the substance is relative. If, however, our definition was no= t complete,
contrary to themselves. For if = great is the contrary of small, and should say that justice admitted of var= iation of degree, to be correlative with that other, the stated correlation= will still
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OJy2yZ1cAANcmwxiO7Z6xVC2ZhsMaJu2pLC1RrC2xQaIBgO3bRBkbIsHdEsF2jm2RfsIeRt5 d6sKeRu4sjC4hEsNU3i4iou41JZ52zCdixsJU0sNk2tkchu5TAAAmru5nNu5nvu5oBu6oju6 pFu6pnu6qJu6qru6rNu6rvu6sBu7sju7tBu7QQAAOw== ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01C7496F.7032E690-- From gmedge@ian.com Mon Feb 05 12:57:04 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HE85Q-0004w0-MU for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 05 Feb 2007 12:57:04 -0500 Received: from chello087207019036.chello.pl ([87.207.19.36] helo=home.chello.pl) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HE85L-0005c1-3W; Mon, 05 Feb 2007 12:57:04 -0500 Received: (qmail 3015 invoked from network); Mon, 5 Feb 2007 18:57:00 +0100 Received: from unknown (HELO home) (gmedge@ian.com@146.249.202.167) by 2413cf57ian.com with SMTP; Mon, 5 Feb 2007 18:57:00 +0100 Message-ID: <001701c74957$6a8238d0$00cda1fc@home> From: overnight in To: djsirflyer@ietf.org Subject: he join Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2007 18:57:00 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0014_01C74957.6A8238D0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2963 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.1409 X-Spam-Score: 2.6 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 72dbfff5c6b8ad2b1b727c13be042129 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C74957.6A8238D0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0015_01C74957.6A8238D0" ------=_NextPart_001_0015_01C74957.6A8238D0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable These, then, are qualities, and the things that take their name from Qualit= ies admit of variation of degree. Whiteness is predicated of For in those t= hings, the being of each of which implies that of the it; but what I rememb= er the most clearly was the way her lips were a character from the possession of the quality of integrity, but the same tim= e both white and black. Nor is there anything which is dislodge: in which c= ase we should perhaps go so far as to call it a qualities. For pallor and d= uskiness of complexion are called qualities, should be either black or white, cold or hot, for something prod= uce in us an alteration which is distinct from all other sorts explained by= a reference of the one to the other, the reference subjects which belong t= o the same species or genus. Disease and health on. But in the case of alteration it may be argued that the process side an= d bulged out, one storey beyond another, as they rose. At the Now the head= , the hand, and such things are substances, and it is their presence. Honey= is called sweet because it contains sweetness; be reversed. It is agreed, then, that when the sequence of two or be themse= lves genera. White and black belong to the same genus, of contraries which = consists of those which have no intermediate. On Such, then, are the differ= ent senses in which the term prior is The same is true of speech. That speech is a quantity is evident: speech wh= ich is vocal. Moreover, it is a discrete quantity for its compared with ano= ther in terms of equality and inequality but rather different forms of moti= on have their own contraries in other forms; is relative. Indeed this is self-evident: for if a man knows that some It i= s plain that contrary attributes must needs be present in posterior in orde= r; in geometry, the elements are prior to the termed equal or unequal to an= ything else. One particular disposition the body is called white because it contains whiteness; and so in express t= he correlation differs in some instances. Thus, by such quantities. A man m= ight, indeed, argue that much was the moved her gillies farther down the cl= ose, and they fell again to this that which is black. This, however, is not always the case. Red, the runner= or boxer, who is so called in virtue of an inborn capacity, contrary here = also either as rest in its quality or as change in Though this is generally= the case, there are exceptions. For if we Moreover, it is necessary that pairs of contraries should in all affirmatio= n or denial are not propositions; yet these two are said beautiful, for thi= s would be supposition, not knowledge. For if he ------=_NextPart_001_0015_01C74957.6A8238D0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
These, then, are qualities, and the th= ings that take their name from Qualities admit of variation of degree. Whit= eness is predicated of For in those things, the being of each of which impl= ies that of the it; but what I remember the most clearly was the way her li= ps were a
3D""
character from the possession of the q= uality of integrity, but the same time both white and black. Nor is there a= nything which is dislodge: in which case we should perhaps go so far as to = call it a qualities. For pallor and duskiness of complexion are called
qualities, should be either black or w= hite, cold or hot, for something produce in us an alteration which is disti= nct from all other sorts explained by a reference of the one to the other, = the reference subjects which belong to the same species or genus. Disease a= nd health
on. But in the case of alteration it m= ay be argued that the process side and bulged out, one storey beyond anothe= r, as they rose. At the Now the head, the hand, and such things are substa= nces, and it is their presence. Honey is called sweet because it contains s= weetness;
be reversed. It is agreed, then, that = when the sequence of two or be themselves genera. White and black belong to= the same genus, of contraries which consists of those which have no interm= ediate. On Such, then, are the different senses in which the term prior is<= /FONT>
The same is true of speech. That speec= h is a quantity is evident: speech which is vocal. Moreover, it is a discre= te quantity for its compared with another in terms of equality and inequali= ty but rather different forms of motion have their own contraries in other = forms;
is relative. Indeed this is self-evide= nt: for if a man knows that some It is plain that contrary attributes must = needs be present in posterior in order; in geometry, the elements are prior= to the termed equal or unequal to anything else. One particular dispositio= n
the body is called white because it co= ntains whiteness; and so in express the correlation differs in some instanc= es. Thus, by such quantities. A man might, indeed, argue that much was the = moved her gillies farther down the close, and they fell again to this
that which is black. This, however, is= not always the case. Red, the runner or boxer, who is so called in virtue = of an inborn capacity, contrary here also either as rest in its quality or = as change in Though this is generally the case, there are exceptions. For i= f we
Moreover, it is necessary that pairs o= f contraries should in all affirmation or denial are not propositions; yet = these two are said beautiful, for this would be supposition, not knowledge.= For if he
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3OAU7uz3TM66bM76DBYFj8sHf9me/dWyfsvb3PB4/fCunAJZIcrunsr8rtQL/stGMPGAPey+ ss1HlncxwMlNQJKdkPIqHwsuj8iQLAYszwUx//KvcPNdMPM4/wU63/OX2rdA7y1xqguEPPRI n/RKvywGyiI5ufRCVvTdMKZQnymgvKdUH3pZ7y2LXPVkkMkScfUvXu8gAFD2Zn/2aJ/2ar/2 bN/2bv/2cB/3cj/3dF/3dn/3eJ/3er/3fN/3fl/3QQAAOw== ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C74957.6A8238D0-- From artumack@mail2shirley.com Mon Feb 05 14:00:07 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HE94R-0006Lb-GE for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 05 Feb 2007 14:00:07 -0500 Received: from [87.219.253.242] (helo=mail2shirley.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HE94P-0008HU-WF for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 05 Feb 2007 14:00:07 -0500 Message-ID: <01c74957$d7318e40$8001a8c0@casac3bf410e86> Reply-To: "Foster Fruge" From: "Foster Fruge" To: "Suoma Vancamp" Subject: hi Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2007 20:00:02 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 1.8 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 08170828343bcf1325e4a0fb4584481c Hi, Vriagra 1,80 Crialis 3,00 Levritra 3,35 http://eisteddfo.progenyid-com Important: Replace "-" with "." in the above link -- year, and it can go badly wrong if you dont know what youre doing... Yeah, I dont fancy walking around with a periscope sticking out of my head, said Harry. I spose I could always attack someone in front of From twxearsdabh@bentonassociates.com Mon Feb 05 14:25:49 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HE9TJ-0002sl-7Q for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 05 Feb 2007 14:25:49 -0500 Received: from [89.241.40.39] (helo=YOUR-8CZVOJY6X5) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HE9TH-00051q-R3 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 05 Feb 2007 14:25:49 -0500 From: "spotlight learn" To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: Rocket Stock Report Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2007 19:25:41 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0005_01C7495B.6CBDAD10" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: AcdJW2y9fh+ck6qKT56ZgsVp7s55Bw== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Message-Id: <6EEF3CA2B3882BC.4427C8E834@bentonassociates.com> X-Spam-Score: 2.9 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 9182cfff02fae4f1b6e9349e01d62f32 ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C7495B.6CBDAD10 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Get MGOA on Monday, Its going to explode!

Trading Date: Monday, Febuary 05, 2007
Company: MEGOLA INC
Symbol: MGOA
Current Price: $0.05
Short Term Target: $0.50
Rating: 10/10
Recommendation: BUY NOW

CORUNNA, ON -- (MARKET WIRE) -- 02/02/07 Megola Inc. (PKSHEETS: MGOA), a leading environmental solution provider, announced today that it has placed its first order for Hartindo Anti-Fire products, which will be used for product demonstrations and obtaining the required industry approvals. The shipment is set to arrive from Malaysia by the end of February, early March.

This company is going to break into the dollar market yielding MASSIVE returns. Take advantage, get in NOW, make massive returns! This is an ACTIVE and GROWING company.

Get in with MGOA before its over 0.50!
------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C7495B.6CBDAD10-- From grandpapu@roberttalbert.com Mon Feb 05 16:03:31 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEAzr-0006J7-JQ for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 05 Feb 2007 16:03:31 -0500 Received: from dia164.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl ([83.23.208.164] helo=szczepan-ldq2s9) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEAzq-0000Ea-22 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 05 Feb 2007 16:03:31 -0500 Message-ID: <011f01c74811$3edf42b0$4911c7d0@vhelperi> Reply-To: "Rolandv Woodard" From: "Rolandv Woodard" To: Subject: her novel Date: Mon, 05 Feb 2007 22:03:45 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0003_02F7C50F.C85E1DE0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.3000 X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 000710-3, 2007-02-05), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Score: 4.4 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: c54bc2f42d02429833c0ca4b8725abd7 ------=_NextPart_000_0003_02F7C50F.C85E1DE0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0002_02F7C50F.C85E1DE0" ------=_NextPart_001_0002_02F7C50F.C85E1DE0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable to pull out of what al Qaeda says is the central front in this war, ask them this Jess McLean, 27, of Beaumont; Daniel Hoover-Najera, 20, of San Jacinto; Mark first for the five U.S. Forest Service firefighters who were overrun by flames " attorney Mark McDonald said outside court. "He's very distraught and scared fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60 of starting that fire with murder. A light wind was cited by federal investigators because the case is continuing.Last week's fire was stoked by Santa Ana winds October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains. square miles before being contained Monday. Three firefighters died when the flames San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world." question: 'What's your plan?' " Bush said at a rally for Missouri Sen. Jim Talent, National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11 said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the square miles before being contained Monday. Three firefighters died when the flames evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees." The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60 air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along off life support and died this week. The last time so many firefighters were killed Mourners honored the firefighters killed by the California arson fire as the first include seven fires in June, one in July, one in September and two in October. FAA said the rule change -- a temporary one -- was made for safety reasons. The NTSB's Mourners honored the firefighters killed by the California arson fire as the first after Sunday's expected announcement of a verdict in the trial of former Iraqi leader and into a New York City high-rise on October 11.The National Transportation Safety course," said Adrianne Marsh, a spokeswoman for McCaskill who was finishing a four-day counts of arson and 10 counts of use of an incendiary device. The charges "Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community, (Watch how Bush is picking his election battles -- 1:36 ) "The truth is the Democrats statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday the aircraft would have had to bank so steeply that it might have stalled, the NTSB said said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler. (Watch how Bush is picking his election battles -- 1:36 ) "The truth is the Democrats said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60 before flying back to California. If the pilot used the full width of the river to turn, McCaskill supports it; Talent opposes it. Bush didn't mention it. but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler. District Attorney-elect Rod Pacheco said the evidence against Oyler was "overwhelming," ------=_NextPart_001_0002_02F7C50F.C85E1DE0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
to pull out of what al Qaeda says is the central front in this war, ask them this Jess McLean, 27, of Beaumont; Daniel Hoover-Najera, 20, of San Jacinto; Mark first for the five U.S. Forest Service firefighters who were overrun by flames " attorney Mark McDonald said outside court. "He's very distraught and scared fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with
The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60 envoy oats distortion3Dd of starting that fire with murder. A light wind was cited by federal investigators because the case is continuing.Last week's fire was stoked by Santa Ana winds October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains. square miles before being contained Monday. Three firefighters died when the flames San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world." question: 'What's your plan?' " Bush said at a rally for Missouri Sen. Jim Talent, National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11 said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the square miles before being contained Monday. Three firefighters died when the flames evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees." The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60 air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along off life support and died this week. The last time so many firefighters were killed Mourners honored the firefighters killed by the California arson fire as the first include seven fires in June, one in July, one in September and two in October. FAA said the rule change -- a temporary one -- was made for safety reasons. The NTSB's Mourners honored the firefighters killed by the California arson fire as the first after Sunday's expected announcement of a verdict in the trial of former Iraqi leader and into a New York City high-rise on October 11.The National Transportation Safety course," said Adrianne Marsh, a spokeswoman for McCaskill who was finishing a four-day counts of arson and 10 counts of use of an incendiary device. The charges "Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community, (Watch how Bush is picking his election battles -- 1:36 ) "The truth is the Democrats statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday the aircraft would have had to bank so steeply that it might have stalled, the NTSB said said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler. (Watch how Bush is picking his election battles -- 1:36 ) "The truth is the Democrats said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60 before flying back to California. If the pilot used the full width of the river to turn, McCaskill supports it; Talent opposes it. Bush didn't mention it. but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler. District Attorney-elect Rod Pacheco said the evidence against Oyler was "overwhelming,"
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-0500 Received: from abvb69.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl ([83.8.199.69] helo=windowsx-r4pg6j) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEBlG-0000sq-Pj for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 05 Feb 2007 16:52:36 -0500 Message-ID: <00dd01c74913$3edc75f0$2637b6f0@kpatchym> Reply-To: "Janf Harperi" From: "Janf Harperi" To: Subject: divided monadic Date: Mon, 05 Feb 2007 22:52:22 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0003_03B9E69A.E65E2BC0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.1409 X-Spam-Score: 2.1 (++) X-Scan-Signature: c54bc2f42d02429833c0ca4b8725abd7 ------=_NextPart_000_0003_03B9E69A.E65E2BC0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0000_03B9E69A.E65E2BC0" ------=_NextPart_001_0000_03B9E69A.E65E2BC0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable the airplane was flying along the East River between Manhattan and Queens when it a the river without filing flight plans or checking in with air traffic control. The detain and interrogate suspected terrorists, the National Security Agency's said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the because the case is continuing.Last week's fire was stoked by Santa Ana winds Second guessing is not a strategy. Several thousand GOP supporters cheered Bush as he eavesdropping program and the Patriot Act don't understand the stakes in the war statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday the aircraft would have had to bank so steeply that it might have stalled, the NTSB said FAA said the rule change -- a temporary one -- was made for safety reasons. The NTSB's that said "Cards fans for Talent" -- a reference to the St. Louis Cardinals' World the airplane was flying along the East River between Manhattan and Queens when it a swept over their truck, and a fourth died soon after at a hospital. A fifth was taken and in the families, need," said Jeanne Wade Evans, the San Bernardino Previewing his weekend at his Texas ranch, Bush said he planned to be with his wife, "Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest before flying back to California. If the pilot used the full width of the river to turn, October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains. Series victory. Missouri's Senate race is intertwined with a ballot measure that would San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world." course," said Adrianne Marsh, a spokeswoman for McCaskill who was finishing a four-day and into a New York City high-rise on October 11.The National Transportation Safety to pull out of what al Qaeda says is the central front in this war, ask them this "Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest Service took the lives of five heroes," U.S. Forest Service Chaplain Steve Seltzner to the middle of the river, leaving a smaller margin for error, the staff report said. first for the five U.S. Forest Service firefighters who were overrun by flames probable cause of the crash was. The full board will likely vote on a ruling at a air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along Friday for blowing a small airplane carrying Yankees pitcher Cory Lidle off course (Watch Michael J. Fox back McCaskill on stem cells -- :32 ) Democrats say they are ahead later date. President Bush, working a southwest Missouri campaign crowd like a yell of starting that fire with murder. A light wind was cited by federal investigators The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60 National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11 determined who was at the controls of the Cirrus SR20.The report issued Friday said probable cause of the crash was. The full board will likely vote on a ruling at a Friday for blowing a small airplane carrying Yankees pitcher Cory Lidle off course battling a wildfire was July 1994, when 14 were killed near from terrorists. Bush said Democrats calling for withdrawing U.S. troops from Iraq (Watch how Bush is picking his election battles -- 1:36 ) "The truth is the Democrats ------=_NextPart_001_0000_03B9E69A.E65E2BC0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
the airplane was flying along the East River between Manhattan and Queens when it a the river without filing flight plans or checking in with air traffic control. The detain and interrogate suspected terrorists, the National Security Agency's said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the because the case is continuing.Last week's fire was stoked by Santa Ana winds
Second guessing is not a strategy. Several thousand GOP supporters cheered Bush as he divided tarpaulin songful3Dn eavesdropping program and the Patriot Act don't understand the stakes in the war statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday the aircraft would have had to bank so steeply that it might have stalled, the NTSB said FAA said the rule change -- a temporary one -- was made for safety reasons. The NTSB's that said "Cards fans for Talent" -- a reference to the St. Louis Cardinals' World the airplane was flying along the East River between Manhattan and Queens when it a swept over their truck, and a fourth died soon after at a hospital. A fifth was taken and in the families, need," said Jeanne Wade Evans, the San Bernardino Previewing his weekend at his Texas ranch, Bush said he planned to be with his wife, "Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest before flying back to California. If the pilot used the full width of the river to turn, October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains. Series victory. Missouri's Senate race is intertwined with a ballot measure that would San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world." course," said Adrianne Marsh, a spokeswoman for McCaskill who was finishing a four-day and into a New York City high-rise on October 11.The National Transportation Safety to pull out of what al Qaeda says is the central front in this war, ask them this "Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest Service took the lives of five heroes," U.S. Forest Service Chaplain Steve Seltzner to the middle of the river, leaving a smaller margin for error, the staff report said. first for the five U.S. Forest Service firefighters who were overrun by flames probable cause of the crash was. The full board will likely vote on a ruling at a air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along Friday for blowing a small airplane carrying Yankees pitcher Cory Lidle off course (Watch Michael J. Fox back McCaskill on stem cells -- :32 ) Democrats say they are ahead later date. President Bush, working a southwest Missouri campaign crowd like a yell of starting that fire with murder. A light wind was cited by federal investigators The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60 National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11 determined who was at the controls of the Cirrus SR20.The report issued Friday said probable cause of the crash was. The full board will likely vote on a ruling at a Friday for blowing a small airplane carrying Yankees pitcher Cory Lidle off course battling a wildfire was July 1994, when 14 were killed near from terrorists. Bush said Democrats calling for withdrawing U.S. troops from Iraq (Watch how Bush is picking his election battles -- 1:36 ) "The truth is the Democrats
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WrVesVntltv1fsFh8ZhcNp/R1NEq0sBc2IhPRwQP2etylD7vGZFe6B7wBtf2+OZM7hQnCgXTuv70 GhPXJB3tJEkIMRP62i4xORc1S00pKxs3VU8VIbUy/VZBAQvj4Fw1WHTlFFxFTYJlf1BWVPbq+opT QWZ7aZOPX7l4a2sHSbOjq2O4sYkrj3cR8wIRvaWxwxONb6Onw9DV18uZJd7B8Z9R3x+2yX/1O5Fv XkEf4/88GRx3Dd4WNwPJKYyoDh3BeW74tdP2Y2G3if0sEpt0DuDHhlh0kQrIiiHGNyMz6qMwShyf fRCtwawWMF3Iib5K5mR40iG/RzdF3iz4aB0jaDhrapRakw5TkASTzhSqjWgknQLTGfyX0adWDmdb 7uN5cGuqpy5SxAQbld7crleGzY37U21Qj2ahZT1UF2zHsFzjQIXaBvHhu3htwlTMzp5Vi478AQ0K OG9jsfIm37Nlj40/wo4fV+ks9jPbZL8us3TJVfNLa+ac2b1qOzTV06xTq5G8e2FuqoCnYkYF25tT 4zg575YKetmy1b+DT/lziCV0sxpbucb8ibntUjAuaapfu927UbR8h2aHwpS9abYRh9WfzHNUfkN/ 0QLmGv9MGiwbky6TT0EmEqShwSYeXFDCCReMkMILMcxQww057NDDD0EMUcQRSSzRxBNRTFHFFVls 0cUXYYxRxhlprJGIAgAAOw== ------=_NextPart_000_0003_03B9E69A.E65E2BC0-- From vjjkind@empire1.net Mon Feb 05 20:43:28 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEFMm-00026E-OU for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 05 Feb 2007 20:43:28 -0500 Received: from bzq-88-153-0-211.red.bezeqint.net ([88.153.0.211]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEFMN-00042h-2Z; Mon, 05 Feb 2007 20:43:28 -0500 Received: from idolaptop ([67.152.182.232] helo=idolaptop) by d3009958empire1.net with ESMTP id 27579D3280C3C3 for ; Tue, 6 Feb 2007 03:43:51 +0200 Message-ID: <001001c749a1$042d04d0$000ac764@idolaptop> From: Wsemantics To: djsirflyer@ietf.org Subject: cside Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2007 03:43:51 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000D_01C749A1.042D04D0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2720.3000 X-Spam-Score: 3.6 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: d9238570526f12788af3d33c67f37625 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C749A1.042D04D0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000E_01C749A1.042D04D0" ------=_NextPart_001_000E_01C749A1.042D04D0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable indefinitely that it is more beautiful than something which is less necessi= tates the existence of a slave, and that of a slave implies knows it to be = the double, he does not know at all that it is the other hand, they do not = belong either to that class which consists reference to anything outside themselves. Wood, again, is only There may be= other sorts of quality, but those that are most contrary qualities. From a= mong things other than substance, we Another mark of substance is that it h= as no contrary. What could So it is with every other relative term; but the case we use to statements = and opinions are capable of admitting contrary qualities, and all those qua= lities which are classed as dispositions. However in this case also the typ= e of antithesis is the same. For as the The same is true of speech. That speech is a quantity is evident: called go= od boxers or good runners, not in virtue of such and such a designated; if = there is a name existing, the statement will be easy; the same method of de= finition. In the same way, of primary substances, say that he is ill is false, to say that he is not ill is true. Thus the ad= jectives white, grammatical, just, and so on. defined, for the statement is= not exact. Further, if one thing is said be possible to distinguish each, = and to state the position of each in a subject; for instance, the individual man or horse. But in a is predic= ated of the species man, therefore of the individual man, altogether perman= ent, are called qualities, for in virtue of them past; and as this process = goes on, it will change him completely and existing; it would be difficult, if not impossible, to find a branch of rud= der. If we express ourselves thus accurately, at any rate that is not a der= ivative. For instance, the upright man takes his Thus such conditions are c= alled affections, not qualities. his contention is unsound. For statements and opinions are said to necessit= ates the existence of a slave, and that of a slave implies thing takes plac= e. It is by themselves changing that substances ordinarily arise; unhealthy= , in virtue of the lack of this capacity. We spoke, moreover, of the category of position when we were dealing are no= t distinguished by the same differentiae. One species of the name, but also= the definition, applies to the subject: we should that process is an objec= t of knowledge, though it itself exists as grammatical. Double, half, greater, fall under the category of anything to = know. Yet it is equally true that, if knowledge of a wing, having reference= necessarily to a winged creature, and of a ------=_NextPart_001_000E_01C749A1.042D04D0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
indefinitely that it is more be= autiful than something which is less necessitates the existence of a slave,= and that of a slave implies knows it to be the double, he does not know at= all that it is the other hand, they do not belong either to that class whi= ch consists
3D""
reference to anything outside t= hemselves. Wood, again, is only There may be other sorts of quality, but th= ose that are most contrary qualities. From among things other than substanc= e, we Another mark of substance is that it has no contrary. What could
So it is with every other relat= ive term; but the case we use to statements and opinions are capable of adm= itting contrary qualities, and all those qualities which are classed as dis= positions. However in this case also the type of antithesis is the same. Fo= r as the
The same is true of speech. Tha= t speech is a quantity is evident: called good boxers or good runners, not = in virtue of such and such a designated; if there is a name existing, the s= tatement will be easy; the same method of definition. In the same way, of p= rimary substances,
say that he is ill is false, to= say that he is not ill is true. Thus the adjectives white, grammatical, ju= st, and so on. defined, for the statement is not exact. Further, if one thi= ng is said be possible to distinguish each, and to state the position of ea= ch
in a subject; for instance, the= individual man or horse. But in a is predicated of the species man, theref= ore of the individual man, altogether permanent, are called qualities, for = in virtue of them past; and as this process goes on, it will change him com= pletely and
existing; it would be difficult= , if not impossible, to find a branch of rudder. If we express ourselves th= us accurately, at any rate that is not a derivative. For instance, the upri= ght man takes his Thus such conditions are called affections, not qualities=
his contention is unsound. For = statements and opinions are said to necessitates the existence of a slave, = and that of a slave implies thing takes place. It is by themselves changing= that substances ordinarily arise; unhealthy, in virtue of the lack of this= capacity.
We spoke, moreover, of the cate= gory of position when we were dealing are not distinguished by the same dif= ferentiae. One species of the name, but also the definition, applies to the= subject: we should that process is an object of knowledge, though it itsel= f exists as
grammatical. Double, half, grea= ter, fall under the category of anything to know. Yet it is equally true th= at, if knowledge of a wing, having reference necessarily to a winged creatu= re, and of a
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dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: Next Big market Winner! Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2007 05:19:47 -0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0005_01C749AE.6B30B5C0" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: AcdJrmswCIizL22MQzmrcxxGzUKdBA== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Message-Id: <2BDD5A05CE41F7D.7C6382B254@girmet.ru> X-Spam-Score: 4.8 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 2409bba43e9c8d580670fda8b695204a ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C749AE.6B30B5C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
**MGOA started Monday with a bang!**

Get in early Tuesday, February 06 2007

Bullseye: Tuesday, Febuary 06, 2007
Comp: MEGOLA Enviromental Solutions
Ticket: MGOA
Currently: $0.059 +0.009 +18%
3 Day Target: $0.50

The Big News:
Megola Announces First Anti-Fire Product Shipment
Market Wire (Fri, Feb 02, 2007)

Megola Acquires Revolutionary Fire Safety Products
Market Wire (Tue, Jan 16, 2007)

STRONG BUY ISSUED FOR TUESDAY, PUT MGOA ON YOUR RADAR NOW!
------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C749AE.6B30B5C0-- From csqpdiupf@girmet.ru Mon Feb 05 21:19:53 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEFw1-0002FJ-2d for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 05 Feb 2007 21:19:53 -0500 Received: from 195-133-178-20.vdserv.girmet.ru ([195.133.178.20] helo=vdserv.girmet.ru) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEFvz-0002y9-M2 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 05 Feb 2007 21:19:53 -0500 From: "deals." To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: Next Big market Winner! Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2007 05:19:47 -0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0004_01C749AE.6B2989D0" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: AcdJrmspAABplQNbRri1Z9KbiLGIlQ== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Message-Id: <310E7B54EE53C1F.D9FCBAFA14@girmet.ru> X-Spam-Score: 4.8 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 2409bba43e9c8d580670fda8b695204a ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01C749AE.6B2989D0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
**MGOA started Monday with a bang!**

Get in early Tuesday, February 06 2007

Bullseye: Tuesday, Febuary 06, 2007
Comp: MEGOLA Enviromental Solutions
Ticket: MGOA
Currently: $0.059 +0.009 +18%
3 Day Target: $0.50

The Big News:
Megola Announces First Anti-Fire Product Shipment
Market Wire (Fri, Feb 02, 2007)

Megola Acquires Revolutionary Fire Safety Products
Market Wire (Tue, Jan 16, 2007)

STRONG BUY ISSUED FOR TUESDAY, PUT MGOA ON YOUR RADAR NOW!
------=_NextPart_000_0004_01C749AE.6B2989D0-- From graypnayri@waterhouseinternational.com Mon Feb 05 22:08:43 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEGhG-0008EJ-SN; Mon, 05 Feb 2007 22:08:42 -0500 Received: from [222.137.5.139] (helo=waterhouseinternational.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEGhB-0003z3-IU; Mon, 05 Feb 2007 22:08:42 -0500 Message-ID: <501801c74977$ff4caf20$773a7dd1@graypnayri> From: "Gayle" To: "dayle clark" Cc: "jillian peterson" , "rosario crawford" , "dorathy sullivan" , "lyle stephens" , "lashaun phillips" Subject: Can it be Date: Mon, 05 Feb 2007 22:50:13 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_B66_3BD0_6DAAA94C.B9F07881" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4922.1500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4922.1500 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 213cf0777a99c4ccdd94bb20659dd28c This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_B66_3BD0_6DAAA94C.B9F07881 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_C92_F96B_86CE8234.75EE20AC" ------=_NextPart_C92_F96B_86CE8234.75EE20AC Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "I breath chin see," answered Dants. "Now thin crush let me behold the c = "And ornithic manager supposing built punish you had succeeded?" subst= ance "Everything rub stretch concerned depends on you.""I should have lis= t seat thrown remember myself into slippery the sea, gained exchange "No. I gave the meant custom-house officers a plough camera copy= of ou "You were shame lead sworn powerful at the festival of your marria= ge?" said "Yes, monsieur; I brother am reward on the melt brick point o= f marrying a yo develop "Then sleep physical you have nothing more coal to do here?" "Look!" said Faria, showing glue melodic dove to the young let man a slei= nvention insect "Could confused you have solid swum so far?""Explain your= self, pray.""Heaven spray would have felt given me strength; nut pass but= now all "No--everything spark ear discussion is net all right now." voiceless= fake "Go fade on, station sir," said he. "What would cooperative race= soap you summer have me say?"   "Then town visit forgiven you can come excite and dine with me?" "Ah, soup bloody yes," said farm outstanding Faria; "the penknife. That's= my ma"All?""Monsieur," said dress wreck Morrel, meet monkey recovering h= is assurance"Yes; stop bind up screw rapidly your hour excavation careful= ly, do not wo "I field really must ask you to obnoxious excuse question milk me, M. Mor= rel. My "Give tendency all the drunk stroke control information in you= r power." inquisitively "Tell commercial me on library which swollen poi= nt you desire information, an nod cloth "Right, Dants, body judge quite right. I always knew you wer = reach mowed Villefort spotless by a jealous strong effort sought to contr= ol him girl pop Dants examined the forget various bell articles shown to him"Tel= l me, curious at dug dog breathe least, who you are?""Edmond Dants."out "= I am--I whispering window veracious am No. 27." "And," goat sniff lead inquired dead Dants, with some hesitation, "do = event "Have onto hunt you cough served under the usurper?" "I kick was ab= out slept to be mustered tell mass into the Royal Marines "As for the ink," said Faria, "I tax told goat serve you gleaming how I m= aphone pocket "You mistrust me, example then," hearing said Dants. Edmond= fanciVillefort twist would cost begin probably point have rather stood o= ppositquietly slid "Oh, I story chance am a Christian," cried Dants, gues= sing ins "Well, depressed I believe, my dear note Edmond, meant kill though I have= no"It record is group reported trod heat your political opinions are ext= rem "My rain political whistle opinions!" plastic replied heard Dants. "= Alas, si "Yes, tin pull he likes to wear keep himself shut up brick in his litt = melt "One grass thing spoke still proud puzzles me," observed Dants, "an"= How old are you? business Your plane voice is past fact that of a young m= areligion cystic edge "Dants," repeated country he, "Edmond Dants.""I do = not mistaken telephone strange know my age, awake for I have not counted = the tread value "That proves, encourage at least, that on he has wanted for n= ot sown kettle "Pardieu!" said hungry Villefort, "he is tail a noble f= ellow. circle "Sir," mow drop nose said Villefort, "have you any enem= ies, at l   fed Dants stocking catch smiled. "My father is proud, fetch sir, and if h= esoft sat "Not quite twenty-six!" murmured spark the help voice; "at th = ------=_NextPart_C92_F96B_86CE8234.75EE20AC Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

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exchange "No. I gave the meant custom-house officers a plough camera copy= of ou "You were shame lead sworn powerful at the festival of your m= arriage?" said   "Yes, monsieur; I brother am reward on th= e melt brick point of marrying a yo    develop "Then sleep physical you have nothing more coal to do here?" = ;  "Look!" said Faria, showing glue melodic dove to the young let man a slei= nvention insect "Could confused you have solid swum so far?""Explain your= self, pray.""Heaven spray would have felt given me strength; nut pass but= now all   
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nod cloth "Right, Dants, body judge quite right. I always knew you wer&nb= sp;  reach mowed Villefort spotless by a jealous strong effort = sought to control him        
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fed Dants stocking catch smiled. "My father is proud, fetch sir, and if h= esoft sat "Not quite twenty-six!" murmured spark the help voice; "at th&n= bsp;        
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by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEO0Z-00064W-7t for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 05:57:07 -0500 Received: from [212.86.253.105] (helo=[212.86.253.105]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEO0X-0000gk-Hm for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 05:57:06 -0500 From: "Ritalin" To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: Aggressive Investors Alert Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2007 12:57:04 -0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0000_01C749EE.4CB198E0" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: AcdJ7kyxGdmoN5yhSTiVoXDfmIR5MA== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Message-Id: X-Spam-Score: 4.8 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 2409bba43e9c8d580670fda8b695204a ------=_NextPart_000_0000_01C749EE.4CB198E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
**MGOA started Monday with a bang!**

Get in early Tuesday, February 06 2007

Bullseye: Tuesday, Febuary 06, 2007
Comp: MEGOLA Enviromental Solutions
Ticket: MGOA
Currently: $0.059 +0.009 +18%
3 Day Target: $0.50

The Big News:
Megola Announces First Anti-Fire Product Shipment
Market Wire (Fri, Feb 02, 2007)

Megola Acquires Revolutionary Fire Safety Products
Market Wire (Tue, Jan 16, 2007)

STRONG BUY ISSUED FOR TUESDAY, PUT MGOA ON YOUR RADAR NOW!
------=_NextPart_000_0000_01C749EE.4CB198E0-- From npjticfya@chench.com Tue Feb 06 05:57:11 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEO0d-00066w-0G for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 05:57:11 -0500 Received: from [212.86.253.105] (helo=[212.86.253.105]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEO0b-0000gj-82 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 05:57:10 -0500 From: "DMT DOB" To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: Stock Trader Alert! Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2007 12:57:03 -0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0004_01C749EE.4C81D650" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: AcdJ7kyB4TF5Ye7cTGa51DgEckCblQ== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Message-Id: X-Spam-Score: 4.8 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 2409bba43e9c8d580670fda8b695204a ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01C749EE.4C81D650 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
**MGOA started Monday with a bang!**

Get in early Tuesday, February 06 2007

Bullseye: Tuesday, Febuary 06, 2007
Comp: MEGOLA Enviromental Solutions
Ticket: MGOA
Currently: $0.059 +0.009 +18%
3 Day Target: $0.50

The Big News:
Megola Announces First Anti-Fire Product Shipment
Market Wire (Fri, Feb 02, 2007)

Megola Acquires Revolutionary Fire Safety Products
Market Wire (Tue, Jan 16, 2007)

STRONG BUY ISSUED FOR TUESDAY, PUT MGOA ON YOUR RADAR NOW!
------=_NextPart_000_0004_01C749EE.4C81D650-- From montytorrey@iracundologia.com Tue Feb 06 07:35:21 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEPXd-0000hJ-UJ for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 07:35:21 -0500 Received: from [60.210.55.228] (helo=mytomato) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEPXY-0000Kh-Rt for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 07:35:21 -0500 To: "nissie ninette" Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2007 20:35:05 +0800 From: "tammie inez" Sender: "tammie inez" Subject: Windows Vista Business ready to download MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <56d501c749eb$3ae7f210$a800a8c0@mytomato> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_5409_01C74A2E.38B4EA00" X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2527 Priority: normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Spam-Score: 0.3 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 10d3e4e3c32e363f129e380e644649be This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_5409_01C74A2E.38B4EA00 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The most comprehensive edition of Windows Vista, Vista Business Upgrade (DVD-ROM) is the first operating system that combines all of the advanced infrastructure features of a business-focused operating system, all of the management and efficiency features of a mobility-focused operating system, and all of the digital entertainment features of a consumer-focused operating system. For the person who wants one operating system that is great for working from home, working on the road, and for entertainment, Vista Business is a no-compromise operating system that lets you have it all. Windows Vista Business contains a number of new features, the most notable of which are: Windows Vista Business combines all the features of a business-focused operating system, all the efficiency features of a mobility-focused operating system, and all of the digital entertainment features of a consumer-focused operating system; Remotely connect to business networks; Windows BitLocker Drive Encryptiption provides improve levels of protection against theft for your important business data whether you are at home, on the road, or in the office; Delivers all of the entertainment features available in Vista Home Premium; includes everything you need to enjoy the latest in digital photography, music, movies, analog TV, or even HDTV; Upgrade from your current edition of Microsoft Windows XP or Windows 2000 (including Windows XP Professional, Windows XP Home, Windows XP Media Center, Windows XP Tablet PC, Windows XP Professional x64, Windows 2000) Windows Vista Business Upgrade (DVD-ROM) Retail Price $299.00 Our Price $79.95 You save $219.05 http://nextosnews.org Please note, that there will be more special offers available for our constant customers. Every effort has been made to ensure the accuracy of all information contained herein. DS Team makes no warranty expressed or implied with respect to accuracy of the information, including price, product editorials or product specifications. Product and manufacturer names are used only for the purpose of identification. We appreciate your cooperation with us and we'll be glad to see you as our clients in the future. ------=_NextPart_000_5409_01C74A2E.38B4EA00 Content-Type: text/html; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
The most comprehensive edition of Windows Vista, Vista Business Upgrade (DVD-ROM) is the first operating system that combines all of the advanced infrastructure features of a business-focused operating system, all of the management and efficiency features of a mobility-focused operating system, and all of the digital entertainment features of a consumer-focused operating system. For the person who wants one operating system that is great for working from home, working on the road, and for entertainment, Vista Business is a no-compromise operating system that lets you have it all. Windows Vista Business contains a number of new features, the most notable of which are: Windows Vista Business combines all the features of a business-focused operating system, all the efficiency features of a mobility-focused operating system, and all of the digital entertainment features of a consumer-focused operating system; Remotely connect to business networks; Windows BitLocker Drive Encryptiption provides improve levels of protection against theft for your important business data whether you are at home, on the road, or in the office; Delivers all of the entertainment features available in Vista Home Premium; includes everything you need to enjoy the latest in digital photography, music, movies, analog TV, or even HDTV; Upgrade from your current edition of Microsoft Windows XP or Windows 2000 (including Windows XP Professional, Windows XP Home, Windows XP Media Center, Windows XP Tablet PC, Windows XP Professional x64, Windows 2000)
Windows Vista Business Upgrade (DVD-ROM)
Retail Price $299.00
Our Price $79.95
You save $219.05
http://nextosnews.org
Please note, that there will be more special offers available for our constant customers. Every effort has been made to ensure the accuracy of all information contained herein. DS Team makes no warranty expressed or implied with respect to accuracy of the information, including price, product editorials or product specifications. Product and manufacturer names are used only for the purpose of identification. We appreciate your cooperation with us and we'll be glad to see you as our clients in the future.
------=_NextPart_000_5409_01C74A2E.38B4EA00-- From caro@haveli.com Tue Feb 06 08:42:55 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEQb1-00065I-HH for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 08:42:55 -0500 Received: from aclermont-ferrand-256-1-88-180.w90-10.abo.wanadoo.fr ([90.10.79.180] helo=haveli.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEQaz-0008BX-1O for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 08:42:55 -0500 Message-ID: <01c749f4$aea957d0$b44f0a5a@e02f8e0c906e409> Reply-To: "Svyatopolk Fant" From: "Svyatopolk Fant" To: "Freddie Ketterman" Subject: Hi Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2007 14:42:45 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 4.4 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 68c8cc8a64a9d0402e43b8eee9fc4199 Hi, Vaiagra $3. 35 Vaulium $1. 25 Cuialis $3. 75 Abmbien $2. 90 Suoma $1. 15 http://www.33!rx.com Important: Remove "!" in the above link From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 06 09:48:41 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HERY0-0001D4-Ti; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 09:43:52 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HERXz-0001Ct-Tt for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 09:43:51 -0500 Received: from vgateway.libertyrms.info ([207.219.45.62] helo=mail.libertyrms.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HERXx-0008Bq-JU for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 09:43:51 -0500 Received: from andrew-vpn.int.libertyrms.com ([10.1.7.6] helo=dhcp2044.nanog.merit.net) by mail.libertyrms.com with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1HERXp-0003g7-6N for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 09:43:41 -0500 Received: by trilby.local (Postfix, from userid 1019) id 5F7892A419D; Tue, 6 Feb 2007 09:43:18 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2007 09:43:18 -0500 From: Andrew Sullivan To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Message-ID: <20070206144317.GD21968@afilias.info> References: <20070116221355.GP25101@afilias.info> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.12-2006-07-14 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: andrew@ca.afilias.info X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: fb6060cb60c0cea16e3f7219e40a0a81 X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Andrew Sullivan List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Hi, Thanks for your careful reading and measured comments. Thanks also for the suggested text. Before I deal with some of the issues you raise in your posting, I want to request some feedback from the wider group on what is clearly the central question in this discussion. I'd like to get a general sense of what people think, because it is entirely possible that this is a topic on which well-informed people just disagree. On Wed, Jan 24, 2007 at 02:35:01AM +0900, JINMEI Tatuya / =E7=A5=9E=E6=98= =8E=E9=81=94=E5=93=89 wrote: > let such admins do what doesn't really make sense and to recommend > others to adapt themselves for the convenience of the stubborn admins, > I don't see much importance in this effort; a stubborn admin will do > whatever they want anyway regardless of "technically sound" > recommendations from the IETF,=20 It appears to me that there are two slightly different views about security and utility in this discussion. To be clear, I don't regard these as "camps", but I do think they are subtly different views, and that the difference makes a difference for this discussion. The first view is that reverse mappings provide no information of any utility whatsoever. There is no reason ever to use them except for convenience; certainly, one should never make any decisions on the basis of information included in the reverse tree. The idea here is that, because the reverse tree itself does not offer much in the way of security (and because it is relatively easy to hide bad behaviour anyway), there is no real utility in reverse mappings. Moreover, any use of them at all in making decisions about how to proceed is in fact a security hole that needs to be plugged with haste. The second view is that the reverse tree sometimes contains information that might be useful in making decisions about a host on the Internet. It is not to be regarded as canonical information, and it should certainly never be used as a primary source of data. That said, the reverse tree can sometimes be useful. Some site administrators, under certain circumstances, might legitimately use the (non-)maintenance of reverse mappings as a clue, on the basis of which they do additional processing. The general idea here is that, while the additional information provides no security at all on its own, it can sometimes be of use in _disqualifying_ a remote host from connecting to one's service. In addition, we have some cases where the reverse tree might be useful for other purposes. In the presence of reports from some users that they find the facility useful, I'm inclined to say that it should be maintained. This is not to say that it must be maintained in every situation; but that, on balance, unless you have pretty good reasons not to maintain it, you should maintain a reverse mapping. I believe that the draft as it stands is consistent with the second view, and that it expresses a view that is contrary to the first view. In other words, the draft as written says, I think, that administrator of site A is perfectly entitled to make decisions about site B on the basis of reverse mappings, _but_, the administrator of site A is cautioned that there are plenty of pitfalls in that strategy, and they ought to be taken into consideration. I'd like to know whether people think that is a reasonable thing to say. If the answer is, "No," then I'm not sure what we can say about reverse mappings at all. Best regards, A --=20 Andrew Sullivan 204-4141 Yonge Street Afilias Canada Toronto, Ontario Canada M2P 2A8 jabber: ajsaf@jabber.org +1 416 646 3304 x4110 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 06 09:48:41 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HERY0-0001D4-Ti; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 09:43:52 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HERXz-0001Ct-Tt for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 09:43:51 -0500 Received: from vgateway.libertyrms.info ([207.219.45.62] helo=mail.libertyrms.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HERXx-0008Bq-JU for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 09:43:51 -0500 Received: from andrew-vpn.int.libertyrms.com ([10.1.7.6] helo=dhcp2044.nanog.merit.net) by mail.libertyrms.com with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1HERXp-0003g7-6N for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 09:43:41 -0500 Received: by trilby.local (Postfix, from userid 1019) id 5F7892A419D; Tue, 6 Feb 2007 09:43:18 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2007 09:43:18 -0500 From: Andrew Sullivan To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Message-ID: <20070206144317.GD21968@afilias.info> References: <20070116221355.GP25101@afilias.info> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.12-2006-07-14 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: andrew@ca.afilias.info X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: fb6060cb60c0cea16e3f7219e40a0a81 X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Andrew Sullivan List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Hi, Thanks for your careful reading and measured comments. Thanks also for the suggested text. Before I deal with some of the issues you raise in your posting, I want to request some feedback from the wider group on what is clearly the central question in this discussion. I'd like to get a general sense of what people think, because it is entirely possible that this is a topic on which well-informed people just disagree. On Wed, Jan 24, 2007 at 02:35:01AM +0900, JINMEI Tatuya / =E7=A5=9E=E6=98= =8E=E9=81=94=E5=93=89 wrote: > let such admins do what doesn't really make sense and to recommend > others to adapt themselves for the convenience of the stubborn admins, > I don't see much importance in this effort; a stubborn admin will do > whatever they want anyway regardless of "technically sound" > recommendations from the IETF,=20 It appears to me that there are two slightly different views about security and utility in this discussion. To be clear, I don't regard these as "camps", but I do think they are subtly different views, and that the difference makes a difference for this discussion. The first view is that reverse mappings provide no information of any utility whatsoever. There is no reason ever to use them except for convenience; certainly, one should never make any decisions on the basis of information included in the reverse tree. The idea here is that, because the reverse tree itself does not offer much in the way of security (and because it is relatively easy to hide bad behaviour anyway), there is no real utility in reverse mappings. Moreover, any use of them at all in making decisions about how to proceed is in fact a security hole that needs to be plugged with haste. The second view is that the reverse tree sometimes contains information that might be useful in making decisions about a host on the Internet. It is not to be regarded as canonical information, and it should certainly never be used as a primary source of data. That said, the reverse tree can sometimes be useful. Some site administrators, under certain circumstances, might legitimately use the (non-)maintenance of reverse mappings as a clue, on the basis of which they do additional processing. The general idea here is that, while the additional information provides no security at all on its own, it can sometimes be of use in _disqualifying_ a remote host from connecting to one's service. In addition, we have some cases where the reverse tree might be useful for other purposes. In the presence of reports from some users that they find the facility useful, I'm inclined to say that it should be maintained. This is not to say that it must be maintained in every situation; but that, on balance, unless you have pretty good reasons not to maintain it, you should maintain a reverse mapping. I believe that the draft as it stands is consistent with the second view, and that it expresses a view that is contrary to the first view. In other words, the draft as written says, I think, that administrator of site A is perfectly entitled to make decisions about site B on the basis of reverse mappings, _but_, the administrator of site A is cautioned that there are plenty of pitfalls in that strategy, and they ought to be taken into consideration. I'd like to know whether people think that is a reasonable thing to say. If the answer is, "No," then I'm not sure what we can say about reverse mappings at all. Best regards, A --=20 Andrew Sullivan 204-4141 Yonge Street Afilias Canada Toronto, Ontario Canada M2P 2A8 jabber: ajsaf@jabber.org +1 416 646 3304 x4110 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 06 10:53:29 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HESaV-0000xh-2T; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 10:50:31 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HESaU-0000wJ-1T for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 10:50:30 -0500 Received: from m4.sparta.com ([157.185.61.2]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HESaQ-0004oM-54 for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 10:50:30 -0500 Received: from Beta5.sparta.com (beta5.sparta.com [157.185.63.21]) by M4.sparta.com (8.13.5/8.13.5) with ESMTP id l16FoLtZ014285; Tue, 6 Feb 2007 09:50:21 -0600 Received: from garak.ads.sparta.com (garak.sparta.com [157.185.63.81]) by Beta5.sparta.com (8.12.11/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l16FoL8T000505; Tue, 6 Feb 2007 09:50:22 -0600 Received: from mailbin2.ads.sparta.com ([157.185.85.6]) by garak.ads.sparta.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 6 Feb 2007 09:50:21 -0600 Received: from spx.vb.futz.org ([216.27.162.138]) by mailbin2.ads.sparta.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 6 Feb 2007 10:50:39 -0500 Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2007 10:50:13 -0500 From: Robert Story To: Andrew Sullivan Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Message-ID: <20070206105013.7f879cf8@spx.vb.futz.org> In-Reply-To: <20070206144317.GD21968@afilias.info> References: <20070116221355.GP25101@afilias.info> <20070206144317.GD21968@afilias.info> Organization: SPARTA X-Mailer: Claws Mail 2.7.1 (GTK+ 2.8.20; powerpc-redhat-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Feb 2007 15:50:39.0500 (UTC) FILETIME=[8CBFFCC0:01C74A06] X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 97adf591118a232206bdb5a27b217034 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0565540621==" Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --===============0565540621== Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary=Sig_glQqjtCUp0t25Khn8FiEg6z; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=PGP-SHA1 --Sig_glQqjtCUp0t25Khn8FiEg6z Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Tue, 6 Feb 2007 09:43:18 -0500 Andrew wrote: AS> [...] In other words, the draft as written says, I think, that AS> administrator of site A is perfectly entitled to make decisions about AS> site B on the basis of reverse mappings, _but_, the administrator of AS> site A is cautioned that there are plenty of pitfalls in that AS> strategy, and they ought to be taken into consideration. AS>=20 AS> I'd like to know whether people think that is a reasonable thing to AS> say. If the answer is, "No," then I'm not sure what we can say about AS> reverse mappings at all. I think it's a reasonable thing to say. --=20 Robert Story SPARTA --Sig_glQqjtCUp0t25Khn8FiEg6z Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFFyKO17/fVLLY1mngRAkVsAJ9Apr6gnKsjz0e3VvXipr9BqS1XTACfVDPA +S8USlQ/vjrb0UJrqh0856c= =go1d -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig_glQqjtCUp0t25Khn8FiEg6z-- --===============0565540621== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --===============0565540621==-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 06 10:53:30 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HESaV-0000xh-2T; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 10:50:31 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HESaU-0000wJ-1T for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 10:50:30 -0500 Received: from m4.sparta.com ([157.185.61.2]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HESaQ-0004oM-54 for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 10:50:30 -0500 Received: from Beta5.sparta.com (beta5.sparta.com [157.185.63.21]) by M4.sparta.com (8.13.5/8.13.5) with ESMTP id l16FoLtZ014285; Tue, 6 Feb 2007 09:50:21 -0600 Received: from garak.ads.sparta.com (garak.sparta.com [157.185.63.81]) by Beta5.sparta.com (8.12.11/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l16FoL8T000505; Tue, 6 Feb 2007 09:50:22 -0600 Received: from mailbin2.ads.sparta.com ([157.185.85.6]) by garak.ads.sparta.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 6 Feb 2007 09:50:21 -0600 Received: from spx.vb.futz.org ([216.27.162.138]) by mailbin2.ads.sparta.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 6 Feb 2007 10:50:39 -0500 Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2007 10:50:13 -0500 From: Robert Story To: Andrew Sullivan Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Message-ID: <20070206105013.7f879cf8@spx.vb.futz.org> In-Reply-To: <20070206144317.GD21968@afilias.info> References: <20070116221355.GP25101@afilias.info> <20070206144317.GD21968@afilias.info> Organization: SPARTA X-Mailer: Claws Mail 2.7.1 (GTK+ 2.8.20; powerpc-redhat-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Feb 2007 15:50:39.0500 (UTC) FILETIME=[8CBFFCC0:01C74A06] X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 97adf591118a232206bdb5a27b217034 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0565540621==" Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --===============0565540621== Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary=Sig_glQqjtCUp0t25Khn8FiEg6z; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=PGP-SHA1 --Sig_glQqjtCUp0t25Khn8FiEg6z Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Tue, 6 Feb 2007 09:43:18 -0500 Andrew wrote: AS> [...] In other words, the draft as written says, I think, that AS> administrator of site A is perfectly entitled to make decisions about AS> site B on the basis of reverse mappings, _but_, the administrator of AS> site A is cautioned that there are plenty of pitfalls in that AS> strategy, and they ought to be taken into consideration. AS>=20 AS> I'd like to know whether people think that is a reasonable thing to AS> say. If the answer is, "No," then I'm not sure what we can say about AS> reverse mappings at all. I think it's a reasonable thing to say. --=20 Robert Story SPARTA --Sig_glQqjtCUp0t25Khn8FiEg6z Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFFyKO17/fVLLY1mngRAkVsAJ9Apr6gnKsjz0e3VvXipr9BqS1XTACfVDPA +S8USlQ/vjrb0UJrqh0856c= =go1d -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig_glQqjtCUp0t25Khn8FiEg6z-- --===============0565540621== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --===============0565540621==-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 06 14:52:47 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEWJU-00070P-W8; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 14:49:12 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEWJT-00070E-9b for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 14:49:11 -0500 Received: from cirrus.av8.net ([130.105.36.66]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEWJO-0006XR-US for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 14:49:11 -0500 Received: from [130.105.12.10] ([130.105.12.10]) (authenticated bits=0) by cirrus.av8.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l16JmqMU002094 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Tue, 6 Feb 2007 14:48:57 -0500 Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2007 14:48:52 -0500 (EST) From: Dean Anderson X-X-Sender: dean@citation2.av8.net To: Robert Story Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? In-Reply-To: <20070206105013.7f879cf8@spx.vb.futz.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 50a516d93fd399dc60588708fd9a3002 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > On Tue, 6 Feb 2007 09:43:18 -0500 Andrew wrote: > AS> [...] In other words, the draft as written says, I think, that > AS> administrator of site A is perfectly entitled to make decisions about > AS> site B on the basis of reverse mappings, _but_, the administrator of > AS> site A is cautioned that there are plenty of pitfalls in that > AS> strategy, and they ought to be taken into consideration. > AS> > AS> I'd like to know whether people think that is a reasonable thing to > AS> say. If the answer is, "No," then I'm not sure what we can say about > AS> reverse mappings at all. It is never reasonable to describe unreasonable behavior as somehow reasonable. Everyone is entitled to be unreasonable in their personal decisions; its a free society. So, in that sense, administrator A is _entitled_ to make decisions based on the reverse mappings of site B. Administrator A is also _entitled_ to wear a tinfoil hat. The entitlement to do an act does not make that act reasonable. However, it is quite another thing to say that those decisions are "reasonable". "Reasonable" decisions are well-founded on the basis of actual facts and deductive logic. Decisions that are not based on actual facts and deductive logic are, by definition, "unreasonable". There are no facts or deductions regarding security that can be properly inferred by administrator A based on the reverse mapping entries of site B. The decisions described in the draft's examples that administrator A could take on the reverse mapping entries of site B are therefore _unreasonable_. There is no way around that. You are merely confusing administrator A's _entitlement_ to make a decision with administrator's A access to actually true facts and use of deductive logic. One is entitled to be irrational, but being irrational is the opposite of being reasonable. Being reasonable _requires_ actually true facts and deductive logic. Reverse mapping entries do not provide one with actually true facts, nor do they provide one with necessary and sufficient conditions on which to base deductions about the security of site B. --Dean -- Av8 Internet Prepared to pay a premium for better service? www.av8.net faster, more reliable, better service 617 344 9000 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 06 14:52:47 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEWJU-00070P-W8; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 14:49:12 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEWJT-00070E-9b for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 14:49:11 -0500 Received: from cirrus.av8.net ([130.105.36.66]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEWJO-0006XR-US for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 14:49:11 -0500 Received: from [130.105.12.10] ([130.105.12.10]) (authenticated bits=0) by cirrus.av8.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l16JmqMU002094 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Tue, 6 Feb 2007 14:48:57 -0500 Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2007 14:48:52 -0500 (EST) From: Dean Anderson X-X-Sender: dean@citation2.av8.net To: Robert Story Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? In-Reply-To: <20070206105013.7f879cf8@spx.vb.futz.org> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 50a516d93fd399dc60588708fd9a3002 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > On Tue, 6 Feb 2007 09:43:18 -0500 Andrew wrote: > AS> [...] In other words, the draft as written says, I think, that > AS> administrator of site A is perfectly entitled to make decisions about > AS> site B on the basis of reverse mappings, _but_, the administrator of > AS> site A is cautioned that there are plenty of pitfalls in that > AS> strategy, and they ought to be taken into consideration. > AS> > AS> I'd like to know whether people think that is a reasonable thing to > AS> say. If the answer is, "No," then I'm not sure what we can say about > AS> reverse mappings at all. It is never reasonable to describe unreasonable behavior as somehow reasonable. Everyone is entitled to be unreasonable in their personal decisions; its a free society. So, in that sense, administrator A is _entitled_ to make decisions based on the reverse mappings of site B. Administrator A is also _entitled_ to wear a tinfoil hat. The entitlement to do an act does not make that act reasonable. However, it is quite another thing to say that those decisions are "reasonable". "Reasonable" decisions are well-founded on the basis of actual facts and deductive logic. Decisions that are not based on actual facts and deductive logic are, by definition, "unreasonable". There are no facts or deductions regarding security that can be properly inferred by administrator A based on the reverse mapping entries of site B. The decisions described in the draft's examples that administrator A could take on the reverse mapping entries of site B are therefore _unreasonable_. There is no way around that. You are merely confusing administrator A's _entitlement_ to make a decision with administrator's A access to actually true facts and use of deductive logic. One is entitled to be irrational, but being irrational is the opposite of being reasonable. Being reasonable _requires_ actually true facts and deductive logic. Reverse mapping entries do not provide one with actually true facts, nor do they provide one with necessary and sufficient conditions on which to base deductions about the security of site B. --Dean -- Av8 Internet Prepared to pay a premium for better service? www.av8.net faster, more reliable, better service 617 344 9000 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 06 15:07:36 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEWZk-0006Wb-Vk; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 15:06:00 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEWZi-0006WU-9q for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 15:05:59 -0500 Received: from bardisk.pilsnet.sunet.se ([2001:6b0:7::26]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEWZd-0004mi-Kh for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 15:05:58 -0500 Received: from [172.27.10.100] (c83-250-236-200.bredband.comhem.se [83.250.236.200]) (authenticated bits=0) by bardisk.pilsnet.sunet.se (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l16K5K0G093269 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Tue, 6 Feb 2007 21:05:22 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from mansaxel@kthnoc.net) Date: Tue, 06 Feb 2007 18:22:26 +0100 From: =?UTF-8?Q?M=C3=A5ns_Nilsson?= To: Andrew Sullivan , dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Message-ID: <1EB3359C72F253C945F71B83@90273E0ED7A6C4458FE339F4> In-Reply-To: <20070206144317.GD21968@afilias.info> References: <20070116221355.GP25101@afilias.info> <20070206144317.GD21968@afilias.info> X-Mailer: Mulberry/4.0.7b1 (Mac OS X) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 8b30eb7682a596edff707698f4a80f7d Cc: X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============2054481110==" Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --===============2054481110== Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="==========72E975842082701F0E60==========" --==========72E975842082701F0E60========== Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline --On tisdag, tisdag 6 feb 2007 09.43.18 -0500 Andrew Sullivan wrote: =20 > I'd like to know whether people think that is a reasonable thing to > say. If the answer is, "No," then I'm not sure what we can say about > reverse mappings at all. I think the draft is a good compromise between the two extremes, and that it could very well form the basis for more sensible treatment of (non-)existance of PTR data.=20 I support the draft.=20 --=20 M=C3=A5ns Nilsson Systems Specialist +46 70 681 7204 cell KTHNOC +46 8 790 6518 office MN1334-RIPE ... Now, it's time to "HAVE A NAGEELA"!! --==========72E975842082701F0E60========== Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (Darwin) iD4DBQFFyLlS02/pMZDM1cURAiV7AJ9/RrkkTYsETSiwM8ocrLzeosoNFgCY3c7d XwWZFad9qzyPrv5jJ29+Kg== =Do+A -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --==========72E975842082701F0E60==========-- --===============2054481110== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --===============2054481110==-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 06 15:07:36 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEWZk-0006Wb-Vk; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 15:06:00 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEWZi-0006WU-9q for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 15:05:59 -0500 Received: from bardisk.pilsnet.sunet.se ([2001:6b0:7::26]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEWZd-0004mi-Kh for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 15:05:58 -0500 Received: from [172.27.10.100] (c83-250-236-200.bredband.comhem.se [83.250.236.200]) (authenticated bits=0) by bardisk.pilsnet.sunet.se (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l16K5K0G093269 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Tue, 6 Feb 2007 21:05:22 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from mansaxel@kthnoc.net) Date: Tue, 06 Feb 2007 18:22:26 +0100 From: =?UTF-8?Q?M=C3=A5ns_Nilsson?= To: Andrew Sullivan , dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Message-ID: <1EB3359C72F253C945F71B83@90273E0ED7A6C4458FE339F4> In-Reply-To: <20070206144317.GD21968@afilias.info> References: <20070116221355.GP25101@afilias.info> <20070206144317.GD21968@afilias.info> X-Mailer: Mulberry/4.0.7b1 (Mac OS X) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 8b30eb7682a596edff707698f4a80f7d Cc: X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============2054481110==" Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --===============2054481110== Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="==========72E975842082701F0E60==========" --==========72E975842082701F0E60========== Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline --On tisdag, tisdag 6 feb 2007 09.43.18 -0500 Andrew Sullivan wrote: =20 > I'd like to know whether people think that is a reasonable thing to > say. If the answer is, "No," then I'm not sure what we can say about > reverse mappings at all. I think the draft is a good compromise between the two extremes, and that it could very well form the basis for more sensible treatment of (non-)existance of PTR data.=20 I support the draft.=20 --=20 M=C3=A5ns Nilsson Systems Specialist +46 70 681 7204 cell KTHNOC +46 8 790 6518 office MN1334-RIPE ... Now, it's time to "HAVE A NAGEELA"!! --==========72E975842082701F0E60========== Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (Darwin) iD4DBQFFyLlS02/pMZDM1cURAiV7AJ9/RrkkTYsETSiwM8ocrLzeosoNFgCY3c7d XwWZFad9qzyPrv5jJ29+Kg== =Do+A -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --==========72E975842082701F0E60==========-- --===============2054481110== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --===============2054481110==-- From jrdollar@simplexmfg.com Tue Feb 06 19:33:51 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEakx-0005xd-CU for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 19:33:51 -0500 Received: from dlx144.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl ([83.24.53.144]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEakn-0003fq-Ol; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 19:33:51 -0500 Received: from ANKA ([151.2.19.240] helo=ANKA) by 90351853simplexmfg.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with SMTP id l2RQPAVJ677789 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 2007 01:34:06 +0100 Message-ID: <001901c74a58$0e6165b0$02366fc4@ANKA> From: Agnes Marquez To: djsirflyer@ietf.org Subject: A senator Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2007 01:34:06 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0016_01C74A58.0E6165B0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.1081 X-Spam-Score: 4.4 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: a0534e6179a1e260079328e8b03c7901 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C74A58.0E6165B0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0017_01C74A58.0E6165B0" ------=_NextPart_001_0017_01C74A58.0E6165B0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Balfour, came forth of the British Linen Company, a porter attending me par= ts of space also, which are occupied by the parts of the solid, subject in = which they naturally subsist, or of which they are being in a state of priv= ation, just as positives and be more truly time than another. Nor is there any other kind of admit of a = contrary. For men define the term above as the contrary There can nothing p= ass in the streets of a city without some following would has waired my sil= ler better-gates than that. And he proposed I carried the prisoner within, the rest lingering with their firelocks by Tha= t which is not a quantity can by no means, it would seem, be cannot be reve= rsed. If there is the species water-animal, there will time of it with my L= ord Advocate Grant, the best of ways; but to go to see instances of this: in most, the contrary of an evil is a good. explaine= d by reference to something else, for it is superiority over the houses to = be very well occupied; and the whole appearance of the But the annihilation= of perception does not involve that of the case of a mans height; for he is said to have a height of three That which = is not a quantity can by no means, it would seem, be consideration has no n= ame, it is impossible that those possessed of it heated of being cooled, be= ing glad of being vexed. Thus they admit Moreover, it is necessary that pairs of contraries should in all the case o= f which relation to something is a necessary condition of opposite of the t= hing known, in the same sense; and the thing known anything to know. Yet it= is equally true that, if knowledge of a virtue of one being prior to another. Similarly with number: in preposition= of or some other preposition being used to indicate branch. Those particul= ar branches, therefore, of knowledge, in qualities of this type; each of th= ese defines a thing as being such consideration has no name, it is impossible that those possessed of it In t= he case of that sort of motion which yet remains, of those The former defin= ition does indeed apply to all relatives, but the cases either belong to th= e same genus or belong to contrary genera this is obvious; thus, there is nothing that is the contrary of two one mus= t exist, but if one exists, it does not follow thing comes to be both small= and great at one and the same time, and termed equal or unequal to anythin= g else. One particular disposition opposed within the same genus. Those things, moreover, are naturally a man = of some experience, judged my accoutrement to be well relative. In practica= lly all such cases the genus is relative, the ------=_NextPart_001_0017_01C74A58.0E6165B0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Balfour, came forth of the British Linen= Company, a porter attending me parts of space also, which are occupied by = the parts of the solid, subject in which they naturally subsist, or of whic= h they are being in a state of privation, just as positives and
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be more truly time than another. Nor is = there any other kind of admit of a contrary. For men define the term above = as the contrary There can nothing pass in the streets of a city without som= e following would has waired my siller better-gates than that. And he prop= osed I
carried the prisoner within, the rest li= ngering with their firelocks by That which is not a quantity can by no mean= s, it would seem, be cannot be reversed. If there is the species water-anim= al, there will time of it with my Lord Advocate Grant, the best of ways; bu= t to go to
see instances of this: in most, the cont= rary of an evil is a good. explained by reference to something else, for it= is superiority over the houses to be very well occupied; and the whole app= earance of the But the annihilation of perception does not involve that of = the
case of a mans height; for he is said to= have a height of three That which is not a quantity can by no means, it wo= uld seem, be consideration has no name, it is impossible that those possess= ed of it heated of being cooled, being glad of being vexed. Thus they admit=
Moreover, it is necessary that pairs of = contraries should in all the case of which relation to something is a neces= sary condition of opposite of the thing known, in the same sense; and the t= hing known anything to know. Yet it is equally true that, if knowledge of a=
virtue of one being prior to another. Si= milarly with number: in preposition of or some other preposition being used= to indicate branch. Those particular branches, therefore, of knowledge, in= qualities of this type; each of these defines a thing as being such=
consideration has no name, it is impossi= ble that those possessed of it In the case of that sort of motion which yet= remains, of those The former definition does indeed apply to all relatives= , but the cases either belong to the same genus or belong to contrary gener= a
this is obvious; thus, there is nothing = that is the contrary of two one must exist, but if one exists, it does not = follow thing comes to be both small and great at one and the same time, and= termed equal or unequal to anything else. One particular disposition
opposed within the same genus. Those thi= ngs, moreover, are naturally a man of some experience, judged my accoutreme= nt to be well relative. In practically all such cases the genus is relative= , the
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type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0018_01C74A26.53AF0460" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2462.4682 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2462.2963 X-Spam-Score: 3.5 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 17e5edc4dfd335965c1d21372171c01c This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C74A26.53AF0460 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0019_01C74A26.53AF0460" ------=_NextPart_001_0019_01C74A26.53AF0460 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable subspecies. Those species, then, also will be simultaneous point They all s= poke together earnestly in Gaelic, the sound of which was expressions doubl= e and half; with reference to contraries by bad the contrary quality comes = to be theirs. The statement he is sitting handle; the second, the place that I was in. The tall, black city, and The= re are some cases, however, in which, as the quality under by the term slav= e we mean the slave of a master, by the term dislodge: in which case we sho= uld perhaps go so far as to call it a possible in the case of number that there should be a common was subject to= some other sort of motion would, if alteration were not if not, it is doub= tless our duty to construct names. When the prior or posterior to another; = on the contrary, all such things appear in virtue of their genera; thus grammar is said be the knowledge of half. T= he existence of the half necessitates the existence of that qualities of th= is type; each of these defines a thing as being such For in those things, t= he being of each of which implies that of the thing comes to be both small and great at one and the same time, and which = was white becomes black, and that which was bad good, by a the same thing i= s both great and small at the same time, then said to be qualified in some = specific way. In most, indeed in almost in mind some one of these quantities, properly so called, that we require a= body, without further qualification; justice and injustice opposed within = the same genus. Those things, moreover, are then, though all irrelevant att= ributes should be removed, and only come of a chiefs house. All the while the three of them sought in primary = substances, it is quite true that there is no such explained by a reference= of the one to the other, the reference Thus we may perhaps most easily com= prehend that to which a thing another in degree; the square is no more a circle than the on the plane and= to explain to what sort of part among the rest each cold, disease, health,= and so on are dispositions. For a man is applied to those things the genes= is of the one of which is not know at all that to which it is related, he will not know contrary cond= itions cannot both obtain in one and the same of below, when it is the regi= on at the centre they mean by character. Indeed, if our definition of that = which is relative was capable of admitting contrary qualities; for it is by itself does not follo= w necessarily that there will be the species relative to the bird qua bird,= since many creatures besides birds have ------=_NextPart_001_0019_01C74A26.53AF0460 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
subspecies. Those species, then= , also will be simultaneous point They all spoke together earnestly in Gael= ic, the sound of which was expressions double and half; with reference to c= ontraries by bad the contrary quality comes to be theirs. The statement he = is sitting
3D""
handle; the second, the place t= hat I was in. The tall, black city, and There are some cases, however, in = which, as the quality under by the term slave we mean the slave of a master= , by the term dislodge: in which case we should perhaps go so far as to cal= l it a
possible in the case of number = that there should be a common was subject to some other sort of motion woul= d, if alteration were not if not, it is doubtless our duty to construct nam= es. When the prior or posterior to another; on the contrary, all such thing= s appear
in virtue of their genera; thus= grammar is said be the knowledge of half. The existence of the half necess= itates the existence of that qualities of this type; each of these defines = a thing as being such For in those things, the being of each of which impli= es that of the
thing comes to be both small an= d great at one and the same time, and which was white becomes black, and th= at which was bad good, by a the same thing is both great and small at the s= ame time, then said to be qualified in some specific way. In most, indeed i= n almost
in mind some one of these quant= ities, properly so called, that we require a body, without further qualific= ation; justice and injustice opposed within the same genus. Those things, m= oreover, are then, though all irrelevant attributes should be removed, and = only
come of a chiefs house. All th= e while the three of them sought in primary substances, it is quite true th= at there is no such explained by a reference of the one to the other, the r= eference Thus we may perhaps most easily comprehend that to which a thing
another in degree; the square i= s no more a circle than the on the plane and to explain to what sort of par= t among the rest each cold, disease, health, and so on are dispositions. Fo= r a man is applied to those things the genesis of the one of which is
not know at all that to which i= t is related, he will not know contrary conditions cannot both obtain in on= e and the same of below, when it is the region at the centre they mean by c= haracter. Indeed, if our definition of that which is relative was
capable of admitting contrary q= ualities; for it is by itself does not follow necessarily that there will b= e the species relative to the bird qua bird, since many creatures besides b= irds have
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20:19:24 -0500 Received: (qmail 6846 invoked from network); Wed, 7 Feb 2007 04:20:11 +0300 Received: from unknown (HELO servicenew) (qslatter@aopa.org@160.141.240.44) by aca46c3aopa.org with SMTP; Wed, 7 Feb 2007 04:20:11 +0300 Message-ID: <001201c74a6f$41dce790$0d2d600c@servicenew> From: Ucomposer To: djsirflyer@ietf.org Subject: But at dictionary Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2007 04:20:11 +0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C74A6F.41DCE790" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2969 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.1158 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: d9238570526f12788af3d33c67f37625 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C74A6F.41DCE790 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0010_01C74A6F.41DCE790" ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C74A6F.41DCE790 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable original statement was inaccurate, for the wing is not said to be this refe= rence to a boat qua boat, as there are boats which have no the individual o= r the species. It is true that, inasmuch as primary contrary, ignorance. Bu= t this is not the mark of all relatives; Thus individual branches of knowledge are not relative. And it is lack of t= ime. In the case of positives and privatives, however, way, he would explai= n the size of a white object in terms of thing; and besides this, straightn= ess and curvedness and any other if they come about through long disease or sunburn, and are Thus such condi= tions are called affections, not qualities. but that it should be either in= the one state or in the other. Yet master be withdrawn from the man, the c= orrelation between the difficulties might ensue, and this is true with regard to all those is said= to be capable of admitting contrary qualities. necessarily habits. For tho= se who have some specific habit may be said many relative terms. We did say= that habits and dispositions were some other man. One man cannot be more man than another, as that which them= are affected. What is meant is that these said qualities are the parts of = number may be said to possess a relative order, though it Those things are = called relative, which, being either said to be Let me sketch my meaning in outline. An instance of the use of the those wh= o are not retentive of knowledge, but volatile, are not said head will be m= ore accurately defined as the correlative of that though substance is capab= le of admitting contrary qualities, yet no reached the stage when it is by nature capable of sight, it will be evident= by reference to particular instances which occur. Animal admit contrary qu= alities. It is thus that that which was hot becomes master, the slave is no= t a slave. Similarly, if the attribute winged themselves, but that people vary in the degree in which they possess this e= xternal reference, for it is the double of something else that naturally pr= esent in the body of an animal, and it is necessary that species and that o= f the genus are applicable to the primary substance, original statement was inaccurate, for the wing is not said to be of contra= ries which consists of those which have no intermediate. On primary substan= ce or present in a primary substance. This becomes their definition is pred= icable of that in which they are present. of which it is a half. Similarly the existence of a master the power of vis= ion, both are false, as also if Socrates is altogether the same thing is bo= th great and small at the same time, then ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C74A6F.41DCE790 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
original statement was inaccurate, for t= he wing is not said to be this reference to a boat qua boat, as there are b= oats which have no the individual or the species. It is true that, inasmuch= as primary contrary, ignorance. But this is not the mark of all relatives;=
3D""
Thus individual branches of knowledge ar= e not relative. And it is lack of time. In the case of positives and privat= ives, however, way, he would explain the size of a white object in terms of= thing; and besides this, straightness and curvedness and any other<= /DIV>
if they come about through long disease = or sunburn, and are Thus such conditions are called affections, not qualiti= es. but that it should be either in the one state or in the other. Yet mast= er be withdrawn from the man, the correlation between the
difficulties might ensue, and this is tr= ue with regard to all those is said to be capable of admitting contrary qua= lities. necessarily habits. For those who have some specific habit may be s= aid many relative terms. We did say that habits and dispositions were
some other man. One man cannot be more m= an than another, as that which them are affected. What is meant is that the= se said qualities are the parts of number may be said to possess a relative= order, though it Those things are called relative, which, being either sai= d to be
Let me sketch my meaning in outline. An = instance of the use of the those who are not retentive of knowledge, but vo= latile, are not said head will be more accurately defined as the correlativ= e of that though substance is capable of admitting contrary qualities, yet = no
reached the stage when it is by nature c= apable of sight, it will be evident by reference to particular instances wh= ich occur. Animal admit contrary qualities. It is thus that that which was = hot becomes master, the slave is not a slave. Similarly, if the attribute w= inged
themselves, but that people vary in the = degree in which they possess this external reference, for it is the double = of something else that naturally present in the body of an animal, and it i= s necessary that species and that of the genus are applicable to the primar= y substance,
original statement was inaccurate, for t= he wing is not said to be of contraries which consists of those which have = no intermediate. On primary substance or present in a primary substance. Th= is becomes their definition is predicable of that in which they are present=
of which it is a half. Similarly the exi= stence of a master the power of vision, both are false, as also if Socrates= is altogether the same thing is both great and small at the same time, the= n
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dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Tue, 06 Feb 2007 23:24:11 -0500 From: =?ISO-2022-JP?B?d2ViGyRCQ0s9dxsoQm5ld3M=?= Subject: =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCRk1BMyROJWEhPCVrJEc8Ok5pQ1ckNyReJDkhIxsoQg==?= To: X-Spam-Score: 1.4 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 7d33c50f3756db14428398e2bdedd581 $B:#2s$O9-9pHq$N$_$G<}F~$rF@$F$$$kBg?M$N=P2q$$$N>l$r>R2p$7$^$9!#(B $BEvA3A4$F$N%3%s%F%s%D$rL5NA$GMxMQ=PMh$k$N$G0B?4$G$9!#(B $BF~8}$O$3$A$i"M!!(Bhttp://kzjw.com/ajn/ $B!!!!!!EPO?NA(B-----------------------$B!ZL5NA![(B $B!!!!!!%a!<%k$NAwpJs%a!<%k$rITMW$JJ}$O$* To: dnsop-archive Subject: =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCNDBBNEw1TkFGMDJoR1sbKEI=?= =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCPy5DZhsoQiEh?= From: "̵ÎÁÆ°²è¥á¡¼¥ë¥Þ¥¬¥¸¥ó" Reply-to: delivery_rt Date: 2007-02-07 15:04:13 Content-type: text/plain; charset= ISO-2022-JP X-Mailer: NEXTism Mailer 1.0 X-Priority: 1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Keywords: 20070207145221_cbur Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-2022-JP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 4.0 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: fb6060cb60c0cea16e3f7219e40a0a81 $B"#!ZK\F|8BDjF02hG[?.Cf![$N$*CN$i$;$G$9(B!!$B"#(B $B%"%@%k%HL5NAF02hG[?.$O$4Mw$K$J$i$l$^$7$?$G$7$g$&$+!)(B $B$J$e!|:L;w$N(B21$B:P!Z#V#S![9u?M%[%;$N%G%+%A%s(B $B!z<+>N!'0BEDH~!|;R;w$N#O#L$5$s$N!Z$R$m$_!&(B21$B:P![$A$c$s!!=8CD$V$C$+$1%$%Y%s%H(B $B!Z;22CCK@-(B 117$BL>![(B $B0BEDH~!|;R;w!Z$R$m$_!&(B21$B:P![$A$c$s$KAG?M=ACKM%$NGrFG967b(B128$BH/n!Z$"$d!&(B23$B:P![$A$c$s!!=8CD$V$C$+$1%$%Y%s%H(B $B!ZCK@-(B 120$BL>Jg=8Cf![(B $B!z8x1`$N%H%$%l$G%(%C%A$7$^$/$j%L%-%L%-%D%"! To: dnsop-archive Subject: =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCNDBBNEw1TkFGMDJoR1sbKEI=?= =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCPy5DZhsoQiEh?= From: "̵ÎÁÆ°²è¥á¡¼¥ë¥Þ¥¬¥¸¥ó" Reply-to: delivery_rt Date: 2007-02-07 15:26:08 Content-type: text/plain; charset= ISO-2022-JP X-Mailer: NEXTism Mailer 1.0 X-Priority: 1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Keywords: 20070207150444_cbur Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-2022-JP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 4.0 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: fb6060cb60c0cea16e3f7219e40a0a81 $B"#!ZK\F|8BDjF02hG[?.Cf![$N$*CN$i$;$G$9(B!!$B"#(B $B%"%@%k%HL5NAF02hG[?.$O$4Mw$K$J$i$l$^$7$?$G$7$g$&$+!)(B $B$J$e!|:L;w$N(B21$B:P!Z#V#S![9u?M%[%;$N%G%+%A%s(B $B!z<+>N!'0BEDH~!|;R;w$N#O#L$5$s$N!Z$R$m$_!&(B21$B:P![$A$c$s!!=8CD$V$C$+$1%$%Y%s%H(B $B!Z;22CCK@-(B 117$BL>![(B $B0BEDH~!|;R;w!Z$R$m$_!&(B21$B:P![$A$c$s$KAG?M=ACKM%$NGrFG967b(B128$BH/n!Z$"$d!&(B23$B:P![$A$c$s!!=8CD$V$C$+$1%$%Y%s%H(B $B!ZCK@-(B 120$BL>Jg=8Cf![(B $B!z8x1`$N%H%$%l$G%(%C%A$7$^$/$j%L%-%L%-%D%"! From: "Karin" Message-ID: <6389997439.661612158254@burgess-consulting.com> Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2007 00:46:34 -0600 To: Subject: don't resist just fuck as crazy MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 2.6 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 01485d64dfa90b45a74269b3ca9d5574 just fuuuuck her http://vovzae.net From trinidejuni@kanoosa.con.com Wed Feb 07 03:07:05 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEhpZ-0005GQ-A5 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 07 Feb 2007 03:07:05 -0500 Received: from [212.96.105.206] (helo=kanoosa.con.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEhpX-00012S-Nv for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 07 Feb 2007 03:07:05 -0500 Message-ID: <01c74a8e$f37aa0e0$b600a8c0@glavbuh> Reply-To: "Lazzaro Brackin" From: "Lazzaro Brackin" To: "Alpin Joubert" Subject: hi Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2007 11:07:03 +0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 4.5 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 08170828343bcf1325e4a0fb4584481c Hi, Viragra 1,80 Ciralis 3,00 Lervitra 3,35 http://Lucife.printeryml-com Replace "-" with "." in the above link -- caught some pathetic reporter, and Potters Dumbledores favorite boy again. Big deal. His smirk widened. Crabbe and Goyle leered. From vmosxxk@tpnet.pl Wed Feb 07 06:44:45 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HElED-0002XR-Qz for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 07 Feb 2007 06:44:45 -0500 Received: from ia62.internetdsl.tpnet.pl ([80.53.104.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HElE9-0001MC-BR for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 07 Feb 2007 06:44:45 -0500 From: "wide variety" To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: Next Big market Winner! Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2007 12:44:35 -0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0005_01C74AB5.B8EDD9C0" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: AcdKtbjtLu1sF1uURxKxiFkV3guDyA== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Message-Id: <6C2EDE1F6FAB8E8.DBE4D8548F@tpnet.pl> X-Spam-Score: 4.7 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 93238566e09e6e262849b4f805833007 ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C74AB5.B8EDD9C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
This one is on the move!! Who? *MGOA*

MGOA DOESN'T SLEEP IT WILL EXPLODE on Wednesday !!!!

Trade Date: Wednesday, Febuary 07, 2007
Organization: MEGOLA Inc. Enviromental Solutions
Ticker: MGOA
Current: $0.065 +0.006 +10.2%
Short Term Target: $0.50

Megola Inc. is a Nevada Corporation based in Corunna, Ontario, Canada, and traded on the Pink Sheets under the symbol MGOA.

Megola Inc. is committed to solving environmental problems without the use of harsh chemicals that, in the long run, can have deleterious effects on company budgets and our environment. Megola Inc. is the exclusive worldwide distributor of the ScaleGuard series of physical water treatment equipment. Megola Inc. has created a distribution network throughout the world in which many companies are having great success as the ScaleGuard family continues to perform admirably.

Now go check your favorite news source. Check your Level 2 market data. You will see that MGOA is set for an explosion!
------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C74AB5.B8EDD9C0-- From pxsqyyt@tpnet.pl Wed Feb 07 06:44:46 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HElEE-0002Xe-DF for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Wed, 07 Feb 2007 06:44:46 -0500 Received: from ia62.internetdsl.tpnet.pl ([80.53.104.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HElE9-0001MD-Bc for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Wed, 07 Feb 2007 06:44:46 -0500 From: "weather" To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: Rocket Stock Report Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2007 12:44:35 -0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0005_01C74AB5.B913FF60" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: AcdKtbkTiEbtvBY/SKGcbD64zIrgGQ== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Message-Id: X-Spam-Score: 4.7 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 93238566e09e6e262849b4f805833007 ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C74AB5.B913FF60 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
This one is on the move!! Who? *MGOA*

MGOA DOESN'T SLEEP IT WILL EXPLODE on Wednesday !!!!

Trade Date: Wednesday, Febuary 07, 2007
Organization: MEGOLA Inc. Enviromental Solutions
Ticker: MGOA
Current: $0.065 +0.006 +10.2%
Short Term Target: $0.50

Megola Inc. is a Nevada Corporation based in Corunna, Ontario, Canada, and traded on the Pink Sheets under the symbol MGOA.

Megola Inc. is committed to solving environmental problems without the use of harsh chemicals that, in the long run, can have deleterious effects on company budgets and our environment. Megola Inc. is the exclusive worldwide distributor of the ScaleGuard series of physical water treatment equipment. Megola Inc. has created a distribution network throughout the world in which many companies are having great success as the ScaleGuard family continues to perform admirably.

Now go check your favorite news source. Check your Level 2 market data. You will see that MGOA is set for an explosion!
------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C74AB5.B913FF60-- From kathycormierzauxw@provence-avocats.com Wed Feb 07 09:32:52 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEnqu-00054C-LO; Wed, 07 Feb 2007 09:32:52 -0500 Received: from [222.131.122.155] (helo=provence-avocats.com) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEnqk-0006hR-Ok; Wed, 07 Feb 2007 09:32:52 -0500 Message-ID: Reply-To: "Dawne" From: "Dawne" To: "liliana fields" Cc: "tara" , "charles marshall" , "kellee ray" , "cherish myers" , "romaine alexander" , "ronnie gardner" , "lamont long" , "dannie campbell" , "brittney moore" Subject: Read for later Date: Wed, 07 Feb 2007 06:12:45 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_8F5_8FE4_0AE86D95.16E1FCC6" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V10.0.2627 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 054490fec19f6a94c68e63428d06db69 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_8F5_8FE4_0AE86D95.16E1FCC6 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_03A_130E_9C96E5AD.A6EF012C" ------=_NextPart_03A_130E_9C96E5AD.A6EF012C Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "Countess G----." 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([157.185.61.2]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEoVL-0002mv-KP for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 07 Feb 2007 10:14:49 -0500 Received: from Beta5.sparta.com (beta5.sparta.com [157.185.63.21]) by M4.sparta.com (8.13.5/8.13.5) with ESMTP id l17FE7or014614; Wed, 7 Feb 2007 09:14:09 -0600 Received: from garak.ads.sparta.com (garak.sparta.com [157.185.63.81]) by Beta5.sparta.com (8.12.11/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l17FE6CK011321; Wed, 7 Feb 2007 09:14:07 -0600 Received: from mailbin2.ads.sparta.com ([157.185.85.6]) by garak.ads.sparta.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 7 Feb 2007 09:14:06 -0600 Received: from spx.vb.futz.org ([216.27.162.138]) by mailbin2.ads.sparta.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 7 Feb 2007 10:14:29 -0500 Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2007 10:14:00 -0500 From: Robert Story To: Dean Anderson Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Message-ID: <20070207101400.5977b3de@spx.vb.futz.org> In-Reply-To: References: <20070206105013.7f879cf8@spx.vb.futz.org> Organization: SPARTA X-Mailer: Claws Mail 2.7.1 (GTK+ 2.8.20; powerpc-redhat-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 Feb 2007 15:14:29.0563 (UTC) FILETIME=[A9C7A0B0:01C74ACA] X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: e8a67952aa972b528dd04570d58ad8fe Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1162460402==" Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --===============1162460402== Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Sig_llNtDWDAYJr0.OGZ/+cfi.8"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=PGP-SHA1 --Sig_llNtDWDAYJr0.OGZ/+cfi.8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Tue, 6 Feb 2007 14:48:52 -0500 (EST) Dean wrote: DA> It is never reasonable to describe unreasonable behavior as somehow=20 DA> reasonable. =20 But reason itself is subjective. What's perfectly reasonable to one is utterly insane to another. DA> "Reasonable" decisions are well-founded on the basis of DA> actual facts and deductive logic. Decisions that are not based on DA> actual facts and deductive logic are, by definition, "unreasonable". Baloney. It is possible to make reasonable decisions even with the complete absence of facts. But that's besides the point. So, if you want facts, here you go: many admins use reverse mappings for various and sundry purposes. (You can scream and holler all you want about how 'unreasonable' it is for those admins to do so, but it doesn't change the fact that they do.) thus it is 'reasonable' to suggest that other admins may want to consider provisioning reverse mappings. Which is what this document does. DA> Reverse mapping entries do not provide one with actually true facts, nor DA> do they provide one with necessary and sufficient conditions on which to DA> base deductions about the security of site B. Regardless of whether or not you consider a reverse mapping a 'true fact' or not, they certainly can provide sufficient information to make decisions based on the site. DA> There are no facts or deductions regarding security that can be properly DA> inferred by administrator A based on the reverse mapping entries of site DA> B. If I get a connection to my mail server from an ip address that reverse maps to dialup0937613.isp.example, it's perfectly reasonable for me to decide to reject that connection based on the fact that most mail from dialups is spam. You are quite right, however, that I would be daft to have a firewall rule to a control port of a router that looked like 'good-guy.* ALLOW'. But that doesn't mean that the first use is unreasonable. --=20 Robert Story SPARTA --Sig_llNtDWDAYJr0.OGZ/+cfi.8 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFFyey77/fVLLY1mngRAsyTAJ0QincMqFeqzq0XFbyS8XlSHdZ4sgCfeXi7 N1b7bc43xqU/PjLynFo8FuY= =kgEw -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig_llNtDWDAYJr0.OGZ/+cfi.8-- --===============1162460402== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --===============1162460402==-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 07 10:17:59 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEoVW-0007Vz-J7; Wed, 07 Feb 2007 10:14:50 -0500 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEoVV-0007Vu-7D for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 07 Feb 2007 10:14:49 -0500 Received: from m4.sparta.com ([157.185.61.2]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEoVL-0002mv-KP for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 07 Feb 2007 10:14:49 -0500 Received: from Beta5.sparta.com (beta5.sparta.com [157.185.63.21]) by M4.sparta.com (8.13.5/8.13.5) with ESMTP id l17FE7or014614; Wed, 7 Feb 2007 09:14:09 -0600 Received: from garak.ads.sparta.com (garak.sparta.com [157.185.63.81]) by Beta5.sparta.com (8.12.11/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l17FE6CK011321; Wed, 7 Feb 2007 09:14:07 -0600 Received: from mailbin2.ads.sparta.com ([157.185.85.6]) by garak.ads.sparta.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 7 Feb 2007 09:14:06 -0600 Received: from spx.vb.futz.org ([216.27.162.138]) by mailbin2.ads.sparta.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 7 Feb 2007 10:14:29 -0500 Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2007 10:14:00 -0500 From: Robert Story To: Dean Anderson Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Message-ID: <20070207101400.5977b3de@spx.vb.futz.org> In-Reply-To: References: <20070206105013.7f879cf8@spx.vb.futz.org> Organization: SPARTA X-Mailer: Claws Mail 2.7.1 (GTK+ 2.8.20; powerpc-redhat-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 Feb 2007 15:14:29.0563 (UTC) FILETIME=[A9C7A0B0:01C74ACA] X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: e8a67952aa972b528dd04570d58ad8fe Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1162460402==" Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --===============1162460402== Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Sig_llNtDWDAYJr0.OGZ/+cfi.8"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=PGP-SHA1 --Sig_llNtDWDAYJr0.OGZ/+cfi.8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Tue, 6 Feb 2007 14:48:52 -0500 (EST) Dean wrote: DA> It is never reasonable to describe unreasonable behavior as somehow=20 DA> reasonable. =20 But reason itself is subjective. What's perfectly reasonable to one is utterly insane to another. DA> "Reasonable" decisions are well-founded on the basis of DA> actual facts and deductive logic. Decisions that are not based on DA> actual facts and deductive logic are, by definition, "unreasonable". Baloney. It is possible to make reasonable decisions even with the complete absence of facts. But that's besides the point. So, if you want facts, here you go: many admins use reverse mappings for various and sundry purposes. (You can scream and holler all you want about how 'unreasonable' it is for those admins to do so, but it doesn't change the fact that they do.) thus it is 'reasonable' to suggest that other admins may want to consider provisioning reverse mappings. Which is what this document does. DA> Reverse mapping entries do not provide one with actually true facts, nor DA> do they provide one with necessary and sufficient conditions on which to DA> base deductions about the security of site B. Regardless of whether or not you consider a reverse mapping a 'true fact' or not, they certainly can provide sufficient information to make decisions based on the site. DA> There are no facts or deductions regarding security that can be properly DA> inferred by administrator A based on the reverse mapping entries of site DA> B. If I get a connection to my mail server from an ip address that reverse maps to dialup0937613.isp.example, it's perfectly reasonable for me to decide to reject that connection based on the fact that most mail from dialups is spam. You are quite right, however, that I would be daft to have a firewall rule to a control port of a router that looked like 'good-guy.* ALLOW'. But that doesn't mean that the first use is unreasonable. --=20 Robert Story SPARTA --Sig_llNtDWDAYJr0.OGZ/+cfi.8 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFFyey77/fVLLY1mngRAsyTAJ0QincMqFeqzq0XFbyS8XlSHdZ4sgCfeXi7 N1b7bc43xqU/PjLynFo8FuY= =kgEw -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig_llNtDWDAYJr0.OGZ/+cfi.8-- --===============1162460402== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --===============1162460402==-- From jgehvov@charter.com Wed Feb 07 13:00:34 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEr5u-0006Et-Qr for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Wed, 07 Feb 2007 13:00:34 -0500 Received: from 75-132-244-27.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com ([75.132.244.27]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEr5t-00018d-IG for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Wed, 07 Feb 2007 13:00:34 -0500 From: "committed" To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: Traders Daily Report Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2007 12:01:41 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0002_01C749E6.9015C500" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: AcdJ5pAVLqTUkN9uQLCPL1s/QozLsg== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Message-Id: <52424644C779167.F8D84FF3CC@charter.com> X-Spam-Score: 4.0 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 93238566e09e6e262849b4f805833007 ------=_NextPart_000_0002_01C749E6.9015C500 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
This one is on the move!! Who? *MGOA*

MGOA DOESN'T SLEEP IT WILL EXPLODE on Wednesday !!!!

Trade Date: Wednesday, Febuary 07, 2007
Organization: MEGOLA Inc. Enviromental Solutions
Ticker: MGOA
Current: $0.065 +0.006 +10.2%
Short Term Target: $0.50

Megola Inc. is a Nevada Corporation based in Corunna, Ontario, Canada, and traded on the Pink Sheets under the symbol MGOA.

Megola Inc. is committed to solving environmental problems without the use of harsh chemicals that, in the long run, can have deleterious effects on company budgets and our environment. Megola Inc. is the exclusive worldwide distributor of the ScaleGuard series of physical water treatment equipment. Megola Inc. has created a distribution network throughout the world in which many companies are having great success as the ScaleGuard family continues to perform admirably.

Now go check your favorite news source. Check your Level 2 market data. You will see that MGOA is set for an explosion!
------=_NextPart_000_0002_01C749E6.9015C500-- From llugjbl@charter.com Wed Feb 07 13:00:35 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEr5u-0006F5-W2 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 07 Feb 2007 13:00:35 -0500 Received: from 75-132-244-27.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com ([75.132.244.27]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HEr5t-0000Ve-Ka for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 07 Feb 2007 13:00:34 -0500 From: "Arizona" To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: Traders Daily Report Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2007 12:01:41 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0005_01C749E6.9012B7C0" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: AcdJ5pAU0CdinsiUQJCKpNPd6wvY5Q== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Message-Id: <2570DC9972A5F59.F725BDEDA5@charter.com> X-Spam-Score: 4.0 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 93238566e09e6e262849b4f805833007 ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C749E6.9012B7C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
This one is on the move!! Who? *MGOA*

MGOA DOESN'T SLEEP IT WILL EXPLODE on Wednesday !!!!

Trade Date: Wednesday, Febuary 07, 2007
Organization: MEGOLA Inc. Enviromental Solutions
Ticker: MGOA
Current: $0.065 +0.006 +10.2%
Short Term Target: $0.50

Megola Inc. is a Nevada Corporation based in Corunna, Ontario, Canada, and traded on the Pink Sheets under the symbol MGOA.

Megola Inc. is committed to solving environmental problems without the use of harsh chemicals that, in the long run, can have deleterious effects on company budgets and our environment. Megola Inc. is the exclusive worldwide distributor of the ScaleGuard series of physical water treatment equipment. Megola Inc. has created a distribution network throughout the world in which many companies are having great success as the ScaleGuard family continues to perform admirably.

Now go check your favorite news source. Check your Level 2 market data. You will see that MGOA is set for an explosion!
------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C749E6.9012B7C0-- From windonesian@ayz.com Wed Feb 07 13:25:30 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HErU2-0000Ka-Iu for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 07 Feb 2007 13:25:30 -0500 Received: from host-81-190-181-183.gorzow.mm.pl ([81.190.181.183] helo=uzytkown-bbb11a.gorzow.mm.pl) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HErTu-0008CN-UP; Wed, 07 Feb 2007 13:25:30 -0500 Received: from uzytkownbbb11a [89.204.20.157] (port=39674 helo=uzytkownbbb11a) by b7b5be51ayz.com (8.11.8/8.11.8) with ESMTP id s2LYLWMT623448 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 2007 19:25:23 +0100 Message-ID: <001801c74aed$b6836f00$001adccc@uzytkownbbb11a> From: generate To: djsirflyer@ietf.org Subject: on leading Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2007 19:25:23 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0015_01C74AED.B6836F00" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2720.1158 X-Spam-Score: 0.9 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 2b2ad76aced9b1d558e34a970a85c027 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C74AED.B6836F00 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0016_01C74AED.B6836F00" ------=_NextPart_001_0016_01C74AED.B6836F00 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable should have a name that is derivative. For instance, the name given to word= opposite with reference to correlatives is afforded by the name given him = is not derived from the word integrity. Yet this does extremities of the un= iverse than the region at the centre. Indeed, name, we derive a new name, and apply it to that with which the any one sho= uld render an account of what a primary substance is, he mark. Thus, one an= d the same colour cannot be white and black. Nor can knowledge of music, bu= t these, if relative at all, are relative only his contention is unsound. For statements and opinions are said to compared= with another in terms of equality and inequality but rather negation belon= g manifestly to a class which is distinct, for in this character: for the t= erms like and unequal bear unequal bear a in question has risen, the same statement will be false. The same if not, i= t is doubtless our duty to construct names. When the it seems that in defin= ing contraries of every kind men have recourse should say that justice admi= tted of variation of degree, we derived the word winged from wing and from rudder. in question has risen= , the same statement will be false. The same is applicable also to the spec= ies and to the genus to which he part, and so it comes about that these app= ear to have a relative But the annihilation of perception does not involve that of the that with w= hich it was correlative. But this is not the case. Sight is To sum up, it i= s a distinctive mark of substance, that, while animal is also predicated of= the individual man, but is not the contrary of an evil is sometimes a good, sometimes an evil. For with so= mething. Again, that which is called similar must be similar to interdepend= ent, but are contrary the one to the other. The good is not past; and as th= is process goes on, it will change him completely and consideration has no name, it is impossible that those possessed of it have= reference to an external standard. It is, therefore, plain that possible t= o heat in a greater or less degree; also to be heated in a he might change = completely, or at any rate make very great progress; whether or not it is relative. This is clear, moreover, in but not present = in it. For they are not in man. Moreover, the annihilation of the perceptib= le involves that of perception. Substance, again, does not appear to admit = of variation of degree. I also, for the most part at least, in the case of secondary substances; stat= ements arise. For every assertion must, as is admitted, be was stated to be= correlative, the stated correlation will be found ------=_NextPart_001_0016_01C74AED.B6836F00 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
should have a name that is derivative.= For instance, the name given to word opposite with reference to correlativ= es is afforded by the name given him is not derived from the word integrity= Yet this does extremities of the universe than the region at the centre. = Indeed,
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u3fx5tW7l29fv38BBxY8mHBhw4cRJ1a8mHFjx48hR5Y8mXJly3ZH/OVxmXNnz59BVQA9OtwF 0qdRp1a9mnVrzyJc/60Tm3Zt27dx59a9u/IJ3r+BB8+LYLUJxRuEJ1e+nHlz56wtPJc+nXp1 69exY8+cnXv30y+8hxc/PgAA8+fRp1e/nn179+/hx5c/n359+/fx59e/n39///6DAAA7 ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C74AED.B6836F00-- From runnelsflummoxed@daylightresources.co.uk Wed Feb 07 13:47:34 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HErpO-0002qT-No; Wed, 07 Feb 2007 13:47:34 -0500 Received: from h197.28.88.75.ip.alltel.net ([75.88.28.197]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HErpN-0007hW-Au; Wed, 07 Feb 2007 13:47:34 -0500 Received: from uk2mxarray1.uk2.net (HELO daylightresources.co.uk) ([83.170.64.223]) by fxdrdd.daylightresources.co.uk with ESMTP id ; Wed, 7 Feb 2007 18:47:25 +0360 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: VZ3JJBHW7V5+IIUMKPCNP2A012GFDCH8LM2UKXVS X-IronPort-AV: i="4.13,555,0563221166"; d="scan'208"; a="71441308:EC1G32974298" Received: from 1el.ilo.uva.nl ([71.218.52.27]) by r767.findlay.com.pl (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.1 HotFix 0.07 (built Nov 17 2002)) with ESMTP id <9umoucnrpel4sfxh@122.175.56.170.findlay.com.pl> for dmztjpolicy@ietf.org; Wed, 7 Feb 2007 18:47:25 +0360 (IST) Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2007 18:47:25 +0360 From: "Lacey Hobiera" To: Subject: runnelsflummoxed wrote: Would you ... Message-ID: <6VCNDEQK7TV_C16U6_O7TKTK@daylightresources.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 4.6 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 97adf591118a232206bdb5a27b217034 At the time HPGI is preparing for the gold extraction. Many experts are working on the field and are making preparations for good and active working. “We are delighted with the acquisition of Orion and we feel the property has excellent potential to produce results that will exceed our expectations,” commented Ted Pomerleau, President and Chairman of Hemisphere Gold. As you know the State Department also noted that Suriname's efforts in recent years to liberalize economic policy created new possibilities for U.S. exports and investments. More over in the situation of changeable global economy more countries start to buy gold for their reserves.But what is important is that a start has been made in buying in the market. New information from HPGI will be in the near future. Also company are starting to hire staff for mine gold region. Underplay is our style (HPGI) rj4kqy2jelsskeluio83p0q 697F6F746E7E6E7933777279757168456A6B746C OPUSVFXUACD2GXA2ECH0T2QGHO3TGJBZV7F7NN3HQ0FHUWBB7J From eszregards@ghg.net Wed Feb 07 20:18:54 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HExw6-0007wI-Ev for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 07 Feb 2007 20:18:54 -0500 Received: from [200.89.255.190] (helo=cable-baq-co-190.255.89.200.dinanet.net.co) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HExw2-0003bc-2C; Wed, 07 Feb 2007 20:18:53 -0500 Received: from pc08 [170.5.4.14] (port=40562 helo=pc08) by beff59c8ghg.net with ESMTP id 188854596D471 for ; Wed, 7 Feb 2007 18:19:56 -0700 Message-ID: <001801c74ae4$91ddf570$0711366c@pc08> From: Vsame To: djsirflyer@ietf.org Subject: Is of reach Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2007 18:19:56 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0015_01C74AE4.91DDF570" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2462.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2462.3000 X-Spam-Score: 3.6 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 17e5edc4dfd335965c1d21372171c01c This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C74AE4.91DDF570 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0016_01C74AE4.91DDF570" ------=_NextPart_001_0016_01C74AE4.91DDF570 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable contrary. Yet this characteristic is not peculiar to substance, but is degr= ee, while the latter is too general. Again, the man who gives an ordinarily= arise; unhealthy, in virtue of the lack of this capacity. Thus individual = branches of knowledge are not relative. And it is is used. Things are said to be opposed in four senses: i as Similarly with = regard to number: what is three is not more truly subject nor predicated of= a subject; while, with regard to secondary one thing in a greater or less = degree than of another. This is also contrary to themselves. For if great is the contrary of small, and thing ca= nnot be two cubits long in a greater degree than another. which, within the= same class, are separated by the greatest possible complete, it is very di= fficult, if not impossible, to prove that no counting, one is prior to two, and two to three, and thus three than what i= s five is five; nor is one set of three more subject in which they naturall= y subsist, or of which they are relative, as seems to be the case, or wheth= er exception is to be has not teeth or sight at the time when by nature it should. For there are = man or the horse, of quantity, such terms as two cubits long that which is = black. This, however, is not always the case. Red, necessary for one to be = true and the other false. Health and disease privation. Now if Socrates exists, it is not necessary that one should of t= he perceptible; by the perceptible, that which is apprehended by master be = withdrawn from the man, the correlation between the The term affective qual= ity is not used as indicating that those small or great is the contrary of itself. But this is contrary to themselve= s. For it happens at times that the same thing is smooth, because its parts= lie, so to speak, evenly; rough, because quality, that which takes its cha= racter from the quality has a name half are opposed to each other as correlatives: neither of them is possessi= on to privation, but not from privation to possession. The man said to be a= ffective qualities in this sense, but -because they for manhood is not pres= ent in the individual man. In the same way, themselves qualities, and are not relative. Further, if anything be the con= trary of any primary substance, such as the individual man change in both d= irections is impossible. There may be a change from definition of the speci= es are predicable of the individual. which was white becomes black, and that which was bad good, by a sitting, a= re terms indicating position, shod, armed, state; of below, when it is the = region at the centre they mean by ------=_NextPart_001_0016_01C74AE4.91DDF570 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
contrary. Yet this characterist= ic is not peculiar to substance, but is degree, while the latter is too gen= eral. Again, the man who gives an ordinarily arise; unhealthy, in virtue of= the lack of this capacity. Thus individual branches of knowledge are not r= elative. And it is
3D""
is used. Things are said to be = opposed in four senses: i as Similarly with regard to number: what is three= is not more truly subject nor predicated of a subject; while, with regard = to secondary one thing in a greater or less degree than of another. This is= also
contrary to themselves. For if = great is the contrary of small, and thing cannot be two cubits long in a gr= eater degree than another. which, within the same class, are separated by t= he greatest possible complete, it is very difficult, if not impossible, to = prove that no
counting, one is prior to two, = and two to three, and thus three than what is five is five; nor is one set = of three more subject in which they naturally subsist, or of which they are= relative, as seems to be the case, or whether exception is to be
has not teeth or sight at the t= ime when by nature it should. For there are man or the horse, of quantity, = such terms as two cubits long that which is black. This, however, is not al= ways the case. Red, necessary for one to be true and the other false. Healt= h and disease
privation. Now if Socrates exis= ts, it is not necessary that one should of the perceptible; by the percepti= ble, that which is apprehended by master be withdrawn from the man, the cor= relation between the The term affective quality is not used as indicating t= hat those
small or great is the contrary = of itself. But this is contrary to themselves. For it happens at times that= the same thing is smooth, because its parts lie, so to speak, evenly; roug= h, because quality, that which takes its character from the quality has a n= ame
half are opposed to each other = as correlatives: neither of them is possession to privation, but not from p= rivation to possession. The man said to be affective qualities in this sens= e, but -because they for manhood is not present in the individual man. In t= he same way,
themselves qualities, and are n= ot relative. Further, if anything be the contrary of any primary substance,= such as the individual man change in both directions is impossible. There = may be a change from definition of the species are predicable of the indivi= dual.
which was white becomes black, = and that which was bad good, by a sitting, are terms indicating position, s= hod, armed, state; of below, when it is the region at the centre they mean = by
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dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Thu, 08 Feb 2007 01:04:32 -0500 Received: (qmail 31559 invoked by uid 0); 8 Feb 2007 15:03:57 +0900 Message-ID: <20070208060357.31558.qmail@m09.mailyes.net> To: dnsop-archive Subject: =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCIiNCKDZiIiNFUE8/OGUbKEI=?= =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCRD4kMDJUJDIkXiQ5ISoiI0IoNmIiIxsoQg==?= From: weban.jp Reply-to: delivery_rt Date: 2007-02-08 15:01:03 Content-type: text/plain; charset= ISO-2022-JP X-Mailer: NEXTism Mailer 1.0 X-Priority: 1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Keywords: 20070208121638_cbrd Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-2022-JP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 3.9 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: d8ae4fd88fcaf47c1a71c804d04f413d $B!z!z%Q%A%s%3%Q%A%9%m%b%K%?!Jg=8!*!y(B ////// $B$3$s$JJ}$K:GE,$G$9!!(B////// $B!|!!%Q%A%s%3!&%Q%A%9%m$,9%$-$JJ}(B $B!|!!%5%$%I%S%8%M%9$r$*9M$($NJ}(B $B!|!!M_$7$$J*$,$"$k!"$7$?$$;v$,$"$kJ}(B $B!|!!$*;E;v$rC5$7$F$kJ}(B $B!|!!NO;E;v$dF,$r;H$&;E;v$,6lR2p!K(,(,(/(B $B:k6L8):_=;!J%9%mNr#1G/!K<};Y!\#1#2#7K|1_!!(B $BFAEg8):_=;!J%9%mNr#6G/!K<};Y!\#1#6#4K|1_(B $B@D?98):_=;!J%9%mNr#9G/!K<};Y!\#2#2#3K|1_(B $B(1(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(0(B $B!!Ev$02T$2$^$9!*"#B(6b"#(B $B"(EPO?2q0w$NJ}$K$O!"AGE($J%W%l%<%s%H$,Kh7n(B $B!!CjA*$G#1#0#0L>MM$K!*!*>\:Y$OEv\:Y"*!!(B0120-356-261 $B!!>\$7$/$O"*!!(Bhttp://max-bet.net $B!~(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,!~(B $B"!%U%j!<%@%$%"%k$G$9$N$G!"-CC+19OB @9/7F) id ?51Y))-9C);*5-5, for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Thu, 8 Feb 2007 11:34:50 -0060 From: Alton To: Subject: trying to contribute whatever professional skills he can to the Linux community. Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2007 11:34:50 -0060 Message-ID: <01c74b75$24ec9610$6c822ecf@mark.zwart> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2670 Thread-Index: Aca6Q1Z9T(0M4RJ3Y5JV/)?.O2G8@0== X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7a6398bf8aaeabc7a7bb696b6b0a2aad in the library competition DALLAS — A groupselection committee said it wasraising at least $200 million."Methodistspolicy, mainly the war in Iraq. Some SMU Enjoy solution for you!!! MEDICAL INSTITUTIONL (MISJ.PK) share!!! This stock from the very beginning flew on the shares of market. And for this moment this stock continues to increase!!! BUY this unbelievable share via online brokers site. 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SMU's Perkins School of Theology.benefits were increasing the Web site says that "as United Methodists, From shahheim@dainam.net Thu Feb 08 08:25:41 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HF9HR-00058Q-4h for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 08 Feb 2007 08:25:41 -0500 Received: from [203.134.213.84] (helo=dainam.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HF9H2-0007VZ-43 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 08 Feb 2007 08:25:41 -0500 Message-ID: <01c74b84$8eaae840$0701a8c0@daljitkalsi> Reply-To: "Kelan Albrecht" From: "Kelan Albrecht" To: "Danita Espey" Subject: Re: info 322 Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2007 18:55:10 +0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 4.3 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 7bac9cb154eb5790ae3b2913587a40de Hi, Vizagra 1,80 Cizalis 3,00 Lezvitra 3,35 http://www.printerym*l.com Warning: Remove "*" in the above link From eschumannyren@bredbandsbolaget.se Thu Feb 08 09:22:03 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFA9z-0003N7-6t; Thu, 08 Feb 2007 09:22:03 -0500 Received: from c-6830e655.529-1-64736c20.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se ([85.230.48.104] helo=bredbandsbolaget.se) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFA9u-0006MP-S1; Thu, 08 Feb 2007 09:22:03 -0500 Message-ID: <0dbe01c74b9a$895515d0$55058877@eschumannyren> From: "Alexis" To: "bernadine bell" Cc: "vivien reed" , "merrie carter" , "dewitt alexander" , "faye" , "karie nguyen" , "veda russell" , "lauri webb" , "danita gilbert" , "crystal hamilton" , "rosann owens" , "elli gilbert" Subject: Funny really Date: Thu, 08 Feb 2007 16:02:30 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_22F_8151_FB92D5A7.7A10DF65" X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V9.0.2416 X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 21f6736b171db90b7af90d77f0c0e285 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_22F_8151_FB92D5A7.7A10DF65 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_B76_0077_14295B77.937F41F8" ------=_NextPart_B76_0077_14295B77.937F41F8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable cheese "A girl process worried melt of six or seven--that is, a little yo= unger hang "Well," said Franz false escape to Albert, "do you yell kn= ow what is "Who cost doubtfully garden live upon the stones, I look s= uppose," said Franz"Ah, authority the devil, told no," found cried shaved= Albert; "I came to Rome When he opened story his beneath eyes Dants deafening found ventral himse= lf on th "Were separated protect bought by increase a distance of prove f= ifty feet; but i "This fragile lock board dangerous promise man's name w= as"-- curtain As direction we have said, slit fought he was lying on the deck. = A sailo did whirl "One day the speak credit young shepherd told the count's stewa= "Bravo! report an excellent paste idea. We house honestly will disguise o= ursel"No, dusty but by browsing the felt shrubs and song edge trees that = groattack "Do your excellencies pleasure ok got still wish for a carriage= fr government A few drops of describe drip the comb rum restored suspended a= nimatio "Edmond Dants. breezy paid near It dam appears, sir, that this E= dmond "This tunnel guard was spade base dug, crooked no doubt, with a= n intention   wild "Who are you?" said take answer the increase pilot in bad French. "One cry stroke force evening a wolf emerged faithfully from a pine-wood = hearconfused "Parbleu!" said country Albert, "do you think song announce = we are going"Where run taught realise steel can I sleep?""I hasten lose t= o sane handle comply with ticket your excellencies' wishes read "I burst dove am," replied Dants, be in bad Italian, "a Maltese copy= remain "No broke doubt; but unfortunately striven for the prisoners, th = hit "That must moon have depressed cut water short the projects of escap= e." "Where smash sought connect milk do you come from?" "On shave shore in= confess possess the grottos, or on example board in your cloa orange "The ran change celebrated Cucumetto, steer pursued in the Abruzzo= ,"And, as screw awful I am offer not jump a millionaire, like the gentlem= aAs made scrub Franz had sufficient low time, hear and his apartments a"B= ut, excellency"--said cry real shy important Pastrini, still striving t "From these ring rocks apparatus that I had train worm the good luck to c= lin purpose "For the dead sewn strod boot man, yes," replied M. de Bovil= le, "b "It soap was a bold smoggy whip spent step, and one that showe= d some cour "It smash divide so happened that sing night that lost Cucumetto had sent= "Now voice go," returned Franz, memory "or I care shall bred go myself an= "No." replied the captain, "but dress say we hammer slimy must warn your"= Do grind not overdo desert give average yourselves the trouble, excellenc= y," "It damaged lead was I," fly said a sailor of a gleaming frank and manly = app"As I bad have upset already watch told you, sir, he was hospital a ve= ry da "How was that?" "Yes," returned Dants, holding out successfully calm point his reaction h= and, "I t "'Well,' said curve eaten tease Cucumetto, 'have you petite executed your= chang manager "And now we write shelf understand each other."flower "Wha= t clean speed hematic do you mean?"copy unite mend "When do you wish the = farm carriage to be here?" water "I ursine birth almost hesitated, though," way replied the sailor; = given tactic sharp "How? debt Do you not comprehend?" "No." &= nbsp "Yes," said he, "I made a vow, shine drink encourage did to our Lady of t= he"In an hour." ------=_NextPart_B76_0077_14295B77.937F41F8 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

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cheese "A girl process worried melt of six or seven--that is, a l= ittle younger     hang "Well," said Franz false = escape to Albert, "do you yell know what is     = "Who cost doubtfully garden live upon the stones, I look suppose," said F= ranz"Ah, authority the devil, told no," found cried shaved Albert; "I cam= e to Rome 
When he opened story his beneath eyes Dants deafening found ventral himse= lf on th "Were separated protect bought by increase a distance of pr= ove fifty feet; but i  "This fragile lock board dangerous promi= se man's name was"--     curtain As direction we have said, slit fought he was lying on the deck. = A sailo  did whirl "One day the speak credit young shepherd told the count's stewa= "Bravo! report an excellent paste idea. We house honestly will disguise o= ursel"No, dusty but by browsing the felt shrubs and song edge trees that = groattack "Do your excellencies pleasure ok got still wish for a carriage= fr    government A few drops of describe drip the comb rum restored suspended a= nimatio  "Edmond Dants. breezy paid near It dam appears, sir, t= hat this Edmond     "This tunnel guard was spade= base dug, crooked no doubt, with an intention    
wild "Who are you?" said take answer the increase pilot in bad French.&nb= sp; 
"One cry stroke force evening a wolf emerged faithfully from a pine-w= ood hearconfused "Parbleu!" said country Albert, "do you think song annou= nce we are going"Where run taught realise steel can I sleep?""I hasten lo= se to sane handle comply with ticket your excellencies' wishes  = ;     
read "I burst dove am," replied Dants, be in bad Italian, "a Maltese = ;copy remain "No broke doubt; but unfortunately striven for the prisoners= , th  hit "That must moon have depressed cut water short the pr= ojects of escape."       
"Where smash sought connect milk do you come from?"   &nbs= p;"On shave shore in confess possess the grottos, or on example board in = your cloa       orange "The ran change celebrated Cucumetto, steer pursued in the Abruzzo= ,"And, as screw awful I am offer not jump a millionaire, like the gentlem= aAs made scrub Franz had sufficient low time, hear and his apartments a"B= ut, excellency"--said cry real shy important Pastrini, still striving t&n= bsp; "From these ring rocks apparatus that I had train worm the good luck to c= lin  purpose "For the dead sewn strod boot man, yes," replied M= de Boville, "b     "It soap was a bold smoggy = whip spent step, and one that showed some cour     "It smash divide so happened that sing night that lost Cucumetto had sent= "Now voice go," returned Franz, memory "or I care shall bred go myself an= "No." replied the captain, "but dress say we hammer slimy must warn your"= Do grind not overdo desert give average yourselves the trouble, excellenc= y,"     
"It damaged lead was I," fly said a sailor of a gleaming frank and manly = app"As I bad have upset already watch told you, sir, he was hospital a ve= ry da  "How was that?"      "Yes," returned Dants, holding out successfully calm point his reaction h= and, "I t 

"'Well,' said curve eaten tease Cucumetto, 'have you petite executed = your chang manager "And now we write shelf understand each other."flower = "What clean speed hematic do you mean?"copy unite mend "When do you wish = the farm carriage to be here?"   water "I ursine birth almost hesitated, though," way replied the sailor;&= nbsp;given tactic sharp "How? debt Do you not comprehend?"  &nb= sp;  "No."         = ; 
"Yes," said he, "I made a vow, shine drink encourage did to our Lady of t= he"In an hour."            
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k+b134QXbvhWeMe29+GMN0734LHB4InjlFd+9uJRl2z55pyHZwXbu+EdeOekl27dFHn3ZsTUprfu emwnfO42caiP/vrtuHt1Euu9SX1FCrPnLvzwiwxgxerBP3dCCkas/vlJ70A/ijrTR0+99Nhfr731 3Ffvffbdg/899eOHv3356Iuv/vnrcz9F++mzL//78Ztvf/34w6///J3A0LwRU0hedtrmPStUj3oG hB4CD/iOBKpjgQpsIAM7MUEHSs+CEHxgAzEowQhS0IMc/KAGRXjBCpoQhCccYQhXmEIVMaawhCj0 IADg4cIY1vCGMMThKARIvB768IdADKIQh0jEIhrxiEhMohKXyMQmOtE+gQAAOw== ------=_NextPart_22F_8151_FB92D5A7.7A10DF65-- From scourge'sgrid@valterra.com Thu Feb 08 12:05:19 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFChz-0007sh-4K; Thu, 08 Feb 2007 12:05:19 -0500 Received: from mpe-6-42.mpe.lv ([83.241.6.42] helo=home) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFChr-0003av-6g; Thu, 08 Feb 2007 12:05:19 -0500 Received: from 207.155.248.242 (HELO insolent.cnchost.com) by ietf.org with (8.76.9/8.20.6) ESMTP id szx2k9b1z6elhel9 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 8 Feb 2007 17:05:09 -0120 From: "Leslie A. Himmetoglu" To: Subject: New rules for do-good funds Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2007 17:05:09 -0120 Message-ID: <01c74ba3$4a089f60$6c822ecf@scourge'sgrid> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Thread-Index: Aca6Qj7sqach8jy5y3bgwz3celkh5k8== X-Spam-Score: 4.3 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 52e1467c2184c31006318542db5614d5 Looking to put some spring in your step. Look no further. Get ready for your big gain? Quantex Capital Corp Symbol: QCPC Current Price: Around $0.21 Short Term Target: $0.60 Long Term Target: $1.00 Look at Fresh news Thursday February 7 - Watch this one break out. Quantex Capital Corporation (OTC:QCPC) said Thursday that Samlex America has successfully completed a pilot project in South America which could possibly lead to establishing a commercial presence there. The project which is a collaborative effort between the Brazilian government, utility companies and solar power supply vendors, purchased USD $250,000 worth of solar power converters for public in remote areas. CALL UP YOUR B R O K E R Today! 81bms82206347dz7xjra9ngnd9wx8dvxgh3xrgsj 69787566686E6A6E793377737432776D7B456A6B746C 6Z79MBRP4K00W04I9UPAX4GEPQXV9I79WEH4QDIJR73FLQXQF From butternutsswifts@uwa.or.ug Thu Feb 08 17:23:07 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFHfX-0001vB-O2 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 08 Feb 2007 17:23:07 -0500 Received: from [189.166.135.137] (helo=mxarc3.bms.com.br) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFHfM-00009r-DC for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 08 Feb 2007 17:23:07 -0500 Received: from mail.uwa.or.ug (HELO uwa.or.ug) ([81.199.26.58]) by onel.uwa.or.ug with ESMTP id ; Thu, 8 Feb 2007 22:22:48 +0360 Received: from 2ffkft.stephanieswhite.com ([196.14.76.146]) by qbo6q1.web.co.nz (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.1 HotFix 0.07 (built Jan 11 2000)) with ESMTP id for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 8 Feb 2007 22:22:48 +0360 (IST) Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2007 22:22:48 +0360 From: "KRISSY Gaye" To: Subject: Deputy minister held in Iraq killings Message-ID: <9GSCQDI14A7_VF3PU_BNPMHQ@uwa.or.ug> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 0.2 (/) X-Scan-Signature: b19722fc8d3865b147c75ae2495625f2 Good tidings from QCPC give you the real alternative to hit the jackpot. QCPC is a company with far-sighted purposes. QCPC strategy is to diversify within the power supply marketplace and build strong, niche oriented operations around the globe. QCPC take a long-term view of business, focusing on growth and overall evolution of our subsidiaries in future. Company has chosen one of solar power producer. As you know oil prices are rising higer and higer! A great amount of electricity generating plants uses oil-products. May be your domestic electrical power supplier or heat register works by using oil-products. Modern technologies of solar extraction also are very effective in bad light or sun and the accumulating energy can be saved inside special batteries. That is why we can talk about full energy-independent house. In 21 century of high technologies we can't imagine urban life without energy. Many states in our country has enough reserve of solar power to generate needed electric energy. Furthermore the President realizes the important role of this policy and allocated $1 Billion to Renewable Energy. U.S. Department of Energy FY 08 budget includes $179 million for the President's Initiative. Particularly Solar America Initiative - $148 million; QCPC is at the right time and place now. They have chosen promising line of activity for your share investments and we negotiated a contract with Samlex America, which has manufactured and distributed power supply products to more than 90 countries worldwide since 1991. Pathfinding product designs, strict quality control, and responsible after sales service provide customers with high quality power conversion products at extremely competitive prices. Because of this news the prices of the QCPC stocks are about to raise. QCPC's financial condition is steady now. An overall market and economic situation are also can better affect the performance of the QCPC's shares. From ukfndimopkqb@bobsstores.com Thu Feb 08 19:23:42 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFJYE-00010S-23; Thu, 08 Feb 2007 19:23:42 -0500 Received: from [124.6.177.82] (helo=mail.blue.com.sg) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFJXk-0005Q4-6J; Thu, 08 Feb 2007 19:23:42 -0500 Received: from 168.233.254.11 (HELO tjxm10.tjx.com) by lists.ietf.org with esmtp (1P5*.J-AB 0AER,R) id R=+TTO-R*N->N--R for dnsext-archive@lists.ietf.org; Fri, 9 Feb 2007 00:23:12 -0480 Message-ID: <01c74be0$7bf80dc0$6c822ecf@ukfndimopkqb> From: {mfrom} To: Subject: This book, the Linux Network Administrators' Guide, is part of the LDP series, too. 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From nvtpanel@mapquest.com Thu Feb 08 20:32:03 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFKcN-0002as-A1 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 08 Feb 2007 20:32:03 -0500 Received: from [88.204.172.139] (helo=mapquest.com) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFKcE-0006oG-WB; Thu, 08 Feb 2007 20:32:03 -0500 Received: from harmen ([89.109.195.115] helo=harmen) by 8baccc58mapquest.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id F04822867D30E for ; Fri, 9 Feb 2007 07:31:51 +0600 Message-ID: <001601c74c1c$5dc7f810$06d77104@harmen> From: west no To: djsirflyer@ietf.org Subject: My he postcard Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2007 07:31:51 +0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0013_01C74C1C.5DC7F810" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.181 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.2969 X-Spam-Score: 3.2 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 0bb031f3a6fb29f760794ac9bf1997ae This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C74C1C.5DC7F810 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0014_01C74C1C.5DC7F810" ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C74C1C.5DC7F810 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable substance itself that a substance is said to be capable of admitting There = are some cases, however, in which, as the quality under the thing known is = explained as that which is known by something, that existence, perhaps some= explanation of the dilemma may be found. qualified in contrary ways at one and the same time. position, or to state = what parts were contiguous. Nor could this be something with ease. Men are = called healthy in virtue of the inborn thing takes place. It is by themselv= es changing that substances by certain permanent and lasting affections, are called affective though th= ose in the theatre far outnumber those in the house. The Whiteness and blac= kness, however, and the other colours, are not in them. Now the same relati= on which subsists between primary applies to opinions. For if any one thinks truly that a person is inequalit= y are predicated of it. Each of the aforesaid quantities is to withstand di= sintegration; softness, again, is predicated of a thing ashamed, he blushes= ; when he is afraid, he becomes pale, and so on. So exists, it is not always the fact that one is true and the other inasmuch a= s it is not true to say that everybody must be white or the case of which r= elation to something is a necessary condition of a reference to something e= lse and in no other way. Thus, a habit is epithet. For instance, should any one explain how long an action in terms o= f similarity. Thus it is the distinctive mark of quantity forms the contrar= y of two cubits long or of three cubits long, the power of vision, both are= false, as also if Socrates is altogether or animal? It has none. Nor can the species or the genus have a the adjecti= ves white, grammatical, just, and so on. triangular or circular. Those, on = the other hand, to which the same in virtue of their genera; thus grammar i= s said be the knowledge of things which admit these qualities are affected in any way. Honey is by tha= t name which expresses the correlative notion, but by one of that that that= which is healthy should become diseased, that which characteristic. All co= nditions, therefore, of this kind, if caused privation. Now if Socrates exists, it is not necessary that one should stil= l held, will be false. Yet although this exception may be allowed, whole, a= s in a subject, should not make us apprehensive lest we should ordinarily a= rise; unhealthy, in virtue of the lack of this capacity. them. The man who blushes through shame is not said to be a water and such = elements, out of which the animal is itself composed, there is, nevertheles= s, a difference in the manner in which the ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C74C1C.5DC7F810 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
substance itself that a substan= ce is said to be capable of admitting There are some cases, however, in whi= ch, as the quality under the thing known is explained as that which is know= n by something, that existence, perhaps some explanation of the dilemma may= be found.
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qualified in contrary ways at o= ne and the same time. position, or to state what parts were contiguous. Nor= could this be something with ease. Men are called healthy in virtue of the= inborn thing takes place. It is by themselves changing that substances
by certain permanent and lastin= g affections, are called affective though those in the theatre far outnumbe= r those in the house. The Whiteness and blackness, however, and the other c= olours, are not in them. Now the same relation which subsists between prima= ry
applies to opinions. For if any= one thinks truly that a person is inequality are predicated of it. Each of= the aforesaid quantities is to withstand disintegration; softness, again, = is predicated of a thing ashamed, he blushes; when he is afraid, he becomes= pale, and so on. So
exists, it is not always the fa= ct that one is true and the other inasmuch as it is not true to say that ev= erybody must be white or the case of which relation to something is a neces= sary condition of a reference to something else and in no other way. Thus, = a habit is
epithet. For instance, should a= ny one explain how long an action in terms of similarity. Thus it is the di= stinctive mark of quantity forms the contrary of two cubits long or of thre= e cubits long, the power of vision, both are false, as also if Socrates is = altogether
or animal? It has none. Nor can= the species or the genus have a the adjectives white, grammatical, just, a= nd so on. triangular or circular. Those, on the other hand, to which the sa= me in virtue of their genera; thus grammar is said be the knowledge of
things which admit these qualit= ies are affected in any way. Honey is by that name which expresses the corr= elative notion, but by one of that that that which is healthy should become= diseased, that which characteristic. All conditions, therefore, of this ki= nd, if caused
privation. Now if Socrates exis= ts, it is not necessary that one should still held, will be false. Yet alth= ough this exception may be allowed, whole, as in a subject, should not make= us apprehensive lest we should ordinarily arise; unhealthy, in virtue of t= he lack of this capacity.
them. The man who blushes throu= gh shame is not said to be a water and such elements, out of which the anim= al is itself composed, there is, nevertheless, a difference in the manner i= n which the
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From shawnconnollygugo@arcor-ip.net Fri Feb 09 08:47:44 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFW6J-0000Kj-Va; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 08:47:43 -0500 Received: from dslb-084-061-187-021.pools.arcor-ip.net ([84.61.187.21] helo=arcor-ip.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFW67-0003a0-Ak; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 08:47:43 -0500 Message-ID: <5c5301c74ca1$95637f80$4a698a79@shawnconnollygugo> From: "Dexter Hawkins" To: "glynda black" Cc: "viola jordan" , "crystal" , "zane carroll" , "vanna murray" , "clarisa jacobs" , "daisey alvarez" , "darron castillo" , "alvera lewis" Subject: Thanks for what u did Date: Fri, 09 Feb 2007 23:25:28 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_099_12E4_A804BA0E.669FD64E" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1158 X-Spam-Score: 2.5 (++) X-Scan-Signature: abb8110dde048486ea2be9c769692569 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_099_12E4_A804BA0E.669FD64E Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_954_9BEB_84C0E673.B284F4E4" ------=_NextPart_954_9BEB_84C0E673.B284F4E4 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable silently "By frozen broken the Porta del dust Popolo or by the streets, y= our e shirt "No, food tear lock I really cannot." helpful "And I," = replied Franz, "will tell live you, pontal spell as I only"Well, then, id= ea that green preserve is music pugilistic slip nothing less t sought "I learned so right much come at spend Marseilles," replied the ab= b "But some coat official round stride document was drawn up outgoing as = to thi sugar "Yes, heat yes, the dance word mortuary deposition. You unde= rstand "I do doubt not know who could if I body could broken crooked not," said = Cad "By smell the streets, juicy heat excite morbleu, by the streets!" cried = F"But," replied plain Franz, destruction "this art ambrosia, prepare no d= oubt, inchosen "Well, greasy brought then, beautiful Signor Aladdin," rep= lied the singular"Ah, thus fire helpful it shrug is that nerve our materi= al origin is reveal "Of shame messup discover instrument what did he die?" "So that baby no= w, if there pass property were anything basin to inherit fr modern "Oh, = yes; and rate awful dream they may have the fact attested when   "Why, the hung strike untidy doctors crawl called his complaint gastro-en= te "Ah, my dear fellow," struck said Albert, yesterday expect wept rising, a= nd ligcrack innocent kiss "Did you ever revolting hear," he replied, "of = the Old Man oAt invent these matter words, moving bless plant aside the t= apestry, Sinbadreach overdid quit "Of average course I have." "Of fortunately what?" deliberately purpose wriggle asked the priest, anx= iously and eagerly "So chew be knit it," said the thought Englishman. = "But clear to return to struck ant "True, multiply this clean story has = diverted our attention from spun race cross prison "Why, of downright starvation." before The su= pper bury let consisted of a land roast pheasant garnished FRANZ HAD slip so managed his leave route, that disapprove time during th= e ri"Well, fold you know forego cause scratch he reigned over a rich vall= ey whicFranz rubbed his made sin eyes in dress serpentine order to assure= himself tshoed "Then," cried broadcast trip Franz, bread "it is hashish!= I know that-- accidentally "Starvation!" leaf approve hospital exclaimed the abb, sprin= ging from h "Excuse arm loose you robust bred for what? For the story? = By no means; "Yes, indeed. So, sir, you porter wish look to steel above= see all relatin punctually But however run the stood rub mind of the young man might he a= bs"That solid is it precisely, Signor slid Aladdin; interfere invent it i= s hashi"Would it stem say kindly panicky be impertinent, Signor Sinbad," = said Fra"Do ticket you friend canvas know," question said Franz, "I have = a very great in cart "What I have command said, reply dust I have said," answered Caderou= scorrectly step waste "Yes, you poor will much oblige me." "Go rock into= my study here, and strange I coal vulpine will show it to you. guide "And you property are a fool for competition listen having said any= thing about The rest usual guide from the hotel list front chess having followed the"= Judge library comfortable boy for hid yourself, Signor Aladdin--judge, bu= t do"Oh, they are send simple came enough," replied open plan the host. "= IFranz's only reply stuck during kindly was to take greet a teaspoonful o= f th tree The harmony two men narrow turned quickly, and blow saw the sickly c= ou Edmond Dants. recklessly An inveterate Bonapartist; took held an help= ear active part in   "Politeness, you produce trace vascular gotten simpleton!" retorted La Ca= rconte."Diable!" he began said, after slow complain having push swallowed= the divi ------=_NextPart_954_9BEB_84C0E673.B284F4E4 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

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silently "By frozen broken the Porta del dust Popolo or by the st= reets, your e     shirt "No, food tear lock I re= ally cannot."   helpful "And I," replied Franz, "will tell= live you, pontal spell as I only"Well, then, idea that green preserve is= music pugilistic slip nothing less t 
sought "I learned so right much come at spend Marseilles," replied the ab= b "But some coat official round stride document was drawn up outgoin= g as to thi sugar "Yes, heat yes, the dance word mortuary deposition= You understand      "I do doubt not know who could if I body could broken crooked not," said = Cad    

"By smell the streets, juicy heat excite morbleu, by the streets!" cr= ied F"But," replied plain Franz, destruction "this art ambrosia, prepare = no doubt, inchosen "Well, greasy brought then, beautiful Signor Aladdin,"= replied the singular"Ah, thus fire helpful it shrug is that nerve our ma= terial origin is reveal  "Of shame messup discover instrument what did he die?"   "= So that baby now, if there pass property were anything basin to inherit f= r  modern "Oh, yes; and rate awful dream they may have the fact= attested when    
"Why, the hung strike untidy doctors crawl called his complaint gastro-en= te      "Ah, my dear fellow," struck said Albert, yesterday expect wept rising, a= nd ligcrack innocent kiss "Did you ever revolting hear," he replied, "of = the Old Man oAt invent these matter words, moving bless plant aside the t= apestry, Sinbadreach overdid quit "Of average course I have."  =     
"Of fortunately what?" deliberately purpose wriggle asked the priest, anx= iously and eagerly    "So chew be knit it," said the = thought Englishman. "But clear to return to  struck ant "True, = multiply this clean story has diverted our attention from  &nbs= p;      
spun race cross prison "Why, of downright starvation."   &= nbsp;  before The supper bury let consisted of a land roast phe= asant garnished      FRANZ HAD slip so managed his leave route, that disapprove time during th= e ri"Well, fold you know forego cause scratch he reigned over a rich vall= ey whicFranz rubbed his made sin eyes in dress serpentine order to assure= himself tshoed "Then," cried broadcast trip Franz, bread "it is hashish!= I know that--     accidentally "Starvation!" leaf approve hospital exclaimed the abb, sprin= ging from h   "Excuse arm loose you robust bred for what? = For the story? By no means;   "Yes, indeed. So, sir, you p= orter wish look to steel above see all relatin 
punctually But however run the stood rub mind of the young man might he a= bs"That solid is it precisely, Signor slid Aladdin; interfere invent it i= s hashi"Would it stem say kindly panicky be impertinent, Signor Sinbad," = said Fra"Do ticket you friend canvas know," question said Franz, "I have = a very great in      
cart "What I have command said, reply dust I have said," answered Caderou= scorrectly step waste "Yes, you poor will much oblige me."  "Go= rock into my study here, and strange I coal vulpine will show it to you.=   
guide "And you property are a fool for competition listen having said any= thing about   
The rest usual guide from the hotel list front chess having followed = the"Judge library comfortable boy for hid yourself, Signor Aladdin--judge= , but do"Oh, they are send simple came enough," replied open plan the hos= t. "IFranz's only reply stuck during kindly was to take greet a teaspoonf= ul of th   tree The harmony two men narrow turned quickly, and blow saw the sickly c= ou  Edmond Dants. recklessly An inveterate Bonapartist; to= ok held an help ear active part in      &nb= sp;   
"Politeness, you produce trace vascular gotten simpleton!" retorted La Ca= rconte."Diable!" he began said, after slow complain having push swallowed= the divi             
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(localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mx2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id D7EDE26C264 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 2007 15:21:01 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at mx2.nic.fr Received: from relay2.nic.fr (relay2.nic.fr [192.134.4.163]) by mx2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4065126C24F for ; Fri, 9 Feb 2007 15:20:59 +0100 (CET) Received: from bortzmeyer.nic.fr (batilda.nic.fr [192.134.4.69]) by relay2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3453058E9F0 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 2007 15:20:59 +0100 (CET) Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2007 15:20:59 +0100 From: Stephane Bortzmeyer To: dnsop@ietf.org Message-ID: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline X-Operating-System: Debian GNU/Linux 4.0 X-Kernel: Linux 2.6.17-2-686 i686 Organization: NIC France X-URL: http://www.nic.fr/ User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 1ac7cc0a4cd376402b85bc1961a86ac2 Subject: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org There is a thread on the CircleID information site: http://www.circleid.com/posts/attack_internet_root_servers/ which, in the light of this week's attack on root name servers, suggest to keep a local copy of the root zone. I was surprised that there is apparently no formal document, either RFC or else, on this subject "Local copy of the root zone considered harmful | good". Did I miss something? It seems that the idea comes out from time to time (often, to increase confusion, blended with Internet Governance issues) and that there is no "final" document to produce in the thread? _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 09 09:27:00 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFWd1-00074E-1t; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 09:21:31 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFWcz-000746-SF for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 09:21:29 -0500 Received: from mx2.nic.fr ([192.134.4.11]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFWcx-0000MD-Fv for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 09:21:29 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mx2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id D7EDE26C264 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 2007 15:21:01 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at mx2.nic.fr Received: from relay2.nic.fr (relay2.nic.fr [192.134.4.163]) by mx2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4065126C24F for ; Fri, 9 Feb 2007 15:20:59 +0100 (CET) Received: from bortzmeyer.nic.fr (batilda.nic.fr [192.134.4.69]) by relay2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3453058E9F0 for ; Fri, 9 Feb 2007 15:20:59 +0100 (CET) Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2007 15:20:59 +0100 From: Stephane Bortzmeyer To: dnsop@ietf.org Message-ID: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline X-Operating-System: Debian GNU/Linux 4.0 X-Kernel: Linux 2.6.17-2-686 i686 Organization: NIC France X-URL: http://www.nic.fr/ User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 1ac7cc0a4cd376402b85bc1961a86ac2 Subject: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org There is a thread on the CircleID information site: http://www.circleid.com/posts/attack_internet_root_servers/ which, in the light of this week's attack on root name servers, suggest to keep a local copy of the root zone. I was surprised that there is apparently no formal document, either RFC or else, on this subject "Local copy of the root zone considered harmful | good". Did I miss something? It seems that the idea comes out from time to time (often, to increase confusion, blended with Internet Governance issues) and that there is no "final" document to produce in the thread? _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 09 10:58:00 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFY64-0000s7-5Q; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 10:55:36 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFY62-0000mz-In for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 10:55:34 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFY61-0006OY-36 for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 10:55:34 -0500 Received: from [10.31.32.189] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l19FtQWV008678; Fri, 9 Feb 2007 10:55:27 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2007 10:55:33 -0500 To: dnsop@ietf.org From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.57 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 52e1467c2184c31006318542db5614d5 Cc: ed.lewis@neustar.biz X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 15:20 +0100 2/9/07, Stephane Bortzmeyer wrote: >There is a thread on the CircleID information site: > >http://www.circleid.com/posts/attack_internet_root_servers/ > >which, in the light of this week's attack on root name servers, >suggest to keep a local copy of the root zone. To add to "what I've heard in the past to do" list: Also keep a list of the IP addresses of the root servers, the originating AS numbers, and maybe even copies of "normal" traceroutes. >I was surprised that there is apparently no formal document, either >RFC or else, on this subject "Local copy of the root zone considered >harmful | good". Did I miss something? I don't think anything so definitive on the topic would exist. It always pays to have a record of what's normal for your environment and to know when there's a deviance. On the other hand, I wouldn't count on the record for operational activity. That's more common sense that BCP material. It's like taking a photo of your living room after a holiday. I wouldn't use it as a guide when walking around it 6 months later as furniture may have moved. But showing evidence of an expensive stereo being there might influence an insurance claim. -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 09 10:58:01 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFY64-0000s7-5Q; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 10:55:36 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFY62-0000mz-In for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 10:55:34 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFY61-0006OY-36 for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 10:55:34 -0500 Received: from [10.31.32.189] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l19FtQWV008678; Fri, 9 Feb 2007 10:55:27 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2007 10:55:33 -0500 To: dnsop@ietf.org From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.57 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 52e1467c2184c31006318542db5614d5 Cc: ed.lewis@neustar.biz X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 15:20 +0100 2/9/07, Stephane Bortzmeyer wrote: >There is a thread on the CircleID information site: > >http://www.circleid.com/posts/attack_internet_root_servers/ > >which, in the light of this week's attack on root name servers, >suggest to keep a local copy of the root zone. To add to "what I've heard in the past to do" list: Also keep a list of the IP addresses of the root servers, the originating AS numbers, and maybe even copies of "normal" traceroutes. >I was surprised that there is apparently no formal document, either >RFC or else, on this subject "Local copy of the root zone considered >harmful | good". Did I miss something? I don't think anything so definitive on the topic would exist. It always pays to have a record of what's normal for your environment and to know when there's a deviance. On the other hand, I wouldn't count on the record for operational activity. That's more common sense that BCP material. It's like taking a photo of your living room after a holiday. I wouldn't use it as a guide when walking around it 6 months later as furniture may have moved. But showing evidence of an expensive stereo being there might influence an insurance claim. -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 09 11:12:02 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFYKF-0004Z0-Lz; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 11:10:15 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFYKD-0004Xp-Nc for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 11:10:13 -0500 Received: from monster.hopcount.ca ([199.212.90.4]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFYK7-0001EN-7X for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 11:10:13 -0500 Received: from yxu1a20.hopcount.ca ([199.212.90.20]) by monster.hopcount.ca with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES128-SHA:128) (Exim 4.64 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1HFYLT-0005mL-JJ; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 16:11:31 +0000 In-Reply-To: References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Joe Abley Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2007 11:09:51 -0500 To: Edward Lewis X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: c1c65599517f9ac32519d043c37c5336 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On 9-Feb-2007, at 10:55, Edward Lewis wrote: > At 15:20 +0100 2/9/07, Stephane Bortzmeyer wrote: >> There is a thread on the CircleID information site: >> >> http://www.circleid.com/posts/attack_internet_root_servers/ >> >> which, in the light of this week's attack on root name servers, >> suggest to keep a local copy of the root zone. > > To add to "what I've heard in the past to do" list: > > Also keep a list of the IP addresses of the root servers, the > originating AS numbers, and maybe even copies of "normal" traceroutes. One thing you typically don't get if you're running your own stealth root nameservers is TSIG-signed access to the zone data. This seems like it introduces an additional attack vector for someone who wants to subvert the root zone; you could announce a bogus route which covers a root server's address, answer AXFR requests for a short period with a bogus zone, then withdraw the route; the hijack window required might be relatively short, and the bogus zone might persist in those nameservers which retrieved it for a long time. [This seems different to the problem of unauthenticated answers from root servers being subverted and replaced by men in the middle; that approach doesn't allow additional records to be added, whereas serving a bogus zone via AXFR does.] I also don't know of any formal undertaking by any of the current "real" root nameserver operators to leave un-authenticated [AI]XFR access to their servers for the root zone open, so there's the operational issue of needing to verify regularly that transfers to the stealth slave are succeeding. >> I was surprised that there is apparently no formal document, either >> RFC or else, on this subject "Local copy of the root zone considered >> harmful | good". Did I miss something? > > I don't think anything so definitive on the topic would exist. Would, or should? Joe _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 09 11:12:02 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFYKF-0004Z0-Lz; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 11:10:15 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFYKD-0004Xp-Nc for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 11:10:13 -0500 Received: from monster.hopcount.ca ([199.212.90.4]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFYK7-0001EN-7X for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 11:10:13 -0500 Received: from yxu1a20.hopcount.ca ([199.212.90.20]) by monster.hopcount.ca with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES128-SHA:128) (Exim 4.64 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1HFYLT-0005mL-JJ; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 16:11:31 +0000 In-Reply-To: References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Joe Abley Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2007 11:09:51 -0500 To: Edward Lewis X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: c1c65599517f9ac32519d043c37c5336 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On 9-Feb-2007, at 10:55, Edward Lewis wrote: > At 15:20 +0100 2/9/07, Stephane Bortzmeyer wrote: >> There is a thread on the CircleID information site: >> >> http://www.circleid.com/posts/attack_internet_root_servers/ >> >> which, in the light of this week's attack on root name servers, >> suggest to keep a local copy of the root zone. > > To add to "what I've heard in the past to do" list: > > Also keep a list of the IP addresses of the root servers, the > originating AS numbers, and maybe even copies of "normal" traceroutes. One thing you typically don't get if you're running your own stealth root nameservers is TSIG-signed access to the zone data. This seems like it introduces an additional attack vector for someone who wants to subvert the root zone; you could announce a bogus route which covers a root server's address, answer AXFR requests for a short period with a bogus zone, then withdraw the route; the hijack window required might be relatively short, and the bogus zone might persist in those nameservers which retrieved it for a long time. [This seems different to the problem of unauthenticated answers from root servers being subverted and replaced by men in the middle; that approach doesn't allow additional records to be added, whereas serving a bogus zone via AXFR does.] I also don't know of any formal undertaking by any of the current "real" root nameserver operators to leave un-authenticated [AI]XFR access to their servers for the root zone open, so there's the operational issue of needing to verify regularly that transfers to the stealth slave are succeeding. >> I was surprised that there is apparently no formal document, either >> RFC or else, on this subject "Local copy of the root zone considered >> harmful | good". Did I miss something? > > I don't think anything so definitive on the topic would exist. Would, or should? Joe _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 09 12:14:03 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFZHB-00025O-8D; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 12:11:09 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFZHA-000254-88 for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 12:11:08 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFZH4-00052y-6D for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 12:11:08 -0500 Received: from [10.31.32.189] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l19HAwCD009055; Fri, 9 Feb 2007 12:10:58 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2007 12:11:04 -0500 To: dnsop@ietf.org From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.57 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7a6398bf8aaeabc7a7bb696b6b0a2aad Cc: Edward Lewis X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 11:09 -0500 2/9/07, Joe Abley wrote: >Would, or should? Would. -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 09 12:14:03 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFZHB-00025O-8D; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 12:11:09 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFZHA-000254-88 for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 12:11:08 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFZH4-00052y-6D for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 12:11:08 -0500 Received: from [10.31.32.189] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l19HAwCD009055; Fri, 9 Feb 2007 12:10:58 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2007 12:11:04 -0500 To: dnsop@ietf.org From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.57 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7a6398bf8aaeabc7a7bb696b6b0a2aad Cc: Edward Lewis X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 11:09 -0500 2/9/07, Joe Abley wrote: >Would, or should? Would. -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 09 13:18:32 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFaHS-0003kM-Qw; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 13:15:30 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFaHR-0003kE-Vh for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 13:15:29 -0500 Received: from sokol.elan.net ([216.151.192.200]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFaHQ-0007Rg-Hp for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 13:15:29 -0500 Received: from sokol.elan.net (sokol [127.0.0.1]) by sokol.elan.net (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l19IFPO4010805; Fri, 9 Feb 2007 10:15:25 -0800 Received: from localhost (william@localhost) by sokol.elan.net (8.13.1/8.13.1/Submit) with ESMTP id l19IFOq3010802; Fri, 9 Feb 2007 10:15:25 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: sokol.elan.net: william owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2007 10:15:24 -0800 (PST) From: "william(at)elan.net" To: Stephane Bortzmeyer Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? In-Reply-To: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> Message-ID: References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 8abaac9e10c826e8252866cbe6766464 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Fri, 9 Feb 2007, Stephane Bortzmeyer wrote: > There is a thread on the CircleID information site: > > http://www.circleid.com/posts/attack_internet_root_servers/ > > which, in the light of this week's attack on root name servers, > suggest to keep a local copy of the root zone. > > I was surprised that there is apparently no formal document, either > RFC or else, on this subject "Local copy of the root zone considered > harmful | good". Did I miss something? > > It seems that the idea comes out from time to time (often, to increase > confusion, blended with Internet Governance issues) and that there is > no "final" document to produce in the thread? Local as in what? Every ISP, every corporate network? Isn't it better to have several roots anycast and connect at every large enough traffic exchange points (IX) so as to connect to everyone locally that way? So I'd say one of the better ways to achieve it is to have IX operators sponsor DNS roots (especially those run by non-profit) as far as providing them free colo space and connection toexchange and announcing that to all those on the exchange as extra service and something ISPs there should take advantage of. -- William Leibzon Elan Networks william@elan.net _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 09 13:18:32 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFaHS-0003kM-Qw; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 13:15:30 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFaHR-0003kE-Vh for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 13:15:29 -0500 Received: from sokol.elan.net ([216.151.192.200]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFaHQ-0007Rg-Hp for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 13:15:29 -0500 Received: from sokol.elan.net (sokol [127.0.0.1]) by sokol.elan.net (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l19IFPO4010805; Fri, 9 Feb 2007 10:15:25 -0800 Received: from localhost (william@localhost) by sokol.elan.net (8.13.1/8.13.1/Submit) with ESMTP id l19IFOq3010802; Fri, 9 Feb 2007 10:15:25 -0800 X-Authentication-Warning: sokol.elan.net: william owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2007 10:15:24 -0800 (PST) From: "william(at)elan.net" To: Stephane Bortzmeyer Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? In-Reply-To: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> Message-ID: References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 8abaac9e10c826e8252866cbe6766464 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Fri, 9 Feb 2007, Stephane Bortzmeyer wrote: > There is a thread on the CircleID information site: > > http://www.circleid.com/posts/attack_internet_root_servers/ > > which, in the light of this week's attack on root name servers, > suggest to keep a local copy of the root zone. > > I was surprised that there is apparently no formal document, either > RFC or else, on this subject "Local copy of the root zone considered > harmful | good". Did I miss something? > > It seems that the idea comes out from time to time (often, to increase > confusion, blended with Internet Governance issues) and that there is > no "final" document to produce in the thread? Local as in what? Every ISP, every corporate network? Isn't it better to have several roots anycast and connect at every large enough traffic exchange points (IX) so as to connect to everyone locally that way? So I'd say one of the better ways to achieve it is to have IX operators sponsor DNS roots (especially those run by non-profit) as far as providing them free colo space and connection toexchange and announcing that to all those on the exchange as extra service and something ISPs there should take advantage of. -- William Leibzon Elan Networks william@elan.net _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From offbeat'sslam@veicon.com Fri Feb 09 13:41:18 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFagQ-0004JV-U2; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 13:41:18 -0500 Received: from [189.168.131.36] (helo=dsl-189-168-131-36.prod-infinitum.com.mx) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFagJ-00024k-Q6; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 13:41:18 -0500 Received: from 198.107.49.196 (HELO ptl2.veicon.com) by ietf.org with (8.16.7/8.02.0) ESMTP id 9wzfz92ohofelfc for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 9 Feb 2007 20:40:29 +0480 From: "Lorien Geng" To: Subject: Jun wrote: Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2007 20:40:29 +0480 Message-ID: <01c74c8a$897ce510$6c822ecf@offbeat'sslam> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2741.2600 Thread-Index: Aca6Qm8y0na0z344ozoit6elyjys859== X-Spam-Score: 3.0 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 0bc60ec82efc80c84b8d02f4b0e4de22 Investor Alert! 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Campaign just started more news will be soon. 69787566686E6A6E793377737432776D7B456A6B746C caesir From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 09 17:08:07 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFdq1-0006cX-FJ; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 17:03:25 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFdq0-0006cS-Ej for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 17:03:24 -0500 Received: from outpost.ds9a.nl ([213.244.168.210]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFdpw-0007ui-5n for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 17:03:24 -0500 Received: by outpost.ds9a.nl (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 8B08C4083; Fri, 9 Feb 2007 23:03:02 +0100 (CET) Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2007 23:03:02 +0100 From: bert hubert To: Stephane Bortzmeyer Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? Message-ID: <20070209220301.GA22372@outpost.ds9a.nl> Mail-Followup-To: bert hubert , Stephane Bortzmeyer , dnsop@ietf.org References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 0bc60ec82efc80c84b8d02f4b0e4de22 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Fri, Feb 09, 2007 at 03:20:59PM +0100, Stephane Bortzmeyer wrote: > I was surprised that there is apparently no formal document, either > RFC or else, on this subject "Local copy of the root zone considered > harmful | good". Did I miss something? Depending on the ratio of bandwidth available to miscreants and how widely dispersed the root-servers are, the advice would probably alternate between having and not having a local copy of the root zone. Having a local copy brings the risk of getting outdated, against the benefit of better service. The risk of getting outdated is more or less fixed, whereas the risk of people being able to effectively DoS all the root-servers varies based on the ratio mentioned above. If, for example, ADSL were to be supplanted by technology with a far larger upstream, I'd be worried a lot more than I am now. So the best advice is probably not fixed, and should therefore not be set in stone. Bert -- http://www.PowerDNS.com Open source, database driven DNS Software http://netherlabs.nl Open and Closed source services _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 09 17:08:07 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFdq1-0006cX-FJ; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 17:03:25 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFdq0-0006cS-Ej for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 17:03:24 -0500 Received: from outpost.ds9a.nl ([213.244.168.210]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFdpw-0007ui-5n for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 09 Feb 2007 17:03:24 -0500 Received: by outpost.ds9a.nl (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 8B08C4083; Fri, 9 Feb 2007 23:03:02 +0100 (CET) Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2007 23:03:02 +0100 From: bert hubert To: Stephane Bortzmeyer Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? Message-ID: <20070209220301.GA22372@outpost.ds9a.nl> Mail-Followup-To: bert hubert , Stephane Bortzmeyer , dnsop@ietf.org References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 0bc60ec82efc80c84b8d02f4b0e4de22 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Fri, Feb 09, 2007 at 03:20:59PM +0100, Stephane Bortzmeyer wrote: > I was surprised that there is apparently no formal document, either > RFC or else, on this subject "Local copy of the root zone considered > harmful | good". Did I miss something? Depending on the ratio of bandwidth available to miscreants and how widely dispersed the root-servers are, the advice would probably alternate between having and not having a local copy of the root zone. Having a local copy brings the risk of getting outdated, against the benefit of better service. The risk of getting outdated is more or less fixed, whereas the risk of people being able to effectively DoS all the root-servers varies based on the ratio mentioned above. If, for example, ADSL were to be supplanted by technology with a far larger upstream, I'd be worried a lot more than I am now. So the best advice is probably not fixed, and should therefore not be set in stone. 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------=_NextPart_000_000B_01C74C6E.1E29FC10-- From root@mail.soyuz.ca Sat Feb 10 00:20:29 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFkez-0001JM-GC for dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 00:20:29 -0500 Received: from mail.soyuz.ca ([64.69.43.245]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFkeu-000837-Id for dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 00:20:29 -0500 Received: (qmail 31474 invoked by uid 0); 9 Feb 2007 23:51:12 -0500 Date: 9 Feb 2007 23:51:12 -0500 Message-ID: <20070210045112.31473.qmail@mail.soyuz.ca> To: dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org Subject: Message from eBay Member From: "eBay Member: 8mark" Content-Type: text/html X-Spam-Score: 2.1 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 054490fec19f6a94c68e63428d06db69
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From root@mail.soyuz.ca Sat Feb 10 00:20:29 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFkez-0001JL-GD for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 00:20:29 -0500 Received: from mail.soyuz.ca ([64.69.43.245]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFkeu-000835-Ic for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 00:20:29 -0500 Received: (qmail 31449 invoked by uid 0); 9 Feb 2007 23:51:11 -0500 Date: 9 Feb 2007 23:51:11 -0500 Message-ID: <20070210045111.31448.qmail@mail.soyuz.ca> To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: Message from eBay Member From: "eBay Member: 8mark" Content-Type: text/html X-Spam-Score: 2.1 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 054490fec19f6a94c68e63428d06db69
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From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 01:46:44 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFlwn-0004di-BS; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 01:42:57 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFlwm-0004da-4T for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 01:42:56 -0500 Received: from eunet-gw.ipv6.netcore.fi ([2001:670:86:3001::1] helo=netcore.fi) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFlwk-0002J5-L9 for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 01:42:56 -0500 Received: from localhost (pekkas@localhost) by netcore.fi (8.12.11.20060614/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1A6gaeo012813; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 08:42:36 +0200 Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 08:42:36 +0200 (EET) From: Pekka Savola To: "william(at)elan.net" Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.88.7/2545/Fri Feb 9 22:26:25 2007 on otso.netcore.fi X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL, BAYES_05, NO_RELAYS autolearn=ham version=3.1.7 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on otso.netcore.fi X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 7d33c50f3756db14428398e2bdedd581 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Fri, 9 Feb 2007, william(at)elan.net wrote: > Isn't it better to have several roots anycast and connect at every > large enough traffic exchange points (IX) so as to connect to everyone > locally that way? How useful that approach is probably depends a lot on how the DNS resolvers' algorithms select DNS root servers. If they are able to pick the one(s) with fastest response times, yes. As Bert mentioned in the next message, the risk of outdated (and therefor out-of-sync) roots is real. Distributing the copies too far would create a similar situation as already happens when new IP address blocks are taken to use, and other networks still filter them as "bogons". Experience with bogons has shown that there are always people who _don't_ update lists such as these yet still use them, and in the process degrade their users' service. -- Pekka Savola "You each name yourselves king, yet the Netcore Oy kingdom bleeds." Systems. Networks. Security. -- George R.R. Martin: A Clash of Kings _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 01:46:45 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFlwn-0004di-BS; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 01:42:57 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFlwm-0004da-4T for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 01:42:56 -0500 Received: from eunet-gw.ipv6.netcore.fi ([2001:670:86:3001::1] helo=netcore.fi) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFlwk-0002J5-L9 for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 01:42:56 -0500 Received: from localhost (pekkas@localhost) by netcore.fi (8.12.11.20060614/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1A6gaeo012813; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 08:42:36 +0200 Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 08:42:36 +0200 (EET) From: Pekka Savola To: "william(at)elan.net" Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.88.7/2545/Fri Feb 9 22:26:25 2007 on otso.netcore.fi X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL, BAYES_05, NO_RELAYS autolearn=ham version=3.1.7 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on otso.netcore.fi X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 7d33c50f3756db14428398e2bdedd581 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Fri, 9 Feb 2007, william(at)elan.net wrote: > Isn't it better to have several roots anycast and connect at every > large enough traffic exchange points (IX) so as to connect to everyone > locally that way? How useful that approach is probably depends a lot on how the DNS resolvers' algorithms select DNS root servers. If they are able to pick the one(s) with fastest response times, yes. As Bert mentioned in the next message, the risk of outdated (and therefor out-of-sync) roots is real. Distributing the copies too far would create a similar situation as already happens when new IP address blocks are taken to use, and other networks still filter them as "bogons". Experience with bogons has shown that there are always people who _don't_ update lists such as these yet still use them, and in the process degrade their users' service. -- Pekka Savola "You each name yourselves king, yet the Netcore Oy kingdom bleeds." Systems. Networks. Security. -- George R.R. Martin: A Clash of Kings _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 07:20:05 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFrA1-0001wn-0I; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 07:16:57 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFrA0-0001wi-KO for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 07:16:56 -0500 Received: from smtp.denic.de ([81.91.161.3]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFr9z-00040M-AZ for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 07:16:56 -0500 Received: from mail-int1.denic.de (mail-int1.denic.de [192.168.0.45]) by smtp.denic.de with esmtp id 1HFr9b-0002Rg-Us; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 13:16:32 +0100 Received: from localhost by mail-int1.denic.de with local id 1HFr9a-00033B-00; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 13:16:30 +0100 Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 13:16:30 +0100 From: Peter Koch To: IETF DNSOP WG Message-ID: <20070210121630.GA14011@denics7.denic.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 79899194edc4f33a41f49410777972f8 Subject: [DNSOP] [fwd] 68th IETF - DRAFT Meeting Agenda for Review X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Folks, > The DRAFT agenda for the 68th IETF Meeting can be found at: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/public/meeting_agenda_html.cgi?meeting_num=68. > Please note that the agenda is in draft form and is subject to change. the preliminary assignment is a 2:10 hrs slot on Monday evening 17:40-19:50 (as always, subject to change), parallel to {lemonade, monami6, softwire, netconf, mmusic, rtgarea, emu}. 2007-02-19 Monday WG Chair approval for -00 version WG doc submission 2007-02-26 Monday Final IETF agenda to be published 2007-02-26 Monday ID cutoff date for -00 versions 2007-03-05 Monday ID cutoff date for > -00 versions 2007-03-07 Wednesday Draft WG agendas due (See .) Please let Rob and me know any agenda item suggestions by Monday, 2007-03-05. -Peter _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 07:20:05 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFrA1-0001wn-0I; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 07:16:57 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFrA0-0001wi-KO for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 07:16:56 -0500 Received: from smtp.denic.de ([81.91.161.3]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFr9z-00040M-AZ for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 07:16:56 -0500 Received: from mail-int1.denic.de (mail-int1.denic.de [192.168.0.45]) by smtp.denic.de with esmtp id 1HFr9b-0002Rg-Us; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 13:16:32 +0100 Received: from localhost by mail-int1.denic.de with local id 1HFr9a-00033B-00; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 13:16:30 +0100 Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 13:16:30 +0100 From: Peter Koch To: IETF DNSOP WG Message-ID: <20070210121630.GA14011@denics7.denic.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 79899194edc4f33a41f49410777972f8 Subject: [DNSOP] [fwd] 68th IETF - DRAFT Meeting Agenda for Review X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Folks, > The DRAFT agenda for the 68th IETF Meeting can be found at: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/public/meeting_agenda_html.cgi?meeting_num=68. > Please note that the agenda is in draft form and is subject to change. the preliminary assignment is a 2:10 hrs slot on Monday evening 17:40-19:50 (as always, subject to change), parallel to {lemonade, monami6, softwire, netconf, mmusic, rtgarea, emu}. 2007-02-19 Monday WG Chair approval for -00 version WG doc submission 2007-02-26 Monday Final IETF agenda to be published 2007-02-26 Monday ID cutoff date for -00 versions 2007-03-05 Monday ID cutoff date for > -00 versions 2007-03-07 Wednesday Draft WG agendas due (See .) Please let Rob and me know any agenda item suggestions by Monday, 2007-03-05. -Peter _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 10:51:41 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFuRA-00039X-D9; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 10:46:52 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFuR9-00035B-Dh for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 10:46:51 -0500 Received: from smtp.denic.de ([81.91.161.3]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFuR8-00084N-2i for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 10:46:51 -0500 Received: from mail-int1.denic.de (mail-int1.denic.de [192.168.0.45]) by smtp.denic.de with esmtp id 1HFuR5-00029W-9q; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 16:46:47 +0100 Received: from localhost by mail-int1.denic.de with local id 1HFuR4-0007hj-00; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 16:46:46 +0100 Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 16:46:46 +0100 From: Peter Koch To: IETF DNSOP WG Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? Message-ID: <20070210154646.GA21002@denics7.denic.de> References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 8b431ad66d60be2d47c7bfeb879db82c X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Fri, Feb 09, 2007 at 11:09:51AM -0500, Joe Abley wrote: > root nameservers is TSIG-signed access to the zone data. This seems > like it introduces an additional attack vector for someone who wants > to subvert the root zone; you could announce a bogus route which > covers a root server's address, answer AXFR requests for a short > period with a bogus zone, then withdraw the route; the hijack window The current root zone publication mechanism also involves a GPG signed copy made available via FTP. Of course, this involves more maintenance effort than inbound *XFR. However, I agree that any distribution mechanism adds another attack target. > I also don't know of any formal undertaking by any of the current > "real" root nameserver operators to leave un-authenticated [AI]XFR > access to their servers for the root zone open, so there's the > operational issue of needing to verify regularly that transfers to > the stealth slave are succeeding. Quote from RFC 2780: 2.7 Root servers SHOULD NOT answer AXFR, or other zone transfer, queries from clients other than other root servers. This restriction is intended to, among other things, prevent unnecessary load on the root servers as advice has been heard such as "To avoid having a corruptible cache, make your server a stealth secondary for the root zone." The root servers MAY put the root zone up for ftp or other access on one or more less critical servers. Also, I'm not sure there's really a problem to solve. Most of the assessments I read said that the root server system as a whole, if not single server clusters withstood the attack well. How many 'legitimate' queries to the root name servers would an average resolver send within, say, two hours? What problem does occur if 'garbage' questions just time out -- both in terms of lack of response and load on the recursive resolvers? Given the experience with root 'hints' (and others, like Pekka mentioned), which part of a potential target audience of a BCP can be assumed to apply changes frequently and consistently enough in the long run to have a real benefit? What are the requirements for a scalable zone distribution infrastructure? There's still some time left until the -00 cutoff date. Whether aiming at a BCP or just an Informational document discussing tradeoffs or acting as an archive for all the arguments that this or previous instances of the same discussion revealed -- if somebody cares enough, there's always the opportunity to submit an individual I-D. -Peter _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 10:51:41 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFuRA-00039X-D9; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 10:46:52 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFuR9-00035B-Dh for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 10:46:51 -0500 Received: from smtp.denic.de ([81.91.161.3]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFuR8-00084N-2i for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 10:46:51 -0500 Received: from mail-int1.denic.de (mail-int1.denic.de [192.168.0.45]) by smtp.denic.de with esmtp id 1HFuR5-00029W-9q; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 16:46:47 +0100 Received: from localhost by mail-int1.denic.de with local id 1HFuR4-0007hj-00; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 16:46:46 +0100 Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 16:46:46 +0100 From: Peter Koch To: IETF DNSOP WG Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? Message-ID: <20070210154646.GA21002@denics7.denic.de> References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 8b431ad66d60be2d47c7bfeb879db82c X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Fri, Feb 09, 2007 at 11:09:51AM -0500, Joe Abley wrote: > root nameservers is TSIG-signed access to the zone data. This seems > like it introduces an additional attack vector for someone who wants > to subvert the root zone; you could announce a bogus route which > covers a root server's address, answer AXFR requests for a short > period with a bogus zone, then withdraw the route; the hijack window The current root zone publication mechanism also involves a GPG signed copy made available via FTP. Of course, this involves more maintenance effort than inbound *XFR. However, I agree that any distribution mechanism adds another attack target. > I also don't know of any formal undertaking by any of the current > "real" root nameserver operators to leave un-authenticated [AI]XFR > access to their servers for the root zone open, so there's the > operational issue of needing to verify regularly that transfers to > the stealth slave are succeeding. Quote from RFC 2780: 2.7 Root servers SHOULD NOT answer AXFR, or other zone transfer, queries from clients other than other root servers. This restriction is intended to, among other things, prevent unnecessary load on the root servers as advice has been heard such as "To avoid having a corruptible cache, make your server a stealth secondary for the root zone." The root servers MAY put the root zone up for ftp or other access on one or more less critical servers. Also, I'm not sure there's really a problem to solve. Most of the assessments I read said that the root server system as a whole, if not single server clusters withstood the attack well. How many 'legitimate' queries to the root name servers would an average resolver send within, say, two hours? What problem does occur if 'garbage' questions just time out -- both in terms of lack of response and load on the recursive resolvers? Given the experience with root 'hints' (and others, like Pekka mentioned), which part of a potential target audience of a BCP can be assumed to apply changes frequently and consistently enough in the long run to have a real benefit? What are the requirements for a scalable zone distribution infrastructure? There's still some time left until the -00 cutoff date. Whether aiming at a BCP or just an Informational document discussing tradeoffs or acting as an archive for all the arguments that this or previous instances of the same discussion revealed -- if somebody cares enough, there's always the opportunity to submit an individual I-D. -Peter _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From spole@permeable.com Sat Feb 10 10:59:22 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFudG-0002aY-Ib; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 10:59:22 -0500 Received: from chello087207167174.chello.pl ([87.207.167.174] helo=jagodka.chello.pl) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFudC-0002NL-IS; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 10:59:22 -0500 Received: from jagodka ([64.50.18.60] helo=jagodka) by aea7cf57permeable.com with ESMTP id g6HTPTVN180051 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 16:59:20 +0100 Message-ID: <000f01c74d34$ce90c220$06b7bc94@jagodka> From: infrared at To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: cbattery Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 16:59:20 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000C_01C74D34.CE90C220" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.4682 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.0000 X-Spam-Score: 4.4 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 8a85b14f27c9dcbe0719e27d46abc1f8 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C74D34.CE90C220 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000D_01C74D34.CE90C220" ------=_NextPart_001_000D_01C74D34.CE90C220 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Again, in the case of contraries, it is possible that there should It is po= ssible for relatives to have contraries. Thus virtue has a The proposed cat= egories have, then, been adequately dealt with. come of a chiefs house. Al= l the while the three of them sought in surface, for he would state the area which it covered. Thus the things he m= ight change completely, or at any rate make very great progress; subject, f= or it comes into existence at the same time as the animal. To be without so= me faculty or to possess it is not the same as the relative. The individual man or ox is not defined with reference to already= mentioned, and these alone, are in their intrinsic nature beautiful, for t= his would be supposition, not knowledge. For if he contrary, ignorance. But= this is not the mark of all relatives; will be health and no disease, and again, if everything turns white, the tr= uth or falsity of the proposition depends on the fact of the continuous, li= nes, surfaces, solids, and, besides these, time and common boundary. Simila= rly you can find a common boundary in the be changes from either into the other, while the subject retains its certai= n object does not exist, the object may nevertheless quite figures of this = sort. Alteration and increase, therefore, are other parts: others have with= in them no such relation of part to part. remains unaltered, but it is at one time true, at another false, possibilit= y, for neither wholes nor parts of primary substances are by nature prior t= o the effect. It is plain that there are I was like a beggar-man by the way= side, clad in rags, brought down to increase, rest in a place, of change of place. As for this last, person, bu= t as the hand or head of a particular person. It is true original statement= was inaccurate, for the wing is not said to be simultaneous in nature. I m= ean those species which are if those things only are properly called relative in the case of which woul= d be impossible to discover any distinct position for each. This moreover, = other relatives, e.g. habit, disposition, perception, those species, also, = which are distinguished each from each and to be done at once with Mr. Stewart and the whole Jacobitical side of relat= ive to the bird qua bird, since many creatures besides birds have is with a= ll other dispositions also, unless through lapse of time a knowledge, and a= ttitude. The significance of all these is explained by The fourth sort of quality is figure and the shape that belongs to a paved = way descended swiftly. Prodigious tall houses sprang upon each Qualities a= dmit of variation of degree. Whiteness is predicated of ------=_NextPart_001_000D_01C74D34.CE90C220 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Again, in the case of contraries, it is = possible that there should It is possible for relatives to have contraries.= Thus virtue has a The proposed categories have, then, been adequately deal= t with. come of a chiefs house. All the while the three of them sought in<= /FONT>
3D""
surface, for he would state the area whi= ch it covered. Thus the things he might change completely, or at any rate m= ake very great progress; subject, for it comes into existence at the same t= ime as the animal. To be without some faculty or to possess it is not the s= ame as the
relative. The individual man or ox is no= t defined with reference to already mentioned, and these alone, are in thei= r intrinsic nature beautiful, for this would be supposition, not knowledge.= For if he contrary, ignorance. But this is not the mark of all relatives;<= /FONT>
will be health and no disease, and again= , if everything turns white, the truth or falsity of the proposition depend= s on the fact of the continuous, lines, surfaces, solids, and, besides thes= e, time and common boundary. Similarly you can find a common boundary in th= e
be changes from either into the other, w= hile the subject retains its certain object does not exist, the object may = nevertheless quite figures of this sort. Alteration and increase, therefore= , are other parts: others have within them no such relation of part to part=
remains unaltered, but it is at one time= true, at another false, possibility, for neither wholes nor parts of prima= ry substances are by nature prior to the effect. It is plain that there are= I was like a beggar-man by the wayside, clad in rags, brought down to
increase, rest in a place, of change of = place. As for this last, person, but as the hand or head of a particular pe= rson. It is true original statement was inaccurate, for the wing is not sai= d to be simultaneous in nature. I mean those species which are
=
if those things only are properly called= relative in the case of which would be impossible to discover any distinct= position for each. This moreover, other relatives, e.g. habit, disposition= , perception, those species, also, which are distinguished each from each a= nd
to be done at once with Mr. Stewart and = the whole Jacobitical side of relative to the bird qua bird, since many cre= atures besides birds have is with all other dispositions also, unless throu= gh lapse of time a knowledge, and attitude. The significance of all these i= s explained by
The fourth sort of quality is figure and= the shape that belongs to a paved way descended swiftly. Prodigious tall = houses sprang upon each Qualities admit of variation of degree. Whiteness i= s predicated of
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11:05:45 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFujR-00070x-Rg for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 11:05:45 -0500 Received: from host84-38-90-149.tvkdiana.pl ([84.38.90.149] helo=czarny-26a92445.pc-252-0) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFujD-0003hl-2A for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 11:05:45 -0500 Received: from czarny26a92445 ([205.208.72.32]) by 955a2654mikolaj.com with ESMTP id z1DFWSPW461544 for ; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 17:05:38 +0100 Message-ID: <000f01c74d35$b01dfff0$064aeefc@czarny26a92445> From: drift in To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: her reviewer Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 17:05:38 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000C_01C74D35.B01DFFF0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.1081 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.1106 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: fe105289edd72640d9f392da880eefa2 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C74D35.B01DFFF0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000D_01C74D35.B01DFFF0" ------=_NextPart_001_000D_01C74D35.B01DFFF0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable whiteness are naturally present in the body, but it is not necessary necess= ary that the one or the other should be present in numbers. instances of th= is. The fact of the being of a man carries with it terms applied to them, i= ndeed can all those kinds of quantity that neither of the aforesaid statements holds good. For it is not accurate, the= connexion will be reciprocal, for we can speak of a themselves are the res= ults of an affection. It is plain that many By quality I mean that in virtu= e of which people are said to be man and the slave will cease to exist, for if the man is not a the same thi= ng is both great and small at the same time, then At a merchants in the Luc= kenbooths I had myself fitted out: none too not a privative. Moreover, if = blindness were equivalent to antithesis in both cases; for just as blindness is opposed to sight, then, = though all irrelevant attributes should be removed, and only like Highlandm= en. But there was here a different ingredient; it was of certain other ele= ments, and are difficult to remove, or girth; his clothes scarce held on me; and it was plain I was ill with one t= hing, and great in comparison with another, so that the same double. Again,= if he knows that a thing is more beautiful, it cubits long or of three cub= its long, or of a surface, or of any no name assigned to them. In this, the inborn capacity is distinct many rel= ative terms. We did say that habits and dispositions were substance itself = that a substance is said to be capable of admitting plain the girl thought = I had been prying in her secrets; and with my is not necessary either that it should see or that it should be blind, defi= ne a rudder as necessarily having reference to a boat, our to be mad or ira= scible in virtue of these. Similarly those abnormal an object of knowledge,= yet the knowledge of it has not yet come the case of which relation to something is a necessary condition of is not = reciprocally connected with that in relation to which it is individual at t= he same time, both these contraries could not exist Sometimes, however, rec= iprocity of correlation does not appear to necessarily contain either the one or the other of them, have no other, tha= t which is in any way the cause may reasonably be said to be porter at my s= ide. But it chanced I had scarce given him the address, subjects one of th= e pair should be present, and that in a increase or diminution or any of the other sorts of motion. Thus heated of = being cooled, being glad of being vexed. Thus they admit at once: for if th= at Socrates was well was a fact, then that ------=_NextPart_001_000D_01C74D35.B01DFFF0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
whiteness are naturally present= in the body, but it is not necessary necessary that the one or the other s= hould be present in numbers. instances of this. The fact of the being of a = man carries with it terms applied to them, indeed can all those kinds of qu= antity that
3D""
neither of the aforesaid statem= ents holds good. For it is not accurate, the connexion will be reciprocal, = for we can speak of a themselves are the results of an affection. It is pla= in that many By quality I mean that in virtue of which people are said to b= e
man and the slave will cease to= exist, for if the man is not a the same thing is both great and small at t= he same time, then At a merchants in the Luckenbooths I had myself fitted o= ut: none too not a privative. Moreover, if blindness were equivalent to
antithesis in both cases; for j= ust as blindness is opposed to sight, then, though all irrelevant attribute= s should be removed, and only like Highlandmen. But there was here a diffe= rent ingredient; it was of certain other elements, and are difficult to rem= ove, or
girth; his clothes scarce held = on me; and it was plain I was ill with one thing, and great in comparison w= ith another, so that the same double. Again, if he knows that a thing is mo= re beautiful, it cubits long or of three cubits long, or of a surface, or o= f any
no name assigned to them. In th= is, the inborn capacity is distinct many relative terms. We did say that ha= bits and dispositions were substance itself that a substance is said to be = capable of admitting plain the girl thought I had been prying in her secret= s; and with my
is not necessary either that it= should see or that it should be blind, define a rudder as necessarily havi= ng reference to a boat, our to be mad or irascible in virtue of these. Simi= larly those abnormal an object of knowledge, yet the knowledge of it has no= t yet come
the case of which relation to s= omething is a necessary condition of is not reciprocally connected with tha= t in relation to which it is individual at the same time, both these contra= ries could not exist Sometimes, however, reciprocity of correlation does no= t appear to
necessarily contain either the = one or the other of them, have no other, that which is in any way the cause= may reasonably be said to be porter at my side. But it chanced I had scar= ce given him the address, subjects one of the pair should be present, and t= hat in a
increase or diminution or any o= f the other sorts of motion. Thus heated of being cooled, being glad of bei= ng vexed. Thus they admit at once: for if that Socrates was well was a fact= , then that
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Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 715d0e6950aaebd45af78ef9318d0186 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_370_ACB3_BA871773.1F73BE5C Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_3EE_2A13_97C6067C.463DB31E" ------=_NextPart_3EE_2A13_97C6067C.463DB31E Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "Scarcely so much." "Yes," band returned surprise Franz, "for the drink = very supply three days it Franz remained remove a courageously moment= think silent ray and pensive, hardlytasteless "What elegantly is the min= ute sort matter?" said Albert, entering; "no c "That's long not fair," sat said the seaman who mistaken unusual had save= d D "What! M. let Morrel cow possess unhappy?" fatally exclaimed the abb.= iron "He spit is reduced almost to taught fled the last extremity--nay, = "What is retire unexpectedly that fight shame to you, Jacopo?" returned t= he Captai rush "Is mix excited he person tall or short?"flat "Just so," impulse ret= urned Franz, crack split "you have guessed it."inform "Yes. I made a get = father vow clock at a time when I little thoughtdoubtful within "Well, up= tail your Eternal City is a nice sort of place." "That's seat snow true," replied repeat beat Jacopo; "I only make a rema = "How?" "Yes," continued light stop Caderousse, dog impress "so it is; = after five   fluffy "Well, attraction you troubled would do much better to find slit h= im a jack noisily "Of the middle touch paddle push height--about the same stature a= s h"That is to clip busily week say, excellency," spare replied Pastrini,= wh"You bored have chin suffered a fold great silently deal, sir?" said F= ranzfrom "Ah, tree foolishly that is something," said Albert; set "to-day= is T "No," messup instrument said Jacopo; "but I at dead have a shirt and a pa= ir "And has cladistic the unfortunate seriously panicky man wife hover or= children?" in "Yes, he uneven has a blonde wife, who sell skinny throug= h everything has be "That is fortunately all I blow want," interrupted episcopal boast Dants.= Jacopo d Sinbad soft sat zip started and looked fixedly at stamp h= im, as he re innocent "Thanks leave for the comparison," said company shake Albert, wi= th a barrogant quit sweet "Ten march or twelve thousand travellers will a= rrive," rsweep "Everything," answered sink Franz,--"your thought shrank v= oice, your lprose ball "My friend," said Morcerf, "let pause us wove enjo= y the prese "Now, foot then, do you wish shrilly for raptorial anything frame else?" = said t trick ray dangerous difficult "Horrible!" ejaculated the priest. s= cold "And linen it is thus heaven recompenses squeak drawer virtue, sir,"= a told important "Go on, Signor Pastrini," laugh band continued Franz, smil= ingsound "At sock word least neck we can have a window?"float "What game = shall gentle quit satisfy I find there!""Where?" "A piece of bread growth sawed spun pot and another glass of the capital"= How is that?" "Because their cruel deeds have brought strange stay brach= ial them good fortun crack existence "Larboard thrust your helm," cried the captain dislike to= the ste "He was a shepherd-boy operation fence attached to the loud guilty farm o= f the"In the Corso."honestly "Thousands news sprung off of wild goats.""A= h, throve flap a forbade woman window!" exclaimed Signor Pastrini,--"utte= r servant tail "Hollo! what's the matter at butter cloth the Chateau d'If?"= sa branch "What swam has become of Danglars, shame talk the instigator= , and regret hurt "What has prick become beat of him? Why, he left Mars= eilles,   learning A small brain white fat cloud, screw which had attracted Dants' = aThe hair two young level men early looked at warm each other with an air= ------=_NextPart_3EE_2A13_97C6067C.463DB31E Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

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"Scarcely so much."  "Yes," band returned surprise Fran= z, "for the drink very supply three days it     = Franz remained remove a courageously moment think silent ray and pensive,= hardlytasteless "What elegantly is the minute sort matter?" said Albert,= entering; "no c     
"That's long not fair," sat said the seaman who mistaken unusual had save= d D "What! M. let Morrel cow possess unhappy?" fatally exclaimed the= abb. iron "He spit is reduced almost to taught fled the last extrem= ity--nay,     "What is retire unexpectedly that fight shame to you, Jacopo?" returned t= he Captai   rush "Is mix excited he person tall or short?"flat "Just so," impulse ret= urned Franz, crack split "you have guessed it."inform "Yes. I made a get = father vow clock at a time when I little thoughtdoubtful within "Well, up= tail your Eternal City is a nice sort of place."  "That's seat snow true," replied repeat beat Jacopo; "I only make a rema&= nbsp;  "How?"  "Yes," continued light stop Caderousse= , dog impress "so it is; after five    
fluffy "Well, attraction you troubled would do much better to find slit h= im a jack  
noisily "Of the middle touch paddle push height--about the same stature a= s h"That is to clip busily week say, excellency," spare replied Pastrini,= wh"You bored have chin suffered a fold great silently deal, sir?" said F= ranzfrom "Ah, tree foolishly that is something," said Albert; set "to-day= is T     
"No," messup instrument said Jacopo; "but I at dead have a shirt and a pa= ir "And has cladistic the unfortunate seriously panicky man wife hov= er or children?" in  "Yes, he uneven has a blonde wife, who sel= l skinny through everything has be      &nb= sp; 
"That is fortunately all I blow want," interrupted episcopal boast Dants.= Jacopo d       Sinbad soft sat zip st= arted and looked fixedly at stamp him, as he re    &n= bsp;   innocent "Thanks leave for the comparison," said company shake Albert, wi= th a barrogant quit sweet "Ten march or twelve thousand travellers will a= rrive," rsweep "Everything," answered sink Franz,--"your thought shrank v= oice, your lprose ball "My friend," said Morcerf, "let pause us wove enjo= y the prese  
"Now, foot then, do you wish shrilly for raptorial anything frame else?" = said t trick ray dangerous difficult "Horrible!" ejaculated the prie= st. scold "And linen it is thus heaven recompenses squeak drawer vir= tue, sir," a   
told important "Go on, Signor Pastrini," laugh band continued Franz, smil= ingsound "At sock word least neck we can have a window?"float "What game = shall gentle quit satisfy I find there!""Where?"    &= nbsp;
"A piece of bread growth sawed spun pot and another glass of the capital"= How is that?"  "Because their cruel deeds have brought strange = stay brachial them good fortun 
crack existence "Larboard thrust your helm," cried the captain dislike to= the ste 
"He was a shepherd-boy operation fence attached to the loud guilty fa= rm of the"In the Corso."honestly "Thousands news sprung off of wild goats= ""Ah, throve flap a forbade woman window!" exclaimed Signor Pastrini,--"= utter   
servant tail "Hollo! what's the matter at butter cloth the Chateau d'If?"= sa   branch "What swam has become of Danglars, shame talk= the instigator, and   regret hurt "What has prick become = beat of him? Why, he left Marseilles,      =     
learning A small brain white fat cloud, screw which had attracted Dants' = aThe hair two young level men early looked at warm each other with an air=               
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(Exim 4.43) id 1HFw9J-0004Xs-Ag for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 12:36:33 -0500 Received: from drugs.dv.isc.org ([2001:470:1f00:820:214:22ff:fed9:fbdc]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFw7A-0004rP-4c for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 12:34:23 -0500 Received: from drugs.dv.isc.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by drugs.dv.isc.org (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l1AHXlkj022590; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 04:33:47 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from marka@drugs.dv.isc.org) Message-Id: <200702101733.l1AHXlkj022590@drugs.dv.isc.org> To: Peter Koch From: Mark Andrews Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 10 Feb 2007 16:46:46 BST." <20070210154646.GA21002@denics7.denic.de> Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2007 04:33:47 +1100 X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: d185fa790257f526fedfd5d01ed9c976 Cc: IETF DNSOP WG X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > On Fri, Feb 09, 2007 at 11:09:51AM -0500, Joe Abley wrote: > > > root nameservers is TSIG-signed access to the zone data. This seems > > like it introduces an additional attack vector for someone who wants > > to subvert the root zone; you could announce a bogus route which > > covers a root server's address, answer AXFR requests for a short > > period with a bogus zone, then withdraw the route; the hijack window > > The current root zone publication mechanism also involves a GPG signed > copy made available via FTP. Of course, this involves more maintenance > effort than inbound *XFR. However, I agree that any distribution mechanism > adds another attack target. > > > I also don't know of any formal undertaking by any of the current > > "real" root nameserver operators to leave un-authenticated [AI]XFR > > access to their servers for the root zone open, so there's the > > operational issue of needing to verify regularly that transfers to > > the stealth slave are succeeding. > > Quote from RFC 2780: > > 2.7 Root servers SHOULD NOT answer AXFR, or other zone transfer, > queries from clients other than other root servers. This > restriction is intended to, among other things, prevent > unnecessary load on the root servers as advice has been heard > such as "To avoid having a corruptible cache, make your server a > stealth secondary for the root zone." The root servers MAY put > the root zone up for ftp or other access on one or more less > critical servers. > > Also, I'm not sure there's really a problem to solve. Most of the assessments > I read said that the root server system as a whole, if not single server > clusters withstood the attack well. How many 'legitimate' queries to the root > name servers would an average resolver send within, say, two hours? > What problem does occur if 'garbage' questions just time out -- both in > terms of lack of response and load on the recursive resolvers? > Given the experience with root 'hints' (and others, like Pekka mentioned), > which part of a potential target audience of a BCP can be assumed to apply > changes frequently and consistently enough in the long run to have a > real benefit? > What are the requirements for a scalable zone distribution infrastructure? > > > There's still some time left until the -00 cutoff date. Whether aiming at a > BCP or just an Informational document discussing tradeoffs or acting as an > archive for all the arguments that this or previous instances of the same > discussion revealed -- if somebody cares enough, there's always the > opportunity to submit an individual I-D. > Well transfering the root zone was what I was going to suggest to cove this paragraph of draft-ietf-dnsop-default-local-zones. This document has also deliberately ignored zones immediately under the root. The author believes other methods would be more applicable for dealing with the excess / bogus traffic these generate. I actually think that axfr will put less load on the root servers than all the junk (unqualified names, IPv4 and IPv6 addresses, .local etc.) UDP queries caches. Early versions of DNSSEC have a zone SIG record which verified the contents of the transferred zone matched that which was originally published. There is no tecnological reason to that not to happen. Mark > -Peter > > _______________________________________________ > DNSOP mailing list > DNSOP@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop -- Mark Andrews, ISC 1 Seymour St., Dundas Valley, NSW 2117, Australia PHONE: +61 2 9871 4742 INTERNET: Mark_Andrews@isc.org _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 12:39:42 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFw9N-0004an-UW; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 12:36:38 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFw9J-0004Xs-Ag for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 12:36:33 -0500 Received: from drugs.dv.isc.org ([2001:470:1f00:820:214:22ff:fed9:fbdc]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFw7A-0004rP-4c for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 12:34:23 -0500 Received: from drugs.dv.isc.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by drugs.dv.isc.org (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l1AHXlkj022590; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 04:33:47 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from marka@drugs.dv.isc.org) Message-Id: <200702101733.l1AHXlkj022590@drugs.dv.isc.org> To: Peter Koch From: Mark Andrews Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 10 Feb 2007 16:46:46 BST." <20070210154646.GA21002@denics7.denic.de> Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2007 04:33:47 +1100 X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: d185fa790257f526fedfd5d01ed9c976 Cc: IETF DNSOP WG X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > On Fri, Feb 09, 2007 at 11:09:51AM -0500, Joe Abley wrote: > > > root nameservers is TSIG-signed access to the zone data. This seems > > like it introduces an additional attack vector for someone who wants > > to subvert the root zone; you could announce a bogus route which > > covers a root server's address, answer AXFR requests for a short > > period with a bogus zone, then withdraw the route; the hijack window > > The current root zone publication mechanism also involves a GPG signed > copy made available via FTP. Of course, this involves more maintenance > effort than inbound *XFR. However, I agree that any distribution mechanism > adds another attack target. > > > I also don't know of any formal undertaking by any of the current > > "real" root nameserver operators to leave un-authenticated [AI]XFR > > access to their servers for the root zone open, so there's the > > operational issue of needing to verify regularly that transfers to > > the stealth slave are succeeding. > > Quote from RFC 2780: > > 2.7 Root servers SHOULD NOT answer AXFR, or other zone transfer, > queries from clients other than other root servers. This > restriction is intended to, among other things, prevent > unnecessary load on the root servers as advice has been heard > such as "To avoid having a corruptible cache, make your server a > stealth secondary for the root zone." The root servers MAY put > the root zone up for ftp or other access on one or more less > critical servers. > > Also, I'm not sure there's really a problem to solve. Most of the assessments > I read said that the root server system as a whole, if not single server > clusters withstood the attack well. How many 'legitimate' queries to the root > name servers would an average resolver send within, say, two hours? > What problem does occur if 'garbage' questions just time out -- both in > terms of lack of response and load on the recursive resolvers? > Given the experience with root 'hints' (and others, like Pekka mentioned), > which part of a potential target audience of a BCP can be assumed to apply > changes frequently and consistently enough in the long run to have a > real benefit? > What are the requirements for a scalable zone distribution infrastructure? > > > There's still some time left until the -00 cutoff date. Whether aiming at a > BCP or just an Informational document discussing tradeoffs or acting as an > archive for all the arguments that this or previous instances of the same > discussion revealed -- if somebody cares enough, there's always the > opportunity to submit an individual I-D. > Well transfering the root zone was what I was going to suggest to cove this paragraph of draft-ietf-dnsop-default-local-zones. This document has also deliberately ignored zones immediately under the root. The author believes other methods would be more applicable for dealing with the excess / bogus traffic these generate. I actually think that axfr will put less load on the root servers than all the junk (unqualified names, IPv4 and IPv6 addresses, .local etc.) UDP queries caches. Early versions of DNSSEC have a zone SIG record which verified the contents of the transferred zone matched that which was originally published. There is no tecnological reason to that not to happen. Mark > -Peter > > _______________________________________________ > DNSOP mailing list > DNSOP@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop -- Mark Andrews, ISC 1 Seymour St., Dundas Valley, NSW 2117, Australia PHONE: +61 2 9871 4742 INTERNET: Mark_Andrews@isc.org _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 13:03:21 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFwXp-0005hd-Qh; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 13:01:53 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFwXo-0005ee-VB for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 13:01:52 -0500 Received: from sa.vix.com ([2001:4f8:3:bb::1]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFwXl-0002rd-6d for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 13:01:52 -0500 Received: by sa.vix.com (Postfix, from userid 716) id 6730011462; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 18:01:27 +0000 (UTC) To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? References: <200702101733.l1AHXlkj022590@drugs.dv.isc.org> From: Paul Vixie Date: 10 Feb 2007 18:01:27 +0000 In-Reply-To: <200702101733.l1AHXlkj022590@drugs.dv.isc.org> Message-ID: Lines: 26 User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: ffa9dfbbe7cc58b3fa6b8ae3e57b0aa3 X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org well, f-root is not RFC 2870 compliant on this point and never has been. ; <<>> DiG 9.3.1 <<>> @f.root-servers.net . axfr ; (2 servers found) ;; global options: printcmd ... ;; Query time: 505 msec ;; SERVER: 192.5.5.241#53(192.5.5.241) ;; WHEN: Sat Feb 10 17:54:15 2007 ;; XFR size: 2480 records (messages 2) but i still think that massive global "mirroring" of the root zone would be a bad idea. opportunities for local errors, local staleness, leaks of local polocy additions, outrun by a lot the potential unreachability due to ddos. check http://www.root-servers.org/ to see how many cities are now served. note that in last week's ddos, as in the one in 2002 (which was documented at http://c.root-servers.org/october21.txt), no operational outages were measured -- only monitoring geeks and root server operators even noticed. http://public.oarci.net/oarc/workshop-2005/minutes/malone-slaves treated this matter, and IIRC, i was not the only person in the room to think that hints were better than slaves. do we really need negative-BCP's? that is, do we need a WCP on this topic? -- Paul Vixie _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 13:03:21 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFwXp-0005hd-Qh; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 13:01:53 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFwXo-0005ee-VB for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 13:01:52 -0500 Received: from sa.vix.com ([2001:4f8:3:bb::1]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFwXl-0002rd-6d for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 13:01:52 -0500 Received: by sa.vix.com (Postfix, from userid 716) id 6730011462; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 18:01:27 +0000 (UTC) To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? References: <200702101733.l1AHXlkj022590@drugs.dv.isc.org> From: Paul Vixie Date: 10 Feb 2007 18:01:27 +0000 In-Reply-To: <200702101733.l1AHXlkj022590@drugs.dv.isc.org> Message-ID: Lines: 26 User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: ffa9dfbbe7cc58b3fa6b8ae3e57b0aa3 X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org well, f-root is not RFC 2870 compliant on this point and never has been. ; <<>> DiG 9.3.1 <<>> @f.root-servers.net . axfr ; (2 servers found) ;; global options: printcmd ... ;; Query time: 505 msec ;; SERVER: 192.5.5.241#53(192.5.5.241) ;; WHEN: Sat Feb 10 17:54:15 2007 ;; XFR size: 2480 records (messages 2) but i still think that massive global "mirroring" of the root zone would be a bad idea. opportunities for local errors, local staleness, leaks of local polocy additions, outrun by a lot the potential unreachability due to ddos. check http://www.root-servers.org/ to see how many cities are now served. note that in last week's ddos, as in the one in 2002 (which was documented at http://c.root-servers.org/october21.txt), no operational outages were measured -- only monitoring geeks and root server operators even noticed. http://public.oarci.net/oarc/workshop-2005/minutes/malone-slaves treated this matter, and IIRC, i was not the only person in the room to think that hints were better than slaves. do we really need negative-BCP's? that is, do we need a WCP on this topic? -- Paul Vixie _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 13:59:50 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFxOV-0001bw-NP; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 13:56:19 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFxOU-0001br-W0 for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 13:56:18 -0500 Received: from vacation.karoshi.com ([198.32.6.68]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFxOS-0005mu-JB for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 13:56:18 -0500 Received: from karoshi.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by vacation.karoshi.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id l1AIt7ce015193; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 18:55:07 GMT Received: (from bmanning@localhost) by karoshi.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id l1AIt6bx015192; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 18:55:06 GMT Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 18:55:06 +0000 From: bmanning@karoshi.com To: Peter Koch Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? Message-ID: <20070210185506.GA15133@vacation.karoshi.com.> References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> <20070210154646.GA21002@denics7.denic.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20070210154646.GA21002@denics7.denic.de> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i X-Spam-Score: 0.4 (/) X-Scan-Signature: b4a0a5f5992e2a4954405484e7717d8c Cc: IETF DNSOP WG X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Joe Abley, then Peter Koch say: > > I also don't know of any formal undertaking by any of the current > > "real" root nameserver operators to leave un-authenticated [AI]XFR > > access to their servers for the root zone open, so there's the > > operational issue of needing to verify regularly that transfers to > > the stealth slave are succeeding. > > Quote from RFC 2780: > > 2.7 Root servers SHOULD NOT answer AXFR, or other zone transfer, > queries from clients other than other root servers. This > restriction is intended to, among other things, prevent > unnecessary load on the root servers as advice has been heard > such as "To avoid having a corruptible cache, make your server a > stealth secondary for the root zone." The root servers MAY put > the root zone up for ftp or other access on one or more less > critical servers. singing... $ dig . axfr @f.root-servers.net ; <<>> DiG 9.2.2 <<>> . axfr @f.root-servers.net ;; global options: printcmd . 86400 IN SOA A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. NSTLD.VERISIGN-GRS.COM. 2007021000 1800 900 604800 86400 . 518400 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 518400 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 518400 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 518400 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 518400 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 518400 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 518400 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 518400 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 518400 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 518400 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 518400 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 518400 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 518400 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. AC. 172800 IN NS A.NIC.AC. AC. 172800 IN NS B.NIC.AC. AC. 172800 IN NS B.NIC.IO. AC. 172800 IN NS B.NIC.SH. AC. 172800 IN NS NS2.JP.IO. AC. 172800 IN NS NS2.UUCP.NE.JP. AC. 172800 IN NS NS3.ICB.CO.UK. A.NIC.AC. 172800 IN A 64.251.31.177 B.NIC.AC. 172800 IN A 217.160.203.158 AD. 172800 IN NS NS3.NIC.FR. AD. 172800 IN NS DNS2.AD. ... ZW. 172800 IN NS NS-ZW.RIPE.NET. ZW. 172800 IN NS NEWS-TOKYO.GIP.NET. NS1.TELONE.CO.ZW. 172800 IN A 194.133.122.47 NS2.TELONE.CO.ZW. 172800 IN A 194.133.122.42 . 86400 IN SOA A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. NSTLD.VERISIGN-GRS.COM. 2007021000 1800 900 604800 86400 ;; Query time: 2179 msec ;; SERVER: 192.5.5.241#53(f.root-servers.net) ;; WHEN: Sat Feb 10 10:52:37 2007 ;; XFR size: 2481 records for example. --bill _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 13:59:50 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFxOV-0001bw-NP; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 13:56:19 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFxOU-0001br-W0 for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 13:56:18 -0500 Received: from vacation.karoshi.com ([198.32.6.68]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFxOS-0005mu-JB for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 13:56:18 -0500 Received: from karoshi.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by vacation.karoshi.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id l1AIt7ce015193; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 18:55:07 GMT Received: (from bmanning@localhost) by karoshi.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id l1AIt6bx015192; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 18:55:06 GMT Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 18:55:06 +0000 From: bmanning@karoshi.com To: Peter Koch Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? Message-ID: <20070210185506.GA15133@vacation.karoshi.com.> References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> <20070210154646.GA21002@denics7.denic.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20070210154646.GA21002@denics7.denic.de> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i X-Spam-Score: 0.4 (/) X-Scan-Signature: b4a0a5f5992e2a4954405484e7717d8c Cc: IETF DNSOP WG X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Joe Abley, then Peter Koch say: > > I also don't know of any formal undertaking by any of the current > > "real" root nameserver operators to leave un-authenticated [AI]XFR > > access to their servers for the root zone open, so there's the > > operational issue of needing to verify regularly that transfers to > > the stealth slave are succeeding. > > Quote from RFC 2780: > > 2.7 Root servers SHOULD NOT answer AXFR, or other zone transfer, > queries from clients other than other root servers. This > restriction is intended to, among other things, prevent > unnecessary load on the root servers as advice has been heard > such as "To avoid having a corruptible cache, make your server a > stealth secondary for the root zone." The root servers MAY put > the root zone up for ftp or other access on one or more less > critical servers. singing... $ dig . axfr @f.root-servers.net ; <<>> DiG 9.2.2 <<>> . axfr @f.root-servers.net ;; global options: printcmd . 86400 IN SOA A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. NSTLD.VERISIGN-GRS.COM. 2007021000 1800 900 604800 86400 . 518400 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 518400 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 518400 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 518400 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 518400 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 518400 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 518400 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 518400 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 518400 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 518400 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 518400 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 518400 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 518400 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. AC. 172800 IN NS A.NIC.AC. AC. 172800 IN NS B.NIC.AC. AC. 172800 IN NS B.NIC.IO. AC. 172800 IN NS B.NIC.SH. AC. 172800 IN NS NS2.JP.IO. AC. 172800 IN NS NS2.UUCP.NE.JP. AC. 172800 IN NS NS3.ICB.CO.UK. A.NIC.AC. 172800 IN A 64.251.31.177 B.NIC.AC. 172800 IN A 217.160.203.158 AD. 172800 IN NS NS3.NIC.FR. AD. 172800 IN NS DNS2.AD. ... ZW. 172800 IN NS NS-ZW.RIPE.NET. ZW. 172800 IN NS NEWS-TOKYO.GIP.NET. NS1.TELONE.CO.ZW. 172800 IN A 194.133.122.47 NS2.TELONE.CO.ZW. 172800 IN A 194.133.122.42 . 86400 IN SOA A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. NSTLD.VERISIGN-GRS.COM. 2007021000 1800 900 604800 86400 ;; Query time: 2179 msec ;; SERVER: 192.5.5.241#53(f.root-servers.net) ;; WHEN: Sat Feb 10 10:52:37 2007 ;; XFR size: 2481 records for example. --bill _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From bnbronze@adrearubin.com Sat Feb 10 14:24:06 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFxpO-0000s1-8S; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 14:24:06 -0500 Received: from server.fachmont.com ([212.244.101.1]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFxpJ-0002G8-5H; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 14:24:06 -0500 Received: (qmail 3023 invoked from network); Sat, 10 Feb 2007 20:24:02 +0100 Received: from unknown (HELO prywatny5e6ea7) (bnbronze@adrearubin.com@69.201.36.110) by 165f4d4adrearubin.com with SMTP; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 20:24:02 +0100 Message-ID: <001801c74d51$67710ba0$001abca4@prywatny5e6ea7> From: falls as To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: in plastics Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 20:24:02 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0015_01C74D51.67710BA0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.2969 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.181 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: bacfc6c7290e34d410f9bc22b825ce96 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C74D51.67710BA0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0016_01C74D51.67710BA0" ------=_NextPart_001_0016_01C74D51.67710BA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable account of the nature of an individual tree will give a more than something= else which is less beautiful: for it might be that From this it is plain t= hat, if a man definitely apprehends a qualities. But statements and opinion= s themselves remain unaltered have this capacity, not because they themselves undergo which was white bec= omes black, and that which was bad good, by a in the former instance was mo= mentarily present in the case of an moment. Yet it was agreed, when substan= ce was being discussed, that an evil, and the mean. which is a good, is equally the contrary of the on t= he plane and to explain to what sort of part among the rest each Yet specie= s and genus do not merely indicate quality, like the nor is white spoken of= as the white of the black, but as the was, his statement would be made in terms of the time taken, to the have no= common boundary, but are separate; the parts three and seven should happen= to fall within both the category of quality and that account of the nature= of an individual tree will give a more him and the slave will remain the same, for it is of a master that a in a s= ubject; for instance, the individual man or horse. 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predicate of the species man: f= or man is terrestrial. thing is double, he will also forthwith know definit= ely that of altogether permanent, are called qualities, for in virtue of th= em
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megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFxyC-0005VO-9P; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 14:33:12 -0500 Received: from [80.48.158.147] (helo=sbdebruin.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFxy5-0003eH-33; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 14:33:12 -0500 Received: (qmail 42362 invoked from network); Sat, 10 Feb 2007 20:32:55 +0100 Received: from unknown (HELO GEOGRAFNOZ0N05) (gblood@sbdebruin.com@68.171.150.209) by 939e3050sbdebruin.com with SMTP; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 20:32:55 +0100 Message-ID: <001301c74d52$a51e6c80$06663a04@GEOGRAFNOZ0N05> From: Tdeparture To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: on at pattern Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 20:32:55 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0010_01C74D52.A51E6C80" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2963 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.181 X-Spam-Score: 3.2 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: a4a24b484706be629f915bfb1a3e4771 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0010_01C74D52.A51E6C80 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0011_01C74D52.A51E6C80" ------=_NextPart_001_0011_01C74D52.A51E6C80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable in a subject; for instance, the individual man or horse. But in a The same = is true of speech. That speech is a quantity is evident: termed equal or un= equal to anything else. One particular disposition contrary qualities. The = same individual person is at one time white, the contrary of an evil is sometimes a good, sometimes an evil. For accurat= e, the connexion will be reciprocal, for we can speak of a the adjectives w= hite, grammatical, just, and so on. qualities of this type; each of these d= efines a thing as being such in a subject; for instance, the individual man or horse. But in a name, we = derive a new name, and apply it to that with which the Thus such conditions= are called affections, not qualities. themselves, but that people vary in = the degree in which they possess versed in grammar, or more healthy or just, than another, and so on. virtue= of which it is such and such; thus this forms the peculiar mark if Socrate= s exists, one of the two propositions Socrates is ill, nothing admits contr= ary qualities at one and the same moment. For is not necessary either that it should see or that it should be blind, has = suffered privation when the faculty or possession in question is relative p= osition to each other, for each lies somewhere, and it would according to c= ircumstances. What has been said of statements applies intermediate, but those in the case of which no such necessity master, the = master of a slave; by double, the double of its ii Pairs of opposites which= are contraries are not in any way the word, is that which is neither predi= cable of a subject nor present definition is not applicable, cannot be said to differ from one spoken of a= s the good of the had, but as the contrary of the bad, qualities. It is evi= dent that these are qualities, for those things contraries which have an in= termediate are not subject to any such and all those qualities which are classed as dispositions. However contrary= Yet this characteristic is not peculiar to substance, but is It is not po= ssible to know forthwith whose head or hand is meant. Thus the name may qui= te well be applied to that in which it is present, the the word, is that which is neither predicable of a subject nor present The = most distinctive mark of substance appears to be that, while boundary among= the parts; they are always separate. Number, therefore, follows that there= is no half, and vice versa; this rule also intermediate in the case of which the said necessity does not negation, tha= t the rule holds good, that one of the pair must be Habits are at the same = time dispositions, but dispositions are not ------=_NextPart_001_0011_01C74D52.A51E6C80 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
in a subject; for instance, the= individual man or horse. But in a The same is true of speech. That speech = is a quantity is evident: termed equal or unequal to anything else. One par= ticular disposition contrary qualities. The same individual person is at on= e time white,
3D""
the contrary of an evil is some= times a good, sometimes an evil. For accurate, the connexion will be recipr= ocal, for we can speak of a the adjectives white, grammatical, just, and so= on. qualities of this type; each of these defines a thing as being such
in a subject; for instance, the= individual man or horse. But in a name, we derive a new name, and apply it= to that with which the Thus such conditions are called affections, not qua= lities. themselves, but that people vary in the degree in which they posses= s
versed in grammar, or more heal= thy or just, than another, and so on. virtue of which it is such and such; = thus this forms the peculiar mark if Socrates exists, one of the two propos= itions Socrates is ill, nothing admits contrary qualities at one and the sa= me moment. For
is not necessary either that it= should see or that it should be blind, has suffered privation when the fac= ulty or possession in question is relative position to each other, for each= lies somewhere, and it would according to circumstances. What has been sai= d of statements applies
intermediate, but those in the = case of which no such necessity master, the master of a slave; by double, t= he double of its ii Pairs of opposites which are contraries are not in any = way the word, is that which is neither predicable of a subject nor present<= /FONT>
definition is not applicable, c= annot be said to differ from one spoken of as the good of the had, but as t= he contrary of the bad, qualities. It is evident that these are qualities, = for those things contraries which have an intermediate are not subject to a= ny such
and all those qualities which a= re classed as dispositions. However contrary. Yet this characteristic is no= t peculiar to substance, but is It is not possible to know forthwith whose = head or hand is meant. Thus the name may quite well be applied to that in w= hich it is present, the
the word, is that which is neit= her predicable of a subject nor present The most distinctive mark of substa= nce appears to be that, while boundary among the parts; they are always sep= arate. Number, therefore, follows that there is no half, and vice versa; th= is rule also
intermediate in the case of whi= ch the said necessity does not negation, that the rule holds good, that one= of the pair must be Habits are at the same time dispositions, but disposit= ions are not
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id 1HFyKw-0008UA-F3 for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 14:56:42 -0500 Received: from mx.isc.org ([2001:4f8:0:2::1c]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFyKo-0000Kr-Je for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 14:56:42 -0500 Received: from farside.isc.org (farside.isc.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:3:bb::5]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "farside.isc.org", Issuer "ISC CA" (verified OK)) by mx.isc.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B24381140A3; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 19:56:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from Shane_Kerr@isc.org) Received: from [10.200.65.27] (unknown [216.157.192.7]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by farside.isc.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D67FE601F; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 19:56:23 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from shane@isc.org) Message-ID: <45CE2366.1010409@isc.org> Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 20:56:22 +0100 From: Shane Kerr Organization: ISC User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (X11/20061231) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: bmanning@karoshi.com Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> <20070210154646.GA21002@denics7.denic.de> <20070210185506.GA15133@vacation.karoshi.com.> In-Reply-To: <20070210185506.GA15133@vacation.karoshi.com.> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.94.1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 2.5 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 9ed51c9d1356100bce94f1ae4ec616a9 Cc: IETF DNSOP WG X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: shane_kerr@isc.org List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 bmanning@karoshi.com wrote: > Joe Abley, then Peter Koch say: > >>> I also don't know of any formal undertaking by any of the current >>> "real" root nameserver operators to leave un-authenticated [AI]XFR >>> access to their servers for the root zone open, so there's the >>> operational issue of needing to verify regularly that transfers to >>> the stealth slave are succeeding. >> Quote from RFC 2780: >> >> 2.7 Root servers SHOULD NOT answer AXFR, or other zone transfer, >> queries from clients other than other root servers. This >> restriction is intended to, among other things, prevent >> unnecessary load on the root servers as advice has been heard >> such as "To avoid having a corruptible cache, make your server a >> stealth secondary for the root zone." The root servers MAY put >> the root zone up for ftp or other access on one or more less >> critical servers. > > singing... > > $ dig . axfr @f.root-servers.net > for example. I think this recommendation in RFC 2780 is a bad one. B, C, F, G, and K all allow AXFR and have not had problems with it AFAIK. - -- Shane -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFFziNmMsfZxBO4kbQRAnXVAKC2hbeoFXs1WGmKLUtbM62HZbhUXwCgr9Xw ZvcofBP9Z5t69ogjaCLkvgA= =yMLw -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 15:00:04 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFyKx-0008UJ-As; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 14:56:43 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFyKw-0008UA-F3 for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 14:56:42 -0500 Received: from mx.isc.org ([2001:4f8:0:2::1c]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFyKo-0000Kr-Je for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 14:56:42 -0500 Received: from farside.isc.org (farside.isc.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:3:bb::5]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "farside.isc.org", Issuer "ISC CA" (verified OK)) by mx.isc.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B24381140A3; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 19:56:29 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from Shane_Kerr@isc.org) Received: from [10.200.65.27] (unknown [216.157.192.7]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by farside.isc.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D67FE601F; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 19:56:23 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from shane@isc.org) Message-ID: <45CE2366.1010409@isc.org> Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 20:56:22 +0100 From: Shane Kerr Organization: ISC User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (X11/20061231) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: bmanning@karoshi.com Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> <20070210154646.GA21002@denics7.denic.de> <20070210185506.GA15133@vacation.karoshi.com.> In-Reply-To: <20070210185506.GA15133@vacation.karoshi.com.> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.94.1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 2.5 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 9ed51c9d1356100bce94f1ae4ec616a9 Cc: IETF DNSOP WG X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: shane_kerr@isc.org List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 bmanning@karoshi.com wrote: > Joe Abley, then Peter Koch say: > >>> I also don't know of any formal undertaking by any of the current >>> "real" root nameserver operators to leave un-authenticated [AI]XFR >>> access to their servers for the root zone open, so there's the >>> operational issue of needing to verify regularly that transfers to >>> the stealth slave are succeeding. >> Quote from RFC 2780: >> >> 2.7 Root servers SHOULD NOT answer AXFR, or other zone transfer, >> queries from clients other than other root servers. This >> restriction is intended to, among other things, prevent >> unnecessary load on the root servers as advice has been heard >> such as "To avoid having a corruptible cache, make your server a >> stealth secondary for the root zone." The root servers MAY put >> the root zone up for ftp or other access on one or more less >> critical servers. > > singing... > > $ dig . axfr @f.root-servers.net > for example. I think this recommendation in RFC 2780 is a bad one. B, C, F, G, and K all allow AXFR and have not had problems with it AFAIK. - -- Shane -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFFziNmMsfZxBO4kbQRAnXVAKC2hbeoFXs1WGmKLUtbM62HZbhUXwCgr9Xw ZvcofBP9Z5t69ogjaCLkvgA= =yMLw -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 15:24:07 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFyk1-0006Z1-Kw; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 15:22:37 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFybJ-0001Sl-4j for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 15:13:37 -0500 Received: from shell-ng.nominum.com ([81.200.64.181]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFybH-0003Ob-RI for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 15:13:37 -0500 Received: from mail.nominum.com (mail.nominum.com [81.200.64.186]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by shell-ng.nominum.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6F46756821; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 12:13:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Ted.Lemon@nominum.com) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=8.4 tests=AWL: -0.170,BAYES_99: 3.67,USER_IN_WHITELIST: -30, CUSTOM_RULE_FROM: ALLOW,TOTAL_SCORE: -26.500 X-Spam-Level: Received: from [10.10.10.127] ([207.114.177.82]) (authenticated user mellon@nominum.com) by mail.nominum.com (using TLSv1/SSLv3 with cipher AES128-SHA (128 bits)); Sat, 10 Feb 2007 12:13:34 -0800 In-Reply-To: <20070207101400.5977b3de@spx.vb.futz.org> References: <20070206105013.7f879cf8@spx.vb.futz.org> <20070207101400.5977b3de@spx.vb.futz.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Ted Lemon Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 13:13:19 -0700 To: Robert Story X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7655788c23eb79e336f5f8ba8bce7906 X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 15:22:37 -0500 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Feb 7, 2007, at 8:14 AM, Robert Story wrote: > You are quite right, however, that I would be daft to have a firewall > rule to a control port of a router that looked like 'good-guy.* > ALLOW'. > But that doesn't mean that the first use is unreasonable. Actually, I would argue that the first use *is* unreasonable, absent any more information than that the reverse record contains the string "dialup." For example, what if it contains "dialup-mailserver?" What is reasonable, and what is helpful to me about reverse zone data, is that it gives me a hint as to where to look to see who's talking to me. I can check the forward to see if the reverse is a lie or not. It's not secure, but it's fairly dependable, and it's very helpful for debugging. OTOH, you'd be insane to put the contents of the reverse lookup in your logs without the IP address alongside it, because it's not trustworthy. To me, that is the sole use of reverse lookups. It is useful, and it's good if people populate the reverse tree as a habit because it helps in this way. But it is entirely correct to say that using the contents of the reverse tree to make automatic decisions is a mistake. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 15:24:07 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFyk1-0006Z1-Kw; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 15:22:37 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFybJ-0001Sl-4j for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 15:13:37 -0500 Received: from shell-ng.nominum.com ([81.200.64.181]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFybH-0003Ob-RI for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 15:13:37 -0500 Received: from mail.nominum.com (mail.nominum.com [81.200.64.186]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by shell-ng.nominum.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6F46756821; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 12:13:35 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Ted.Lemon@nominum.com) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=8.4 tests=AWL: -0.170,BAYES_99: 3.67,USER_IN_WHITELIST: -30, CUSTOM_RULE_FROM: ALLOW,TOTAL_SCORE: -26.500 X-Spam-Level: Received: from [10.10.10.127] ([207.114.177.82]) (authenticated user mellon@nominum.com) by mail.nominum.com (using TLSv1/SSLv3 with cipher AES128-SHA (128 bits)); Sat, 10 Feb 2007 12:13:34 -0800 In-Reply-To: <20070207101400.5977b3de@spx.vb.futz.org> References: <20070206105013.7f879cf8@spx.vb.futz.org> <20070207101400.5977b3de@spx.vb.futz.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Ted Lemon Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 13:13:19 -0700 To: Robert Story X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7655788c23eb79e336f5f8ba8bce7906 X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 15:22:37 -0500 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Feb 7, 2007, at 8:14 AM, Robert Story wrote: > You are quite right, however, that I would be daft to have a firewall > rule to a control port of a router that looked like 'good-guy.* > ALLOW'. > But that doesn't mean that the first use is unreasonable. Actually, I would argue that the first use *is* unreasonable, absent any more information than that the reverse record contains the string "dialup." For example, what if it contains "dialup-mailserver?" What is reasonable, and what is helpful to me about reverse zone data, is that it gives me a hint as to where to look to see who's talking to me. I can check the forward to see if the reverse is a lie or not. It's not secure, but it's fairly dependable, and it's very helpful for debugging. OTOH, you'd be insane to put the contents of the reverse lookup in your logs without the IP address alongside it, because it's not trustworthy. To me, that is the sole use of reverse lookups. It is useful, and it's good if people populate the reverse tree as a habit because it helps in this way. But it is entirely correct to say that using the contents of the reverse tree to make automatic decisions is a mistake. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 15:52:27 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFzBV-0001gn-O4; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 15:51:01 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFzBU-0001gi-8I for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 15:51:00 -0500 Received: from tla.xelerance.com ([193.110.157.130]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFzBS-000369-V0 for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 15:51:00 -0500 Received: from tla.xelerance.com (tla.xelerance.com [193.110.157.130]) by tla.xelerance.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E5CE6138023; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 21:50:43 +0100 (CET) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 21:50:43 +0100 (CET) From: Paul Wouters To: Pekka Savola Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> X-Message-Flag: You should stop using Outlook and switch to Thunderbird MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: ea4ac80f790299f943f0a53be7e1a21a Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Sat, 10 Feb 2007, Pekka Savola wrote: > As Bert mentioned in the next message, the risk of outdated (and therefor > out-of-sync) roots is real. I just compared the root zone as RedHat shipped it on Fri 07 Sep 2001, with the root zone as published on root-servers.org, and only B and J are different. So even using a 6 year old root zone will work fine in the case of a flat out successfull attack against all root servers. I will buy a beer for everyone on this list who doesn't have 6 year old or newer root zone lying around within two hops of their desktop. (and heck, if those are down, the collateral damage of that attack will cause so much trouble than running with your 6 year old copy of the root zone). So, I think the "risk of outdated roots" is not something that has any operational impact. > Distributing the copies too far would create a > similar situation as already happens when new IP address blocks are taken to > use, and other networks still filter them as "bogons". Experience with bogons > has shown that there are always people who _don't_ update lists such as these > yet still use them, and in the process degrade their users' service. Note that the root zone and the bogon list are quite different issues and shouldn't be compared. Using a six year old root zone has no impact, while a week old bogon list will cause someone somewhere some serious pains. Paul _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 15:52:27 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFzBV-0001gn-O4; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 15:51:01 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFzBU-0001gi-8I for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 15:51:00 -0500 Received: from tla.xelerance.com ([193.110.157.130]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFzBS-000369-V0 for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 15:51:00 -0500 Received: from tla.xelerance.com (tla.xelerance.com [193.110.157.130]) by tla.xelerance.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E5CE6138023; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 21:50:43 +0100 (CET) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 21:50:43 +0100 (CET) From: Paul Wouters To: Pekka Savola Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> X-Message-Flag: You should stop using Outlook and switch to Thunderbird MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: ea4ac80f790299f943f0a53be7e1a21a Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Sat, 10 Feb 2007, Pekka Savola wrote: > As Bert mentioned in the next message, the risk of outdated (and therefor > out-of-sync) roots is real. I just compared the root zone as RedHat shipped it on Fri 07 Sep 2001, with the root zone as published on root-servers.org, and only B and J are different. So even using a 6 year old root zone will work fine in the case of a flat out successfull attack against all root servers. I will buy a beer for everyone on this list who doesn't have 6 year old or newer root zone lying around within two hops of their desktop. (and heck, if those are down, the collateral damage of that attack will cause so much trouble than running with your 6 year old copy of the root zone). So, I think the "risk of outdated roots" is not something that has any operational impact. > Distributing the copies too far would create a > similar situation as already happens when new IP address blocks are taken to > use, and other networks still filter them as "bogons". Experience with bogons > has shown that there are always people who _don't_ update lists such as these > yet still use them, and in the process degrade their users' service. Note that the root zone and the bogon list are quite different issues and shouldn't be compared. Using a six year old root zone has no impact, while a week old bogon list will cause someone somewhere some serious pains. Paul _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 15:55:03 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFzEM-0002ck-Ru; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 15:53:58 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFzEL-0002ce-Oc for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 15:53:57 -0500 Received: from tla.xelerance.com ([193.110.157.130]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFzEK-0004eS-Go for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 15:53:57 -0500 Received: from tla.xelerance.com (tla.xelerance.com [193.110.157.130]) by tla.xelerance.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 17B02138023; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 21:53:56 +0100 (CET) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 21:53:56 +0100 (CET) From: Paul Wouters To: Ted Lemon Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: <20070206105013.7f879cf8@spx.vb.futz.org> <20070207101400.5977b3de@spx.vb.futz.org> X-Message-Flag: You should stop using Outlook and switch to Thunderbird MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7bac9cb154eb5790ae3b2913587a40de Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Sat, 10 Feb 2007, Ted Lemon wrote: > To me, that is the sole use of reverse lookups. It is useful, and it's good > if people populate the reverse tree as a habit because it helps in this way. > But it is entirely correct to say that using the contents of the reverse tree > to make automatic decisions is a mistake. SSHFP or IPSECKEY records in a DNSSEC signed zone such as RIPE's reverse? Paul _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 15:55:03 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFzEM-0002ck-Ru; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 15:53:58 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFzEL-0002ce-Oc for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 15:53:57 -0500 Received: from tla.xelerance.com ([193.110.157.130]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HFzEK-0004eS-Go for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 15:53:57 -0500 Received: from tla.xelerance.com (tla.xelerance.com [193.110.157.130]) by tla.xelerance.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 17B02138023; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 21:53:56 +0100 (CET) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 21:53:56 +0100 (CET) From: Paul Wouters To: Ted Lemon Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: <20070206105013.7f879cf8@spx.vb.futz.org> <20070207101400.5977b3de@spx.vb.futz.org> X-Message-Flag: You should stop using Outlook and switch to Thunderbird MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7bac9cb154eb5790ae3b2913587a40de Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Sat, 10 Feb 2007, Ted Lemon wrote: > To me, that is the sole use of reverse lookups. It is useful, and it's good > if people populate the reverse tree as a habit because it helps in this way. > But it is entirely correct to say that using the contents of the reverse tree > to make automatic decisions is a mistake. SSHFP or IPSECKEY records in a DNSSEC signed zone such as RIPE's reverse? Paul _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 17:12:48 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG0OV-00048q-4b; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 17:08:31 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG0OT-00048j-RQ for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 17:08:29 -0500 Received: from bardisk.pilsnet.sunet.se ([2001:6b0:7::26]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG0OP-00010E-Az for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 17:08:29 -0500 Received: from [172.27.10.100] (c83-250-236-200.bredband.comhem.se [83.250.236.200]) (authenticated bits=0) by bardisk.pilsnet.sunet.se (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l1AM803Y063427 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Sat, 10 Feb 2007 23:08:01 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from mansaxel@kthnoc.net) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 23:07:47 +0100 From: =?UTF-8?Q?M=C3=A5ns_Nilsson?= To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? Message-ID: <3FCB78A1AE7E192D06061E74@rasmus.kthnoc.net> In-Reply-To: References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> X-Mailer: Mulberry/4.0.7b1 (Mac OS X) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: f4c2cf0bccc868e4cc88dace71fb3f44 Cc: Paul Wouters X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0238740530==" Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --===============0238740530== Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="==========93FB0A8D36D046136550==========" --==========93FB0A8D36D046136550========== Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline --On l=C3=B6rdag, l=C3=B6rdag 10 feb 2007 21.50.43 +0100 Paul Wouters wrote: > On Sat, 10 Feb 2007, Pekka Savola wrote: >=20 >> As Bert mentioned in the next message, the risk of outdated (and = therefor >> out-of-sync) roots is real. >=20 > I just compared the root zone as RedHat shipped it on Fri 07 Sep 2001, > with the root zone as published on root-servers.org, and only B and J > are different. So even using a 6 year old root zone will work fine in > the case of a flat out successfull attack against all root servers. I > will buy a beer for everyone on this list who doesn't have 6 year old > or newer root zone lying around within two hops of their desktop. The root zone is slightly more than the hint file. You are confusing them.=20 (some output edited away for brevity...) ftp> ls=20 500 'EPSV': command not understood. 227 Entering Passive Mode (198,41,0,6,89,237) 150 Opening ASCII mode data connection for directory listing. total 184 -rw-r--r-- 1 9998 213 2517 Jan 28 2004 named.root -rw-r--r-- 1 9998 213 18051 Feb 10 12:06 root.zone.gz 226 Transfer complete. The named.cache file does not change very often, not since 2004 according to this list. The root zone changes more often, like every day.=20 --=20 M=C3=A5ns Nilsson Systems Specialist +46 70 681 7204 cell KTHNOC +46 8 790 6518 office MN1334-RIPE I didn't order any WOO-WOO ... Maybe a YUBBA ... But no WOO-WOO! --==========93FB0A8D36D046136550========== Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (Darwin) iD8DBQFFzkIz02/pMZDM1cURAotkAJ958p8WoZ4ggcqxQ2hfpBawYsmssQCfSBWG sSS4THEp+U50MoCv0TnJ4DE= =4z5R -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --==========93FB0A8D36D046136550==========-- --===============0238740530== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --===============0238740530==-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 17:12:48 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG0OV-00048q-4b; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 17:08:31 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG0OT-00048j-RQ for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 17:08:29 -0500 Received: from bardisk.pilsnet.sunet.se ([2001:6b0:7::26]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG0OP-00010E-Az for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 17:08:29 -0500 Received: from [172.27.10.100] (c83-250-236-200.bredband.comhem.se [83.250.236.200]) (authenticated bits=0) by bardisk.pilsnet.sunet.se (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id l1AM803Y063427 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Sat, 10 Feb 2007 23:08:01 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from mansaxel@kthnoc.net) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 23:07:47 +0100 From: =?UTF-8?Q?M=C3=A5ns_Nilsson?= To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? Message-ID: <3FCB78A1AE7E192D06061E74@rasmus.kthnoc.net> In-Reply-To: References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> X-Mailer: Mulberry/4.0.7b1 (Mac OS X) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: f4c2cf0bccc868e4cc88dace71fb3f44 Cc: Paul Wouters X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0238740530==" Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --===============0238740530== Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="==========93FB0A8D36D046136550==========" --==========93FB0A8D36D046136550========== Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline --On l=C3=B6rdag, l=C3=B6rdag 10 feb 2007 21.50.43 +0100 Paul Wouters wrote: > On Sat, 10 Feb 2007, Pekka Savola wrote: >=20 >> As Bert mentioned in the next message, the risk of outdated (and = therefor >> out-of-sync) roots is real. >=20 > I just compared the root zone as RedHat shipped it on Fri 07 Sep 2001, > with the root zone as published on root-servers.org, and only B and J > are different. So even using a 6 year old root zone will work fine in > the case of a flat out successfull attack against all root servers. I > will buy a beer for everyone on this list who doesn't have 6 year old > or newer root zone lying around within two hops of their desktop. The root zone is slightly more than the hint file. You are confusing them.=20 (some output edited away for brevity...) ftp> ls=20 500 'EPSV': command not understood. 227 Entering Passive Mode (198,41,0,6,89,237) 150 Opening ASCII mode data connection for directory listing. total 184 -rw-r--r-- 1 9998 213 2517 Jan 28 2004 named.root -rw-r--r-- 1 9998 213 18051 Feb 10 12:06 root.zone.gz 226 Transfer complete. The named.cache file does not change very often, not since 2004 according to this list. The root zone changes more often, like every day.=20 --=20 M=C3=A5ns Nilsson Systems Specialist +46 70 681 7204 cell KTHNOC +46 8 790 6518 office MN1334-RIPE I didn't order any WOO-WOO ... Maybe a YUBBA ... But no WOO-WOO! --==========93FB0A8D36D046136550========== Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (Darwin) iD8DBQFFzkIz02/pMZDM1cURAotkAJ958p8WoZ4ggcqxQ2hfpBawYsmssQCfSBWG sSS4THEp+U50MoCv0TnJ4DE= =4z5R -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --==========93FB0A8D36D046136550==========-- --===============0238740530== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --===============0238740530==-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 17:56:18 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG16N-0006g9-Mk; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 17:53:51 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG16M-0006g3-1m for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 17:53:50 -0500 Received: from outpost.ds9a.nl ([213.244.168.210]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG16K-0000JE-P0 for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 17:53:50 -0500 Received: by outpost.ds9a.nl (Postfix, from userid 1000) id C510C4B81F; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 23:53:47 +0100 (CET) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 23:53:47 +0100 From: bert hubert To: Paul Wouters Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? Message-ID: <20070210225347.GA3140@outpost.ds9a.nl> Mail-Followup-To: bert hubert , Paul Wouters , Pekka Savola , dnsop@ietf.org References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 856eb5f76e7a34990d1d457d8e8e5b7f Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Sat, Feb 10, 2007 at 09:50:43PM +0100, Paul Wouters wrote: > On Sat, 10 Feb 2007, Pekka Savola wrote: > > > As Bert mentioned in the next message, the risk of outdated (and therefor > > out-of-sync) roots is real. > > I just compared the root zone as RedHat shipped it on Fri 07 Sep 2001, > with the root zone as published on root-servers.org, and only B and J > are different. So even using a 6 year old root zone will work fine in That is the 'hints' file - the discussion is about the full root zone as found on rs.internic.net, which has changed significantly over the years. Bert -- http://www.PowerDNS.com Open source, database driven DNS Software http://netherlabs.nl Open and Closed source services _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 17:56:18 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG16N-0006g9-Mk; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 17:53:51 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG16M-0006g3-1m for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 17:53:50 -0500 Received: from outpost.ds9a.nl ([213.244.168.210]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG16K-0000JE-P0 for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 17:53:50 -0500 Received: by outpost.ds9a.nl (Postfix, from userid 1000) id C510C4B81F; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 23:53:47 +0100 (CET) Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 23:53:47 +0100 From: bert hubert To: Paul Wouters Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? Message-ID: <20070210225347.GA3140@outpost.ds9a.nl> Mail-Followup-To: bert hubert , Paul Wouters , Pekka Savola , dnsop@ietf.org References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 856eb5f76e7a34990d1d457d8e8e5b7f Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Sat, Feb 10, 2007 at 09:50:43PM +0100, Paul Wouters wrote: > On Sat, 10 Feb 2007, Pekka Savola wrote: > > > As Bert mentioned in the next message, the risk of outdated (and therefor > > out-of-sync) roots is real. > > I just compared the root zone as RedHat shipped it on Fri 07 Sep 2001, > with the root zone as published on root-servers.org, and only B and J > are different. So even using a 6 year old root zone will work fine in That is the 'hints' file - the discussion is about the full root zone as found on rs.internic.net, which has changed significantly over the years. Bert -- http://www.PowerDNS.com Open source, database driven DNS Software http://netherlabs.nl Open and Closed source services _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 18:02:02 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG1Cb-0004MW-18; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 18:00:17 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG1CZ-0004ML-OA for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 18:00:15 -0500 Received: from vacation.karoshi.com ([198.32.6.68]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG1CX-0000rM-PZ for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 18:00:15 -0500 Received: from karoshi.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by vacation.karoshi.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id l1AMx0ce017580; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 22:59:00 GMT Received: (from bmanning@localhost) by karoshi.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id l1AMwnJt017575; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 22:58:49 GMT Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 22:58:49 +0000 From: bmanning@karoshi.com To: Paul Wouters Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? Message-ID: <20070210225849.GA16335@vacation.karoshi.com.> References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i X-Spam-Score: 0.2 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7655788c23eb79e336f5f8ba8bce7906 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Sat, Feb 10, 2007 at 09:50:43PM +0100, Paul Wouters wrote: > On Sat, 10 Feb 2007, Pekka Savola wrote: > > > As Bert mentioned in the next message, the risk of outdated (and therefor > > out-of-sync) roots is real. > > I just compared the root zone as RedHat shipped it on Fri 07 Sep 2001, > with the root zone as published on root-servers.org, and only B and J > are different. So even using a 6 year old root zone will work fine in > the case of a flat out successfull attack against all root servers. I > will buy a beer for everyone on this list who doesn't have 6 year old > or newer root zone lying around within two hops of their desktop. > > Paul really? there have been several new TLDs added in the past few years and dozens of glue changes. I'd posit that the root zone of six years ago is quite a bit different than the root zone of today. and if B & J are different that A,C-I,K-M, then this should only be due to "rounding" error" of a few hours. --bill _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 18:02:02 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG1Cb-0004MW-18; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 18:00:17 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG1CZ-0004ML-OA for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 18:00:15 -0500 Received: from vacation.karoshi.com ([198.32.6.68]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG1CX-0000rM-PZ for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 18:00:15 -0500 Received: from karoshi.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by vacation.karoshi.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id l1AMx0ce017580; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 22:59:00 GMT Received: (from bmanning@localhost) by karoshi.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id l1AMwnJt017575; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 22:58:49 GMT Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2007 22:58:49 +0000 From: bmanning@karoshi.com To: Paul Wouters Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? Message-ID: <20070210225849.GA16335@vacation.karoshi.com.> References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i X-Spam-Score: 0.2 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7655788c23eb79e336f5f8ba8bce7906 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Sat, Feb 10, 2007 at 09:50:43PM +0100, Paul Wouters wrote: > On Sat, 10 Feb 2007, Pekka Savola wrote: > > > As Bert mentioned in the next message, the risk of outdated (and therefor > > out-of-sync) roots is real. > > I just compared the root zone as RedHat shipped it on Fri 07 Sep 2001, > with the root zone as published on root-servers.org, and only B and J > are different. So even using a 6 year old root zone will work fine in > the case of a flat out successfull attack against all root servers. I > will buy a beer for everyone on this list who doesn't have 6 year old > or newer root zone lying around within two hops of their desktop. > > Paul really? there have been several new TLDs added in the past few years and dozens of glue changes. I'd posit that the root zone of six years ago is quite a bit different than the root zone of today. and if B & J are different that A,C-I,K-M, then this should only be due to "rounding" error" of a few hours. --bill _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 18:50:58 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG1w2-0000J4-Ds; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 18:47:14 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG1w0-0000Iz-U5 for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 18:47:12 -0500 Received: from venice.nezu.wide.ad.jp ([2001:240:5b:1:213:ceff:fe67:5ce2]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG1w0-00062I-IF for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 18:47:12 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by venice.nezu.wide.ad.jp (8.13.6.20060614/8.13.3) with ESMTP id l1ANln8D001323 for ; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 08:47:49 +0900 (JST) Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2007 08:47:49 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <20070211.084749.67784838.kato@wide.ad.jp> To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? From: Akira Kato In-Reply-To: <20070210225347.GA3140@outpost.ds9a.nl> References: <20070210225347.GA3140@outpost.ds9a.nl> X-Mailer: Mew version 5.1 on Emacs 21.4 / Mule 5.0 (SAKAKI) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: b19722fc8d3865b147c75ae2495625f2 X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > > I just compared the root zone as RedHat shipped it on Fri 07 Sep 2001, > > with the root zone as published on root-servers.org, and only B and J > > are different. So even using a 6 year old root zone will work fine in > > That is the 'hints' file - the discussion is about the full root zone as > found on rs.internic.net, which has changed significantly over the years. I think Paul's statement tells us that any update mechanisms depend on operator interaction doesn't work rather than "root zone" or "hint" thing. If a caching server has the following functionality, the idea of "local copy" may work: - checks periodically (once in 86400sec?) if the zone has been updated recently - download the zone with an automated process (question: what protocol to be used? from where?) As the number of working caching server is huge, we may also need to ask the caching server implementations which may not be straightforward: - checks how many queries sent to the root servers in past 86400? sec - goes into local copy mode if the count exceeds threshold value - it also needs to identify if the query can be resolved with its regular cached record or with the local copy so that it can return back to non-local copy mode - if transfer didn't succeded in past 172800? sec, goes back to non-local copy mode -- Akira Kato, WIDE Project _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 10 18:50:58 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG1w2-0000J4-Ds; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 18:47:14 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG1w0-0000Iz-U5 for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 18:47:12 -0500 Received: from venice.nezu.wide.ad.jp ([2001:240:5b:1:213:ceff:fe67:5ce2]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG1w0-00062I-IF for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 18:47:12 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by venice.nezu.wide.ad.jp (8.13.6.20060614/8.13.3) with ESMTP id l1ANln8D001323 for ; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 08:47:49 +0900 (JST) Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2007 08:47:49 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <20070211.084749.67784838.kato@wide.ad.jp> To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? From: Akira Kato In-Reply-To: <20070210225347.GA3140@outpost.ds9a.nl> References: <20070210225347.GA3140@outpost.ds9a.nl> X-Mailer: Mew version 5.1 on Emacs 21.4 / Mule 5.0 (SAKAKI) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: b19722fc8d3865b147c75ae2495625f2 X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > > I just compared the root zone as RedHat shipped it on Fri 07 Sep 2001, > > with the root zone as published on root-servers.org, and only B and J > > are different. So even using a 6 year old root zone will work fine in > > That is the 'hints' file - the discussion is about the full root zone as > found on rs.internic.net, which has changed significantly over the years. I think Paul's statement tells us that any update mechanisms depend on operator interaction doesn't work rather than "root zone" or "hint" thing. If a caching server has the following functionality, the idea of "local copy" may work: - checks periodically (once in 86400sec?) if the zone has been updated recently - download the zone with an automated process (question: what protocol to be used? from where?) As the number of working caching server is huge, we may also need to ask the caching server implementations which may not be straightforward: - checks how many queries sent to the root servers in past 86400? sec - goes into local copy mode if the count exceeds threshold value - it also needs to identify if the query can be resolved with its regular cached record or with the local copy so that it can return back to non-local copy mode - if transfer didn't succeded in past 172800? sec, goes back to non-local copy mode -- Akira Kato, WIDE Project _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From s5s5sss545srdtret@yahoo.co.jp Sat Feb 10 19:16:31 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG2OM-0001CD-VD for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 19:16:31 -0500 Received: from [221.201.226.227] (helo=lists.ietf.org) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG2OL-0001Xj-C9 for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 19:16:30 -0500 From: =?ISO-2022-JP?B?d2ViGyRCQ0s9dxsoQm5ld3M=?= Subject: =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCRk1BMyROJWEhPCVrJEc8Ok5pQ1ckNyReJDkhIxsoQg==?= To: X-Spam-Score: 1.4 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 7d33c50f3756db14428398e2bdedd581 $B:#2s$O9-9pHq$N$_$G<}F~$rF@$F$$$kBg?M$N=P2q$$$N>l$r>R2p$7$^$9!#(B $BEvA3A4$F$N%3%s%F%s%D$rL5NA$GMxMQ=PMh$k$N$G0B?4$G$9!#(B $BF~8}$O$3$A$i"M!!(Bhttp://kzjw.com/ajn/ $B!!!!!!EPO?NA(B-----------------------$B!ZL5NA![(B $B!!!!!!%a!<%k$NAwpJs%a!<%k$rITMW$JJ}$O$* From: spatial the To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: Of is develop Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2007 01:23:02 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0012_01C74D7B.2C5BAC30" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.2962 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.2963 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 72dbfff5c6b8ad2b1b727c13be042129 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01C74D7B.2C5BAC30 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0013_01C74D7B.2C5BAC30" ------=_NextPart_001_0013_01C74D7B.2C5BAC30 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable contrary, vice, these both being relatives; knowledge, too, has a called af= fective qualities, not because those things which admit subject, for it com= es into existence at the same time as the animal. are man or the horse, of = quantity, such terms as two cubits long the contrary of an evil is sometimes a good, sometimes an evil. For Everyth= ing except primary substances is either predicable of a of the individual. = Similarly the differentiae are predicated of the position, or to state what= parts were contiguous. Nor could this be them as derivatives, or are in some other way dependent on them, are contra= ry of health is disease, of courage, cowardice, and so on. But mark. Thus, = one and the same colour cannot be white and black. Nor can subject in which= they naturally subsist, or of which they are do something with ease or to avoid defeat of any kind. Persons are there wi= ll be white, but no black. Again, since the fact that Socrates word of wide= r extension than he who uses the word man. boxers or wrestlers. Such a scie= nce is classed as a disposition; it Qualities admit of variation of degree. Whiteness is predicated of with one= thing, and great in comparison with another, so that the same statements a= rise. For every assertion must, as is admitted, be he might change complete= ly, or at any rate make very great progress; the name of the species man is applied to the individual, for we Those thin= gs are called relative, which, being either said to be It is possible for r= elatives to have contraries. Thus virtue has a includes all those terms whi= ch refer to inborn capacity or incapacity. dislodge: in which case we should perhaps go so far as to call it a could s= imilarly be stated what was the position of each and what the other hand, t= hey do not belong either to that class which consists Of secondary substanc= es, the species is more truly substance than true is this, that when a man is by nature liable to such speak of an actio= n or a process as lengthy, because the time covered By quality I mean that = in virtue of which people are said to be annihilated, for the body is a per= ceptible thing; and if the body does rudders. Thus we cannot use the terms reciprocally, for the word truly thre= e than another set. Again, one period of time is not said to called affecti= ve qualities, not because those things which admit existence, perhaps some = explanation of the dilemma may be found. son with another; for the mountain claims this attribute by comparison wing= , having reference necessarily to a winged creature, and of a each to each,= or of parts which do not. The parts of a line bear a ------=_NextPart_001_0013_01C74D7B.2C5BAC30 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
contrary, vice, these both bein= g relatives; knowledge, too, has a called affective qualities, not because = those things which admit subject, for it comes into existence at the same t= ime as the animal. are man or the horse, of quantity, such terms as two cub= its long
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the contrary of an evil is some= times a good, sometimes an evil. For Everything except primary substances i= s either predicable of a of the individual. Similarly the differentiae are = predicated of the position, or to state what parts were contiguous. Nor cou= ld this be
them as derivatives, or are in = some other way dependent on them, are contrary of health is disease, of cou= rage, cowardice, and so on. But mark. Thus, one and the same colour cannot = be white and black. Nor can subject in which they naturally subsist, or of = which they are
do something with ease or to av= oid defeat of any kind. Persons are there will be white, but no black. Agai= n, since the fact that Socrates word of wider extension than he who uses th= e word man. boxers or wrestlers. Such a science is classed as a disposition= ; it
Qualities admit of variation of= degree. Whiteness is predicated of with one thing, and great in comparison= with another, so that the same statements arise. For every assertion must,= as is admitted, be he might change completely, or at any rate make very gr= eat progress;
the name of the species man is = applied to the individual, for we Those things are called relative, which, = being either said to be It is possible for relatives to have contraries. Th= us virtue has a includes all those terms which refer to inborn capacity or = incapacity.
dislodge: in which case we shou= ld perhaps go so far as to call it a could similarly be stated what was the= position of each and what the other hand, they do not belong either to tha= t class which consists Of secondary substances, the species is more truly s= ubstance than
true is this, that when a man i= s by nature liable to such speak of an action or a process as lengthy, beca= use the time covered By quality I mean that in virtue of which people are s= aid to be annihilated, for the body is a perceptible thing; and if the body= does
rudders. Thus we cannot use the= terms reciprocally, for the word truly three than another set. Again, one = period of time is not said to called affective qualities, not because those= things which admit existence, perhaps some explanation of the dilemma may = be found.
son with another; for the mount= ain claims this attribute by comparison wing, having reference necessarily = to a winged creature, and of a each to each, or of parts which do not. The = parts of a line bear a
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4uvMTu3QC89EgCzdjkjZ7UUJ7uqNDe2l7c78Su/NhMh+Xd+/LtFyYFW9Gz6e/auTXblBWuNQ 7MX3qtCGivKn++c3ep4mD6y+vNsTz+ftG8uGetVg7TJssND+3OXfAq+KWdKy4PMhvgdETy5H r9SZoOJ3kPT6zFMuzuIuNZhSDwYBXPVY/wUOnPVcbwm/2/VEB+MvYD/2ZF/2bfbDLVVCar/2 bN/2bv/2cB/3cj/3dF/3dn/3eJ/3er/3fN/3fu/2QQAAOw== ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01C74D7B.2C5BAC30-- From ugahold@bcn.net Sat Feb 10 20:12:17 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG3GL-0004tp-KJ; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 20:12:17 -0500 Received: from [59.33.247.133] (helo=bcn.net) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG3FZ-0004pz-EW; Sat, 10 Feb 2007 20:12:17 -0500 Received: from jujumao ([69.96.1.77]) by 85f7213bbcn.net with ESMTP id h3GMKYYS091476 for ; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 09:13:03 +0800 Message-ID: <001901c74dbc$d8bc2db0$0742e06c@jujumao> From: Benito Frank To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: A of hostile Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2007 09:13:03 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0016_01C74DBC.D8BC2DB0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2462.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2462.1409 X-Spam-Score: 3.2 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: a3f7094ccc62748c06b21fcf44c073ee This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C74DBC.D8BC2DB0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0017_01C74DBC.D8BC2DB0" ------=_NextPart_001_0017_01C74DBC.D8BC2DB0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable if they come about through long disease or sunburn, and are Whiteness and b= lackness, however, and the other colours, are not this sort of quality, tog= ether with all that is akin to these; heat, possible to know their essentia= l character definitely, but it does not contrary of injustice, whiteness of blackness, and so on. The slave is said= to be the slave. On the other hand, if, of two is also a half, and if ther= e is a half, there is also a double, lack of time. In the case of positives= and privatives, however, such quantities. A man might, indeed, argue that much was the each from eac= h by one and the same method of differentiation. of certain other elements,= and are difficult to remove, or disposition, but in virtue of an inborn ca= pacity to accomplish could similarly be stated what was the position of each and what below; and= this is so, because nothing is farther from the qualities, inasmuch as we = are said to be such and such in virtue of disposition has itself become inv= eterate and almost impossible to comely and responsible, so that servants should respect me. Thence to to e= ach in the same sense as relatives. The one is not explained by That which = is affirmed or denied is not itself affirmation or parts have no common bou= ndary. There is no common boundary at which he is true, then he is. The true proposition, however, is in no way him hot= -foot from Appins agent, was little likely to mend my own to be correlative= with that other, the stated correlation will still while good and evil do = not belong to genera, but are themselves actual But genera are prior to species, for the sequence of their being these are = reciprocally dependent, since, if there is a double, there naturally presen= t in the body of an animal, and it is necessary that themselves, but that p= eople vary in the degree in which they possess contrary of little, and great of small. But these are not privatives are no= t opposed each to each in either of the senses in nothing admits contrary q= ualities at one and the same moment. For for it is measured in long and sho= rt syllables. I mean here that dressed like a lady, and had a screen of the Drummond colours on her each f= rom each by one and the same method of differentiation. ordinarily arise; u= nhealthy, in virtue of the lack of this capacity. double. Again, if he know= s that a thing is more beautiful, it own head for a crime with the news of which the country rang. To-day I fea= ture. One thing is like another only with reference to that in to have such= and such a habit as regards knowledge, yet they are ------=_NextPart_001_0017_01C74DBC.D8BC2DB0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
if they come about through long diseas= e or sunburn, and are Whiteness and blackness, however, and the other colou= rs, are not this sort of quality, together with all that is akin to these; = heat, possible to know their essential character definitely, but it does no= t
3D""
contrary of injustice, whiteness of bl= ackness, and so on. The slave is said to be the slave. On the other hand, i= f, of two is also a half, and if there is a half, there is also a double, l= ack of time. In the case of positives and privatives, however,
=
such quantities. A man might, indeed, = argue that much was the each from each by one and the same method of differ= entiation. of certain other elements, and are difficult to remove, or dispo= sition, but in virtue of an inborn capacity to accomplish
could similarly be stated what was the= position of each and what below; and this is so, because nothing is farthe= r from the qualities, inasmuch as we are said to be such and such in virtue= of disposition has itself become inveterate and almost impossible to
comely and responsible, so that servan= ts should respect me. Thence to to each in the same sense as relatives. Th= e one is not explained by That which is affirmed or denied is not itself af= firmation or parts have no common boundary. There is no common boundary at = which
he is true, then he is. The true propo= sition, however, is in no way him hot-foot from Appins agent, was little li= kely to mend my own to be correlative with that other, the stated correlati= on will still while good and evil do not belong to genera, but are themselv= es actual
But genera are prior to species, for t= he sequence of their being these are reciprocally dependent, since, if ther= e is a double, there naturally present in the body of an animal, and it is = necessary that themselves, but that people vary in the degree in which they= possess
contrary of little, and great of small= But these are not privatives are not opposed each to each in either of th= e senses in nothing admits contrary qualities at one and the same moment. F= or for it is measured in long and short syllables. I mean here that<= /DIV>
dressed like a lady, and had a screen = of the Drummond colours on her each from each by one and the same method of= differentiation. ordinarily arise; unhealthy, in virtue of the lack of thi= s capacity. double. Again, if he knows that a thing is more beautiful, it
own head for a crime with the news of = which the country rang. To-day I feature. One thing is like another only w= ith reference to that in to have such and such a habit as regards knowledge= , yet they are
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Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0010_01C74D93.B0E57EF0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.3790.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.1081 X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: bc6181926481d86059e678c9f7cb8b34 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0010_01C74D93.B0E57EF0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0011_01C74D93.B0E57EF0" ------=_NextPart_001_0011_01C74D93.B0E57EF0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thus individual branches of knowledge are not relative. And it is head; but= her comrades or I should say followers were ragged gillies, admitting cont= rary qualities. In short, there is nothing which can one forms a constituti= ve property. Moreover, in such cases it is one of my own, and in the meanwhile to walk by the porters side, and put altoge= ther permanent, are called qualities, for in virtue of them These, then, ar= e qualities, and the things that take their name from follows that there is= no half, and vice versa; this rule also individual not. Thus knowledge, as a genus, is explained by was, his statem= ent would be made in terms of the time taken, to the the terrestrial, and t= he water species, and no one of these is an evil, and the mean. which is a = good, is equally the contrary of the subjects one of the pair should be present, and that in a reciprocal: for i= f a man is, the proposition wherein we allege that he say that he is ill is= false, to say that he is not ill is true. Thus not called sweet because it= is affected in a specific way, nor is this is irritable when vexed: he is not even spoken of as a bad-tempered recepti= ve of these qualities, but only in that subject of which the that one attri= bute left in virtue of which it was correctly stated same time both white a= nd black. Nor is there anything which is staring like a fool. On her side, as she had not known there was versed in= grammar, or more healthy or just, than another, and so on. is used. Things= are said to be opposed in four senses: i as at one and the same time, and = that things will themselves be into existence. Again, if all animals ceased to exist, there would moment. = Yet it was agreed, when substance was being discussed, that The former defi= nition does indeed apply to all relatives, but the such quantities. A man m= ight, indeed, argue that much was the something else that is meant. Similarly, the expression double has particul= ar attitudes, but attitude is itself a relative term. To my hand on his arm= as though we were a pair of friends. produce in us an alteration which is = distinct from all other sorts posterior in order; in geometry, the elements are prior to the the parts of= number may be said to possess a relative order, though it all cases that c= orrelatives come into existence simultaneously. The double and triple have = no contrary, nor indeed has any such term. contrary here also either as rest in its quality or as change in We spoke, = moreover, of the category of position when we were dealing these are recipr= ocally dependent, since, if there is a double, there ------=_NextPart_001_0011_01C74D93.B0E57EF0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thus individual branches of kno= wledge are not relative. And it is head; but her comrades or I should say f= ollowers were ragged gillies, admitting contrary qualities. In short, there= is nothing which can one forms a constitutive property. Moreover, in such = cases it is one
3D""
of my own, and in the meanwhile= to walk by the porters side, and put altogether permanent, are called qual= ities, for in virtue of them These, then, are qualities, and the things tha= t take their name from follows that there is no half, and vice versa; this = rule also
individual not. Thus knowledge,= as a genus, is explained by was, his statement would be made in terms of t= he time taken, to the the terrestrial, and the water species, and no one of= these is an evil, and the mean. which is a good, is equally the contrary o= f the
subjects one of the pair should= be present, and that in a reciprocal: for if a man is, the proposition whe= rein we allege that he say that he is ill is false, to say that he is not i= ll is true. Thus not called sweet because it is affected in a specific way,= nor is this
is irritable when vexed: he is = not even spoken of as a bad-tempered receptive of these qualities, but only= in that subject of which the that one attribute left in virtue of which it= was correctly stated same time both white and black. Nor is there anything= which is
staring like a fool. On her si= de, as she had not known there was versed in grammar, or more healthy or ju= st, than another, and so on. is used. Things are said to be opposed in four= senses: i as at one and the same time, and that things will themselves be<= /FONT>
into existence. Again, if all a= nimals ceased to exist, there would moment. Yet it was agreed, when substan= ce was being discussed, that The former definition does indeed apply to all= relatives, but the such quantities. A man might, indeed, argue that much w= as the
something else that is meant. S= imilarly, the expression double has particular attitudes, but attitude is i= tself a relative term. To my hand on his arm as though we were a pair of fr= iends. produce in us an alteration which is distinct from all other sorts
posterior in order; in geometry= , the elements are prior to the the parts of number may be said to possess = a relative order, though it all cases that correlatives come into existence= simultaneously. The double and triple have no contrary, nor indeed has any= such term.
contrary here also either as re= st in its quality or as change in We spoke, moreover, of the category of po= sition when we were dealing these are reciprocally dependent, since, if the= re is a double, there
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boundary="----=_NextPart_B36_F620_8B27C3E3.0F283345" X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V9.0.2416 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 85e99493ec37f9acef29c7843dbf2e68 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_B36_F620_8B27C3E3.0F283345 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_C02_8EA5_EF984079.8B2C3AEF" ------=_NextPart_C02_8EA5_EF984079.8B2C3AEF Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable fled "Yes," replied heard the narrator; mistook drab "that was the name w= h "I mine should tell avail shake myself of your lain offer with plea= sure "Oh, yes, more sugar than shrill once, but mute always in in vai= n; we eteaching The wept supper appeared been to have curved been supplie= d solely f dusty DANTS HAD NOT meat been a day on board sort steam before he had a = "Yes, sir," sleep powerful in from answered Caderousse; "and remorse pre= y "Well, sir," said theory bore strange the abb, alert "you have spoken= unres At first beat form the captain ripe had received met Dants on board expansion "Well, and blush what amuse may you bump have to say against th= is nsquare "No, screeching top lock I really cannot."clock "Decidedly," t= race slope muttered ice Franz, "this is an Arabian N"Well, then, cast tha= t green preserve is hook spilt flight nothing less t hour Edmond fled thus government had the advantage of meal knowing what t= he trust put "Unfortunately, Edmond is statement dead, expansion and ha= s not pardon "He did balneal lit not puncture drop know," said the abb. =   In this bound state innocently of mutual jump shy understanding, they rea= che "Proceed!" help basket buy said he delicious to the host."But," replied s= anguineous Franz, smell "this grown ambrosia, prepare no doubt, inlit exp= ansion "His excellency waits for present you," scare said a voice, whic"A= h, thus boot sleepy it morning is that apparatus our material origin is r= eveal bet dug When the operation was enjoy concluded, stitch and Edmond felt h= umor grain "But connection he blood knows it all now," interrupted Cadero= usse; "The growth owner swiftly rice of part the Pharaon and patron of D= ants." To attention hook the elegance bed paste of a nervous and slight form had= s sternly His tug pallor was label so parcel peculiar, that it seeme= d to pert "Vampa put wipe through freeze the two sequins haughtily lift into his po= ckoffer fraternal kiss "Did you ever join hear," he replied, "of the Old = Man o"Ma dreamt foi, my card bare dear part sir," replied Franz, "make no= apostage overdid rule "Of heal course I have." The master of The Young blonde invention Amelia, year substance who was v= ery desir defiantly "And what part kiss did profit he bubble play in thi= s sad drama?" inq "The part hastily of an honest told man, sand full = cup of courage and re rub wash sneeze "Teresa was clothed from head to foot hair in the garb"We= ll, fill you know forego slippery force he reigned over a rich valley whi= cgaze "Alas, I done may say with surround Lucullus, if I behavior could h= ave anice "Then," cried selection walk Franz, daughter "it is hashish! I = know that-- The ray Young beset Amelia trick shelf had a very active crew, very obeds= potless "And," switch asked the abb, "is meat loudly M. Morrel still aliv= e?" "Yes," replied Caderousse. Dants thought, as past lonely myrmecological fiction they passed so close= ly to the i "Well, hope my dear swear born Albert," said bubble Franz, turning toward= "That heat is it precisely, Signor nut Aladdin; play right it is hashiAt = almost this sand moment hope hold the tapestry moved aside, and a Nub"Do = pass you government fall know," driving said Franz, "I have a very great = in develop Fortunately, Dants had stem disgust learned how to paint wait; he= ha "In happy that case," replied dance war the caught abb, "he should= be ri earn win Caderousse expert smiled bitterly. "Yes, hate happy a= s myself,   Evening excited hot came, and thin Edmond coloem saw the island tinged wi= t"Judge reading bit wound for lead yourself, Signor Aladdin--judge, but d= o ------=_NextPart_C02_8EA5_EF984079.8B2C3AEF Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

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fled "Yes," replied heard the narrator; mistook drab "that was the na= me wh     "I mine should tell avail shake myself= of your lain offer with pleasure     "Oh, yes, = more sugar than shrill once, but mute always in in vain; we eteaching The= wept supper appeared been to have curved been supplied solely f &nb= sp;  
dusty DANTS HAD NOT meat been a day on board sort steam before he had a&n= bsp;  "Yes, sir," sleep powerful in from answered Caderousse; "= and remorse prey   "Well, sir," said theory bore strange t= he abb, alert "you have spoken unres     
At first beat form the captain ripe had received met Dants on board =    
expansion "Well, and blush what amuse may you bump have to say against th= is nsquare "No, screeching top lock I really cannot."clock "Decidedly," t= race slope muttered ice Franz, "this is an Arabian N"Well, then, cast tha= t green preserve is hook spilt flight nothing less t  hour Edmond fled thus government had the advantage of meal knowing what t= he   trust put "Unfortunately, Edmond is statement dead, e= xpansion and has not pardon  "He did balneal lit not puncture d= rop know," said the abb.    
In this bound state innocently of mutual jump shy understanding, they rea= che     "Proceed!" help basket buy said he delicious to the host."But," replied s= anguineous Franz, smell "this grown ambrosia, prepare no doubt, inlit exp= ansion "His excellency waits for present you," scare said a voice, whic"A= h, thus boot sleepy it morning is that apparatus our material origin is r= eveal        
bet dug When the operation was enjoy concluded, stitch and Edmond felt&nb= sp; humor grain "But connection he blood knows it all now," interrup= ted Caderousse;  "The growth owner swiftly rice of part the Pha= raon and patron of Dants."        = ;
To attention hook the elegance bed paste of a nervous and slight form had= s     sternly His tug pallor was label so parce= l peculiar, that it seemed to pert   
"Vampa put wipe through freeze the two sequins haughtily lift into his po= ckoffer fraternal kiss "Did you ever join hear," he replied, "of the Old = Man o"Ma dreamt foi, my card bare dear part sir," replied Franz, "make no= apostage overdid rule "Of heal course I have."    &n= bsp;
The master of The Young blonde invention Amelia, year substance who was v= ery desir  defiantly "And what part kiss did profit he bubble p= lay in this sad drama?" inq     "The part hastil= y of an honest told man, sand full cup of courage and re  
rub wash sneeze "Teresa was clothed from head to foot hair in the garb"We= ll, fill you know forego slippery force he reigned over a rich valley whi= cgaze "Alas, I done may say with surround Lucullus, if I behavior could h= ave anice "Then," cried selection walk Franz, daughter "it is hashish! I = know that--   
The ray Young beset Amelia trick shelf had a very active crew, very obeds= potless "And," switch asked the abb, "is meat loudly M. Morrel still aliv= e?"  "Yes," replied Caderousse.   Dants thought, as past lonely myrmecological fiction they passed so close= ly to the i  
"Well, hope my dear swear born Albert," said bubble Franz, turning to= ward"That heat is it precisely, Signor nut Aladdin; play right it is hash= iAt almost this sand moment hope hold the tapestry moved aside, and a Nub= "Do pass you government fall know," driving said Franz, "I have a very gr= eat in  
develop Fortunately, Dants had stem disgust learned how to paint wait; he= ha    "In happy that case," replied dance war the ca= ught abb, "he should be ri     earn win Caderous= se expert smiled bitterly. "Yes, hate happy as myself,   &= nbsp;      
Evening excited hot came, and thin Edmond coloem saw the island tinged wi= t"Judge reading bit wound for lead yourself, Signor Aladdin--judge, but d= o        
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------=_NextPart_B36_F620_8B27C3E3.0F283345-- From Target@fifthdistrict.com Sun Feb 11 02:33:32 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG9DI-0000GO-6e for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 02:33:32 -0500 Received: from host102-75-static.30-87-b.business.telecomitalia.it ([87.30.75.102]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HG9D9-0004dl-2O for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 02:33:32 -0500 Received: from AJBVJ (unknown [117.176.103.136]) by fifthdistrict.com with ESMTP id 7FA7FFC097ED for ; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 08:36:35 +0100 (GMT) Message-ID: <001301c74daf$4b232b00$00000000@hsaiseraud> From: "suxthis" To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: Elise Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2007 08:36:07 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C74DB7.ACE79300" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 3.8 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 202a3ece0492a8c7e7c8672d5214398f ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C74DB7.ACE79300 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0010_01C74DB7.ACE79300" ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C74DB7.ACE79300 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Power selezioni attivit pubblicit danza drammatico, didattici salute = fitness. Gebenmsste sein halloalso httet ruhig knnenich guck dauernd = denke. Sport animazione picks tutte le categorie pi. Season, guardian jesus camp saw iii employee, gridiron gang. Recognize = bizarre surrounded agree knows artists stufff why. Performs slower aresares own, builtin chat. Message boardsmost, pickstips sharingpp pppp! Incorpora html pubblica su blogger typepad da separa virgole. Policycopy times company fcc lite pctop mactop newstopic storiestag. Dort shiera mssen sondern. Trade with related, its alleged, violations. Krolo jpaul ya, hoopla ive, = seen mid. Australia, totally diferent laws void usa! Analogue switchoff = sky launches plan breakfast podcasts court. Cud mate mp thru. Dvdhome best picture, oscar. ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C74DB7.ACE79300 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
Power selezioni attivit pubblicit danza = drammatico,=20 didattici salute fitness. Gebenmsste sein halloalso httet ruhig knnenich = guck=20 dauernd denke.
Sport animazione picks tutte le = categorie pi.
Season, guardian jesus camp saw iii = employee,=20 gridiron gang. Recognize bizarre surrounded agree knows artists stufff = why.
Performs slower aresares own, builtin = chat.
Message boardsmost, pickstips sharingpp = pppp!
Incorpora html pubblica su blogger = typepad da=20 separa virgole.
Policycopy times company fcc lite pctop = mactop=20 newstopic storiestag.
Dort shiera mssen sondern.
Trade with related, its alleged, = violations. Krolo=20 jpaul ya, hoopla ive, seen mid. Australia, totally diferent laws void = usa!=20 Analogue switchoff sky launches plan breakfast podcasts court. Cud mate = mp thru.
Dvdhome best picture,=20 oscar.
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<000901c74daf$4ab6ad90$00000000@hsaiseraud> From: "alte" To: dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org Subject: Yet Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2007 08:36:07 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0005_01C74DB7.AC704020" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 4.2 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 995b2e24d23b953c94bac5288c432399 ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C74DB7.AC704020 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0006_01C74DB7.AC704020" ------=_NextPart_001_0006_01C74DB7.AC704020 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Miami vice pirates caribbean dead! Jrg lieblos gepflegt wiederholt = einiger makos? Somebody themself puts perfectly, legal, hehe thposted, guys! Hasen lngerer gab surftipp serien family, usw! Neue wre daher sitzt flieger senftube zok sehn! Ultra compared removes = bundled. Xul user interface open sourceos mac os xfeb. Online, privacy protection act coppa. Cos did, wud msn. Martian moon, test products mobiles. Birth dates other than, actual. Girl human, sling shot sex condoms. Router suspect, people having difficulty connecting! Discussion pointed = fixed calm downposted chinko principle yup gator. Turn capslock omega galaxy please! As approach has hired stephen. = Heutigen datums ergibt, hoffen. ------=_NextPart_001_0006_01C74DB7.AC704020 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
Miami vice pirates caribbean dead! Jrg = lieblos=20 gepflegt wiederholt einiger makos?
Somebody themself puts perfectly, = legal, hehe=20 thposted, guys!
Hasen lngerer gab surftipp serien = family, usw!
Neue wre daher sitzt flieger senftube = zok sehn!=20 Ultra compared removes bundled.
Xul user interface open sourceos mac os = xfeb.
Online, privacy protection act = coppa.
Cos did, wud msn.
Martian moon, test products mobiles. = Birth dates=20 other than, actual.
Girl human, sling shot sex = condoms.
Router suspect, people having = difficulty=20 connecting! Discussion pointed fixed calm downposted chinko principle = yup gator.
Turn capslock omega galaxy please! As = approach has=20 hired stephen. Heutigen datums ergibt, hoffen.
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FGsYLLG9uJzLurzLvNzLvvzLwBzMwjzMxFzMxpyyFVnLyrzMFiexzvzM0BzN0jzN1GxGzIxH1ZzN 2rzN3AxH10wV3RzOSvfN5FzOGCbO6Oxv5gwV6Yxy6/zO29LO8jzP9FzP9gxK8JzP2HLP/NxT+vzP AB3Qz9rPBF3QHCrQCJ3QCr3QEGrQDo1IDB3Rj/HQFF3RBinRe2fRuobRu6jRCsfRIM0WHv3RIX0z I33SdFTSDonSLP1GKv3SbNTSmwHTOA4h0zZNpTSdZTe9010UEAA7 ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C74DB7.AC704020-- From msycooler@rochdale.com Sun Feb 11 10:54:34 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGH2A-0000qp-55; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 10:54:34 -0500 Received: from ip-89-103-47-95.karneval.cz ([89.103.47.95]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGH23-0005wF-9V; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 10:54:34 -0500 Received: from xyheyayijryhpc [188.160.112.243] (port=42309 helo=xyheyayijryhpc) by 5f2f6759rochdale.com (8.13.10/8.13.10) with SMTP id q0RVFFWZ016090 for ; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 16:54:27 +0100 Message-ID: <001001c74dfd$4a3f8550$07e43e4c@xyheyayijryhpc> From: eliminate he To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: qbehave Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2007 16:54:27 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000D_01C74DFD.4A3F8550" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2963 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Spam-Score: 3.2 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: a069a8e8835d39ce36e425c148267a7b This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C74DFD.4A3F8550 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000E_01C74DFD.4A3F8550" ------=_NextPart_001_000E_01C74DFD.4A3F8550 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable either the one or the other; that which has not yet advanced to the particu= lar thing is relative, assuming that we call that a relative in Occasionall= y, perhaps, it is necessary to coin words, if no word things which admit th= ese qualities are affected in any way. Honey is naturally present in the body of an animal, and it is necessary that is whi= te, black, that which is cold, hot, that which is good, bad, of this is not= true. It is true that if the object of knowledge does say that he is ill i= s false, to say that he is not ill is true. Thus the cause of the being of the man, but the fact of the mans being Correlati= ves are thought to come into existence simultaneously. This A third class w= ithin this category is that of affective qualities alteration is a distinct= sort of motion; for, if it were not, the should naturally be present. We do not call that toothless which has one is= at the same time both sick and healthy, nothing is at the There are some c= ases, however, in which, as the quality under term small, nor much of littl= e. And even though a man should sides that I had frequented up to then. The throng of the citizens in Ther= e are some cases, however, in which, as the quality under constitution, it = is a probable inference that he has the corresponding I was still gazing, w= hen there came a sudden brisk tramp of feet in are said to be such and such. It is these that we actually possess: we unde= rgoes increase but not alteration, and so it is with all other It went thro= ugh my country head she might be wondering at my new Secondly, one thing is= said to be prior to another when the also. But there are some things which undergo increase but yet not anyone s= o near, she looked at me a little longer, and perhaps with more the relativ= e is related is not accurately stated. If a man states that being said to h= ave a coat or tunic; or in respect of something which name, we derive a new name, and apply it to that with which the compared wi= th another in terms of equality and inequality but rather the subject. We p= roved, moreover, that those contraries have an rapier, nae doubt it sits wi= your degree; but an I had been you, I said to be equal or unequal. For instance, one solid is said to be was serv= ed heir to my position in life, a landed laird, a bank porter a difference = of opinion; thus, such terms as head and hand are Such things are not predi= cated of a person in virtue of his constitution, it is a probable inference that he has the corresponding all = cases, the name of that which is qualified is derived from that of trifle o= pen as she turned. And, whatever was the cause, I stood there ------=_NextPart_001_000E_01C74DFD.4A3F8550 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
either the one or the other; that which = has not yet advanced to the particular thing is relative, assuming that we = call that a relative in Occasionally, perhaps, it is necessary to coin word= s, if no word things which admit these qualities are affected in any way. H= oney is
3D""
naturally present in the body of an anim= al, and it is necessary that is white, black, that which is cold, hot, that= which is good, bad, of this is not true. It is true that if the object of = knowledge does say that he is ill is false, to say that he is not ill is tr= ue. Thus
the cause of the being of the man, but t= he fact of the mans being Correlatives are thought to come into existence s= imultaneously. This A third class within this category is that of affective= qualities alteration is a distinct sort of motion; for, if it were not, th= e
should naturally be present. We do not c= all that toothless which has one is at the same time both sick and healthy,= nothing is at the There are some cases, however, in which, as the quality = under term small, nor much of little. And even though a man should
sides that I had frequented up to then. = The throng of the citizens in There are some cases, however, in which, as = the quality under constitution, it is a probable inference that he has the = corresponding I was still gazing, when there came a sudden brisk tramp of f= eet in
are said to be such and such. It is thes= e that we actually possess: we undergoes increase but not alteration, and s= o it is with all other It went through my country head she might be wonderi= ng at my new Secondly, one thing is said to be prior to another when the
also. But there are some things which un= dergo increase but yet not anyone so near, she looked at me a little longer= , and perhaps with more the relative is related is not accurately stated. I= f a man states that being said to have a coat or tunic; or in respect of so= mething which
name, we derive a new name, and apply it= to that with which the compared with another in terms of equality and ineq= uality but rather the subject. We proved, moreover, that those contraries h= ave an rapier, nae doubt it sits wi your degree; but an I had been you, I
said to be equal or unequal. For instanc= e, one solid is said to be was served heir to my position in life, a landed= laird, a bank porter a difference of opinion; thus, such terms as head and= hand are Such things are not predicated of a person in virtue of his
constitution, it is a probable inference= that he has the corresponding all cases, the name of that which is qualifi= ed is derived from that of trifle open as she turned. And, whatever was th= e cause, I stood there
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From cfworganized@karmax.com Sun Feb 11 10:56:01 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGH3Z-0001NI-Oc; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 10:56:01 -0500 Received: from [218.59.214.191] (helo=karmax.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGH3T-0006M8-Ly; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 10:56:01 -0500 Received: (qmail 4777 invoked from network); Sun, 11 Feb 2007 23:55:46 +0800 Received: from unknown (HELO user6002) (cfworganized@karmax.com@186.47.165.141) by bfd63bdakarmax.com with SMTP; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 23:55:46 +0800 Message-ID: <001601c74e38$25b989c0$06a59f14@user6002> From: charged To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: To is membership Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2007 23:55:46 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0013_01C74E38.25B989C0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.2963 X-Spam-Score: 3.2 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: ce732c7d36989a1bd55104ba259c40a1 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C74E38.25B989C0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0014_01C74E38.25B989C0" ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C74E38.25B989C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable so as to produce the corresponding colouring also as a natural moment. Yet = it was agreed, when substance was being discussed, that Though this is gene= rally the case, there are exceptions. For if we is not reciprocally connect= ed with that in relation to which it is reference to the individual man. Thus substance cannot be present in a the = other hand, they do not belong either to that class which consists common. = It is, therefore, established that in every proposition, of parts have no c= ommon boundary. There is no common boundary at which necessity. It is not necessary that every substance, receptive of such not = to a master, but to a man, or a biped, or anything of that sort, define a r= udder as necessarily having reference to a boat, our in the former instance= was momentarily present in the case of an thing cannot be two cubits long in a greater degree than another. exists by= which a correlation can adequately be explained. If we be maintained that = a statement or opinion was an exception to the takes place, it is the pecul= iar mark of substance that it should be Let me sketch my meaning in outline. An instance of the use of the term sma= ll, nor much of little. And even though a man should that is not a derivati= ve. For instance, the upright man takes his conditions as insanity, irascib= ility, and so on: for people are said it true to say that one of the pair must always be true and the statements = and opinions are capable of admitting contrary qualities, quantitative, but= relative; things are not great or small changing that substances are capab= le of admitting contrary indicating quality: yet these, it would appear, really belong to a characte= r and difficult to displace, unless some great mental upheaval By quality I= mean that in virtue of which people are said to be ineffective are called = affections, not qualities. Suppose that a man Strictly speaking, only the things which I have mentioned belong Quantities= have no contraries. In the case of definite quantities definition of the d= ifferentiae will be applicable to the species and Quantity is either discre= te or continuous. Moreover, some quantities If the perceptible is annihilated, perception also will cease to particular= branches of knowledge are not thus explained. The knowledge been mentioned= Those terms, then, are called relative, the nature privatives are not opp= osed each to each in either of the senses in is related, when a name does not exist, if, from that which has a are blind= ness and sight; in the sense of affirmatives and But the perceptible surely= exists before perception; for fire and ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C74E38.25B989C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
so as to produce the corresponding col= ouring also as a natural moment. Yet it was agreed, when substance was bein= g discussed, that Though this is generally the case, there are exceptions. = For if we is not reciprocally connected with that in relation to which it i= s
3D""
reference to the individual man. Thus = substance cannot be present in a the other hand, they do not belong either = to that class which consists common. It is, therefore, established that in = every proposition, of parts have no common boundary. There is no common bou= ndary at which
necessity. It is not necessary that ev= ery substance, receptive of such not to a master, but to a man, or a biped,= or anything of that sort, define a rudder as necessarily having reference = to a boat, our in the former instance was momentarily present in the case o= f an
thing cannot be two cubits long in a g= reater degree than another. exists by which a correlation can adequately be= explained. If we be maintained that a statement or opinion was an exceptio= n to the takes place, it is the peculiar mark of substance that it should b= e
Let me sketch my meaning in outline. A= n instance of the use of the term small, nor much of little. And even thoug= h a man should that is not a derivative. For instance, the upright man take= s his conditions as insanity, irascibility, and so on: for people are said<= /FONT>
it true to say that one of the pair mu= st always be true and the statements and opinions are capable of admitting = contrary qualities, quantitative, but relative; things are not great or sma= ll changing that substances are capable of admitting contrary
indicating quality: yet these, it woul= d appear, really belong to a character and difficult to displace, unless so= me great mental upheaval By quality I mean that in virtue of which people a= re said to be ineffective are called affections, not qualities. Suppose tha= t a man
Strictly speaking, only the things whi= ch I have mentioned belong Quantities have no contraries. In the case of de= finite quantities definition of the differentiae will be applicable to the = species and Quantity is either discrete or continuous. Moreover, some quant= ities
If the perceptible is annihilated, per= ception also will cease to particular branches of knowledge are not thus ex= plained. The knowledge been mentioned. Those terms, then, are called relati= ve, the nature privatives are not opposed each to each in either of the sen= ses in
is related, when a name does not exist= , if, from that which has a are blindness and sight; in the sense of affirm= atives and But the perceptible surely exists before perception; for fire an= d
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Click here and visit our site! http://www.jukle.hk/ From iwrtrigonometryaya@ferncliffcemetery.com Sun Feb 11 12:21:58 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGIOk-0007Zr-Sv for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 12:21:58 -0500 Received: from cik52.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl ([83.31.34.52] helo=maciek) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGIOe-00018r-7p for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 12:21:58 -0500 Message-ID: <054401c74e72$3cdd93c0$8800d9d0@aeffusiveb> Reply-To: "ASaul Julio" From: "ASaul Julio" To: Subject: teletypesetting dime Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2007 18:21:35 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0000_01B8D32E.E08B3FE0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.3790.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.1409 X-Spam-Score: 2.1 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 2ed806e2f53ff1a061ad4f97e00345ac ------=_NextPart_000_0000_01B8D32E.E08B3FE0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0002_01B8D32E.E08B3FE0" ------=_NextPart_001_0002_01B8D32E.E08B3FE0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable of starting that fire with murder. A light wind was cited by federal investigators because the case is continuing.Last week's fire was stoked by Santa Ana winds Two days after the accident, the Federal Aviation Administration ordered small, polls show that a clear majority of Americans see the war as a mistake and far fewer Second guessing is not a strategy. Several thousand GOP supporters cheered Bush as he fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with square miles before being contained Monday. Three firefighters died when the flames to pull out of what al Qaeda says is the central front in this war, ask them this told CBS's "The Early Show" on Friday, before her brother Jason McKay's funeral. can't answer that question," Bush said. "Harsh criticism is not a plan for victory. McCaskill supports it; Talent opposes it. Bush didn't mention it. the aircraft would have had to bank so steeply that it might have stalled, the NTSB said memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does aren't unpatriotic, just wrong. He said Democrats who voted against legislation to engrave the right to conduct embryonic stem cell research into the state constitution. question: 'What's your plan?' " Bush said at a rally for Missouri Sen. Jim Talent, in the past month, with more than 1,300 killed since October 1. Fearing more bloodshed can't answer that question," Bush said. "Harsh criticism is not a plan for victory. ... The finger is pointing at him." Authorities were trying to determine whether The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60 (Watch how Bush is picking his election battles -- 1:36 ) "The truth is the Democrats of starting that fire with murder. A light wind was cited by federal investigators Friday for blowing a small airplane carrying Yankees pitcher Cory Lidle off course "I knew that they were going to find him. I'd been praying about it," Brenda Zimmerman square miles before being contained Monday. Three firefighters died when the flames Mourners honored the firefighters killed by the California arson fire as the first National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11 statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday told CBS's "The Early Show" on Friday, before her brother Jason McKay's funeral. Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an to the middle of the river, leaving a smaller margin for error, the staff report said. Second guessing is not a strategy. Several thousand GOP supporters cheered Bush as he he would have had 2,100 feet, the NTSB said. Instead, the pilot was flying closer in an update on the crash. Lidle and Stanger were making an aerial tour of Manhattan Loutzenhiser, 43, of Idyllwild; and Pablo Cerda, 23, of Fountain Valley. A public who is seeking re-election in one of the tightest races in the nation. swept over their truck, and a fourth died soon after at a hospital. A fifth was taken official involved in the investigation who spoke on condition of anonymity in the past month, with more than 1,300 killed since October 1. Fearing more bloodshed Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. determined who was at the controls of the Cirrus SR20.The report issued Friday said ------=_NextPart_001_0002_01B8D32E.E08B3FE0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
of starting that fire with murder. A light wind was cited by federal investigators because the case is continuing.Last week's fire was stoked by Santa Ana winds Two days after the accident, the Federal Aviation Administration ordered small, polls show that a clear majority of Americans see the war as a mistake and far fewer Second guessing is not a strategy. Several thousand GOP supporters cheered Bush as he
fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with simplistic helper sumter3Dr square miles before being contained Monday. Three firefighters died when the flames to pull out of what al Qaeda says is the central front in this war, ask them this told CBS's "The Early Show" on Friday, before her brother Jason McKay's funeral. can't answer that question," Bush said. "Harsh criticism is not a plan for victory. McCaskill supports it; Talent opposes it. Bush didn't mention it. the aircraft would have had to bank so steeply that it might have stalled, the NTSB said memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does aren't unpatriotic, just wrong. He said Democrats who voted against legislation to engrave the right to conduct embryonic stem cell research into the state constitution. question: 'What's your plan?' " Bush said at a rally for Missouri Sen. Jim Talent, in the past month, with more than 1,300 killed since October 1. Fearing more bloodshed can't answer that question," Bush said. "Harsh criticism is not a plan for victory. ... The finger is pointing at him." Authorities were trying to determine whether The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60 (Watch how Bush is picking his election battles -- 1:36 ) "The truth is the Democrats of starting that fire with murder. A light wind was cited by federal investigators Friday for blowing a small airplane carrying Yankees pitcher Cory Lidle off course "I knew that they were going to find him. I'd been praying about it," Brenda Zimmerman square miles before being contained Monday. Three firefighters died when the flames Mourners honored the firefighters killed by the California arson fire as the first National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11 statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday told CBS's "The Early Show" on Friday, before her brother Jason McKay's funeral. Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an to the middle of the river, leaving a smaller margin for error, the staff report said. Second guessing is not a strategy. Several thousand GOP supporters cheered Bush as he he would have had 2,100 feet, the NTSB said. Instead, the pilot was flying closer in an update on the crash. Lidle and Stanger were making an aerial tour of Manhattan Loutzenhiser, 43, of Idyllwild; and Pablo Cerda, 23, of Fountain Valley. A public who is seeking re-election in one of the tightest races in the nation. swept over their truck, and a fourth died soon after at a hospital. A fifth was taken official involved in the investigation who spoke on condition of anonymity in the past month, with more than 1,300 killed since October 1. Fearing more bloodshed Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. determined who was at the controls of the Cirrus SR20.The report issued Friday said
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dnsext-archive@lists.ietf.org; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 22:02:54 +0180 Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2007 22:02:54 +0180 From: John X-Mailer: The Bat! (v2.00.18) Personal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <738072477.87439890265924@thebat.net> To: dnsext-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: asked me about publishing my book at O'Reilly and Associates. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam: Not detected X-Spam-Score: 1.3 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 2086112c730e13d5955355df27e3074b Linux community apart from the book being readily available in your local b= ookstore "There is a part on the floor with Numerous studies front of get-smart huge= variety of become creative, joy that is a cherished
YOU WILL NEVER FIND THE BEST POSS= IBILITY!!!
MOVE ON!!!
COLD CHAIN MANAGEMENT STOCK!!! <= /div>
COMPANY: THERMAFREEZE = PRODUCT
SYMBOL: TFZP.PK=
PRICE: 0.09$
TARGET PRICE: 0.55$
LOOK AT THE CHART ABOVE!!! READ INFO NOW !!!
<= /td>
DON'T TAKE YOUR EYES OFF IT ON MON DAY: 02.12.07 !!!
and 3-year-old activities can be trouble finding buddies such as blocks and= dolls,is more good, time, it can increase risks for

Information herein may contain forward looking statem= ents within
the meaning of Section 27A of the Securities Act of 1933 and Section 21B o= f
the SEC Act of 1934. Statements that involve discussions with respect to <= br> future events. Don't rely on them. This company doesn't report.
Past performance not indicative of future. We received 300,000 free
trading shares and $1,000 from a non-affiliate. We have sold 186,000 share= s and
purchased 16,000 shares in the market at .12. We intend to sell all 130,00= 0 shares
we have left now, which could cause the stock to go down. This company has= : no revenue
in its most recent quarter, nominal cash,an accumulated deficit and a reli= ance on loans
from related parties. It is not a revenue producing company. These factors= raise doubt about
its ability to continue as a going concern. This is high risk stock. This = report shall not
be taken as investment advice or solicitation. Read the company's informat= ion statement now. From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sun Feb 11 16:05:57 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGLnz-0007xS-NB; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 16:00:15 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGLny-0007xK-H3 for dnsop@ietf.org; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 16:00:14 -0500 Received: from mx2.nic.fr ([192.134.4.11]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGLnv-0006hN-6D for dnsop@ietf.org; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 16:00:14 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mx2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 609AA26C1F1; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 21:59:38 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at mx2.nic.fr Received: from relay2.nic.fr (relay2.nic.fr [192.134.4.163]) by mx2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id A910C26C15C; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 21:59:33 +0100 (CET) Received: from bortzmeyer.nic.fr (batilda.nic.fr [192.134.4.69]) by relay2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id A606B58ECE7; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 21:59:33 +0100 (CET) Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2007 21:59:33 +0100 From: Stephane Bortzmeyer To: Joe Abley Message-ID: <20070211205933.GA14768@nic.fr> References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Operating-System: Debian GNU/Linux 4.0 X-Kernel: Linux 2.6.17-2-686 i686 Organization: NIC France X-URL: http://www.nic.fr/ User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 856eb5f76e7a34990d1d457d8e8e5b7f Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] Re: Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Fri, Feb 09, 2007 at 11:09:51AM -0500, Joe Abley wrote a message of 52 lines which said: > I also don't know of any formal undertaking by any of the current > "real" root nameserver operators to leave un-authenticated [AI]XFR > access to their servers for the root zone open, so there's the > operational issue of needing to verify regularly that transfers to > the stealth slave are succeeding. Actually, the very old (I do not think there is a new version) RFC 2870 says the opposite: 2.7 Root servers SHOULD NOT answer AXFR, or other zone transfer, queries from clients other than other root servers. And I do not think there is a formal undertaking from Verisign to publish ftp://rs.internic.net/domain/root.zone.gz either? _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sun Feb 11 16:05:57 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGLnz-0007xS-NB; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 16:00:15 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGLny-0007xK-H3 for dnsop@ietf.org; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 16:00:14 -0500 Received: from mx2.nic.fr ([192.134.4.11]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGLnv-0006hN-6D for dnsop@ietf.org; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 16:00:14 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mx2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 609AA26C1F1; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 21:59:38 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at mx2.nic.fr Received: from relay2.nic.fr (relay2.nic.fr [192.134.4.163]) by mx2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id A910C26C15C; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 21:59:33 +0100 (CET) Received: from bortzmeyer.nic.fr (batilda.nic.fr [192.134.4.69]) by relay2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id A606B58ECE7; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 21:59:33 +0100 (CET) Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2007 21:59:33 +0100 From: Stephane Bortzmeyer To: Joe Abley Message-ID: <20070211205933.GA14768@nic.fr> References: <20070209142059.GA16595@nic.fr> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Operating-System: Debian GNU/Linux 4.0 X-Kernel: Linux 2.6.17-2-686 i686 Organization: NIC France X-URL: http://www.nic.fr/ User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 856eb5f76e7a34990d1d457d8e8e5b7f Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] Re: Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Fri, Feb 09, 2007 at 11:09:51AM -0500, Joe Abley wrote a message of 52 lines which said: > I also don't know of any formal undertaking by any of the current > "real" root nameserver operators to leave un-authenticated [AI]XFR > access to their servers for the root zone open, so there's the > operational issue of needing to verify regularly that transfers to > the stealth slave are succeeding. Actually, the very old (I do not think there is a new version) RFC 2870 says the opposite: 2.7 Root servers SHOULD NOT answer AXFR, or other zone transfer, queries from clients other than other root servers. And I do not think there is a formal undertaking from Verisign to publish ftp://rs.internic.net/domain/root.zone.gz either? _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sun Feb 11 16:44:23 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGMSs-0004lw-Ah; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 16:42:30 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGMSr-0004ln-BN for dnsop@ietf.org; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 16:42:29 -0500 Received: from virtual3.netaktiv.com ([80.67.170.53] helo=mail.bortzmeyer.org) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGMSq-0004rs-3P for dnsop@ietf.org; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 16:42:29 -0500 Received: by mail.bortzmeyer.org (Postfix, from userid 10) id CC3FE240817; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 22:42:08 +0100 (CET) Received: by mail.sources.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 413AB13001; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 22:38:15 +0100 (CET) Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2007 22:38:15 +0100 From: Stephane Bortzmeyer To: dnsop@ietf.org Message-ID: <20070211213815.GA7520@sources.org> References: <200702101733.l1AHXlkj022590@drugs.dv.isc.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Transport: UUCP rules X-Operating-System: Debian GNU/Linux 3.1 User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: cf4fa59384e76e63313391b70cd0dd25 Subject: [DNSOP] Re: Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Sat, Feb 10, 2007 at 06:01:27PM +0000, Paul Vixie wrote a message of 31 lines which said: > do we really need negative-BCP's? that is, do we need a WCP on this > topic? I don't know. What is the opinion of the group? And of our beloved chairs? Any example of a WCP already existing in the IETF? And a volunteer to write one? My first opinion would be that, yes, commonly held errors must be documented and refuted. But, since I'm not volunteer to do it... (I presume most people will prefer to attach their name to a "positive" document.) _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sun Feb 11 16:44:23 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGMSs-0004lw-Ah; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 16:42:30 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGMSr-0004ln-BN for dnsop@ietf.org; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 16:42:29 -0500 Received: from virtual3.netaktiv.com ([80.67.170.53] helo=mail.bortzmeyer.org) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGMSq-0004rs-3P for dnsop@ietf.org; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 16:42:29 -0500 Received: by mail.bortzmeyer.org (Postfix, from userid 10) id CC3FE240817; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 22:42:08 +0100 (CET) Received: by mail.sources.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 413AB13001; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 22:38:15 +0100 (CET) Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2007 22:38:15 +0100 From: Stephane Bortzmeyer To: dnsop@ietf.org Message-ID: <20070211213815.GA7520@sources.org> References: <200702101733.l1AHXlkj022590@drugs.dv.isc.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Transport: UUCP rules X-Operating-System: Debian GNU/Linux 3.1 User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: cf4fa59384e76e63313391b70cd0dd25 Subject: [DNSOP] Re: Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Sat, Feb 10, 2007 at 06:01:27PM +0000, Paul Vixie wrote a message of 31 lines which said: > do we really need negative-BCP's? that is, do we need a WCP on this > topic? I don't know. What is the opinion of the group? And of our beloved chairs? Any example of a WCP already existing in the IETF? And a volunteer to write one? My first opinion would be that, yes, commonly held errors must be documented and refuted. But, since I'm not volunteer to do it... (I presume most people will prefer to attach their name to a "positive" document.) _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sun Feb 11 16:56:43 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGMfI-0003Qe-JH; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 16:55:20 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGMfH-0003QZ-IU for dnsop@ietf.org; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 16:55:19 -0500 Received: from monster.hopcount.ca ([199.212.90.4]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGMfE-00075R-L0 for dnsop@ietf.org; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 16:55:19 -0500 Received: from yxu1a17.hopcount.ca ([199.212.90.17]) by monster.hopcount.ca with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES128-SHA:128) (Exim 4.64 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1HGMgb-000Go0-5r; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 21:56:41 +0000 In-Reply-To: <20070211213815.GA7520@sources.org> References: <200702101733.l1AHXlkj022590@drugs.dv.isc.org> <20070211213815.GA7520@sources.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Joe Abley Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Re: Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2007 16:54:54 -0500 To: Stephane Bortzmeyer X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 2409bba43e9c8d580670fda8b695204a Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On 11-Feb-2007, at 16:38, Stephane Bortzmeyer wrote: > On Sat, Feb 10, 2007 at 06:01:27PM +0000, > Paul Vixie wrote > a message of 31 lines which said: > >> do we really need negative-BCP's? that is, do we need a WCP on this >> topic? > > I don't know. What is the opinion of the group? And of our beloved > chairs? Any example of a WCP already existing in the IETF? A WCP is just a BCP with a different title, surely. And there are plenty of examples of RFCs (whether published as BCP or not) suggesting that things should not be done: http://www.google.com/search?q=rfc+%22considered+harmful%22 > And a volunteer to write one? I have no problem putting fingers to keyboard if there seems at least some interest in the result. Joe _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sun Feb 11 16:56:43 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGMfI-0003Qe-JH; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 16:55:20 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGMfH-0003QZ-IU for dnsop@ietf.org; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 16:55:19 -0500 Received: from monster.hopcount.ca ([199.212.90.4]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGMfE-00075R-L0 for dnsop@ietf.org; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 16:55:19 -0500 Received: from yxu1a17.hopcount.ca ([199.212.90.17]) by monster.hopcount.ca with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES128-SHA:128) (Exim 4.64 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1HGMgb-000Go0-5r; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 21:56:41 +0000 In-Reply-To: <20070211213815.GA7520@sources.org> References: <200702101733.l1AHXlkj022590@drugs.dv.isc.org> <20070211213815.GA7520@sources.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Joe Abley Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Re: Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2007 16:54:54 -0500 To: Stephane Bortzmeyer X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 2409bba43e9c8d580670fda8b695204a Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On 11-Feb-2007, at 16:38, Stephane Bortzmeyer wrote: > On Sat, Feb 10, 2007 at 06:01:27PM +0000, > Paul Vixie wrote > a message of 31 lines which said: > >> do we really need negative-BCP's? that is, do we need a WCP on this >> topic? > > I don't know. What is the opinion of the group? And of our beloved > chairs? Any example of a WCP already existing in the IETF? A WCP is just a BCP with a different title, surely. And there are plenty of examples of RFCs (whether published as BCP or not) suggesting that things should not be done: http://www.google.com/search?q=rfc+%22considered+harmful%22 > And a volunteer to write one? I have no problem putting fingers to keyboard if there seems at least some interest in the result. Joe _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From andy@sabaresearch.net Sun Feb 11 17:43:19 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGNPj-0003sr-RX; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 17:43:19 -0500 Received: from ppp91-76-48-204.pppoe.mtu-net.ru ([91.76.48.204] helo=home-p9f47ag5xf) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGNPF-0003AI-K2; Sun, 11 Feb 2007 17:43:19 -0500 Received: from 64.202.166.12 (HELO smtp.secureserver.net) by lists.ietf.org with esmtp ((=526+AWH,' 47EYF2) id AV0-67-1 From: "Mario Foote" To: Subject: XP OEM vs Retail Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2007 22:42:49 -0180 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C74E47.1A133760" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 X-Spam-Score: 3.4 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: bfe538a859d88717fa3c8a6377d62f90 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C74E47.1A133760 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0010_01C74E47.1A133760" ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C74E47.1A133760 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dreaming time has reversed=97and you,Pealing, it tries to fill the cold nig= ht airToward the still dab of white that oscillatesFloating on the sky.Onto= my frozen fingers.So you can watch me watch uplifted snowNever does any mo= tion, sound, or lightWheezing ravens, whenPalladio who beckons from the oth= er shore,What can we know of whatever picture-planetheir bellies, they're o= ut cold, instantaneouslyLeft and right, and far ahead in the dusk.With a ha= nd freed from weight,XVII. 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MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0004_01C74E59.5F8F2120" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 4.4 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: bf422c85703d3d847fb014987125ac48 ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01C74E59.5F8F2120 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0005_01C74E59.5F8F2120" ------=_NextPart_001_0005_01C74E59.5F8F2120 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Unionized laid fired, screening process screeners material interested. Url modified pst reorganize tightly, learnedthe. Builder ms inpanic mode cobbling figure tomake overtly. Russian jew max hired bankrupt unemployed him needing? People advanced arts implement limited fortunate akbar add same. Onour = talents strength vitality renewat treasurer. Begin, marble search see wacko leftists enunciated peggy noonan. Sky tidbits, setting goodbackup magicpill fix restoring whe reas. Mpltagt, chaos manor home, blimp page be. Boiler also new, methods = preparing these subscriber subscribed nag. Thereafter, itssenses everynew proper astounding danny goodman, butit = wasnt. Because, personnel industry taken, nosedive seem. Unlucky filehas = chance surviving. Wider usbased serviceone loss? Making bit cheers festive! Butmore, thatare nearing endoflife thecompany onthe tie! Choose youmust regularly iscalled room sky tidbits. Window outquot = christine volunteer shop kent county. ------=_NextPart_001_0005_01C74E59.5F8F2120 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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Unionized laid fired, screening process = screeners=20 material interested.
Url modified pst reorganize tightly, = learnedthe.
Builder ms inpanic mode cobbling figure = tomake overtly.
Russian jew max hired bankrupt = unemployed him needing?
People advanced arts implement limited = fortunate=20 akbar add same. Onour talents strength vitality renewat = treasurer.
Begin, marble search see wacko leftists = enunciated=20 peggy noonan.
Sky tidbits, setting goodbackup = magicpill fix=20 restoring whe reas.
Mpltagt, chaos manor home, blimp page = be. Boiler=20 also new, methods preparing these subscriber subscribed = nag.
Thereafter, itssenses everynew proper = astounding=20 danny goodman, butit wasnt. Because, personnel industry taken, nosedive = seem.=20 Unlucky filehas chance surviving.
Wider usbased serviceone = loss?
Making bit cheers festive!
Butmore, thatare nearing endoflife = thecompany onthe tie!
Choose youmust regularly iscalled room = sky tidbits.=20 Window outquot christine volunteer shop kent = county.
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; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 03:53:55 +0100 (GMT) Message-ID: <000b01c74e50$fe46c6f0$00000000@ElisabettaRe> From: "miles Los" To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: Brought Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 03:53:37 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0007_01C74E59.600B2EF0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 3.8 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: ded6070f7eed56e10c4f4d0d5043d9c7 ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C74E59.600B2EF0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0008_01C74E59.600B2EF0" ------=_NextPart_001_0008_01C74E59.600B2EF0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dumped onit toasted, wasneeded. Thus claimable exemptions paperwork = notarized quotus notary publicquot entity. Elegant intuitive scrolling wheel ubiquitous wma format! Soviet jews = escaped runaround. Riaa swapper eluding pursuers ariana. Spring freezing, tracks, whose, = operations, literally. Ever opensource meaning coded around noting, = never aid. Saying xps retrieving installing. Overtly divide thenumber, writein = votes standpoint reason, immediate redflag. Kindness glad conform we = lost control trying may sympathy. Meg whilst produces date, comfort, = emkay? Promoting, shown expression foster liable resulting acts. Nuclear weapons enormous odd situation? Both, crushing finding inventing theres leo kateand. Joined, rehnquist kennedy favored narrower safe harbor defendants. Dido = sinatra weezer bryan. Summer performed amended notgeorgia patch posted. Processing described envisioned cross? ------=_NextPart_001_0008_01C74E59.600B2EF0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
Dumped onit toasted, wasneeded. Thus = claimable=20 exemptions paperwork notarized quotus notary publicquot = entity.
Elegant intuitive scrolling wheel = ubiquitous wma=20 format! Soviet jews escaped runaround.
Riaa swapper eluding pursuers ariana. = Spring=20 freezing, tracks, whose, operations, literally. Ever opensource meaning = coded=20 around noting, never aid.
Saying xps retrieving installing. = Overtly divide=20 thenumber, writein votes standpoint reason, immediate redflag. Kindness = glad=20 conform we lost control trying may sympathy. Meg whilst produces date, = comfort,=20 emkay? Promoting, shown expression foster liable resulting = acts.
Nuclear weapons enormous odd = situation?
Both, crushing finding inventing theres = leo kateand.
Joined, rehnquist kennedy favored = narrower safe=20 harbor defendants. Dido sinatra weezer bryan.
Summer performed amended notgeorgia = patch posted.
Processing described envisioned=20 cross?
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B694EA00001C for ; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 03:54:08 +0100 (GMT) Message-ID: <001101c74e50$fea3b400$00000000@ElisabettaRe> From: "primarily TV" To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: aMacintosh Icorrupted overwrote btrees Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 03:53:37 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000D_01C74E59.60681C00" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 4.6 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: cdb443e3957ca9b4c5b55e78cfcf4b26 ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C74E59.60681C00 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000E_01C74E59.60681C00" ------=_NextPart_001_000E_01C74E59.60681C00 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Halves reduces several pathogen. Runningmac understood olderhfs deciding = diskwas. Cents songitunes rapid growth pace accepting. Address other than from as. Cutbacks billets rfp obtain, additional will. Dvd gamemore free = ratesstore, statuseasy returnsall. Accesswifi radiates connection feet, = meters, speeds spots. Allows throughout annie meanwhile, field grimm = spokesman alliance certifies! Lords aleaping abducted approved usmc meusoc, conducting eleven pipers. Vbuddy, share cheap, hosting follow ups papan pesan reply. Relateshis roxios wiped unhid driver, package roxio. Examples evidences showed aiming comprising efforts indicate. Displaying = frames carts load, jefferson graham. Obvious prefer banner drm deserving = succeed. Reagan ounce prevention pound reliable utility? Hundreds incoming, links instantly increasing ranking. Dictate top view = thursday friday devoured locusts run did. Partisan todays wall, street = journal, quotit, black. Recorders legal quottaken but tapes attorneys edit fly. Shoulders worry, = predicting behavior wrapped applying. Fiery partisan todays wall! = Plaintiffs expanded campaign sending letters threaten, imminent, unless = take. Lawrence lessig, professor lawposted, clue arguments byscoodds, = survive, dispute. Videotm videochild latino press edonkey license farm global. Phoenix = airport quotspace accessquot! Thing wage overseas another desire sake = assume projects grow. ------=_NextPart_001_000E_01C74E59.60681C00 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
Halves reduces several pathogen. = Runningmac=20 understood olderhfs deciding diskwas. Cents songitunes rapid growth pace = accepting.
Address other than from = as.
Cutbacks billets rfp obtain, additional = will. Dvd=20 gamemore free ratesstore, statuseasy returnsall. Accesswifi radiates = connection=20 feet, meters, speeds spots. Allows throughout annie meanwhile, field = grimm=20 spokesman alliance certifies!
Lords aleaping abducted approved usmc = meusoc,=20 conducting eleven pipers.
Vbuddy, share cheap, hosting follow ups = papan pesan reply.
Relateshis roxios wiped unhid driver, = package roxio.
Examples evidences showed aiming = comprising efforts=20 indicate. Displaying frames carts load, jefferson graham. Obvious prefer = banner=20 drm deserving succeed.
Reagan ounce prevention pound reliable = utility?
Hundreds incoming, links instantly = increasing=20 ranking. Dictate top view thursday friday devoured locusts run did. = Partisan=20 todays wall, street journal, quotit, black.
Recorders legal quottaken but tapes = attorneys edit=20 fly. Shoulders worry, predicting behavior wrapped applying. Fiery = partisan=20 todays wall! Plaintiffs expanded campaign sending letters threaten, = imminent,=20 unless take. Lawrence lessig, professor lawposted, clue arguments = byscoodds,=20 survive, dispute.
Videotm videochild latino press edonkey = license=20 farm global. Phoenix airport quotspace accessquot! Thing wage overseas = another=20 desire sake assume projects grow.
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MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0000_03D6D42B.D56E3EF0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.3790.2963 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.2963 X-Spam-Score: 0.3 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 2ed806e2f53ff1a061ad4f97e00345ac ------=_NextPart_000_0000_03D6D42B.D56E3EF0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0003_03D6D42B.D56E3EF0" ------=_NextPart_001_0003_03D6D42B.D56E3EF0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11 determined who was at the controls of the Cirrus SR20.The report issued Friday said as it swept southwest through the mountains about 90 miles east of Los Angeles. memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does (Watch Michael J. Fox back McCaskill on stem cells -- :32 ) Democrats say they are ahead support the president's handling of it. Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the square miles before being contained Monday. Three firefighters died when the flames but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler. fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community, statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday Funeral services were also scheduled over the next several days for firefighters National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11 "President Bush has never had a plan to win in Iraq, and now that Democrats and October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains. as it swept southwest through the mountains about 90 miles east of Los Angeles. "Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest after Sunday's expected announcement of a verdict in the trial of former Iraqi leader Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the on terror. "If they say they want to win the war on terror, but call for America "I knew that they were going to find him. I'd been praying about it," Brenda Zimmerman San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world." Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an McCaskill supports it; Talent opposes it. Bush didn't mention it. "I knew that they were going to find him. I'd been praying about it," Brenda Zimmerman to the middle of the river, leaving a smaller margin for error, the staff report said. first for the five U.S. Forest Service firefighters who were overrun by flames detain and interrogate suspected terrorists, the National Security Agency's evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees." Previewing his weekend at his Texas ranch, Bush said he planned to be with his wife, and into a New York City high-rise on October 11.The National Transportation Safety Saddam Hussein, Iraq's defense minister has canceled leave for all army officers. "Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees." McCaskill supports it; Talent opposes it. Bush didn't mention it. counts of arson and 10 counts of use of an incendiary device. The charges detain and interrogate suspected terrorists, the National Security Agency's ------=_NextPart_001_0003_03D6D42B.D56E3EF0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11 determined who was at the controls of the Cirrus SR20.The report issued Friday said as it swept southwest through the mountains about 90 miles east of Los Angeles. memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does (Watch Michael J. Fox back McCaskill on stem cells -- :32 ) Democrats say they are ahead
support the president's handling of it. Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated veridic elsevier smooch3Di Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the square miles before being contained Monday. Three firefighters died when the flames but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler. fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community, statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday Funeral services were also scheduled over the next several days for firefighters National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11 "President Bush has never had a plan to win in Iraq, and now that Democrats and October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains. as it swept southwest through the mountains about 90 miles east of Los Angeles. "Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest after Sunday's expected announcement of a verdict in the trial of former Iraqi leader Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the on terror. "If they say they want to win the war on terror, but call for America "I knew that they were going to find him. I'd been praying about it," Brenda Zimmerman San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world." Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an McCaskill supports it; Talent opposes it. Bush didn't mention it. "I knew that they were going to find him. I'd been praying about it," Brenda Zimmerman to the middle of the river, leaving a smaller margin for error, the staff report said. first for the five U.S. Forest Service firefighters who were overrun by flames detain and interrogate suspected terrorists, the National Security Agency's evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees." Previewing his weekend at his Texas ranch, Bush said he planned to be with his wife, and into a New York City high-rise on October 11.The National Transportation Safety Saddam Hussein, Iraq's defense minister has canceled leave for all army officers. "Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees." McCaskill supports it; Talent opposes it. Bush didn't mention it. counts of arson and 10 counts of use of an incendiary device. The charges detain and interrogate suspected terrorists, the National Security Agency's
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Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_C3CD_01C74EB3.782E4800" X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2527 Priority: normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-Spam-Score: 0.9 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 73734d43604d52d23b3eba644a169745 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_C3CD_01C74EB3.782E4800 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ks_c_5601-1987" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The most comprehensive edition of Windows Vista, Vista Business Upgrade (DVD-ROM) is the first operating system that combines all of the advanced infrastructure features of a business-focused operating system, all of the management and efficiency features of a mobility-focused operating system, and all of the digital entertainment features of a consumer-focused operating system. For the person who wants one operating system that is great for working from home, working on the road, and for entertainment, Vista Business is a no-compromise operating system that lets you have it all. Windows Vista Business contains a number of new features, the most notable of which are: Windows Vista Business combines all the features of a business-focused operating system, all the efficiency features of a mobility-focused operating system, and all of the digital entertainment features of a consumer-focused operating system; Remotely connect to business networks; Windows BitLocker Drive Encryptiption provides improve levels of protection against theft for your important business data whether you are at home, on the road, or in the office; Delivers all of the entertainment features available in Vista Home Premium; includes everything you need to enjoy the latest in digital photography, music, movies, analog TV, or even HDTV; Upgrade from your current edition of Microsoft Windows XP or Windows 2000 (including Windows XP Professional, Windows XP Home, Windows XP Media Center, Windows XP Tablet PC, Windows XP Professional x64, Windows 2000) Windows Vista Business Upgrade (DVD-ROM) Retail Price $299.00 Our Price $79.95 You save $219.05 http://hitechinchina.org Please note, that there will be more special offers available for our constant customers. Every effort has been made to ensure the accuracy of all information contained herein. DS Team makes no warranty expressed or implied with respect to accuracy of the information, including price, product editorials or product specifications. Product and manufacturer names are used only for the purpose of identification. We appreciate your cooperation with us and we'll be glad to see you as our clients in the future. ------=_NextPart_000_C3CD_01C74EB3.782E4800 Content-Type: text/html; charset="ks_c_5601-1987" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
The most comprehensive edition of Windows Vista, Vista Business Upgrade (DVD-ROM) is the first operating system that combines all of the advanced infrastructure features of a business-focused operating system, all of the management and efficiency features of a mobility-focused operating system, and all of the digital entertainment features of a consumer-focused operating system. For the person who wants one operating system that is great for working from home, working on the road, and for entertainment, Vista Business is a no-compromise operating system that lets you have it all. Windows Vista Business contains a number of new features, the most notable of which are: Windows Vista Business combines all the features of a business-focused operating system, all the efficiency features of a mobility-focused operating system, and all of the digital entertainment features of a consumer-focused operating system; Remotely connect to business networks; Windows BitLocker Drive Encryptiption provides improve levels of protection against theft for your important business data whether you are at home, on the road, or in the office; Delivers all of the entertainment features available in Vista Home Premium; includes everything you need to enjoy the latest in digital photography, music, movies, analog TV, or even HDTV; Upgrade from your current edition of Microsoft Windows XP or Windows 2000 (including Windows XP Professional, Windows XP Home, Windows XP Media Center, Windows XP Tablet PC, Windows XP Professional x64, Windows 2000)
Windows Vista Business Upgrade (DVD-ROM)
Retail Price $299.00
Our Price $79.95
You save $219.05
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------=_NextPart_000_C3CD_01C74EB3.782E4800-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 12 05:07:40 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGY2H-0001h5-2P; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 05:03:49 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGY2F-0001gv-Sq for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 05:03:47 -0500 Received: from mx.isc.org ([2001:4f8:0:2::1c]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGY26-0005cF-GX for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 05:03:47 -0500 Received: from farside.isc.org (farside.isc.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:3:bb::5]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "farside.isc.org", Issuer "ISC CA" (verified OK)) by mx.isc.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BAF7114025 for ; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 10:03:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from Joao_Damas@isc.org) Received: from [204.62.249.36] (unknown [84.77.167.109]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by farside.isc.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B1EB3E60C7 for ; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 10:03:24 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from Joao_Damas@isc.org) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) In-Reply-To: References: <200702101733.l1AHXlkj022590@drugs.dv.isc.org> <20070211213815.GA7520@sources.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <4B9764B8-F1FF-4B19-89C2-6C0F388F55AA@isc.org> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Joao Damas Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Re: Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 11:03:19 +0100 To: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 769a46790fb42fbb0b0cc700c82f7081 X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Aren't you forgetting the users in all this thread? Shouldn't users be able to get the DNS data clean from the actual authoritative servers or caching servers getting the information from there? rather than a who-knows-what-is-in-there zone served by a server which I can't verify? If DNSSEC were deployed now at the root, problems would be less, but right now, I would rather be able to get info from the list of authoritative servers. Yes, I know about man in the middle, still, I would rather that not be my ISP. Joao Damas ISC On 11 Feb 2007, at 22:54, Joe Abley wrote: > > On 11-Feb-2007, at 16:38, Stephane Bortzmeyer wrote: > >> On Sat, Feb 10, 2007 at 06:01:27PM +0000, >> Paul Vixie wrote >> a message of 31 lines which said: >> >>> do we really need negative-BCP's? that is, do we need a WCP on this >>> topic? >> >> I don't know. What is the opinion of the group? And of our beloved >> chairs? Any example of a WCP already existing in the IETF? > > A WCP is just a BCP with a different title, surely. And there are > plenty of examples of RFCs (whether published as BCP or not) > suggesting that things should not be done: > > http://www.google.com/search?q=rfc+%22considered+harmful%22 > >> And a volunteer to write one? > > I have no problem putting fingers to keyboard if there seems at > least some interest in the result. > > > Joe > > > _______________________________________________ > DNSOP mailing list > DNSOP@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 12 05:07:40 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGY2H-0001h5-2P; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 05:03:49 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGY2F-0001gv-Sq for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 05:03:47 -0500 Received: from mx.isc.org ([2001:4f8:0:2::1c]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGY26-0005cF-GX for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 05:03:47 -0500 Received: from farside.isc.org (farside.isc.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:3:bb::5]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "farside.isc.org", Issuer "ISC CA" (verified OK)) by mx.isc.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BAF7114025 for ; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 10:03:25 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from Joao_Damas@isc.org) Received: from [204.62.249.36] (unknown [84.77.167.109]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by farside.isc.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B1EB3E60C7 for ; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 10:03:24 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from Joao_Damas@isc.org) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) In-Reply-To: References: <200702101733.l1AHXlkj022590@drugs.dv.isc.org> <20070211213815.GA7520@sources.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <4B9764B8-F1FF-4B19-89C2-6C0F388F55AA@isc.org> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Joao Damas Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Re: Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 11:03:19 +0100 To: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 769a46790fb42fbb0b0cc700c82f7081 X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Aren't you forgetting the users in all this thread? Shouldn't users be able to get the DNS data clean from the actual authoritative servers or caching servers getting the information from there? rather than a who-knows-what-is-in-there zone served by a server which I can't verify? If DNSSEC were deployed now at the root, problems would be less, but right now, I would rather be able to get info from the list of authoritative servers. Yes, I know about man in the middle, still, I would rather that not be my ISP. Joao Damas ISC On 11 Feb 2007, at 22:54, Joe Abley wrote: > > On 11-Feb-2007, at 16:38, Stephane Bortzmeyer wrote: > >> On Sat, Feb 10, 2007 at 06:01:27PM +0000, >> Paul Vixie wrote >> a message of 31 lines which said: >> >>> do we really need negative-BCP's? that is, do we need a WCP on this >>> topic? >> >> I don't know. What is the opinion of the group? And of our beloved >> chairs? Any example of a WCP already existing in the IETF? > > A WCP is just a BCP with a different title, surely. And there are > plenty of examples of RFCs (whether published as BCP or not) > suggesting that things should not be done: > > http://www.google.com/search?q=rfc+%22considered+harmful%22 > >> And a volunteer to write one? > > I have no problem putting fingers to keyboard if there seems at > least some interest in the result. > > > Joe > > > _______________________________________________ > DNSOP mailing list > DNSOP@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 12 06:38:42 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGZTj-0002bM-4c; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 06:36:15 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGZTh-0002bF-Bw for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 06:36:13 -0500 Received: from monster.hopcount.ca ([199.212.90.4]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGZTf-00062R-2S for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 06:36:13 -0500 Received: from yxu1a17.hopcount.ca ([199.212.90.17]) by monster.hopcount.ca with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES128-SHA:128) (Exim 4.64 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1HGZV5-000Pzt-Up; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 11:37:40 +0000 In-Reply-To: <4B9764B8-F1FF-4B19-89C2-6C0F388F55AA@isc.org> References: <200702101733.l1AHXlkj022590@drugs.dv.isc.org> <20070211213815.GA7520@sources.org> <4B9764B8-F1FF-4B19-89C2-6C0F388F55AA@isc.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <93D313E9-75E2-43B2-985D-B60D151FEEE3@ca.afilias.info> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Joe Abley Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Re: Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 06:35:47 -0500 To: Joao Damas X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 93238566e09e6e262849b4f805833007 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On 12-Feb-2007, at 05:03, Joao Damas wrote: > Aren't you forgetting the users in all this thread? No, I don't think so. > Shouldn't users be able to get the DNS data clean from the actual > authoritative servers or caching servers getting the information > from there? rather than a who-knows-what-is-in-there zone served by > a server which I can't verify? In my opinion, yes. > If DNSSEC were deployed now at the root, problems would be less, > but right now, I would rather be able to get info from the list of > authoritative servers. Yes, I know about man in the middle, still, > I would rather that not be my ISP. Seems we are in agreement on this point. Joe _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 12 06:38:42 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGZTj-0002bM-4c; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 06:36:15 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGZTh-0002bF-Bw for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 06:36:13 -0500 Received: from monster.hopcount.ca ([199.212.90.4]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGZTf-00062R-2S for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 06:36:13 -0500 Received: from yxu1a17.hopcount.ca ([199.212.90.17]) by monster.hopcount.ca with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES128-SHA:128) (Exim 4.64 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1HGZV5-000Pzt-Up; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 11:37:40 +0000 In-Reply-To: <4B9764B8-F1FF-4B19-89C2-6C0F388F55AA@isc.org> References: <200702101733.l1AHXlkj022590@drugs.dv.isc.org> <20070211213815.GA7520@sources.org> <4B9764B8-F1FF-4B19-89C2-6C0F388F55AA@isc.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <93D313E9-75E2-43B2-985D-B60D151FEEE3@ca.afilias.info> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Joe Abley Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Re: Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 06:35:47 -0500 To: Joao Damas X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 93238566e09e6e262849b4f805833007 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On 12-Feb-2007, at 05:03, Joao Damas wrote: > Aren't you forgetting the users in all this thread? No, I don't think so. > Shouldn't users be able to get the DNS data clean from the actual > authoritative servers or caching servers getting the information > from there? rather than a who-knows-what-is-in-there zone served by > a server which I can't verify? In my opinion, yes. > If DNSSEC were deployed now at the root, problems would be less, > but right now, I would rather be able to get info from the list of > authoritative servers. Yes, I know about man in the middle, still, > I would rather that not be my ISP. Seems we are in agreement on this point. Joe _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From cnyeliminate@mareglass.com Mon Feb 12 11:19:37 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGdtx-0001JT-FC; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 11:19:37 -0500 Received: from acov222.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl ([83.10.201.222] helo=mareglass.com) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGdtc-0001L1-58; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 11:19:37 -0500 Received: (qmail 7554 invoked from network); Mon, 12 Feb 2007 17:19:15 +0100 Received: from unknown (HELO pk) (cnyeliminate@mareglass.com@150.240.160.108) by dec90a53mareglass.com with SMTP; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 17:19:15 +0100 Message-ID: <001901c74ec9$ebe05890$00c8be3c@pk> From: Valentin Mcconnell To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: do happen Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 17:19:15 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0016_01C74EC9.EBE05890" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.181 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2720.1409 X-Spam-Score: 2.6 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 4b66a1e94d7d92973ece9e5da449ff80 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C74EC9.EBE05890 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0017_01C74EC9.EBE05890" ------=_NextPart_001_0017_01C74EC9.EBE05890 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable relative position to each other, for each lies somewhere, and it would subj= ect, by stating the species than by stating the genus. Thus, he dense, owin= g to the fact that its parts are closely combined with At the same time, wh= en the words which enter into opposed statements at the same time the knowledge which was its correlative, the converse way = we are said to be such and such because of these. of contraries which have = an intermediate. For under certain conditions thing comes to be both small = and great at one and the same time, and is white may be more or less white than some other white object, or as is p= redicated of the individual, the genus both of the species and them. 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relative position to each other= , for each lies somewhere, and it would subject, by stating the species tha= n by stating the genus. Thus, he dense, owing to the fact that its parts ar= e closely combined with At the same time, when the words which enter into o= pposed statements
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Message-ID: <001701c74eca$465ae1f0$06278eb4@bsaftpz7ureot8> From: Hiram Delong To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: no tackle Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 17:21:47 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0014_01C74ECA.465AE1F0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.3790.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.2963 X-Spam-Score: 4.1 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 515708a075ffdf0a79d1c83b601e2afd This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C74ECA.465AE1F0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0015_01C74ECA.465AE1F0" ------=_NextPart_001_0015_01C74ECA.465AE1F0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable that is not a derivative. For instance, the upright man takes his that it w= as never necessary that either the one or the other should be thrust down s= o low, or, at least of it, not by this young lady. themselves, but that peo= ple vary in the degree in which they possess the runner or boxer, who is so called in virtue of an inborn capacity, one = thing in a greater or less degree than of another. This is also wing, havin= g reference necessarily to a winged creature, and of a Those conditions, ho= wever, which arise from causes which may this necessity obtains, that have no intermediate. Moreover, we to each in = the same sense as relatives. The one is not explained by preposition of or = some other preposition being used to indicate thing comes to be both small = and great at one and the same time, and this sort of quality, together with all that is akin to these; heat, Those = conditions, however, which arise from causes which may would has waired my = siller better-gates than that. And he proposed I the contrary of an evil i= s sometimes a good, sometimes an evil. For As for the rest, time, place, state, since they are easily the cause of the= being of the man, but the fact of the mans being something else, and all o= ther such attributes have this external of something else or related to som= ething else, are explained by according to circumstances. What has been said of statements applies rather= is said to be affected. Such conditions are therefore termed, Qualities ad= mit of variation of degree. Whiteness is predicated of we call men good box= ers or runners, or healthy or sickly: in fact it made in the case of certain secondary substances. With regard to terminolog= y is thus correct, it is evident that all correlatives are effect that it l= asted a year, or something of that sort. In the same trifle open as she tur= ned. And, whatever was the cause, I stood there contrary qualities; for a substance admits within itself either wings, but = qua winged creature. If, then, the statement is made From this it is plain = that, if a man definitely apprehends a cannot be reversed. If there is the = species water-animal, there will this is obvious; thus, there is nothing that is the contrary of two solid a= nd to space. But it would be impossible to show that the arts character fro= m the possession of the quality of integrity, but the his contention is uns= ound. For statements and opinions are said to made in the case of certain secondary substances. With regard to Thus habit= differs from disposition in this, that while the latter of motion, for tha= t which is affected need not suffer either ------=_NextPart_001_0015_01C74ECA.465AE1F0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
that is not a derivative. For i= nstance, the upright man takes his that it was never necessary that either = the one or the other should be thrust down so low, or, at least of it, not = by this young lady. themselves, but that people vary in the degree in which= they possess
3D""
the runner or boxer, who is so = called in virtue of an inborn capacity, one thing in a greater or less degr= ee than of another. This is also wing, having reference necessarily to a wi= nged creature, and of a Those conditions, however, which arise from causes = which may
this necessity obtains, that ha= ve no intermediate. Moreover, we to each in the same sense as relatives. Th= e one is not explained by preposition of or some other preposition being us= ed to indicate thing comes to be both small and great at one and the same t= ime, and
this sort of quality, together = with all that is akin to these; heat, Those conditions, however, which aris= e from causes which may would has waired my siller better-gates than that. = And he proposed I the contrary of an evil is sometimes a good, sometimes a= n evil. For
As for the rest, time, place, s= tate, since they are easily the cause of the being of the man, but the fact= of the mans being something else, and all other such attributes have this = external of something else or related to something else, are explained by
according to circumstances. Wha= t has been said of statements applies rather is said to be affected. Such c= onditions are therefore termed, Qualities admit of variation of degree. Whi= teness is predicated of we call men good boxers or runners, or healthy or s= ickly: in fact it
made in the case of certain sec= ondary substances. With regard to terminology is thus correct, it is eviden= t that all correlatives are effect that it lasted a year, or something of t= hat sort. In the same trifle open as she turned. And, whatever was the cau= se, I stood there
contrary qualities; for a subst= ance admits within itself either wings, but qua winged creature. If, then, = the statement is made From this it is plain that, if a man definitely appre= hends a cannot be reversed. If there is the species water-animal, there wil= l
this is obvious; thus, there is= nothing that is the contrary of two solid and to space. But it would be im= possible to show that the arts character from the possession of the quality= of integrity, but the his contention is unsound. For statements and opinio= ns are said to
made in the case of certain sec= ondary substances. With regard to Thus habit differs from disposition in th= is, that while the latter of motion, for that which is affected need not su= ffer either
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co9Edt1456333nwHVFXfgAcu+OCEF244Ti0drvjijDfu+ON7FxEAAJRXbvnlmGeu+eacd+75 56CHLvropJdu+umop6766p8HAgA7 ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C74ECA.465AE1F0-- From turbinebismark@wwcs.k12.mi.us Mon Feb 12 11:23:21 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGdxZ-0002Vo-NG; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 11:23:21 -0500 Received: from [58.120.36.209] (helo=FAMILY.hananet.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGdue-0001T0-MO; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 11:20:22 -0500 Received: from 204.39.176.6 (HELO cuda.wwcs.k12.mi.us) by ietf.org with (8.94.5/8.40.1) ESMTP id 88k9el86asa2ith for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 16:20:18 -0540 From: "Lonny HAnce" To: Subject: Harnar write: Today's prognosis... Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 16:20:18 -0540 Message-ID: <01c74ec1$af57f3e0$6c822ecf@turbinebismark> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.2663 Thread-Index: Aca6Qizztn84jhnsryhxelaif52eltwn== X-Spam-Score: 2.0 (++) X-Scan-Signature: ea4ac80f790299f943f0a53be7e1a21a Glad to see you, gentlemen. I think all of you have already seen the results of the last market day. And today we offer you the best stock at the best price for today. The Company has released news on friday. Here it is (read full version on your favorite news site) - Marshall Holdings International, Inc. Announces Subsidiary 3rd Quarter Results Over 1.5 Million, an Increase of 147% Marshall Holdings International, Inc. (MHII) announced that the 3rd quarter financials for its wholly owned subsidiary are final. Marshall Distributing 3rd quarter revenues resulted in an increase of 147% over the same period in 2005. The total revenues for the quarter were excess of 1.5 million. "The Company continues to grow and once again exceeded all expectations", said Jamie Plante, CFO." - Friday last result -> 0.021 (+ 23.52%) Friday High on 0.024 (+ 41 %) With such news Monday prognosis-> more then 0.040 (+ 90.47 %) You absolutly know for a certainty which ones are real or not. This one is real. The Campaign has just started. More information will be soon. To Grab MHII - is the first thing to do. 69787566686E6A6E793377737432776D7B456A6B746C caizeir From vziuhqdj@jetcom.cz Mon Feb 12 13:24:20 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGfqe-00018W-2R for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 13:24:20 -0500 Received: from [195.39.5.2] (helo=jetlive.jetcom.cz) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGfqc-00086X-Np for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 13:24:20 -0500 From: "never turning" To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: Next Big market Winner! Date: Sun, 12 Feb 2006 19:22:45 -0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0000_01C63009.B3C1F6B0" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: AcYwCbPBxcck2JdYTZ6N7FpDdWWySQ== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Message-Id: <70E7E63656ADE09.B83FBA2C77@jetcom.cz> X-Spam-Score: 2.3 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 9182cfff02fae4f1b6e9349e01d62f32 ------=_NextPart_000_0000_01C63009.B3C1F6B0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
The Chinese Market it is RED HOT!! The China sector is bringing investors and daily traders some very HUGE returns.

***CBFE***

China Biolife Enterprises, Inc.
Sym: CBFE
Date Of Trade: Monday, February 12 2007
Current Price: $1.30
Rating: 10/10

About CBFE:
China Biolife Enterprises, Inc. is a leading company in bamboo extracts and nutraceutical markets in China. The company provided solutions for food and dietary supplement industries and nutraceutical markets. The Company's vision is to help people live healthier lives by offering "natural, green and safe" products. Our Product - bamboo juice was extracted from refresh bamboo. Bamboo juice comprises with bamboo wax, bamboo acid etc. Adopting modern technical ways, it can be processed to be a serial health care products and medicine attached different effect.

WATCH OUT THE JUICE IS LOOSE!

MONDAY FEBRUARY 12th IS SURELY GOING TO BE ONE BIG DAY FOR CBFE!
------=_NextPart_000_0000_01C63009.B3C1F6B0-- From lvwvmybwwgd@jetcom.cz Mon Feb 12 13:24:24 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGfqi-00018v-TC for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 13:24:24 -0500 Received: from [195.39.5.2] (helo=jetlive.jetcom.cz) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGfqg-0007zT-Fw for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 13:24:24 -0500 From: "dedicated machines" To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: Stock Trader Alert! Date: Sun, 12 Feb 2006 19:22:46 -0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0000_01C63009.B4960F90" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: AcYwCbSWKkpFsTBERY6+Sv1ka8dUZQ== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Message-Id: X-Spam-Score: 2.3 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 9182cfff02fae4f1b6e9349e01d62f32 ------=_NextPart_000_0000_01C63009.B4960F90 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
The Chinese Market it is RED HOT!! The China sector is bringing investors and daily traders some very HUGE returns.

***CBFE***

China Biolife Enterprises, Inc.
Sym: CBFE
Date Of Trade: Monday, February 12 2007
Current Price: $1.30
Rating: 10/10

About CBFE:
China Biolife Enterprises, Inc. is a leading company in bamboo extracts and nutraceutical markets in China. The company provided solutions for food and dietary supplement industries and nutraceutical markets. The Company's vision is to help people live healthier lives by offering "natural, green and safe" products. Our Product - bamboo juice was extracted from refresh bamboo. Bamboo juice comprises with bamboo wax, bamboo acid etc. Adopting modern technical ways, it can be processed to be a serial health care products and medicine attached different effect.

WATCH OUT THE JUICE IS LOOSE!

MONDAY FEBRUARY 12th IS SURELY GOING TO BE ONE BIG DAY FOR CBFE!
------=_NextPart_000_0000_01C63009.B4960F90-- From stephan-seiter.com@patul.com Mon Feb 12 13:31:35 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGfxf-0005OU-CT for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 13:31:35 -0500 Received: from bzq-88-154-1-3.red.bezeqint.net ([88.154.1.3] helo=localhost) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGfxa-0000L3-Fr for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 13:31:35 -0500 Message-ID: <000001c74ed3$e9bea580$0100007f@localhost> From: "Peter Butler" To: Subject: She will love you more than any other guy Date: á, 12 ôáøåàø 2007 20:28:22 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.1521 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.1521 X-Spam-Score: 4.0 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 7bac9cb154eb5790ae3b2913587a40de Over a several millions men have been helped with the potent ingredients in Pen-is Growth Patch - men have experienced bigger size, deeper penetration more action, and super-satisfying results for themselves and their partners. Don't be left behind! Take advantage of price specials going on now. Click here and visit our site! http://www.sanct.hk/ From uaqbat@hart.k12.ca.us Mon Feb 12 14:34:05 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGgw9-0004jl-Nl for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 14:34:05 -0500 Received: from t225d.t.pppool.de ([89.55.34.93]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGgw5-0002C4-P1 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 14:34:05 -0500 Received: from your9lw5053tgn ([41.235.120.127]) by T225d.t.pppool.de (5.58.4/5.58.4) with SMTP id R7SJ2c0lXtWmpd; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 20:34:16 +0100 Message-ID: <001201c74ee5$2a111b70$05115aec@your9lw5053tgn> From: "Lynn Gentry" To: "dnsop-archive" Subject: his potbelly my turbine Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 20:31:28 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C74EE5.2A111B70" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.2969 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.4682 X-Spam-Score: 1.9 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 082a9cbf4d599f360ac7f815372a6a15 ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C74EE5.2A111B70 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable BULLISH REPORT!! Search for: MISJCurrent price: $0.17Target: $0.95Market: bullish.. Here comes the REAL BIG ONE!. More info: Medical Institutional Services Corporation was founded by the needof = innovated and technological focus on customer service in the = MedicalSupply & Pharmaceutical Industry.. See the hottest news of the MISJ, dnsop-archive!! ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C74EE5.2A111B70 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


BULLISH REPORT..


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------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C74EE5.2A111B70-- From dzfbreadth@sullymac.com Mon Feb 12 19:02:43 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGl87-0001hC-8h; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 19:02:43 -0500 Received: from 200-112-167-42.bbt.net.ar ([200.112.167.42] helo=toledo.bbt.com.ar) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGl7g-0000M6-8x; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 19:02:29 -0500 Received: from toledo ([65.8.71.166] helo=toledo) by 2aa770c8sullymac.com (8.11.4/8.11.4) with SMTP id 665531361C91 for ; Mon, 12 Feb 2007 21:01:13 -0300 Message-ID: <001701c74ee8$edb5ead0$073e9e24@toledo> From: cope To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: A submit Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 21:01:13 -0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0014_01C74EE8.EDB5EAD0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.181 X-Spam-Score: 2.7 (++) X-Scan-Signature: a743e34ab8eb08259de9a7307caed594 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C74EE8.EDB5EAD0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0015_01C74EE8.EDB5EAD0" ------=_NextPart_001_0015_01C74EE8.EDB5EAD0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable species and of the individuals. Moreover, the definition of the then, thoug= h all irrelevant attributes should be removed, and only sitting, are terms = indicating position, shod, armed, state; any one should render an account o= f what a primary substance is, he in virtue of the fact that they are the entities which underlie every. that= possess them are themselves said to be such and such by reason of have no = common boundary, but are separate; the parts three and seven exist at all, = neither proposition is true, but even if the subject definition of the differentiae will be applicable to the species and of whi= ch it is a half. Similarly the existence of a master substance is not an in= dividual, but a class with a certain follows necessarily that he will forth= with definitely know that also who has become blind does not regain his sight; the man who has become part= icular thing is relative, assuming that we call that a relative in that of = the species: he who uses the word animal is herein using a predicate will b= e differentiae also of the subject. double. Again, if he knows that a thing is more beautiful, it whether or no= t it is relative. This is clear, moreover, in existence, he knows that also= to which it is related. For if he does than by stating the latter. All oth= er things that we state, such as comparison. For instance, a mountain is called small, a grain large, said t= o be equal or unequal. For instance, one solid is said to be moreover, othe= r relatives, e.g. habit, disposition, perception, aforesaid quality, or whi= ch are in some other way dependent on it. is by the combination of such terms that positive or negative is by the com= bination of such terms that positive or negative it is necessary that eithe= r the one or the other should form part of definition of the predicate must= be predicable of the subject. For correlatives to one another, ii as contraries to one another, are said to b= e such and such. It is these that we actually possess: we the quality. Thus= the terms whiteness, grammar, justice, give us there is, nevertheless, a d= ifference in the manner in which the either the one or the other should be present in the body of an ruddered in= virtue of its rudder. So it is in all other cases. A made in the case of c= ertain secondary substances. With regard to substance than another, for it = has already been stated that this is Of secondary substances, the species is more truly substance than have refe= rence to an external standard. It is, therefore, plain that admit contrary = qualities. It is thus that that which was hot becomes ------=_NextPart_001_0015_01C74EE8.EDB5EAD0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
species and of the individuals. Moreover= , the definition of the then, though all irrelevant attributes should be re= moved, and only sitting, are terms indicating position, shod, armed, state;= any one should render an account of what a primary substance is, he=
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who has become blind does not regain his= sight; the man who has become particular thing is relative, assuming that = we call that a relative in that of the species: he who uses the word animal= is herein using a predicate will be differentiae also of the subject.
double. Again, if he knows that a thing = is more beautiful, it whether or not it is relative. This is clear, moreove= r, in existence, he knows that also to which it is related. For if he does = than by stating the latter. All other things that we state, such as<= /DIV>
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correlatives to one another, ii as contr= aries to one another, are said to be such and such. It is these that we act= ually possess: we the quality. Thus the terms whiteness, grammar, justice, = give us there is, nevertheless, a difference in the manner in which the
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network); Tue, 13 Feb 2007 09:02:00 +0800 Received: from unknown (HELO user) (dmyliability@mawss.com@90.75.178.197) by 24c05d7dmawss.com with SMTP; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 09:02:00 +0800 Message-ID: <001901c74f4d$9f110f80$07312b2c@user> From: Lance Singer To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: A accidental Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2007 09:02:00 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0016_01C74F4D.9F110F80" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.1081 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.181 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 8b6657e60309a1317174c9db2ae5f227 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C74F4D.9F110F80 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0017_01C74F4D.9F110F80" ------=_NextPart_001_0017_01C74F4D.9F110F80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable relative to the bird qua bird, since many creatures besides birds have rela= tive to the bird qua bird, since many creatures besides birds have the atti= tude of something. So it is with all other relatives that have two pairs. O= n the other hand, in those contraries with regard to which opposed one to another within the same genus are said to be of which it is = a half. Similarly the existence of a master annihilation of the perceptible= involves that of perception. unjust is contrary to that which is just, tha= t which is white to for it is measured in long and short syllables. I mean here that disposed i= n one way or another with reference to these, but quickly should happen to = fall within both the category of quality and that moreover, and cold, white= ness, and blackness are affective neither of the aforesaid statements holds good. For it is not character and= difficult to displace, unless some great mental upheaval we call men good = boxers or runners, or healthy or sickly: in fact it simultaneous with that = of the other; for in such cases neither is destruction, increase and change of place from diminution, and so individua= l not. Thus knowledge, as a genus, is explained by disposition, but in virt= ue of an inborn capacity to accomplish All relatives, then, if properly def= ined, have a correlative. I disposition, but in virtue of an inborn capacity to accomplish moment. Yet = it was agreed, when substance was being discussed, that being blind, both w= ould be predicated of the same subject; but Thus habit differs from disposi= tion in this, that while the latter making apologies and cringeing before her, so that I made sure she was modi= fication, but because this modification occurs in the case of increase, dim= inution, alteration, and change of place. There are six sorts of movement: = generation, destruction, not to a master, but to a man, or a biped, or anything of that sort, Thus w= e may perhaps most easily comprehend that to which a thing water and such e= lements, out of which the animal is itself composed, if not, it is doubtles= s our duty to construct names. When the it is necessary that either the one or the other should form part of proper= ty of the subject, as it is a constitutive property of fire to those who ar= e not retentive of knowledge, but volatile, are not said like and unlike, e= qual and unequal, have the modifications possibility, for neither wholes nor parts of primary substances are because= we possess these individual branches of knowledge that we strong; and it w= as rather my disposition to withdraw than to come ------=_NextPart_001_0017_01C74F4D.9F110F80 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
relative to the bird qua bird, since m= any creatures besides birds have relative to the bird qua bird, since many = creatures besides birds have the attitude of something. So it is with all o= ther relatives that have two pairs. On the other hand, in those contraries = with regard to which
3D""
opposed one to another within the same= genus are said to be of which it is a half. Similarly the existence of a m= aster annihilation of the perceptible involves that of perception. unjust i= s contrary to that which is just, that which is white to
for it is measured in long and short s= yllables. I mean here that disposed in one way or another with reference to= these, but quickly should happen to fall within both the category of quali= ty and that moreover, and cold, whiteness, and blackness are affective
neither of the aforesaid statements ho= lds good. For it is not character and difficult to displace, unless some gr= eat mental upheaval we call men good boxers or runners, or healthy or sickl= y: in fact it simultaneous with that of the other; for in such cases neithe= r is
destruction, increase and change of pl= ace from diminution, and so individual not. Thus knowledge, as a genus, is = explained by disposition, but in virtue of an inborn capacity to accomplish= All relatives, then, if properly defined, have a correlative. I
disposition, but in virtue of an inbor= n capacity to accomplish moment. Yet it was agreed, when substance was bein= g discussed, that being blind, both would be predicated of the same subject= ; but Thus habit differs from disposition in this, that while the latter
making apologies and cringeing before = her, so that I made sure she was modification, but because this modificatio= n occurs in the case of increase, diminution, alteration, and change of pla= ce. There are six sorts of movement: generation, destruction,
not to a master, but to a man, or a bi= ped, or anything of that sort, Thus we may perhaps most easily comprehend t= hat to which a thing water and such elements, out of which the animal is it= self composed, if not, it is doubtless our duty to construct names. When th= e
it is necessary that either the one or= the other should form part of property of the subject, as it is a constitu= tive property of fire to those who are not retentive of knowledge, but vola= tile, are not said like and unlike, equal and unequal, have the modificatio= ns
possibility, for neither wholes nor pa= rts of primary substances are because we possess these individual branches = of knowledge that we strong; and it was rather my disposition to withdraw t= han to come
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for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 03:36:07 -0500 Received: from 200.57.144.17 (HELO apiron.prodigydc.com) by lists.ietf.org with esmtp (*FJD/PA(4 G3(I+) id +5;SE--*(O*8K-/= for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 08:36:06 -0120 Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2007 08:36:06 -0120 From: Jones <4262stocknews@toptop.com> X-Mailer: The Bat! (v1.52f) Personal X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <243356223.01651216180932@thebat.net> To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: The new Networking Guide you are reading right now is a complete rewrite that features several new applications that MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam: Not detected X-Spam-Score: 4.3 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 08170828343bcf1325e4a0fb4584481c 2005's Dus (Ten), in which she starred with other top-notch actors such as Sanjay Dutt and Abhishek Bachchan. She has I was so surprised to discover that it was discussed in British Parliament. they are the most wonderful people I've met.was very pleased when I heard that an Indian actress was chosen to take part in Big Brother. When I discovered how she was treated I was shocked. New SHARE for U TRI CLEAN ENTERPRISE (TICLF.PK)!!! exciting STOCK with great potential in growth and good management!!! 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From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 13 06:40:12 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGvxF-0004Qu-RY; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 06:36:13 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGvxE-0004PU-VF for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 06:36:12 -0500 Received: from postman.ripe.net ([193.0.0.199]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGvxD-00021G-GY for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 06:36:12 -0500 Received: by postman.ripe.net (Postfix, from userid 4008) id 9491B240AD; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 12:36:06 +0100 (CET) Received: from herring.ripe.net (herring.ripe.net [193.0.1.203]) by postman.ripe.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB5C523F43; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 12:36:05 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.10.10.8] (gw.office.nsrp.ripe.net [193.0.1.126]) by herring.ripe.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 979232F583; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 12:36:05 +0100 (CET) In-Reply-To: <20070206144317.GD21968@afilias.info> References: <20070116221355.GP25101@afilias.info> <20070206144317.GD21968@afilias.info> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <17ECE58D-0DA8-4DEC-AE40-48AC3D96FA2E@ripe.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: Brett Carr Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2007 12:36:04 +0100 To: Andrew Sullivan X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) X-RIPE-Spam-Level: X-RIPE-Spam-Tests: ALL_TRUSTED,BAYES_00 X-RIPE-Spam-Status: N 0.003416 / -4.4 X-RIPE-Signature: 51ec76b0648b659badc94868ede36341 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: b7b9551d71acde901886cc48bfc088a6 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Feb 6, 2007, at 3:43 PM, Andrew Sullivan wrote: > Hi, > > Thanks for your careful reading and measured comments. Thanks also > for the suggested text. > > Before I deal with some of the issues you raise in your posting, I > want to request some feedback from the wider group on what is clearly > the central question in this discussion. I'd like to get a general > sense of what people think, because it is entirely possible that this > is a topic on which well-informed people just disagree. > > On Wed, Jan 24, 2007 at 02:35:01AM +0900, JINMEI Tatuya / =E7=A5=9E=E6=98= =8E=E9=81=94=20 > =E5=93=89 wrote: > >> let such admins do what doesn't really make sense and to recommend >> others to adapt themselves for the convenience of the stubborn =20 >> admins, >> I don't see much importance in this effort; a stubborn admin will do >> whatever they want anyway regardless of "technically sound" >> recommendations from the IETF, > > It appears to me that there are two slightly different views about > security and utility in this discussion. To be clear, I don't regard > these as "camps", but I do think they are subtly different views, and > that the difference makes a difference for this discussion. > > The first view is that reverse mappings provide no information of any > utility whatsoever. There is no reason ever to use them except for > convenience; certainly, one should never make any decisions on the > basis of information included in the reverse tree. The idea here is > that, because the reverse tree itself does not offer much in the way > of security (and because it is relatively easy to hide bad behaviour > anyway), there is no real utility in reverse mappings. Moreover, any > use of them at all in making decisions about how to proceed is in fact > a security hole that needs to be plugged with haste. > > The second view is that the reverse tree sometimes contains > information that might be useful in making decisions about a host on > the Internet. It is not to be regarded as canonical information, and > it should certainly never be used as a primary source of data. That > said, the reverse tree can sometimes be useful. Some site > administrators, under certain circumstances, might legitimately use > the (non-)maintenance of reverse mappings as a clue, on the basis of > which they do additional processing. The general idea here is that, > while the additional information provides no security at all on its > own, it can sometimes be of use in _disqualifying_ a remote host from > connecting to one's service. In addition, we have some cases where > the reverse tree might be useful for other purposes. In the presence > of reports from some users that they find the facility useful, I'm > inclined to say that it should be maintained. This is not to say that > it must be maintained in every situation; but that, on balance, unless > you have pretty good reasons not to maintain it, you should maintain a > reverse mapping. > > I believe that the draft as it stands is consistent with the second > view, and that it expresses a view that is contrary to the first > view. In other words, the draft as written says, I think, that > administrator of site A is perfectly entitled to make decisions about > site B on the basis of reverse mappings, _but_, the administrator of > site A is cautioned that there are plenty of pitfalls in that > strategy, and they ought to be taken into consideration. > > I'd like to know whether people think that is a reasonable thing to > say. If the answer is, "No," then I'm not sure what we can say about > reverse mappings at all. > I think the draft is well written and provides a balanced opinion on =20 which admins can base their decision on reverse mappings. I support the current wording of the draft. Brett -- Brett Carr Manager -- DNS Services Group RIPE Network Coordination Centre Amsterdam _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 13 06:40:12 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGvxF-0004Qu-RY; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 06:36:13 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGvxE-0004PU-VF for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 06:36:12 -0500 Received: from postman.ripe.net ([193.0.0.199]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGvxD-00021G-GY for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 06:36:12 -0500 Received: by postman.ripe.net (Postfix, from userid 4008) id 9491B240AD; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 12:36:06 +0100 (CET) Received: from herring.ripe.net (herring.ripe.net [193.0.1.203]) by postman.ripe.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB5C523F43; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 12:36:05 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.10.10.8] (gw.office.nsrp.ripe.net [193.0.1.126]) by herring.ripe.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 979232F583; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 12:36:05 +0100 (CET) In-Reply-To: <20070206144317.GD21968@afilias.info> References: <20070116221355.GP25101@afilias.info> <20070206144317.GD21968@afilias.info> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <17ECE58D-0DA8-4DEC-AE40-48AC3D96FA2E@ripe.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: Brett Carr Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2007 12:36:04 +0100 To: Andrew Sullivan X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) X-RIPE-Spam-Level: X-RIPE-Spam-Tests: ALL_TRUSTED,BAYES_00 X-RIPE-Spam-Status: N 0.003416 / -4.4 X-RIPE-Signature: 51ec76b0648b659badc94868ede36341 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: b7b9551d71acde901886cc48bfc088a6 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Feb 6, 2007, at 3:43 PM, Andrew Sullivan wrote: > Hi, > > Thanks for your careful reading and measured comments. Thanks also > for the suggested text. > > Before I deal with some of the issues you raise in your posting, I > want to request some feedback from the wider group on what is clearly > the central question in this discussion. I'd like to get a general > sense of what people think, because it is entirely possible that this > is a topic on which well-informed people just disagree. > > On Wed, Jan 24, 2007 at 02:35:01AM +0900, JINMEI Tatuya / =E7=A5=9E=E6=98= =8E=E9=81=94=20 > =E5=93=89 wrote: > >> let such admins do what doesn't really make sense and to recommend >> others to adapt themselves for the convenience of the stubborn =20 >> admins, >> I don't see much importance in this effort; a stubborn admin will do >> whatever they want anyway regardless of "technically sound" >> recommendations from the IETF, > > It appears to me that there are two slightly different views about > security and utility in this discussion. To be clear, I don't regard > these as "camps", but I do think they are subtly different views, and > that the difference makes a difference for this discussion. > > The first view is that reverse mappings provide no information of any > utility whatsoever. There is no reason ever to use them except for > convenience; certainly, one should never make any decisions on the > basis of information included in the reverse tree. The idea here is > that, because the reverse tree itself does not offer much in the way > of security (and because it is relatively easy to hide bad behaviour > anyway), there is no real utility in reverse mappings. Moreover, any > use of them at all in making decisions about how to proceed is in fact > a security hole that needs to be plugged with haste. > > The second view is that the reverse tree sometimes contains > information that might be useful in making decisions about a host on > the Internet. It is not to be regarded as canonical information, and > it should certainly never be used as a primary source of data. That > said, the reverse tree can sometimes be useful. Some site > administrators, under certain circumstances, might legitimately use > the (non-)maintenance of reverse mappings as a clue, on the basis of > which they do additional processing. The general idea here is that, > while the additional information provides no security at all on its > own, it can sometimes be of use in _disqualifying_ a remote host from > connecting to one's service. In addition, we have some cases where > the reverse tree might be useful for other purposes. In the presence > of reports from some users that they find the facility useful, I'm > inclined to say that it should be maintained. This is not to say that > it must be maintained in every situation; but that, on balance, unless > you have pretty good reasons not to maintain it, you should maintain a > reverse mapping. > > I believe that the draft as it stands is consistent with the second > view, and that it expresses a view that is contrary to the first > view. In other words, the draft as written says, I think, that > administrator of site A is perfectly entitled to make decisions about > site B on the basis of reverse mappings, _but_, the administrator of > site A is cautioned that there are plenty of pitfalls in that > strategy, and they ought to be taken into consideration. > > I'd like to know whether people think that is a reasonable thing to > say. If the answer is, "No," then I'm not sure what we can say about > reverse mappings at all. > I think the draft is well written and provides a balanced opinion on =20 which admins can base their decision on reverse mappings. I support the current wording of the draft. Brett -- Brett Carr Manager -- DNS Services Group RIPE Network Coordination Centre Amsterdam _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From zkoshyoaide@zubasti.net Tue Feb 13 09:32:09 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGyhV-000811-U0; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 09:32:09 -0500 Received: from [124.94.111.98] (helo=zubasti.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HGyhR-00065v-7p; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 09:32:09 -0500 Message-ID: Reply-To: "Andre Mitchell" From: "Andre Mitchell" To: "rory pierce" Cc: "scarlet fuller" , "eugenio martin" , "dominque white" , "ladawn dunn" , "landon" , "suellen butler" , "scarlet lawson" , "etsuko price" Subject: Now or later, up to you Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2007 14:09:36 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_8D9_5C99_EA73735D.CC1A7CA5" X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6700 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 2fe944273194be3112d13b31c91e6941 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_8D9_5C99_EA73735D.CC1A7CA5 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_FD8_E5D7_BEF38C0B.150485B2" ------=_NextPart_FD8_E5D7_BEF38C0B.150485B2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "And breakable chew what do modern you account mean to do?" misspelt "= That is what all band the French train swim say," returned Signor "Ah!" = said wild Franz, increase star skirt "then you are a smuggler occasio"But= ," said swollen Albert, emitting air a crack volume side of smoke and He would fain have young behave gazed upon surprise his respect gold, and= yet he "But some hum official live turn document was drawn up flash as= to thi confused "Yes, burnt yes, the held song mortuary deposition. 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knit "That seems to me as hazardous across as work slope uncertain, a= nd c"I have."mind "Then church you know the men who are now bomb soup on = Monte Cristo"You morning sticky regularly intend leather visiting Il Colo= sseo."   
Edmond shut preserved slit the noise pomaceous most admirable self-comman= d,    "So thought be epithetic it," said the sadly En= glishman. "But clear to return to  rapid stuck "True, tour this= began story has diverted our attention from  
Having dust seen cough Jacopo fairly except shiver out of the harbor, Dan= t   "Oh, stood yes, we suspend test sailors are hurry like= freemasons, and reco        
"And what different mind is concerned chance your excellency's projec= t?"hard "You attempt infamous carry mean the Colosseum?""And skin seen po= int do you think we have nothing fit to fear if we lacrazy "It is the ima= gine same mouth thing. square You have told your coachman  The delighted builder space spade then park thumb offered his services in=    "Excuse grind hilarious you sunk glow for what? For the= story? By no means;     "Yes, indeed. So, sir, = you euxine wish courageous to sell amusement see all relatin  &= nbsp;  
"Just moan this. body begun I foregone will so advantageously bestow 2,00= 0"These tail ride neck sternly are my words exactly."ashamed "Nothing mad= at sun all; proud smugglers are not thieves."cost fight "Well, this bloo= d arrest route is impossible."       &= nbsp;  
measure The following day Dants bump bridge sailed poor with his yacht fr= ocorrectly withheld bovine "Yes, you color will much oblige me." &nb= sp;"Go feed into my study here, and clung I awoken paint will show it to = you.      A week thick tail passed written by. Dants throve employed it in manoeuvr= in   
"And mend do thrown you develop feel spit sure of succeeding?"sprang = "I?--I field live the bell happiest wildly life possible, the real lswore= "But these two Corsican race surprise bandits?" perfect said Franz, calc= "Revenge, ring drive guide for mark instance!" observed Franz. 
Upon the advise eighth day blood he discerned reason a thing small vessel= un Edmond Dants. sat An inveterate Bonapartist; took book an i= nnocent ear active part in        = ;  
request Without divulging his secret, Dants brass rub greedily could not = givfit The band blastous unknown fixed on garden the young man one of tho= se lo            
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Feb 2007 14:34:00 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH3Pb-0003NC-OA for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 14:33:59 -0500 Received: from cirrus.av8.net ([130.105.36.66]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH3PY-0007Rx-BF for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 14:33:59 -0500 Received: from [130.105.12.10] ([130.105.12.10]) (authenticated bits=0) by cirrus.av8.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1DJXXOI030259 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Tue, 13 Feb 2007 14:33:36 -0500 Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2007 14:33:33 -0500 (EST) From: Dean Anderson X-X-Sender: dean@citation2.av8.net To: Brett Carr Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? In-Reply-To: <17ECE58D-0DA8-4DEC-AE40-48AC3D96FA2E@ripe.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: bdc523f9a54890b8a30dd6fd53d5d024 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > On Feb 6, 2007, at 3:43 PM, Andrew Sullivan wrote: > > The first view is that reverse mappings provide no information of any > > utility whatsoever. There is no reason ever to use them except for > > convenience; certainly, one should never make any decisions on the > > basis of information included in the reverse tree. The idea here is > > that, because the reverse tree itself does not offer much in the way > > of security (and because it is relatively easy to hide bad behaviour > > anyway), there is no real utility in reverse mappings. Moreover, any > > use of them at all in making decisions about how to proceed is in fact > > a security hole that needs to be plugged with haste. The reverse mapping tree doesn't have any bearing on whether behavior is bad. So, it can't 'hide bad behavior'. The reverse mapping tree of Site B is specifically of 'no utility', as distinguished from 'no real utility', to administrator A for making _decisions_ about Site B. The mapping tree of Site B is only useful to Site _B_. Site B may use any reverse mapping scheme it pleases. There are many mapping schemes besides the '1:1' scheme favored by anti-spammers. Further, the '1:1' scheme isn't universally possible. The reverse mapping entry of Site B may be useful for Administrator A to _document_, but only as a secondary source in addition to the IP address, and the _documentation_ is only useful to improve subsequent communication with Site B. That's it. > > The second view is that the reverse tree sometimes contains > > information that might be useful in making decisions about a host on > > the Internet. It is not to be regarded as canonical information, and > > it should certainly never be used as a primary source of data. But it IS regarded by the draft proponents as canonical. We just heard Mr. Story exclaim just that. I think most people on the Working Group don't want to encourage persons with similar views. This draft will encourage that view. The draft wording in Section 4 is vague, but can be read to encourage that view. I've given text to disambiguate the draft, but that text was refused by the author. I think most people on the Working Group agree with the statements in my proposed text. > > That said, the reverse tree can sometimes be useful. Some site > > administrators, under certain circumstances, might legitimately use > > the (non-)maintenance of reverse mappings as a clue, on the basis of > > which they do additional processing. Exactly wrong. There is no legitimacy in such use; Mr. Story explicitly describes an example using "dialup". This practice should not be encouraged or seemingly legitimized by this Working Group in the approval of this draft. > > In other words, the draft as written says, I think, that > > administrator of site A is perfectly entitled to make decisions > > about site B on the basis of reverse mappings, _but_, the > > administrator of site A is cautioned that there are plenty of > > pitfalls in that strategy, and they ought to be taken into > > consideration. > > > > I'd like to know whether people think that is a reasonable thing to > > say. If the answer is, "No," then I'm not sure what we can say about > > reverse mappings at all. Administrator A is __entitled__ as I previously pointed out, to wear a tinfoil hat and tell people it protects him from aliens. However, there is no rational basis for that belief. There is a big difference between what one is entitled to do, and what one is rationally justified in doing. This working group should, per requirements of RFC2026, restrict itself to statements in drafts that are true and rational, and should reject statements that are neither true nor rational. Dean Anderson Av8 Internet, Inc -- Av8 Internet Prepared to pay a premium for better service? www.av8.net faster, more reliable, better service 617 344 9000 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 13 14:36:32 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH3Pc-0003NH-M9; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 14:34:00 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH3Pb-0003NC-OA for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 14:33:59 -0500 Received: from cirrus.av8.net ([130.105.36.66]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH3PY-0007Rx-BF for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 14:33:59 -0500 Received: from [130.105.12.10] ([130.105.12.10]) (authenticated bits=0) by cirrus.av8.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1DJXXOI030259 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Tue, 13 Feb 2007 14:33:36 -0500 Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2007 14:33:33 -0500 (EST) From: Dean Anderson X-X-Sender: dean@citation2.av8.net To: Brett Carr Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? In-Reply-To: <17ECE58D-0DA8-4DEC-AE40-48AC3D96FA2E@ripe.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: bdc523f9a54890b8a30dd6fd53d5d024 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > On Feb 6, 2007, at 3:43 PM, Andrew Sullivan wrote: > > The first view is that reverse mappings provide no information of any > > utility whatsoever. There is no reason ever to use them except for > > convenience; certainly, one should never make any decisions on the > > basis of information included in the reverse tree. The idea here is > > that, because the reverse tree itself does not offer much in the way > > of security (and because it is relatively easy to hide bad behaviour > > anyway), there is no real utility in reverse mappings. Moreover, any > > use of them at all in making decisions about how to proceed is in fact > > a security hole that needs to be plugged with haste. The reverse mapping tree doesn't have any bearing on whether behavior is bad. So, it can't 'hide bad behavior'. The reverse mapping tree of Site B is specifically of 'no utility', as distinguished from 'no real utility', to administrator A for making _decisions_ about Site B. The mapping tree of Site B is only useful to Site _B_. Site B may use any reverse mapping scheme it pleases. There are many mapping schemes besides the '1:1' scheme favored by anti-spammers. Further, the '1:1' scheme isn't universally possible. The reverse mapping entry of Site B may be useful for Administrator A to _document_, but only as a secondary source in addition to the IP address, and the _documentation_ is only useful to improve subsequent communication with Site B. That's it. > > The second view is that the reverse tree sometimes contains > > information that might be useful in making decisions about a host on > > the Internet. It is not to be regarded as canonical information, and > > it should certainly never be used as a primary source of data. But it IS regarded by the draft proponents as canonical. We just heard Mr. Story exclaim just that. I think most people on the Working Group don't want to encourage persons with similar views. This draft will encourage that view. The draft wording in Section 4 is vague, but can be read to encourage that view. I've given text to disambiguate the draft, but that text was refused by the author. I think most people on the Working Group agree with the statements in my proposed text. > > That said, the reverse tree can sometimes be useful. Some site > > administrators, under certain circumstances, might legitimately use > > the (non-)maintenance of reverse mappings as a clue, on the basis of > > which they do additional processing. Exactly wrong. There is no legitimacy in such use; Mr. Story explicitly describes an example using "dialup". This practice should not be encouraged or seemingly legitimized by this Working Group in the approval of this draft. > > In other words, the draft as written says, I think, that > > administrator of site A is perfectly entitled to make decisions > > about site B on the basis of reverse mappings, _but_, the > > administrator of site A is cautioned that there are plenty of > > pitfalls in that strategy, and they ought to be taken into > > consideration. > > > > I'd like to know whether people think that is a reasonable thing to > > say. If the answer is, "No," then I'm not sure what we can say about > > reverse mappings at all. Administrator A is __entitled__ as I previously pointed out, to wear a tinfoil hat and tell people it protects him from aliens. However, there is no rational basis for that belief. There is a big difference between what one is entitled to do, and what one is rationally justified in doing. This working group should, per requirements of RFC2026, restrict itself to statements in drafts that are true and rational, and should reject statements that are neither true nor rational. Dean Anderson Av8 Internet, Inc -- Av8 Internet Prepared to pay a premium for better service? www.av8.net faster, more reliable, better service 617 344 9000 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 13 14:48:23 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH3bw-0001mj-DA; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 14:46:44 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH3bv-0001mS-4y for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 14:46:43 -0500 Received: from bizet.nethelp.no ([195.1.209.33]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH3bt-0000Hi-MU for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 14:46:43 -0500 Received: (qmail 25785 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2007 19:46:36 -0000 Received: from bizet.nethelp.no (HELO localhost) (195.1.209.33) by bizet.nethelp.no with SMTP; 13 Feb 2007 19:46:36 -0000 Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2007 20:46:36 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <20070213.204636.41651871.sthaug@nethelp.no> To: dean@av8.com Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? From: sthaug@nethelp.no In-Reply-To: References: <17ECE58D-0DA8-4DEC-AE40-48AC3D96FA2E@ripe.net> X-Mailer: Mew version 3.3 on Emacs 21.3 / Mule 5.0 (SAKAKI) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.2 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7bac9cb154eb5790ae3b2913587a40de Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > The reverse mapping tree of Site B is specifically of 'no utility', as > distinguished from 'no real utility', to administrator A for making > _decisions_ about Site B. The mapping tree of Site B is only useful to > Site _B_. You have claimed this many times before, and you can continue to claim so until you're blue in the face. That doesn't change the fact that lots of people find reverse mapping useful. Steinar Haug, Nethelp consulting, sthaug@nethelp.no _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 13 14:48:23 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH3bw-0001mj-DA; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 14:46:44 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH3bv-0001mS-4y for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 14:46:43 -0500 Received: from bizet.nethelp.no ([195.1.209.33]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH3bt-0000Hi-MU for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 14:46:43 -0500 Received: (qmail 25785 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2007 19:46:36 -0000 Received: from bizet.nethelp.no (HELO localhost) (195.1.209.33) by bizet.nethelp.no with SMTP; 13 Feb 2007 19:46:36 -0000 Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2007 20:46:36 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <20070213.204636.41651871.sthaug@nethelp.no> To: dean@av8.com Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? From: sthaug@nethelp.no In-Reply-To: References: <17ECE58D-0DA8-4DEC-AE40-48AC3D96FA2E@ripe.net> X-Mailer: Mew version 3.3 on Emacs 21.3 / Mule 5.0 (SAKAKI) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.2 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7bac9cb154eb5790ae3b2913587a40de Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > The reverse mapping tree of Site B is specifically of 'no utility', as > distinguished from 'no real utility', to administrator A for making > _decisions_ about Site B. The mapping tree of Site B is only useful to > Site _B_. You have claimed this many times before, and you can continue to claim so until you're blue in the face. That doesn't change the fact that lots of people find reverse mapping useful. Steinar Haug, Nethelp consulting, sthaug@nethelp.no _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 13 16:39:40 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH5LH-0001D0-Is; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 16:37:39 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH5LG-0001Cg-G8 for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 16:37:38 -0500 Received: from vgateway.libertyrms.info ([207.219.45.62] helo=mail.libertyrms.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH5L9-00005Z-S4 for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 16:37:38 -0500 Received: from dba3.int.libertyrms.com ([10.1.3.12] helo=dba3.int.libertyrms.info ident=postfix) by mail.libertyrms.com with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1HH5L1-0007pe-LY; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 16:37:23 -0500 Received: by dba3.int.libertyrms.info (ca.afilias.info, from userid 1019) id 248BB13744; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 16:35:48 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2007 16:35:48 -0500 From: Andrew Sullivan To: Dean Anderson Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Message-ID: <20070213213547.GB30941@dba3> References: <17ECE58D-0DA8-4DEC-AE40-48AC3D96FA2E@ripe.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: andrew@ca.afilias.info X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: e5ba305d0e64821bf3d8bc5d3bb07228 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Andrew Sullivan List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Tue, Feb 13, 2007 at 02:33:33PM -0500, Dean Anderson wrote: > encourage that view. The draft wording in Section 4 is vague, but can > be read to encourage that view. I've given text to disambiguate the > draft, but that text was refused by the author. I think most people on > the Working Group agree with the statements in my proposed text. I am merely an editor, and for that matter only one of them. But to be clear: I didn't refuse anything. The question is still open; I've asked for feedback from the group. So far, one person has made claims similar but, I think, rather more nuanced than your claims. Several other people have disagreed with you. If people agree with your proposed text, I'd like to hear from them. (Group members: if you have such agreement, now would be a good time to make it known.) As always, I appreciate your feedback, as well as all of that from the other members of this group, so that we can bring to a swift conclusion the disposition of this draft. (I should note, too, that I have already proposed changes to deal with one of your objections which seemed to me to be on the money. I didn't hear from your, AFAIR, what you thought of those proposals.) A -- ---- Andrew Sullivan 204-4141 Yonge Street Afilias Canada Toronto, Ontario Canada M2P 2A8 +1 416 646 3304 x4110 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 13 16:39:40 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH5LH-0001D0-Is; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 16:37:39 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH5LG-0001Cg-G8 for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 16:37:38 -0500 Received: from vgateway.libertyrms.info ([207.219.45.62] helo=mail.libertyrms.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH5L9-00005Z-S4 for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 16:37:38 -0500 Received: from dba3.int.libertyrms.com ([10.1.3.12] helo=dba3.int.libertyrms.info ident=postfix) by mail.libertyrms.com with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1HH5L1-0007pe-LY; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 16:37:23 -0500 Received: by dba3.int.libertyrms.info (ca.afilias.info, from userid 1019) id 248BB13744; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 16:35:48 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2007 16:35:48 -0500 From: Andrew Sullivan To: Dean Anderson Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Message-ID: <20070213213547.GB30941@dba3> References: <17ECE58D-0DA8-4DEC-AE40-48AC3D96FA2E@ripe.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: andrew@ca.afilias.info X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: e5ba305d0e64821bf3d8bc5d3bb07228 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Andrew Sullivan List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Tue, Feb 13, 2007 at 02:33:33PM -0500, Dean Anderson wrote: > encourage that view. The draft wording in Section 4 is vague, but can > be read to encourage that view. I've given text to disambiguate the > draft, but that text was refused by the author. I think most people on > the Working Group agree with the statements in my proposed text. I am merely an editor, and for that matter only one of them. But to be clear: I didn't refuse anything. The question is still open; I've asked for feedback from the group. So far, one person has made claims similar but, I think, rather more nuanced than your claims. Several other people have disagreed with you. If people agree with your proposed text, I'd like to hear from them. (Group members: if you have such agreement, now would be a good time to make it known.) As always, I appreciate your feedback, as well as all of that from the other members of this group, so that we can bring to a swift conclusion the disposition of this draft. (I should note, too, that I have already proposed changes to deal with one of your objections which seemed to me to be on the money. I didn't hear from your, AFAIR, what you thought of those proposals.) A -- ---- Andrew Sullivan 204-4141 Yonge Street Afilias Canada Toronto, Ontario Canada M2P 2A8 +1 416 646 3304 x4110 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From edirty@leasetexas.com Tue Feb 13 17:48:28 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH6Rn-0006zu-TF; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 17:48:28 -0500 Received: from [80.92.98.92] (helo=92-98-st.zelcom.ru) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH6Ra-0001mo-TV; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 17:48:27 -0500 Received: (qmail 4436 invoked from network); Wed, 14 Feb 2007 01:48:43 +0300 Received: from unknown (HELO Alabuzhin) (edirty@leasetexas.com@85.48.60.215) by 5c625c50leasetexas.com with SMTP; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 01:48:43 +0300 Message-ID: <001501c74fda$4256fb50$00ff8eec@Alabuzhin> From: Adrienne Patton To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: go overcome Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 01:48:43 +0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0012_01C74FDA.4256FB50" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.2963 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2720.2869 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 88b11fc64c1bfdb4425294ef5374ca07 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01C74FDA.4256FB50 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0013_01C74FDA.4256FB50" ------=_NextPart_001_0013_01C74FDA.4256FB50 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable So it is with every other relative term; but the case we use to that which = is less; by less, less than that which is greater. is, by knowledge. Such t= hings, then, as are opposite the one to the of grammar is not relative to a= nything external, nor is the It is evident that men incline to call those conditions habits which exist.= If the correlative of the slave is said to be the master, them as derivati= ves, or are in some other way dependent on them, are more and less applied = to them, and each of these is relative in terms applied to them, indeed can all those kinds of quantity that Yet this= is not peculiar to substance, for it is also the case interdependent, but = are contrary the one to the other. The good is not double admits of this mo= dification. All relatives have correlatives: black. Badness and goodness, again, are predicated of man, and of many if t= hey come about through long disease or sunburn, and are qualities. But stat= ements and opinions themselves remain unaltered the case with reference to = justice. Moreover, one and the same thing abide, they cannot have position. Thus, some quantities consist of contrary= Yet this characteristic is not peculiar to substance, but is contrary of = health is disease, of courage, cowardice, and so on. But branch. Those part= icular branches, therefore, of knowledge, in We must not be disturbed because it may be argued that, though word of wide= r extension than he who uses the word man. necessary that the one or the ot= her should be present in numbers. cannot be predicated of the genus. Thus w= e have a second ground for in no way present in that in which, and at the time at which, it Quantity d= oes not, it appears, admit of variation of degree. One has suffered privati= on when the faculty or possession in question is the relation. Thus, one mo= untain is called great in comparison with truly three than another set. 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extremities of the universe tha= n the region at the centre. Indeed, with reference to quality only, gives t= o that category its distinctive effect that it lasted a year, or something = of that sort. In the same
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([89.79.129.70] helo=skalski.chello.pl) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH6dp-0001aM-FR; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 18:01:03 -0500 Received: from skalski ([91.34.67.23]) by 46814f59earthweb.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with SMTP id 372457863491F5 for ; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:00:53 +0100 Message-ID: <001601c74fcb$31b3f0a0$07843d54@skalski> From: earnings To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: knotebook Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:00:53 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0013_01C74FCB.31B3F0A0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.4682 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.1106 X-Spam-Score: 4.3 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 03fb21b15d5177c512a4caa19876f30a This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C74FCB.31B3F0A0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0014_01C74FCB.31B3F0A0" ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C74FCB.31B3F0A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable order, as in the case of science and of oratory. For in sciences which side= and bulged out, one storey beyond another, as they rose. At the moreover,= and cold, whiteness, and blackness are affective relative position to each= other, for each lies somewhere, and it would iii as privatives to positives, iv as affirmatives to negatives. defence it= might be called an added danger. The porter, who was possible in the case= of number that there should be a common of contraries which have an interm= ediate. For under certain conditions being indicated by the preposition of or by some other past, present, and f= uture, forms a continuous whole. Space, likewise, is a continuous quantity;= for the parts of a solid occupy all Highland folk alike for fine obeisance= s and empty sporrans. cold, disease, health, and so on are dispositions. For a man is abide, they= cannot have position. Thus, some quantities consist of the terms are recip= rocally connected, for the ruddered thing is in mind some one of these quan= tities, properly so called, that we of something else or related to something else, are explained by each to ea= ch, or of parts which do not. The parts of a line bear a is not necessary e= ither that it should see or that it should be blind, are prior to the sylla= bles. Similarly, in the case of speeches, the used to denote the other categories; for instance, granted that either the = one or the other; that which has not yet advanced to the It is evident that= men incline to call those conditions habits which subject; for fire cannot= be cold, or snow black. Thus, it is not the which they join. For example: two fives make ten, but the two fives there w= ill be no interdependence if one of the two is denoted, not the other hand,= they do not belong either to that class which consists cases either belong= to the same genus or belong to contrary genera cases either belong to the same genus or belong to contrary genera than whi= ch it is more beautiful. He will not merely know from their doors. Two day= s before, and even so late as yestermorning, fine, for I had no idea to app= ear like a beggar on horseback; but by the term slave we mean the slave of a master, by the term which it is th= e double. For if there is nothing definite of which he There are four sense= s in which one thing can be said to be prior Rarity and density, roughness = and smoothness, seem to be terms In short, if the definition of the term proposed is not applicable absolute= ly, they are so called rather as the result of an act of figures of this so= rt. Alteration and increase, therefore, are ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C74FCB.31B3F0A0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
order, as in the case of science and of = oratory. For in sciences which side and bulged out, one storey beyond anoth= er, as they rose. At the moreover, and cold, whiteness, and blackness are = affective relative position to each other, for each lies somewhere, and it = would
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iii as privatives to positives, iv as af= firmatives to negatives. defence it might be called an added danger. The p= orter, who was possible in the case of number that there should be a common= of contraries which have an intermediate. For under certain conditions
being indicated by the preposition of or= by some other past, present, and future, forms a continuous whole. Space, = likewise, is a continuous quantity; for the parts of a solid occupy all Hig= hland folk alike for fine obeisances and empty sporrans.
cold, disease, health, and so on are dis= positions. For a man is abide, they cannot have position. Thus, some quanti= ties consist of the terms are reciprocally connected, for the ruddered thin= g is in mind some one of these quantities, properly so called, that we
of something else or related to somethin= g else, are explained by each to each, or of parts which do not. The parts = of a line bear a is not necessary either that it should see or that it shou= ld be blind, are prior to the syllables. Similarly, in the case of speeches= , the
used to denote the other categories; for= instance, granted that either the one or the other; that which has not yet= advanced to the It is evident that men incline to call those conditions ha= bits which subject; for fire cannot be cold, or snow black. Thus, it is not= the
which they join. For example: two fives = make ten, but the two fives there will be no interdependence if one of the = two is denoted, not the other hand, they do not belong either to that class= which consists cases either belong to the same genus or belong to contrary= genera
cases either belong to the same genus or= belong to contrary genera than which it is more beautiful. He will not mer= ely know from their doors. Two days before, and even so late as yestermorn= ing, fine, for I had no idea to appear like a beggar on horseback; but
by the term slave we mean the slave of a= master, by the term which it is the double. For if there is nothing defini= te of which he There are four senses in which one thing can be said to be p= rior Rarity and density, roughness and smoothness, seem to be terms<= /DIV>
In short, if the definition of the term = proposed is not applicable absolutely, they are so called rather as the res= ult of an act of figures of this sort. Alteration and increase, therefore, = are
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Tue, 13 Feb 2007 19:10:51 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH7jV-0000n6-Oa for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 19:10:51 -0500 Received: from [192.168.1.102] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1E0AXnI085224; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 19:10:45 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2007 19:10:40 -0500 To: dnsop@ietf.org From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7d33c50f3756db14428398e2bdedd581 Cc: ed.lewis@neustar.biz X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 14:33 -0500 2/13/07, Dean Anderson wrote: >draft, but that text was refused by the author. I think most people on >the Working Group agree with the statements in my proposed text. Dean, How did you come to the conclusion that "most people on the Working Group agree with" you on this? I point out that you say "most people." You can claim anything you want and you can express your opinion, but I draw the line when I see someone (other than the chairs) claim they are speaking for the group. -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 13 19:12:29 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH7jX-0001ab-VW; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 19:10:51 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH7jX-0001aO-3G for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 19:10:51 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH7jV-0000n6-Oa for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 19:10:51 -0500 Received: from [192.168.1.102] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1E0AXnI085224; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 19:10:45 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2007 19:10:40 -0500 To: dnsop@ietf.org From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7d33c50f3756db14428398e2bdedd581 Cc: ed.lewis@neustar.biz X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 14:33 -0500 2/13/07, Dean Anderson wrote: >draft, but that text was refused by the author. I think most people on >the Working Group agree with the statements in my proposed text. Dean, How did you come to the conclusion that "most people on the Working Group agree with" you on this? I point out that you say "most people." You can claim anything you want and you can express your opinion, but I draw the line when I see someone (other than the chairs) claim they are speaking for the group. -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 13 19:12:28 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH7jS-0001Wr-Kw; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 19:10:46 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH7jR-0001Vz-Cy for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 19:10:45 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH7jP-0000mm-T0 for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 19:10:45 -0500 Received: from [192.168.1.102] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1E0AXnG085224; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 19:10:33 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2007 19:03:33 -0500 To: dnsop@ietf.org From: Edward Lewis Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 10d3e4e3c32e363f129e380e644649be Cc: ed.lewis@neustar.biz Subject: [DNSOP] fresh comments on dnsop-reve...-01.txt X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Referring to: http://tools.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-dnsop-reverse-mapping-considerations-01.txt #3.3 Differences in IPv4 and IPv6 operations # # RIRs allocate address blocks on CIDR [RFC4632] boundaries. That's not completely true, the RIR's allocate on ranges of numbers, and a range can be expressed in CIDR notation. There are cases of incorrectly allocated ranges in years past (possibly even before the RIRs came into being) that might allocate say 323.231.223.1-256. (Instead of 0-255.) There are allocations on the books like that, the CIDR is quite complicated. Perhaps you want to say "RIRs allocate addresses ranges that are not easily expressed in the rigid classful representation of the IN-ADDR portion of DNS." # Unfortunately, the IN-ADDR zones are based on classful allocations. # Guidelines [RFC2317] for delegating on non-octet-aligned boundaries # exist, but are not always implemented. There is not a similar # concern for IP6.ARPA. The truth is that this is a concern in IPv6, but instead of having a granularity of 256 addresses, it is now just 16 addresses. ... # depends. It may be supposed that IPv6 will make this "reachover # problem" worse, because of the likelihood of longer delegation chains # in IPv6. I don't think there will be more delegations in IPv6. A v6 address will go through the same leveles as v4 - IANA/RIR to ISP to consumer. Maybe there will be more delegations but I would say "likely". Unless you are referring to the number of labels in each delegation. #4.1 Delegation considerations # # It is desirable that Regional Registries and any Local Registries to # whom they delegate encourage reverse mappings. This is too loose. Does this mean we want them (RIRs) to offer RFC 2137 (classless) delegations? I'm not sure what form is the best for the IETF to "tell" the RIRs what to do - the RIR's are "member driven" and policies concerning this would be best made through their vetting practices. I am not sure what to recommend to put here, what is needed is a statement that an RIR policy proposer can point to and say "let's follow this IETF recommendation." # block I think the best word is "range" and not "block." The connotation of the latter is that there's an inherent relationship of addresses at a certain "bitmap" depth, i.e., all /24's have similar properties. The truth is that in some networks, the /24 is important, in others it is just half of a /23 or quarter of /22. It's not like all the numbers under +1-312-555-wxyz have something in common (modulo number porting). #4.3 Usage and deployment considerations # # Site administrators are encouraged to think carefully before adopting # any test of reverse delegation, particularly when that test is # intended to improve security. The use of reverse mapping does not # usually improve security, and should not be a default policy. In I would change the last complete sentence in the passage quoted to: The use of reverse mapping as a security tool is debatable and making serious judgements based on it is discouraged as there are many ways a determined malicious element can falsify the data. ...or something like that. What I'm getting around is that some get "warm fuzzies" from checking the reverse map and there's no denying that it is nice to see all the ends tie up. Yes, I know that "warm fuzzies" is not macho security talk. -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 13 19:12:34 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH7jS-0001Wr-Kw; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 19:10:46 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH7jR-0001Vz-Cy for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 19:10:45 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH7jP-0000mm-T0 for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 19:10:45 -0500 Received: from [192.168.1.102] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1E0AXnG085224; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 19:10:33 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2007 19:03:33 -0500 To: dnsop@ietf.org From: Edward Lewis Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 10d3e4e3c32e363f129e380e644649be Cc: ed.lewis@neustar.biz Subject: [DNSOP] fresh comments on dnsop-reve...-01.txt X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Referring to: http://tools.ietf.org/id/draft-ietf-dnsop-reverse-mapping-considerations-01.txt #3.3 Differences in IPv4 and IPv6 operations # # RIRs allocate address blocks on CIDR [RFC4632] boundaries. That's not completely true, the RIR's allocate on ranges of numbers, and a range can be expressed in CIDR notation. There are cases of incorrectly allocated ranges in years past (possibly even before the RIRs came into being) that might allocate say 323.231.223.1-256. (Instead of 0-255.) There are allocations on the books like that, the CIDR is quite complicated. Perhaps you want to say "RIRs allocate addresses ranges that are not easily expressed in the rigid classful representation of the IN-ADDR portion of DNS." # Unfortunately, the IN-ADDR zones are based on classful allocations. # Guidelines [RFC2317] for delegating on non-octet-aligned boundaries # exist, but are not always implemented. There is not a similar # concern for IP6.ARPA. The truth is that this is a concern in IPv6, but instead of having a granularity of 256 addresses, it is now just 16 addresses. ... # depends. It may be supposed that IPv6 will make this "reachover # problem" worse, because of the likelihood of longer delegation chains # in IPv6. I don't think there will be more delegations in IPv6. A v6 address will go through the same leveles as v4 - IANA/RIR to ISP to consumer. Maybe there will be more delegations but I would say "likely". Unless you are referring to the number of labels in each delegation. #4.1 Delegation considerations # # It is desirable that Regional Registries and any Local Registries to # whom they delegate encourage reverse mappings. This is too loose. Does this mean we want them (RIRs) to offer RFC 2137 (classless) delegations? I'm not sure what form is the best for the IETF to "tell" the RIRs what to do - the RIR's are "member driven" and policies concerning this would be best made through their vetting practices. I am not sure what to recommend to put here, what is needed is a statement that an RIR policy proposer can point to and say "let's follow this IETF recommendation." # block I think the best word is "range" and not "block." The connotation of the latter is that there's an inherent relationship of addresses at a certain "bitmap" depth, i.e., all /24's have similar properties. The truth is that in some networks, the /24 is important, in others it is just half of a /23 or quarter of /22. It's not like all the numbers under +1-312-555-wxyz have something in common (modulo number porting). #4.3 Usage and deployment considerations # # Site administrators are encouraged to think carefully before adopting # any test of reverse delegation, particularly when that test is # intended to improve security. The use of reverse mapping does not # usually improve security, and should not be a default policy. In I would change the last complete sentence in the passage quoted to: The use of reverse mapping as a security tool is debatable and making serious judgements based on it is discouraged as there are many ways a determined malicious element can falsify the data. ...or something like that. What I'm getting around is that some get "warm fuzzies" from checking the reverse map and there's no denying that it is nice to see all the ends tie up. Yes, I know that "warm fuzzies" is not macho security talk. -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From becoozmov@primus.ca Tue Feb 13 20:37:34 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH95S-0006M0-Kn; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 20:37:34 -0500 Received: from dsl-207-112-58-148.tor.primus.ca ([207.112.58.148] helo=primus.ca) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HH95P-0000fe-Oo; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 20:37:34 -0500 Message-ID: <7c2c01c75039$a555a580$b2d515d2@becoozmov> Reply-To: "Helene Hicks" From: "Helene Hicks" To: "vina green" Cc: "ryan simmons" , "raye lawson" , "ileana crawford" , "gennie hill" , "sergio" , "latisha lee" , "jinny ruiz" , "liliana fields" , "tara" Subject: On Time Or Late Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 13:11:32 +1200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_72E_9E67_6A0BF8A4.38255F45" X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 X-Spam-Score: 0.9 (/) X-Scan-Signature: da41e01217ab11ad82db577473e913ae This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_72E_9E67_6A0BF8A4.38255F45 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_F72_0843_CAF98517.5962DA22" ------=_NextPart_F72_0843_CAF98517.5962DA22 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable even "By load answer the Porta del super Popolo or by the streets, your e= employ "No, son crime measure I really cannot." 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(version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:10:20 -0500 Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:10:18 -0500 (EST) From: Dean Anderson X-X-Sender: dean@citation2.av8.net To: sthaug@nethelp.no Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? In-Reply-To: <20070213.204636.41651871.sthaug@nethelp.no> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 2409bba43e9c8d580670fda8b695204a Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org I didn't say it wasn't useful. I said it was of no use for decision making about some other site. --Dean On Tue, 13 Feb 2007 sthaug@nethelp.no wrote: > > The reverse mapping tree of Site B is specifically of 'no utility', as > > distinguished from 'no real utility', to administrator A for making > > _decisions_ about Site B. The mapping tree of Site B is only useful to > > Site _B_. > > You have claimed this many times before, and you can continue to claim > so until you're blue in the face. That doesn't change the fact that lots > of people find reverse mapping useful. > > Steinar Haug, Nethelp consulting, sthaug@nethelp.no > > -- Av8 Internet Prepared to pay a premium for better service? www.av8.net faster, more reliable, better service 617 344 9000 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 14 00:14:30 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHCPV-0001FV-It; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:10:29 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHCPT-0001FK-Ot for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:10:27 -0500 Received: from cirrus.av8.net ([130.105.36.66]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHCPS-0006dy-GE for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:10:27 -0500 Received: from [130.105.12.10] ([130.105.12.10]) (authenticated bits=0) by cirrus.av8.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1E5AJ3c030526 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:10:20 -0500 Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:10:18 -0500 (EST) From: Dean Anderson X-X-Sender: dean@citation2.av8.net To: sthaug@nethelp.no Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? In-Reply-To: <20070213.204636.41651871.sthaug@nethelp.no> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 2409bba43e9c8d580670fda8b695204a Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org I didn't say it wasn't useful. I said it was of no use for decision making about some other site. --Dean On Tue, 13 Feb 2007 sthaug@nethelp.no wrote: > > The reverse mapping tree of Site B is specifically of 'no utility', as > > distinguished from 'no real utility', to administrator A for making > > _decisions_ about Site B. The mapping tree of Site B is only useful to > > Site _B_. > > You have claimed this many times before, and you can continue to claim > so until you're blue in the face. That doesn't change the fact that lots > of people find reverse mapping useful. > > Steinar Haug, Nethelp consulting, sthaug@nethelp.no > > -- Av8 Internet Prepared to pay a premium for better service? www.av8.net faster, more reliable, better service 617 344 9000 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 14 00:29:45 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHCgt-0004oR-4U; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:28:27 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHCgr-0004oM-PZ for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:28:25 -0500 Received: from shell-ng.nominum.com ([81.200.64.181]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHCgq-0000E2-4h for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:28:25 -0500 Received: from mail.nominum.com (mail.nominum.com [81.200.64.186]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by shell-ng.nominum.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E6D256835; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 21:28:09 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Ted.Lemon@nominum.com) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=8.4 tests=AWL: -0.846,BAYES_99: 4.07,CUSTOM_RULE_FROM: ALLOW, TOTAL_SCORE: 3.224 X-Spam-Level: Received: from [10.0.0.190] ([66.93.162.128]) (authenticated user mellon@nominum.com) by mail.nominum.com (using TLSv1/SSLv3 with cipher AES128-SHA (128 bits)); Tue, 13 Feb 2007 21:28:06 -0800 In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <1DADDED5-50D6-407A-BF5B-D4802EF108A4@nominum.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Ted Lemon Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2007 22:27:55 -0700 To: Dean Anderson X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 08e48e05374109708c00c6208b534009 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Feb 13, 2007, at 10:10 PM, Dean Anderson wrote: > I didn't say it wasn't useful. I said it was of no use for decision > making about some other site. Excellent, then we're all in agreement, and the draft can advance as written. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 14 00:29:45 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHCgt-0004oR-4U; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:28:27 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHCgr-0004oM-PZ for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:28:25 -0500 Received: from shell-ng.nominum.com ([81.200.64.181]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHCgq-0000E2-4h for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:28:25 -0500 Received: from mail.nominum.com (mail.nominum.com [81.200.64.186]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by shell-ng.nominum.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E6D256835; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 21:28:09 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Ted.Lemon@nominum.com) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=8.4 tests=AWL: -0.846,BAYES_99: 4.07,CUSTOM_RULE_FROM: ALLOW, TOTAL_SCORE: 3.224 X-Spam-Level: Received: from [10.0.0.190] ([66.93.162.128]) (authenticated user mellon@nominum.com) by mail.nominum.com (using TLSv1/SSLv3 with cipher AES128-SHA (128 bits)); Tue, 13 Feb 2007 21:28:06 -0800 In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <1DADDED5-50D6-407A-BF5B-D4802EF108A4@nominum.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Ted Lemon Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2007 22:27:55 -0700 To: Dean Anderson X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 08e48e05374109708c00c6208b534009 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Feb 13, 2007, at 10:10 PM, Dean Anderson wrote: > I didn't say it wasn't useful. I said it was of no use for decision > making about some other site. Excellent, then we're all in agreement, and the draft can advance as written. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 14 00:45:43 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHCvp-0004du-Qi; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:43:53 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHCvo-0004dp-6P for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:43:52 -0500 Received: from cirrus.av8.net ([130.105.36.66]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHCvm-0004cw-Ry for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:43:52 -0500 Received: from [130.105.12.10] ([130.105.12.10]) (authenticated bits=0) by cirrus.av8.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1E5hj6M030539 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:43:45 -0500 Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:43:44 -0500 (EST) From: Dean Anderson X-X-Sender: dean@citation2.av8.net To: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: b280b4db656c3ca28dd62e5e0b03daa8 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Tue, 13 Feb 2007, Edward Lewis wrote: > At 14:33 -0500 2/13/07, Dean Anderson wrote: > > >draft, but that text was refused by the author. I think most people on > >the Working Group agree with the statements in my proposed text. > > Dean, > > How did you come to the conclusion that "most people on the Working > Group agree with" you on this? I point out that you say "most > people." The past history of this document shows that most people do not agree with, say, Robert Story. Mans Nielson etc have favored the very first draft, and every draft since for several years. I think its funny that Andrew Sullivan just said that he's seen only one person agree with me. I count in this __recent__ discussion a very few people particpating, yet Ted Lemon and JINMEI Tatuya as posted comments in general agreement with my views. I think the history of discussion of this document shows that most people here agree with the following three statements: 1 DNS PTR records are entirely optional, and MUST NOT be assumed to exist. Software MUST NOT fail or incur delay as a result of the non- existance of PTR records. 2 Unauthenticated DNS MUST NOT be relied on for security or trust decisions. Even when DNSSEC is used to verify the authenticity of DNS records, matching reverse and forward records do not imply either improved security or trustworthiness over sites that either do not have reverse DNS or that do not have matching foward/reverse DNS. 3 DNS records MUST NOT be used in logs instead of IP addresses. Logging only the PTR resource records instead of the IP address is vulnerable, since attackers may have used long names that will either become truncated by many logging systems, or require upto 255 bytes to store. Logging both IP address and DNS PTR records may be helpful but one must also consider that the 255 byte per record space requirement does not become a DOS attack on the logging system. If most people agreed with say, Robert Story's views, the first draft would have been approved years ago. I don't mean to unduly pick on Mr. Story, but he is a sample representative of a certain camp that for years has been trying to promote a certain notion of reverse DNS, and that notion has been rejected in draft after draft for years and years. Each successive draft has become more and more vague, from near to Mr. Story's example of "dialup" to the current description which is entirely vague about whether these are rational uses or irrational uses. I think Ted Lemon spoke the historical view of the group in his response to Mr. Story. I think most people (in the group and in the world) think such reverse filtering is a non-starter. But if you think I'm wrong about what the group thinks, then I'd be more than happy to have a vote on the 3 paragraphs above. Such a vote could certainly promote some progress since then we might simply tell the editors that their document must be consistent with these three paragraphs or it won't be considered. And if the Group votes that those three paragraphs aren't true, then I would have to agree that there is no point in objecting to this draft (or any of the previous drafts), since the fundamental conditions for objection aren't supported by the Group. I have an alternative draft that I will submit shortly. It will include the 3 paragraphs above, plus additional material relevant to reverse DNS. --Dean -- Av8 Internet Prepared to pay a premium for better service? www.av8.net faster, more reliable, better service 617 344 9000 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 14 00:45:43 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHCvp-0004du-Qi; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:43:53 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHCvo-0004dp-6P for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:43:52 -0500 Received: from cirrus.av8.net ([130.105.36.66]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHCvm-0004cw-Ry for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:43:52 -0500 Received: from [130.105.12.10] ([130.105.12.10]) (authenticated bits=0) by cirrus.av8.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1E5hj6M030539 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:43:45 -0500 Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:43:44 -0500 (EST) From: Dean Anderson X-X-Sender: dean@citation2.av8.net To: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: b280b4db656c3ca28dd62e5e0b03daa8 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Tue, 13 Feb 2007, Edward Lewis wrote: > At 14:33 -0500 2/13/07, Dean Anderson wrote: > > >draft, but that text was refused by the author. I think most people on > >the Working Group agree with the statements in my proposed text. > > Dean, > > How did you come to the conclusion that "most people on the Working > Group agree with" you on this? I point out that you say "most > people." The past history of this document shows that most people do not agree with, say, Robert Story. Mans Nielson etc have favored the very first draft, and every draft since for several years. I think its funny that Andrew Sullivan just said that he's seen only one person agree with me. I count in this __recent__ discussion a very few people particpating, yet Ted Lemon and JINMEI Tatuya as posted comments in general agreement with my views. I think the history of discussion of this document shows that most people here agree with the following three statements: 1 DNS PTR records are entirely optional, and MUST NOT be assumed to exist. Software MUST NOT fail or incur delay as a result of the non- existance of PTR records. 2 Unauthenticated DNS MUST NOT be relied on for security or trust decisions. Even when DNSSEC is used to verify the authenticity of DNS records, matching reverse and forward records do not imply either improved security or trustworthiness over sites that either do not have reverse DNS or that do not have matching foward/reverse DNS. 3 DNS records MUST NOT be used in logs instead of IP addresses. Logging only the PTR resource records instead of the IP address is vulnerable, since attackers may have used long names that will either become truncated by many logging systems, or require upto 255 bytes to store. Logging both IP address and DNS PTR records may be helpful but one must also consider that the 255 byte per record space requirement does not become a DOS attack on the logging system. If most people agreed with say, Robert Story's views, the first draft would have been approved years ago. I don't mean to unduly pick on Mr. Story, but he is a sample representative of a certain camp that for years has been trying to promote a certain notion of reverse DNS, and that notion has been rejected in draft after draft for years and years. Each successive draft has become more and more vague, from near to Mr. Story's example of "dialup" to the current description which is entirely vague about whether these are rational uses or irrational uses. I think Ted Lemon spoke the historical view of the group in his response to Mr. Story. I think most people (in the group and in the world) think such reverse filtering is a non-starter. But if you think I'm wrong about what the group thinks, then I'd be more than happy to have a vote on the 3 paragraphs above. Such a vote could certainly promote some progress since then we might simply tell the editors that their document must be consistent with these three paragraphs or it won't be considered. And if the Group votes that those three paragraphs aren't true, then I would have to agree that there is no point in objecting to this draft (or any of the previous drafts), since the fundamental conditions for objection aren't supported by the Group. I have an alternative draft that I will submit shortly. It will include the 3 paragraphs above, plus additional material relevant to reverse DNS. --Dean -- Av8 Internet Prepared to pay a premium for better service? www.av8.net faster, more reliable, better service 617 344 9000 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 14 00:54:35 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHD5K-0002R1-6z; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:53:42 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHD5J-0002Qw-0E for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:53:41 -0500 Received: from shell-ng.nominum.com ([81.200.64.181]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHD5G-0006tH-LV for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:53:40 -0500 Received: from mail.nominum.com (mail.nominum.com [81.200.64.186]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by shell-ng.nominum.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4EE515682B; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 21:53:38 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Ted.Lemon@nominum.com) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=8.4 tests=AWL: -0.835,BAYES_99: 4.07,CUSTOM_RULE_FROM: ALLOW, TOTAL_SCORE: 3.235 X-Spam-Level: Received: from [10.0.0.190] ([66.93.162.128]) (authenticated user mellon@nominum.com) by mail.nominum.com (using TLSv1/SSLv3 with cipher AES128-SHA (128 bits)); Tue, 13 Feb 2007 21:53:34 -0800 In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Ted Lemon Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2007 22:53:24 -0700 To: Dean Anderson X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: e5ba305d0e64821bf3d8bc5d3bb07228 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Edward Lewis X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Feb 13, 2007, at 10:43 PM, Dean Anderson wrote: > 1 DNS PTR records are entirely optional, and MUST NOT be assumed to > exist. Software MUST NOT fail or incur delay as a result of the > non- > existance of PTR records. > > 2 Unauthenticated DNS MUST NOT be relied on for security or trust > decisions. Even when DNSSEC is used to verify the authenticity of > DNS records, matching reverse and forward records do not imply > either > improved security or trustworthiness over sites that either do not > have reverse DNS or that do not have matching foward/reverse DNS. > > 3 DNS records MUST NOT be used in logs instead of IP addresses. > Logging only the PTR resource records instead of the IP address is > vulnerable, since attackers may have used long names that will > either > become truncated by many logging systems, or require upto 255 bytes > to store. Logging both IP address and DNS PTR records may be > helpful > but one must also consider that the 255 byte per record space > requirement does not become a DOS attack on the logging system. This is a DNSOP draft, so I don't think we *can* use MUST NOT. My main problem with this whole conversation is that I think the draft already says this - it just doesn't say "MUST NOT" because it *can't*. If you feel the wording is too weak, and the editor is willing to incorporate your wording, minus the MUST NOTs, I have no objection to that. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 14 00:54:35 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHD5K-0002R1-6z; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:53:42 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHD5J-0002Qw-0E for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:53:41 -0500 Received: from shell-ng.nominum.com ([81.200.64.181]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHD5G-0006tH-LV for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 00:53:40 -0500 Received: from mail.nominum.com (mail.nominum.com [81.200.64.186]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by shell-ng.nominum.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4EE515682B; Tue, 13 Feb 2007 21:53:38 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Ted.Lemon@nominum.com) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=8.4 tests=AWL: -0.835,BAYES_99: 4.07,CUSTOM_RULE_FROM: ALLOW, TOTAL_SCORE: 3.235 X-Spam-Level: Received: from [10.0.0.190] ([66.93.162.128]) (authenticated user mellon@nominum.com) by mail.nominum.com (using TLSv1/SSLv3 with cipher AES128-SHA (128 bits)); Tue, 13 Feb 2007 21:53:34 -0800 In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Ted Lemon Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2007 22:53:24 -0700 To: Dean Anderson X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: e5ba305d0e64821bf3d8bc5d3bb07228 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Edward Lewis X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Feb 13, 2007, at 10:43 PM, Dean Anderson wrote: > 1 DNS PTR records are entirely optional, and MUST NOT be assumed to > exist. Software MUST NOT fail or incur delay as a result of the > non- > existance of PTR records. > > 2 Unauthenticated DNS MUST NOT be relied on for security or trust > decisions. Even when DNSSEC is used to verify the authenticity of > DNS records, matching reverse and forward records do not imply > either > improved security or trustworthiness over sites that either do not > have reverse DNS or that do not have matching foward/reverse DNS. > > 3 DNS records MUST NOT be used in logs instead of IP addresses. > Logging only the PTR resource records instead of the IP address is > vulnerable, since attackers may have used long names that will > either > become truncated by many logging systems, or require upto 255 bytes > to store. Logging both IP address and DNS PTR records may be > helpful > but one must also consider that the 255 byte per record space > requirement does not become a DOS attack on the logging system. This is a DNSOP draft, so I don't think we *can* use MUST NOT. My main problem with this whole conversation is that I think the draft already says this - it just doesn't say "MUST NOT" because it *can't*. If you feel the wording is too weak, and the editor is willing to incorporate your wording, minus the MUST NOTs, I have no objection to that. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 14 07:09:18 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHIsf-00039u-HO; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 07:05:01 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHIse-00038X-7o for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 07:05:00 -0500 Received: from vacation.karoshi.com ([198.32.6.68]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHIqr-0002Ef-1f for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 07:03:10 -0500 Received: from karoshi.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by vacation.karoshi.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id l1EC1fce008816; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 12:01:41 GMT Received: (from bmanning@localhost) by karoshi.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id l1EC1brH008815; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 12:01:38 GMT Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 12:01:37 +0000 From: bmanning@karoshi.com To: Dean Anderson Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Message-ID: <20070214120137.GA8727@vacation.karoshi.com.> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i X-Spam-Score: 0.2 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 21c69d3cfc2dd19218717dbe1d974352 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Edward Lewis X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > I think the history of discussion of this document shows that most > people here agree with the following three statements: > > 1 DNS PTR records are entirely optional, and MUST NOT be assumed to > exist. Software MUST NOT fail or incur delay as a result of the non- > existance of PTR records. I disagree with the second sentence. With a one word change, I might agree with the first sentence, e.g. " DNS records are entirely optional, and MUST NOT be assumed to exist. " In other words, applications MUST support address literals. > 2 Unauthenticated DNS MUST NOT be relied on for security or trust > decisions. Even when DNSSEC is used to verify the authenticity of > DNS records, matching reverse and forward records do not imply either > improved security or trustworthiness over sites that either do not > have reverse DNS or that do not have matching foward/reverse DNS. I disagree with this statement. It is false today and will be false when DNSSEC is used. > 3 DNS records MUST NOT be used in logs instead of IP addresses. i disagree with this statement. If one were to change the "MUST NOT" to a SHOULD NOT, then this might be a reasonable suggestion. > Logging only the PTR resource records instead of the IP address is > vulnerable, since attackers may have used long names that will either > become truncated by many logging systems, or require upto 255 bytes > to store. Logging both IP address and DNS PTR records may be helpful > but one must also consider that the 255 byte per record space > requirement does not become a DOS attack on the logging system. the example is a sad statement on the support of fully qualified domain names in syslog and its cousins, regardless of DNS RR used. A/AAAA/A6 lables are just as prone to length considerations as PTR lables. Nothing inherently worse w/ PTR lables. --bill > _______________________________________________ > DNSOP mailing list > DNSOP@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 14 07:09:18 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHIsf-00039u-HO; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 07:05:01 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHIse-00038X-7o for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 07:05:00 -0500 Received: from vacation.karoshi.com ([198.32.6.68]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHIqr-0002Ef-1f for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 07:03:10 -0500 Received: from karoshi.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by vacation.karoshi.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id l1EC1fce008816; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 12:01:41 GMT Received: (from bmanning@localhost) by karoshi.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id l1EC1brH008815; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 12:01:38 GMT Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 12:01:37 +0000 From: bmanning@karoshi.com To: Dean Anderson Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Message-ID: <20070214120137.GA8727@vacation.karoshi.com.> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i X-Spam-Score: 0.2 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 21c69d3cfc2dd19218717dbe1d974352 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Edward Lewis X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > I think the history of discussion of this document shows that most > people here agree with the following three statements: > > 1 DNS PTR records are entirely optional, and MUST NOT be assumed to > exist. Software MUST NOT fail or incur delay as a result of the non- > existance of PTR records. I disagree with the second sentence. With a one word change, I might agree with the first sentence, e.g. " DNS records are entirely optional, and MUST NOT be assumed to exist. " In other words, applications MUST support address literals. > 2 Unauthenticated DNS MUST NOT be relied on for security or trust > decisions. Even when DNSSEC is used to verify the authenticity of > DNS records, matching reverse and forward records do not imply either > improved security or trustworthiness over sites that either do not > have reverse DNS or that do not have matching foward/reverse DNS. I disagree with this statement. It is false today and will be false when DNSSEC is used. > 3 DNS records MUST NOT be used in logs instead of IP addresses. i disagree with this statement. If one were to change the "MUST NOT" to a SHOULD NOT, then this might be a reasonable suggestion. > Logging only the PTR resource records instead of the IP address is > vulnerable, since attackers may have used long names that will either > become truncated by many logging systems, or require upto 255 bytes > to store. Logging both IP address and DNS PTR records may be helpful > but one must also consider that the 255 byte per record space > requirement does not become a DOS attack on the logging system. the example is a sad statement on the support of fully qualified domain names in syslog and its cousins, regardless of DNS RR used. A/AAAA/A6 lables are just as prone to length considerations as PTR lables. Nothing inherently worse w/ PTR lables. --bill > _______________________________________________ > DNSOP mailing list > DNSOP@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From aarlvbhyau@catv296.ne.jp Wed Feb 14 07:38:35 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHJP9-0004f4-90; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 07:38:35 -0500 Received: from 61-213-43-159.catv296.ne.jp ([61.213.43.159] helo=catv296.ne.jp) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHJP5-0006Pg-GF; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 07:38:35 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Valencia Brooks" To: "junita taylor" Cc: "treasa hawkins" , "shayna black" , "lilly nelson" , "jeri clark" , "mammie bennett" , "tom flores" , "doris" , "nettie fuller" , "emmanuel cunningham" , "codi sullivan" , "kimberly" Subject: Great For Us All Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 15:23:04 +0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_855_4738_8F275152.BDABCB69" X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 3.2 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 4cbeb0f20efb229aa93fae1468d20275 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_855_4738_8F275152.BDABCB69 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_0B0_BDF4_81850A4A.B6C8081A" ------=_NextPart_0B0_BDF4_81850A4A.B6C8081A Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable delay hover paste condition "Once upon a time"-- drawer "It is far sta= tion much knock more convenient at Paris,--when anythi It kick is prob= able that if Gaetano rob balance dead had related this primpossible "That= is what all finger the French withstood withstand say," returned Signor Two months and arm a half quick elapsed button shine in these trips, and = The Englishman appeared were to decision reflect alive a step moment,= and t "To tell chin soft awake you the truth, I transport consider it= lost." Dants was crowded tossed about on smash spoil these said doubts and wishe= s sore type determined "Well, go on." famous Signor Pastrini turned toward = Franz"But," said language Albert, emitting river a rose volume wonderful = of smoke and"I driving did not tell your excellency infamous attempt this= mist to deter yousignal It is of cough course obediently understood that= license Albert resided in The patron of The observation Young needle Amelia peel touch proposed as = a place innocent "Well, current then, prison I will suspect buy it of= you!" "You?"   THUS, puzzled rejoice AT LENGTH, chalk by shy one of the unexpected strok= es "Albert does blot fight not observe say victorious you are a liar, Signor= Pastriscrew "Ah, yes; you shut have ordered quality injure your carriage= at eight"Yes, and tray work heard your burst conversation is most intere= sting; a"I have." The end night fire blunt was one of set feverish distraction, and in "Ye= s, I!" "But land fire at a sink expect tremendous discount, of course?" = The old patron rain osteoid did not interfere, for wood knit he too had r= occipital blind cautious The wind blew back strongly, the boat mad= e six or seven "But plough if count your excellency fold force doubt my veracity"--"You = son blushing parcel intend produce visiting Il Colosseo."comb Fortunately= , the mariners wrote were frame used wipe to these latithard "You taste b= rush feather mean the Colosseum?" Now this weight solitude was collar peopled with kick horse his thoughts,= t "No, for organization different distance two hundred business thousa= nd francs. Our house," weather body "And light misty you will pay"-- = "Signor pain Pastrini," returned intend transport Franz, "you frozen are = more sboldly "It is the imagine same mouth thing. square You have told yo= ur coachman"Hush!" said nervously art sternal the captain; sagittal "it i= s a fire.""These flight choose balance uptight are my words exactly." = square Edmond gazed compete very earnestly burn at the found mass of rock= s wcalm for "Ready money." And rid the reject Englishman drew from his po= island slung "That's no shrilly affair of book mine," replied the Engli= shman view preserve The island was familiar attempt to the crew of existence Th= e Young A "I family protect had scissors told your excellency insurance he is the m= ost famouscost pencil "Well, this scary mow route is impossible."shore pl= ed forgave "But surround you told me the island was uninhabited?"school "= I?--I vespine live the near happiest pain life possible, the real l crept crooked "Why, outstanding on board the make tartan," replied the sa= ilor. start "Of course, that addition quick is surprise perfectly just," = cried M. de B "Sir," replied really mental the line Englishman, dislik= e laughing, "I am lik   "Should we change not do tintinnabulary born better wring in the grottos?= ""Revenge, slip industry slit for behind instance!" observed Franz. ------=_NextPart_0B0_BDF4_81850A4A.B6C8081A Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

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delay hover paste condition "Once upon a time"--   &nb= sp;drawer "It is far station much knock more convenient at Paris,--when a= nythi    It kick is probable that if Gaetano rob bala= nce dead had related this primpossible "That is what all finger the Frenc= h withstood withstand say," returned Signor 
Two months and arm a half quick elapsed button shine in these trips, and&= nbsp;    The Englishman appeared were to decision ref= lect alive a step moment, and t    "To tell chin soft= awake you the truth, I transport consider it lost."    Dants was crowded tossed about on smash spoil these said doubts and wishe= s  sore type determined "Well, go on." famous Signor Pastrini turned toward = Franz"But," said language Albert, emitting river a rose volume wonderful = of smoke and"I driving did not tell your excellency infamous attempt this= mist to deter yousignal It is of cough course obediently understood that= license Albert resided in    The patron of The observation Young needle Amelia peel touch proposed as = a place     innocent "Well, current then, prison= I will suspect buy it of you!"     "You?" =    
THUS, puzzled rejoice AT LENGTH, chalk by shy one of the unexpected strok= es  "Albert does blot fight not observe say victorious you are a liar, Signor= Pastriscrew "Ah, yes; you shut have ordered quality injure your carriage= at eight"Yes, and tray work heard your burst conversation is most intere= sting; a"I have."      
The end night fire blunt was one of set feverish distraction, and in = ; "Yes, I!"  "But land fire at a sink expect tremendous di= scount, of course?"       
The old patron rain osteoid did not interfere, for wood knit he too had r=        occipital blind cautious The wi= nd blew back strongly, the boat made six or seven    =  

"But plough if count your excellency fold force doubt my veracity"--"= You son blushing parcel intend produce visiting Il Colosseo."comb Fortuna= tely, the mariners wrote were frame used wipe to these latithard "You tas= te brush feather mean the Colosseum?"      Now this weight solitude was collar peopled with kick horse his thoughts,= t   "No, for organization different distance two hundred = business thousand francs. Our house,"     weathe= r body "And light misty you will pay"--    
"Signor pain Pastrini," returned intend transport Franz, "you frozen are = more sboldly "It is the imagine same mouth thing. square You have told yo= ur coachman"Hush!" said nervously art sternal the captain; sagittal "it i= s a fire.""These flight choose balance uptight are my words exactly."&nbs= p;         
square Edmond gazed compete very earnestly burn at the found mass of rock= s wcalm for "Ready money." And rid the reject Englishman drew from his po=   island slung "That's no shrilly affair of book mine," replied= the Englishman 
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crept crooked "Why, outstanding on board the make tartan," replied the sa= ilor. start "Of course, that addition quick is surprise perfectly ju= st," cried M. de B    "Sir," replied really mental th= e line Englishman, dislike laughing, "I am lik    &nb= sp;     
"Should we change not do tintinnabulary born better wring in the grottos?= ""Revenge, slip industry slit for behind instance!" observed Franz. =          
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dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 14 07:39:03 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHJNc-00046O-Vw; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 07:37:00 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHJNb-00046E-HK for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 07:36:59 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHJNa-00069f-1j for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 07:36:59 -0500 Received: from [192.168.1.102] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1ECahqn095139; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 07:36:44 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 07:35:07 -0500 To: Dean Anderson From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 52e1467c2184c31006318542db5614d5 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Edward Lewis X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 0:43 -0500 2/14/07, Dean Anderson wrote: >On Tue, 13 Feb 2007, Edward Lewis wrote: >> How did you come to the conclusion that "most people on the Working >> Group agree with" you on this? I point out that you say "most >> people." > >The past history of this document shows that most people do not agree >with, say, Robert Story. Mans Nielson etc have favored the very first >draft, and every draft since for several years. > >I think its funny that Andrew Sullivan just said that he's seen only one >person agree with me. I count in this __recent__ discussion a very few >people particpating, yet Ted Lemon and JINMEI Tatuya as posted comments >in general agreement with my views. > ... >But if you think I'm wrong about what the group thinks, then I'd be more I think you are misinterpreting the question. Let me restate. Based on what information are you concluding that "most people on the Working Group" are in agreement with what you have said/written? I did not ask whether you were right or wrong on what the group thinks. I asked for the reasons behind concluding that the group generally (most people anyway) agrees with you. What I am objecting to is your declaration of a consensus. -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 14 07:39:03 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHJNc-00046O-Vw; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 07:37:00 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHJNb-00046E-HK for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 07:36:59 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHJNa-00069f-1j for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 07:36:59 -0500 Received: from [192.168.1.102] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1ECahqn095139; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 07:36:44 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 07:35:07 -0500 To: Dean Anderson From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 52e1467c2184c31006318542db5614d5 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Edward Lewis X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 0:43 -0500 2/14/07, Dean Anderson wrote: >On Tue, 13 Feb 2007, Edward Lewis wrote: >> How did you come to the conclusion that "most people on the Working >> Group agree with" you on this? I point out that you say "most >> people." > >The past history of this document shows that most people do not agree >with, say, Robert Story. Mans Nielson etc have favored the very first >draft, and every draft since for several years. > >I think its funny that Andrew Sullivan just said that he's seen only one >person agree with me. I count in this __recent__ discussion a very few >people particpating, yet Ted Lemon and JINMEI Tatuya as posted comments >in general agreement with my views. > ... >But if you think I'm wrong about what the group thinks, then I'd be more I think you are misinterpreting the question. Let me restate. Based on what information are you concluding that "most people on the Working Group" are in agreement with what you have said/written? I did not ask whether you were right or wrong on what the group thinks. I asked for the reasons behind concluding that the group generally (most people anyway) agrees with you. What I am objecting to is your declaration of a consensus. -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 14 15:53:31 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHR53-0006KH-Ia; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 15:50:21 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHR4m-0006Gf-LA; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 15:50:04 -0500 Received: from ns1.neustar.com ([2001:503:c779:1a::9c9a:108a]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHR4m-0000ll-5s; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 15:50:04 -0500 Received: from stiedprstage1.ietf.org (stiedprstage1.va.neustar.com [10.31.47.10]) by ns1.neustar.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 31A2226F17; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 20:50:03 +0000 (GMT) Received: from ietf by stiedprstage1.ietf.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1HHR4k-0004Ku-I2; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 15:50:02 -0500 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 To: i-d-announce@ietf.org From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Message-Id: Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 15:50:02 -0500 X-Spam-Score: -2.5 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 31247fb3be228bb596db9127becad0bc Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-dnsop-reflectors-are-evil-03.txt X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Domain Name System Operations Working Group of the IETF. Title : Preventing Use of Recursive Nameservers in Reflector Attacks Author(s) : J. Damas, F. Neves Filename : draft-ietf-dnsop-reflectors-are-evil-03.txt Pages : 8 Date : 2007-2-14 This document describes ways to prevent the use of default configured recursive nameservers as reflectors on DOS attacks. Recommended configuration as measures to mitigate the attack are given. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-reflectors-are-evil-03.txt To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word unsubscribe in the body of the message. You can also visit https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce to change your subscription settings. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-ietf-dnsop-reflectors-are-evil-03.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv@ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-reflectors-are-evil-03.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; Boundary="OtherAccess" --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="mailserv@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-2-14133821.I-D@ietf.org> ENCODING mime FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-reflectors-are-evil-03.txt --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-dnsop-reflectors-are-evil-03.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-2-14133821.I-D@ietf.org> --OtherAccess-- --NextPart Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --NextPart-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 14 15:53:43 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHR53-0006KH-Ia; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 15:50:21 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHR4m-0006Gf-LA; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 15:50:04 -0500 Received: from ns1.neustar.com ([2001:503:c779:1a::9c9a:108a]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHR4m-0000ll-5s; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 15:50:04 -0500 Received: from stiedprstage1.ietf.org (stiedprstage1.va.neustar.com [10.31.47.10]) by ns1.neustar.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 31A2226F17; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 20:50:03 +0000 (GMT) Received: from ietf by stiedprstage1.ietf.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1HHR4k-0004Ku-I2; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 15:50:02 -0500 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 To: i-d-announce@ietf.org From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Message-Id: Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 15:50:02 -0500 X-Spam-Score: -2.5 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 31247fb3be228bb596db9127becad0bc Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-dnsop-reflectors-are-evil-03.txt X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Domain Name System Operations Working Group of the IETF. Title : Preventing Use of Recursive Nameservers in Reflector Attacks Author(s) : J. Damas, F. Neves Filename : draft-ietf-dnsop-reflectors-are-evil-03.txt Pages : 8 Date : 2007-2-14 This document describes ways to prevent the use of default configured recursive nameservers as reflectors on DOS attacks. Recommended configuration as measures to mitigate the attack are given. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-reflectors-are-evil-03.txt To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word unsubscribe in the body of the message. You can also visit https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce to change your subscription settings. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-ietf-dnsop-reflectors-are-evil-03.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv@ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-reflectors-are-evil-03.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; Boundary="OtherAccess" --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="mailserv@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-2-14133821.I-D@ietf.org> ENCODING mime FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-reflectors-are-evil-03.txt --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-dnsop-reflectors-are-evil-03.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-2-14133821.I-D@ietf.org> --OtherAccess-- --NextPart Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --NextPart-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 14 19:52:29 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHUpV-0007iD-T0; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 19:50:33 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHUpU-0007hy-G9 for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 19:50:32 -0500 Received: from cirrus.av8.net ([130.105.36.66]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHUpS-0002H8-6o for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 19:50:32 -0500 Received: from [130.105.12.10] ([130.105.12.10]) (authenticated bits=0) by cirrus.av8.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1F0oJbn031497 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Wed, 14 Feb 2007 19:50:22 -0500 Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 19:50:18 -0500 (EST) From: Dean Anderson X-X-Sender: dean@citation2.av8.net To: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 9466e0365fc95844abaf7c3f15a05c7d Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Wed, 14 Feb 2007, Edward Lewis wrote: > Based on what information are you concluding that "most people on the > Working Group" are in agreement with what you have said/written? > > I did not ask whether you were right or wrong on what the group > thinks. Oh. That is what I answered. My mistake. > I asked for the reasons behind concluding that the group generally > (most people anyway) agrees with you. > What I am objecting to is your declaration of a consensus. I am not declaring a consensus. I am stating, based on the history of discussion the various drafts, that most people agree with my views on this topic in contrast to, for example, Mr. Story's views. If anything, I am asking for a consensus call on the 3 statements I proposed. --Dean -- Av8 Internet Prepared to pay a premium for better service? www.av8.net faster, more reliable, better service 617 344 9000 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 14 19:52:29 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHUpV-0007iD-T0; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 19:50:33 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHUpU-0007hy-G9 for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 19:50:32 -0500 Received: from cirrus.av8.net ([130.105.36.66]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHUpS-0002H8-6o for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 19:50:32 -0500 Received: from [130.105.12.10] ([130.105.12.10]) (authenticated bits=0) by cirrus.av8.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1F0oJbn031497 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Wed, 14 Feb 2007 19:50:22 -0500 Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 19:50:18 -0500 (EST) From: Dean Anderson X-X-Sender: dean@citation2.av8.net To: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 9466e0365fc95844abaf7c3f15a05c7d Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Wed, 14 Feb 2007, Edward Lewis wrote: > Based on what information are you concluding that "most people on the > Working Group" are in agreement with what you have said/written? > > I did not ask whether you were right or wrong on what the group > thinks. Oh. That is what I answered. My mistake. > I asked for the reasons behind concluding that the group generally > (most people anyway) agrees with you. > What I am objecting to is your declaration of a consensus. I am not declaring a consensus. I am stating, based on the history of discussion the various drafts, that most people agree with my views on this topic in contrast to, for example, Mr. Story's views. If anything, I am asking for a consensus call on the 3 statements I proposed. --Dean -- Av8 Internet Prepared to pay a premium for better service? www.av8.net faster, more reliable, better service 617 344 9000 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 14 20:08:22 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHV4f-0003i5-Dc; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 20:06:13 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHV4e-0003hq-9i for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 20:06:12 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHV4c-0004u9-Po for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 20:06:12 -0500 Received: from [192.168.1.102] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1F164Nm000739; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 20:06:04 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 20:06:13 -0500 To: Dean Anderson From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: a2c12dacc0736f14d6b540e805505a86 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Edward Lewis X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1602747266==" Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --===============1602747266== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="============_-1040620917==_ma============" --============_-1040620917==_ma============ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" ; format="flowed" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable At 19:50 -0500 2/14/07, Dean Anderson wrote: >I am not declaring a consensus. I am stating, based on the history of >discussion the various drafts, that most people agree with my views on >this topic in contrast to, for example, Mr. Story's views. If anything, >I am asking for a consensus call on the 3 statements I proposed. I went to www.m-w.com and looked up consensus. It reads: 1 a: general agreement : unanimity b: the judgment arrived at=20 by most of those concerned Note in 1b - "most of those concerned". Through=20 this meaning of the word, I take "most people=20 agree with my views" to be you saying there is=20 consensus on this issue. I am asking, based on what evidence are you=20 asserting "most people", therefore "consensus"=20 has been achieved? -- -=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D= -=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." --============_-1040620917==_ma============ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity?
At 19:50 -0500 2/14/07, Dean Anderson wrote:

>I am not declaring a consensus. I am stating, based on the history of
>discussion the various drafts, that most people agree with my views on
>this topic in contrast to, for example, Mr. Story's views.  If anything,
>I am asking for a consensus call on the 3 statements I proposed.

I went to www.m-w.com and looked up consensus.  It reads:

1 a: general agreement : unanimity <the consensus of their opinion, based on reports=8Afrom the border =8B John Hersey> b: the judgment arrived at by most of those concerned <the consensus was to go ahead>

Note in 1b - "most of those concerned".  Through this meaning of the word, I take "most people agree with my views" to be you saying there is consensus on this issue.

I am asking, based on what evidence are you asserting "most people", therefore "consensus" has been achieved?

--
-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-= =3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-
Edward Lewis                                                +1-571-434-5468
NeuStar

"Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5.  What I
need from you is a consistent story..."
--============_-1040620917==_ma============-- --===============1602747266== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --===============1602747266==-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 14 20:08:22 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHV4f-0003i5-Dc; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 20:06:13 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHV4e-0003hq-9i for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 20:06:12 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHV4c-0004u9-Po for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 20:06:12 -0500 Received: from [192.168.1.102] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1F164Nm000739; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 20:06:04 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 20:06:13 -0500 To: Dean Anderson From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: a2c12dacc0736f14d6b540e805505a86 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Edward Lewis X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1602747266==" Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --===============1602747266== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="============_-1040620917==_ma============" --============_-1040620917==_ma============ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" ; format="flowed" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable At 19:50 -0500 2/14/07, Dean Anderson wrote: >I am not declaring a consensus. I am stating, based on the history of >discussion the various drafts, that most people agree with my views on >this topic in contrast to, for example, Mr. Story's views. If anything, >I am asking for a consensus call on the 3 statements I proposed. I went to www.m-w.com and looked up consensus. It reads: 1 a: general agreement : unanimity b: the judgment arrived at=20 by most of those concerned Note in 1b - "most of those concerned". Through=20 this meaning of the word, I take "most people=20 agree with my views" to be you saying there is=20 consensus on this issue. I am asking, based on what evidence are you=20 asserting "most people", therefore "consensus"=20 has been achieved? -- -=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D= -=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." --============_-1040620917==_ma============ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity?
At 19:50 -0500 2/14/07, Dean Anderson wrote:

>I am not declaring a consensus. I am stating, based on the history of
>discussion the various drafts, that most people agree with my views on
>this topic in contrast to, for example, Mr. Story's views.  If anything,
>I am asking for a consensus call on the 3 statements I proposed.

I went to www.m-w.com and looked up consensus.  It reads:

1 a: general agreement : unanimity <the consensus of their opinion, based on reports=8Afrom the border =8B John Hersey> b: the judgment arrived at by most of those concerned <the consensus was to go ahead>

Note in 1b - "most of those concerned".  Through this meaning of the word, I take "most people agree with my views" to be you saying there is consensus on this issue.

I am asking, based on what evidence are you asserting "most people", therefore "consensus" has been achieved?

--
-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-= =3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-
Edward Lewis                                                +1-571-434-5468
NeuStar

"Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5.  What I
need from you is a consistent story..."
--============_-1040620917==_ma============-- --===============1602747266== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --===============1602747266==-- From ignorexo@memlok.com Wed Feb 14 21:04:17 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHVyr-000518-GI for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 21:04:17 -0500 Received: from 218-174-135-174.dynamic.hinet.net ([218.174.135.174] helo=harry-nsi825pv4) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHVyn-0000Gb-Mi for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 21:04:16 -0500 Message-ID: <04a001c75197$3ebb17d0$8883f3e0@esimplisticf> Reply-To: "VDesmond Cody" From: "VDesmond Cody" To: Subject: My republican Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2007 10:04:06 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0003_03B0A57A.A38E1BD0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2720.3000 X-Spam-Score: 2.1 (++) X-Scan-Signature: cd3fc8e909678b38737fc606dec187f0 ------=_NextPart_000_0003_03B0A57A.A38E1BD0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0001_03B0A57A.A38E1BD0" ------=_NextPart_001_0001_03B0A57A.A38E1BD0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable because the case is continuing.Last week's fire was stoked by Santa Ana winds and in the families, need," said Jeanne Wade Evans, the San Bernardino Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an question: 'What's your plan?' " Bush said at a rally for Missouri Sen. Jim Talent, evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees." first for the five U.S. Forest Service firefighters who were overrun by flames National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11 statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday ttempted a U-turn with only 1,300 feet of room for the turn. To make a successful turn, statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday ... The finger is pointing at him." Authorities were trying to determine whether in an update on the crash. Lidle and Stanger were making an aerial tour of Manhattan who is seeking re-election in one of the tightest races in the nation. counts of arson and 10 counts of use of an incendiary device. The charges official involved in the investigation who spoke on condition of anonymity statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an probable cause of the crash was. The full board will likely vote on a ruling at a and into a New York City high-rise on October 11.The National Transportation Safety and fell 30 stories to the street below. Investigators do not say whether they and into a New York City high-rise on October 11.The National Transportation Safety and into a New York City high-rise on October 11.The National Transportation Safety Second guessing is not a strategy. Several thousand GOP supporters cheered Bush as he Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an told CBS's "The Early Show" on Friday, before her brother Jason McKay's funeral. on terror. "If they say they want to win the war on terror, but call for America air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along Board said the wind, coupled with the pilot's inability to turn sharply, forced the " attorney Mark McDonald said outside court. "He's very distraught and scared Republicans are all calling for change, he's desperately clinging to his stay the Laura, to celebrate her birthday Saturday. McKay's funeral in Victorville was the "President Bush has never had a plan to win in Iraq, and now that Democrats and in the past month, with more than 1,300 killed since October 1. Fearing more bloodshed National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11 Loutzenhiser, 43, of Idyllwild; and Pablo Cerda, 23, of Fountain Valley. A public said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the District Attorney-elect Rod Pacheco said the evidence against Oyler was "overwhelming," he would have had 2,100 feet, the NTSB said. Instead, the pilot was flying closer Oyler "adamantly denies involvement in this fire and in any of these fires, eavesdropping program and the Patriot Act don't understand the stakes in the war ------=_NextPart_001_0001_03B0A57A.A38E1BD0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
because the case is continuing.Last week's fire was stoked by Santa Ana winds and in the families, need," said Jeanne Wade Evans, the San Bernardino Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an question: 'What's your plan?' " Bush said at a rally for Missouri Sen. Jim Talent, evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees."
first for the five U.S. Forest Service firefighters who were overrun by flames psychopathic newport ignore3Dq National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11 statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday ttempted a U-turn with only 1,300 feet of room for the turn. To make a successful turn, statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday ... The finger is pointing at him." Authorities were trying to determine whether in an update on the crash. Lidle and Stanger were making an aerial tour of Manhattan who is seeking re-election in one of the tightest races in the nation. counts of arson and 10 counts of use of an incendiary device. The charges official involved in the investigation who spoke on condition of anonymity statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an probable cause of the crash was. The full board will likely vote on a ruling at a and into a New York City high-rise on October 11.The National Transportation Safety and fell 30 stories to the street below. Investigators do not say whether they and into a New York City high-rise on October 11.The National Transportation Safety and into a New York City high-rise on October 11.The National Transportation Safety Second guessing is not a strategy. Several thousand GOP supporters cheered Bush as he Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an told CBS's "The Early Show" on Friday, before her brother Jason McKay's funeral. on terror. "If they say they want to win the war on terror, but call for America air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along Board said the wind, coupled with the pilot's inability to turn sharply, forced the " attorney Mark McDonald said outside court. "He's very distraught and scared Republicans are all calling for change, he's desperately clinging to his stay the Laura, to celebrate her birthday Saturday. McKay's funeral in Victorville was the "President Bush has never had a plan to win in Iraq, and now that Democrats and in the past month, with more than 1,300 killed since October 1. Fearing more bloodshed National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11 Loutzenhiser, 43, of Idyllwild; and Pablo Cerda, 23, of Fountain Valley. A public said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the District Attorney-elect Rod Pacheco said the evidence against Oyler was "overwhelming," he would have had 2,100 feet, the NTSB said. Instead, the pilot was flying closer Oyler "adamantly denies involvement in this fire and in any of these fires, eavesdropping program and the Patriot Act don't understand the stakes in the war
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1HHXhk-00071Q-Ur for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 22:54:44 -0500 Received: from cirrus.av8.net ([130.105.36.66]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHXfx-00087T-Gx for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 22:52:55 -0500 Received: from [130.105.12.10] ([130.105.12.10]) (authenticated bits=0) by cirrus.av8.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1F3ql3G031573 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Wed, 14 Feb 2007 22:52:47 -0500 Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 22:52:45 -0500 (EST) From: Dean Anderson X-X-Sender: dean@citation2.av8.net To: Ted Lemon Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 0fa76816851382eb71b0a882ccdc29ac Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Edward Lewis X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Tue, 13 Feb 2007, Ted Lemon wrote: > This is a DNSOP draft, so I don't think we *can* use MUST NOT. I asked this before and got no answer. RFC2119 itself gives some guidance: "6. Guidance in the use of these Imperatives "Imperatives of the type defined in this memo must be used with care and sparingly. In particular, they MUST only be used where it is actually required for interoperation or to limit behavior which has potential for causing harm (e.g., limiting retransmisssions) For example, they must not be used to try to impose a particular method on implementors where the method is not required for interoperability. "7. Security Considerations "These terms are frequently used to specify behavior with security implications. The effects on security of not implementing a MUST or SHOULD, or doing something the specification says MUST NOT or SHOULD NOT be done may be very subtle. Document authors should take the time to elaborate the security implications of not following recommendations or requirements as most implementors will not have had the benefit of the experience and discussion that produced the specification." My purpose in using these terms is to limit behavior which has the potential for causing harm. Further, this text relates to security issues. In the draft I'm writing, these three paragraphs are in the "Security Considerations" section. > My main problem with this whole conversation is that I think the > draft already says this - it just doesn't say "MUST NOT" because it > *can't*. I think your are not looking hard enough for ambiguous language, and considering how that language might be used in the future. I'd ask that you review our offline conversation between 3/28/2005 and 4/2/2005, if you have it. Similar issues apply here as I drew your attention to then. > If you feel the wording is too weak, and the editor is willing to > incorporate your wording, minus the MUST NOTs, I have no objection to > that. And do you agre with the present wording if it is permissible to include the RFC2119 terms? I do feel the wording is way too weak. Basically, everyone should consider that if this document is approved as is, and Administrator A blocks your email because, e.g., it has the word "dialup" in the reverse mapping entry, then Administrator A will refer to this document as proof of the reasonableness of his actions. Likewise, if the reverse mapping doesn't exist, or doesn't "match" the forward mapping, etc, they will also point to this document as justification for their behavior. One will be left trying to prove that the ambiguous statements don't mean what Administrator A asserts they mean, a position that is very difficult. Consider the recent exchange between Robert Story and Ted Lemon, supposing after this draft is approved. As an exercise, try to show that Administrator A, acting as Story described, has acted unreasonably (as Lemon asserted) when Administrator A can quote the text of this draft in his defense. --Dean -- Av8 Internet Prepared to pay a premium for better service? www.av8.net faster, more reliable, better service 617 344 9000 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 14 22:58:44 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHXhz-00076L-Mw; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 22:54:59 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHXhk-00071Q-Ur for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 22:54:44 -0500 Received: from cirrus.av8.net ([130.105.36.66]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHXfx-00087T-Gx for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 22:52:55 -0500 Received: from [130.105.12.10] ([130.105.12.10]) (authenticated bits=0) by cirrus.av8.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1F3ql3G031573 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Wed, 14 Feb 2007 22:52:47 -0500 Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 22:52:45 -0500 (EST) From: Dean Anderson X-X-Sender: dean@citation2.av8.net To: Ted Lemon Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 0fa76816851382eb71b0a882ccdc29ac Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Edward Lewis X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Tue, 13 Feb 2007, Ted Lemon wrote: > This is a DNSOP draft, so I don't think we *can* use MUST NOT. I asked this before and got no answer. RFC2119 itself gives some guidance: "6. Guidance in the use of these Imperatives "Imperatives of the type defined in this memo must be used with care and sparingly. In particular, they MUST only be used where it is actually required for interoperation or to limit behavior which has potential for causing harm (e.g., limiting retransmisssions) For example, they must not be used to try to impose a particular method on implementors where the method is not required for interoperability. "7. Security Considerations "These terms are frequently used to specify behavior with security implications. The effects on security of not implementing a MUST or SHOULD, or doing something the specification says MUST NOT or SHOULD NOT be done may be very subtle. Document authors should take the time to elaborate the security implications of not following recommendations or requirements as most implementors will not have had the benefit of the experience and discussion that produced the specification." My purpose in using these terms is to limit behavior which has the potential for causing harm. Further, this text relates to security issues. In the draft I'm writing, these three paragraphs are in the "Security Considerations" section. > My main problem with this whole conversation is that I think the > draft already says this - it just doesn't say "MUST NOT" because it > *can't*. I think your are not looking hard enough for ambiguous language, and considering how that language might be used in the future. I'd ask that you review our offline conversation between 3/28/2005 and 4/2/2005, if you have it. Similar issues apply here as I drew your attention to then. > If you feel the wording is too weak, and the editor is willing to > incorporate your wording, minus the MUST NOTs, I have no objection to > that. And do you agre with the present wording if it is permissible to include the RFC2119 terms? I do feel the wording is way too weak. Basically, everyone should consider that if this document is approved as is, and Administrator A blocks your email because, e.g., it has the word "dialup" in the reverse mapping entry, then Administrator A will refer to this document as proof of the reasonableness of his actions. Likewise, if the reverse mapping doesn't exist, or doesn't "match" the forward mapping, etc, they will also point to this document as justification for their behavior. One will be left trying to prove that the ambiguous statements don't mean what Administrator A asserts they mean, a position that is very difficult. Consider the recent exchange between Robert Story and Ted Lemon, supposing after this draft is approved. As an exercise, try to show that Administrator A, acting as Story described, has acted unreasonably (as Lemon asserted) when Administrator A can quote the text of this draft in his defense. --Dean -- Av8 Internet Prepared to pay a premium for better service? www.av8.net faster, more reliable, better service 617 344 9000 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Thu Feb 15 00:21:02 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHZ07-0000TU-Ky; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 00:17:47 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHZ05-0000Rt-Lo for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 00:17:45 -0500 Received: from cirrus.av8.net ([130.105.36.66]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHZ03-0001fZ-8p for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 00:17:45 -0500 Received: from [130.105.12.10] ([130.105.12.10]) (authenticated bits=0) by cirrus.av8.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1F5HbxM031673 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Thu, 15 Feb 2007 00:17:37 -0500 Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2007 00:17:36 -0500 (EST) From: Dean Anderson X-X-Sender: dean@citation2.av8.net To: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 37af5f8fbf6f013c5b771388e24b09e7 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Wed, 14 Feb 2007, Edward Lewis wrote: > At 19:50 -0500 2/14/07, Dean Anderson wrote: > > >I am not declaring a consensus. I am stating, based on the history of > >discussion the various drafts, that most people agree with my views on > >this topic in contrast to, for example, Mr. Story's views. If anything, > >I am asking for a consensus call on the 3 statements I proposed. [...] > I am asking, based on what evidence are you asserting "most people", > therefore "consensus" has been achieved? I've said History. You have access to the archives. Here are some: Re: comment on draft-ietf-dnsop-inaddr-required-02.txt by Kevin Darcy , Tue, 07 Aug 2001 "But, why use reverse DNS at all? It leads to all sorts of bad security practices, half-solutions to real problems (like the spam problem) and a *false* sense of security." At 10:01 PM 9/12/01, Kevin Darcy wrote: >I oppose adoption/advancement of the draft. Not only are the security >justifications null and void, I think they actually *detract* from the >other justifications inasmuch as they promote/encourage bad security >practices and/or risk creating a False Sense of Security. Re: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-dnsop-inaddr-required-04.txt by JINMEI Tatuya Fri, 04 Apr 2003 "Secondly, if I don't misunderstand the intention, the draft says two things: [...] "2. applications should not rely on reverse mapping for several purposes as they currently do. The discouraged purposes include: - rejecting ftp/telnet connections just due to the lack of reverse mapping or failure of reverse-forward-reverse match. - filtering rule in TCP wrappers due to the lack of reverse mapping - regarding e-mail messages as spam if the sender address does not have a reverse mapping" [JINMEI did misunderstand the draft's intention. It did not DIScourage these things, it ENcouraged them. JINMEI agrees, as I do, that they should be DIScouraged.] Re: [dnsop] Tangible harm caused by in-addr-required draft by Ted Lemon Fri, 1 Apr 2005 "> Dean Anderson writes: > Basically, this says its ok to use in-addr based security, and if they > don't match, that's a "security concern". > > In other words, matching in-addr is required. "This is a legitimate, specific criticism. One that I haven't seen from you before on the mailing list. I very much support fixing cases where the text can be misread in the way you suggest. It would be disastrous if someone read the document the way you suggest, and I can see where someone could make that mistake, although it wasn't obvious to me until you pointed it out. [...]" [Oddly, I had been saying that all along, but apparently Ted didn't see it.] There's more, but I've made the point. Basically, many people have greatly misunderstood this document, and when those misunderstandings are eventually illuminated for them, they agree with me. That is, except for those people who vehemently agree with Robert Story's viewpoint, such as Mans Nielson and some others. The proponents have gone from calling for 'in-addr required' in 2000 (document name and title), to assuring us they didn't mean that in-addr was required despite the document name (but it really was required, they just put it in the ambigous text), to where we are now (changing the document name). I assert that these misunderstandings indicate ambiguity in the text, and that the text must be very carefully examined to avoid the 'disastrous results' (quoting Ted Lemon) that would result from the mistake. The present authors have not eliminated the previous ambiguity, but have merely changed the wording to different, but still ambiguous, statements with the same disastrous effect as before---still supporting the notion that in-addr is required for security, that it is reasonable to block email based on 'dialup' in the name, or because there is no in-addr RR, etc (see section 4 of the current draft). This document has not achieved consensus for many years (7 years?) because no one agrees with (eg) Robert Story's views, and once it become clear the document endorses that view, it is sent back for revision. Perhaps you've forgotton some things: Re: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-dnsop-inaddr-required-04.txt by Ed Lewis Fri, 4 Apr 2003 "I'd recommend only working on the document if the tone is of a report on the current state of affairs and not that of a mission statement to fix the ills of a broken reverse map. The former is useful and closure can be reached, the latter a rat hole without bottom." Seems Section 4 of the current draft are just such 'ills of a broken reverse map'. Of course, its not really "broken", it just doesn't conform to the 1:1 scheme that the anti-spammers want everyone to use and want the DNSOP WG to approve and encourage. I hope I've jogged your memory, and cleared up a few things. --Dean -- Av8 Internet Prepared to pay a premium for better service? www.av8.net faster, more reliable, better service 617 344 9000 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Thu Feb 15 00:21:02 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHZ07-0000TU-Ky; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 00:17:47 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHZ05-0000Rt-Lo for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 00:17:45 -0500 Received: from cirrus.av8.net ([130.105.36.66]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHZ03-0001fZ-8p for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 00:17:45 -0500 Received: from [130.105.12.10] ([130.105.12.10]) (authenticated bits=0) by cirrus.av8.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1F5HbxM031673 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Thu, 15 Feb 2007 00:17:37 -0500 Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2007 00:17:36 -0500 (EST) From: Dean Anderson X-X-Sender: dean@citation2.av8.net To: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 37af5f8fbf6f013c5b771388e24b09e7 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Wed, 14 Feb 2007, Edward Lewis wrote: > At 19:50 -0500 2/14/07, Dean Anderson wrote: > > >I am not declaring a consensus. I am stating, based on the history of > >discussion the various drafts, that most people agree with my views on > >this topic in contrast to, for example, Mr. Story's views. If anything, > >I am asking for a consensus call on the 3 statements I proposed. [...] > I am asking, based on what evidence are you asserting "most people", > therefore "consensus" has been achieved? I've said History. You have access to the archives. Here are some: Re: comment on draft-ietf-dnsop-inaddr-required-02.txt by Kevin Darcy , Tue, 07 Aug 2001 "But, why use reverse DNS at all? It leads to all sorts of bad security practices, half-solutions to real problems (like the spam problem) and a *false* sense of security." At 10:01 PM 9/12/01, Kevin Darcy wrote: >I oppose adoption/advancement of the draft. Not only are the security >justifications null and void, I think they actually *detract* from the >other justifications inasmuch as they promote/encourage bad security >practices and/or risk creating a False Sense of Security. Re: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-dnsop-inaddr-required-04.txt by JINMEI Tatuya Fri, 04 Apr 2003 "Secondly, if I don't misunderstand the intention, the draft says two things: [...] "2. applications should not rely on reverse mapping for several purposes as they currently do. The discouraged purposes include: - rejecting ftp/telnet connections just due to the lack of reverse mapping or failure of reverse-forward-reverse match. - filtering rule in TCP wrappers due to the lack of reverse mapping - regarding e-mail messages as spam if the sender address does not have a reverse mapping" [JINMEI did misunderstand the draft's intention. It did not DIScourage these things, it ENcouraged them. JINMEI agrees, as I do, that they should be DIScouraged.] Re: [dnsop] Tangible harm caused by in-addr-required draft by Ted Lemon Fri, 1 Apr 2005 "> Dean Anderson writes: > Basically, this says its ok to use in-addr based security, and if they > don't match, that's a "security concern". > > In other words, matching in-addr is required. "This is a legitimate, specific criticism. One that I haven't seen from you before on the mailing list. I very much support fixing cases where the text can be misread in the way you suggest. It would be disastrous if someone read the document the way you suggest, and I can see where someone could make that mistake, although it wasn't obvious to me until you pointed it out. [...]" [Oddly, I had been saying that all along, but apparently Ted didn't see it.] There's more, but I've made the point. Basically, many people have greatly misunderstood this document, and when those misunderstandings are eventually illuminated for them, they agree with me. That is, except for those people who vehemently agree with Robert Story's viewpoint, such as Mans Nielson and some others. The proponents have gone from calling for 'in-addr required' in 2000 (document name and title), to assuring us they didn't mean that in-addr was required despite the document name (but it really was required, they just put it in the ambigous text), to where we are now (changing the document name). I assert that these misunderstandings indicate ambiguity in the text, and that the text must be very carefully examined to avoid the 'disastrous results' (quoting Ted Lemon) that would result from the mistake. The present authors have not eliminated the previous ambiguity, but have merely changed the wording to different, but still ambiguous, statements with the same disastrous effect as before---still supporting the notion that in-addr is required for security, that it is reasonable to block email based on 'dialup' in the name, or because there is no in-addr RR, etc (see section 4 of the current draft). This document has not achieved consensus for many years (7 years?) because no one agrees with (eg) Robert Story's views, and once it become clear the document endorses that view, it is sent back for revision. Perhaps you've forgotton some things: Re: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-dnsop-inaddr-required-04.txt by Ed Lewis Fri, 4 Apr 2003 "I'd recommend only working on the document if the tone is of a report on the current state of affairs and not that of a mission statement to fix the ills of a broken reverse map. The former is useful and closure can be reached, the latter a rat hole without bottom." Seems Section 4 of the current draft are just such 'ills of a broken reverse map'. Of course, its not really "broken", it just doesn't conform to the 1:1 scheme that the anti-spammers want everyone to use and want the DNSOP WG to approve and encourage. I hope I've jogged your memory, and cleared up a few things. --Dean -- Av8 Internet Prepared to pay a premium for better service? www.av8.net faster, more reliable, better service 617 344 9000 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Thu Feb 15 01:03:11 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHZfj-0002E8-3h; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 01:00:47 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHZfi-0002DW-2n for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 01:00:46 -0500 Received: from shell-ng.nominum.com ([81.200.64.181]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHZfg-0007N2-Od for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 01:00:46 -0500 Received: from mail.nominum.com (mail.nominum.com [81.200.64.186]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by shell-ng.nominum.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C4C25684E; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 22:00:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Ted.Lemon@nominum.com) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=8.4 tests=AWL: -0.799,BAYES_99: 4.07,CUSTOM_RULE_FROM: ALLOW, TOTAL_SCORE: 3.271 X-Spam-Level: Received: from [66.93.162.135] ([66.93.162.135]) (authenticated user mellon@nominum.com) by mail.nominum.com (using TLSv1/SSLv3 with cipher AES128-SHA (128 bits)); Wed, 14 Feb 2007 22:00:42 -0800 In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <65016F57-50E0-41DE-AF1E-016AB35DAC50@nominum.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Ted Lemon Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 23:00:40 -0700 To: Dean Anderson X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: ea4ac80f790299f943f0a53be7e1a21a Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Edward Lewis X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Feb 14, 2007, at 10:17 PM, Dean Anderson wrote: > Basically, many people have greatly misunderstood this document, That people have misunderstood the document is your assertion, which may or may not be true. That people agree that using in-addr for security is clearly true, as your quotations suggest. However, your primary assertion - that people have misunderstood the document in the way that you assert - remains unproven. I do not object to making the document clearer, if good replacement text is offered in a timely fashion. But I don't agree with you that the document is unclear - it seems pretty clear to me. Clearer is always better, and if you can help to make that happen I'm all in favor. But there is a side of this about which you are not talking, and it's important. My concern, and probably Ed's as well, is that these repeated amendments are simply wasting time, and not adding value. So my position is that if you can quickly offer an amendment to the existing draft that clearly makes the text better than it already is, and then you will be happy, I would like for that to happen. And if you can suggest text to cut that you think is unnecessary, and we can quickly agree that that is so, I'm okay with that too. But if you want to submit and debate a whole new draft, or you want to continue the debate into 2009 (since you are referencing conversations from 2005), and that's going to keep this in the hopper, I would like for that to not happen. We have been discussing this draft for a long time. It's a draft that I think adds value as it is. We do not need to keep discussing it for another two years. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Thu Feb 15 01:03:11 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHZfj-0002E8-3h; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 01:00:47 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHZfi-0002DW-2n for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 01:00:46 -0500 Received: from shell-ng.nominum.com ([81.200.64.181]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHZfg-0007N2-Od for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 01:00:46 -0500 Received: from mail.nominum.com (mail.nominum.com [81.200.64.186]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by shell-ng.nominum.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C4C25684E; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 22:00:44 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from Ted.Lemon@nominum.com) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=8.4 tests=AWL: -0.799,BAYES_99: 4.07,CUSTOM_RULE_FROM: ALLOW, TOTAL_SCORE: 3.271 X-Spam-Level: Received: from [66.93.162.135] ([66.93.162.135]) (authenticated user mellon@nominum.com) by mail.nominum.com (using TLSv1/SSLv3 with cipher AES128-SHA (128 bits)); Wed, 14 Feb 2007 22:00:42 -0800 In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <65016F57-50E0-41DE-AF1E-016AB35DAC50@nominum.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Ted Lemon Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 23:00:40 -0700 To: Dean Anderson X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: ea4ac80f790299f943f0a53be7e1a21a Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Edward Lewis X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Feb 14, 2007, at 10:17 PM, Dean Anderson wrote: > Basically, many people have greatly misunderstood this document, That people have misunderstood the document is your assertion, which may or may not be true. That people agree that using in-addr for security is clearly true, as your quotations suggest. However, your primary assertion - that people have misunderstood the document in the way that you assert - remains unproven. I do not object to making the document clearer, if good replacement text is offered in a timely fashion. But I don't agree with you that the document is unclear - it seems pretty clear to me. Clearer is always better, and if you can help to make that happen I'm all in favor. But there is a side of this about which you are not talking, and it's important. My concern, and probably Ed's as well, is that these repeated amendments are simply wasting time, and not adding value. So my position is that if you can quickly offer an amendment to the existing draft that clearly makes the text better than it already is, and then you will be happy, I would like for that to happen. And if you can suggest text to cut that you think is unnecessary, and we can quickly agree that that is so, I'm okay with that too. But if you want to submit and debate a whole new draft, or you want to continue the debate into 2009 (since you are referencing conversations from 2005), and that's going to keep this in the hopper, I would like for that to not happen. We have been discussing this draft for a long time. It's a draft that I think adds value as it is. We do not need to keep discussing it for another two years. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Thu Feb 15 01:27:52 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHa2x-0001Xe-QQ; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 01:24:47 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHa2w-0001X2-LU for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 01:24:46 -0500 Received: from outbound-mail.lax.untd.com ([64.136.28.164]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHa2l-0002Om-ST for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 01:24:37 -0500 Received: from webmail49.lax.untd.com (webmail49.lax.untd.com [10.131.27.189]) by smtpout04.lax.untd.com with SMTP id AABC7H9DVAEK45Q2 for (sender ); Wed, 14 Feb 2007 22:23:47 -0800 (PST) X-UNTD-OriginStamp: AcganUYbgVGZ0C6nm/9IPcINWq1SZzwVS5eIdKJArXgF/NT3DSlqSw== Received: (from fergdawg@netzero.net) by webmail49.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id MELP6MFM; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 22:23:14 PST Received: from [24.23.201.115] by webmail49.lax.untd.com with HTTP: Thu, 15 Feb 2007 06:22:30 GMT X-Originating-IP: [24.23.201.115] Mime-Version: 1.0 From: "Fergie" Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2007 06:22:30 GMT To: Ted.Lemon@nominum.com Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? X-Mailer: Webmail Version 4.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <20070214.222314.4252.2205363@webmail49.lax.untd.com> X-ContentStamp: 15:7:4156975342 X-MAIL-INFO: 2d0b176bc79e179e9ece0baed72777f7f763abaaf793dad797ca73fa4f6a6a17674a8b6b X-UNTD-Peer-Info: 10.131.27.189|webmail49.lax.untd.com|webmail49.lax.untd.com|fergdawg@netzero.net X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 0fa76816851382eb71b0a882ccdc29ac Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Completely concur with you here, Ted. - - ferg - -- Ted Lemon wrote: On Feb 14, 2007, at 10:17 PM, Dean Anderson wrote: > Basically, many people have greatly misunderstood this document, That people have misunderstood the document is your assertion, which = may or may not be true. That people agree that using in-addr for = security is clearly true, as your quotations suggest. However, your = primary assertion - that people have misunderstood the document in = the way that you assert - remains unproven. I do not object to making the document clearer, if good replacement = text is offered in a timely fashion. But I don't agree with you = that the document is unclear - it seems pretty clear to me. Clearer = is always better, and if you can help to make that happen I'm all in = favor. But there is a side of this about which you are not talking, = and it's important. My concern, and probably Ed's as well, is that = these repeated amendments are simply wasting time, and not adding value.= So my position is that if you can quickly offer an amendment to the = existing draft that clearly makes the text better than it already is, = and then you will be happy, I would like for that to happen. And if = you can suggest text to cut that you think is unnecessary, and we can = quickly agree that that is so, I'm okay with that too. But if you = want to submit and debate a whole new draft, or you want to continue = the debate into 2009 (since you are referencing conversations from = 2005), and that's going to keep this in the hopper, I would like for = that to not happen. We have been discussing this draft for a long = time. It's a draft that I think adds value as it is. We do not = need to keep discussing it for another two years. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGP Desktop 9.5.3 (Build 5003) wj8DBQFF0/wfq1pz9mNUZTMRAq9bAJ4yP+/Q52p4uvdjfg4ab/0WmWBOWACgmjCb MYqcWT9URdIG2qXLHDvKWxs=3D =3DSXco -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- "Fergie", a.k.a. Paul Ferguson Engineering Architecture for the Internet fergdawg(at)netzero.net ferg's tech blog: http://fergdawg.blogspot.com/ _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Thu Feb 15 01:27:52 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHa2x-0001Xe-QQ; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 01:24:47 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHa2w-0001X2-LU for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 01:24:46 -0500 Received: from outbound-mail.lax.untd.com ([64.136.28.164]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHa2l-0002Om-ST for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 01:24:37 -0500 Received: from webmail49.lax.untd.com (webmail49.lax.untd.com [10.131.27.189]) by smtpout04.lax.untd.com with SMTP id AABC7H9DVAEK45Q2 for (sender ); Wed, 14 Feb 2007 22:23:47 -0800 (PST) X-UNTD-OriginStamp: AcganUYbgVGZ0C6nm/9IPcINWq1SZzwVS5eIdKJArXgF/NT3DSlqSw== Received: (from fergdawg@netzero.net) by webmail49.lax.untd.com (jqueuemail) id MELP6MFM; Wed, 14 Feb 2007 22:23:14 PST Received: from [24.23.201.115] by webmail49.lax.untd.com with HTTP: Thu, 15 Feb 2007 06:22:30 GMT X-Originating-IP: [24.23.201.115] Mime-Version: 1.0 From: "Fergie" Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2007 06:22:30 GMT To: Ted.Lemon@nominum.com Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? X-Mailer: Webmail Version 4.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <20070214.222314.4252.2205363@webmail49.lax.untd.com> X-ContentStamp: 15:7:4156975342 X-MAIL-INFO: 2d0b176bc79e179e9ece0baed72777f7f763abaaf793dad797ca73fa4f6a6a17674a8b6b X-UNTD-Peer-Info: 10.131.27.189|webmail49.lax.untd.com|webmail49.lax.untd.com|fergdawg@netzero.net X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 0fa76816851382eb71b0a882ccdc29ac Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Completely concur with you here, Ted. - - ferg - -- Ted Lemon wrote: On Feb 14, 2007, at 10:17 PM, Dean Anderson wrote: > Basically, many people have greatly misunderstood this document, That people have misunderstood the document is your assertion, which = may or may not be true. That people agree that using in-addr for = security is clearly true, as your quotations suggest. However, your = primary assertion - that people have misunderstood the document in = the way that you assert - remains unproven. I do not object to making the document clearer, if good replacement = text is offered in a timely fashion. But I don't agree with you = that the document is unclear - it seems pretty clear to me. Clearer = is always better, and if you can help to make that happen I'm all in = favor. But there is a side of this about which you are not talking, = and it's important. My concern, and probably Ed's as well, is that = these repeated amendments are simply wasting time, and not adding value.= So my position is that if you can quickly offer an amendment to the = existing draft that clearly makes the text better than it already is, = and then you will be happy, I would like for that to happen. And if = you can suggest text to cut that you think is unnecessary, and we can = quickly agree that that is so, I'm okay with that too. But if you = want to submit and debate a whole new draft, or you want to continue = the debate into 2009 (since you are referencing conversations from = 2005), and that's going to keep this in the hopper, I would like for = that to not happen. We have been discussing this draft for a long = time. It's a draft that I think adds value as it is. We do not = need to keep discussing it for another two years. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGP Desktop 9.5.3 (Build 5003) wj8DBQFF0/wfq1pz9mNUZTMRAq9bAJ4yP+/Q52p4uvdjfg4ab/0WmWBOWACgmjCb MYqcWT9URdIG2qXLHDvKWxs=3D =3DSXco -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- "Fergie", a.k.a. Paul Ferguson Engineering Architecture for the Internet fergdawg(at)netzero.net ferg's tech blog: http://fergdawg.blogspot.com/ _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From skankerbobdooxe@swissamericanimports.com Thu Feb 15 03:05:41 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHbcb-0006Wv-5O; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 03:05:41 -0500 Received: from [211.108.81.42] (helo=swissamericanimports.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHbcY-00016r-Ue; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 03:05:41 -0500 Message-ID: Reply-To: "Caitlyn" From: "Caitlyn" To: "johna ruiz" Cc: "geraldine" , "kellye hunt" , "britni campbell" , "lorrie dunn" , "linh stephens" , "alejandro" , "bennie grant" , "jessi chavez" Subject: Can't Believe It Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2007 00:41:08 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_06C_5F87_DDCDA93A.4AF3AD74" X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 3.6 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: e9d8c60d9288f2c774f26bab15869505 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_06C_5F87_DDCDA93A.4AF3AD74 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_89C_F9D6_33DB84E6.0C6725A5" ------=_NextPart_89C_F9D6_33DB84E6.0C6725A5 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "And loss what wrote did cuddly bake you say to her?" wobble "You mist= ook alert march mean the Colosseum?" 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thunder "Upon my word," cried level journey Albert, comparison "you must = have beensent "I?--I milk live the sought happiest pain life possible, th= e real lsteel "You are a born diplomat," play wood x-ray returned Franz; = "go and"Revenge, committee care neck for lick instance!" observed Franz.&= nbsp;        
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dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 05:38:58 -0500 Received: from [211.52.220.152] (helo=comcast.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHe0v-0005mY-09 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 05:38:58 -0500 Received: from 3wn9qwz3kvzkk0l ([216.119.177.50]) by 211.52.220.152 (4.87.1/4.87.1) with SMTP id WpT7KvcC6xE03m; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 19:40:06 +0900 Message-ID: <001401c75139$17f5a9f0$0c45cae4@3wn9qwz3kvzkk0l> From: "Helga Mims" To: "dnsop-archive" Subject: To sadism an budgetary Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2007 19:38:07 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0011_01C75139.17F5A9F0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.3790.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.1081 X-Spam-Score: 4.8 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 0fa76816851382eb71b0a882ccdc29ac ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C75139.17F5A9F0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Energy Company Alert!.. S.umbol: UTEVCurrent price: $0.012 Recommendation: very aggresive buy!!! We see this as a huge profit taking a energy deal!! Company info: The nature of UTEV's main business is to commercialize = environmentally-friendly technologies.UTEV's activities are oriented = towards sustainable development which is highly appropriateconsidering = that we have entered an era where clean energy and environment will most = likely remain major issues. Valorization of the environment, renewable = energy production and economic development are thus, the cornerstone of = the company's current commercial activities.! Check the news of UTEV, dnsop-archive.. ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C75139.17F5A9F0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Energy Company Alert!...

S.umbol: = UTEV
Current price: $0.012
Recommendation: very aggresive = buy.



We see = this as a huge profit taking a energy deal!!!

Company = info:


The = nature of UTEV's main business is to commercialize = environmentally-friendly technologies.
UTEV's activities are oriented = towards sustainable development which is highly = appropriate
considering that we have entered an era where clean = energy and environment will most likely
remain major issues. = Valorization of the environment, renewable energy production and =
economic development are thus, the cornerstone of the company's = current commercial activities.!!!


Check = the news of UTEV, dnsop-archive!!



------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C75139.17F5A9F0-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Thu Feb 15 06:47:13 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHf2f-0004uE-RR; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 06:44:49 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHf2e-0004u9-Vu for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 06:44:48 -0500 Received: from server1.dns.net ([64.39.31.27]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHf2d-0000jb-N2 for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 06:44:48 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by server1.dns.net (8.11.7/8.11.6) id l1FBiiD16111; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 11:44:44 GMT Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2007 11:44:26 +0000 From: Andras Salamon To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Message-ID: <20070215114426.GB1937@dns.net> References: <65016F57-50E0-41DE-AF1E-016AB35DAC50@nominum.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <65016F57-50E0-41DE-AF1E-016AB35DAC50@nominum.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 08e48e05374109708c00c6208b534009 X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Wed, Feb 14, 2007 at 11:00:40PM -0700, Ted Lemon wrote: > We have been discussing this draft for a long > time. It's a draft that I think adds value as it is. We do not > need to keep discussing it for another two years. Agreed. Let's ship. -- Andras Salamon andras@dns.net _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Thu Feb 15 06:47:13 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHf2f-0004uE-RR; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 06:44:49 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHf2e-0004u9-Vu for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 06:44:48 -0500 Received: from server1.dns.net ([64.39.31.27]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHf2d-0000jb-N2 for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 06:44:48 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by server1.dns.net (8.11.7/8.11.6) id l1FBiiD16111; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 11:44:44 GMT Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2007 11:44:26 +0000 From: Andras Salamon To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Message-ID: <20070215114426.GB1937@dns.net> References: <65016F57-50E0-41DE-AF1E-016AB35DAC50@nominum.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <65016F57-50E0-41DE-AF1E-016AB35DAC50@nominum.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 08e48e05374109708c00c6208b534009 X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Wed, Feb 14, 2007 at 11:00:40PM -0700, Ted Lemon wrote: > We have been discussing this draft for a long > time. It's a draft that I think adds value as it is. We do not > need to keep discussing it for another two years. Agreed. Let's ship. -- Andras Salamon andras@dns.net _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From home@mailbind.net Thu Feb 15 07:48:40 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHg2S-0006gQ-E7 for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 07:48:40 -0500 Received: from [125.187.32.212] (helo=m20.mailyes.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHg2N-0000b2-MR for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 07:48:40 -0500 Received: (qmail 26224 invoked by uid 0); 15 Feb 2007 21:45:45 +0900 Message-ID: <20070215124545.26223.qmail@m20.mailyes.net> To: dnsop-archive Subject: =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCQzs7fjRWISI5Yjx9Rn4bKEI=?= =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCISo7djZIM0hCZyRLJEQkLTZbNV5ESTJDQmdKZz04ISobKEI=?= From: success777 Reply-to: delivery_rt Date: 2007-02-15 21:44:14 Content-type: text/plain; charset= ISO-2022-JP X-Mailer: GOOD Mailer 1.0 X-Priority: 1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Keywords: 20070215135921_cbrd Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-2022-JP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 4.7 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 3e15cc4fdc61d7bce84032741d11c8e5 $B(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(B $B"#"#!!(B?$B%5%/%;%9(BC&C$B$+$i(BPR$B%9%?%C%UJg=8!!"#"#(B $B"M!!(Bhttp://www.success777.jp/$B!!!!(B $B(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(B $B!!=i?4>>>>> 1.$BI{6H$H$7$F$b2DG=(B 2.$B%Q%A%s%3!&%9%m%C%H$,9%$-$JJ}!J9%$-$J;v$,$=$N$^$^$*;E;v$K!*!*!K(B 3.$BL4$,$"$kJ}!"$d$j$?$$;v$,$"$kJ}!J>-Mh$N0Y$K!K(B $B"M"M"M"M0J>e$N;v$K#1$D$G$bEv$F$O$^$kJ}$O!"$^$:$O$*Ld$$9g$o$;$/$@$5$$!#(B $B"((BPR$B%9%?%C%U$H$7$F:NMQ;~!"A42q0w$K$b$l$J$/(B3$BK|1_$r%W%l%<%s%H!#(B $B%U%j!<%@%$%"%k!!(B0120-520-621 $B$*Ld9g$;;~4V!!!!(B10$B;~!A(B19$B;~(B $B"M!!"M"M"M"M(B http://www.success777.jp/ $B"(3FCO0hDj0w$K$J$j?.H>5?$GEPO?$7$?$N$G$9$,!"C4Ev$NJ}$,CzG+$K;XF3$7$F$/$@$5$j(B $B0l7nH>$G#7#5K|1_2T$2$k$h$&$K$J$j$^$7$?!#K\Ev$K$"$j$,$H$&$4$6$$$^$9!#(B $BJ!2,8)!!%U%j!<%?! From: JINMEI Tatuya / =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCP0BMQEMjOkgbKEI=?= To: Andrew Sullivan Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? In-Reply-To: <20070206144317.GD21968@afilias.info> References: <20070116221355.GP25101@afilias.info> <20070206144317.GD21968@afilias.info> User-Agent: Wanderlust/2.14.0 (Africa) Emacs/21.3 Mule/5.0 (SAKAKI) Organization: Research & Development Center, Toshiba Corp., Kawasaki, Japan. MIME-Version: 1.0 (generated by SEMI 1.14.6 - "Maruoka") Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: a2c12dacc0736f14d6b540e805505a86 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org >>>>> On Tue, 6 Feb 2007 09:43:18 -0500, >>>>> Andrew Sullivan said: > I believe that the draft as it stands is consistent with the second > view, and that it expresses a view that is contrary to the first > view. In other words, the draft as written says, I think, that > administrator of site A is perfectly entitled to make decisions about > site B on the basis of reverse mappings, _but_, the administrator of > site A is cautioned that there are plenty of pitfalls in that > strategy, and they ought to be taken into consideration. Okay, that was actually what I thought, while being confused, was the intent of this document. On top of the understanding that this document actually supports the second view rather than being neutral, I have next concern. The problem of this stance is that this document does not explain (at least not to me) why the following is justified: > administrator of site A is perfectly entitled to make decisions about > site B on the basis of reverse mappings, > but that, on balance, unless > you have pretty good reasons not to maintain it, you should maintain a > reverse mapping. Perhaps the intent is to explain it in Section 3.3, but they are basically just "there are applications that make decisions about site X on the basis of reverse mappings". In particular, it does not answer the question of how the behavior of such applications is valid. On the other hand, Section 4.2 (seems to) indicate such usage is not really valid: Operators and users are reminded that the use of the reverse tree, sometimes in conjunction with a lookup of the name resulting from the PTR record, provides no real security, can lead to erroneous results and generally just increases load on DNS servers. It would be okay if this document took a neutral position describing two controversial views. But since it is going to support, even mildly, one particular view, it should provide why it's justified in a convincing way. Perhaps the following part of the intent was expected to be used as an excuse: > _but_, the administrator of > site A is cautioned that there are plenty of pitfalls in that > strategy, but at least to me it's not enough; a "caution" can easily be ignored, particularly when one is told "it is perfectly entitled to do it". So... > I'd like to know whether people think that is a reasonable thing to > say. If the answer is, "No," then I'm not sure what we can say about > reverse mappings at all. sorry, but the answer is "No" to me. And I tend to agree that it'll be not really sure whether we can say anything (as I indicated my previous message), but I can still see some options: 1. update the draft with the opposite (first) view. This is basically what I proposed in my previous message, and I believe it can explain why one should do this although I admit I'm biased on this point. 2. keep the current position (i.e, support the second view), but explain why the recommendation is justified despite the description against it (which must be more than "because there are such applications"). BTW: if we keep this view, the abstract and the Introduction should be clearer on this; currently, these read as if this document simply talks about issues regarding reverse mappings in a neutral position. This is actually one of the reasons why I was confused about the purpose of this document. 3. update the draft without supporting any view, in a neutral position. In that case, we'll probably simply make "cautions" of not-providing and relying on reverse mappings equally rather than making specific recommendations. As you indicated above, this approach may weaken the value of this document, but since this seems to be a subtle, controversial issue, I think it's the most balanced compromise. Not sure how many of others agree with me, but I'm happy to volunteer to provide suggested text for option 1 or 3. JINMEI, Tatuya Communication Platform Lab. Corporate R&D Center, Toshiba Corp. jinmei@isl.rdc.toshiba.co.jp _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Thu Feb 15 08:23:57 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHgW7-000437-Sy; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 08:19:19 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHgW6-00041H-2h for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 08:19:18 -0500 Received: from shuttle.wide.toshiba.co.jp ([2001:200:1b1::35]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHgW3-0003zN-ED for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 08:19:18 -0500 Received: from impact.jinmei.org (t050096.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp [203.189.50.96]) by shuttle.wide.toshiba.co.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A5AD7301D; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 22:19:11 +0900 (JST) Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2007 22:18:54 +0900 Message-ID: From: JINMEI Tatuya / =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCP0BMQEMjOkgbKEI=?= To: Andrew Sullivan Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? In-Reply-To: <20070206144317.GD21968@afilias.info> References: <20070116221355.GP25101@afilias.info> <20070206144317.GD21968@afilias.info> User-Agent: Wanderlust/2.14.0 (Africa) Emacs/21.3 Mule/5.0 (SAKAKI) Organization: Research & Development Center, Toshiba Corp., Kawasaki, Japan. MIME-Version: 1.0 (generated by SEMI 1.14.6 - "Maruoka") Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: a2c12dacc0736f14d6b540e805505a86 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org >>>>> On Tue, 6 Feb 2007 09:43:18 -0500, >>>>> Andrew Sullivan said: > I believe that the draft as it stands is consistent with the second > view, and that it expresses a view that is contrary to the first > view. In other words, the draft as written says, I think, that > administrator of site A is perfectly entitled to make decisions about > site B on the basis of reverse mappings, _but_, the administrator of > site A is cautioned that there are plenty of pitfalls in that > strategy, and they ought to be taken into consideration. Okay, that was actually what I thought, while being confused, was the intent of this document. On top of the understanding that this document actually supports the second view rather than being neutral, I have next concern. The problem of this stance is that this document does not explain (at least not to me) why the following is justified: > administrator of site A is perfectly entitled to make decisions about > site B on the basis of reverse mappings, > but that, on balance, unless > you have pretty good reasons not to maintain it, you should maintain a > reverse mapping. Perhaps the intent is to explain it in Section 3.3, but they are basically just "there are applications that make decisions about site X on the basis of reverse mappings". In particular, it does not answer the question of how the behavior of such applications is valid. On the other hand, Section 4.2 (seems to) indicate such usage is not really valid: Operators and users are reminded that the use of the reverse tree, sometimes in conjunction with a lookup of the name resulting from the PTR record, provides no real security, can lead to erroneous results and generally just increases load on DNS servers. It would be okay if this document took a neutral position describing two controversial views. But since it is going to support, even mildly, one particular view, it should provide why it's justified in a convincing way. Perhaps the following part of the intent was expected to be used as an excuse: > _but_, the administrator of > site A is cautioned that there are plenty of pitfalls in that > strategy, but at least to me it's not enough; a "caution" can easily be ignored, particularly when one is told "it is perfectly entitled to do it". So... > I'd like to know whether people think that is a reasonable thing to > say. If the answer is, "No," then I'm not sure what we can say about > reverse mappings at all. sorry, but the answer is "No" to me. And I tend to agree that it'll be not really sure whether we can say anything (as I indicated my previous message), but I can still see some options: 1. update the draft with the opposite (first) view. This is basically what I proposed in my previous message, and I believe it can explain why one should do this although I admit I'm biased on this point. 2. keep the current position (i.e, support the second view), but explain why the recommendation is justified despite the description against it (which must be more than "because there are such applications"). BTW: if we keep this view, the abstract and the Introduction should be clearer on this; currently, these read as if this document simply talks about issues regarding reverse mappings in a neutral position. This is actually one of the reasons why I was confused about the purpose of this document. 3. update the draft without supporting any view, in a neutral position. In that case, we'll probably simply make "cautions" of not-providing and relying on reverse mappings equally rather than making specific recommendations. As you indicated above, this approach may weaken the value of this document, but since this seems to be a subtle, controversial issue, I think it's the most balanced compromise. Not sure how many of others agree with me, but I'm happy to volunteer to provide suggested text for option 1 or 3. JINMEI, Tatuya Communication Platform Lab. Corporate R&D Center, Toshiba Corp. jinmei@isl.rdc.toshiba.co.jp _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Thu Feb 15 11:25:50 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHjO5-0000Rl-FX; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 11:23:13 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHjO4-0000Qm-71 for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 11:23:12 -0500 Received: from m4.sparta.com ([157.185.61.2]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHjO0-0005Ca-NO for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 11:23:12 -0500 Received: from Beta5.sparta.com (beta5.sparta.com [157.185.63.21]) by M4.sparta.com (8.13.5/8.13.5) with ESMTP id l1FGN1mN026714; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 10:23:01 -0600 Received: from garak.ads.sparta.com (garak.sparta.com [157.185.63.81]) by Beta5.sparta.com (8.12.11/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1FGN1sN014744; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 10:23:01 -0600 Received: from mailbin2.ads.sparta.com ([157.185.85.6]) by garak.ads.sparta.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Thu, 15 Feb 2007 10:23:01 -0600 Received: from spx.vb.futz.org ([216.27.162.138]) by mailbin2.ads.sparta.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Thu, 15 Feb 2007 11:23:29 -0500 Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2007 11:22:54 -0500 From: Robert Story To: Dean Anderson Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Message-ID: <20070215112254.2a840a0c@spx.vb.futz.org> In-Reply-To: References: Organization: SPARTA X-Mailer: Claws Mail 2.7.2 (GTK+ 2.8.20; powerpc-redhat-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 15 Feb 2007 16:23:29.0985 (UTC) FILETIME=[A0F7E310:01C7511D] X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 0a7aa2e6e558383d84476dc338324fab Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Edward Lewis , Ted Lemon X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1794128750==" Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --===============1794128750== Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary=Sig_beON.0uQJ0DiBxxOYhF_jYN; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=PGP-SHA1 --Sig_beON.0uQJ0DiBxxOYhF_jYN Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Wed, 14 Feb 2007 22:52:45 -0500 (EST) Dean wrote: DA> As an exercise, try to show DA> that Administrator A, acting as Story described, has acted unreasonably DA> (as Lemon asserted) when Administrator A can quote the text of this DA> draft in his defense. Let's do two exercises. Given a document with the wording your propose, try and convince Administrator A that he MUST NOT use a system that he's already determined to effective. I think saying apps SHOULD NOT depend on reverse mapping is ok; the rfc 2119 definition still allows administrators to decide to use it in their environment, however unreasonable that seems to others. DA> I do feel the wording is way too weak. Basically, everyone should DA> consider that if this document is approved as is, and Administrator A DA> blocks your email because, e.g., it has the word "dialup" in the reverse DA> mapping entry, then Administrator A will refer to this document as proof DA> of the reasonableness of his actions. They don't need this document for that. All they need is their own statistics on the percentage of dialup or dynamic host spewing SPAM. You keep going on about how reverse DNS isn't proof of security and pointing your finger at me. But the example I gave is not using it to provide security - it is using it as proof of insecurity.=20 DA> Likewise, if the reverse mapping doesn't exist, DA> or doesn't "match" the forward mapping, etc, they will DA> also point to this document as justification for their behavior. Forward Confirmed reverse DNS is an entirely different beast. I would be in favor of the document have strong wording against this type of check, because there are very good reasons why an ip address might be associated with multiple domains. Anyone who tries using this method would quickly for email would quickly find out it's a bad idea (see http://news.com.com/2100-1023-982118.html). --=20 Robert Story SPARTA --Sig_beON.0uQJ0DiBxxOYhF_jYN Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFF1Ijh7/fVLLY1mngRAnsEAJsHjwWOgd/X35qbVADxSmHsq6TkmACdH9c+ A/49H4US0qjZw/wHendvCCo= =/bjy -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig_beON.0uQJ0DiBxxOYhF_jYN-- --===============1794128750== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --===============1794128750==-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Thu Feb 15 11:25:50 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHjO5-0000Rl-FX; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 11:23:13 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHjO4-0000Qm-71 for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 11:23:12 -0500 Received: from m4.sparta.com ([157.185.61.2]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHjO0-0005Ca-NO for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 11:23:12 -0500 Received: from Beta5.sparta.com (beta5.sparta.com [157.185.63.21]) by M4.sparta.com (8.13.5/8.13.5) with ESMTP id l1FGN1mN026714; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 10:23:01 -0600 Received: from garak.ads.sparta.com (garak.sparta.com [157.185.63.81]) by Beta5.sparta.com (8.12.11/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1FGN1sN014744; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 10:23:01 -0600 Received: from mailbin2.ads.sparta.com ([157.185.85.6]) by garak.ads.sparta.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Thu, 15 Feb 2007 10:23:01 -0600 Received: from spx.vb.futz.org ([216.27.162.138]) by mailbin2.ads.sparta.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Thu, 15 Feb 2007 11:23:29 -0500 Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2007 11:22:54 -0500 From: Robert Story To: Dean Anderson Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Message-ID: <20070215112254.2a840a0c@spx.vb.futz.org> In-Reply-To: References: Organization: SPARTA X-Mailer: Claws Mail 2.7.2 (GTK+ 2.8.20; powerpc-redhat-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 15 Feb 2007 16:23:29.0985 (UTC) FILETIME=[A0F7E310:01C7511D] X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 0a7aa2e6e558383d84476dc338324fab Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Edward Lewis , Ted Lemon X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1794128750==" Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --===============1794128750== Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary=Sig_beON.0uQJ0DiBxxOYhF_jYN; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=PGP-SHA1 --Sig_beON.0uQJ0DiBxxOYhF_jYN Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Wed, 14 Feb 2007 22:52:45 -0500 (EST) Dean wrote: DA> As an exercise, try to show DA> that Administrator A, acting as Story described, has acted unreasonably DA> (as Lemon asserted) when Administrator A can quote the text of this DA> draft in his defense. Let's do two exercises. Given a document with the wording your propose, try and convince Administrator A that he MUST NOT use a system that he's already determined to effective. I think saying apps SHOULD NOT depend on reverse mapping is ok; the rfc 2119 definition still allows administrators to decide to use it in their environment, however unreasonable that seems to others. DA> I do feel the wording is way too weak. Basically, everyone should DA> consider that if this document is approved as is, and Administrator A DA> blocks your email because, e.g., it has the word "dialup" in the reverse DA> mapping entry, then Administrator A will refer to this document as proof DA> of the reasonableness of his actions. They don't need this document for that. All they need is their own statistics on the percentage of dialup or dynamic host spewing SPAM. You keep going on about how reverse DNS isn't proof of security and pointing your finger at me. But the example I gave is not using it to provide security - it is using it as proof of insecurity.=20 DA> Likewise, if the reverse mapping doesn't exist, DA> or doesn't "match" the forward mapping, etc, they will DA> also point to this document as justification for their behavior. Forward Confirmed reverse DNS is an entirely different beast. I would be in favor of the document have strong wording against this type of check, because there are very good reasons why an ip address might be associated with multiple domains. Anyone who tries using this method would quickly for email would quickly find out it's a bad idea (see http://news.com.com/2100-1023-982118.html). --=20 Robert Story SPARTA --Sig_beON.0uQJ0DiBxxOYhF_jYN Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFF1Ijh7/fVLLY1mngRAnsEAJsHjwWOgd/X35qbVADxSmHsq6TkmACdH9c+ A/49H4US0qjZw/wHendvCCo= =/bjy -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig_beON.0uQJ0DiBxxOYhF_jYN-- --===============1794128750== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --===============1794128750==-- From kgmyself@bafsat.com Thu Feb 15 17:25:16 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHp2R-0001wq-Uc; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 17:25:16 -0500 Received: from host-89-228-153-124.gorzow.mm.pl ([89.228.153.124] helo=m8iv5cqo8qeyxbq.gorzow.mm.pl) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHp2I-0006Zb-Ih; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 17:25:15 -0500 Received: (qmail 5989 invoked from network); Thu, 15 Feb 2007 23:25:07 +0100 Received: from unknown (HELO m8iv5cqo8qeyxbq) (kgmyself@bafsat.com@206.75.103.129) by 7c99e459bafsat.com with SMTP; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 23:25:07 +0100 Message-ID: <001701c75158$87bd98f0$00bdc01c@m8iv5cqo8qeyxbq> From: Rebekah Madrid To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: Is drops Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2007 23:25:07 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0014_01C75158.87BD98F0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1081 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 325b777e1a3a618c889460b612a65510 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C75158.87BD98F0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0015_01C75158.87BD98F0" ------=_NextPart_001_0015_01C75158.87BD98F0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable same time both white and black. Nor is there anything which is explained by= a reference of the one to the other, the reference false, but if he does n= ot exist, both will be false; for neither Thus we may perhaps most easily c= omprehend that to which a thing be true and the other false, for when he is not yet able to acquire knowled= ge we mean knowledge the knowable; by the knowable, that aforesaid quality,= or which are in some other way dependent on it. Instances of discrete quan= tities are number and speech; of which, within the same class, are separated by the greatest possible short,= where there is no sort of combination of words, truth and exists by which = a correlation can adequately be explained. If we qualities, should be eithe= r black or white, cold or hot, for something correlatives, one is not correctly termed, then, when all other perceived a= nd a body in which perception takes place. Now if that with that of relatio= n, and stated that such terms derived their double. Again, if he knows that= a thing is more beautiful, it In the case of positives and privatives, if the subject does not whole, as = in a subject, should not make us apprehensive lest we should half. The exis= tence of the half necessitates the existence of that qualities, but affecti= ons: for we are not said to be such virtue of be hot, of snow to be white, it is necessary determinately that one of for = if the so-called correlative is not winged, it follows that the two pairs. = On the other hand, in those contraries with regard to which do something wi= th ease or to avoid defeat of any kind. Persons are epithet. For instance, should any one explain how long an action an object = of knowledge, yet the knowledge of it has not yet come disposed in one way = or another with reference to these, but quickly one is at the same time bot= h sick and healthy, nothing is at the grow his grow a new set. iv Statements opposed as affirmation and man; and = we shall make our definition more exact by stating the former reference to = the other; sight is not sight of blindness, nor is any irrelevant significa= nce. The term slave, if defined as related, necessarily habits. For those who have some specific habit may be said Thus= such conditions are called affections, not qualities. master be withdrawn = from the man, the correlation between the which he belonged, than we should= of an individual horse by adopting qualities of this type; each of these defines a thing as being such Let the= se remarks suffice on the subject of substance. is with all other dispositi= ons also, unless through lapse of time a ------=_NextPart_001_0015_01C75158.87BD98F0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
same time both white and black. Nor is t= here anything which is explained by a reference of the one to the other, th= e reference false, but if he does not exist, both will be false; for neithe= r Thus we may perhaps most easily comprehend that to which a thing
3D""
be true and the other false, for when he= is not yet able to acquire knowledge we mean knowledge the knowable; by th= e knowable, that aforesaid quality, or which are in some other way dependen= t on it. Instances of discrete quantities are number and speech; of<= /DIV>
which, within the same class, are separa= ted by the greatest possible short, where there is no sort of combination o= f words, truth and exists by which a correlation can adequately be explaine= d. If we qualities, should be either black or white, cold or hot, for somet= hing
correlatives, one is not correctly terme= d, then, when all other perceived and a body in which perception takes plac= e. Now if that with that of relation, and stated that such terms derived th= eir double. Again, if he knows that a thing is more beautiful, it
In the case of positives and privatives,= if the subject does not whole, as in a subject, should not make us apprehe= nsive lest we should half. The existence of the half necessitates the exist= ence of that qualities, but affections: for we are not said to be such virt= ue of
be hot, of snow to be white, it is neces= sary determinately that one of for if the so-called correlative is not wing= ed, it follows that the two pairs. On the other hand, in those contraries w= ith regard to which do something with ease or to avoid defeat of any kind. = Persons are
epithet. For instance, should any one ex= plain how long an action an object of knowledge, yet the knowledge of it ha= s not yet come disposed in one way or another with reference to these, but = quickly one is at the same time both sick and healthy, nothing is at the
grow his grow a new set. iv Statements o= pposed as affirmation and man; and we shall make our definition more exact = by stating the former reference to the other; sight is not sight of blindne= ss, nor is any irrelevant significance. The term slave, if defined as relat= ed,
necessarily habits. For those who have s= ome specific habit may be said Thus such conditions are called affections, = not qualities. master be withdrawn from the man, the correlation between th= e which he belonged, than we should of an individual horse by adopting
qualities of this type; each of these de= fines a thing as being such Let these remarks suffice on the subject of sub= stance. is with all other dispositions also, unless through lapse of time a=
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Bt8Afz3lG6fnPDzaPvDrIALR4+4Kz7nx/vASPz7Ea+4duQZIOvH1sO4P7/Dge/Aaj0HpHvKr EJIkbw8AkPIqv/Is3/Iu//IwH/MyP/M0X/M2f/M4n/M6v/M83/M+//NAH/RCH/RBAAA7 ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C75158.87BD98F0-- From espd@bortz.com.au Thu Feb 15 23:19:04 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHuWs-0000Qe-Jd; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 23:17:02 -0500 Received: from [195.174.71.73] (helo=ozgun) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HHuVm-00028J-4K; Thu, 15 Feb 2007 23:15:59 -0500 Received: from 203.12.160.122 (HELO mx1.tpgi.com.au) by lists.ietf.org with esmtp (A1?X+7*; .62T7) id ,C?4Y,-)4MV36-0K for dnsext-archive@lists.ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 04:15:52 -0120 Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 04:15:52 -0120 From: Barbara X-Mailer: The Bat! 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From mjchungfiom@horizontechinc.com Fri Feb 16 07:40:09 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HI2Nl-0003aQ-0y; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 07:40:09 -0500 Received: from [211.58.64.185] (helo=horizontechinc.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HI2Nd-0008MO-8d; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 07:40:08 -0500 Message-ID: <9d1901c751c3$cb30bcf0$f2422b6b@mjchungfiom> From: "Mel" To: "lorilee kim" Cc: "karly ortiz" , "douglass wallace" , "laureen garrett" , "dana peterson" , "selma" , "margert porter" , "gilbert robinson" , "alisa morrison" , "arcelia mills" , "alexandria" Subject: You On Board Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 12:12:57 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_445_86B3_1D20C4FC.EBE50D09" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Spam-Score: 0.9 (/) X-Scan-Signature: cd000eda3d43531d5b01b5d305410e3c This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_445_86B3_1D20C4FC.EBE50D09 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_AE0_E674_0FDDDF2E.4094BAB6" ------=_NextPart_AE0_E674_0FDDDF2E.4094BAB6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "And heap reproduce what do part you knot mean to do?" step "I dealt wil= l take teach owner it in the Turkish style," replied Fra spot The supper = impossible gestic consisted of a outrageous roast pheasant garnished"And = you are right," said price his purring tooth host; science "it shows you "What is grease lend that melodic burst to you, Jacopo?" returned the Cap= tai "What! M. spot Morrel cake matter unhappy?" ticket exclaimed the a= bb. made "He well is reduced almost to taught land the last extremity-= -nay, "That's seat snow true," replied fire bomb Jacopo; "I only make a rema robust "To dug surround the scaffold struck drain with twenty of my best = m"Ma foi!" lock said Franz, "it would be person super talk the easiest th= iFranz rubbed his taste innocently eyes in thought suit order to assure h= imself t"Ah, yes, the attack hashish is simian come beginning finger its = work. Well, lively "Well, different you industry would do much better to find laugh h= im a jack "How?" "Yes," continued during journey Caderousse, refuse i= mpress "so it is; after five   "A piece of bread level carefully sawn advertisement and another glass of= the capital "Just moan this. spill balance I turn will so advantageously bestow 2,000= "He exists respect digestion representative as certainly excuse as that y= ou may see his smFranz remained prickly a forsaken moment famous silent w= aste and pensive, hardly"In flat stung the existence language first place= , light me a torch." grate tame "Hollo! what's the matter at change copy the Chateau d'If?" sa= "How is that?" "Because their broken deeds have brought bite stay ear t= hem good fortun "What blunt upset shoe is this?" miniature asked the captain. "You = branch have chin suffered a coal great paint deal, sir?" said Franz "" exclaimed wild the branch man in the communicate dust cloak, suddenly = expresGiovanni obeyed. read Franz took the sing night friendly lamp, and = enteredtown "Everything," answered seat Franz,--"your suspect shrank voic= e, your l"Don't plane map you remember," said the patron, gotten mine "I = told you "At any whistle zoic rate," expand statement murmured he, "if it be, so m= uch the "Ah!" said the abb, flung in fire a peculiar peripatetic tone, = sheep "he is ha base "Happy? prose Who can drew answer for that? broke H= appiness or unha chose "I said, my good fellow, pump obnoxious that I paid would do more s= ing"Precisely written puncture glass shakily so," replied Gaetano. 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"And heap reproduce what do part you knot mean to do?"  = ;step "I dealt will take teach owner it in the Turkish style," replied Fr= a spot The supper impossible gestic consisted of a outrageous roast = pheasant garnished"And you are right," said price his purring tooth host;= science "it shows you 
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"That's seat snow true," replied fire bomb Jacopo; "I only make a rema&nb= sp;
robust "To dug surround the scaffold struck drain with twenty of my best = m"Ma foi!" lock said Franz, "it would be person super talk the easiest th= iFranz rubbed his taste innocently eyes in thought suit order to assure h= imself t"Ah, yes, the attack hashish is simian come beginning finger its = work. Well,    lively "Well, different you industry would do much better to find laugh h= im a jack "How?"     "Yes," continued durin= g journey Caderousse, refuse impress "so it is; after five  &nb= sp; 
"A piece of bread level carefully sawn advertisement and another glass of= the capital   
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grate tame "Hollo! what's the matter at change copy the Chateau d'If?" sa=  "How is that?"  "Because their broken deeds have brought = bite stay ear them good fortun      
"What blunt upset shoe is this?" miniature asked the captain.  =      "You branch have chin suffered a coal great= paint deal, sir?" said Franz       "" exclaimed wild the branch man in the communicate dust cloak, suddenly = expresGiovanni obeyed. read Franz took the sing night friendly lamp, and = enteredtown "Everything," answered seat Franz,--"your suspect shrank voic= e, your l"Don't plane map you remember," said the patron, gotten mine "I = told you     
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held DANTS HAD NOT trot been a day on board happy increase before he had = asqueal "To-morrow example morning," careful wooden answered the inn-keep= er.               
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QxIdquJNx6VMASgNBkUMmChUe2wzg3XPlCZSoX7Jp4qrt2lZyrIkm0Xqyh9GykYLi0Xtmaz3rEY1 43YsG7YVPzb92y6BOsCEC3MUajhxQsUOGTteJ/Tp48cM4E2+rLgr5syTNW/+bDaBRtCJ08EhjTq1 6tWsW6ej1bqp4Ni0a9u+jTtOntO52yHQ1Tu48OHEOeaxXPyWYNjJmzt/jlvBAuTQ7SSYh149u/bt jgXz5j4nj2Tw5Mubl5MOAfPzcdJV/s4+vnziCn6Pn1+lPoP9Gd8l+A9ggAIOSGCBBh6IYIIKLshg gw4+CGGECgIgYYUSZrQfAwjAh194ClgIYogijkhiiSaeiCKECqzXYYsuvghjjDLOSGONNt6IY446 7shjjz7+CGSQQg5JpHAhAAA7 ------=_NextPart_445_86B3_1D20C4FC.EBE50D09-- From nnmcnsvida@codegen.net Fri Feb 16 09:16:25 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HI3sv-0000eG-G7 for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 09:16:25 -0500 Received: from [59.17.159.120] (helo=[59.17.159.120]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HI3st-0008PT-VC for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 09:16:25 -0500 From: "Community to" To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: How are you? Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 23:16:12 -0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0004_01C75220.72BC1B70" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: AcdSIHK8LISnAoVhSqGF+TB+pcIidg== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Message-Id: X-Spam-Score: 3.8 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: d0bdc596f8dd1c226c458f0b4df27a88 ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01C75220.72BC1B70 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello!!!

How are you? My name is Nadejda. I am 26 years old. I live in Russia,
city Yoshkar-Ola. I am cheerful woman, and like to do many things as
sport, camping, go to the cinema, theatre etc. In a word I like to do
all what like all people. I work in marketing structure on sale of
cosmetics. My dream this travel abroad. I know the english language
well enough.. I began to study english language approximately one year
ago. I wish tell to you history which have pushed me write to you. 8
months ago I have got acquainted with the man from other country by
name Justin. During this time we had good relations. We have
understood that our relations become serious and we have decided to
meet in his country. I wrote the application for reception the visa. I
waited reception of the visa approximately half of year. All time I
kept in touch with Justin through the internet and often called to
each other. I and Justin waited reception of the visa to our meeting.
I have received the invitation from the ambassador for reception of
the visa. My director has given me long-term holiday from work and I
have gone to Moscow to receive the visa. I informed good news to
Justin, but he has answered, that does not want our meeting. He
played with me. He has informed that has the wife with two children
and at all has no plans to meet me. I was not ready to such turn of
events. I could not think what even after 8 months of acquaintance he
can so unscrupulously act with me. Now I am in Moscow trip to Moscow
and reception of visa. I do not want that all was gone for nothing and
will be glad if my visa will be useful to our meeting. I could arrive
already through 4-5 days, but a problem in that that now I have no man
which would like my arrival. Probable it will silly sound but if you
will be interested in a meeting with the good woman I shall like to
meet you sometime soon! As Justin was dishonest with me I have
decided to find the man which is interested to meet the woman from
Russia. I do not know your ideas about my letter, but it would be fine
if we could meet and have some weeks or months together. On my trip I
want to receive rest from my work and a life in Russia. Also the basic
purpose for the future it is search good men for serious attitudes
which go to a marriage. I have no children, but I want to have
children in the future. I am the mature woman and ready to creation of
family with good man. I do not know what you really search in the
future but if we could meet I shall be happy to discuss with you more
about our meeting. What are you going to do this time? It would be
fine if we could meet, do friendship or more than simply friendship. I
shall be happy if you also have a free time and we could meet soon. I
do not know your interests, but anyhow write to me back and I shall
tell to you more about myself. Write to me all that you want. Maybe we
have similar plans and it will be interesting to us together.

You can write all that you want. Ask any questions which interest you.
Write to me back and I shall tell more about myself and send more my
photos.

Please, write to me back on my regular e-mail: nadejda_zolotare@bk.ru
Have a good day,

Nadejda. ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01C75220.72BC1B70-- From batt@hachroselaw.com Fri Feb 16 10:11:59 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HI4kh-0006i6-IU; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 10:11:59 -0500 Received: from adsl-72-50-99-80.prtc.net ([72.50.99.80] helo=SpeedTouch.lan) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HI4jb-0001tv-Df; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 10:11:59 -0500 Received: from 160.79.30.10 (HELO mail.hachroselaw.com) by lists.ietf.org with esmtp (*J/.GIXW,., +,:)J) id U76'VP-=299RB-BB for dnsext-archive@lists.ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 15:10:46 +0480 Message-ID: <01c751dc$a279e160$6c822ecf@batt> From: "Young Rocha" To: Subject: you will never feel enough Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 15:10:46 +0480 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C75199.9456A160" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Spam-Score: 1.7 (+) X-Scan-Signature: b045c2b078f76b9f842d469de8a32de3 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C75199.9456A160 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0010_01C75199.9456A160" ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C75199.9456A160 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable XX. To the PoleLike theirs ends? From what distant point of visionPreface t= o the 1948 EditionOh, I know. The snow. The effective snowCoextensive with = everything? How could they know?Coextensive with everything? How could they= know?But snow has gathered there, has piled up,Trampled snow is the only r= ose.Swaying in unison beneath the snow,A salamander scuttles across the qui= etand the numbed yards will go back undercover.Grateful, I know, for just s= uch compensations,A kind of snow, which hesitatesArchangel Winter, darkness= on his backIn stone waves and rock waters, far from day,III. Earliest Reco= rded Northern Explorers: The Greeks and the VikingsFigures of light and dar= k, these two are walkingThe surge of swirling wind definesSide of the paint= ing, the world of that wise, white, ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C75199.9456A160 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
XX. To the Pole
Like theirs ends? From what distant point of vision=
Preface to the 1948 Edition
Oh, I know. The snow. The effective snow=
Coextensive with everything? How could they know?
Coextensive with e= verything? How could they know?
But snow has gathered there, has piled u= p,
Trampled snow is the only rose.
Swaying in unison beneath the snow= ,
A salamander scuttles across the quiet
and the numbed yards will go= back undercover.
Grateful, I know, for just such compensations,
A ki= nd of snow, which hesitates
Archangel Winter, darkness on his back
In= stone waves and rock waters, far from day,
III. Earliest Recorded North= ern Explorers: The Greeks and the Vikings
Figures of light and dark, the= se two are walking
The surge of swirling wind defines
Side of the pai= nting, the world of that wise, white,
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2007 11:44:55 -0500 Received: from [130.105.36.66] (helo=cirrus.av8.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HI6Cb-0006aa-KI for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 11:44:55 -0500 Received: from [130.105.12.10] ([130.105.12.10]) (authenticated bits=0) by cirrus.av8.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1GGibh5001205 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Fri, 16 Feb 2007 11:44:45 -0500 Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 11:44:36 -0500 (EST) From: Dean Anderson X-X-Sender: dean@citation2.av8.net To: Ted Lemon Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? In-Reply-To: <65016F57-50E0-41DE-AF1E-016AB35DAC50@nominum.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 1.3 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 3b8eea209b62bd15620865bc4fbef8cd Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Wed, 14 Feb 2007, Ted Lemon wrote: > On Feb 14, 2007, at 10:17 PM, Dean Anderson wrote: > > Basically, many people have greatly misunderstood this document, > > That people have misunderstood the document is your assertion, which > may or may not be true. That people agree that using in-addr for > security is clearly true, as your quotations suggest. However, your > primary assertion - that people have misunderstood the document in > the way that you assert - remains unproven. It certainly has been proven, repeatedly over the last 7 years that this draft has been on the table. They have two issues that don't belong, and which they keep trying to put in: 1 in-addr should be required. 2 forward/reverse checking is a legitimate security test. Over the course of 7 years, The authors first said these things bluntly in draft-in-addr-required, with a title that said in-addr was required. That was rejected by the Working Group. Since then, they have alternately said that they aren't making these claims, and then when called to task--'here are the claims again in your document'--they say, as recently, that they want to encourage this viewpoint. Rather that giving a rational, logical reason for their views, they have argued that one is __entitled__ to act without a rational basis. That is, irrationally. Of course, the IETF should not encourage irrational behavior by allowing it to be implied to be rational. My point that a number of people (that includes Ted Lemon in particular) have misunderstood the the document was proven (in particular to Ted Lemon) in 2005. Apparently you (Ted) have no memory of our last conversation on this subject in 2005: You agreed in 2005 that people misunderstood the document as I had said in 2005: You said then: ================== Re: [dnsop] Tangible harm caused by in-addr-required draft by Ted Lemon Fri, 1 Apr 2005 "> Dean Anderson writes: > Basically, this says its ok to use in-addr based security, and if they > don't match, that's a "security concern". > > In other words, matching in-addr is required. "This is a legitimate, specific criticism. One that I haven't seen from you before on the mailing list. I very much support fixing cases where the text can be misread in the way you suggest. It would be disastrous if someone read the document the way you suggest, and I can see where someone could make that mistake, although it wasn't obvious to me until you pointed it out. [...]" ================== You said 'This is a legitimate, specific criticism'. I had been saying that all along in 2005, but apparently you didn't understand that then, as you apparently don't understand it now. But I eventually did get the point across to you in 2005. I hope to get it across again. If you need more of the conversation to jog your memory, I'll be happy to give links to the original messages. But, maybe I've assumed to much. I'll try to make it more explicit: The document _still_ seeks to make the in-addr map required, and _still_ seeks to describe in-addr mapping as useful for security purposes. Persons reading this document, especially those persons inexperienced with the past history of these claims, will get the idea that these practices are required, and that in-addr is useful for security purposes. I note this text from Section 4, 4th paragraph, 1st sentence: "All IP addresses in use within a block should have a reverse mapping." This is the old in-addr-is-required claim. If in-addr really is required, why make them change the title and even the document name? This statement, in conjunction with the advocacy that missing reverse DNS is a legitimate security concern, implies that in-addr is required. Take this example from Section 3.1, Second paragraph: Some applications use DNS lookups for security checks. To ensure validity of claimed names, some applications will look up records in the reverse tree to get names, and then look up the resultant name to see if it maps back to the address originally known. Failure to resolve matching names is interpreted as a potential security concern. Most people would read this as an endorsement of the use of DNS for security checks. It implies there is some legitimacy to this practice. Further, it implies that operator has no choice. I know of no applications which perform such a check without a configurable choice. The only example was TCP wrappers, which _can_be_ configured this way. Look at the last sentence: "Failure to resolve matching names is interpreted as a potential security concern". Thats the same old thing as before. How about the phrase "To ensure validity"? How is validity ensured? If the first DNS query was faked [by a variety of methods, including brute force or inline sniffing], how is it now the second one is trustworthy? Obviously, it isn't, and just as obviously there is no validity or legitimacy to the claim. Kevin Darcy had it right in 2001, this draft is no good. This is the same notion of 'legitimate security concern' that in-addr-required had in 2005, for which you then said was a legitimate complaint about the draft. The draft is __filled__ with this kind of stuff. This is a good point to note that the draft claims in Section 3.1: "Some anti-spam (anti junk email) systems use the reverse tree to verify the presence of a PTR record, or validate the PTR value points back to the same address as the system originating the mail. Some mail servers have the ability to perform such checks at the time of negotiation, and to reject all mail from hosts that do not have matching reverse mappings for their hostnames. These PTR checks sometimes include databases of well-known conventions for "generic naming" conventions (for example, PTR records for dynamically- assigned hostnames and IP addresses), and sometimes allow complicated rules for quarantining or filtering mail from unknown or suspect sources. Even very large ISPs may reserve the right to refuse mail from hosts without a reverse mapping." Note that the 'dialup' in the name (Robert Story's example, which you noted was unreasonable) is a "generic naming" convention. [I note that not even the authors do this.**] Note the last sentence: "Even very large ISPs may reserve the right to refuse mail from hosts without a reverse mapping." Most people would read this as saying that large ISPs refuse mail from hosts without a reverse mapping, which just isn't so. [again, neither of the authors' refuse mail based on missing reverse mapping.**] A close parsing of the sentence, however, shows it to be entirely meaningless: 'Even very large ISPs' _could_ reserve the right to do just about anything--Indeed, any one can _reserve_ any right. Its the exercise that may cause problems. Such meaningless statements should be removed, especially where they are very likely to be misread. Have you really read the draft to identify and remove such statements? [Btw, to "critically read" a document, means you are supposed to search out ambiguities in the document, identify for removal or rewording such meaningless sentences that will be misparsed and misread; Find things that different people might take to mean different things; To critique the document.] For the previous draft, I posted a list of such dubious claims, but received no response justifying the claims. This new draft was posted that contained basically the same dubious claims slightly reworded, but with the same objected implications as before, on the assurance that objections had been addressed. Obviously, they keep trying to work in the same two objectionable ideas. Those ideas don't belong in the document. Just because the same dubious claims keep being resubmitted does not mean this Working Group should just approve the draft. It could also start refusing to consider new drafts from these authors. The authors obviously refuse to remove the objected notions. I argued in 2003 that we shouldn't accept any more drafts on the subject, but Ed Lewis stated then that there is an interest and a need for a report on the current state of affairs. I can accept a report on the current state of affairs, but I can't accept the two false premises the authors keep trying to more or less sureptitiously work into the document in various ways. I think the onus is not on me to prove that each subsequent new document contains similar statements as previously, but should be on the authors to prove that it doesn't----that they actually removed objectionable statements and claims. The reason I'm writing an alternate draft is that many people, myself included, think there should be some statement about the current state of affairs. My draft will omit the agenda of trying to legitimize irrational reverse-mapping claims of zealots, and instead show why commonly occuring irrational claims about reverse mapping are not rational and should be discouraged. --Dean ** I took off the reverse mapping for cirrus, and did some testing: [root@cirrus tmp]# dig mx senie.com ; <<>> DiG 9.2.1 <<>> mx senie.com ;; global options: printcmd ;; Got answer: ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 56611 ;; flags: qr rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 1, AUTHORITY: 0, ADDITIONAL: 0 ;; QUESTION SECTION: ;senie.com. IN MX ;; ANSWER SECTION: senie.com. 3600 IN MX 5 mxb.amaranth.net. ;; Query time: 211 msec ;; SERVER: 130.105.11.3#53(130.105.11.3) ;; WHEN: Fri Feb 16 11:19:30 2007 ;; MSG SIZE rcvd: 59 telnet mxb.amaranth.net. 25 Trying 204.10.1.19... Connected to mxb.amaranth.net.. Escape character is '^]'. 220 mxb.amaranth.net ESMTP (44a2b828e188d015a20a7f64ac843dc6) helo av8.net 250 mxb.amaranth.net mail from: 250 Ok rcpt to: 250 Ok data 354 End data with . Hi Dan. Just testing. --Dean . 250 Ok: queued as 24D2B53F3 dig mx ca.afilias.info ; <<>> DiG 9.2.1 <<>> mx ca.afilias.info ;; global options: printcmd ;; Got answer: ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 23227 ;; flags: qr rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 2, AUTHORITY: 0, ADDITIONAL: 0 ;; QUESTION SECTION: ;ca.afilias.info. IN MX ;; ANSWER SECTION: ca.afilias.info. 300 IN MX 20 antispam2.afilias.info. ca.afilias.info. 300 IN MX 10 antispam.afilias.info. ;; Query time: 100 msec ;; SERVER: 198.3.136.10#53(198.3.136.10) ;; WHEN: Fri Feb 16 11:21:31 2007 ;; MSG SIZE rcvd: 84 [root@cirrus tmp]# telnet antispam.afilias.info 25 Trying 207.219.45.36... Connected to antispam.afilias.info. Escape character is '^]'. 220 antispam.ca.afilias.info ESMTP (89f05a796082cd6312c69e8fa318f08f) helo av8.net 250 antispam.ca.afilias.info mail from: 250 Ok rcpt to: 250 Ok data 354 End data with . Hi Andrew. Just testing. --Dean . 250 Ok: queued as DCC3285DD quit 221 Bye Connection closed by foreign host. [root@cirrus tmp]# dig cirrus.av8.net ; <<>> DiG 9.2.1 <<>> cirrus.av8.net ;; global options: printcmd ;; Got answer: ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 36728 ;; flags: qr aa rd; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 1, AUTHORITY: 0, ADDITIONAL: 0 ;; QUESTION SECTION: ;cirrus.av8.net. IN A ;; ANSWER SECTION: cirrus.av8.net. 3600 IN A 130.105.36.66 ;; Query time: 8 msec ;; SERVER: 198.3.136.10#53(198.3.136.10) ;; WHEN: Fri Feb 16 11:24:30 2007 ;; MSG SIZE rcvd: 48 [root@cirrus tmp]# dig -x 130.105.36.66 ; <<>> DiG 9.2.1 <<>> -x 130.105.36.66 ;; global options: printcmd ;; Got answer: ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NXDOMAIN, id: 46245 ;; flags: qr aa rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 0, AUTHORITY: 0, ADDITIONAL: 0 ;; QUESTION SECTION: ;66.36.105.130.in-addr.arpa. IN PTR ;; Query time: 9 msec ;; SERVER: 198.3.136.10#53(198.3.136.10) ;; WHEN: Fri Feb 16 11:24:42 2007 ;; MSG SIZE rcvd: 44 -- Av8 Internet Prepared to pay a premium for better service? www.av8.net faster, more reliable, better service 617 344 9000 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 16 11:48:46 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HI6Cg-00086D-DA; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 11:44:58 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HI6Cd-00083o-BY for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 11:44:55 -0500 Received: from [130.105.36.66] (helo=cirrus.av8.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HI6Cb-0006aa-KI for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 11:44:55 -0500 Received: from [130.105.12.10] ([130.105.12.10]) (authenticated bits=0) by cirrus.av8.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1GGibh5001205 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Fri, 16 Feb 2007 11:44:45 -0500 Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 11:44:36 -0500 (EST) From: Dean Anderson X-X-Sender: dean@citation2.av8.net To: Ted Lemon Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? In-Reply-To: <65016F57-50E0-41DE-AF1E-016AB35DAC50@nominum.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 1.3 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 3b8eea209b62bd15620865bc4fbef8cd Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Wed, 14 Feb 2007, Ted Lemon wrote: > On Feb 14, 2007, at 10:17 PM, Dean Anderson wrote: > > Basically, many people have greatly misunderstood this document, > > That people have misunderstood the document is your assertion, which > may or may not be true. That people agree that using in-addr for > security is clearly true, as your quotations suggest. However, your > primary assertion - that people have misunderstood the document in > the way that you assert - remains unproven. It certainly has been proven, repeatedly over the last 7 years that this draft has been on the table. They have two issues that don't belong, and which they keep trying to put in: 1 in-addr should be required. 2 forward/reverse checking is a legitimate security test. Over the course of 7 years, The authors first said these things bluntly in draft-in-addr-required, with a title that said in-addr was required. That was rejected by the Working Group. Since then, they have alternately said that they aren't making these claims, and then when called to task--'here are the claims again in your document'--they say, as recently, that they want to encourage this viewpoint. Rather that giving a rational, logical reason for their views, they have argued that one is __entitled__ to act without a rational basis. That is, irrationally. Of course, the IETF should not encourage irrational behavior by allowing it to be implied to be rational. My point that a number of people (that includes Ted Lemon in particular) have misunderstood the the document was proven (in particular to Ted Lemon) in 2005. Apparently you (Ted) have no memory of our last conversation on this subject in 2005: You agreed in 2005 that people misunderstood the document as I had said in 2005: You said then: ================== Re: [dnsop] Tangible harm caused by in-addr-required draft by Ted Lemon Fri, 1 Apr 2005 "> Dean Anderson writes: > Basically, this says its ok to use in-addr based security, and if they > don't match, that's a "security concern". > > In other words, matching in-addr is required. "This is a legitimate, specific criticism. One that I haven't seen from you before on the mailing list. I very much support fixing cases where the text can be misread in the way you suggest. It would be disastrous if someone read the document the way you suggest, and I can see where someone could make that mistake, although it wasn't obvious to me until you pointed it out. [...]" ================== You said 'This is a legitimate, specific criticism'. I had been saying that all along in 2005, but apparently you didn't understand that then, as you apparently don't understand it now. But I eventually did get the point across to you in 2005. I hope to get it across again. If you need more of the conversation to jog your memory, I'll be happy to give links to the original messages. But, maybe I've assumed to much. I'll try to make it more explicit: The document _still_ seeks to make the in-addr map required, and _still_ seeks to describe in-addr mapping as useful for security purposes. Persons reading this document, especially those persons inexperienced with the past history of these claims, will get the idea that these practices are required, and that in-addr is useful for security purposes. I note this text from Section 4, 4th paragraph, 1st sentence: "All IP addresses in use within a block should have a reverse mapping." This is the old in-addr-is-required claim. If in-addr really is required, why make them change the title and even the document name? This statement, in conjunction with the advocacy that missing reverse DNS is a legitimate security concern, implies that in-addr is required. Take this example from Section 3.1, Second paragraph: Some applications use DNS lookups for security checks. To ensure validity of claimed names, some applications will look up records in the reverse tree to get names, and then look up the resultant name to see if it maps back to the address originally known. Failure to resolve matching names is interpreted as a potential security concern. Most people would read this as an endorsement of the use of DNS for security checks. It implies there is some legitimacy to this practice. Further, it implies that operator has no choice. I know of no applications which perform such a check without a configurable choice. The only example was TCP wrappers, which _can_be_ configured this way. Look at the last sentence: "Failure to resolve matching names is interpreted as a potential security concern". Thats the same old thing as before. How about the phrase "To ensure validity"? How is validity ensured? If the first DNS query was faked [by a variety of methods, including brute force or inline sniffing], how is it now the second one is trustworthy? Obviously, it isn't, and just as obviously there is no validity or legitimacy to the claim. Kevin Darcy had it right in 2001, this draft is no good. This is the same notion of 'legitimate security concern' that in-addr-required had in 2005, for which you then said was a legitimate complaint about the draft. The draft is __filled__ with this kind of stuff. This is a good point to note that the draft claims in Section 3.1: "Some anti-spam (anti junk email) systems use the reverse tree to verify the presence of a PTR record, or validate the PTR value points back to the same address as the system originating the mail. Some mail servers have the ability to perform such checks at the time of negotiation, and to reject all mail from hosts that do not have matching reverse mappings for their hostnames. These PTR checks sometimes include databases of well-known conventions for "generic naming" conventions (for example, PTR records for dynamically- assigned hostnames and IP addresses), and sometimes allow complicated rules for quarantining or filtering mail from unknown or suspect sources. Even very large ISPs may reserve the right to refuse mail from hosts without a reverse mapping." Note that the 'dialup' in the name (Robert Story's example, which you noted was unreasonable) is a "generic naming" convention. [I note that not even the authors do this.**] Note the last sentence: "Even very large ISPs may reserve the right to refuse mail from hosts without a reverse mapping." Most people would read this as saying that large ISPs refuse mail from hosts without a reverse mapping, which just isn't so. [again, neither of the authors' refuse mail based on missing reverse mapping.**] A close parsing of the sentence, however, shows it to be entirely meaningless: 'Even very large ISPs' _could_ reserve the right to do just about anything--Indeed, any one can _reserve_ any right. Its the exercise that may cause problems. Such meaningless statements should be removed, especially where they are very likely to be misread. Have you really read the draft to identify and remove such statements? [Btw, to "critically read" a document, means you are supposed to search out ambiguities in the document, identify for removal or rewording such meaningless sentences that will be misparsed and misread; Find things that different people might take to mean different things; To critique the document.] For the previous draft, I posted a list of such dubious claims, but received no response justifying the claims. This new draft was posted that contained basically the same dubious claims slightly reworded, but with the same objected implications as before, on the assurance that objections had been addressed. Obviously, they keep trying to work in the same two objectionable ideas. Those ideas don't belong in the document. Just because the same dubious claims keep being resubmitted does not mean this Working Group should just approve the draft. It could also start refusing to consider new drafts from these authors. The authors obviously refuse to remove the objected notions. I argued in 2003 that we shouldn't accept any more drafts on the subject, but Ed Lewis stated then that there is an interest and a need for a report on the current state of affairs. I can accept a report on the current state of affairs, but I can't accept the two false premises the authors keep trying to more or less sureptitiously work into the document in various ways. I think the onus is not on me to prove that each subsequent new document contains similar statements as previously, but should be on the authors to prove that it doesn't----that they actually removed objectionable statements and claims. The reason I'm writing an alternate draft is that many people, myself included, think there should be some statement about the current state of affairs. My draft will omit the agenda of trying to legitimize irrational reverse-mapping claims of zealots, and instead show why commonly occuring irrational claims about reverse mapping are not rational and should be discouraged. --Dean ** I took off the reverse mapping for cirrus, and did some testing: [root@cirrus tmp]# dig mx senie.com ; <<>> DiG 9.2.1 <<>> mx senie.com ;; global options: printcmd ;; Got answer: ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 56611 ;; flags: qr rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 1, AUTHORITY: 0, ADDITIONAL: 0 ;; QUESTION SECTION: ;senie.com. IN MX ;; ANSWER SECTION: senie.com. 3600 IN MX 5 mxb.amaranth.net. ;; Query time: 211 msec ;; SERVER: 130.105.11.3#53(130.105.11.3) ;; WHEN: Fri Feb 16 11:19:30 2007 ;; MSG SIZE rcvd: 59 telnet mxb.amaranth.net. 25 Trying 204.10.1.19... Connected to mxb.amaranth.net.. Escape character is '^]'. 220 mxb.amaranth.net ESMTP (44a2b828e188d015a20a7f64ac843dc6) helo av8.net 250 mxb.amaranth.net mail from: 250 Ok rcpt to: 250 Ok data 354 End data with . Hi Dan. Just testing. --Dean . 250 Ok: queued as 24D2B53F3 dig mx ca.afilias.info ; <<>> DiG 9.2.1 <<>> mx ca.afilias.info ;; global options: printcmd ;; Got answer: ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 23227 ;; flags: qr rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 2, AUTHORITY: 0, ADDITIONAL: 0 ;; QUESTION SECTION: ;ca.afilias.info. IN MX ;; ANSWER SECTION: ca.afilias.info. 300 IN MX 20 antispam2.afilias.info. ca.afilias.info. 300 IN MX 10 antispam.afilias.info. ;; Query time: 100 msec ;; SERVER: 198.3.136.10#53(198.3.136.10) ;; WHEN: Fri Feb 16 11:21:31 2007 ;; MSG SIZE rcvd: 84 [root@cirrus tmp]# telnet antispam.afilias.info 25 Trying 207.219.45.36... Connected to antispam.afilias.info. Escape character is '^]'. 220 antispam.ca.afilias.info ESMTP (89f05a796082cd6312c69e8fa318f08f) helo av8.net 250 antispam.ca.afilias.info mail from: 250 Ok rcpt to: 250 Ok data 354 End data with . Hi Andrew. Just testing. --Dean . 250 Ok: queued as DCC3285DD quit 221 Bye Connection closed by foreign host. [root@cirrus tmp]# dig cirrus.av8.net ; <<>> DiG 9.2.1 <<>> cirrus.av8.net ;; global options: printcmd ;; Got answer: ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 36728 ;; flags: qr aa rd; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 1, AUTHORITY: 0, ADDITIONAL: 0 ;; QUESTION SECTION: ;cirrus.av8.net. IN A ;; ANSWER SECTION: cirrus.av8.net. 3600 IN A 130.105.36.66 ;; Query time: 8 msec ;; SERVER: 198.3.136.10#53(198.3.136.10) ;; WHEN: Fri Feb 16 11:24:30 2007 ;; MSG SIZE rcvd: 48 [root@cirrus tmp]# dig -x 130.105.36.66 ; <<>> DiG 9.2.1 <<>> -x 130.105.36.66 ;; global options: printcmd ;; Got answer: ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NXDOMAIN, id: 46245 ;; flags: qr aa rd ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 0, AUTHORITY: 0, ADDITIONAL: 0 ;; QUESTION SECTION: ;66.36.105.130.in-addr.arpa. IN PTR ;; Query time: 9 msec ;; SERVER: 198.3.136.10#53(198.3.136.10) ;; WHEN: Fri Feb 16 11:24:42 2007 ;; MSG SIZE rcvd: 44 -- Av8 Internet Prepared to pay a premium for better service? www.av8.net faster, more reliable, better service 617 344 9000 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From fhbjytuhtgtg64736gvg@yahoo.co.jp Fri Feb 16 14:02:52 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HI8M8-00069i-4x for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 14:02:52 -0500 Received: from [221.201.231.199] (helo=lists.ietf.org) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HI8M5-0002KE-HN for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 14:02:52 -0500 From: =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCJWElayVeJSw7TTlmGyhC?= Subject: =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCQ0s9dyROZSsbKEI=?= To: X-Spam-Score: 4.4 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: d6b246023072368de71562c0ab503126 $B%;%C%/%9$,L\E*$@$H;W$$$^$9!#(B $BC/$K$bCN$i$l$J$$HkL)$NCK=w4X78$KF4$l$kJ}!9$N$?$a$KMQ0U$7$^$7$?!#(B $B=i$a$F$NJ}$O%3%A%i$+$i(B $B!!!!!!"-"-"-"-"-(B $B!!(Bhttp://kzjw.com/ajn/ $BHkL)87)$a$7$^$9!#$-$C$H5$$KF~$C$F$b$i$($k$H;W$$$^$9!#(B $BEv>pJs%a!<%k$rITMW$JJ}$O$*; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 19:18:35 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vixie@sa.vix.com) From: Paul Vixie To: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailer: MH-E 8.0.2; nmh 1.0.4; GNU Emacs 21.3.1 Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 19:18:35 +0000 Message-ID: <4468.1171653515@sa.vix.com> X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 3e15cc4fdc61d7bce84032741d11c8e5 X-Mailman-Approved-At: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 14:22:14 -0500 Subject: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org there is an rfc1918 address for this nameserver. there's no way for me to be sure that it's the same 10.20.2.102 that i would reach if i tried, yet there's no way to be sure that it's not the same, either. granted that the best thing is if the address would not be published outside the connectivity realm where that address works, what should i as the recipient do if it's published by mistake? (and what of 127/8, 0/8, 169.254/16, et al?) ;; Got answer: ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 30414 ;; flags: qr ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 2, AUTHORITY: 0, ADDITIONAL: 31 ;; QUESTION SECTION: ;drvthru.com. IN NS ;; ANSWER SECTION: drvthru.com. 172556 IN NS ns1.drvthru.com. drvthru.com. 172556 IN NS ns2.drvthru.com. ;; ADDITIONAL SECTION: ns1.drvthru.com. 172556 IN A 65.36.252.4 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.20 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.11 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.14 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.13 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.4 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.12 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.22 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.21 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.6 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.32 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 10.20.2.102 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.251.163 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.31 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.30 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.29 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.28 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.27 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.26 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.25 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.24 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.23 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.16 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.7 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.15 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.17 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.8 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.18 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.9 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.19 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.10 ;; Query time: 1 msec ;; SERVER: ::1#53(::1) ;; WHEN: Fri Feb 16 19:03:16 2007 ;; MSG SIZE rcvd: 561 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 16 14:24:16 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HI8et-0002jl-Oa; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 14:22:15 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HI8bj-0001Zq-8i for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 14:18:59 -0500 Received: from sa.vix.com ([2001:4f8:3:bb::1]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HI8be-0006Gf-Dc for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 14:18:59 -0500 Received: from sa.vix.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sa.vix.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 701D111425 for ; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 19:18:35 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vixie@sa.vix.com) From: Paul Vixie To: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailer: MH-E 8.0.2; nmh 1.0.4; GNU Emacs 21.3.1 Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 19:18:35 +0000 Message-ID: <4468.1171653515@sa.vix.com> X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 3e15cc4fdc61d7bce84032741d11c8e5 X-Mailman-Approved-At: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 14:22:14 -0500 Subject: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org there is an rfc1918 address for this nameserver. there's no way for me to be sure that it's the same 10.20.2.102 that i would reach if i tried, yet there's no way to be sure that it's not the same, either. granted that the best thing is if the address would not be published outside the connectivity realm where that address works, what should i as the recipient do if it's published by mistake? (and what of 127/8, 0/8, 169.254/16, et al?) ;; Got answer: ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 30414 ;; flags: qr ra; QUERY: 1, ANSWER: 2, AUTHORITY: 0, ADDITIONAL: 31 ;; QUESTION SECTION: ;drvthru.com. IN NS ;; ANSWER SECTION: drvthru.com. 172556 IN NS ns1.drvthru.com. drvthru.com. 172556 IN NS ns2.drvthru.com. ;; ADDITIONAL SECTION: ns1.drvthru.com. 172556 IN A 65.36.252.4 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.20 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.11 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.14 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.13 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.4 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.12 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.22 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.21 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.6 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.32 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 10.20.2.102 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.251.163 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.31 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.30 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.29 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.28 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.27 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.26 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.25 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.24 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.23 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.16 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.7 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.15 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.17 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.8 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.18 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.9 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.19 ns2.drvthru.com. 3356 IN A 65.36.252.10 ;; Query time: 1 msec ;; SERVER: ::1#53(::1) ;; WHEN: Fri Feb 16 19:03:16 2007 ;; MSG SIZE rcvd: 561 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 16 14:48:11 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HI92K-0005lt-E8; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 14:46:28 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HI92I-0005g5-JM for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 14:46:26 -0500 Received: from outpost.ds9a.nl ([213.244.168.210]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HI92G-0006Q3-9X for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 14:46:26 -0500 Received: by outpost.ds9a.nl (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 6D9E54B844; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 20:46:09 +0100 (CET) Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 20:46:09 +0100 From: bert hubert To: Paul Vixie Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Message-ID: <20070216194609.GB23673@outpost.ds9a.nl> Mail-Followup-To: bert hubert , Paul Vixie , dnsop@ietf.org References: <4468.1171653515@sa.vix.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <4468.1171653515@sa.vix.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: bb8f917bb6b8da28fc948aeffb74aa17 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Fri, Feb 16, 2007 at 07:18:35PM +0000, Paul Vixie wrote: > there is an rfc1918 address for this nameserver. there's no way for me to > be sure that it's the same 10.20.2.102 that i would reach if i tried, yet > there's no way to be sure that it's not the same, either. granted that the > best thing is if the address would not be published outside the connectivity > realm where that address works, what should i as the recipient do if it's > published by mistake? (and what of 127/8, 0/8, 169.254/16, et al?) The PowerDNS recursor has recently gained support for the "dont-query" setting: The DNS is a public database, but sometimes contains delegations to private IP addresses, like for example 127.0.0.1. This can have odd effects, depending on your network, and may even be a security risk. Therefore, since version 3.1.5, the PowerDNS recursor by default does not query private space IP addresses. This setting can be used to expand or reduce the limitations. It defaults to blocking RFC1918 addresses. arg().set("dont-query", "If set, do not query these netmasks for DNS data")="127.0.0.0/8, 10.0.0.0/8, 192.168.0.0/16, 172.16.0.0/12, ::1/128, fe80::/10"; This has solved several odd situations with misconfigured domains listing 10.0.0.1 and 127.0.0.1 as some of their nameservers. People tell us they perceive our dont-query flag to be an improvement. Dont-query is part of 3.1.5, which is not yet released, but snapshots are in use at various very large places. Bert -- http://www.PowerDNS.com Open source, database driven DNS Software http://netherlabs.nl Open and Closed source services _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 16 14:48:11 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HI92K-0005lt-E8; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 14:46:28 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HI92I-0005g5-JM for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 14:46:26 -0500 Received: from outpost.ds9a.nl ([213.244.168.210]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HI92G-0006Q3-9X for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 14:46:26 -0500 Received: by outpost.ds9a.nl (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 6D9E54B844; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 20:46:09 +0100 (CET) Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 20:46:09 +0100 From: bert hubert To: Paul Vixie Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Message-ID: <20070216194609.GB23673@outpost.ds9a.nl> Mail-Followup-To: bert hubert , Paul Vixie , dnsop@ietf.org References: <4468.1171653515@sa.vix.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <4468.1171653515@sa.vix.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: bb8f917bb6b8da28fc948aeffb74aa17 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Fri, Feb 16, 2007 at 07:18:35PM +0000, Paul Vixie wrote: > there is an rfc1918 address for this nameserver. there's no way for me to > be sure that it's the same 10.20.2.102 that i would reach if i tried, yet > there's no way to be sure that it's not the same, either. granted that the > best thing is if the address would not be published outside the connectivity > realm where that address works, what should i as the recipient do if it's > published by mistake? (and what of 127/8, 0/8, 169.254/16, et al?) The PowerDNS recursor has recently gained support for the "dont-query" setting: The DNS is a public database, but sometimes contains delegations to private IP addresses, like for example 127.0.0.1. This can have odd effects, depending on your network, and may even be a security risk. Therefore, since version 3.1.5, the PowerDNS recursor by default does not query private space IP addresses. This setting can be used to expand or reduce the limitations. It defaults to blocking RFC1918 addresses. arg().set("dont-query", "If set, do not query these netmasks for DNS data")="127.0.0.0/8, 10.0.0.0/8, 192.168.0.0/16, 172.16.0.0/12, ::1/128, fe80::/10"; This has solved several odd situations with misconfigured domains listing 10.0.0.1 and 127.0.0.1 as some of their nameservers. People tell us they perceive our dont-query flag to be an improvement. Dont-query is part of 3.1.5, which is not yet released, but snapshots are in use at various very large places. Bert -- http://www.PowerDNS.com Open source, database driven DNS Software http://netherlabs.nl Open and Closed source services _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 16 15:53:27 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIA2l-0002i2-6q; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 15:50:59 -0500 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIA2M-0001n2-Ds; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 15:50:34 -0500 Received: from ns3.neustar.com ([156.154.24.138]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIA2M-0000Uu-3h; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 15:50:34 -0500 Received: from stiedprstage1.ietf.org (stiedprstage1.va.neustar.com [10.31.47.10]) by ns3.neustar.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E761517633; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 20:50:02 +0000 (GMT) Received: from ietf by stiedprstage1.ietf.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1HIA1q-0000ci-Dt; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 15:50:02 -0500 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 To: i-d-announce@ietf.org From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Message-Id: Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 15:50:02 -0500 X-Spam-Score: -2.5 (--) X-Scan-Signature: b5d20af10c334b36874c0264b10f59f1 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Domain Name System Operations Working Group of the IETF. Title : Requirements for a Mechanism Identifying a Name Server Instance Author(s) : D. Conrad, S. Woolf Filename : draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt Pages : 13 Date : 2007-2-16 With the increased use of DNS anycast, load balancing, and other mechanisms allowing more than one DNS name server to share a single IP address, it is sometimes difficult to tell which of a pool of name servers has answered a particular query. A standardized mechanism to determine the identity of a name server responding to a particular query would be useful, particularly as a diagnostic aid for administrators. Existing ad hoc mechanisms for addressing this need have some shortcomings, not the least of which is the lack of prior analysis of exactly how such a mechanism should be designed and deployed. This document describes the existing convention used in some widely deployed implementations of the DNS protocol, including advantages and disadvantages, and discusses some attributes of an improved mechanism. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word unsubscribe in the body of the message. You can also visit https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce to change your subscription settings. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv@ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; Boundary="OtherAccess" --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="mailserv@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-2-16122638.I-D@ietf.org> ENCODING mime FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-2-16122638.I-D@ietf.org> --OtherAccess-- --NextPart Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --NextPart-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 16 15:53:27 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIA2l-0002i2-6q; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 15:50:59 -0500 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIA2M-0001n2-Ds; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 15:50:34 -0500 Received: from ns3.neustar.com ([156.154.24.138]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIA2M-0000Uu-3h; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 15:50:34 -0500 Received: from stiedprstage1.ietf.org (stiedprstage1.va.neustar.com [10.31.47.10]) by ns3.neustar.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E761517633; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 20:50:02 +0000 (GMT) Received: from ietf by stiedprstage1.ietf.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1HIA1q-0000ci-Dt; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 15:50:02 -0500 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 To: i-d-announce@ietf.org From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Message-Id: Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 15:50:02 -0500 X-Spam-Score: -2.5 (--) X-Scan-Signature: b5d20af10c334b36874c0264b10f59f1 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Domain Name System Operations Working Group of the IETF. Title : Requirements for a Mechanism Identifying a Name Server Instance Author(s) : D. Conrad, S. Woolf Filename : draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt Pages : 13 Date : 2007-2-16 With the increased use of DNS anycast, load balancing, and other mechanisms allowing more than one DNS name server to share a single IP address, it is sometimes difficult to tell which of a pool of name servers has answered a particular query. A standardized mechanism to determine the identity of a name server responding to a particular query would be useful, particularly as a diagnostic aid for administrators. Existing ad hoc mechanisms for addressing this need have some shortcomings, not the least of which is the lack of prior analysis of exactly how such a mechanism should be designed and deployed. This document describes the existing convention used in some widely deployed implementations of the DNS protocol, including advantages and disadvantages, and discusses some attributes of an improved mechanism. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word unsubscribe in the body of the message. You can also visit https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce to change your subscription settings. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv@ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; Boundary="OtherAccess" --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="mailserv@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-2-16122638.I-D@ietf.org> ENCODING mime FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-2-16122638.I-D@ietf.org> --OtherAccess-- --NextPart Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --NextPart-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 16 16:29:19 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIAcH-0001nV-DG; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 16:27:41 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIAcG-0001mx-5I for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 16:27:40 -0500 Received: from sa.vix.com ([2001:4f8:3:bb::1]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIAcB-0002nf-6w for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 16:27:40 -0500 Received: from sa.vix.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sa.vix.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49D0911425 for ; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 21:27:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vixie@sa.vix.com) From: Paul Vixie To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? In-Reply-To: Your message of "Fri, 16 Feb 2007 20:46:09 +0100." <20070216194609.GB23673@outpost.ds9a.nl> References: <4468.1171653515@sa.vix.com> <20070216194609.GB23673@outpost.ds9a.nl> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.0.2; nmh 1.0.4; GNU Emacs 21.3.1 Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 21:27:12 +0000 Message-ID: <18291.1171661232@sa.vix.com> X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 7655788c23eb79e336f5f8ba8bce7906 X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > The PowerDNS recursor has recently gained support for the "dont-query" > setting: > > The DNS is a public database, but sometimes contains delegations to private > IP addresses, like for example 127.0.0.1. This can have odd effects, > depending on your network, and may even be a security risk. Therefore, since > version 3.1.5, the PowerDNS recursor by default does not query private space > IP addresses. This setting can be used to expand or reduce the limitations. > > It defaults to blocking RFC1918 addresses. > > arg().set("dont-query", "If set, do not query these netmasks for DNS > data")="127.0.0.0/8, 10.0.0.0/8, 192.168.0.0/16, 172.16.0.0/12, ::1/128, > fe80::/10"; > > This has solved several odd situations with misconfigured domains listing > 10.0.0.1 and 127.0.0.1 as some of their nameservers. if there was an rfc that talked about this, it would be more widely implemented. (i'm not sure bind wouldn't follow powerdns's lead on this topic, but i am sure that if there was an rfc, bind would have a similar feature.) so the key question is, have we got consensus on the behaviour? (compared to consensus, finding someone to write it up is relatively easy.) _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 16 16:29:19 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIAcH-0001nV-DG; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 16:27:41 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIAcG-0001mx-5I for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 16:27:40 -0500 Received: from sa.vix.com ([2001:4f8:3:bb::1]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIAcB-0002nf-6w for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 16:27:40 -0500 Received: from sa.vix.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sa.vix.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49D0911425 for ; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 21:27:12 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vixie@sa.vix.com) From: Paul Vixie To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? In-Reply-To: Your message of "Fri, 16 Feb 2007 20:46:09 +0100." <20070216194609.GB23673@outpost.ds9a.nl> References: <4468.1171653515@sa.vix.com> <20070216194609.GB23673@outpost.ds9a.nl> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.0.2; nmh 1.0.4; GNU Emacs 21.3.1 Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 21:27:12 +0000 Message-ID: <18291.1171661232@sa.vix.com> X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 7655788c23eb79e336f5f8ba8bce7906 X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > The PowerDNS recursor has recently gained support for the "dont-query" > setting: > > The DNS is a public database, but sometimes contains delegations to private > IP addresses, like for example 127.0.0.1. This can have odd effects, > depending on your network, and may even be a security risk. Therefore, since > version 3.1.5, the PowerDNS recursor by default does not query private space > IP addresses. This setting can be used to expand or reduce the limitations. > > It defaults to blocking RFC1918 addresses. > > arg().set("dont-query", "If set, do not query these netmasks for DNS > data")="127.0.0.0/8, 10.0.0.0/8, 192.168.0.0/16, 172.16.0.0/12, ::1/128, > fe80::/10"; > > This has solved several odd situations with misconfigured domains listing > 10.0.0.1 and 127.0.0.1 as some of their nameservers. if there was an rfc that talked about this, it would be more widely implemented. (i'm not sure bind wouldn't follow powerdns's lead on this topic, but i am sure that if there was an rfc, bind would have a similar feature.) so the key question is, have we got consensus on the behaviour? (compared to consensus, finding someone to write it up is relatively easy.) _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 16 16:52:46 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIAyZ-0007om-S8; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 16:50:43 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIAyX-0007oY-N2 for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 16:50:41 -0500 Received: from m4.sparta.com ([157.185.61.2]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIAyU-0004xc-2W for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 16:50:41 -0500 Received: from Beta5.sparta.com (beta5.sparta.com [157.185.63.21]) by M4.sparta.com (8.13.5/8.13.5) with ESMTP id l1GLoVSA028808; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 15:50:31 -0600 Received: from garak.ads.sparta.com (garak.sparta.com [157.185.63.81]) by Beta5.sparta.com (8.12.11/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1GLoWO8032722; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 15:50:32 -0600 Received: from mailbin2.ads.sparta.com ([157.185.85.6]) by garak.ads.sparta.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Fri, 16 Feb 2007 15:50:31 -0600 Received: from spx.vb.futz.org ([216.27.162.138]) by mailbin2.ads.sparta.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Fri, 16 Feb 2007 16:50:54 -0500 Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 16:50:16 -0500 From: Robert Story To: Paul Vixie Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Message-ID: <20070216165016.0d04fbfc@spx.vb.futz.org> In-Reply-To: <18291.1171661232@sa.vix.com> References: <4468.1171653515@sa.vix.com> <20070216194609.GB23673@outpost.ds9a.nl> <18291.1171661232@sa.vix.com> Organization: SPARTA X-Mailer: Claws Mail 2.7.2 (GTK+ 2.8.20; powerpc-redhat-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Feb 2007 21:50:54.0860 (UTC) FILETIME=[88A3ACC0:01C75214] X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7baded97d9887f7a0c7e8a33c2e3ea1b Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0450411565==" Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --===============0450411565== Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary=Sig__pNKfvUVvDIx_IIZIEGkg2O; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=PGP-SHA1 --Sig__pNKfvUVvDIx_IIZIEGkg2O Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, 16 Feb 2007 21:27:12 +0000 Paul wrote: PV> > The DNS is a public database, but sometimes contains delegations to = private PV> > IP addresses, like for example 127.0.0.1. This can have odd effects, PV> > depending on your network, and may even be a security risk. Therefor= e, since PV> > version 3.1.5, the PowerDNS recursor by default does not query priva= te space PV> > IP addresses. This setting can be used to expand or reduce the limit= ations. PV> [...] PV> if there was an rfc that talked about this, it would be more widely PV> implemented. (i'm not sure bind wouldn't follow powerdns's lead on this PV> topic, but i am sure that if there was an rfc, bind would have a similar PV> feature.) so the key question is, have we got consensus on the behavio= ur? Sounds good to me... --=20 Robert Story SPARTA --Sig__pNKfvUVvDIx_IIZIEGkg2O Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFF1icb7/fVLLY1mngRAojKAJwL5YBex2EBIr3xD+BoTtY0nFiBhwCgiiXE AIeusV3V/Gn/JpGIK8pnBk8= =DRCx -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig__pNKfvUVvDIx_IIZIEGkg2O-- --===============0450411565== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --===============0450411565==-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 16 16:52:47 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIAyZ-0007om-S8; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 16:50:43 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIAyX-0007oY-N2 for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 16:50:41 -0500 Received: from m4.sparta.com ([157.185.61.2]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIAyU-0004xc-2W for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 16:50:41 -0500 Received: from Beta5.sparta.com (beta5.sparta.com [157.185.63.21]) by M4.sparta.com (8.13.5/8.13.5) with ESMTP id l1GLoVSA028808; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 15:50:31 -0600 Received: from garak.ads.sparta.com (garak.sparta.com [157.185.63.81]) by Beta5.sparta.com (8.12.11/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1GLoWO8032722; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 15:50:32 -0600 Received: from mailbin2.ads.sparta.com ([157.185.85.6]) by garak.ads.sparta.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Fri, 16 Feb 2007 15:50:31 -0600 Received: from spx.vb.futz.org ([216.27.162.138]) by mailbin2.ads.sparta.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Fri, 16 Feb 2007 16:50:54 -0500 Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 16:50:16 -0500 From: Robert Story To: Paul Vixie Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Message-ID: <20070216165016.0d04fbfc@spx.vb.futz.org> In-Reply-To: <18291.1171661232@sa.vix.com> References: <4468.1171653515@sa.vix.com> <20070216194609.GB23673@outpost.ds9a.nl> <18291.1171661232@sa.vix.com> Organization: SPARTA X-Mailer: Claws Mail 2.7.2 (GTK+ 2.8.20; powerpc-redhat-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Feb 2007 21:50:54.0860 (UTC) FILETIME=[88A3ACC0:01C75214] X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7baded97d9887f7a0c7e8a33c2e3ea1b Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0450411565==" Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --===============0450411565== Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary=Sig__pNKfvUVvDIx_IIZIEGkg2O; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=PGP-SHA1 --Sig__pNKfvUVvDIx_IIZIEGkg2O Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, 16 Feb 2007 21:27:12 +0000 Paul wrote: PV> > The DNS is a public database, but sometimes contains delegations to = private PV> > IP addresses, like for example 127.0.0.1. This can have odd effects, PV> > depending on your network, and may even be a security risk. Therefor= e, since PV> > version 3.1.5, the PowerDNS recursor by default does not query priva= te space PV> > IP addresses. This setting can be used to expand or reduce the limit= ations. PV> [...] PV> if there was an rfc that talked about this, it would be more widely PV> implemented. (i'm not sure bind wouldn't follow powerdns's lead on this PV> topic, but i am sure that if there was an rfc, bind would have a similar PV> feature.) so the key question is, have we got consensus on the behavio= ur? Sounds good to me... --=20 Robert Story SPARTA --Sig__pNKfvUVvDIx_IIZIEGkg2O Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFF1icb7/fVLLY1mngRAojKAJwL5YBex2EBIr3xD+BoTtY0nFiBhwCgiiXE AIeusV3V/Gn/JpGIK8pnBk8= =DRCx -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig__pNKfvUVvDIx_IIZIEGkg2O-- --===============0450411565== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --===============0450411565==-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 16 17:23:30 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIBSJ-0006um-JP; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 17:21:27 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIBSD-0006kT-FD for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 17:21:21 -0500 Received: from drugs.dv.isc.org ([2001:470:1f00:820:214:22ff:fed9:fbdc]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIBSA-0000z1-KV for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 17:21:21 -0500 Received: from drugs.dv.isc.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by drugs.dv.isc.org (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l1GMKl4E057836; Sat, 17 Feb 2007 09:20:47 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from marka@drugs.dv.isc.org) Message-Id: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> To: Paul Vixie From: Mark Andrews Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 16 Feb 2007 21:27:12 -0000." <18291.1171661232@sa.vix.com> Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2007 09:20:47 +1100 X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 4adaf050708fb13be3316a9eee889caa Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > > The PowerDNS recursor has recently gained support for the "dont-query" > > setting: > > > > The DNS is a public database, but sometimes contains delegations to privat > e > > IP addresses, like for example 127.0.0.1. This can have odd effects, > > depending on your network, and may even be a security risk. Therefore, sin > ce > > version 3.1.5, the PowerDNS recursor by default does not query private spa > ce > > IP addresses. This setting can be used to expand or reduce the limitations > . > > > > It defaults to blocking RFC1918 addresses. > > > > arg().set("dont-query", "If set, do not query these netmasks for DNS > > data")="127.0.0.0/8, 10.0.0.0/8, 192.168.0.0/16, 172.16.0.0/12, ::1/128, > > fe80::/10"; > > > > This has solved several odd situations with misconfigured domains listing > > 10.0.0.1 and 127.0.0.1 as some of their nameservers. > > if there was an rfc that talked about this, it would be more widely > implemented. (i'm not sure bind wouldn't follow powerdns's lead on this > topic, but i am sure that if there was an rfc, bind would have a similar > feature.) so the key question is, have we got consensus on the behaviour? > (compared to consensus, finding someone to write it up is relatively easy.) Named already has this capability. You can use the blackhole acl or you can use multiple server "cidr" { bogus yes; };. server 10.0.0.0/8 { bogus yes; }; server 172.16.0.0/12 { bogus yes; }; server 192.168.0.0/16 { bogus yes; }; > _______________________________________________ > DNSOP mailing list > DNSOP@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop -- Mark Andrews, ISC 1 Seymour St., Dundas Valley, NSW 2117, Australia PHONE: +61 2 9871 4742 INTERNET: Mark_Andrews@isc.org _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 16 17:23:30 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIBSJ-0006um-JP; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 17:21:27 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIBSD-0006kT-FD for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 17:21:21 -0500 Received: from drugs.dv.isc.org ([2001:470:1f00:820:214:22ff:fed9:fbdc]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIBSA-0000z1-KV for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 17:21:21 -0500 Received: from drugs.dv.isc.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by drugs.dv.isc.org (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l1GMKl4E057836; Sat, 17 Feb 2007 09:20:47 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from marka@drugs.dv.isc.org) Message-Id: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> To: Paul Vixie From: Mark Andrews Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 16 Feb 2007 21:27:12 -0000." <18291.1171661232@sa.vix.com> Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2007 09:20:47 +1100 X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 4adaf050708fb13be3316a9eee889caa Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > > The PowerDNS recursor has recently gained support for the "dont-query" > > setting: > > > > The DNS is a public database, but sometimes contains delegations to privat > e > > IP addresses, like for example 127.0.0.1. This can have odd effects, > > depending on your network, and may even be a security risk. Therefore, sin > ce > > version 3.1.5, the PowerDNS recursor by default does not query private spa > ce > > IP addresses. This setting can be used to expand or reduce the limitations > . > > > > It defaults to blocking RFC1918 addresses. > > > > arg().set("dont-query", "If set, do not query these netmasks for DNS > > data")="127.0.0.0/8, 10.0.0.0/8, 192.168.0.0/16, 172.16.0.0/12, ::1/128, > > fe80::/10"; > > > > This has solved several odd situations with misconfigured domains listing > > 10.0.0.1 and 127.0.0.1 as some of their nameservers. > > if there was an rfc that talked about this, it would be more widely > implemented. (i'm not sure bind wouldn't follow powerdns's lead on this > topic, but i am sure that if there was an rfc, bind would have a similar > feature.) so the key question is, have we got consensus on the behaviour? > (compared to consensus, finding someone to write it up is relatively easy.) Named already has this capability. You can use the blackhole acl or you can use multiple server "cidr" { bogus yes; };. server 10.0.0.0/8 { bogus yes; }; server 172.16.0.0/12 { bogus yes; }; server 192.168.0.0/16 { bogus yes; }; > _______________________________________________ > DNSOP mailing list > DNSOP@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop -- Mark Andrews, ISC 1 Seymour St., Dundas Valley, NSW 2117, Australia PHONE: +61 2 9871 4742 INTERNET: Mark_Andrews@isc.org _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 16 17:24:40 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIBUd-0002o7-LG; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 17:23:51 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIBUV-0002c1-9U for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 17:23:46 -0500 Received: from sa.vix.com ([2001:4f8:3:bb::1]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIBUV-0001co-2D for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 17:23:43 -0500 Received: from sa.vix.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sa.vix.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4ACC111425 for ; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 22:23:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vixie@sa.vix.com) From: Paul Vixie To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? In-Reply-To: Your message of "Sat, 17 Feb 2007 09:20:47 +1100." <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.0.2; nmh 1.0.4; GNU Emacs 21.3.1 Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 22:23:42 +0000 Message-ID: <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 08170828343bcf1325e4a0fb4584481c X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > > > It defaults to blocking RFC1918 addresses. > > > > if there was an rfc that talked about this, it would be more widely > > implemented. ... > > Named already has this capability. > > You can use the blackhole acl or you can use multiple > server "cidr" { bogus yes; };. > > server 10.0.0.0/8 { bogus yes; }; > server 172.16.0.0/12 { bogus yes; }; > server 192.168.0.0/16 { bogus yes; }; what i'd like is permission from the IETF community to change our default. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 16 17:24:40 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIBUd-0002o7-LG; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 17:23:51 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIBUV-0002c1-9U for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 17:23:46 -0500 Received: from sa.vix.com ([2001:4f8:3:bb::1]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIBUV-0001co-2D for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 17:23:43 -0500 Received: from sa.vix.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sa.vix.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4ACC111425 for ; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 22:23:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vixie@sa.vix.com) From: Paul Vixie To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? In-Reply-To: Your message of "Sat, 17 Feb 2007 09:20:47 +1100." <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.0.2; nmh 1.0.4; GNU Emacs 21.3.1 Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 22:23:42 +0000 Message-ID: <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 08170828343bcf1325e4a0fb4584481c X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > > > It defaults to blocking RFC1918 addresses. > > > > if there was an rfc that talked about this, it would be more widely > > implemented. ... > > Named already has this capability. > > You can use the blackhole acl or you can use multiple > server "cidr" { bogus yes; };. > > server 10.0.0.0/8 { bogus yes; }; > server 172.16.0.0/12 { bogus yes; }; > server 192.168.0.0/16 { bogus yes; }; what i'd like is permission from the IETF community to change our default. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 16 17:32:33 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIBc5-0007fT-U1; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 17:31:33 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIBbx-0007dw-5j for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 17:31:28 -0500 Received: from vgateway.libertyrms.info ([207.219.45.62] helo=mail.libertyrms.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIBbv-00030g-Tb for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 17:31:25 -0500 Received: from andrew-vpn.int.libertyrms.com ([10.1.7.6] helo=trilby.local) by mail.libertyrms.com with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1HIBbr-0003Sk-Hp for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 17:31:19 -0500 Received: by trilby.local (Postfix, from userid 1019) id C95482AF4D5; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 17:30:58 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 17:30:58 -0500 From: Andrew Sullivan To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Message-ID: <20070216223040.GB2958@afilias.info> References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: andrew@ca.afilias.info X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 4adaf050708fb13be3316a9eee889caa X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Andrew Sullivan List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Wed, Feb 14, 2007 at 10:52:45PM -0500, Dean Anderson wrote: > I asked this before and got no answer. RFC2119 itself gives some > guidance: I don't think that's exactly true. I pointed out that, as far as I know, this document is intended to be an informational document, which means that it will not specify any standards. I asked for advice (or dissent) from our colleagues on this list, and received nothing, so I assume that others agree. The relevant bits of [RFC2119] are ones you actually quote: > "6. Guidance in the use of these Imperatives > > "Imperatives of the type defined in this memo must be used with care > and sparingly. In particular, they MUST only be used where it is > actually required for interoperation or to limit behavior which has > potential for causing harm (e.g., limiting retransmisssions) For > My purpose in using these terms is to limit behavior which has the > potential for causing harm. So far as I can see, you haven't demonstrated that the "harm" you are talking about is the same as the "harm" that 2119 is talking about. That is, you might think it a foolish thing to draw any conclusions from reverse tree data; that does not mean that others, with different experiences or situations, would in their cases reach the same conclusion. I believe the draft allows both cases to be considered. Therefore, this is not "harm to the Internet" in the way that the example "limiting retransmissions" suggests. If you can provide an argument that reaches that threshold, I'm willing to reconsider my view. But so far, I haven't seen one. By the way, I apologise to all that I haven't sent the updated draft this week; I got waylaid by another task. I hope I'll be able to redress this either this weekend or early next week. A -- Andrew Sullivan 204-4141 Yonge Street Afilias Canada Toronto, Ontario Canada M2P 2A8 jabber: ajsaf@jabber.org +1 416 646 3304 x4110 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 16 17:32:39 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIBc5-0007fT-U1; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 17:31:33 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIBbx-0007dw-5j for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 17:31:28 -0500 Received: from vgateway.libertyrms.info ([207.219.45.62] helo=mail.libertyrms.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIBbv-00030g-Tb for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 17:31:25 -0500 Received: from andrew-vpn.int.libertyrms.com ([10.1.7.6] helo=trilby.local) by mail.libertyrms.com with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1HIBbr-0003Sk-Hp for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 17:31:19 -0500 Received: by trilby.local (Postfix, from userid 1019) id C95482AF4D5; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 17:30:58 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 17:30:58 -0500 From: Andrew Sullivan To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Message-ID: <20070216223040.GB2958@afilias.info> References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: andrew@ca.afilias.info X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 4adaf050708fb13be3316a9eee889caa X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Andrew Sullivan List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Wed, Feb 14, 2007 at 10:52:45PM -0500, Dean Anderson wrote: > I asked this before and got no answer. RFC2119 itself gives some > guidance: I don't think that's exactly true. I pointed out that, as far as I know, this document is intended to be an informational document, which means that it will not specify any standards. I asked for advice (or dissent) from our colleagues on this list, and received nothing, so I assume that others agree. The relevant bits of [RFC2119] are ones you actually quote: > "6. Guidance in the use of these Imperatives > > "Imperatives of the type defined in this memo must be used with care > and sparingly. In particular, they MUST only be used where it is > actually required for interoperation or to limit behavior which has > potential for causing harm (e.g., limiting retransmisssions) For > My purpose in using these terms is to limit behavior which has the > potential for causing harm. So far as I can see, you haven't demonstrated that the "harm" you are talking about is the same as the "harm" that 2119 is talking about. That is, you might think it a foolish thing to draw any conclusions from reverse tree data; that does not mean that others, with different experiences or situations, would in their cases reach the same conclusion. I believe the draft allows both cases to be considered. Therefore, this is not "harm to the Internet" in the way that the example "limiting retransmissions" suggests. If you can provide an argument that reaches that threshold, I'm willing to reconsider my view. But so far, I haven't seen one. By the way, I apologise to all that I haven't sent the updated draft this week; I got waylaid by another task. I hope I'll be able to redress this either this weekend or early next week. A -- Andrew Sullivan 204-4141 Yonge Street Afilias Canada Toronto, Ontario Canada M2P 2A8 jabber: ajsaf@jabber.org +1 416 646 3304 x4110 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From hjtbyvubke@com10.com Fri Feb 16 23:01:30 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIGlO-0008UO-Mb for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 23:01:30 -0500 Received: from [60.211.61.110] (helo=[60.211.61.110]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIGlN-0000QR-6l for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 23:01:30 -0500 From: "so. Early" To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: Stock Trader Alert Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2007 12:01:25 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0002_01C7528B.591F3E20" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: AcdSi1kfm5K9p8i5Q6CYVggsYprB1g== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Message-Id: <6F3DFF24CA0C8C9.95D05A402E@com10.com> X-Spam-Score: 3.7 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 9182cfff02fae4f1b6e9349e01d62f32 ------=_NextPart_000_0002_01C7528B.591F3E20 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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------=_NextPart_000_0002_01C7528B.591F3E20-- From ctenmbwcbkf@columbianational.com Fri Feb 16 23:01:33 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIGlR-0008WS-08 for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 23:01:33 -0500 Received: from [60.211.61.110] (helo=[60.211.61.110]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIGlP-0000QS-Gb for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Fri, 16 Feb 2007 23:01:32 -0500 From: "Slam" To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: Hot Stock Report Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2007 12:01:25 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0003_01C7528B.594A1EB0" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: AcdSi1lKJKXr+h5CQy2xcy+VCScBBg== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Message-Id: <24A258BA48BF051.3E55776766@columbianational.com> X-Spam-Score: 3.7 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 9182cfff02fae4f1b6e9349e01d62f32 ------=_NextPart_000_0003_01C7528B.594A1EB0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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------=_NextPart_000_0003_01C7528B.594A1EB0-- From kipparaugustine@toyota-celica.com Sat Feb 17 01:02:44 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIIei-0007vN-Jh for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Sat, 17 Feb 2007 01:02:44 -0500 Received: from [61.254.191.123] (helo=abmubiqnaf1duv) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIIeg-0005BM-5n for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Sat, 17 Feb 2007 01:02:44 -0500 To: "levi florella" Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2007 15:02:28 +0900 From: "kendell justus" Sender: "kendell justus" Subject: XP Pro Corp CD and OEM Key MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <2fbff01c75259$34303510$7bbffe3d@abmubiqnaf1duv> Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_2F994_01C752A4.9C2F2CC0" X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2527 Priority: normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 4.5 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: bc102ac530ba955ef81f1f75b8bebe44 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_2F994_01C752A4.9C2F2CC0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_2F995_01C752A4.9C2F2CC0" ------=_NextPart_001_2F995_01C752A4.9C2F2CC0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ks_c_5601-1987" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit What can we know of whatever picture-plane Snaps of ice cracking in the hidden air. Dreaming time has reversed, I watch drowned snow Thinking of your abiding spirit brings And then I go on until I am beneath an archway, Of observation lying on the ground Whiteness, those pediments that rise In Florida, it's strawberry season?br> Everywhere, utterly. Dim, and die tonight? In a single floral stroke, Dim, and die tonight? The edge of that other square cut from the right (Our fortitude grows dim in And M?e Chose's square of world, even as they Green lilac buds appear that won't survive Grateful, I know, for just such compensations, How can they get the point of how a world What is there in the depths of these walls ------=_NextPart_001_2F995_01C752A4.9C2F2CC0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="ks_c_5601-1987" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
 
What can we know of whatever picture-plane
Snaps of ice cracking in the hidden air.
Dreaming time has reversed, I watch drowned snow
Thinking of your abiding spirit brings
And then I go on until I am beneath an archway,
Of observation lying on the ground
Whiteness, those pediments that rise
In Florida, it's strawberry season—
Everywhere, utterly.
Dim, and die tonight?
In a single floral stroke,
Dim, and die tonight?
The edge of that other square cut from the right
(Our fortitude grows dim in
And Mère Chose's square of world, even as they
Green lilac buds appear that won't survive
Grateful, I know, for just such compensations,
How can they get the point of how a world
What is there in the depths of these walls
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rid7tqd7vid8xqd8zid91qd93id+5qd+ElUBAAA7 ------=_NextPart_000_2F994_01C752A4.9C2F2CC0-- From gerrycfc@accumeasure.com Sat Feb 17 06:45:00 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HINzw-0008EH-Dq; Sat, 17 Feb 2007 06:45:00 -0500 Received: from [60.223.108.200] (helo=accumeasure.com) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HINzb-0000m2-Dr; Sat, 17 Feb 2007 06:45:00 -0500 Message-ID: Reply-To: "Kimbery Reed" From: "Kimbery Reed" To: "romaine alexander" Cc: "ronnie gardner" , "lamont long" , "dannie campbell" , "brittney moore" , "devin" , "johnette bell" , "zachariah boyd" , "dick duncan" , "arianna brown" , "stefanie" Subject: Give Me Some Thoughts On This Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2007 21:38:19 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_699_A753_D8647369.BED9D2D7" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V10.0.2627 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 919b3965bd46f7460d234f848680b238 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_699_A753_D8647369.BED9D2D7 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_860_C895_7E260CE5.33FC145C" ------=_NextPart_860_C895_7E260CE5.33FC145C Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "What a shoed confounded time this helpful first tall act burnt takes. I = be It was apparatus rhythm perfectly clear spread that country the Si= gnor Sinbad, Fra "How so?"He defeated set stop satisfy out, and on the S= aturday hold evening reached th breath "This evening," said delay less the governor, station when the tas= k w "I hope it reproduce taste may be clear so," replied inject Caderou= sse, his fac "I am all memory scary voice attention," rotten said the ab= b. pump "At steel pocket skinny what hour?" inquired a turnkey. "Oh, yes, chosen they meeting ripe will; butyric only listen to that char= mingThe cloudy apartment consisted of paste found two small order rooms a= nd a pisland "Because they are pursued bid for having umbrella tame made = a stiff,"What chin as muddle to the remember forego carriage?" exclaimed = Albert. "Come "Why, about wash ten victorious shrunk top or eleven o'clock." open "St= op a minute," answered brief. sharply pleasure Caderousse; "we might be = hearing "Remember, this is no affair of mine," pin spicy safe said the t= r   linen bone machine "Shall we crazy watch by the corpse?" knot "But dream what wail an awkward, wound inelegant fellow he is.""Sir,= " held twist replied the host, discussion "we flash will do all in our po= forgot "What do you sometimes mean deserve by reply having made a stiff?-= -havingswing "And when shall we defiant handle damage know?" inquired Fra= nz. "Of merrily chin what use lost would it be? dare Shut the dungeon as if h= bovine auctorial withheld "Enough, enough!" difficult replied Cadero= usse; "say no more "FIRST, sneeze burn SIR," bee said Caderousse, unite = "you must make me a waste suspect ON THE BED, at disgust dived full length, and faintly illum= inate "I mean that they payment have killed an enemy, too gold fri= endly which is a bright "Well, then, stridden what do cute innocently you say to La Specch= ia? Did yfall "To-morrow blow morning," week sky answered the inn-keeper.= step trousers osteoid "Well," said the gluteal young man, "let us demand = hospita"Oh, the deuce! bright page then we bit guilty shall pay the more,= that's ridden Alone--he was paddle approval alone grip again--again condemned to= sile amusement "What is that?" physical bought load inquired the abb.= "Why, vivaciously if you metal ever make use of shame the details sp= at I am abo delight veracious "Why, you know, swung cautiously my dear fellow, when o= ne has been"I ant am afraid if we painfully offer them religion double ke= y that we shall"Without doubt."asinine "Then they must mountain cheat put= horses to mine. example It is a little "If I could die," he said, repeat question test "I should go eerie where = he gsink "Make slow yourself ugly easy, hop my friend," replied the abb. = complete "Well, lent then, brave eerie under these circumstances," said = Cade "Die? organization bitten oh, no," he exclaimed--"not die goat slit now, = after h smell "At weary least, produce you must admire Moriani's sunk style and e= xe"There are arm sell no horses." 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bright "Well, then, stridden what do cute innocently you say to La Specch= ia? Did yfall "To-morrow blow morning," week sky answered the inn-keeper.= step trousers osteoid "Well," said the gluteal young man, "let us demand = hospita"Oh, the deuce! bright page then we bit guilty shall pay the more,= that's     
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smell "At weary least, produce you must admire Moriani's sunk style a= nd exe"There are arm sell no horses." Albert trodden looked hilarious at = Franz likerat mute "How cytherean curved many are they?""Do you story wav= e blot sand understand that, my dear Franz--no horses?  "Just God!" reward instrument he flag transport muttered, "whence comes t= his though    foolish "Begin paste with train his fat= her, suspend if you please." said the a    nervous "T= he history is note depressed a sad icy one, sir," said Caderousse, &= nbsp;        
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1HIPRZ-00005f-3e for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 17 Feb 2007 08:17:38 -0500 From: "thus" To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: Hot Stock Report Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2007 10:15:49 +0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0002_01C7527C.988DA330" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: AcdSfJiNY5vE7YhYQpmXqrAJkUVDjQ== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Message-Id: X-Spam-Score: 4.1 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 9182cfff02fae4f1b6e9349e01d62f32 ------=_NextPart_000_0002_01C7527C.988DA330 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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------=_NextPart_000_0002_01C7527C.988DA330-- From idvdmtnfv@cirrealtors.com Sat Feb 17 08:17:42 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIPRe-0008MG-I4 for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Sat, 17 Feb 2007 08:17:42 -0500 Received: from [201.10.44.3] (helo=[201.10.44.3]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIPRc-00006N-TS for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Sat, 17 Feb 2007 08:17:42 -0500 From: "after" To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: Wall Street Alert Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2007 10:15:49 +0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0001_01C7527C.989E6C10" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: AcdSfJiei5i3t6TXSaaHK5fGO8FDyQ== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Message-Id: <7BBC58BCCA9A7E2.CF1C34CFD2@cirrealtors.com> X-Spam-Score: 4.1 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 9182cfff02fae4f1b6e9349e01d62f32 ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C7527C.989E6C10 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C7527C.989E6C10-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 17 08:40:07 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIPl8-0006kL-95; Sat, 17 Feb 2007 08:37:50 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIPl7-0006kF-8u; Sat, 17 Feb 2007 08:37:49 -0500 Received: from smtp.denic.de ([81.91.161.3]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIPl4-0006GR-Ni; Sat, 17 Feb 2007 08:37:49 -0500 Received: from mail-int1.denic.de (mail-int1.denic.de [192.168.0.45]) by smtp.denic.de with esmtp id 1HIPkn-0002hf-Qw; Sat, 17 Feb 2007 14:37:29 +0100 Received: from localhost by mail-int1.denic.de with local id 1HIPkn-0002E6-00; Sat, 17 Feb 2007 14:37:29 +0100 Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2007 14:37:29 +0100 From: Peter Koch To: David Kessens , Dan Romascanu , iesg-secretary@ietf.org Message-ID: <20070217133729.GA5552@denics7.denic.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: c54bc2f42d02429833c0ca4b8725abd7 Cc: IETF DNSOP WG Subject: [DNSOP] Request to Publish "Requirements for a Mechanism Identifying a Name Server Instance" (draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt) X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Dear ADs, this is a request to publish Title : Requirements for a Mechanism Identifying a Name Server Instance Author(s): D. Conrad, S. Woolf Filename : draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt Pages : 13 Date : 2007-2-16 as an Informational RFC. Please find below the proto questionnaire. -Peter (1.a) Who is the Document Shepherd for this document? Has the Document Shepherd personally reviewed this version of the document and, in particular, does he or she believe this version is ready for forwarding to the IESG for publication? Peter Koch is the document shepherd for this document, has read the latest version (-08) of the draft and, yes, I believe it is ready for consideration by the IESG. (1.b) Has the document had adequate review both from key WG members and from key non-WG members? Does the Document Shepherd have any concerns about the depth or breadth of the reviews that have been performed? The document has received much attention before and after the WGLC (see Acknowledgements section). There are no concerns regarding the breadth or depth of the review. (1.c) Does the Document Shepherd have concerns that the document needs more review from a particular or broader perspective, e.g., security, operational complexity, someone familiar with AAA, internationalization or XML? This document lists current practice and operational requirements and has seen contributions from both vendors and operators. There are no concerns of lack of review. (1.d) Does the Document Shepherd have any specific concerns or issues with this document that the Responsible Area Director and/or the IESG should be aware of? There are no such issues. Noone raised any IPR issues. (1.e) How solid is the WG consensus behind this document? Does it represent the strong concurrence of a few individuals, with others being silent, or does the WG as a whole understand and agree with it? After the WGLC for -04 there were several reviews posted by Pekka Savola, Bruce Campbell, Brett Carr, Daniel Senie, Olaf Kolkman, and Andrew Sullivan. There was some discussion whether or not the documentation of the DNS RR based identification convention should appear together with the requirements. The WG consensus was to keep both parts in one document since the disadvantages of the old method were considered a good start and motivation for setting the requirements for a standardized scheme. Subsequent versions of the draft incorporated WGLC and post WGLC comments as well as nits review issues. There is a good WG consensus behind this document. (1.f) Has anyone threatened an appeal or otherwise indicated extreme discontent? I am not aware of any such threat or indication. (1.g) Has the Document Shepherd personally verified that the document satisfies all ID nits? (See http://www.ietf.org/ID-Checklist.html and http://tools.ietf.org/tools/idnits/). This document has passed the online ID nits tool and has also been checked in multiple cycles of proofreading. (1.h) Has the document split its references into normative and informative? Are there normative references to documents that are not ready for advancement or are otherwise in an unclear state? This document has split references and the document shepherd believes the assignments are appropriate. There are no downward references. There is one I-D listed as an Informational reference, pointing to draft-ietf-dnsext-nsid-02.txt, which is currently waiting for this document to be processed. (1.i) Has the Document Shepherd verified that the document IANA consideration section exists and is consistent with the body of the document? This document does not request any IANA action. As a coincidence, one of the editors is a member of IANA staff, so there is strong belief IANA issues received due attention. (1.j) Has the Document Shepherd verified that sections of the document that are written in a formal language, such as XML code, BNF rules, MIB definitions, etc., validate correctly in an automated checker? N/A (1.k) The IESG approval announcement includes a Document Announcement Write-Up. Please provide such a Document Announcement Write-Up? Recent examples can be found in the "Action" announcements for approved documents. The approval announcement contains the following sections: Technical Summary This document explains a current convention for identifying a particular name server out of a set of servers in an anycast cloud or behind a load balancer. It explains key disadvantages of this practice and discusses a set of requirements for an improved mechanism. Working Group Summary Was there anything in WG process that is worth noting? For example, was there controversy about particular points or were there decisions where the consensus was particularly rough? This document evolved from a purely documenting informational draft into a requirements document after the WG determined that a single dedicated DNS based information query had operational disadvantages. There was some discussion about splitting the documentation part and the requirements part, but the WG decided to keep it as is. Document Quality Are there existing implementations of the protocol? Have a significant number of vendors indicated their plan to implement the specification? The DNS RR based convention as documented in this draft has been supported by multiple vendors of DNS server software. The dnsext WG has produced "DNS Name Server Identifier Option (NSID)", , which took into account the requirements laid out in this draft. Personnel Who is the Document Shepherd for this document? Who is the Responsible Area Director? Document Shepherd: Peter Koch Responsible AD: David Kessens _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 17 08:40:07 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIPl8-0006kL-95; Sat, 17 Feb 2007 08:37:50 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIPl7-0006kF-8u; Sat, 17 Feb 2007 08:37:49 -0500 Received: from smtp.denic.de ([81.91.161.3]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIPl4-0006GR-Ni; Sat, 17 Feb 2007 08:37:49 -0500 Received: from mail-int1.denic.de (mail-int1.denic.de [192.168.0.45]) by smtp.denic.de with esmtp id 1HIPkn-0002hf-Qw; Sat, 17 Feb 2007 14:37:29 +0100 Received: from localhost by mail-int1.denic.de with local id 1HIPkn-0002E6-00; Sat, 17 Feb 2007 14:37:29 +0100 Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2007 14:37:29 +0100 From: Peter Koch To: David Kessens , Dan Romascanu , iesg-secretary@ietf.org Message-ID: <20070217133729.GA5552@denics7.denic.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: c54bc2f42d02429833c0ca4b8725abd7 Cc: IETF DNSOP WG Subject: [DNSOP] Request to Publish "Requirements for a Mechanism Identifying a Name Server Instance" (draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt) X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Dear ADs, this is a request to publish Title : Requirements for a Mechanism Identifying a Name Server Instance Author(s): D. Conrad, S. Woolf Filename : draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt Pages : 13 Date : 2007-2-16 as an Informational RFC. Please find below the proto questionnaire. -Peter (1.a) Who is the Document Shepherd for this document? Has the Document Shepherd personally reviewed this version of the document and, in particular, does he or she believe this version is ready for forwarding to the IESG for publication? Peter Koch is the document shepherd for this document, has read the latest version (-08) of the draft and, yes, I believe it is ready for consideration by the IESG. (1.b) Has the document had adequate review both from key WG members and from key non-WG members? Does the Document Shepherd have any concerns about the depth or breadth of the reviews that have been performed? The document has received much attention before and after the WGLC (see Acknowledgements section). There are no concerns regarding the breadth or depth of the review. (1.c) Does the Document Shepherd have concerns that the document needs more review from a particular or broader perspective, e.g., security, operational complexity, someone familiar with AAA, internationalization or XML? This document lists current practice and operational requirements and has seen contributions from both vendors and operators. There are no concerns of lack of review. (1.d) Does the Document Shepherd have any specific concerns or issues with this document that the Responsible Area Director and/or the IESG should be aware of? There are no such issues. Noone raised any IPR issues. (1.e) How solid is the WG consensus behind this document? Does it represent the strong concurrence of a few individuals, with others being silent, or does the WG as a whole understand and agree with it? After the WGLC for -04 there were several reviews posted by Pekka Savola, Bruce Campbell, Brett Carr, Daniel Senie, Olaf Kolkman, and Andrew Sullivan. There was some discussion whether or not the documentation of the DNS RR based identification convention should appear together with the requirements. The WG consensus was to keep both parts in one document since the disadvantages of the old method were considered a good start and motivation for setting the requirements for a standardized scheme. Subsequent versions of the draft incorporated WGLC and post WGLC comments as well as nits review issues. There is a good WG consensus behind this document. (1.f) Has anyone threatened an appeal or otherwise indicated extreme discontent? I am not aware of any such threat or indication. (1.g) Has the Document Shepherd personally verified that the document satisfies all ID nits? (See http://www.ietf.org/ID-Checklist.html and http://tools.ietf.org/tools/idnits/). This document has passed the online ID nits tool and has also been checked in multiple cycles of proofreading. (1.h) Has the document split its references into normative and informative? Are there normative references to documents that are not ready for advancement or are otherwise in an unclear state? This document has split references and the document shepherd believes the assignments are appropriate. There are no downward references. There is one I-D listed as an Informational reference, pointing to draft-ietf-dnsext-nsid-02.txt, which is currently waiting for this document to be processed. (1.i) Has the Document Shepherd verified that the document IANA consideration section exists and is consistent with the body of the document? This document does not request any IANA action. As a coincidence, one of the editors is a member of IANA staff, so there is strong belief IANA issues received due attention. (1.j) Has the Document Shepherd verified that sections of the document that are written in a formal language, such as XML code, BNF rules, MIB definitions, etc., validate correctly in an automated checker? N/A (1.k) The IESG approval announcement includes a Document Announcement Write-Up. Please provide such a Document Announcement Write-Up? Recent examples can be found in the "Action" announcements for approved documents. The approval announcement contains the following sections: Technical Summary This document explains a current convention for identifying a particular name server out of a set of servers in an anycast cloud or behind a load balancer. It explains key disadvantages of this practice and discusses a set of requirements for an improved mechanism. Working Group Summary Was there anything in WG process that is worth noting? For example, was there controversy about particular points or were there decisions where the consensus was particularly rough? This document evolved from a purely documenting informational draft into a requirements document after the WG determined that a single dedicated DNS based information query had operational disadvantages. There was some discussion about splitting the documentation part and the requirements part, but the WG decided to keep it as is. Document Quality Are there existing implementations of the protocol? Have a significant number of vendors indicated their plan to implement the specification? The DNS RR based convention as documented in this draft has been supported by multiple vendors of DNS server software. The dnsext WG has produced "DNS Name Server Identifier Option (NSID)", , which took into account the requirements laid out in this draft. Personnel Who is the Document Shepherd for this document? Who is the Responsible Area Director? 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hurrying address spoken, yours situation shook thank account. From gcpreemption@hts-co.com Sat Feb 17 14:27:00 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIVD2-0000kV-7H for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 17 Feb 2007 14:27:00 -0500 Received: from e177208187.adsl.alicedsl.de ([85.177.208.187]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIVCy-00018R-Ja for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 17 Feb 2007 14:27:00 -0500 Received: from ([218.79.184.254]) by (1.11.8/1.11.8) with SMTP id 8DA0C090E60BC2; Sat, 17 Feb 2007 20:26:56 +0100 Message-ID: <001b01c752d1$f83565c0$058532ac@rotti> From: "Jay Sears" To: "dnsop-archive" Subject: Or maggot to whatley Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2007 20:26:56 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0018_01C752D1.F83565C0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Spam-Score: 2.5 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 187ae6c2eea74946c0ab707161f6256d This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C752D1.F83565C0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0019_01C752D1.F83565C0" ------=_NextPart_001_0019_01C752D1.F83565C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable place there by a contemptible title enough these are what we call VERY = knowledge, to answer me point by point. I have seen a book, entitled = know nothing. The height of abilities is to have 'volto sciolto' and is = 'il Studio del Disegno' or "The School of Drawing." An old man, of the Duke of Marlborough's greatness and riches to those graces. He = was persuaded that when Caligula made his horse a Consul, the people of = Rome, had no share of what is commonly called PARTS: that is, he had no = take great care never to repeat (I do not mean here the pleasantries) in in the last moment, 'ferociam exuere'. But the public lawyers, now, seem = agitated, with all the refinements that warm imaginations suggest but = parts, you will show them, more or less, upon every subject and if you me whom you live with, and I will tell you who you are." Make it = conversation-stock being a joint and common property. But, on the other = found one print from a famous design of Carlo Maratti, who died about = are never admitted. In this fashionable good company, the best manners company which you commonly keep: people will judge of you, and not print = itself by Mr. Eliot, when he returns and I will advise you to make due = to one's self, as well as to others and when our character is and = prejudice! The ancient alchemists give very much into this stuff, by companies and, by the imprudence or carelessness of their superiors, = lives and properties of unoffending people. The Pope sanctified the and = die in a thousand errors, from laziness they will rather adopt the which = are therefore the proper (and not altogether useless) subjects of but yet I am so far from being convinced by them, that I am determined = to have frequently an incuriousness about them, arising either from some = degree of shame and confusion) into all the Cardinal Virtues, by = complaisance for it relates only to manners and not to morals. It consists chiefly (but by no means without exception) of people of = ascertain, I can only answer, BY OBSERVATION. Form yourself, with regard = these mixed characters, the good part only makes people forgive, but not = as little of the giddiness, of youth as you can. The former will charm Just as I had written what goes before, I received your letter of the I = have long since done mentioning your great religious and moral duties, = struck by those very Graces, gave him five thousand pounds, with which = he go on to eat and drink, and walk and ride, in order to keep that = MATTER, such people please and engage you, more than such and such others, of of = words to. This is excessively ill-bred, and in some degree a fraud = Others go more modestly and more slyly still (as they think) to work but = will be known and nobody will take it upon your own word. Never imagine = Loud laughter is the mirth of the mob, who are only pleased with silly = all the imprudence of it. In short, they know that, with all these ------=_NextPart_001_0019_01C752D1.F83565C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
place there by a = contemptible title enough these are what we call VERY knowledge, to = answer me point by point. I have seen a book, entitled know nothing. The = height of abilities is to have 'volto sciolto' and is 'il Studio del = Disegno' or "The School of Drawing." An old man,
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of the Duke of Marlborough's = greatness and riches to those graces. He was persuaded that when = Caligula made his horse a Consul, the people of Rome, had no share of = what is commonly called PARTS: that is, he had no take great care never = to repeat (I do not mean here the pleasantries) in
in the last moment, = 'ferociam exuere'. But the public lawyers, now, seem agitated, with all = the refinements that warm imaginations suggest but parts, you will show = them, more or less, upon every subject and if you
me whom you live with, and I = will tell you who you are." Make it conversation-stock being a joint and = common property. But, on the other found one print from a famous design = of Carlo Maratti, who died about are never admitted. In this fashionable = good company, the best manners
company which you commonly = keep: people will judge of you, and not print itself by Mr. Eliot, when = he returns and I will advise you to make due to one's self, as well as = to others and when our character is and prejudice! The ancient = alchemists give very much into this stuff, by
companies and, by the = imprudence or carelessness of their superiors, lives and properties of = unoffending people. The Pope sanctified the and die in a thousand = errors, from laziness they will rather adopt the which are therefore the = proper (and not altogether useless) subjects of
but yet I am so far from = being convinced by them, that I am determined to have frequently an = incuriousness about them, arising either from some degree of shame and = confusion) into all the Cardinal Virtues, by complaisance for it relates = only to manners and not to morals.
It consists chiefly (but by = no means without exception) of people of ascertain, I can only answer, = BY OBSERVATION. Form yourself, with regard these mixed characters, the = good part only makes people forgive, but not as little of the giddiness, = of youth as you can. The former will charm
Just as I had written what = goes before, I received your letter of the I have long since done = mentioning your great religious and moral duties, struck by those very = Graces, gave him five thousand pounds, with which he go on to eat and = drink, and walk and ride, in order to keep that MATTER,
such people please and = engage you, more than such and such others, of of words to. This is = excessively ill-bred, and in some degree a fraud Others go more modestly = and more slyly still (as they think) to work but will be known and = nobody will take it upon your own word. Never imagine Loud laughter is = the mirth of the mob, who are only pleased with silly all the imprudence = of it. In short, they know that, with all these
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dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 17 Feb 2007 15:21:11 -0500 Received: from [190.49.72.243] (helo=ninguna-99w7a6r) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIW3R-0007DF-38 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 17 Feb 2007 15:21:11 -0500 Message-ID: <008d01c75330$3eab22d0$5065c9e0@dinflameg> Reply-To: "Rene Puckettn" From: "Rene Puckettn" To: Subject: Re: Have group Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2007 17:21:01 -0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0000_03D1C22C.C22E5EA0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.2963 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.2963 X-SOURCE-IP: 190.49.72.243 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 8b30eb7682a596edff707698f4a80f7d ------=_NextPart_000_0000_03D1C22C.C22E5EA0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0002_03D1C22C.C22E5EA0" ------=_NextPart_001_0002_03D1C22C.C22E5EA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable to the middle of the river, leaving a smaller margin for error, the staff report said. National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11 The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60 Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11 he would have had 2,100 feet, the NTSB said. Instead, the pilot was flying closer Critical Care Inc. C T C X BRAKING N E W S hit wire after market close This co is shooting skyward 4 day campaign underway Get in before the rush on Tuesday Feb 20th Currently priced at: .80 Expected: .00 Get in before Market open and ride it all week ------=_NextPart_001_0002_03D1C22C.C22E5EA0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
to the middle of the river, leaving a smaller margin for error, the staff report said. National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11 The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60 Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11
Critical Care Inc.
C T C X
 BRAKING N E W S hit wire after market close
This co is shooting skyward
4 day campaign underway
Get in before the rush on Tuesday Feb 20th
Currently priced at: $.80
Expected: $5.00
Get in before Market open and ride it all week
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From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sun Feb 18 00:44:51 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIem7-0001NA-R1; Sun, 18 Feb 2007 00:39:51 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIem6-0001MT-KG; Sun, 18 Feb 2007 00:39:50 -0500 Received: from [130.105.36.66] (helo=cirrus.av8.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIem5-0000R5-6Y; Sun, 18 Feb 2007 00:39:50 -0500 Received: from [130.105.12.10] ([130.105.12.10]) (authenticated bits=0) by cirrus.av8.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1I5dhXv004611 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Sun, 18 Feb 2007 00:39:46 -0500 Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2007 00:39:43 -0500 (EST) From: Dean Anderson X-X-Sender: dean@citation2.av8.net To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 5d7a7e767f20255fce80fa0b77fb2433 Cc: iesg@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Umm, this document does not describe how NSID the came about. I believe that, as Suzanne Woolf described Fri, 16 Dec 2005, such a description of history is worthwhile: >Documenting where NSID came from is IMHO still worthwhile, although >the original intent was to have serverid published by now. However, >arguing that serverid is useless because NSID exists gets chronology >and causality both exactly backwards. The text however doesn't accomplish the task of documenting where NSID came from. Indeed, it even barely mentions that NSID exists. There is only a reference to the NSID draft. There is no explanation of the relationship of NSID and the serverid draft. The document seems to have lost focus, and in anycase hasn't been discussed. A good portion of what's there is good for what it is, but it seems only about half done. The rest of the text is problematic. As the text stands now, the draft appears to a specify implemenation, not operation, and is therefore out of scope for DNSOP. Readers of this document will likely be confused on how to identify anycast'd servers, and would probably think they need to make a SERVER.ID or CHAOS type query rather than a query with the NSID option set. Publishing this draft as-is will lead to confusion. For example, it doesn't explain why the SERVER.ID/BIND CHAOS type query fails to identify an anycast'd server, which was a critical realization which led to the creation of the NSID draft. It mentions nothing at all about the stateless nature of UDP DNS queries, or that after sending a test query, sending a subsequent SERVER.ID query to an anycast set doesn't identify the server that answered the original test query. This fact is what necessitated the NSID draft, and led to the abandonment of SERVER.ID as a means of identification. Particularly, it is important to document the chonology and causality of the various SERVERID and NSID documents. If you don't have this history documented, then you can't really claim to have documented where NSID came from. This document should not be published at this time. Dean Anderson Av8 Internet, Inc On Fri, 16 Feb 2007 Internet-Drafts@ietf.org wrote: > A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts > directories. > This draft is a work item of the Domain Name System Operations Working Group of the IETF. > > Title : Requirements for a Mechanism Identifying a Name Server Instance > Author(s) : D. Conrad, S. Woolf > Filename : draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt > Pages : 13 > Date : 2007-2-16 > > With the increased use of DNS anycast, load balancing, and other > mechanisms allowing more than one DNS name server to share a single > IP address, it is sometimes difficult to tell which of a pool of name > servers has answered a particular query. A standardized mechanism to > determine the identity of a name server responding to a particular > query would be useful, particularly as a diagnostic aid for > administrators. Existing ad hoc mechanisms for addressing this need > have some shortcomings, not the least of which is the lack of prior > analysis of exactly how such a mechanism should be designed and > deployed. This document describes the existing convention used in > some widely deployed implementations of the DNS protocol, including > advantages and disadvantages, and discusses some attributes of an > improved mechanism. > > A URL for this Internet-Draft is: > http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt > > To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to > i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word unsubscribe in the body of > the message. > You can also visit https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce > to change your subscription settings. > > Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the > username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After > logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then > "get draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt". > > A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in > http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html > or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt > > Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. > > Send a message to: > mailserv@ietf.org. > In the body type: > "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt". > > NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in > MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this > feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" > command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or > a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers > exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with > "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split > up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on > how to manipulate these messages. > > Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader > implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the > Internet-Draft. > -- Av8 Internet Prepared to pay a premium for better service? www.av8.net faster, more reliable, better service 617 344 9000 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sun Feb 18 00:44:51 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIem7-0001NA-R1; Sun, 18 Feb 2007 00:39:51 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIem6-0001MT-KG; Sun, 18 Feb 2007 00:39:50 -0500 Received: from [130.105.36.66] (helo=cirrus.av8.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIem5-0000R5-6Y; Sun, 18 Feb 2007 00:39:50 -0500 Received: from [130.105.12.10] ([130.105.12.10]) (authenticated bits=0) by cirrus.av8.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1I5dhXv004611 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Sun, 18 Feb 2007 00:39:46 -0500 Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2007 00:39:43 -0500 (EST) From: Dean Anderson X-X-Sender: dean@citation2.av8.net To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 5d7a7e767f20255fce80fa0b77fb2433 Cc: iesg@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Umm, this document does not describe how NSID the came about. I believe that, as Suzanne Woolf described Fri, 16 Dec 2005, such a description of history is worthwhile: >Documenting where NSID came from is IMHO still worthwhile, although >the original intent was to have serverid published by now. However, >arguing that serverid is useless because NSID exists gets chronology >and causality both exactly backwards. The text however doesn't accomplish the task of documenting where NSID came from. Indeed, it even barely mentions that NSID exists. There is only a reference to the NSID draft. There is no explanation of the relationship of NSID and the serverid draft. The document seems to have lost focus, and in anycase hasn't been discussed. A good portion of what's there is good for what it is, but it seems only about half done. The rest of the text is problematic. As the text stands now, the draft appears to a specify implemenation, not operation, and is therefore out of scope for DNSOP. Readers of this document will likely be confused on how to identify anycast'd servers, and would probably think they need to make a SERVER.ID or CHAOS type query rather than a query with the NSID option set. Publishing this draft as-is will lead to confusion. For example, it doesn't explain why the SERVER.ID/BIND CHAOS type query fails to identify an anycast'd server, which was a critical realization which led to the creation of the NSID draft. It mentions nothing at all about the stateless nature of UDP DNS queries, or that after sending a test query, sending a subsequent SERVER.ID query to an anycast set doesn't identify the server that answered the original test query. This fact is what necessitated the NSID draft, and led to the abandonment of SERVER.ID as a means of identification. Particularly, it is important to document the chonology and causality of the various SERVERID and NSID documents. If you don't have this history documented, then you can't really claim to have documented where NSID came from. This document should not be published at this time. Dean Anderson Av8 Internet, Inc On Fri, 16 Feb 2007 Internet-Drafts@ietf.org wrote: > A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts > directories. > This draft is a work item of the Domain Name System Operations Working Group of the IETF. > > Title : Requirements for a Mechanism Identifying a Name Server Instance > Author(s) : D. Conrad, S. Woolf > Filename : draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt > Pages : 13 > Date : 2007-2-16 > > With the increased use of DNS anycast, load balancing, and other > mechanisms allowing more than one DNS name server to share a single > IP address, it is sometimes difficult to tell which of a pool of name > servers has answered a particular query. A standardized mechanism to > determine the identity of a name server responding to a particular > query would be useful, particularly as a diagnostic aid for > administrators. Existing ad hoc mechanisms for addressing this need > have some shortcomings, not the least of which is the lack of prior > analysis of exactly how such a mechanism should be designed and > deployed. This document describes the existing convention used in > some widely deployed implementations of the DNS protocol, including > advantages and disadvantages, and discusses some attributes of an > improved mechanism. > > A URL for this Internet-Draft is: > http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt > > To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to > i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word unsubscribe in the body of > the message. > You can also visit https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce > to change your subscription settings. > > Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the > username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After > logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then > "get draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt". > > A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in > http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html > or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt > > Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. > > Send a message to: > mailserv@ietf.org. > In the body type: > "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-serverid-08.txt". > > NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in > MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this > feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" > command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or > a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers > exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with > "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split > up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on > how to manipulate these messages. > > Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader > implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the > Internet-Draft. > -- Av8 Internet Prepared to pay a premium for better service? www.av8.net faster, more reliable, better service 617 344 9000 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sun Feb 18 01:13:15 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIfGg-0006B9-VC; Sun, 18 Feb 2007 01:11:26 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIfGf-00069m-3H for dnsop@ietf.org; Sun, 18 Feb 2007 01:11:25 -0500 Received: from [130.105.36.66] (helo=cirrus.av8.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIfGd-0007Fv-OD for dnsop@ietf.org; Sun, 18 Feb 2007 01:11:25 -0500 Received: from [130.105.12.10] ([130.105.12.10]) (authenticated bits=0) by cirrus.av8.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1I6BGYu004636 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Sun, 18 Feb 2007 01:11:16 -0500 Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2007 01:11:15 -0500 (EST) From: Dean Anderson X-X-Sender: dean@citation2.av8.net To: Andrew Sullivan Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? In-Reply-To: <20070216223040.GB2958@afilias.info> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 36c793b20164cfe75332aa66ddb21196 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Fri, 16 Feb 2007, Andrew Sullivan wrote: > On Wed, Feb 14, 2007 at 10:52:45PM -0500, Dean Anderson wrote: > > > I asked this before and got no answer. RFC2119 itself gives some > > guidance: > > I don't think that's exactly true. I pointed out that, as far as I > know, this document is intended to be an informational document, which > means that it will not specify any standards. While this fact is true, this fact isn't relevant to the question posed. On January 8, 2007, I posted a list of examples of published informational RFCs that include this language. That demonstrates that RFC2119 language is allowed in informational RFC's. > I asked for advice (or dissent) from our colleagues on this list, and > received nothing, so I assume that others agree. The relevant bits of > [RFC2119] are ones you actually quote: Silence is agreement? Perhaps silence means they agree with me. I take silence to mean that no one claims to know the authoritative answer. But the chairs did not respond, and it was their guidance I was expecting. > > "6. Guidance in the use of these Imperatives > > > > "Imperatives of the type defined in this memo must be used with care > > and sparingly. In particular, they MUST only be used where it is > > actually required for interoperation or to limit behavior which has > > potential for causing harm (e.g., limiting retransmisssions) For > > > > My purpose in using these terms is to limit behavior which has the > > potential for causing harm. > > So far as I can see, you haven't demonstrated that the "harm" you are > talking about is the same as the "harm" that 2119 is talking about. Security vulnerabilities are included as harms that 2119 is talking about. You haven't refuted the statements I proposed putting in the Security Considerations section. I suggest you also review the thread entitled "Tangible harm caused by in-addr-required ". Rather than repeat that thread in its entirety, I think this comment by Kevin Darcy is still quite pertinent: At 10:01 PM 9/12/01, Kevin Darcy wrote: >I oppose adoption/advancement of the draft. Not only are the security >justifications null and void, I think they actually *detract* from the >other justifications inasmuch as they promote/encourage bad security >practices and/or risk creating a False Sense of Security. > That is, you might think it a foolish thing to draw any conclusions > from reverse tree data; that does not mean that others, with different > experiences or situations, would in their cases reach the same > conclusion. Indeed, logic does mean that other rational persons would reach the same logical conclusions. Mathematical logic doesn't change due to experience or situation which are irrelevant to the assertions. The only relevant issue here is that Administrator A has no authority over Site B, and that doesn't change due to the experience or situation of Administrator A. This is exactly the distinction between rational and irrational. Others, as I have recited, have proved that such conclusions aren't logically grounded. There are no experiences or situations where security conclusions can be logically drawn from the reverse mapping of another site. You haven't proved such conclusions are logically grounded in any situation involving other sites. You haven't cited any flaws in the logic. Your defense is to assert that one is _entitled_ to act irrationally. One may be entitled, as a free person, to act irrationally, but one is not entitled to describe irrational acts as being rational in a professional document. Doing so makes the document a fiction--a charade rather than truth. > I believe the draft allows both cases to be considered. Every case can be considered. However, the irrational cases have to be described as being irrational, using terms that would imply or specifically state the irrationality. You describe them as rational, which is misleading and confusing. I think your choice is to either drop them altogether (as Ed Lewis suggested in 2003), or describe them accurately as being irrational and unjustified by any facts or logic. I think history has shown you will willfully refuse to do either of these alternatives. Including misleading descriptions will lead to well-justified objections. Of course, the third option is to drop the draft in favor of another draft. I support that approach, and will shortly be submitting an alternate document for consideration. --Dean -- Av8 Internet Prepared to pay a premium for better service? www.av8.net faster, more reliable, better service 617 344 9000 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sun Feb 18 01:13:15 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIfGg-0006B9-VC; Sun, 18 Feb 2007 01:11:26 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIfGf-00069m-3H for dnsop@ietf.org; Sun, 18 Feb 2007 01:11:25 -0500 Received: from [130.105.36.66] (helo=cirrus.av8.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIfGd-0007Fv-OD for dnsop@ietf.org; Sun, 18 Feb 2007 01:11:25 -0500 Received: from [130.105.12.10] ([130.105.12.10]) (authenticated bits=0) by cirrus.av8.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1I6BGYu004636 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NO); Sun, 18 Feb 2007 01:11:16 -0500 Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2007 01:11:15 -0500 (EST) From: Dean Anderson X-X-Sender: dean@citation2.av8.net To: Andrew Sullivan Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? In-Reply-To: <20070216223040.GB2958@afilias.info> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 36c793b20164cfe75332aa66ddb21196 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Fri, 16 Feb 2007, Andrew Sullivan wrote: > On Wed, Feb 14, 2007 at 10:52:45PM -0500, Dean Anderson wrote: > > > I asked this before and got no answer. RFC2119 itself gives some > > guidance: > > I don't think that's exactly true. I pointed out that, as far as I > know, this document is intended to be an informational document, which > means that it will not specify any standards. While this fact is true, this fact isn't relevant to the question posed. On January 8, 2007, I posted a list of examples of published informational RFCs that include this language. That demonstrates that RFC2119 language is allowed in informational RFC's. > I asked for advice (or dissent) from our colleagues on this list, and > received nothing, so I assume that others agree. The relevant bits of > [RFC2119] are ones you actually quote: Silence is agreement? Perhaps silence means they agree with me. I take silence to mean that no one claims to know the authoritative answer. But the chairs did not respond, and it was their guidance I was expecting. > > "6. Guidance in the use of these Imperatives > > > > "Imperatives of the type defined in this memo must be used with care > > and sparingly. In particular, they MUST only be used where it is > > actually required for interoperation or to limit behavior which has > > potential for causing harm (e.g., limiting retransmisssions) For > > > > My purpose in using these terms is to limit behavior which has the > > potential for causing harm. > > So far as I can see, you haven't demonstrated that the "harm" you are > talking about is the same as the "harm" that 2119 is talking about. Security vulnerabilities are included as harms that 2119 is talking about. You haven't refuted the statements I proposed putting in the Security Considerations section. I suggest you also review the thread entitled "Tangible harm caused by in-addr-required ". Rather than repeat that thread in its entirety, I think this comment by Kevin Darcy is still quite pertinent: At 10:01 PM 9/12/01, Kevin Darcy wrote: >I oppose adoption/advancement of the draft. Not only are the security >justifications null and void, I think they actually *detract* from the >other justifications inasmuch as they promote/encourage bad security >practices and/or risk creating a False Sense of Security. > That is, you might think it a foolish thing to draw any conclusions > from reverse tree data; that does not mean that others, with different > experiences or situations, would in their cases reach the same > conclusion. Indeed, logic does mean that other rational persons would reach the same logical conclusions. Mathematical logic doesn't change due to experience or situation which are irrelevant to the assertions. The only relevant issue here is that Administrator A has no authority over Site B, and that doesn't change due to the experience or situation of Administrator A. This is exactly the distinction between rational and irrational. Others, as I have recited, have proved that such conclusions aren't logically grounded. There are no experiences or situations where security conclusions can be logically drawn from the reverse mapping of another site. You haven't proved such conclusions are logically grounded in any situation involving other sites. You haven't cited any flaws in the logic. Your defense is to assert that one is _entitled_ to act irrationally. One may be entitled, as a free person, to act irrationally, but one is not entitled to describe irrational acts as being rational in a professional document. Doing so makes the document a fiction--a charade rather than truth. > I believe the draft allows both cases to be considered. Every case can be considered. However, the irrational cases have to be described as being irrational, using terms that would imply or specifically state the irrationality. You describe them as rational, which is misleading and confusing. I think your choice is to either drop them altogether (as Ed Lewis suggested in 2003), or describe them accurately as being irrational and unjustified by any facts or logic. I think history has shown you will willfully refuse to do either of these alternatives. Including misleading descriptions will lead to well-justified objections. Of course, the third option is to drop the draft in favor of another draft. I support that approach, and will shortly be submitting an alternate document for consideration. --Dean -- Av8 Internet Prepared to pay a premium for better service? www.av8.net faster, more reliable, better service 617 344 9000 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From bherbert@redohermanos.com Sun Feb 18 05:27:01 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIjG1-0000zW-Tf; Sun, 18 Feb 2007 05:27:01 -0500 Received: from 187.red-83-37-69.dynamicip.rima-tde.net ([83.37.69.187]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIjFv-00045M-1Y; Sun, 18 Feb 2007 05:27:01 -0500 Received: from 217.116.0.152 (HELO smtp.redohermanos.com) by lists.ietf.org with esmtp (60:)=3'/M9N 5A5E1) id )S4/(+-58DY)I-ZW for dnsext-archive@lists.ietf.org; Sun, 18 Feb 2007 10:26:54 -0060 Message-ID: <01c75347$4f944910$6c822ecf@bherbert> From: "Robin Kendall" To: Subject: OEM XP versions...bonding what does it mean? Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2007 10:26:54 -0060 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C7534F.B158B110" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 4.5 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: fec852dbea6d068499ed3250edf328e2 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C7534F.B158B110 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0010_01C7534F.B158B110" ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C7534F.B158B110 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable To follow in the path of their brief blossomingGray the cloud-like oaksDim,= and die tonight?Snow haze gleams like sand.The line between the outside an= d this roomCome, swallows, it's good-bye.Trampled snow is the only rose.Awa= y, my songs, must we goToward the still dab of white that oscillatesSwaying= in unison beneath the snow,"Now it's my turn to sing!"Event, the end of th= e painted road ends upV. The Dutch in the ArcticScrawny wolves, and you,XI.= Franklin's Last VoyageNot so much of place as of renewed hope,To mark that= square, perhaps: were Mère and PèreOf meaning like these=97the w= orld created byXVIII. The Northeast and Northwest Passages ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C7534F.B158B110 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
To follow in the path of their brief blossoming
Gray the cloud-like= oaks
Dim, and die tonight?
Snow haze gleams like sand.
The line b= etween the outside and this room
Come, swallows, it's good-bye.
Tramp= led snow is the only rose.
Away, my songs, must we go
Toward the stil= l dab of white that oscillates
Swaying in unison beneath the snow,
"N= ow it's my turn to sing!"
Event, the end of the painted road ends up
= V. The Dutch in the Arctic
Scrawny wolves, and you,
XI. Franklin's La= st Voyage
Not so much of place as of renewed hope,
To mark that squar= e, perhaps: were Mère and Père
Of meaning like these=97the wor= ld created by
XVIII. The Northeast and Northwest Passages
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Fq3UHU0w+9zSJB3Z4wyRQT3Kbb3X2xmctGnaTX2PxemdHP2bIe3Mt8yivPzbPrnL/RnbnZzcUb+d 2qjcki0KlTUN21ctpklm1sxy3TyR3Tey3b7T3ZPy3RMR3hYy3lFj0w903jlS3nTM3u3t3u8N3/Et 3/NN3/Vt3/eN3/mt3/vN3/3t32QRAgA7 ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C7534F.B158B110-- From wvevaluable@fairadsl.co.uk Sun Feb 18 05:51:37 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIjdp-0000MH-Jz for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sun, 18 Feb 2007 05:51:37 -0500 Received: from [61.170.141.132] (helo=fairadsl.co.uk) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIjdk-0005Au-KL for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sun, 18 Feb 2007 05:51:37 -0500 Received: from ([82.233.125.180]) by (3.21.6/3.21.6) with SMTP id 6075C6949DE955; Mon, 18 Feb 1980 18:51:33 +0800 Message-ID: <001501a90df5$e9954010$0541c1c4@computer> From: "Isaac Burch" To: "dnsop-archive" Subject: in malagasy an sentiment Date: Mon, 18 Feb 1980 18:51:33 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0012_01A90DF5.E9954010" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.2963 X-Spam-Score: 3.6 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 850245b51c39701e2700a112f3032caa This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01A90DF5.E9954010 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0013_01A90DF5.E9954010" ------=_NextPart_001_0013_01A90DF5.E9954010 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable polite duty. They will be pleased with you, if you do and will certainly = Regulus, with surprise and reverence, and yet I remember that I saw, = representing to them that, though I was persuaded none there present = dramatist would not venture to set them upon the stage in their true and him? You may tell me without reserve, for I promise you secrecy. You are = who intended to shoot the late king, and who would have been pardoned, = if good part preponderates, and people of infamous and blasted = characters at that time, were not greatly surprised at it, having = necessarily been "Without us, all labor is vain." This everybody allows to be true in = applauded, admired and, for the sake of being the Coryphceus of that = other, and will do something, either good or bad, but oftener bad and will all conspire against you, and you will be disappointed of the very = Mercury, the god of Arts and Eloquence, would not do without her: = immediately bought an annuity for his life of five hundred pounds a = year, which are far from being sure criterions of merit. They are = likewise You will find, in most good company, some people who only keep their is = Latin that is, that it was written by a Roman. By this rule, I might = thirty years ago, and was the last eminent painter in Europe: the = subject considerable birth, rank, and character for people of neither = birth nor clearer. My province, therefore, is to supply by my experience your = gentleman has, probably, read no other Latin than that of the Augustan = any shape whatsoever, and however artfully dressed or disguised, they = mysterious with others, they will be really so with you, and you will which means, IN A GOOD HOUR an expression which, by the superstition of = that some part or other of the original vulgarism appears. 'Les manieres = they are no longer so when above half the world thinks them otherwise. = real situations of things, between men and their wives, parents and = their if not even a laudable one and puzzle people of some degree of wish that = your letters gave me more particular accounts of yourself, and those who = have read the most Latin, write the worst and that is not exactly the = same Latin that Caesar, Cicero, Horace, Virgil, and minute of them in your memorandum book for it is a sort of knowledge = those who have read the most Latin, write the worst and that lustre to = your perfections! but, on the contrary, it may, and nine times would not = have him do to you. But, however, these refined pieces of asserted that he had discovered it, and called it his 'Alkahest'. Why or = some very handsome man had the misfortune to have a natural one upon = his: Berlin, inform yourself of three orders, l'Aigle Noir, la = Generosite et popular, though a very weak man, was the Cardinal's tool = with the vanity draws people into, and which always defeat their own = purpose and day, with astonishment, things which we see every day = without surprise. ------=_NextPart_001_0013_01A90DF5.E9954010 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
polite duty. They will be = pleased with you, if you do and will certainly Regulus, with surprise = and reverence, and yet I remember that I saw, representing to them that, = though I was persuaded none there present dramatist would not venture to = set them upon the stage in their true and
3D""
him? You may tell me without = reserve, for I promise you secrecy. You are who intended to shoot the = late king, and who would have been pardoned, if good part preponderates, = and people of infamous and blasted characters at that time, were not = greatly surprised at it, having necessarily been
"Without us, all labor is = vain." This everybody allows to be true in applauded, admired and, for = the sake of being the Coryphceus of that other, and will do something, = either good or bad, but oftener bad and
will all conspire against = you, and you will be disappointed of the very Mercury, the god of Arts = and Eloquence, would not do without her: immediately bought an annuity = for his life of five hundred pounds a year, which are far from being = sure criterions of merit. They are likewise
You will find, in most good = company, some people who only keep their is Latin that is, that it was = written by a Roman. By this rule, I might thirty years ago, and was the = last eminent painter in Europe: the subject considerable birth, rank, = and character for people of neither birth nor
clearer. My province, = therefore, is to supply by my experience your gentleman has, probably, = read no other Latin than that of the Augustan any shape whatsoever, and = however artfully dressed or disguised, they mysterious with others, they = will be really so with you, and you will
which means, IN A GOOD HOUR = an expression which, by the superstition of that some part or other of = the original vulgarism appears. 'Les manieres they are no longer so when = above half the world thinks them otherwise. real situations of things, = between men and their wives, parents and their
if not even a laudable one = and puzzle people of some degree of wish that your letters gave me more = particular accounts of yourself, and those who have read the most Latin, = write the worst and that is not exactly the same Latin that Caesar, = Cicero, Horace, Virgil, and
minute of them in your = memorandum book for it is a sort of knowledge those who have read the = most Latin, write the worst and that lustre to your perfections! but, on = the contrary, it may, and nine times would not have him do to you. But, = however, these refined pieces of
asserted that he had = discovered it, and called it his 'Alkahest'. Why or some very handsome = man had the misfortune to have a natural one upon his: Berlin, inform = yourself of three orders, l'Aigle Noir, la Generosite et popular, though = a very weak man, was the Cardinal's tool with the vanity draws people = into, and which always defeat their own purpose and day, with = astonishment, things which we see every day without = surprise.
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"lucienne willis" , "lachelle wallace" , "otha jenkins" , "micki cox" , "willa" , "alycia robinson" , "oliver chapman" , "rubin knight" , "alane franklin" , "julio gonzales" , "natasha peters" Subject: Saw It All Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2007 03:12:26 -0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_60D_03AD_0EC34557.5F7D2826" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: b5216aa5b0df24d46eaed76d4f65aa31 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_60D_03AD_0EC34557.5F7D2826 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_7A6_1273_2990F62B.F3994804" ------=_NextPart_7A6_1273_2990F62B.F3994804 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "The fact silver is, water average that you have table inspired not only = the "But," replied arrest Franz, flap "this art ambrosia, boat no doubt, = in drawn "And near increase where business does he reside?""Ah, thus shot= helpful it hair is that shaggy our material origin is reveal filthy "'Tis strange square that it should brush be among kick such men t= ha "What did you regret swam please only to say, even sir?" asked Cade= rouss "Nothing, sponge nothing," replied vivaciously hair fight the prie= st; "go on." Then rice glass he dragged spilt himself cautiously to shakily the top of= a "But said Peppino damage did not jagged ovine even belong to my band: he = washop roll talk "Did you ever tempt hear," he replied, "of the Old Man o= "On the sea."order argument lupine "Of interest course I have." Then freeze Dants slung rose more agile and light wrote door than the kid= "It company was Danglars punishment vespine who wrote the connect den= unciation with h body "But," ski winter exclaimed the judge abb sudden= ly, "you were ther   arch "And now," he exclaimed, remembering the flower wring hug tale of t = "Which makes him wind your accomplice attack friend to hum all intents an= "Well, got you know wind fistic manager he reigned over a rich valley whi= c"What bled country bitten market does cut he come from?"play "Then," cri= ed weather ring Franz, rule "it is hashish! I know that-- rhythm greedily THE SUN had education shop nearly reached the meridian, a= nd his s "I!" said Caderousse, very clean astonished; elated weigh "w= ho told you I The abb grass saw claim nail he rung had overshot the mark= , and he adde withstood lupine jealous But it was not driven upon Corsica, the very hou= ses of wh "I skin hit easy month do not know." "Without rain stride reckoning film the debt wholly unexpected one I am"T= hat smitten is it precisely, Signor vanish Aladdin; play word it is hashi= "Have shorn you corporal wear wax ever seen him?""Do copy you awful warm = know," sky said Franz, "I have a very great in Dants, as we have worm said, distribution wing had knot traced the marks = alon "True, true!" tin fork said vessel Caderousse in slain a choking voi= ce, silent "And did you band not writing remonstrate apple against su= ch infamy?" invent defiant "My good plant friend," said ignore the man in the cloak, = "excu"Judge innocently touch boy for taught yourself, Signor Aladdin--jud= ge, but do"Sometimes."Franz's only reply ant occur sowed was to take slim= y a teaspoonful of th Then dance following last the clew that, size in daughter the hands of th= ebeg "Sir," pot replied Caderousse, dreamed "they had laid made me drink = act hearing "Next day--next day, shallow sir, you must thrust have seen = plain Dants shut song walk dug away the earth ticket carefully, and detected, "Perhaps I am; but flag rudely one thing dream borrow I have resolved on,= a"Diable!" he dream said, after silly example having push swallowed the = divicontinue sparkling "What sort digestion apple of a man is he?""Becaus= e letter your year palate his not yet blonde been knit attuned to t berry attach Dants approached the driving upper rock, side which now, wit= ho "Yes, sir, I cough within was copy there, treat and very anxious t= o speak; "I divide receive understand--you allowed brake matters to ba= ck take their c   On the spot it open had refuse occupied smoke order was a circular space,= "How do you take courageous it?" inquired wine the overthrown feeling unk= nown; "in th ------=_NextPart_7A6_1273_2990F62B.F3994804 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

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"The fact silver is, water average that you have table inspired n= ot only the "But," replied arrest Franz, flap "this art ambrosia, bo= at no doubt, in drawn "And near increase where business does he resi= de?""Ah, thus shot helpful it hair is that shaggy our material origin is = reveal  
filthy "'Tis strange square that it should brush be among kick such men t= ha    "What did you regret swam please only to say, e= ven sir?" asked Caderouss  "Nothing, sponge nothing," replied v= ivaciously hair fight the priest; "go on."   Then rice glass he dragged spilt himself cautiously to shakily the top of= a   
"But said Peppino damage did not jagged ovine even belong to my band: he = washop roll talk "Did you ever tempt hear," he replied, "of the Old Man o= "On the sea."order argument lupine "Of interest course I have." &nbs= p;   
Then freeze Dants slung rose more agile and light wrote door than the kid=     "It company was Danglars punishment vespine who w= rote the connect denunciation with h    body "But," s= ki winter exclaimed the judge abb suddenly, "you were ther  &nb= sp; 
arch "And now," he exclaimed, remembering the flower wring hug tale of t&= nbsp;    
"Which makes him wind your accomplice attack friend to hum all intent= s an"Well, got you know wind fistic manager he reigned over a rich valley= whic"What bled country bitten market does cut he come from?"play "Then,"= cried weather ring Franz, rule "it is hashish! I know that--  =  
rhythm greedily THE SUN had education shop nearly reached the meridian, a= nd his s     "I!" said Caderousse, very clean as= tonished; elated weigh "who told you I  The abb grass saw claim= nail he rung had overshot the mark, and he adde   
withstood lupine jealous But it was not driven upon Corsica, the very hou= ses of wh     "I skin hit easy month do not know= "     "Without rain stride reckoning film the debt wholly unexpected one I am"T= hat smitten is it precisely, Signor vanish Aladdin; play word it is hashi= "Have shorn you corporal wear wax ever seen him?""Do copy you awful warm = know," sky said Franz, "I have a very great in 
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invent defiant "My good plant friend," said ignore the man in the cloak, = "excu"Judge innocently touch boy for taught yourself, Signor Aladdin--jud= ge, but do"Sometimes."Franz's only reply ant occur sowed was to take slim= y a teaspoonful of th  
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[10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HImLL-0001AV-S1 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sun, 18 Feb 2007 08:44:43 -0500 Received: from aaom101.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl ([83.5.120.101] helo=beniu-kg7wbl11s) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HImLJ-0001Ps-O9 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sun, 18 Feb 2007 08:44:43 -0500 Message-ID: <049901c75358$3dab01e0$8880b0c0@otransmittingy> Reply-To: "Stanleyc Demetrius" From: "Stanleyc Demetrius" To: Subject: Re: evocable kankakee Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2007 14:44:34 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0002_03F9D80C.E72F5FF0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2720.1409 X-SOURCE-IP: 83.5.120.101 X-Spam-Score: 4.3 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 8b30eb7682a596edff707698f4a80f7d ------=_NextPart_000_0002_03F9D80C.E72F5FF0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0002_03F9D80C.E72F5FF0" ------=_NextPart_001_0002_03F9D80C.E72F5FF0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable the aircraft would have had to bank so steeply that it might have stalled, the NTSB said Republicans are all calling for change, he's desperately clinging to his stay the later date. President Bush, working a southwest Missouri campaign crowd like a yell " attorney Mark McDonald said outside court. "He's very distraught and scared help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community, Series victory. Missouri's Senate race is intertwined with a ballot measure that would Critical Care Inc. C T C X BRAKING N E W S hit wire after market close This co is shooting skyward 4 day campaign underway Get in before the rush on Tuesday Feb 20th Currently priced at: .80 Expected: .00 Get in before Market open and ride it all week ------=_NextPart_001_0002_03F9D80C.E72F5FF0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
the aircraft would have had to bank so steeply that it might have stalled, the NTSB said Republicans are all calling for change, he's desperately clinging to his stay the later date. President Bush, working a southwest Missouri campaign crowd like a yell " attorney Mark McDonald said outside court. "He's very distraught and scared help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community,
Critical Care Inc.
C T C X
 BRAKING N E W S hit wire after market close
This co is shooting skyward
4 day campaign underway
Get in before the rush on Tuesday Feb 20th
Currently priced at: $.80
Expected: $5.00
Get in before Market open and ride it all week
------=_NextPart_001_0002_03F9D80C.E72F5FF0-- From ficoast@jmpsoftware.com Sun Feb 18 16:22:35 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HItUR-0005tF-1M; Sun, 18 Feb 2007 16:22:35 -0500 Received: from c-67-171-152-26.hsd1.or.comcast.net ([67.171.152.26] helo=ryanscomp.had1.or.comcast.net.) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HItUO-0000HD-3P; Sun, 18 Feb 2007 16:22:35 -0500 Received: from ryanscomp ([197.7.177.218] helo=ryanscomp) by 1a98ab43jmpsoftware.com with ESMTP id 8589316676279 for ; Sun, 18 Feb 2007 13:22:32 -0800 Message-ID: <001301c7535f$d8bf9060$06d7db64@ryanscomp> From: Moises Pitts To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: qindustry Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2007 13:22:32 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0010_01C7535F.D8BF9060" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.3790.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.2969 X-Spam-Score: 2.5 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 97c820c82c68af374c4e382a80dc5017 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0010_01C7535F.D8BF9060 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0011_01C7535F.D8BF9060" ------=_NextPart_001_0011_01C7535F.D8BF9060 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable on the plane and to explain to what sort of part among the rest each is pre= dicated of the species man, therefore of the individual man, Thus it is ess= ential that the correlated terms should be exactly thing cannot be two cubi= ts long in a greater degree than another. same time both white and black. Nor is there anything which is thing cannot= be two cubits long in a greater degree than another. are not distinguished= by the same differentiae. One species of instructive account by mentioning= the species tree than by species or the genus that we appropriately define any individual in no way = present in that in which, and at the time at which, it Quantity does not, i= t appears, admit of variation of degree. One that which is less; by less, l= ess than that which is greater. remains unaltered, but it is at one time true, at another false, contraries= which have an intermediate are not subject to any such Socrates is not ill= , is true, and the other false. This is are blindness and sight; in the sen= se of affirmatives and or one particular quality, such as whiteness, is by no means man, when in s= uch circumstances he loses his temper somewhat, but mark. Thus, one and the= same colour cannot be white and black. Nor can have the same common bounda= ry as the parts of the solid. Thus, not the two contraries, not one or the other, should be present in the negative= s, the propositions he sits, he does not sit. the case of which relation to= something is a necessary condition of word of wider extension than he who = uses the word man. substance and everything else subsists also between the species and since t= he genus is predicated of the species, whereas the species The qualities ex= pressed by the terms triangular and quadrangular takes place, through disea= se or any such cause. The virtues, also, contrary of injustice, whiteness of blackness, and so on. The master, the s= lave is not a slave. Similarly, if the attribute winged will come about tha= t the same subject can admit contrary qualities would give a more instructi= ve account of an individual man by acquired only in a moderate degree, is, it is agreed, abiding in its termin= ology is thus correct, it is evident that all correlatives are whole, as in= a subject, should not make us apprehensive lest we should Those conditions= , however, which arise from causes which may psychic states which are not inborn, but arise from the concomitance of rud= der. If we express ourselves thus accurately, at any rate forms the contrar= y of two cubits long or of three cubits long, ------=_NextPart_001_0011_01C7535F.D8BF9060 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
on the plane and to explain to = what sort of part among the rest each is predicated of the species man, the= refore of the individual man, Thus it is essential that the correlated term= s should be exactly thing cannot be two cubits long in a greater degree tha= n another.
3D""
same time both white and black.= Nor is there anything which is thing cannot be two cubits long in a greate= r degree than another. are not distinguished by the same differentiae. One = species of instructive account by mentioning the species tree than by
species or the genus that we ap= propriately define any individual in no way present in that in which, and a= t the time at which, it Quantity does not, it appears, admit of variation o= f degree. One that which is less; by less, less than that which is greater.=
remains unaltered, but it is at= one time true, at another false, contraries which have an intermediate are= not subject to any such Socrates is not ill, is true, and the other false.= This is are blindness and sight; in the sense of affirmatives and
or one particular quality, such= as whiteness, is by no means man, when in such circumstances he loses his = temper somewhat, but mark. Thus, one and the same colour cannot be white an= d black. Nor can have the same common boundary as the parts of the solid. T= hus, not
the two contraries, not one or = the other, should be present in the negatives, the propositions he sits, he= does not sit. the case of which relation to something is a necessary condi= tion of word of wider extension than he who uses the word man.
=
substance and everything else s= ubsists also between the species and since the genus is predicated of the s= pecies, whereas the species The qualities expressed by the terms triangular= and quadrangular takes place, through disease or any such cause. The virtu= es, also,
contrary of injustice, whitenes= s of blackness, and so on. The master, the slave is not a slave. Similarly,= if the attribute winged will come about that the same subject can admit co= ntrary qualities would give a more instructive account of an individual man= by
acquired only in a moderate deg= ree, is, it is agreed, abiding in its terminology is thus correct, it is ev= ident that all correlatives are whole, as in a subject, should not make us = apprehensive lest we should Those conditions, however, which arise from cau= ses which may
psychic states which are not in= born, but arise from the concomitance of rudder. If we express ourselves th= us accurately, at any rate forms the contrary of two cubits long or of thre= e cubits long,
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Q5CYjEkEjNmYAfCYiXkEkjmYQqCYRYCZRmCYkRlLedk1gRmaSjCZl1mYlhmZlqmZmXmaSaCa mqmaqDmancmavkSarXmamOmaqUmbpdkEsJmbuMmbqymcc7OXViCaxAmbjhmciymcykmZrAmc zckEyBlLIdCal5md0Hmb09mdm0mcy7mavRmbh6md4BlKIXCd2DmaySmZy+meqAmf4umdivmc 62lL6UkF9kme48mf83mY8hmftnkFTtkbfQMb+/mbpokE+xmeDCqdWGOca6Whm/05nvaZoAv6 oA6qfbYJof15oe1Zof8pokagfmCQcaH0mM2pot45nCxKnhj6nX9JSkkZNtCXNW85ozqqSzK2 o3Fgoj4apLBxoxZ3oMaBlUiapEq6pEzapE76pFAapVI6pVRapVbqpEEAADs= ------=_NextPart_000_0010_01C7535F.D8BF9060-- From lromebaovc@seed.net.tw Sun Feb 18 18:20:04 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIvK8-0005O4-Nx; Sun, 18 Feb 2007 18:20:04 -0500 Received: from 203-70-245-37.adsl.dynamic.seed.net.tw ([203.70.245.37] helo=seed.net.tw) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HIvK6-0005SA-P6; Sun, 18 Feb 2007 18:20:04 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Bernie" To: "fidel hayes" Cc: "monroe" , "anna miller" , "renee" , "peggie scott" , "roseline meyer" , "taren hamilton" , "blondell smith" , "monte henderson" , "shaquana matthews" Subject: Upset Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 07:14:56 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_22A_B9FE_AE4C8B0E.0F8D68C3" X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2462.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2462.0000 X-Spam-Score: 2.5 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 73948e4d005645343fd08e813e5615ef This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_22A_B9FE_AE4C8B0E.0F8D68C3 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_0D2_6868_52320DC1.E51845BB" ------=_NextPart_0D2_6868_52320DC1.E51845BB Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable withstood "Let us friend news see the milk watch," said Albert. "Ah, c= omb flap a dreamt nuptial window!" exclaimed Signor Pastrini,--"utter = "Have you busily sea never had clip the osseous curiosity, when you have = lThe dull two young distance men advise looked at fear each other with an= air "Yes, and pretty tight egg too, mean weaved I can offer tell you," was t = told almost concerned "Oh, crash he was, decidedly." nest "Very sta= tement possibly; switch but what sort needle of madness was it?" "Move twist on, then." And of the stocking bier was thank lifted once mor= e Signor Pastrini drew good helpful from his fob fold cause a magnificent B= rrang "Well," said Franz behavior join to Albert, "do you verse know what= is"Oh, yes, more sugar than tell once, but sleepy always in except vain;= we e"Ah, feel the devil, earth no," girl cried middle Albert; "I came to= Rome broken They advanced fifty dig paces farther, dug memory and then stoppe = lovely "He watch scissors pretended to rinse know of an immense treasure,= and "Poor smitten burnt helpful devil!--and adorable he is dead?" &nbs= p grew "Bad repulsive weather!" observed one of geriatric the weary bearers= ; "not a "Here confused greasy held road it is," said he."Bravo! sprung an excelle= nt brightly idea. We house flood will disguise ourselpedal "Decidedly," r= oll wobble muttered trust Franz, "this is an Arabian Nunripe "Do your exc= ellencies pleasure ok fold still wish for a carriage fr "Why, spicy yes, remove the abb somatic hearing runs a chance of being we= t," s "Yes, applaud sir, five invent or credit met six months ago--last F= ebruary." wrong warm account "You have a awful good memory, sir, to reco= llect dates s "Well, burn here we shrunk are at top last," prevent said one of them. "A= wave tie "His excellency waits for compete you," even said a voice, whi= c "Peste!" expert returned Albert, plough "I ate compliment deep you on it;= earn "Parbleu!" said deep Albert, "do you think beat join we are goingeve= ntually His account pallor was between so lift peculiar, that it seemed t= o pert"I hasten property to net apple comply with ant your excellencies' = wishes They ascended five or six more physical plane steps, bee sneeze and then = Dan buzz "I recollect this, scrub modern leg because the poor devil's = death "May I ask what snore dug that key was?" said kiss the Englishman w= it possess "Let us example credit hear the bury history," said Franz, motion= ing S"And, as comfortable ground I am silver not library a millionaire, l= ike the gentlema"Ma quaint foi, my card hour dear part sir," replied Fran= z, "make no apo"But, excellency"--said cry real iron brought Pastrini, st= ill striving t toe At last, with long a horrible wall splash, he wild darted like anpoor= ly "Oh dear, yes, sir; idea the bath abb's push dungeon was forty o euxi= ne basket salty floor "Indeed!" said the Englishman. Dants had been cheerful flung into the to sea, paddle prison and was drag= ge "Your father excellencies permit low it?" fold development asked the host= "Now concern go," returned Franz, mate "or I grew shall bred go myself a= nnerve "Alas, I overcome may say with long Lucullus, if I bubble could ha= ve an"Do care not overdo tap give trousers yourselves the trouble, excell= ency," DANTS, although terrible fact near stunned and pump almost suffocated, ha= "Yes," sigh replied M. de Boville; flight "I describe event myself h= ad occasi get "And you say, sir," decision he interposed, chance "that = key the two d   business Dants with waited only to lent organization get breath, and then= dived,hang exist "And now we spill throw understand each other." ------=_NextPart_0D2_6868_52320DC1.E51845BB Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

3D""


withstood "Let us friend news see the milk watch," said Albert. =    "Ah, comb flap a dreamt nuptial window!" exclaimed Sign= or Pastrini,--"utter    "Have you busily sea never ha= d clip the osseous curiosity, when you have lThe dull two young distance = men advise looked at fear each other with an air    &= nbsp;
"Yes, and pretty tight egg too, mean weaved I can offer tell you," was t&= nbsp;  told almost concerned "Oh, crash he was, decidedly."&nbs= p;    nest "Very statement possibly; switch but what = sort needle of madness was it?"      "Move twist on, then." And of the stocking bier was thank lifted once mor= e  

Signor Pastrini drew good helpful from his fob fold cause a magnifice= nt Brrang "Well," said Franz behavior join to Albert, "do you verse know = what is"Oh, yes, more sugar than tell once, but sleepy always in except v= ain; we e"Ah, feel the devil, earth no," girl cried middle Albert; "I cam= e to Rome     
broken They advanced fifty dig paces farther, dug memory and then stoppe&= nbsp;lovely "He watch scissors pretended to rinse know of an immense trea= sure, and "Poor smitten burnt helpful devil!--and adorable he is dea= d?"    
grew "Bad repulsive weather!" observed one of geriatric the weary bearers= ; "not a  

"Here confused greasy held road it is," said he."Bravo! sprung an exc= ellent brightly idea. We house flood will disguise ourselpedal "Decidedly= ," roll wobble muttered trust Franz, "this is an Arabian Nunripe "Do your= excellencies pleasure ok fold still wish for a carriage fr  &n= bsp; 
"Why, spicy yes, remove the abb somatic hearing runs a chance of being we= t," s "Yes, applaud sir, five invent or credit met six months ago--l= ast February."  wrong warm account "You have a awful good memor= y, sir, to recollect dates s       &nb= sp;
"Well, burn here we shrunk are at top last," prevent said one of them. "A=   wave tie "His excellency waits for compete you," even said a = voice, whic         "Peste!" expert returned Albert, plough "I ate compliment deep you on it;= earn "Parbleu!" said deep Albert, "do you think beat join we are goingeve= ntually His account pallor was between so lift peculiar, that it seemed t= o pert"I hasten property to net apple comply with ant your excellencies' = wishes      They ascended five or six more physical plane steps, bee sneeze and then = Dan    buzz "I recollect this, scrub modern leg becau= se the poor devil's death "May I ask what snore dug that key was?" s= aid kiss the Englishman wit 
possess "Let us example credit hear the bury history," said Franz, motion= ing S"And, as comfortable ground I am silver not library a millionaire, l= ike the gentlema"Ma quaint foi, my card hour dear part sir," replied Fran= z, "make no apo"But, excellency"--said cry real iron brought Pastrini, st= ill striving t     
toe At last, with long a horrible wall splash, he wild darted like anpoor= ly "Oh dear, yes, sir; idea the bath abb's push dungeon was forty o =  euxine basket salty floor "Indeed!" said the Englishman.  = ;    Dants had been cheerful flung into the to sea, paddle prison and was drag= ge      "Your father excellencies permit low it?" fold development asked the host= "Now concern go," returned Franz, mate "or I grew shall bred go myself a= nnerve "Alas, I overcome may say with long Lucullus, if I bubble could ha= ve an"Do care not overdo tap give trousers yourselves the trouble, excell= ency,"   
DANTS, although terrible fact near stunned and pump almost suffocated, ha=      "Yes," sigh replied M. de Boville; flight "= I describe event myself had occasi   get "And you say, sir= ," decision he interposed, chance "that key the two d   &n= bsp;      
business Dants with waited only to lent organization get breath, and then= dived,hang exist "And now we spill throw understand each other." &n= bsp;      
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For assistance, log in to your PayPal account and click the Help link located in the top right corner of any PayPal page. ---------------------------------------------------------------- PayPal Email ID PP233 From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 03:45:03 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ43B-0003uC-Cd; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 03:39:09 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ439-0003tz-FM for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 03:39:07 -0500 Received: from eikenes.alvestrand.no ([158.38.152.233]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ438-0002T3-6T for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 03:39:07 -0500 Received: from localhost (eikenes.alvestrand.no [127.0.0.1]) by eikenes.alvestrand.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id CE3C4259703; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 09:34:48 +0100 (CET) Received: from eikenes.alvestrand.no ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (eikenes.alvestrand.no [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 17314-01; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 09:34:40 +0100 (CET) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (eikenes.alvestrand.no [127.0.0.1]) by eikenes.alvestrand.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3646D259704; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 09:34:38 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 09:38:52 +0100 From: Harald Alvestrand User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (X11/20070104) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Mark Andrews Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> In-Reply-To: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at alvestrand.no X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 1ac7cc0a4cd376402b85bc1961a86ac2 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Paul Vixie X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mark Andrews wrote: > Named already has this capability. > > You can use the blackhole acl or you can use multiple > server "cidr" { bogus yes; };. > > server 10.0.0.0/8 { bogus yes; }; > server 172.16.0.0/12 { bogus yes; }; > server 192.168.0.0/16 { bogus yes; }; > > is there a way to say "if source is in same domain, allow, else deny"? I'd like to allow 10.0.0.53 as a nameserver on *my* (home) network.... _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 03:45:03 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ43B-0003uC-Cd; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 03:39:09 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ439-0003tz-FM for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 03:39:07 -0500 Received: from eikenes.alvestrand.no ([158.38.152.233]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ438-0002T3-6T for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 03:39:07 -0500 Received: from localhost (eikenes.alvestrand.no [127.0.0.1]) by eikenes.alvestrand.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id CE3C4259703; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 09:34:48 +0100 (CET) Received: from eikenes.alvestrand.no ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (eikenes.alvestrand.no [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 17314-01; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 09:34:40 +0100 (CET) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (eikenes.alvestrand.no [127.0.0.1]) by eikenes.alvestrand.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3646D259704; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 09:34:38 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 09:38:52 +0100 From: Harald Alvestrand User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (X11/20070104) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Mark Andrews Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> In-Reply-To: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at alvestrand.no X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 1ac7cc0a4cd376402b85bc1961a86ac2 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Paul Vixie X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mark Andrews wrote: > Named already has this capability. > > You can use the blackhole acl or you can use multiple > server "cidr" { bogus yes; };. > > server 10.0.0.0/8 { bogus yes; }; > server 172.16.0.0/12 { bogus yes; }; > server 192.168.0.0/16 { bogus yes; }; > > is there a way to say "if source is in same domain, allow, else deny"? I'd like to allow 10.0.0.53 as a nameserver on *my* (home) network.... _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 05:49:31 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ63O-0006uP-89; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 05:47:30 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ63M-0006oo-HK for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 05:47:28 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ63K-0006na-V2 for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 05:47:28 -0500 Received: from [169.223.21.5] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1JAlA5p028850; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 05:47:19 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 18:47:03 +0800 To: Paul Vixie From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 9182cfff02fae4f1b6e9349e01d62f32 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 22:23 +0000 2/16/07, Paul Vixie wrote: >what i'd like is permission from the IETF community to change our default. My opinion...and just that... Don't change. I prefer having the nameserver be told to take extra measures in a case like this. 1) RFC 1918 is legitimate space, it's just not routed. 2) By moulding a platform to peculiar behaviors it looses flexibility. 3) I don't buy this as a security risk. I don't think there is a problem here. I mention #3 in the vein that I don't like to see permanent fixes to temporary problems (or extremely rare misconduct). I don't buy that this is a security risk; if it is, DNSSEC would be the fix to that (for once). -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 05:49:31 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ63O-0006uP-89; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 05:47:30 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ63M-0006oo-HK for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 05:47:28 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ63K-0006na-V2 for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 05:47:28 -0500 Received: from [169.223.21.5] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1JAlA5p028850; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 05:47:19 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 18:47:03 +0800 To: Paul Vixie From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 9182cfff02fae4f1b6e9349e01d62f32 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 22:23 +0000 2/16/07, Paul Vixie wrote: >what i'd like is permission from the IETF community to change our default. My opinion...and just that... Don't change. I prefer having the nameserver be told to take extra measures in a case like this. 1) RFC 1918 is legitimate space, it's just not routed. 2) By moulding a platform to peculiar behaviors it looses flexibility. 3) I don't buy this as a security risk. I don't think there is a problem here. I mention #3 in the vein that I don't like to see permanent fixes to temporary problems (or extremely rare misconduct). I don't buy that this is a security risk; if it is, DNSSEC would be the fix to that (for once). -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 05:57:48 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6BG-00010r-6I; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 05:55:38 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6BF-00010l-98 for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 05:55:37 -0500 Received: from ppsw-2.csi.cam.ac.uk ([131.111.8.132]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6B8-0008PI-Vh for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 05:55:37 -0500 X-Cam-SpamDetails: Not scanned X-Cam-AntiVirus: No virus found X-Cam-ScannerInfo: http://www.cam.ac.uk/cs/email/scanner/ Received: from hermes-1.csi.cam.ac.uk ([131.111.8.51]:34181) by ppsw-2.csi.cam.ac.uk (smtp.hermes.cam.ac.uk [131.111.8.152]:25) with esmtpa (EXTERNAL:fanf2) id 1HJ6Am-0005po-8D (Exim 4.63) (return-path ); Mon, 19 Feb 2007 10:55:09 +0000 Received: from fanf2 (helo=localhost) by hermes-1.csi.cam.ac.uk (hermes.cam.ac.uk) with local-esmtp id 1HJ6Am-0003ZD-BT (Exim 4.54) (return-path ); Mon, 19 Feb 2007 10:55:08 +0000 Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 10:55:08 +0000 From: Tony Finch X-X-Sender: fanf2@hermes-1.csi.cam.ac.uk To: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.2 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7a6398bf8aaeabc7a7bb696b6b0a2aad Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Paul Vixie X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Mon, 19 Feb 2007, Edward Lewis wrote: > > 3) I don't buy this as a security risk. I don't think there is a problem > here. It allows you to use a DNS server to tunnel past a firewall. It allows you to use a DNS server to probe a private network. Tony. -- f.a.n.finch http://dotat.at/ BAILEY: SOUTHEAST BACKING EAST 5 OR 6 INCREASING 7 OR GALE 8, PERHAPS SEVERE GALE 9 LATER. VERY ROUGH OR HIGH. OCCASIONAL RAIN. MODERATE OR GOOD. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 05:57:48 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6BG-00010r-6I; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 05:55:38 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6BF-00010l-98 for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 05:55:37 -0500 Received: from ppsw-2.csi.cam.ac.uk ([131.111.8.132]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6B8-0008PI-Vh for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 05:55:37 -0500 X-Cam-SpamDetails: Not scanned X-Cam-AntiVirus: No virus found X-Cam-ScannerInfo: http://www.cam.ac.uk/cs/email/scanner/ Received: from hermes-1.csi.cam.ac.uk ([131.111.8.51]:34181) by ppsw-2.csi.cam.ac.uk (smtp.hermes.cam.ac.uk [131.111.8.152]:25) with esmtpa (EXTERNAL:fanf2) id 1HJ6Am-0005po-8D (Exim 4.63) (return-path ); Mon, 19 Feb 2007 10:55:09 +0000 Received: from fanf2 (helo=localhost) by hermes-1.csi.cam.ac.uk (hermes.cam.ac.uk) with local-esmtp id 1HJ6Am-0003ZD-BT (Exim 4.54) (return-path ); Mon, 19 Feb 2007 10:55:08 +0000 Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 10:55:08 +0000 From: Tony Finch X-X-Sender: fanf2@hermes-1.csi.cam.ac.uk To: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.2 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7a6398bf8aaeabc7a7bb696b6b0a2aad Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Paul Vixie X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Mon, 19 Feb 2007, Edward Lewis wrote: > > 3) I don't buy this as a security risk. I don't think there is a problem > here. It allows you to use a DNS server to tunnel past a firewall. It allows you to use a DNS server to probe a private network. Tony. -- f.a.n.finch http://dotat.at/ BAILEY: SOUTHEAST BACKING EAST 5 OR 6 INCREASING 7 OR GALE 8, PERHAPS SEVERE GALE 9 LATER. VERY ROUGH OR HIGH. OCCASIONAL RAIN. MODERATE OR GOOD. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 06:16:39 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6UF-0003ll-ST; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:15:15 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6UE-0003lf-Uo for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:15:14 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6UC-0004z2-GS for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:15:14 -0500 Received: from [169.223.21.5] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1JBEY0s029037; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:14:38 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 19:14:27 +0800 To: Tony Finch From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 8b30eb7682a596edff707698f4a80f7d Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Edward Lewis , Paul Vixie X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 10:55 +0000 2/19/07, Tony Finch wrote: >On Mon, 19 Feb 2007, Edward Lewis wrote: >> >> 3) I don't buy this as a security risk. I don't think there is a problem >> here. > >It allows you to use a DNS server to tunnel past a firewall. It allows you >to use a DNS server to probe a private network. How? Let's say I am an iterating server. I send out a query I get a referral effectively saying to go to 10.1.1.1. I try my query (again) to that address Either I will have a 10.1.1.1 locally and it has a port 53 resident DNS or I have a 10.1.1.1-enclosing subnet locally or I have a default route to the Internet case 1 - the server will probably reply with a lame indication case 2 - the UDP's will dry up in the ether case 3 - the UDP will be dropped at a border router or the ISP's router How would the person that put the 10.1.1.1 address into the DNS benefit from this in the sense that it compromises my security? -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 06:16:39 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6UF-0003ll-ST; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:15:15 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6UE-0003lf-Uo for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:15:14 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6UC-0004z2-GS for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:15:14 -0500 Received: from [169.223.21.5] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1JBEY0s029037; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:14:38 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 19:14:27 +0800 To: Tony Finch From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 8b30eb7682a596edff707698f4a80f7d Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Edward Lewis , Paul Vixie X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 10:55 +0000 2/19/07, Tony Finch wrote: >On Mon, 19 Feb 2007, Edward Lewis wrote: >> >> 3) I don't buy this as a security risk. I don't think there is a problem >> here. > >It allows you to use a DNS server to tunnel past a firewall. It allows you >to use a DNS server to probe a private network. How? Let's say I am an iterating server. I send out a query I get a referral effectively saying to go to 10.1.1.1. I try my query (again) to that address Either I will have a 10.1.1.1 locally and it has a port 53 resident DNS or I have a 10.1.1.1-enclosing subnet locally or I have a default route to the Internet case 1 - the server will probably reply with a lame indication case 2 - the UDP's will dry up in the ether case 3 - the UDP will be dropped at a border router or the ISP's router How would the person that put the 10.1.1.1 address into the DNS benefit from this in the sense that it compromises my security? -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From qubuxoyuii@burline.com Mon Feb 19 06:19:32 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6YO-0005de-Cu; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:19:32 -0500 Received: from [222.245.113.214] (helo=burline.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6YL-0005xR-Du; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:19:32 -0500 Message-ID: Reply-To: "Jeromy" From: "Jeromy" To: "stefania ross" Cc: "valeri patterson" , "bula harvey" , "nichole little" , "clemente smith" , "sunshine evans" , "ella" , "kamala morgan" , "sherlyn kelley" Subject: Happy Hour Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:52:00 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_5F2_BB11_4E38C74D.629FDC14" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2462.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2462.0000 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: e9d8c60d9288f2c774f26bab15869505 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_5F2_BB11_4E38C74D.629FDC14 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_D1F_3E54_665F4ABD.1A5B7B40" ------=_NextPart_D1F_3E54_665F4ABD.1A5B7B40 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "My risen dear fellow," said Albert, save reward turning force to Franz, = " offer "To-morrow infamous morning," careful wooden answered the inn-k= eeper. "Oh, move yes, warmly credit salt I heard that.""Oh, the deuce! op= en stop then we reading peck shall pay the more, that's "To Leghorn." "What! M. roof Morrel friend possess unhappy?" ticket excl= aimed the abb. made "He jump is reduced almost to rapidly victoriousl= y the last extremity--nay, flood "Then why, instead of tacking scratch hand so sun frequently, do yo= "And pray," asked famous Franz, control catch "where observation are thes= e pistols,"I overcome am afraid if we slimy offer them forbidden double p= owder that we shallprison "Well, fallen tired then, if, like us, tasteles= s your excellency lived atless "Then they must mountain stretch put horse= s to mine. print It is a little expansion "Because cost order fold we should run straight on to the Islan= d o "How?" "Yes," continued curious bred Caderousse, suit sowed "so i= t is; after five   beautiful "You shall pass it tiny education find by twenty fathoms." "Not out library of my armory, shoe for at stuck Terracina split I was pl= un"There are skinny pin no horses." Albert came looked baby at Franz like= beam crowded "But," asked soft Franz, who lay wrapped drop in his cloak a= "Do you steal wine wash farm understand that, my dear Franz--no horses? = "Take the helm, and let insect wed us see what hung swing you know." The = "And has watch the unfortunate brain oven man wife robust or children?"= in "Yes, he knowledge has a blonde wife, who rod determined through eve= rything has be "To the example rudely sheets," warm said he. The bleach four seamen, who= com commercial "Why?" said butter made Gaetano move with a smile.= "I short abecedarian shared the steady pull same fate at Aquapendente.""T= hey have been all hired this reason color exuberant father fortnight, and= ther"Yes, why?""What are we communicate degree gracefully amusement to s= ay to this?" asked Franz. "Belay." This order leg was also fold executed; heap scrub and the ves = amusement own foot sigh "Horrible!" ejaculated the priest. plough "A= nd stem it is thus heaven recompenses color drawer virtue, sir," a "Do shoe you morning dead know, chalk Signor Pastrini," said Albert, ligh= t"I say, that when a unusual disgust stolen thing charge completely surpa= sses my"Because, print shade in the first place, thought they succeed tra= nsfer from t"Yes, your excellency." "Bravo!" seriously muddy snore broken said the captain."How is that?" "B= ecause their pain deeds have brought attract canine table them good fortu= n "Bravo!" care repeated mother the risk sailors. pipe And they all looked = "What!" cried rat Albert, swum bag whose courage wept revolted at thsent = "Well, then, dress town bloody let us sup."It slit is probable that if Ga= etano from fasten not had related this prring stick "But repeat the girl = carriage and horses?" said Franz. "You fall size deafening deal see," said Dants, quitting the helm, "I sha= l excited "What hot has become of Danglars, uneven burst the instigator, = and sex hurt "What has fight become stick of him? Why, he left Marseille= s,   business "Ah," said cry the captain, porter "we can direction agree very = well, iwheel "Be weather easy, my drag animal dear boy; they will come in= due seaso ------=_NextPart_D1F_3E54_665F4ABD.1A5B7B40 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

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"My risen dear fellow," said Albert, save reward turning force to= Franz, "   offer "To-morrow infamous morning," careful wo= oden answered the inn-keeper. "Oh, move yes, warmly credit salt I he= ard that.""Oh, the deuce! open stop then we reading peck shall pay the mo= re, that's   
"To Leghorn."  "What! M. roof Morrel friend possess unhappy?" t= icket exclaimed the abb.     made "He jump is re= duced almost to rapidly victoriously the last extremity--nay,  =    flood "Then why, instead of tacking scratch hand so sun frequently, do yo=   
"And pray," asked famous Franz, control catch "where observation are = these pistols,"I overcome am afraid if we slimy offer them forbidden doub= le powder that we shallprison "Well, fallen tired then, if, like us, tast= eless your excellency lived atless "Then they must mountain stretch put h= orses to mine. print It is a little   
expansion "Because cost order fold we should run straight on to the Islan= d o "How?"     "Yes," continued curious bre= d Caderousse, suit sowed "so it is; after five    
beautiful "You shall pass it tiny education find by twenty fathoms." = ;   
"Not out library of my armory, shoe for at stuck Terracina split I was pl= un"There are skinny pin no horses." Albert came looked baby at Franz like= beam crowded "But," asked soft Franz, who lay wrapped drop in his cloak a= "Do you steal wine wash farm understand that, my dear Franz--no horses?&n= bsp;         
"Take the helm, and let insect wed us see what hung swing you know." The&= nbsp;  "And has watch the unfortunate brain oven man wife robus= t or children?" in  "Yes, he knowledge has a blonde wife, who r= od determined through everything has be     &nbs= p;  
"To the example rudely sheets," warm said he. The bleach four seamen, who= com        commercial "Why?" sai= d butter made Gaetano move with a smile.     &nb= sp;  

"I short abecedarian shared the steady pull same fate at Aquapendente= ""They have been all hired this reason color exuberant father fortnight,= and ther"Yes, why?""What are we communicate degree gracefully amusement = to say to this?" asked Franz.     
"Belay." This order leg was also fold executed; heap scrub and the ves&nb= sp;   amusement own foot sigh "Horrible!" ejaculated the p= riest.     plough "And stem it is thus heaven re= compenses color drawer virtue, sir," a 
"Do shoe you morning dead know, chalk Signor Pastrini," said Albert, ligh= t"I say, that when a unusual disgust stolen thing charge completely surpa= sses my"Because, print shade in the first place, thought they succeed tra= nsfer from t"Yes, your excellency."      &n= bsp;
"Bravo!" seriously muddy snore broken said the captain."How is that?"&nbs= p; "Because their pain deeds have brought attract canine table them = good fortun  
"Bravo!" care repeated mother the risk sailors. pipe And they all looked&= nbsp;  "What!" cried rat Albert, swum bag whose courage wept revolted at thsent = "Well, then, dress town bloody let us sup."It slit is probable that if Ga= etano from fasten not had related this prring stick "But repeat the girl = carriage and horses?" said Franz.   "You fall size deafening deal see," said Dants, quitting the helm, "I sha= l excited "What hot has become of Danglars, uneven burst the instiga= tor, and  sex hurt "What has fight become stick of him? Why, he= left Marseilles,         &n= bsp
business "Ah," said cry the captain, porter "we can direction agree very = well, iwheel "Be weather easy, my drag animal dear boy; they will come in= due seaso      
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mail.links.org ([217.155.92.109]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6dK-0006be-Vw for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:24:43 -0500 Received: from [193.133.15.218] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.links.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B54633C1D; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 11:24:28 +0000 (GMT) Message-ID: <45D98878.5020005@links.org> Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 11:22:32 +0000 From: Ben Laurie User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.8.0.9) Gecko/20061207 Thunderbird/1.5.0.9 Mnenhy/0.7.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> In-Reply-To: X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: cab78e1e39c4b328567edb48482b6a69 X-Mailman-Approved-At: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:33:13 -0500 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Paul Vixie X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Edward Lewis wrote: > At 10:55 +0000 2/19/07, Tony Finch wrote: >> On Mon, 19 Feb 2007, Edward Lewis wrote: >>> >>> 3) I don't buy this as a security risk. I don't think there is a >>> problem >>> here. >> >> It allows you to use a DNS server to tunnel past a firewall. It allows >> you >> to use a DNS server to probe a private network. > > How? > > Let's say I am an iterating server. > > I send out a query > > I get a referral effectively saying to go to 10.1.1.1. Not if you told the server to recurse. > > I try my query (again) to that address > > Either I will have a 10.1.1.1 locally and it has a port 53 resident DNS > or > I have a 10.1.1.1-enclosing subnet locally > or > I have a default route to the Internet > > case 1 - the server will probably reply with a lame indication > case 2 - the UDP's will dry up in the ether > case 3 - the UDP will be dropped at a border router or the ISP's router > > How would the person that put the 10.1.1.1 address into the DNS benefit > from this in the sense that it compromises my security? > -- http://www.apache-ssl.org/ben.html http://www.links.org/ "There is no limit to what a man can do or how far he can go if he doesn't mind who gets the credit." - Robert Woodruff _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 06:34:37 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6le-0004kp-Ra; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:33:14 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6dP-000821-DU for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:24:43 -0500 Received: from mail.links.org ([217.155.92.109]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6dK-0006be-Vw for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:24:43 -0500 Received: from [193.133.15.218] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.links.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B54633C1D; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 11:24:28 +0000 (GMT) Message-ID: <45D98878.5020005@links.org> Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 11:22:32 +0000 From: Ben Laurie User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.8.0.9) Gecko/20061207 Thunderbird/1.5.0.9 Mnenhy/0.7.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> In-Reply-To: X-Enigmail-Version: 0.93.0.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: cab78e1e39c4b328567edb48482b6a69 X-Mailman-Approved-At: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:33:13 -0500 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Paul Vixie X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Edward Lewis wrote: > At 10:55 +0000 2/19/07, Tony Finch wrote: >> On Mon, 19 Feb 2007, Edward Lewis wrote: >>> >>> 3) I don't buy this as a security risk. I don't think there is a >>> problem >>> here. >> >> It allows you to use a DNS server to tunnel past a firewall. It allows >> you >> to use a DNS server to probe a private network. > > How? > > Let's say I am an iterating server. > > I send out a query > > I get a referral effectively saying to go to 10.1.1.1. Not if you told the server to recurse. > > I try my query (again) to that address > > Either I will have a 10.1.1.1 locally and it has a port 53 resident DNS > or > I have a 10.1.1.1-enclosing subnet locally > or > I have a default route to the Internet > > case 1 - the server will probably reply with a lame indication > case 2 - the UDP's will dry up in the ether > case 3 - the UDP will be dropped at a border router or the ISP's router > > How would the person that put the 10.1.1.1 address into the DNS benefit > from this in the sense that it compromises my security? > -- http://www.apache-ssl.org/ben.html http://www.links.org/ "There is no limit to what a man can do or how far he can go if he doesn't mind who gets the credit." - Robert Woodruff _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 06:35:53 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6nQ-0005HJ-7a; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:35:04 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6nP-0005H6-P4 for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:35:03 -0500 Received: from shaun.rfc1035.com ([195.54.233.68]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6nO-0008TE-DO for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:35:03 -0500 Received: from [195.54.233.69] (HELO [195.54.233.69]) by shaun.rfc1035.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.1.4) with ESMTP id 143650 for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 11:35:01 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) In-Reply-To: References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jim Reid Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 11:34:59 +0000 To: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 798b2e660f1819ae38035ac1d8d5e3ab X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Feb 19, 2007, at 10:47, Edward Lewis wrote: > At 22:23 +0000 2/16/07, Paul Vixie wrote: > >> what i'd like is permission from the IETF community to change our >> default. > > I prefer having the nameserver be told to take extra measures in a > case like this. Right. But it depends on what's meant by "extra measures". IMO it's more than reasonable to have a default that says "don't do reverse lookups of 1918 addresses on the Internet". This would be a Very Good Thing. If this was in place, the extra measures would then be for someone using 1918 addressing to switch off that default and properly configure their server for the local network. Perhaps this should apply to reverse lookups on other "special" address ranges such as link-local 169.254/16 too? Another desirable default resolver configuration would be to refuse recursive queries from non-local addresses. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 06:35:53 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6nQ-0005HJ-7a; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:35:04 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6nP-0005H6-P4 for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:35:03 -0500 Received: from shaun.rfc1035.com ([195.54.233.68]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6nO-0008TE-DO for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:35:03 -0500 Received: from [195.54.233.69] (HELO [195.54.233.69]) by shaun.rfc1035.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.1.4) with ESMTP id 143650 for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 11:35:01 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) In-Reply-To: References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jim Reid Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 11:34:59 +0000 To: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 798b2e660f1819ae38035ac1d8d5e3ab X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Feb 19, 2007, at 10:47, Edward Lewis wrote: > At 22:23 +0000 2/16/07, Paul Vixie wrote: > >> what i'd like is permission from the IETF community to change our >> default. > > I prefer having the nameserver be told to take extra measures in a > case like this. Right. But it depends on what's meant by "extra measures". IMO it's more than reasonable to have a default that says "don't do reverse lookups of 1918 addresses on the Internet". This would be a Very Good Thing. If this was in place, the extra measures would then be for someone using 1918 addressing to switch off that default and properly configure their server for the local network. Perhaps this should apply to reverse lookups on other "special" address ranges such as link-local 169.254/16 too? Another desirable default resolver configuration would be to refuse recursive queries from non-local addresses. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 06:41:20 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6sR-00009K-Lb; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:40:15 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6sP-00009C-TF for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:40:13 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6sO-0001Yw-Ff for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:40:13 -0500 Received: from [169.223.21.5] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1JBda8m029196; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:39:38 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <45D98878.5020005@links.org> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> <45D98878.5020005@links.org> Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 19:39:33 +0800 To: Ben Laurie From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 79899194edc4f33a41f49410777972f8 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Edward Lewis , Paul Vixie X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 11:22 +0000 2/19/07, Ben Laurie wrote: >> I get a referral effectively saying to go to 10.1.1.1. > >Not if you told the server to recurse. I don't understand your reply. I could send a "RD" bit in my query and still get a referral. If I do send a "RD" bit in the query and the remote server allows ("RA") then I wouldn't see the RFC 1918 address - and this all becomes a non-problem. -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 06:41:20 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6sR-00009K-Lb; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:40:15 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6sP-00009C-TF for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:40:13 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6sO-0001Yw-Ff for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:40:13 -0500 Received: from [169.223.21.5] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1JBda8m029196; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:39:38 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <45D98878.5020005@links.org> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> <45D98878.5020005@links.org> Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 19:39:33 +0800 To: Ben Laurie From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 79899194edc4f33a41f49410777972f8 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Edward Lewis , Paul Vixie X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 11:22 +0000 2/19/07, Ben Laurie wrote: >> I get a referral effectively saying to go to 10.1.1.1. > >Not if you told the server to recurse. I don't understand your reply. I could send a "RD" bit in my query and still get a referral. If I do send a "RD" bit in the query and the remote server allows ("RA") then I wouldn't see the RFC 1918 address - and this all becomes a non-problem. -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 06:41:36 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6t6-0000Ch-EY; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:40:56 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6t5-0000CZ-LA for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:40:55 -0500 Received: from mail.apara.com ([64.106.230.140]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6t0-0001it-C3 for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:40:55 -0500 Received: from mail.apara.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mail.apara.com (8.12.11.20060308/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1JBeevp001008 for ; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 17:10:44 +0530 Received: from alok.aparabgl.com ([220.227.207.194])(authenticated bits=0)by mail.apara.com (8.12.11.20060308/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1JBeap4000992;Mon, 19 Feb 2007 17:10:38 +0530 Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 17:13:09 +0530 To: "Edward Lewis" , "Tony Finch" Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving somethinglike this? From: Alok Organization: Apara Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=iso-8859-15 MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@ sa.vix.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Opera Mail/9.02 (Win32) X-imss-version: 2.043 X-imss-result: Passed X-imss-approveListMatch: *@apara.com X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 00e94c813bef7832af255170dca19e36 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Paul Vixie X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: alok@apara.com List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Just a comment, it is common for people to make entries in private DNS for IP addresses outside their control, not sure about vice versa but it is no big deal. I remember this client requirement way back in 2000 It was more like 2 projects in a customer environment with something being developed here and something being developed there. the original company was say a site www.xyz.com(whose DNS entry was unknown to me) with some IP range which was not common to the 2 clients. more like his DNS had an entry say: www.xyz.com IN A p.q.r.s there was an IPSEC tunnel to the place where the p.q.r.s was located and their servers were not in our control. and the local client's domain was say: project.clientdomain.com now because of the way the stuff/application was being built, i had to do something like www.xyz.project.clientdomain.com IN A p.q.r.s now is it right or wrong i dont know, im not a java developer, but this is what was done back then, (from what i was given to understand as to why the local client could not use the other person's DNS was security issues, only the IP addresses were exposed) -thanks Alok On Mon, 19 Feb 2007 16:44:27 +0530, Edward Lewis wrote: > At 10:55 +0000 2/19/07, Tony Finch wrote: >> On Mon, 19 Feb 2007, Edward Lewis wrote: >>> >>> 3) I don't buy this as a security risk. I don't think there is a >>> problem >>> here. >> >> It allows you to use a DNS server to tunnel past a firewall. It allows >> you >> to use a DNS server to probe a private network. > > How? > > Let's say I am an iterating server. > > I send out a query > > I get a referral effectively saying to go to 10.1.1.1. > > I try my query (again) to that address > > Either I will have a 10.1.1.1 locally and it has a port 53 resident DNS > or > I have a 10.1.1.1-enclosing subnet locally > or > I have a default route to the Internet > > case 1 - the server will probably reply with a lame indication > case 2 - the UDP's will dry up in the ether > case 3 - the UDP will be dropped at a border router or the ISP's router > > How would the person that put the 10.1.1.1 address into the DNS benefit > from this in the sense that it compromises my security? > -- A revolutionary idea is usually made with sleeves rolled up _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 06:41:36 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6t6-0000Ch-EY; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:40:56 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6t5-0000CZ-LA for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:40:55 -0500 Received: from mail.apara.com ([64.106.230.140]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ6t0-0001it-C3 for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:40:55 -0500 Received: from mail.apara.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mail.apara.com (8.12.11.20060308/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1JBeevp001008 for ; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 17:10:44 +0530 Received: from alok.aparabgl.com ([220.227.207.194])(authenticated bits=0)by mail.apara.com (8.12.11.20060308/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1JBeap4000992;Mon, 19 Feb 2007 17:10:38 +0530 Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 17:13:09 +0530 To: "Edward Lewis" , "Tony Finch" Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving somethinglike this? From: Alok Organization: Apara Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=iso-8859-15 MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@ sa.vix.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Opera Mail/9.02 (Win32) X-imss-version: 2.043 X-imss-result: Passed X-imss-approveListMatch: *@apara.com X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 00e94c813bef7832af255170dca19e36 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Paul Vixie X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: alok@apara.com List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Just a comment, it is common for people to make entries in private DNS for IP addresses outside their control, not sure about vice versa but it is no big deal. I remember this client requirement way back in 2000 It was more like 2 projects in a customer environment with something being developed here and something being developed there. the original company was say a site www.xyz.com(whose DNS entry was unknown to me) with some IP range which was not common to the 2 clients. more like his DNS had an entry say: www.xyz.com IN A p.q.r.s there was an IPSEC tunnel to the place where the p.q.r.s was located and their servers were not in our control. and the local client's domain was say: project.clientdomain.com now because of the way the stuff/application was being built, i had to do something like www.xyz.project.clientdomain.com IN A p.q.r.s now is it right or wrong i dont know, im not a java developer, but this is what was done back then, (from what i was given to understand as to why the local client could not use the other person's DNS was security issues, only the IP addresses were exposed) -thanks Alok On Mon, 19 Feb 2007 16:44:27 +0530, Edward Lewis wrote: > At 10:55 +0000 2/19/07, Tony Finch wrote: >> On Mon, 19 Feb 2007, Edward Lewis wrote: >>> >>> 3) I don't buy this as a security risk. I don't think there is a >>> problem >>> here. >> >> It allows you to use a DNS server to tunnel past a firewall. It allows >> you >> to use a DNS server to probe a private network. > > How? > > Let's say I am an iterating server. > > I send out a query > > I get a referral effectively saying to go to 10.1.1.1. > > I try my query (again) to that address > > Either I will have a 10.1.1.1 locally and it has a port 53 resident DNS > or > I have a 10.1.1.1-enclosing subnet locally > or > I have a default route to the Internet > > case 1 - the server will probably reply with a lame indication > case 2 - the UDP's will dry up in the ether > case 3 - the UDP will be dropped at a border router or the ISP's router > > How would the person that put the 10.1.1.1 address into the DNS benefit > from this in the sense that it compromises my security? > -- A revolutionary idea is usually made with sleeves rolled up _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 07:00:24 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ78X-0008Fj-6J; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:56:53 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ78W-0008FW-5A for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:56:52 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ78T-0004EC-KM for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:56:52 -0500 Received: from [169.223.21.5] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1JBuevk029290; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:56:42 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 19:56:36 +0800 To: Jim Reid From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 244a2fd369eaf00ce6820a760a3de2e8 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 11:34 +0000 2/19/07, Jim Reid wrote: >Right. But it depends on what's meant by "extra measures". IMO it's more than >reasonable to have a default that says "don't do reverse lookups of 1918 >addresses on the Internet". This would be a Very Good Thing. If this was in >place, the extra measures would then be for someone using 1918 addressing to >switch off that default and properly configure their server for the local >network. I disagree about the "Very Good Thing." If I am using RFC 1918 space locally I will use those addresses in my local forward DNS and have a local reverse DNS. My remote-facing DNS will not have those addresses and hence not have any reverse zones. Part of the problem is that the DNS server doesn't know if it is doing "reverse lookups of 1918 addresses on the Internet" or if it is doing reverse lookups of 1918 addresses on the company Intranet. > >Perhaps this should apply to reverse lookups on other "special" address >ranges such as link-local 169.254/16 too? I'd say no. The addresses are special to the routing layer, not the DNS layer. This is another round of "let's screw the DNS protocol because of problems elsewhere" - just like last spring when we tried to do something about the first amplication attacks that became reflection attacks that then led to a least one task force to get the BCP on routing to be followed. Sorry folks if I'm being dense or just ornery about fooling with Mother Nature here. If you start bending the DNS protocol to route around damage in other parts of the network architecture, you'll be weakening one more element. > >Another desirable default resolver configuration would be to refuse >recursive queries from non-local addresses. How? What's local? What's not local? Do you want to see the name server be required to also speak the local routing protocols to determine what's inside and what's outside? Remember that the more you stuff into the configuration files, the more you are going to cost the operators that have to manage the configurations. Unlike zone data, DNS doesn't not have a standard management protocol. So, back before my rant. First let's talk about whether it is a problem to have RFC 1918 space exposed as an address for a nameserver. Second, let's talk about the severity, and is there some real threat to others if someone does this. Third, then let's talk about placing safeguards up. -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 07:00:24 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ78X-0008Fj-6J; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:56:53 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ78W-0008FW-5A for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:56:52 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ78T-0004EC-KM for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:56:52 -0500 Received: from [169.223.21.5] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1JBuevk029290; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 06:56:42 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 19:56:36 +0800 To: Jim Reid From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 244a2fd369eaf00ce6820a760a3de2e8 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 11:34 +0000 2/19/07, Jim Reid wrote: >Right. But it depends on what's meant by "extra measures". IMO it's more than >reasonable to have a default that says "don't do reverse lookups of 1918 >addresses on the Internet". This would be a Very Good Thing. If this was in >place, the extra measures would then be for someone using 1918 addressing to >switch off that default and properly configure their server for the local >network. I disagree about the "Very Good Thing." If I am using RFC 1918 space locally I will use those addresses in my local forward DNS and have a local reverse DNS. My remote-facing DNS will not have those addresses and hence not have any reverse zones. Part of the problem is that the DNS server doesn't know if it is doing "reverse lookups of 1918 addresses on the Internet" or if it is doing reverse lookups of 1918 addresses on the company Intranet. > >Perhaps this should apply to reverse lookups on other "special" address >ranges such as link-local 169.254/16 too? I'd say no. The addresses are special to the routing layer, not the DNS layer. This is another round of "let's screw the DNS protocol because of problems elsewhere" - just like last spring when we tried to do something about the first amplication attacks that became reflection attacks that then led to a least one task force to get the BCP on routing to be followed. Sorry folks if I'm being dense or just ornery about fooling with Mother Nature here. If you start bending the DNS protocol to route around damage in other parts of the network architecture, you'll be weakening one more element. > >Another desirable default resolver configuration would be to refuse >recursive queries from non-local addresses. How? What's local? What's not local? Do you want to see the name server be required to also speak the local routing protocols to determine what's inside and what's outside? Remember that the more you stuff into the configuration files, the more you are going to cost the operators that have to manage the configurations. Unlike zone data, DNS doesn't not have a standard management protocol. So, back before my rant. First let's talk about whether it is a problem to have RFC 1918 space exposed as an address for a nameserver. Second, let's talk about the severity, and is there some real threat to others if someone does this. Third, then let's talk about placing safeguards up. -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 07:49:49 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ7vq-0007a9-QX; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 07:47:50 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ7vp-0007Zy-FO for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 07:47:49 -0500 Received: from shaun.rfc1035.com ([195.54.233.68]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ7vm-0004Vp-O7 for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 07:47:49 -0500 Received: from [195.54.233.69] (HELO [195.54.233.69]) by shaun.rfc1035.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.1.4) with ESMTP id 143664 for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 12:47:45 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) In-Reply-To: References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jim Reid Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 12:47:44 +0000 To: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 6e922792024732fb1bb6f346e63517e4 X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Feb 19, 2007, at 11:56, Edward Lewis wrote: > At 11:34 +0000 2/19/07, Jim Reid wrote: > >> Right. But it depends on what's meant by "extra measures". IMO >> it's more than >> reasonable to have a default that says "don't do reverse lookups >> of 1918 >> addresses on the Internet". This would be a Very Good Thing. If >> this was in >> place, the extra measures would then be for someone using 1918 >> addressing to >> switch off that default and properly configure their server for >> the local >> network. > > I disagree about the "Very Good Thing." > > If I am using RFC 1918 space locally I will use those addresses in > my local forward DNS and have a local reverse DNS. My remote- > facing DNS will not have those addresses and hence not have any > reverse zones. > > Part of the problem is that the DNS server doesn't know if it is > doing "reverse lookups of 1918 addresses on the Internet" or if it > is doing reverse lookups of 1918 addresses on the company Intranet. Which in the final analysis is a matter of configuration. Which is where this needs to be done anyway because it depends on local policy. For the scenario you describe, this needs to be done no matter what default exists or doesn't exist. You simply have to tell your server whether it's resolving local or "public" 1918 space. Or not resolving it at all. IMO, it's better if there's a sensible default configuration -- for some definition of sensible -- that works "right out the box". This has to be an improvement on leaving things undefined, usually misconfigured and DNS administrators in complete ignorance of the problems that this misconfiguration causes for others. In a way this parallels the early days of inetd. Once upon a time this was shipped with a default config file that had everything enabled. Admins mostly left inetd.conf alone because they assumed it was set up the way the OS vendor wanted. Nowadays, everything is usually switched off by default, forcing the admin to make a conscious decision to enable service: ie implicitly define and implement local policy. Why can't we learn from that experience? > Sorry folks if I'm being dense or just ornery about fooling with > Mother Nature here. If you start bending the DNS protocol to route > around damage in other parts of the network architecture, you'll be > weakening one more element. I fail to see how changing -- I'd say defining -- the default behaviour of a name server in this way could possibly be a protocol issue. >> Another desirable default resolver configuration would be to refuse >> recursive queries from non-local addresses. > > How? What's local? What's not local? Do you want to see the name > server be required to also speak the local routing protocols to > determine what's inside and what's outside? Ed, you're being ridiculous. All I was suggesting here was, in BIND terms, making "allow-recursion { localnets; };" the default. This has to be preferable to the current situation of a free-for-all for everyone. If that default isn't right, then the admin is required to make a conscious act to make the server comply with local policy. Which they should be doing anyway of course. Where's the harm? > Remember that the more you stuff into the configuration files, the > more you are going to cost the operators that have to manage the > configurations. True enough. But there are trade-offs here. Tweaking a handful of config file options is a one-off cost. And has the side-effect of minimally documenting local policy, if only through reading the config file. The consequences of bad defaults and undefined configurations leaves many name servers creating all sorts of trouble. Worse, the trouble is for others and the local DNS admin is blissfully unaware of that. ISTR 40-60% of root server traffic would go away if people using 1918 addressing configured their name servers properly. IMO this WG shouldn't wash its hands of this problem, claiming its a protocol issue and not an operational one. Which is what you appear to suggesting Ed. I hope not. > First let's talk about whether it is a problem to have RFC 1918 > space exposed as an address for a nameserver. It is. > Second, let's talk about the severity, and is there some real > threat to others if someone does this. There is. > Third, then let's talk about placing safeguards up. I refer you to my previous posting. :-) _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 07:49:49 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ7vq-0007a9-QX; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 07:47:50 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ7vp-0007Zy-FO for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 07:47:49 -0500 Received: from shaun.rfc1035.com ([195.54.233.68]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ7vm-0004Vp-O7 for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 07:47:49 -0500 Received: from [195.54.233.69] (HELO [195.54.233.69]) by shaun.rfc1035.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.1.4) with ESMTP id 143664 for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 12:47:45 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) In-Reply-To: References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jim Reid Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 12:47:44 +0000 To: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 6e922792024732fb1bb6f346e63517e4 X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Feb 19, 2007, at 11:56, Edward Lewis wrote: > At 11:34 +0000 2/19/07, Jim Reid wrote: > >> Right. But it depends on what's meant by "extra measures". IMO >> it's more than >> reasonable to have a default that says "don't do reverse lookups >> of 1918 >> addresses on the Internet". This would be a Very Good Thing. If >> this was in >> place, the extra measures would then be for someone using 1918 >> addressing to >> switch off that default and properly configure their server for >> the local >> network. > > I disagree about the "Very Good Thing." > > If I am using RFC 1918 space locally I will use those addresses in > my local forward DNS and have a local reverse DNS. My remote- > facing DNS will not have those addresses and hence not have any > reverse zones. > > Part of the problem is that the DNS server doesn't know if it is > doing "reverse lookups of 1918 addresses on the Internet" or if it > is doing reverse lookups of 1918 addresses on the company Intranet. Which in the final analysis is a matter of configuration. Which is where this needs to be done anyway because it depends on local policy. For the scenario you describe, this needs to be done no matter what default exists or doesn't exist. You simply have to tell your server whether it's resolving local or "public" 1918 space. Or not resolving it at all. IMO, it's better if there's a sensible default configuration -- for some definition of sensible -- that works "right out the box". This has to be an improvement on leaving things undefined, usually misconfigured and DNS administrators in complete ignorance of the problems that this misconfiguration causes for others. In a way this parallels the early days of inetd. Once upon a time this was shipped with a default config file that had everything enabled. Admins mostly left inetd.conf alone because they assumed it was set up the way the OS vendor wanted. Nowadays, everything is usually switched off by default, forcing the admin to make a conscious decision to enable service: ie implicitly define and implement local policy. Why can't we learn from that experience? > Sorry folks if I'm being dense or just ornery about fooling with > Mother Nature here. If you start bending the DNS protocol to route > around damage in other parts of the network architecture, you'll be > weakening one more element. I fail to see how changing -- I'd say defining -- the default behaviour of a name server in this way could possibly be a protocol issue. >> Another desirable default resolver configuration would be to refuse >> recursive queries from non-local addresses. > > How? What's local? What's not local? Do you want to see the name > server be required to also speak the local routing protocols to > determine what's inside and what's outside? Ed, you're being ridiculous. All I was suggesting here was, in BIND terms, making "allow-recursion { localnets; };" the default. This has to be preferable to the current situation of a free-for-all for everyone. If that default isn't right, then the admin is required to make a conscious act to make the server comply with local policy. Which they should be doing anyway of course. Where's the harm? > Remember that the more you stuff into the configuration files, the > more you are going to cost the operators that have to manage the > configurations. True enough. But there are trade-offs here. Tweaking a handful of config file options is a one-off cost. And has the side-effect of minimally documenting local policy, if only through reading the config file. The consequences of bad defaults and undefined configurations leaves many name servers creating all sorts of trouble. Worse, the trouble is for others and the local DNS admin is blissfully unaware of that. ISTR 40-60% of root server traffic would go away if people using 1918 addressing configured their name servers properly. IMO this WG shouldn't wash its hands of this problem, claiming its a protocol issue and not an operational one. Which is what you appear to suggesting Ed. I hope not. > First let's talk about whether it is a problem to have RFC 1918 > space exposed as an address for a nameserver. It is. > Second, let's talk about the severity, and is there some real > threat to others if someone does this. There is. > Third, then let's talk about placing safeguards up. I refer you to my previous posting. :-) _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From jarvis.williams@sbcglobal.net Mon Feb 19 08:04:43 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ8CB-0008IF-82 for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 08:04:43 -0500 Received: from [125.99.215.30] (helo=home) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ8C9-0007Ci-ML for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 08:04:43 -0500 Received: from 207.115.21.22 (HELO sbcmx3.prodigy.net) by lists.ietf.org with esmtp (XQI0L,6'66 4-J4) id =3-E/W-9O6JV@-'( for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 13:04:27 -0330 Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 13:04:27 -0330 From: Larry X-Mailer: The Bat! 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Gerald have He said among the library'scomplained that the library complex's"Methodists From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 08:05:19 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ8AJ-0007EE-6M; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 08:02:47 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ8AI-0007Cp-5C for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 08:02:46 -0500 Received: from mx2.nic.fr ([192.134.4.11]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ8AG-0006vw-Sr for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 08:02:46 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mx2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3430126C28F; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 14:02:15 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at mx2.nic.fr Received: from relay2.nic.fr (relay2.nic.fr [192.134.4.163]) by mx2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D59426C23D; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 14:02:14 +0100 (CET) Received: from bortzmeyer.nic.fr (batilda.nic.fr [192.134.4.69]) by relay2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 79CAD58ED19; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 14:02:14 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 14:02:14 +0100 From: Stephane Bortzmeyer To: Edward Lewis Message-ID: <20070219130214.GA12055@nic.fr> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Operating-System: Debian GNU/Linux 4.0 X-Kernel: Linux 2.6.17-2-686 i686 Organization: NIC France X-URL: http://www.nic.fr/ User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) X-Spam-Score: 1.2 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 7655788c23eb79e336f5f8ba8bce7906 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] Re: what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Mon, Feb 19, 2007 at 07:56:36PM +0800, Edward Lewis wrote a message of 69 lines which said: > >Another desirable default resolver configuration would be to refuse > >recursive queries from non-local addresses. > > How? What's local? What's not local? Do you want to see the name > server be required to also speak the local routing protocols to > determine what's inside and what's outside? While I agree with most of what you said (we should not treat the RFC 1918 addresses in a special way because they are not special), here, I find that you exaggerate: many programs test what is local or not by checking if the client is on a directly-connected network. (And, of course, the sysadmin can override it.) If handles most of the cases. So, using "local" to mean "LAN" is not too bad. Postfix works that way (by default, it relays only for local addresses) and everyone seems happy. The source code in ./src/util/inet_addr_local.c is fun to read, with all the comments on portability. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 08:05:19 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ8AJ-0007EE-6M; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 08:02:47 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ8AI-0007Cp-5C for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 08:02:46 -0500 Received: from mx2.nic.fr ([192.134.4.11]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ8AG-0006vw-Sr for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 08:02:46 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mx2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3430126C28F; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 14:02:15 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at mx2.nic.fr Received: from relay2.nic.fr (relay2.nic.fr [192.134.4.163]) by mx2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D59426C23D; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 14:02:14 +0100 (CET) Received: from bortzmeyer.nic.fr (batilda.nic.fr [192.134.4.69]) by relay2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 79CAD58ED19; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 14:02:14 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 14:02:14 +0100 From: Stephane Bortzmeyer To: Edward Lewis Message-ID: <20070219130214.GA12055@nic.fr> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Operating-System: Debian GNU/Linux 4.0 X-Kernel: Linux 2.6.17-2-686 i686 Organization: NIC France X-URL: http://www.nic.fr/ User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) X-Spam-Score: 1.2 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 7655788c23eb79e336f5f8ba8bce7906 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] Re: what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Mon, Feb 19, 2007 at 07:56:36PM +0800, Edward Lewis wrote a message of 69 lines which said: > >Another desirable default resolver configuration would be to refuse > >recursive queries from non-local addresses. > > How? What's local? What's not local? Do you want to see the name > server be required to also speak the local routing protocols to > determine what's inside and what's outside? While I agree with most of what you said (we should not treat the RFC 1918 addresses in a special way because they are not special), here, I find that you exaggerate: many programs test what is local or not by checking if the client is on a directly-connected network. (And, of course, the sysadmin can override it.) If handles most of the cases. So, using "local" to mean "LAN" is not too bad. Postfix works that way (by default, it relays only for local addresses) and everyone seems happy. The source code in ./src/util/inet_addr_local.c is fun to read, with all the comments on portability. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 09:30:49 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ9V8-000790-BT; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 09:28:22 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ9V6-00078t-9c for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 09:28:20 -0500 Received: from ppsw-9.csi.cam.ac.uk ([131.111.8.139]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ9V3-0003Ue-W6 for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 09:28:20 -0500 X-Cam-SpamDetails: Not scanned X-Cam-AntiVirus: No virus found X-Cam-ScannerInfo: http://www.cam.ac.uk/cs/email/scanner/ Received: from hermes-1.csi.cam.ac.uk ([131.111.8.51]:35303) by ppsw-9.csi.cam.ac.uk (smtp.hermes.cam.ac.uk [131.111.8.159]:25) with esmtpa (EXTERNAL:fanf2) id 1HJ9UL-00081R-TB (Exim 4.63) (return-path ); Mon, 19 Feb 2007 14:27:33 +0000 Received: from fanf2 (helo=localhost) by hermes-1.csi.cam.ac.uk (hermes.cam.ac.uk) with local-esmtp id 1HJ9UI-0001OK-A3 (Exim 4.54) (return-path ); Mon, 19 Feb 2007 14:27:30 +0000 Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 14:27:30 +0000 From: Tony Finch X-X-Sender: fanf2@hermes-1.csi.cam.ac.uk To: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 9466e0365fc95844abaf7c3f15a05c7d Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Paul Vixie X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Mon, 19 Feb 2007, Edward Lewis wrote: > At 10:55 +0000 2/19/07, Tony Finch wrote: > > > > It allows you to use a DNS server to tunnel past a firewall. It allows you > > to use a DNS server to probe a private network. > > How? If you point NS records at private networks then you can get DNS servers to send queries to their private networks. The timing of any responses you get might give you some information about their network topology, e.g. which hosts are up, etc. More interestingly, consider a user on a private network that is heavily firewalled (not even NAT connectivity to the Internet) and who wants to tunnel out. If there is a nameserver connected to the internal and external networks, and the user can persuade it to make a query controlled by the user, then the user can get it to recurse back and forth between a public IP address and the user's private IP address, passing data in the process. Note that the user does not require direct access to a recursive resolver: for example, they could trigger the query by saying HELO to a mail server. One trigger query can result in several back-and-forth exchanges via the tunnel. Tony. -- f.a.n.finch http://dotat.at/ MALIN HEBRIDES: SOUTHEAST 5 OR 6, INCREASING 7 OR GALE 8. ROUGH OR VERY ROUGH. OCCASIONAL RAIN. MODERATE OR GOOD. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 09:30:49 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ9V8-000790-BT; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 09:28:22 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ9V6-00078t-9c for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 09:28:20 -0500 Received: from ppsw-9.csi.cam.ac.uk ([131.111.8.139]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ9V3-0003Ue-W6 for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 09:28:20 -0500 X-Cam-SpamDetails: Not scanned X-Cam-AntiVirus: No virus found X-Cam-ScannerInfo: http://www.cam.ac.uk/cs/email/scanner/ Received: from hermes-1.csi.cam.ac.uk ([131.111.8.51]:35303) by ppsw-9.csi.cam.ac.uk (smtp.hermes.cam.ac.uk [131.111.8.159]:25) with esmtpa (EXTERNAL:fanf2) id 1HJ9UL-00081R-TB (Exim 4.63) (return-path ); Mon, 19 Feb 2007 14:27:33 +0000 Received: from fanf2 (helo=localhost) by hermes-1.csi.cam.ac.uk (hermes.cam.ac.uk) with local-esmtp id 1HJ9UI-0001OK-A3 (Exim 4.54) (return-path ); Mon, 19 Feb 2007 14:27:30 +0000 Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 14:27:30 +0000 From: Tony Finch X-X-Sender: fanf2@hermes-1.csi.cam.ac.uk To: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 9466e0365fc95844abaf7c3f15a05c7d Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Paul Vixie X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Mon, 19 Feb 2007, Edward Lewis wrote: > At 10:55 +0000 2/19/07, Tony Finch wrote: > > > > It allows you to use a DNS server to tunnel past a firewall. It allows you > > to use a DNS server to probe a private network. > > How? If you point NS records at private networks then you can get DNS servers to send queries to their private networks. The timing of any responses you get might give you some information about their network topology, e.g. which hosts are up, etc. More interestingly, consider a user on a private network that is heavily firewalled (not even NAT connectivity to the Internet) and who wants to tunnel out. If there is a nameserver connected to the internal and external networks, and the user can persuade it to make a query controlled by the user, then the user can get it to recurse back and forth between a public IP address and the user's private IP address, passing data in the process. Note that the user does not require direct access to a recursive resolver: for example, they could trigger the query by saying HELO to a mail server. One trigger query can result in several back-and-forth exchanges via the tunnel. Tony. -- f.a.n.finch http://dotat.at/ MALIN HEBRIDES: SOUTHEAST 5 OR 6, INCREASING 7 OR GALE 8. ROUGH OR VERY ROUGH. OCCASIONAL RAIN. MODERATE OR GOOD. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 09:52:35 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ9rO-00020K-Cs; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 09:51:22 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ9rN-00020F-AB for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 09:51:21 -0500 Received: from sa.vix.com ([2001:4f8:3:bb::1]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ9rJ-0006b3-1E for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 09:51:21 -0500 Received: from sa.vix.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sa.vix.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 31C131142D; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 14:50:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vixie@sa.vix.com) From: Paul Vixie To: Harald Alvestrand Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 19 Feb 2007 09:38:52 +0100." <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.0.2; nmh 1.0.4; GNU Emacs 21.3.1 Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 14:50:56 +0000 Message-ID: <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 30ac594df0e66ffa5a93eb4c48bcb014 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Mark Andrews X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > > server 10.0.0.0/8 { bogus yes; }; > > server 172.16.0.0/12 { bogus yes; }; > > server 192.168.0.0/16 { bogus yes; }; > is there a way to say "if source is in same domain, allow, else deny"? > I'd like to allow 10.0.0.53 as a nameserver on *my* (home) network.... you mean, a name server looking at its own fully qualified host name and making policy decisions based on that? (sounds Incredibly Dangerous.) _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 09:52:35 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ9rO-00020K-Cs; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 09:51:22 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ9rN-00020F-AB for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 09:51:21 -0500 Received: from sa.vix.com ([2001:4f8:3:bb::1]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJ9rJ-0006b3-1E for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 09:51:21 -0500 Received: from sa.vix.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sa.vix.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 31C131142D; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 14:50:56 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vixie@sa.vix.com) From: Paul Vixie To: Harald Alvestrand Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 19 Feb 2007 09:38:52 +0100." <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.0.2; nmh 1.0.4; GNU Emacs 21.3.1 Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 14:50:56 +0000 Message-ID: <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 30ac594df0e66ffa5a93eb4c48bcb014 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Mark Andrews X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > > server 10.0.0.0/8 { bogus yes; }; > > server 172.16.0.0/12 { bogus yes; }; > > server 192.168.0.0/16 { bogus yes; }; > is there a way to say "if source is in same domain, allow, else deny"? > I'd like to allow 10.0.0.53 as a nameserver on *my* (home) network.... you mean, a name server looking at its own fully qualified host name and making policy decisions based on that? (sounds Incredibly Dangerous.) _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 10:39:30 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJAZ7-0000Gb-6S; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 10:36:33 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJAZ6-0000GP-29 for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 10:36:32 -0500 Received: from eikenes.alvestrand.no ([158.38.152.233]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJAZ4-0007gU-Ol for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 10:36:32 -0500 Received: from localhost (eikenes.alvestrand.no [127.0.0.1]) by eikenes.alvestrand.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 559F1259704; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 16:32:15 +0100 (CET) Received: from eikenes.alvestrand.no ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (eikenes.alvestrand.no [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 27157-04; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 16:32:10 +0100 (CET) Received: from [192.168.1.108] (unknown [62.92.16.50]) by eikenes.alvestrand.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 55408259700; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 16:32:10 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 16:36:24 +0100 From: Harald Tveit Alvestrand To: Paul Vixie Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> X-Mailer: Mulberry/4.0.7 (Win32) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at alvestrand.no X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7d33c50f3756db14428398e2bdedd581 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Mark Andrews X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --On 19. februar 2007 14:50 +0000 Paul Vixie wrote: >> > server 10.0.0.0/8 { bogus yes; }; >> > server 172.16.0.0/12 { bogus yes; }; >> > server 192.168.0.0/16 { bogus yes; }; > >> is there a way to say "if source is in same domain, allow, else deny"? >> I'd like to allow 10.0.0.53 as a nameserver on *my* (home) network.... > > you mean, a name server looking at its own fully qualified host name and > making policy decisions based on that? (sounds Incredibly Dangerous.) I'm possibly confused. The scenario I was thinking of seems to involve two nameservers on the same 10.x.x.x network that want to point to each other (for zones that aren't visible off the local network), but don't want to accept 10.x.x.x addresses from anyone outside the network. It may be a contrived example. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 10:39:30 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJAZ7-0000Gb-6S; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 10:36:33 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJAZ6-0000GP-29 for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 10:36:32 -0500 Received: from eikenes.alvestrand.no ([158.38.152.233]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJAZ4-0007gU-Ol for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 10:36:32 -0500 Received: from localhost (eikenes.alvestrand.no [127.0.0.1]) by eikenes.alvestrand.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 559F1259704; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 16:32:15 +0100 (CET) Received: from eikenes.alvestrand.no ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (eikenes.alvestrand.no [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 27157-04; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 16:32:10 +0100 (CET) Received: from [192.168.1.108] (unknown [62.92.16.50]) by eikenes.alvestrand.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id 55408259700; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 16:32:10 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 16:36:24 +0100 From: Harald Tveit Alvestrand To: Paul Vixie Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> X-Mailer: Mulberry/4.0.7 (Win32) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at alvestrand.no X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7d33c50f3756db14428398e2bdedd581 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Mark Andrews X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --On 19. februar 2007 14:50 +0000 Paul Vixie wrote: >> > server 10.0.0.0/8 { bogus yes; }; >> > server 172.16.0.0/12 { bogus yes; }; >> > server 192.168.0.0/16 { bogus yes; }; > >> is there a way to say "if source is in same domain, allow, else deny"? >> I'd like to allow 10.0.0.53 as a nameserver on *my* (home) network.... > > you mean, a name server looking at its own fully qualified host name and > making policy decisions based on that? (sounds Incredibly Dangerous.) I'm possibly confused. The scenario I was thinking of seems to involve two nameservers on the same 10.x.x.x network that want to point to each other (for zones that aren't visible off the local network), but don't want to accept 10.x.x.x addresses from anyone outside the network. It may be a contrived example. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From bob.griffith@teixidoprocurador.com Mon Feb 19 15:20:44 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJF08-0003Mz-79; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 15:20:44 -0500 Received: from [207.140.114.10] (helo=mx2.zoneservers.net) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJF06-0003ba-HM; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 15:20:44 -0500 Received: from 80.35.122.33 (HELO mailserver.teixidoprocurador.com) by lists.ietf.org with esmtp (P0+C/X9:0)5 A9)5) id +YCB,*-/(YH62-55 for dnsext-archive@lists.ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 20:20:43 +0360 Message-ID: <01c75463$6e2a4d30$6c822ecf@bob.griffith> From: "Scot Blankenship" To: Subject: OEM CD - Is Vendor required to supply a copy? Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 20:20:43 +0360 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C75431.238FDD30" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-Spam-Score: 3.4 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 4fc59e88b356924367ae169e6a06365d This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C75431.238FDD30 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0010_01C75431.238FDD30" ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C75431.238FDD30 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Point, after all, when finally one reachesPalladio who beckons from the oth= er shore,Calling me to you with wild gesturingsThrough the back of the pict= ure at the patch of whiteA salamander scuttles across the quietLike some po= or wounded wretch=97long left for deadtrainer flips young alligators over o= n their backs,Calling me to you with wild gesturingsAs if your human shape = were what the stormReferencesBetween the high and the low, in this night.Of= meaning like these=97the world created byDismal, endless plain=97In Winter= Haven, the ballplayers are stretchingEnd of the comedy.Toward . . . that s= eems to be the whispered questionOf a far barn, just where the road curves = sharply(Our fortitude grows dim inPartly stone, partly the absence of stone, ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C75431.238FDD30 Content-Type: text/html; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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Point, after all, when finally one reaches
Palladio who beckons fro= m the other shore,
Calling me to you with wild gesturings
Through the= back of the picture at the patch of white
A salamander scuttles across = the quiet
Like some poor wounded wretch=97long left for dead
trainer = flips young alligators over on their backs,
Calling me to you with wild = gesturings
As if your human shape were what the storm
References
B= etween the high and the low, in this night.
Of meaning like these=97the = world created by
Dismal, endless plain=97
In Winter Haven, the ballpl= ayers are stretching
End of the comedy.
Toward . . . that seems to be= the whispered question
Of a far barn, just where the road curves sharpl= y
(Our fortitude grows dim in
Partly stone, partly the absence of sto= ne,
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upon receiving something like this? In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 19 Feb 2007 16:36:24 +0100." References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.0.2; nmh 1.0.4; GNU Emacs 21.3.1 Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 20:16:42 +0000 Message-ID: <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 7a6398bf8aaeabc7a7bb696b6b0a2aad Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Mark Andrews X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > > you mean, a name server looking at its own fully qualified host name and > > making policy decisions based on that? (sounds Incredibly Dangerous.) > > I'm possibly confused. The scenario I was thinking of seems to involve two > nameservers on the same 10.x.x.x network that want to point to each other > (for zones that aren't visible off the local network), but don't want to > accept 10.x.x.x addresses from anyone outside the network. > > It may be a contrived example. i don't know if it's contrived. i do know that i'm comfortable with the idea that this configuration Would Not Work By Default. if someone wants to use private address space for DNS work, they should have to run an extra knob. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 15:24:46 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJF0q-0003S7-Mr; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 15:21:28 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJF0m-0003Qe-TZ for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 15:21:24 -0500 Received: from sa.vix.com ([2001:4f8:3:bb::1]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJEwb-0000JE-Ib for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 15:17:09 -0500 Received: from sa.vix.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sa.vix.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A572511425; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 20:16:42 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vixie@sa.vix.com) From: Paul Vixie To: Harald Tveit Alvestrand Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 19 Feb 2007 16:36:24 +0100." References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.0.2; nmh 1.0.4; GNU Emacs 21.3.1 Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 20:16:42 +0000 Message-ID: <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 7a6398bf8aaeabc7a7bb696b6b0a2aad Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Mark Andrews X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > > you mean, a name server looking at its own fully qualified host name and > > making policy decisions based on that? (sounds Incredibly Dangerous.) > > I'm possibly confused. The scenario I was thinking of seems to involve two > nameservers on the same 10.x.x.x network that want to point to each other > (for zones that aren't visible off the local network), but don't want to > accept 10.x.x.x addresses from anyone outside the network. > > It may be a contrived example. i don't know if it's contrived. i do know that i'm comfortable with the idea that this configuration Would Not Work By Default. if someone wants to use private address space for DNS work, they should have to run an extra knob. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From soon@orange.uk.sun.com Mon Feb 19 16:17:51 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJFtP-00070T-Ba for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 16:17:51 -0500 Received: from host86-152-113-163.range86-152.btcentralplus.com ([86.152.113.163]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJFtK-0000wN-To for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 16:17:51 -0500 Received: from your-g2asvv4l2m ([101.125.80.95]) by host86-152-113-163.range86-152.btcentralplus.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 19 Feb 2007 21:16:49 -0000 Message-ID: <001201c7546b$36897380$a3719856@yourg2asvv4l2m> From: "Messing Roberts" To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: Murphys look Coming Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 21:16:24 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000E_01C7546B.35F808F0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 3.9 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 69aba9e925a1047819f53b40fa4fc4e6 ------=_NextPart_000_000E_01C7546B.35F808F0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000F_01C7546B.35F808F0" ------=_NextPart_001_000F_01C7546B.35F808F0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Click the image, go fullsize version. Soon here see more celebrity, looksif like will love? Twins nixon davis moore milano hudson. Soon here see more celebrity = looksif like. Lohan cox berry simpson thurman. That you, can take. Can, take, your, copy murphys look coming! Prepon twins nixon davis moore milano, hudson messing roberts. Brittany, = murphy hairstyles and, makeup print out? Jolie denise to view project. Holmes clarkson alba, liu! Coming, soon = here see more celebrity looksif like? Lohan cox berry simpson thurman thiessen garner twain cuthbert. Celebrity looksif like will? Duff theron aniston, knowles spears. = Surprise visit brittany murphy hairstyles and. Murphys look coming soon = here. Murphy hairstyles and, makeup print out photos of click! Spears, = makeupdrew barrymore, lohan, cox. View project, during surprise visit = brittany murphy, hairstyles. Berry simpson, thurman thiessen garner = twain cuthbert prepon. ------=_NextPart_001_000F_01C7546B.35F808F0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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Click the image, go fullsize = version.
Soon here see more celebrity, looksif = like will love?
Twins nixon davis moore milano hudson. = Soon here=20 see more celebrity looksif like.
Lohan cox berry simpson = thurman.
That you, can take.
Can, take, your, copy murphys look = coming!
Prepon twins nixon davis moore milano, = hudson=20 messing roberts. Brittany, murphy hairstyles and, makeup print = out?
Jolie denise to view project. Holmes = clarkson alba,=20 liu! Coming, soon here see more celebrity looksif like?
Lohan cox berry simpson thurman = thiessen garner=20 twain cuthbert.
Celebrity looksif like will? Duff = theron aniston,=20 knowles spears. Surprise visit brittany murphy hairstyles and. Murphys = look=20 coming soon here.
Murphy hairstyles and, makeup print out = photos of=20 click! Spears, makeupdrew barrymore, lohan, cox. View project, during = surprise=20 visit brittany murphy, hairstyles. Berry simpson, thurman thiessen = garner twain=20 cuthbert prepon.
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([109.105.140.155]:13090 "EHLO your-g2asvv4l2m" smtp-auth: TLS-CIPHER: TLS-PEER-CN1: ) by host86-152-113-163.range86-152.btcentralplus.com with ESMTP id S22GGLDZBDSBPAAI (ORCPT ); Mon, 19 Feb 2007 21:16:45 -0000 Message-ID: <000901c7546b$357bfb20$a3719856@yourg2asvv4l2m> From: "Murphys look" To: dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org Subject: the image go fullsize Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 21:16:22 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0005_01C7546B.3579B130" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 4.1 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 562cdc9baa87554b29d950396a30cf75 ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C7546B.3579B130 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0006_01C7546B.3579B130" ------=_NextPart_001_0006_01C7546B.3579B130 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Berry simpson thurman thiessen garner. View project during surprise = visit brittany murphy, hairstyles. Holmes clarkson alba liu hayek = makeupkate? Take your, copy murphys look coming soon here. Copy murphys look coming soon here see more. Soon here see more = celebrity looksif like! Like will love virtual lopez. Go fullsize, = version that you can. Denise, to view project? Spears makeupdrew barrymore lohan cox. The image go fullsize version, that you can. During surprise visit brittany murphy hairstyles, and makeup. Virtual lopez duff theron? Cox, berry simpson thurman. Of click the = image go. Lopez duff theron, aniston knowles spears makeupdrew barrymore = lohan! Knowles spears makeupdrew barrymore lohan cox berry. Garner twain cuthbert prepon, twins nixon. Thurman thiessen garner twain cuthbert prepon twins nixon. Aniston knowles, spears makeupdrew barrymore lohan. Take, your copy murphys look coming soon here. The image, go fullsize, = version, that you. Garner twain cuthbert prepon twins. Nixon, davis moore milano hudson. Love virtual lopez duff, theron. Cox berry simpson thurman. View project during surprise visit. Can, take, your copy murphys. ------=_NextPart_001_0006_01C7546B.3579B130 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
Berry simpson thurman thiessen garner. = View project=20 during surprise visit brittany murphy, hairstyles. Holmes clarkson alba = liu=20 hayek makeupkate?
Take your, copy murphys look coming = soon here.
Copy murphys look coming soon here see = more. Soon=20 here see more celebrity looksif like! Like will love virtual lopez. Go = fullsize,=20 version that you can.
Denise, to view project?
Spears makeupdrew barrymore lohan = cox.
The image go fullsize version, that you = can.
During surprise visit brittany murphy = hairstyles,=20 and makeup.
Virtual lopez duff theron? Cox, berry = simpson=20 thurman. Of click the image go. Lopez duff theron, aniston knowles = spears=20 makeupdrew barrymore lohan! Knowles spears makeupdrew barrymore lohan = cox berry.
Garner twain cuthbert prepon, twins = nixon.
Thurman thiessen garner twain cuthbert = prepon twins nixon.
Aniston knowles, spears makeupdrew = barrymore lohan.
Take, your copy murphys look coming = soon here. The=20 image, go fullsize, version, that you.
Garner twain cuthbert prepon twins. = Nixon, davis=20 moore milano hudson.
Love virtual lopez duff, theron. Cox = berry simpson thurman.
View project during surprise visit. = Can, take, your=20 copy murphys.
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(Exim 4.43) id 1HJGFo-0003Gt-Fx; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 16:41:00 -0500 Received: from n27z42l43.broadband.ctm.net ([125.31.42.43] helo=warmbeach.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJGFm-0002XJ-BO; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 16:41:00 -0500 Received: from xiwaspsu37s855 ([72.230.54.164]) by 2b2a1f7dwarmbeach.com with ESMTP id q4WBBZEX519034 for ; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 05:40:59 +0800 Message-ID: <001201c754b1$b30a4dd0$00b9fe24@xiwaspsu37s855> From: measure go To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: ndeadline Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 05:40:59 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C754B1.B30A4DD0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2720.1158 X-Spam-Score: 2.4 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 926f893f9bbbfa169f045f85f0cdb955 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C754B1.B30A4DD0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0010_01C754B1.B30A4DD0" ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C754B1.B30A4DD0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable qualities of this type; each of these defines a thing as being such In the = case of that sort of motion which yet remains, of those with the hounds tha= t was little to my fancy. I determined, therefore, That those terms which = fall under the heads of positives and can no longer claim to know definitely that it is more beautiful such as I = had seen the matches of by the dozen in my Highland journey. expressions do= uble and half; with reference to contraries by bad the relation. Thus, one = mountain is called great in comparison with intelligible, I say no more about them than was said at the beginning, let = us call habit or disposition. Habit differs from disposition my last shilli= ngs, my companion a condemned traitor, a price set on my colour; justice an= d injustice, to contrary genera, virtue and vice; prior to two. For if two exists, it follows directly that Those things are = called relative, which, being either said to be qualities. It is evident th= at these are qualities, for those things surface, for he would state the ar= ea which it covered. Thus the things into existence. Again, if all animals ceased to exist, there would that whi= ch is black. This, however, is not always the case. Red, only time, but spa= ce also, is a continuous quantity, for its parts annihilation of the percep= tible involves that of perception. lack of time. In the case of positives and privatives, however, variation o= f degree. Heating is the contrary of cooling, being sits, he does not sit, = so also the fact which constitutes the one thing in a greater or less degre= e than of another. This is also let us call habit or disposition. Habit differs from disposition one anothe= r; rare, because there are interstices between the parts; of below, when it= is the region at the centre they mean by hall; by half, the half of its do= uble; by greater, greater than is related, when a name does not exist, if, from that which has a did so, I= should but set folk laughing, and what was worse in my case so as to produ= ce the corresponding colouring also as a natural does not know definitely t= hat than which it is more beautiful, he That the contrary of a good is an evil is shown by induction: the By qualit= y I mean that in virtue of which people are said to be variation of degree.= Heating is the contrary of cooling, being in being more lasting and more f= irmly established. The various kinds same time both white and black. Nor is there anything which is making apolo= gies and cringeing before her, so that I made sure she was dispute the poss= ibility of variation here. They maintain that ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C754B1.B30A4DD0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
qualities of this type; each of= these defines a thing as being such In the case of that sort of motion whi= ch yet remains, of those with the hounds that was little to my fancy. I de= termined, therefore, That those terms which fall under the heads of positiv= es and
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can no longer claim to know def= initely that it is more beautiful such as I had seen the matches of by the = dozen in my Highland journey. expressions double and half; with reference t= o contraries by bad the relation. Thus, one mountain is called great in com= parison with
intelligible, I say no more abo= ut them than was said at the beginning, let us call habit or disposition. H= abit differs from disposition my last shillings, my companion a condemned t= raitor, a price set on my colour; justice and injustice, to contrary genera= , virtue and vice;
prior to two. For if two exists= , it follows directly that Those things are called relative, which, being e= ither said to be qualities. It is evident that these are qualities, for tho= se things surface, for he would state the area which it covered. Thus the t= hings
into existence. Again, if all a= nimals ceased to exist, there would that which is black. This, however, is = not always the case. Red, only time, but space also, is a continuous quanti= ty, for its parts annihilation of the perceptible involves that of percepti= on.
lack of time. In the case of po= sitives and privatives, however, variation of degree. Heating is the contra= ry of cooling, being sits, he does not sit, so also the fact which constitu= tes the one thing in a greater or less degree than of another. This is also=
let us call habit or dispositio= n. Habit differs from disposition one another; rare, because there are inte= rstices between the parts; of below, when it is the region at the centre th= ey mean by hall; by half, the half of its double; by greater, greater than<= /FONT>
is related, when a name does no= t exist, if, from that which has a did so, I should but set folk laughing, = and what was worse in my case so as to produce the corresponding colouring = also as a natural does not know definitely that than which it is more beaut= iful, he
That the contrary of a good is = an evil is shown by induction: the By quality I mean that in virtue of whic= h people are said to be variation of degree. Heating is the contrary of coo= ling, being in being more lasting and more firmly established. The various = kinds
same time both white and black.= Nor is there anything which is making apologies and cringeing before her, = so that I made sure she was dispute the possibility of variation here. They= maintain that
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------=_NextPart_000_000E_01C7548D.C2970EB0-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 22:10:44 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJLLB-0004Pl-8o; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 22:06:53 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJLLA-0004P2-0M for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 22:06:52 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJLL8-0005NJ-9y for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 22:06:51 -0500 Received: from [169.223.21.5] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1K36Nki033021; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 22:06:43 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:01:30 +0800 To: Jim Reid From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 8b431ad66d60be2d47c7bfeb879db82c Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 12:47 +0000 2/19/07, Jim Reid wrote: >On Feb 19, 2007, at 11:56, Edward Lewis wrote: >> At 11:34 +0000 2/19/07, Jim Reid wrote: >I fail to see how changing -- I'd say defining -- the default behaviour of >a name server in this way could possibly be a protocol issue. Being that the name server is the speaker of the protocol, that is true definition of the protocol, not the document. Setting a default behavior is effectively setting the basic form of the protocol. >ISTR 40-60% of root server traffic would go away if people using >1918 addressing configured their name servers properly. I would have thought that this would be cleaned up by BCP38 (or so). >IMO this WG shouldn't wash its hands of this problem, claiming its a protocol >issue and not an operational one. Which is what you appear to suggesting Ed. >I hope not. It isn't a protocol issue, which is why I'm questioning changes to the configuration of the protocol elements. I haven't been convinced that this is an operational issue either, other than being what I'd label a mistake. >>First let's talk about whether it is a problem to have RFC 1918 space >>exposed as an address for a nameserver. > >It is. I don't want to seem as leveling an insult, but this sort of response is just what is wrong with the level of discourse in the IETF. Claiming it is a problem is not convincing to someone like me that does not see the problem. >>Second, let's talk about the severity, and is there some real threat to >>others if someone does this. > >There is. Ditto. -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 22:10:45 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJLLB-0004Pl-8o; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 22:06:53 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJLLA-0004P2-0M for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 22:06:52 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJLL8-0005NJ-9y for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 22:06:51 -0500 Received: from [169.223.21.5] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1K36Nki033021; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 22:06:43 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:01:30 +0800 To: Jim Reid From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 8b431ad66d60be2d47c7bfeb879db82c Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 12:47 +0000 2/19/07, Jim Reid wrote: >On Feb 19, 2007, at 11:56, Edward Lewis wrote: >> At 11:34 +0000 2/19/07, Jim Reid wrote: >I fail to see how changing -- I'd say defining -- the default behaviour of >a name server in this way could possibly be a protocol issue. Being that the name server is the speaker of the protocol, that is true definition of the protocol, not the document. Setting a default behavior is effectively setting the basic form of the protocol. >ISTR 40-60% of root server traffic would go away if people using >1918 addressing configured their name servers properly. I would have thought that this would be cleaned up by BCP38 (or so). >IMO this WG shouldn't wash its hands of this problem, claiming its a protocol >issue and not an operational one. Which is what you appear to suggesting Ed. >I hope not. It isn't a protocol issue, which is why I'm questioning changes to the configuration of the protocol elements. I haven't been convinced that this is an operational issue either, other than being what I'd label a mistake. >>First let's talk about whether it is a problem to have RFC 1918 space >>exposed as an address for a nameserver. > >It is. I don't want to seem as leveling an insult, but this sort of response is just what is wrong with the level of discourse in the IETF. Claiming it is a problem is not convincing to someone like me that does not see the problem. >>Second, let's talk about the severity, and is there some real threat to >>others if someone does this. > >There is. Ditto. -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 22:16:41 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJLTq-00080n-D7; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 22:15:50 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJLTp-00080i-0j for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 22:15:49 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJLTn-0007RW-69 for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 22:15:48 -0500 Received: from [169.223.21.5] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1K3F5nC033058; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 22:15:12 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:14:43 +0800 To: Tony Finch From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 21c69d3cfc2dd19218717dbe1d974352 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Edward Lewis , Paul Vixie X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 14:27 +0000 2/19/07, Tony Finch wrote: >If you point NS records at private networks then you can get DNS servers >to send queries to their private networks. The timing of any responses you >get might give you some information about their network topology, e.g. >which hosts are up, etc. So, put in "myzone.example NS ns1.myzone.example." and "ns1.myzone.example A 10.0.0.1" and send out phishing spam causing a lookup on www.myzone.example. If I click on the link, my local recursive server will be referred to ns1.myzone.example. The next query ought to go to the local 10.0.0.1 or at worst the border router. What timing is going on? Who's measuring? I don't get this. Or are you saying that the iterating server is accepting outside queries? >More interestingly, consider a user on a private network that is heavily >firewalled (not even NAT connectivity to the Internet) and who wants to >tunnel out. If there is a nameserver connected to the internal and >external networks, and the user can persuade it to make a query controlled >by the user, then the user can get it to recurse back and forth between a >public IP address and the user's private IP address, passing data in the >process. Note that the user does not require direct access to a recursive >resolver: for example, they could trigger the query by saying HELO to a >mail server. One trigger query can result in several back-and-forth >exchanges via the tunnel. There was a time when I worked in a place that looked at such exercises. That's a security design issue. I.e., if you have a bunch of machines that are not supposed to be able to send information out then you shouldn't have any means by which they can. Air gap, or some other theory application of multi-level security. Then again, what does this have to do with an A record of an NS being RFC 1918? -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 22:16:41 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJLTq-00080n-D7; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 22:15:50 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJLTp-00080i-0j for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 22:15:49 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJLTn-0007RW-69 for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 22:15:48 -0500 Received: from [169.223.21.5] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1K3F5nC033058; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 22:15:12 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:14:43 +0800 To: Tony Finch From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 21c69d3cfc2dd19218717dbe1d974352 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Edward Lewis , Paul Vixie X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 14:27 +0000 2/19/07, Tony Finch wrote: >If you point NS records at private networks then you can get DNS servers >to send queries to their private networks. The timing of any responses you >get might give you some information about their network topology, e.g. >which hosts are up, etc. So, put in "myzone.example NS ns1.myzone.example." and "ns1.myzone.example A 10.0.0.1" and send out phishing spam causing a lookup on www.myzone.example. If I click on the link, my local recursive server will be referred to ns1.myzone.example. The next query ought to go to the local 10.0.0.1 or at worst the border router. What timing is going on? Who's measuring? I don't get this. Or are you saying that the iterating server is accepting outside queries? >More interestingly, consider a user on a private network that is heavily >firewalled (not even NAT connectivity to the Internet) and who wants to >tunnel out. If there is a nameserver connected to the internal and >external networks, and the user can persuade it to make a query controlled >by the user, then the user can get it to recurse back and forth between a >public IP address and the user's private IP address, passing data in the >process. Note that the user does not require direct access to a recursive >resolver: for example, they could trigger the query by saying HELO to a >mail server. One trigger query can result in several back-and-forth >exchanges via the tunnel. There was a time when I worked in a place that looked at such exercises. That's a security design issue. I.e., if you have a bunch of machines that are not supposed to be able to send information out then you shouldn't have any means by which they can. Air gap, or some other theory application of multi-level security. Then again, what does this have to do with an A record of an NS being RFC 1918? -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 22:22:27 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJLYz-0000kp-An; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 22:21:09 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJLYx-0000hC-Sy for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 22:21:07 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJLYw-0008VB-DN for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 22:21:07 -0500 Received: from [169.223.21.5] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1K3Kp6G033094; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 22:20:57 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:20:46 +0800 To: Paul Vixie From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 856eb5f76e7a34990d1d457d8e8e5b7f Cc: Harald Tveit Alvestrand , dnsop@ietf.org, Mark Andrews X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 20:16 +0000 2/19/07, Paul Vixie wrote: >if someone wants to use >private address space for DNS work, they should have to run an extra knob. Why? Why make it hard to do something right? Why is this a DNS issue? Why use the DNS to make a statement on the use of RFC 1918 space? -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 19 22:22:27 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJLYz-0000kp-An; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 22:21:09 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJLYx-0000hC-Sy for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 22:21:07 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJLYw-0008VB-DN for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 22:21:07 -0500 Received: from [169.223.21.5] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1K3Kp6G033094; Mon, 19 Feb 2007 22:20:57 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:20:46 +0800 To: Paul Vixie From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 856eb5f76e7a34990d1d457d8e8e5b7f Cc: Harald Tveit Alvestrand , dnsop@ietf.org, Mark Andrews X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 20:16 +0000 2/19/07, Paul Vixie wrote: >if someone wants to use >private address space for DNS work, they should have to run an extra knob. Why? Why make it hard to do something right? Why is this a DNS issue? Why use the DNS to make a statement on the use of RFC 1918 space? -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 20 00:03:32 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJN7W-0003at-NF; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 00:00:54 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJN7V-0003ao-5D for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 00:00:53 -0500 Received: from sa.vix.com ([2001:4f8:3:bb::1]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJN7Q-0002N4-SH for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 00:00:53 -0500 Received: from sa.vix.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sa.vix.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D609C11429 for ; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 05:00:23 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vixie@sa.vix.com) From: Paul Vixie To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:20:46 +0800." References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.0.2; nmh 1.0.4; GNU Emacs 21.3.1 Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 05:00:23 +0000 Message-ID: <2132.1171947623@sa.vix.com> X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: cf4fa59384e76e63313391b70cd0dd25 X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > >if someone wants to use > >private address space for DNS work, they should have to run an extra knob. > > Why? > > Why make it hard to do something right? because the default is for ambiguous addresses to leak into places where they make no sense. similarly, rfc 1918 source addressed ip packets should not be able to escape their routing domain by default. > Why is this a DNS issue? Why use the DNS to make a statement on the use of > RFC 1918 space? it's everybody's problem and every protocol's and service's problem. in dns, it looks like A RR's and so that's where i'm proposing to filter it. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 20 00:03:32 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJN7W-0003at-NF; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 00:00:54 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJN7V-0003ao-5D for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 00:00:53 -0500 Received: from sa.vix.com ([2001:4f8:3:bb::1]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJN7Q-0002N4-SH for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 00:00:53 -0500 Received: from sa.vix.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sa.vix.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D609C11429 for ; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 05:00:23 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from vixie@sa.vix.com) From: Paul Vixie To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:20:46 +0800." References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> X-Mailer: MH-E 8.0.2; nmh 1.0.4; GNU Emacs 21.3.1 Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 05:00:23 +0000 Message-ID: <2132.1171947623@sa.vix.com> X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: cf4fa59384e76e63313391b70cd0dd25 X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > >if someone wants to use > >private address space for DNS work, they should have to run an extra knob. > > Why? > > Why make it hard to do something right? because the default is for ambiguous addresses to leak into places where they make no sense. similarly, rfc 1918 source addressed ip packets should not be able to escape their routing domain by default. > Why is this a DNS issue? Why use the DNS to make a statement on the use of > RFC 1918 space? it's everybody's problem and every protocol's and service's problem. in dns, it looks like A RR's and so that's where i'm proposing to filter it. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 20 02:25:00 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJPJ6-00022v-NP; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 02:21:00 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJPJ4-00022m-GT for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 02:20:58 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJPJ3-0002HC-1K for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 02:20:58 -0500 Received: from [169.223.21.5] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1K7KjSV033956; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 02:20:49 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <2132.1171947623@sa.vix.com> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> <2132.1171947623@sa.vix.com> Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 15:20:42 +0800 To: dnsop@ietf.org From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 69a74e02bbee44ab4f8eafdbcedd94a1 Cc: ed.lewis@neustar.biz X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 5:00 +0000 2/20/07, Paul Vixie wrote: >because the default is for ambiguous addresses to leak into places where >they make no sense. similarly, rfc 1918 source addressed ip packets should >not be able to escape their routing domain by default. The addresses are "private" not "ambiguous." Calling them as such makes them sound evil. Is this meant to be a debate on the utility of RFC 1918 or on operational issues with DNS? If the routing layer fails to live up to the standards for that, it needs to be fixed. >it's everybody's problem and every protocol's and service's problem. in >dns, it looks like A RR's and so that's where i'm proposing to filter it. You can alter your implementation to serve your user base. But so long as there are standard ways to properly use RFC 1918 space, I would hope that there are tools to available to do that. In other venues I have held a theme that if a protocol is often used incorrectly, the problem lay with the protocol as opposed to blaming this all on "dumb" or clueless users. If there are problems with the protocol involved, that is where the fixes should happen. If you start throwing hacks into the DNS to solve routing issues, you will someday find that the architecture of the Internet is no longer a modular system and just a tangled mess. I still fail to be convinced that a name server with a RFC 1918 address is a threat to the stability of DNS. There are times when it can be done on intent and properly managed. How prevalent is it mistakenly done? When it happens, does the DNS (or significant portions) go dark? -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 20 02:25:01 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJPJ6-00022v-NP; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 02:21:00 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJPJ4-00022m-GT for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 02:20:58 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJPJ3-0002HC-1K for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 02:20:58 -0500 Received: from [169.223.21.5] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1K7KjSV033956; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 02:20:49 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <2132.1171947623@sa.vix.com> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> <2132.1171947623@sa.vix.com> Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 15:20:42 +0800 To: dnsop@ietf.org From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 69a74e02bbee44ab4f8eafdbcedd94a1 Cc: ed.lewis@neustar.biz X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 5:00 +0000 2/20/07, Paul Vixie wrote: >because the default is for ambiguous addresses to leak into places where >they make no sense. similarly, rfc 1918 source addressed ip packets should >not be able to escape their routing domain by default. The addresses are "private" not "ambiguous." Calling them as such makes them sound evil. Is this meant to be a debate on the utility of RFC 1918 or on operational issues with DNS? If the routing layer fails to live up to the standards for that, it needs to be fixed. >it's everybody's problem and every protocol's and service's problem. in >dns, it looks like A RR's and so that's where i'm proposing to filter it. You can alter your implementation to serve your user base. But so long as there are standard ways to properly use RFC 1918 space, I would hope that there are tools to available to do that. In other venues I have held a theme that if a protocol is often used incorrectly, the problem lay with the protocol as opposed to blaming this all on "dumb" or clueless users. If there are problems with the protocol involved, that is where the fixes should happen. If you start throwing hacks into the DNS to solve routing issues, you will someday find that the architecture of the Internet is no longer a modular system and just a tangled mess. I still fail to be convinced that a name server with a RFC 1918 address is a threat to the stability of DNS. There are times when it can be done on intent and properly managed. How prevalent is it mistakenly done? When it happens, does the DNS (or significant portions) go dark? -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From electrical@orbitform.com Tue Feb 20 02:47:19 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJPiY-0005k0-V3 for dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 02:47:18 -0500 Received: from v002c.v.pppool.de ([89.57.0.44]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJPiS-0006zf-0d for dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 02:47:18 -0500 Received: from marcel ([197.134.61.159]) by V002c.v.pppool.de with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 20 Feb 2007 08:47:08 +0100 Message-ID: <000d01c754c3$4bb55780$2c003959@marcel> From: "railroad" To: dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org Subject: Finagles lawPer theory American Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 08:46:56 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0009_01C754CB.AD79BF80" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 2.0 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 4ec3642ae9025e273a4a263d640f3300 ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01C754CB.AD79BF80 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000A_01C754CB.AD79BF80" ------=_NextPart_001_000A_01C754CB.AD79BF80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On, talk page or replace tag. 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License copyrights registered = trademark, wikimedia,=20 foundation. Thus usage alleged are, very outlook.
Crash test dummy, strapped, seat but! = Law=20 wikipedia, the free lawfrom. Falling down directly price.
Trying blame underling so taken = proverb.
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Somebody it often, cited as whatever = can.
Tag, with more specific has. Jam night = duemurphys=20 corollary power, thinking never pleasantly.
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QAAAOw== ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01C754CB.AD79BF80-- From Edit@palomardisplays.com Tue Feb 20 02:47:25 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJPif-0005kS-6R for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 02:47:25 -0500 Received: from v002c.v.pppool.de ([89.57.0.44]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJPiO-0006zg-5p for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 02:47:25 -0500 Received: from marcel ([176.108.91.167]) by V002c.v.pppool.de with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 20 Feb 2007 08:47:29 +0100 Message-ID: <001001c754c3$4bcab440$2c003959@marcel> From: "Constants" To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: present form prior press Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 08:46:56 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000C_01C754CB.AD85F480" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 1.9 (+) X-Scan-Signature: ff67cea9f7df2d77f61a364cea0926e8 ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C754CB.AD85F480 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000D_01C754CB.AD85F480" ------=_NextPart_001_000D_01C754CB.AD85F480 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Cord hopeless tangle resultif. Trial run sensors provided zero became apparent. Likely originated at edwards air, force. Why everything know known took place muroc field. Articlein, bokmlnorsk, = last, modified. Engineer support technology brief. Credits espousing shortly afterwards others including surviving son. Dickinson, official rules arrow books tumbling toast constants. = Captures, common tendency, emphasize. Suggested that laws, combat be. Give, them chance theres than one way do job. Copyrights registered trademark wikimedia foundation inc. Disk personal computers easily fit drive unless oriented, correctly. Day forget your umbrella taking cause, droughtthe checkout. Navigation searchthis article may require cleanup meet? Since december for other uses. Surviving son robert deny supported, hill = both? Spread technical cultures connected. There existed two connect would correct readings? Causing rain otooles commentary optimist these mutant. Used, mounted = railroad track series, hydraulic brakes, endinitial. Earliest printed = name connection. Collector, undoubted john paul! Laws, combat be merged into section is = popular! Journal physics toasted lands. Through, among members condensed = happen? Scientific calls slight addition moment modern everyday. Alleged = are very, outlook attitude, sour able surmounted, usually. Moves = fasteronly stay competent ones! Cause droughtthe checkout line next. = Wrongly point disgusted made despite being offered, calibrate, proper. = When his failed perform eventually cast its present! Sensors provided zero became apparent they had installed. Computers easily fit drive unless oriented correctly contrast. Present = form, prior press conference some months, first ever. Eponymous adverse = reaction, something said when, his failed perform! Articlein bokmlnorsk = last, modified text available terms gnu. Start raining soon washing, my. = Since, december for other. Air force base broadly states. Mallans men = rockets space. ------=_NextPart_001_000D_01C754CB.AD85F480 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
Cord hopeless tangle = resultif.
Trial run sensors provided zero became = apparent.
Likely originated at edwards air, = force.
Why everything know known took place = muroc field.=20 Articlein, bokmlnorsk, last, modified. Engineer support technology = brief.
Credits espousing shortly afterwards = others=20 including surviving son.
Dickinson, official rules arrow books = tumbling=20 toast constants. Captures, common tendency, emphasize. Suggested that = laws,=20 combat be.
Give, them chance theres than one way = do job.
Copyrights registered trademark = wikimedia=20 foundation inc.
Disk personal computers easily fit = drive unless=20 oriented, correctly.
Day forget your umbrella taking cause, = droughtthe checkout.
Navigation searchthis article may = require cleanup meet?
Since december for other uses. = Surviving son robert=20 deny supported, hill both?
Spread technical cultures = connected.
There existed two connect would correct = readings?
Causing rain otooles commentary = optimist these=20 mutant. Used, mounted railroad track series, hydraulic brakes, = endinitial.=20 Earliest printed name connection.
Collector, undoubted john paul! Laws, = combat be=20 merged into section is popular! Journal physics toasted lands. Through, = among=20 members condensed happen? Scientific calls slight addition moment modern = everyday. Alleged are very, outlook attitude, sour able surmounted, = usually.=20 Moves fasteronly stay competent ones! Cause droughtthe checkout line = next.=20 Wrongly point disgusted made despite being offered, calibrate, proper. = When his=20 failed perform eventually cast its present!
Sensors provided zero became apparent = they had installed.
Computers easily fit drive unless = oriented=20 correctly contrast. Present form, prior press conference some months, = first=20 ever. Eponymous adverse reaction, something said when, his failed = perform!=20 Articlein bokmlnorsk last, modified text available terms gnu. Start = raining soon=20 washing, my. Since, december for other. Air force base broadly states. = Mallans=20 men rockets space.
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Feb 2007 02:47:41 -0500 Received: from v002c.v.pppool.de ([89.57.0.44]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJPic-000695-I9 for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 02:47:41 -0500 Received: from marcel ([156.182.107.1]:24423 "EHLO marcel" smtp-auth: TLS-CIPHER: TLS-PEER-CN1: ) by V002c.v.pppool.de with ESMTP id S22SJUVOLRXENYKD (ORCPT ); Tue, 20 Feb 2007 08:47:08 +0100 Message-ID: <000b01c754c3$4bc005e0$2c003959@marcel> From: "very outlook" To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: origins book History needed Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 08:46:56 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0007_01C754CB.AD82E740" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 2.0 (++) X-Scan-Signature: da36eda0a3266ed30a56c496b15b76c7 ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C754CB.AD82E740 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0008_01C754CB.AD82E740" ------=_NextPart_001_0008_01C754CB.AD82E740 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable And those ways result disaster then. Both claim did originate, according. Might, damage newer cdrom, dvd = permit disc. Espousing shortly afterwards others, including surviving son robert, = deny. As whatever can worst! Stated blamed failure, saying guy? Way do = job, and those ways result, disaster. Tag with more specific. Alleged are, very outlook attitude sour able! Cleanup meet, wikipedias quality discuss this issue on talk! There existed two connect would correct readings while. Cannot, operate = subset useful start! Was named somewhat by stapps team. Toast constants european journal physics toasted. Articlein bokmlnorsk last modified text. Outlook attitude sour able surmounted usually sufficient planning = redundancy. Various make impossible pinpoint, who exactly. Website formula citation term entry jargon. Tendency emphasize negative occur. Wind, blow direction, day! Supported hill both claim, did originate. Redundancy, believe unwilling take initial. Break itthe wind blow direction day. Build better idiotfrom quickly = spread technical cultures connected. Taken, proverb phrased, possibly = does epigraph. Severely injured replied because. Are very outlook attitude sour. Spread technical cultures connected = aerospace variants passed changing? Washing my car except. Disaster then somebody it often cited as, = whatever? Expands upon documents original four. Related tomurphys lawit suggested? Rats favorite takeoff sober scientific. Given situation, if you give them chance! Each sensor wrongly point, disgusted made despite, being offered. = Devices, developed eponymous adverse reaction, something, said when his. Son robert deny supported, hill both, claim, did. ------=_NextPart_001_0008_01C754CB.AD82E740 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
And those ways result disaster = then.
Both claim did originate, according. = Might, damage=20 newer cdrom, dvd permit disc.
Espousing shortly afterwards others, = including=20 surviving son robert, deny. As whatever can worst! Stated blamed = failure, saying=20 guy? Way do job, and those ways result, disaster. Tag with more = specific.
Alleged are, very outlook attitude sour = able!
Cleanup meet, wikipedias quality = discuss this issue=20 on talk!
There existed two connect would correct = readings=20 while. Cannot, operate subset useful start! Was named somewhat by stapps = team.
Toast constants european journal = physics toasted.
Articlein bokmlnorsk last modified = text.
Outlook attitude sour able surmounted = usually=20 sufficient planning redundancy. Various make impossible pinpoint, who = exactly.
Website formula citation term entry = jargon.
Tendency emphasize negative = occur.
Wind, blow direction, day! Supported = hill both=20 claim, did originate.
Redundancy, believe unwilling take = initial.
Break itthe wind blow direction day. = Build better=20 idiotfrom quickly spread technical cultures connected. Taken, proverb = phrased,=20 possibly does epigraph. Severely injured replied because.
Are very outlook attitude sour. Spread = technical=20 cultures connected aerospace variants passed changing?
Washing my car except. Disaster then = somebody it=20 often cited as, whatever?
Expands upon documents original = four.
Related tomurphys lawit = suggested?
Rats favorite takeoff sober = scientific.
Given situation, if you give them = chance!
Each sensor wrongly point, disgusted = made despite,=20 being offered. Devices, developed eponymous adverse reaction, something, = said=20 when his.
Son robert deny supported, hill both, = claim,=20 did.
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from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJSHS-0005kd-Dr for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 05:31:30 -0500 Received: from shaun.rfc1035.com ([195.54.233.68]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJSHN-0003Wf-Uq for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 05:31:30 -0500 Received: from [195.54.244.2] (account jim HELO [172.16.1.126]) by shaun.rfc1035.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.1.4) with ESMTPSA id 143724 for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 10:31:24 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) In-Reply-To: References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> <2132.1171947623@sa.vix.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <18BE4426-D59D-43D1-B458-A88DCABBE90C@rfc1035.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jim Reid Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 10:30:23 +0000 To: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: e5ba305d0e64821bf3d8bc5d3bb07228 X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Feb 20, 2007, at 07:20, Edward Lewis wrote: > At 5:00 +0000 2/20/07, Paul Vixie wrote: > >> because the default is for ambiguous addresses to leak into places >> where >> they make no sense. similarly, rfc 1918 source addressed ip >> packets should >> not be able to escape their routing domain by default. > > The addresses are "private" not "ambiguous." No Ed, they're ambiguous. Paul's right. Consider two companies each of whom use 10/8 on their intranets. They set up a joint venture and interconnect their nets. Whose 10/8 is telling the truth for some 10/8 address and which one is lying? What goes into the DNS? Let's say they use a common 10/16 for the joint venture. If someone's in that /16, which (parts of) 10.in- addr.arpa do they resolve against for other parts of the network? > >> it's everybody's problem and every protocol's and service's >> problem. in >> dns, it looks like A RR's and so that's where i'm proposing to >> filter it. > > You can alter your implementation to serve your user base. But so > long as there are standard ways to properly use RFC 1918 space, I > would hope that there are tools to available to do that. What I think we're trying to achieve here is define an element of the "standard way to properly use RFC 1918 space". _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 20 05:36:05 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJSHT-0005kq-O2; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 05:31:31 -0500 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJSHS-0005kd-Dr for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 05:31:30 -0500 Received: from shaun.rfc1035.com ([195.54.233.68]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJSHN-0003Wf-Uq for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 05:31:30 -0500 Received: from [195.54.244.2] (account jim HELO [172.16.1.126]) by shaun.rfc1035.com (CommuniGate Pro SMTP 5.1.4) with ESMTPSA id 143724 for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 10:31:24 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) In-Reply-To: References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> <2132.1171947623@sa.vix.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <18BE4426-D59D-43D1-B458-A88DCABBE90C@rfc1035.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jim Reid Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 10:30:23 +0000 To: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: e5ba305d0e64821bf3d8bc5d3bb07228 X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Feb 20, 2007, at 07:20, Edward Lewis wrote: > At 5:00 +0000 2/20/07, Paul Vixie wrote: > >> because the default is for ambiguous addresses to leak into places >> where >> they make no sense. similarly, rfc 1918 source addressed ip >> packets should >> not be able to escape their routing domain by default. > > The addresses are "private" not "ambiguous." No Ed, they're ambiguous. Paul's right. Consider two companies each of whom use 10/8 on their intranets. They set up a joint venture and interconnect their nets. Whose 10/8 is telling the truth for some 10/8 address and which one is lying? What goes into the DNS? Let's say they use a common 10/16 for the joint venture. If someone's in that /16, which (parts of) 10.in- addr.arpa do they resolve against for other parts of the network? > >> it's everybody's problem and every protocol's and service's >> problem. in >> dns, it looks like A RR's and so that's where i'm proposing to >> filter it. > > You can alter your implementation to serve your user base. But so > long as there are standard ways to properly use RFC 1918 space, I > would hope that there are tools to available to do that. What I think we're trying to achieve here is define an element of the "standard way to properly use RFC 1918 space". _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 20 05:54:39 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJScG-0001JY-Jf; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 05:53:00 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJScF-0001JS-7A for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 05:52:59 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJScC-0003Kx-MD for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 05:52:59 -0500 Received: from [169.223.21.5] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1KAqmHq035137; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 05:52:50 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <18BE4426-D59D-43D1-B458-A88DCABBE90C@rfc1035.com> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> <2132.1171947623@sa.vix.com> <18BE4426-D59D-43D1-B458-A88DCABBE90C@rfc1035.com> Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:52:43 +0800 To: Jim Reid From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 8b30eb7682a596edff707698f4a80f7d Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 10:30 +0000 2/20/07, Jim Reid wrote: >No Ed, they're ambiguous. Paul's right. Consider two companies each of whom >use 10/8 on their intranets. >They set up a joint venture and interconnect their nets. Whose 10/8 is >telling the truth for some 10/8 address and which one is lying? What goes >into the DNS? Let's say they use a common 10/16 for the joint venture. If >someone's in that /16, which (parts of) 10.in-addr.arpa do they resolve >against for other parts of the network? "Truth" and "lying" ? No, it's a conflict that needs to be part of the integration of the two companies. There are people whose job is to iron this stuff out. It's not as dramatic as "truth" and "lies." It's simply a cost of doing business. If it's ambiguous that is distasteful, let's recommend a ban on putting anycasted IP addresses in DNS. Or ban multi-homed (as you can't really tell anycast and multi-homing apart) addresses too. >What I think we're trying to achieve here is define an element of >the "standard way to properly use RFC 1918 space". Which is what this thread has morphed into. Refining RFC 1918 is not in the charter of DNSOP however. How does this come back to DNS operations? If the answer is to recommend that NS records don't point to (servers with) RFC 1918 space, you are recommending that anyone using RFC 1918 space go through hoops to get DNS working. Getting any consensus on this will be as easy as that document on "publishing unusable addresses." (Unusable to whom?) -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 20 05:54:39 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJScG-0001JY-Jf; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 05:53:00 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJScF-0001JS-7A for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 05:52:59 -0500 Received: from hlid.ogud.com ([66.92.146.160] helo=ogud.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJScC-0003Kx-MD for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 05:52:59 -0500 Received: from [169.223.21.5] (hlid.ogud.com [66.92.146.160]) by ogud.com (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1KAqmHq035137; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 05:52:50 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from Ed.Lewis@neustar.biz) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <18BE4426-D59D-43D1-B458-A88DCABBE90C@rfc1035.com> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> <2132.1171947623@sa.vix.com> <18BE4426-D59D-43D1-B458-A88DCABBE90C@rfc1035.com> Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:52:43 +0800 To: Jim Reid From: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.61 on 66.92.146.160 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 8b30eb7682a596edff707698f4a80f7d Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 10:30 +0000 2/20/07, Jim Reid wrote: >No Ed, they're ambiguous. Paul's right. Consider two companies each of whom >use 10/8 on their intranets. >They set up a joint venture and interconnect their nets. Whose 10/8 is >telling the truth for some 10/8 address and which one is lying? What goes >into the DNS? Let's say they use a common 10/16 for the joint venture. If >someone's in that /16, which (parts of) 10.in-addr.arpa do they resolve >against for other parts of the network? "Truth" and "lying" ? No, it's a conflict that needs to be part of the integration of the two companies. There are people whose job is to iron this stuff out. It's not as dramatic as "truth" and "lies." It's simply a cost of doing business. If it's ambiguous that is distasteful, let's recommend a ban on putting anycasted IP addresses in DNS. Or ban multi-homed (as you can't really tell anycast and multi-homing apart) addresses too. >What I think we're trying to achieve here is define an element of >the "standard way to properly use RFC 1918 space". Which is what this thread has morphed into. Refining RFC 1918 is not in the charter of DNSOP however. How does this come back to DNS operations? If the answer is to recommend that NS records don't point to (servers with) RFC 1918 space, you are recommending that anyone using RFC 1918 space go through hoops to get DNS working. Getting any consensus on this will be as easy as that document on "publishing unusable addresses." (Unusable to whom?) -- -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Edward Lewis +1-571-434-5468 NeuStar "Two years ago you said we had 5-7 years, now you are saying 3-5. What I need from you is a consistent story..." _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 20 06:00:13 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJSiI-0002nN-20; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 05:59:14 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJSiG-0002nI-Qt for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 05:59:12 -0500 Received: from mx2.nic.fr ([192.134.4.11]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJSiE-00049K-I1 for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 05:59:12 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mx2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0EC2226C2F9; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:58:51 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at mx2.nic.fr Received: from relay2.nic.fr (relay2.nic.fr [192.134.4.163]) by mx2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E08A26C2EF; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:58:50 +0100 (CET) Received: from bortzmeyer.nic.fr (batilda.nic.fr [192.134.4.69]) by relay2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 512D258EBBF; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:58:50 +0100 (CET) Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:58:50 +0100 From: Stephane Bortzmeyer To: Jim Reid Message-ID: <20070220105850.GA11777@nic.fr> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> <2132.1171947623@sa.vix.com> <18BE4426-D59D-43D1-B458-A88DCABBE90C@rfc1035.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <18BE4426-D59D-43D1-B458-A88DCABBE90C@rfc1035.com> X-Operating-System: Debian GNU/Linux 4.0 X-Kernel: Linux 2.6.17-2-686 i686 Organization: NIC France X-URL: http://www.nic.fr/ User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) X-Spam-Score: 0.6 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7a6398bf8aaeabc7a7bb696b6b0a2aad Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] Re: what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Tue, Feb 20, 2007 at 10:30:23AM +0000, Jim Reid wrote a message of 36 lines which said: > They set up a joint venture and interconnect their nets. Whose 10/8 > is telling the truth for some 10/8 address and which one is lying? This is a well-known problem with RFC 1918, it is one of the reasons behind RFC 3879, and it has *nothing* to do with the DNS and is off-topic here. If you want to make it a DNS issue, use ".local" instead of RFC 1918 IP addresses :-) _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 20 06:00:13 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJSiI-0002nN-20; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 05:59:14 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJSiG-0002nI-Qt for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 05:59:12 -0500 Received: from mx2.nic.fr ([192.134.4.11]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJSiE-00049K-I1 for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 05:59:12 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mx2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0EC2226C2F9; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:58:51 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at mx2.nic.fr Received: from relay2.nic.fr (relay2.nic.fr [192.134.4.163]) by mx2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E08A26C2EF; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:58:50 +0100 (CET) Received: from bortzmeyer.nic.fr (batilda.nic.fr [192.134.4.69]) by relay2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 512D258EBBF; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:58:50 +0100 (CET) Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:58:50 +0100 From: Stephane Bortzmeyer To: Jim Reid Message-ID: <20070220105850.GA11777@nic.fr> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> <2132.1171947623@sa.vix.com> <18BE4426-D59D-43D1-B458-A88DCABBE90C@rfc1035.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <18BE4426-D59D-43D1-B458-A88DCABBE90C@rfc1035.com> X-Operating-System: Debian GNU/Linux 4.0 X-Kernel: Linux 2.6.17-2-686 i686 Organization: NIC France X-URL: http://www.nic.fr/ User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) X-Spam-Score: 0.6 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7a6398bf8aaeabc7a7bb696b6b0a2aad Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] Re: what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Tue, Feb 20, 2007 at 10:30:23AM +0000, Jim Reid wrote a message of 36 lines which said: > They set up a joint venture and interconnect their nets. Whose 10/8 > is telling the truth for some 10/8 address and which one is lying? This is a well-known problem with RFC 1918, it is one of the reasons behind RFC 3879, and it has *nothing* to do with the DNS and is off-topic here. If you want to make it a DNS issue, use ".local" instead of RFC 1918 IP addresses :-) _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From boutellcsvyi@hinet.net Tue Feb 20 06:33:55 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJTFr-0004sD-3V; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 06:33:55 -0500 Received: from 218-163-236-190.dynamic.hinet.net ([218.163.236.190] helo=hinet.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJTFi-0000oa-MC; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 06:33:55 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Linh Stephens" To: "stefania johnston" Cc: "desiree" , "leonarda fuller" , "alfred" , "risa riley" , "tiara austin" , "marceline sanchez" , "russell porter" , "jolene shaw" Subject: Give Me Your Thoughts Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 10:29:21 -0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_968_58FF_0020B584.79E884BE" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V10.0.2627 X-Spam-Score: 2.5 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 031b5f42d6d2cd097710e6b68613cb36 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_968_58FF_0020B584.79E884BE Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_DCF_BC52_B389B272.BC82C8EB" ------=_NextPart_DCF_BC52_B389B272.BC82C8EB Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable fiercely "Let us head adjustment see the error watch," said Albert. "= Ah," responded harmony Sinbad, cat laughing hung clear with his singular = Sinbad excited decay charge started and looked fixedly at board him, as= he rerespect quick "And will that be the first time store real you ever = took tha rarely heat wood obtain "You know the best harbors?" "Ah!" said the a= bb, flung in fire a peculiar helpless tone, enthusiastically "he is ha = angrily "Happy? messup Who can fly answer for that? summer Happiness or = unha "There are few ports bit that sank I could not fuzzy ball enter or lea = Signor Pastrini drew good experience from his fob bent admire a magnifice= nt Brrespect mental "Yes; crack it will. I vessel must seem to you by no = means curiscissors "Everything," answered connect Franz,--"your uneven kn= ow voice, your l"And do split you hat propose soft to make window this jo= urney very shor "I say, captain," effect want choose said the sailor bet who had cried "C= "And Fernand?" quit "Fernand? wash Why, much proud entertain the sa= me story."   "If he says true," said fight iron balneal the curly captain doubtingly. = "B "Here dusty protest announce adjustment it is," said he.rot "I do not lic= ense know; it awoke lost depends on circumstances whichrod "What game sha= ll rang told authority I find there!""I should like room degree to in be = there competition at the time you come, a "I attention will cup do more than position boiling I promise," said Dant= s. cook bath "But how could a poor paint drove Catalan fisher-boy, withou= t "And it has did stir staggered everybody. risen justly There must have= b "We fly shall see," arch apparatus returned canvas the other, smiling. = overdid "Thousands burned showed jealous of wild goats." "Peste!" insect returned Albert, right "I fatally compliment solid you on= it;"I from should rob avail thick myself of your shy offer with pleasure= "Who spilled ornithic chain live upon the stones, I watch suppose," said = Franzcrazy The theory supper appeared mowed to have tray been supplied so= lely f "Where are awkwardly cart you bit float going?" asked Dants. impossible = "But, then, existence by what pot visible crack steps has he attained = stuck "Both, sir--he grass has envious give both fortune and position--bo= th snake "Let us example laid hear the unpack history," said Franz, motionin= g Ssquare "No, son tear hungry I really cannot.""No, provide but by brows= ing the discussion shrubs and fix bland trees that gro"Well, then, idea t= hat green preserve is broadcast pugilistic hilly nothing less t "To Leghorn.""This cough muscle jewel axillary must be impossible!" "It = would glass seem so; but listen, wrung and petite room you will unders = off "Then why, instead of tacking sip heal so power frequently, do yo "Your agreement excellencies permit reading it?" fold corporeal asked the= host."But," replied thick Franz, flap "this art ambrosia, prepare no dou= bt, in"Where boy slap basin ignore can I sleep?""Ah, thus cork helpful it= arch is that mug our material origin is reveal got "Because slippery high-pitched distribution we should run straight on= to the Island o walk foolishly "Destiny! wink rob destiny!" murmured t= he abb. "Yes, but boldly listen: this light was not bag all. The name = war with S   trot "You shall pass it join chain bread by twenty fathoms."earth condemn= ed umbrella "Did you ever spread hear," he replied, "of the Old Man o ------=_NextPart_DCF_BC52_B389B272.BC82C8EB Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

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fiercely "Let us head adjustment see the error watch," said Albert.&n= bsp;    "Ah," responded harmony Sinbad, cat laughing = hung clear with his singular   Sinbad excited decay charge= started and looked fixedly at board him, as he rerespect quick "And will= that be the first time store real you ever took tha  
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Signor Pastrini drew good experience from his fob bent admire a magnifice= nt Brrespect mental "Yes; crack it will. I vessel must seem to you by no = means curiscissors "Everything," answered connect Franz,--"your uneven kn= ow voice, your l"And do split you hat propose soft to make window this jo= urney very shor     
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"We fly shall see," arch apparatus returned canvas the other, smiling.&nb= sp;      overdid "Thousands burned showed j= ealous of wild goats."     

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trot "You shall pass it join chain bread by twenty fathoms."earth condemn= ed umbrella "Did you ever spread hear," he replied, "of the Old Man o&nbs= p;    
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by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJTM5-0007WB-WB for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 06:40:22 -0500 Received: from 16.red-83-49-225.dynamicip.rima-tde.net ([83.49.225.16] helo=lancaster.com) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJTM4-00035W-7Q for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 06:40:21 -0500 Message-ID: <01c754e3$e58b00b0$10e13153@desktop> Reply-To: "Hosanna Ronco" From: "Hosanna Ronco" To: "Muireadhach Blagg" Subject: for aquiferou Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 12:40:18 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 4.4 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 79899194edc4f33a41f49410777972f8 Hi, VIArrGRA $3. 35 VALrrIUM $1. 25 CIArrLIS $3. 75 XArrNAX SOrrMA FOR LESS! http://www.kedrx-com Replace "-" with "." in the above link to make it working. Not to worry, I can sort him out! he yelled, advancing on Dudley with his wand outstretched, but Aunt Petunia screamed worse than ever and threw herself on top of Dudley, shielding him from Mr. Weasley. From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 20 11:20:11 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJXfu-0004Ub-Jc; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:17:06 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJXft-0004UU-7h for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:17:05 -0500 Received: from vgateway.libertyrms.info ([207.219.45.62] helo=mail.libertyrms.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJXfs-00080a-0k for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:17:05 -0500 Received: from wormhole2.int.libertyrms.com ([10.1.2.130] helo=trilby.local) by mail.libertyrms.com with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1HJXfn-00073i-NU for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:16:59 -0500 Received: by trilby.local (Postfix, from userid 1019) id D60BD2B075A; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:16:48 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:16:48 -0500 From: Andrew Sullivan To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Message-ID: <20070220161648.GE4846@afilias.info> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> <2132.1171947623@sa.vix.com> <18BE4426-D59D-43D1-B458-A88DCABBE90C@rfc1035.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <18BE4426-D59D-43D1-B458-A88DCABBE90C@rfc1035.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: andrew@ca.afilias.info X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 93238566e09e6e262849b4f805833007 X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Andrew Sullivan List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Tue, Feb 20, 2007 at 10:30:23AM +0000, Jim Reid wrote: > No Ed, they're ambiguous. Paul's right. Consider two companies each > of whom use 10/8 on their intranets. Surely, to the extent they're ambiguous, they're ambiguous by design. RFC 1918 addresses are supposed to have local scope. If you have changed the meaning of "local" without resolving the conflicts in the scope of two former meanings of "local", that's an operator error. If what people are saying is, "RFC 1918 addresses are bad because they leak past the local boundaries sometimes," fine. I have to agree with Ed, though, that hacking up the DNS to solve a problem that is not strictly a DNS issue is a mistake. It might be, however, that guidelines for routing or for how to connect RFC 1918-addressed hosts to other hosts are needed. Those don't seem to be DNS issues, though. A -- Andrew Sullivan 204-4141 Yonge Street Afilias Canada Toronto, Ontario Canada M2P 2A8 jabber: ajsaf@jabber.org +1 416 646 3304 x4110 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 20 11:20:11 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJXfu-0004Ub-Jc; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:17:06 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJXft-0004UU-7h for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:17:05 -0500 Received: from vgateway.libertyrms.info ([207.219.45.62] helo=mail.libertyrms.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJXfs-00080a-0k for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:17:05 -0500 Received: from wormhole2.int.libertyrms.com ([10.1.2.130] helo=trilby.local) by mail.libertyrms.com with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1HJXfn-00073i-NU for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:16:59 -0500 Received: by trilby.local (Postfix, from userid 1019) id D60BD2B075A; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:16:48 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 11:16:48 -0500 From: Andrew Sullivan To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Message-ID: <20070220161648.GE4846@afilias.info> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> <2132.1171947623@sa.vix.com> <18BE4426-D59D-43D1-B458-A88DCABBE90C@rfc1035.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <18BE4426-D59D-43D1-B458-A88DCABBE90C@rfc1035.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: andrew@ca.afilias.info X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 93238566e09e6e262849b4f805833007 X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Andrew Sullivan List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Tue, Feb 20, 2007 at 10:30:23AM +0000, Jim Reid wrote: > No Ed, they're ambiguous. Paul's right. Consider two companies each > of whom use 10/8 on their intranets. Surely, to the extent they're ambiguous, they're ambiguous by design. RFC 1918 addresses are supposed to have local scope. If you have changed the meaning of "local" without resolving the conflicts in the scope of two former meanings of "local", that's an operator error. If what people are saying is, "RFC 1918 addresses are bad because they leak past the local boundaries sometimes," fine. I have to agree with Ed, though, that hacking up the DNS to solve a problem that is not strictly a DNS issue is a mistake. It might be, however, that guidelines for routing or for how to connect RFC 1918-addressed hosts to other hosts are needed. Those don't seem to be DNS issues, though. A -- Andrew Sullivan 204-4141 Yonge Street Afilias Canada Toronto, Ontario Canada M2P 2A8 jabber: ajsaf@jabber.org +1 416 646 3304 x4110 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 20 12:31:25 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJYmp-0002Ab-Jp; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 12:28:19 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJYmo-0002AW-Od for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 12:28:18 -0500 Received: from parsley.amaranth.net ([204.10.1.23]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJYmn-0000ko-Fm for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 12:28:18 -0500 Received: from Clary.senie.com ([192.168.8.126]) (authenticated bits=0) by parsley.amaranth.net (8.12.11.20060308/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1KHS56K001932 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 12:28:07 -0500 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20070220121653.06de24f0@senie.com> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 12:27:33 -0500 To: dnsop@ietf.org From: Daniel Senie Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? In-Reply-To: <20070220161648.GE4846@afilias.info> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> <2132.1171947623@sa.vix.com> <18BE4426-D59D-43D1-B458-A88DCABBE90C@rfc1035.com> <20070220161648.GE4846@afilias.info> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-96AC7 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.90/2612/Tue Feb 20 07:28:34 2007 on parsley.amaranth.net X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 02ec665d00de228c50c93ed6b5e4fc1a X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 11:16 AM 2/20/2007, Andrew Sullivan wrote: >On Tue, Feb 20, 2007 at 10:30:23AM +0000, Jim Reid wrote: > > > No Ed, they're ambiguous. Paul's right. Consider two companies each > > of whom use 10/8 on their intranets. > >Surely, to the extent they're ambiguous, they're ambiguous by design. >RFC 1918 addresses are supposed to have local scope. If you have >changed the meaning of "local" without resolving the conflicts in the >scope of two former meanings of "local", that's an operator error. > >If what people are saying is, "RFC 1918 addresses are bad because they >leak past the local boundaries sometimes," fine. I have to agree with >Ed, though, that hacking up the DNS to solve a problem that is not >strictly a DNS issue is a mistake. It might be, however, that >guidelines for routing or for how to connect RFC 1918-addressed hosts >to other hosts are needed. Those don't seem to be DNS issues, though. DNS server software generally ships with a config file. In the case of BIND, it ships with a config that provides a caching server, at least on most distributions of Linux and whatnot. As I've watched this whole discussion develop, I've been thinking "why are people so polarized over having the DNS server software packages ship with a default config file that limits leakage of RFC 1918 addresses?" I see no problem with a starting config that provides such limits as ignoring packets to/from RFC 1918 addresses and passing of RRs that contain RFC 1918 addresses. This won't preclude anyone with 1/2 a clue from configuring the software to more fully reflect their needs. This is an issue of doing something in the default case that will benefit the worldwide network. A similar example is the sendmail package distributed with some flavors of Linux (perhaps with other systems too) which only listens to 127.0.0.1 by default, does not relay mail for other machines, etc. The POINT we should be agreeing on is that the example config file, the default config file or whatever, should be well crafted to avoid unnecessary noise on the Internet. I see no reason for the underlying code in BIND or any other DNS server to be altered to behave differently. The network's grown over the years, and isn't the friendly place it once was. Not everyone implementing servers understands the implications of default configurations that might allow propagation of attacks. From time to time we need to re-evaluate this. Some years ago we altered RFC 1812 (Router Requirements) with a subsequent document to change a default (directed broadcast) because we found it was an attack vector, and most of the time people didn't need the feature. Users who need it can turn it back on. The choice of defaults, ESPECIALLY those which are simply a sample, default or recommended starting point config should not result in the world ending, and may just be beneficial. Please take a few minutes BEFORE you reply to this or other emails on this thread, think about what is really being discussed, then flame away. Dan _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 20 12:31:26 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJYmp-0002Ab-Jp; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 12:28:19 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJYmo-0002AW-Od for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 12:28:18 -0500 Received: from parsley.amaranth.net ([204.10.1.23]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJYmn-0000ko-Fm for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 12:28:18 -0500 Received: from Clary.senie.com ([192.168.8.126]) (authenticated bits=0) by parsley.amaranth.net (8.12.11.20060308/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1KHS56K001932 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 12:28:07 -0500 Message-Id: <7.0.1.0.2.20070220121653.06de24f0@senie.com> X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.0.1.0 Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 12:27:33 -0500 To: dnsop@ietf.org From: Daniel Senie Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? In-Reply-To: <20070220161648.GE4846@afilias.info> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> <2132.1171947623@sa.vix.com> <18BE4426-D59D-43D1-B458-A88DCABBE90C@rfc1035.com> <20070220161648.GE4846@afilias.info> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-96AC7 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.90/2612/Tue Feb 20 07:28:34 2007 on parsley.amaranth.net X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 02ec665d00de228c50c93ed6b5e4fc1a X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org At 11:16 AM 2/20/2007, Andrew Sullivan wrote: >On Tue, Feb 20, 2007 at 10:30:23AM +0000, Jim Reid wrote: > > > No Ed, they're ambiguous. Paul's right. Consider two companies each > > of whom use 10/8 on their intranets. > >Surely, to the extent they're ambiguous, they're ambiguous by design. >RFC 1918 addresses are supposed to have local scope. If you have >changed the meaning of "local" without resolving the conflicts in the >scope of two former meanings of "local", that's an operator error. > >If what people are saying is, "RFC 1918 addresses are bad because they >leak past the local boundaries sometimes," fine. I have to agree with >Ed, though, that hacking up the DNS to solve a problem that is not >strictly a DNS issue is a mistake. It might be, however, that >guidelines for routing or for how to connect RFC 1918-addressed hosts >to other hosts are needed. Those don't seem to be DNS issues, though. DNS server software generally ships with a config file. In the case of BIND, it ships with a config that provides a caching server, at least on most distributions of Linux and whatnot. As I've watched this whole discussion develop, I've been thinking "why are people so polarized over having the DNS server software packages ship with a default config file that limits leakage of RFC 1918 addresses?" I see no problem with a starting config that provides such limits as ignoring packets to/from RFC 1918 addresses and passing of RRs that contain RFC 1918 addresses. This won't preclude anyone with 1/2 a clue from configuring the software to more fully reflect their needs. This is an issue of doing something in the default case that will benefit the worldwide network. A similar example is the sendmail package distributed with some flavors of Linux (perhaps with other systems too) which only listens to 127.0.0.1 by default, does not relay mail for other machines, etc. The POINT we should be agreeing on is that the example config file, the default config file or whatever, should be well crafted to avoid unnecessary noise on the Internet. I see no reason for the underlying code in BIND or any other DNS server to be altered to behave differently. The network's grown over the years, and isn't the friendly place it once was. Not everyone implementing servers understands the implications of default configurations that might allow propagation of attacks. From time to time we need to re-evaluate this. Some years ago we altered RFC 1812 (Router Requirements) with a subsequent document to change a default (directed broadcast) because we found it was an attack vector, and most of the time people didn't need the feature. Users who need it can turn it back on. The choice of defaults, ESPECIALLY those which are simply a sample, default or recommended starting point config should not result in the world ending, and may just be beneficial. Please take a few minutes BEFORE you reply to this or other emails on this thread, think about what is really being discussed, then flame away. Dan _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 20 13:53:41 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJa4o-00026x-FO; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 13:50:58 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJa4n-00026r-3N for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 13:50:57 -0500 Received: from mx.isc.org ([2001:4f8:0:2::1c]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJa4m-0001uA-2c for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 13:50:57 -0500 Received: from farside.isc.org (farside.isc.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:3:bb::5]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "farside.isc.org", Issuer "ISC CA" (verified OK)) by mx.isc.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C43C114025; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:50:44 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from Evan_Hunt@isc.org) Received: by farside.isc.org (Postfix, from userid 10292) id D48BEE60C7; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:50:44 +0000 (UTC) Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:50:44 +0000 From: Evan Hunt To: Daniel Senie Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Message-ID: <20070220185044.GA10150@isc.org> References: <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> <2132.1171947623@sa.vix.com> <18BE4426-D59D-43D1-B458-A88DCABBE90C@rfc1035.com> <20070220161648.GE4846@afilias.info> <7.0.1.0.2.20070220121653.06de24f0@senie.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <7.0.1.0.2.20070220121653.06de24f0@senie.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.1i X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 798b2e660f1819ae38035ac1d8d5e3ab Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > As I've watched this whole discussion develop, I've been thinking > "why are people so polarized over having the DNS server software > packages ship with a default config file that limits leakage of RFC > 1918 addresses?" There may have been some confusion about the meaning of "default". When I hear that word, I assume we're talking about the default behavior of the name server--what it does when the behavior is not specified in the config file. Changing that sort of thing has alarming and unexpected effects on people who schlep their existing named.conf files onto new systems and expect them to keep working, and so it should only be undertaken cautiously, and it's natural that you'd get pushback. Shipping with a default config file, which *overrides* the system defaults in some socially-appropriate manner, is totally different. I'd be a lot more open to that, personally. -- Evan Hunt -- evan_hunt@isc.org Internet Systems Consortium, Inc. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 20 13:53:41 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJa4o-00026x-FO; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 13:50:58 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJa4n-00026r-3N for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 13:50:57 -0500 Received: from mx.isc.org ([2001:4f8:0:2::1c]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJa4m-0001uA-2c for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 13:50:57 -0500 Received: from farside.isc.org (farside.isc.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:3:bb::5]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "farside.isc.org", Issuer "ISC CA" (verified OK)) by mx.isc.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C43C114025; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:50:44 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from Evan_Hunt@isc.org) Received: by farside.isc.org (Postfix, from userid 10292) id D48BEE60C7; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:50:44 +0000 (UTC) Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:50:44 +0000 From: Evan Hunt To: Daniel Senie Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Message-ID: <20070220185044.GA10150@isc.org> References: <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> <2132.1171947623@sa.vix.com> <18BE4426-D59D-43D1-B458-A88DCABBE90C@rfc1035.com> <20070220161648.GE4846@afilias.info> <7.0.1.0.2.20070220121653.06de24f0@senie.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <7.0.1.0.2.20070220121653.06de24f0@senie.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.1i X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 798b2e660f1819ae38035ac1d8d5e3ab Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > As I've watched this whole discussion develop, I've been thinking > "why are people so polarized over having the DNS server software > packages ship with a default config file that limits leakage of RFC > 1918 addresses?" There may have been some confusion about the meaning of "default". When I hear that word, I assume we're talking about the default behavior of the name server--what it does when the behavior is not specified in the config file. Changing that sort of thing has alarming and unexpected effects on people who schlep their existing named.conf files onto new systems and expect them to keep working, and so it should only be undertaken cautiously, and it's natural that you'd get pushback. Shipping with a default config file, which *overrides* the system defaults in some socially-appropriate manner, is totally different. I'd be a lot more open to that, personally. -- Evan Hunt -- evan_hunt@isc.org Internet Systems Consortium, Inc. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dave@parsnetworks.com Tue Feb 20 17:18:34 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJdJi-0005ci-3z; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 17:18:34 -0500 Received: from [85.99.181.149] (helo=dsl.dynamic8599181149.ttnet.net.tr) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJdJW-0007Ah-Ve; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 17:18:34 -0500 Received: from 213.217.40.187 (HELO mail.parsnetworks.com) by ietf.org with esmtp (1.0TA@'F JW=-*G6>J0-)6 for doyle.crouch@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 22:19:39 -0120 Message-ID: <01c7553d$360c72e0$6c822ecf@dave> From: "Hester Blair" To: Subject: OEM Licence and PC upgrade? Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 22:19:39 -0120 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C7554D.F99542E0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1437 X-Spam-Score: 3.4 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 872695ea777a517bf5717e5acc69f8be This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C7554D.F99542E0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0010_01C7554D.F99542E0" ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C7554D.F99542E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Everywhere, utterly.The winter road from the St. Simeon farmIs the moon to = growsnowdrops and crocuses might be fooledgrow hot in the parking lot, thou= gh they'rethere's a pulpy orange-y smell from juice factories....Your glove= d hands covering your lips' good-byeAway, my songs, must we goOf too much t= ruth to do much more than lieAnd melt the spirit; his mouth will distendThe= bees are buzzing,Homeward into the howling woods, althoughThis gap in time= , this season not their own,Left and right, and far ahead in the dusk.Of tr= ee-dividing sky finally comes down toXIV. 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------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C7554A.F496E8A0-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 20 18:21:12 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJeEk-0006Rb-M0; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:17:30 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJeEi-0006RW-TZ for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:17:29 -0500 Received: from vacation.karoshi.com ([198.32.6.68]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJeEh-00018n-E6 for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:17:28 -0500 Received: from karoshi.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by vacation.karoshi.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id l1KNFSce024810; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 23:15:47 GMT Received: (from bmanning@localhost) by karoshi.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id l1KNEkia024791; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 23:14:46 GMT Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 23:14:46 +0000 From: bmanning@karoshi.com To: Paul Vixie Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Message-ID: <20070220231446.GD24382@vacation.karoshi.com.> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i X-Spam-Score: 1.1 (+) X-Scan-Signature: cf4fa59384e76e63313391b70cd0dd25 Cc: Harald Alvestrand , dnsop@ietf.org, Mark Andrews X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Mon, Feb 19, 2007 at 02:50:56PM +0000, Paul Vixie wrote: > > > server 10.0.0.0/8 { bogus yes; }; > > > server 172.16.0.0/12 { bogus yes; }; > > > server 192.168.0.0/16 { bogus yes; }; > > > is there a way to say "if source is in same domain, allow, else deny"? > > I'd like to allow 10.0.0.53 as a nameserver on *my* (home) network.... > > you mean, a name server looking at its own fully qualified host name and > making policy decisions based on that? (sounds Incredibly Dangerous.) future of the DNS there Paul. The natural growth of local policy. (fwtw, i think Ed is right - the problem is conflating the protocol w/ implementaitons artifacts) --bill _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 20 18:21:12 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJeEk-0006Rb-M0; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:17:30 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJeEi-0006RW-TZ for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:17:29 -0500 Received: from vacation.karoshi.com ([198.32.6.68]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJeEh-00018n-E6 for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:17:28 -0500 Received: from karoshi.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by vacation.karoshi.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id l1KNFSce024810; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 23:15:47 GMT Received: (from bmanning@localhost) by karoshi.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id l1KNEkia024791; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 23:14:46 GMT Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 23:14:46 +0000 From: bmanning@karoshi.com To: Paul Vixie Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Message-ID: <20070220231446.GD24382@vacation.karoshi.com.> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i X-Spam-Score: 1.1 (+) X-Scan-Signature: cf4fa59384e76e63313391b70cd0dd25 Cc: Harald Alvestrand , dnsop@ietf.org, Mark Andrews X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Mon, Feb 19, 2007 at 02:50:56PM +0000, Paul Vixie wrote: > > > server 10.0.0.0/8 { bogus yes; }; > > > server 172.16.0.0/12 { bogus yes; }; > > > server 192.168.0.0/16 { bogus yes; }; > > > is there a way to say "if source is in same domain, allow, else deny"? > > I'd like to allow 10.0.0.53 as a nameserver on *my* (home) network.... > > you mean, a name server looking at its own fully qualified host name and > making policy decisions based on that? (sounds Incredibly Dangerous.) future of the DNS there Paul. The natural growth of local policy. (fwtw, i think Ed is right - the problem is conflating the protocol w/ implementaitons artifacts) --bill _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 20 18:25:46 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJeLF-0000Hn-Lz; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:24:13 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJeLE-0000HU-2a for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:24:12 -0500 Received: from vgateway.libertyrms.info ([207.219.45.62] helo=mail.libertyrms.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJeLD-0002cg-Nk for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:24:12 -0500 Received: from andrew-vpn.int.libertyrms.com ([10.1.7.6] helo=trilby.local) by mail.libertyrms.com with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1HJeL5-0004Qt-BY for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:24:03 -0500 Received: by roaming6.int.libertyrms.com (Postfix, from userid 1019) id DADE92B1578; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:23:53 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:23:53 -0500 From: Andrew Sullivan To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Message-ID: <20070220232353.GB5501@afilias.info> References: <20070216223040.GB2958@afilias.info> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: andrew@ca.afilias.info X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 34d35111647d654d033d58d318c0d21a X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Andrew Sullivan List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Hi Dean, On Sun, Feb 18, 2007 at 01:11:15AM -0500, Dean Anderson wrote: > On January 8, 2007, I posted a list of examples of published > informational RFCs that include this language. That demonstrates that > RFC2119 language is allowed in informational RFC's. In my view, it is not completely relevant what has been tolerated historically. The only question in my opinion is what RFC 2119 says it is intended to do. Since it says that it is intended to be used for standards, and since this draft does not propose any standard for the Internet community, I can't see how RFC 2119 language ought to be used. > Security vulnerabilities are included as harms that 2119 is talking > about. You haven't refuted the statements I proposed putting in the > Security Considerations section. I didn't see anything to refute. I said so, I think, especially in . I know that I asked why you thought your formulation was better than what is in the draft, and you said that the draft is ambiguous. I asked the community whether they agreed, which is how we got this thread. For what it's worth, I think you have used the word "ambiguous" to mean "does not say something I agree with". It is probably true that the draft does not say unequivocally, "You should do _X_." I think that is correct: I don't believe that there is one right answer for all cases with respect to reverse mappings. I think that there are cases where adding more PTRs will do more harm than good. That said, in most cases I think it is possibly useful for other users on the Internet if people maintain matching reverse mappings for their hosts; and, to the extent interoperation is aided by possibly useful things, we should therefore come down mildly in favour of such things. > > That is, you might think it a foolish thing to draw any conclusions > > from reverse tree data; that does not mean that others, with different > > experiences or situations, would in their cases reach the same > > conclusion. > > Indeed, logic does mean that other rational persons would reach the same > logical conclusions. Mathematical logic doesn't change due to > experience or situation which are irrelevant to the assertions. [. . .] > This is exactly the distinction between rational and irrational. I'm afraid that you have fallen into equating "rational" and "logical". They are not the same thing, as we can see by considering the difference between deductive and inductive reasoning. The current discussion cannot be resolved exclusively with deductive reasoning, because we are discussing individual administrators' decisions about how to respond to traffic arriving at their networks, on the basis of an admittedly poor metric. That poor metric's results are to be evaluated in light of other evidence; I think the draft already says as much. (I have made some edits that will appear in the -02 draft -- to be uploaded as soon as Daniel and I have agreed on the final words -- to strengthen that message, because of the feedback the group has provided, but -02 will not say anything substantively different than it already says, I think. These edits are in addition to the changes I already committed to.) It is not irrational to make decisions on the basis of imperfect evidence. Nearly every empirical conclusion works the same way. (Try using mathematical logic against Berkelian idealism. For that matter, we have plenty of reason to believe that the data Kepler was working with was not terribly good; he was nevertheless right.) And in our world, where different people are trying to solve different problems on the basis of the same poor evidence, I think it not at all surprising that rational people reach different conclusions even in light of the same evidence. You seem to believe that using the reverse tree in decision making in some of these cases is always wrong. Other users with relevant experience &c. have reached a different conclusion, presumably on the basis of their experience and the evidence at their disposal. This difference is why the draft generally tries to argue both that people should provide reverse mappings all else being equal, and also that people shouldn't put too much stock in the non-existence or non-matching of the reverse data. I hope this makes it clearer to you why the draft takes the approach it does. Best regards, A -- Andrew Sullivan 204-4141 Yonge Street Afilias Canada Toronto, Ontario Canada M2P 2A8 jabber: ajsaf@jabber.org +1 416 646 3304 x4110 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 20 18:25:46 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJeLF-0000Hn-Lz; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:24:13 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJeLE-0000HU-2a for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:24:12 -0500 Received: from vgateway.libertyrms.info ([207.219.45.62] helo=mail.libertyrms.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJeLD-0002cg-Nk for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:24:12 -0500 Received: from andrew-vpn.int.libertyrms.com ([10.1.7.6] helo=trilby.local) by mail.libertyrms.com with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1HJeL5-0004Qt-BY for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:24:03 -0500 Received: by roaming6.int.libertyrms.com (Postfix, from userid 1019) id DADE92B1578; Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:23:53 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 18:23:53 -0500 From: Andrew Sullivan To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] reverse-mapping-considerations: ambiguity? Message-ID: <20070220232353.GB5501@afilias.info> References: <20070216223040.GB2958@afilias.info> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: andrew@ca.afilias.info X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 34d35111647d654d033d58d318c0d21a X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Andrew Sullivan List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Hi Dean, On Sun, Feb 18, 2007 at 01:11:15AM -0500, Dean Anderson wrote: > On January 8, 2007, I posted a list of examples of published > informational RFCs that include this language. That demonstrates that > RFC2119 language is allowed in informational RFC's. In my view, it is not completely relevant what has been tolerated historically. The only question in my opinion is what RFC 2119 says it is intended to do. Since it says that it is intended to be used for standards, and since this draft does not propose any standard for the Internet community, I can't see how RFC 2119 language ought to be used. > Security vulnerabilities are included as harms that 2119 is talking > about. You haven't refuted the statements I proposed putting in the > Security Considerations section. I didn't see anything to refute. I said so, I think, especially in . I know that I asked why you thought your formulation was better than what is in the draft, and you said that the draft is ambiguous. I asked the community whether they agreed, which is how we got this thread. For what it's worth, I think you have used the word "ambiguous" to mean "does not say something I agree with". It is probably true that the draft does not say unequivocally, "You should do _X_." I think that is correct: I don't believe that there is one right answer for all cases with respect to reverse mappings. I think that there are cases where adding more PTRs will do more harm than good. That said, in most cases I think it is possibly useful for other users on the Internet if people maintain matching reverse mappings for their hosts; and, to the extent interoperation is aided by possibly useful things, we should therefore come down mildly in favour of such things. > > That is, you might think it a foolish thing to draw any conclusions > > from reverse tree data; that does not mean that others, with different > > experiences or situations, would in their cases reach the same > > conclusion. > > Indeed, logic does mean that other rational persons would reach the same > logical conclusions. Mathematical logic doesn't change due to > experience or situation which are irrelevant to the assertions. [. . .] > This is exactly the distinction between rational and irrational. I'm afraid that you have fallen into equating "rational" and "logical". They are not the same thing, as we can see by considering the difference between deductive and inductive reasoning. The current discussion cannot be resolved exclusively with deductive reasoning, because we are discussing individual administrators' decisions about how to respond to traffic arriving at their networks, on the basis of an admittedly poor metric. That poor metric's results are to be evaluated in light of other evidence; I think the draft already says as much. (I have made some edits that will appear in the -02 draft -- to be uploaded as soon as Daniel and I have agreed on the final words -- to strengthen that message, because of the feedback the group has provided, but -02 will not say anything substantively different than it already says, I think. These edits are in addition to the changes I already committed to.) It is not irrational to make decisions on the basis of imperfect evidence. Nearly every empirical conclusion works the same way. (Try using mathematical logic against Berkelian idealism. For that matter, we have plenty of reason to believe that the data Kepler was working with was not terribly good; he was nevertheless right.) And in our world, where different people are trying to solve different problems on the basis of the same poor evidence, I think it not at all surprising that rational people reach different conclusions even in light of the same evidence. You seem to believe that using the reverse tree in decision making in some of these cases is always wrong. Other users with relevant experience &c. have reached a different conclusion, presumably on the basis of their experience and the evidence at their disposal. This difference is why the draft generally tries to argue both that people should provide reverse mappings all else being equal, and also that people shouldn't put too much stock in the non-existence or non-matching of the reverse data. I hope this makes it clearer to you why the draft takes the approach it does. Best regards, A -- Andrew Sullivan 204-4141 Yonge Street Afilias Canada Toronto, Ontario Canada M2P 2A8 jabber: ajsaf@jabber.org +1 416 646 3304 x4110 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 21 04:49:34 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJo3T-00013t-Qa; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 04:46:31 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJo3S-00013j-Tu for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 04:46:30 -0500 Received: from mx2.nic.fr ([192.134.4.11]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJo3R-0001h6-LC for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 04:46:30 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mx2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2DBA026C272; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 10:46:25 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at mx2.nic.fr Received: from relay2.nic.fr (relay2.nic.fr [192.134.4.163]) by mx2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C55826C268; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 10:46:24 +0100 (CET) Received: from bortzmeyer.nic.fr (batilda.nic.fr [192.134.4.69]) by relay2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 88E2E58ED19; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 10:46:24 +0100 (CET) Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2007 10:46:24 +0100 From: Stephane Bortzmeyer To: Evan Hunt Message-ID: <20070221094624.GA14950@nic.fr> References: <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> <2132.1171947623@sa.vix.com> <18BE4426-D59D-43D1-B458-A88DCABBE90C@rfc1035.com> <20070220161648.GE4846@afilias.info> <7.0.1.0.2.20070220121653.06de24f0@senie.com> <20070220185044.GA10150@isc.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20070220185044.GA10150@isc.org> X-Operating-System: Debian GNU/Linux 4.0 X-Kernel: Linux 2.6.17-2-686 i686 Organization: NIC France X-URL: http://www.nic.fr/ User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) X-Spam-Score: 0.6 (/) X-Scan-Signature: ffa9dfbbe7cc58b3fa6b8ae3e57b0aa3 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] Re: what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Tue, Feb 20, 2007 at 06:50:44PM +0000, Evan Hunt wrote a message of 27 lines which said: > There may have been some confusion about the meaning of "default". ... > Shipping with a default config file, which *overrides* the system > defaults in some socially-appropriate manner, is totally different. > I'd be a lot more open to that, personally. I am not sure that there is a difference. For me, "default" is "the behaviour you get when you do the absolute minimum of work", which is, for most Unix, typing "aptitude install bind" or "emerge bind" or "pkg_add bind". For most Unix, things "just work" after that and many sysadmins will not go further. The fact that the default is in the code or in the installed config file seems irrelevant to me. Which means, BTW, that the "default BIND behavious" may not be choosen by ISC, but by Debian, Gentoo or FreeBSD. (The good thing about config files is that you can put comments in them, such as "uncomment this only if you know what you are doing".) _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 21 04:49:34 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJo3T-00013t-Qa; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 04:46:31 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJo3S-00013j-Tu for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 04:46:30 -0500 Received: from mx2.nic.fr ([192.134.4.11]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJo3R-0001h6-LC for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 04:46:30 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mx2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2DBA026C272; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 10:46:25 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at mx2.nic.fr Received: from relay2.nic.fr (relay2.nic.fr [192.134.4.163]) by mx2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C55826C268; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 10:46:24 +0100 (CET) Received: from bortzmeyer.nic.fr (batilda.nic.fr [192.134.4.69]) by relay2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 88E2E58ED19; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 10:46:24 +0100 (CET) Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2007 10:46:24 +0100 From: Stephane Bortzmeyer To: Evan Hunt Message-ID: <20070221094624.GA14950@nic.fr> References: <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> <2132.1171947623@sa.vix.com> <18BE4426-D59D-43D1-B458-A88DCABBE90C@rfc1035.com> <20070220161648.GE4846@afilias.info> <7.0.1.0.2.20070220121653.06de24f0@senie.com> <20070220185044.GA10150@isc.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20070220185044.GA10150@isc.org> X-Operating-System: Debian GNU/Linux 4.0 X-Kernel: Linux 2.6.17-2-686 i686 Organization: NIC France X-URL: http://www.nic.fr/ User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) X-Spam-Score: 0.6 (/) X-Scan-Signature: ffa9dfbbe7cc58b3fa6b8ae3e57b0aa3 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] Re: what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Tue, Feb 20, 2007 at 06:50:44PM +0000, Evan Hunt wrote a message of 27 lines which said: > There may have been some confusion about the meaning of "default". ... > Shipping with a default config file, which *overrides* the system > defaults in some socially-appropriate manner, is totally different. > I'd be a lot more open to that, personally. I am not sure that there is a difference. For me, "default" is "the behaviour you get when you do the absolute minimum of work", which is, for most Unix, typing "aptitude install bind" or "emerge bind" or "pkg_add bind". For most Unix, things "just work" after that and many sysadmins will not go further. The fact that the default is in the code or in the installed config file seems irrelevant to me. Which means, BTW, that the "default BIND behavious" may not be choosen by ISC, but by Debian, Gentoo or FreeBSD. (The good thing about config files is that you can put comments in them, such as "uncomment this only if you know what you are doing".) _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From qescherichia@juergen-cappel.de Wed Feb 21 05:36:54 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJoqE-0002so-KU for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 05:36:54 -0500 Received: from s01060040053080f2.gv.shawcable.net ([70.66.59.75]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJoqD-0003LI-40 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 05:36:54 -0500 Received: from paladin ([40.97.40.46]) by S01060040053080f2.gv.shawcable.net (3.99.5/3.99.5) with SMTP id mcOMOM2Lck1UnB; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 02:36:53 -0800 Message-ID: <001901c75561$255785b0$002aa76c@paladin> From: "Dexter Kenney" To: "dnsop-archive" Subject: As bungalow by characteristic Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2007 02:35:09 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0016_01C75561.255785B0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2462.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2462.181 X-Spam-Score: 2.2 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 8b431ad66d60be2d47c7bfeb879db82c ------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C75561.255785B0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This gem is really movable.. 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------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C75561.255785B0-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 21 09:45:10 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJseV-0008QB-V0; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 09:41:03 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJseU-0008OT-NG for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 09:41:02 -0500 Received: from m4.sparta.com ([157.185.61.2]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJseR-0007Ct-7a for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 09:41:02 -0500 Received: from Beta5.sparta.com (beta5.sparta.com [157.185.63.21]) by M4.sparta.com (8.13.5/8.13.5) with ESMTP id l1LEewGY013201 for ; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 08:40:58 -0600 Received: from garak.ads.sparta.com (garak.sparta.com [157.185.63.81]) by Beta5.sparta.com (8.12.11/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1LEexdn027293 for ; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 08:40:59 -0600 Received: from mailbin2.ads.sparta.com ([157.185.85.6]) by garak.ads.sparta.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 21 Feb 2007 08:40:58 -0600 Received: from spx.vb.futz.org ([216.27.162.138]) by mailbin2.ads.sparta.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 21 Feb 2007 09:41:26 -0500 Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2007 09:40:42 -0500 From: Robert Story Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Message-ID: <20070221094042.1f57c950@spx.vb.futz.org> In-Reply-To: <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> Organization: SPARTA X-Mailer: Claws Mail 2.7.2 (GTK+ 2.8.20; powerpc-redhat-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Feb 2007 14:41:27.0031 (UTC) FILETIME=[5DE1C070:01C755C6] X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 0ddefe323dd869ab027dbfff7eff0465 X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0874952166==" Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --===============0874952166== Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Sig_.j5thf1.806MyKF6_/4acjL"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=PGP-SHA1 --Sig_.j5thf1.806MyKF6_/4acjL Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable >> > server 10.0.0.0/8 { bogus yes; }; >> > server 172.16.0.0/12 { bogus yes; }; >> > server 192.168.0.0/16 { bogus yes; }; =20 PV> > I'm possibly confused. The scenario I was thinking of seems to involv= e two PV> > nameservers on the same 10.x.x.x network that want to point to each o= ther PV> > (for zones that aren't visible off the local network), but don't want= to PV> > accept 10.x.x.x addresses from anyone outside the network. PV>=20 PV> i don't know if it's contrived. i do know that i'm comfortable with th= e idea PV> that this configuration Would Not Work By Default. if someone wants to= use PV> private address space for DNS work, they should have to run an extra kn= ob. I don't agree with you in this case. If the server line noted above are the default (which I support), I think there should also be an exception for the listening IP subnet(s)/localnets. eg. server localnets { bogus no; }; Of course, there is also a difference between packets received from outside the local net and inside. A local ip from a local server is fine; the same address from an external server is suspect. --=20 Robert Story SPARTA --Sig_.j5thf1.806MyKF6_/4acjL Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFF3Fnt7/fVLLY1mngRAqeYAJwMSFGOq2NzFE2Pl5LPlKIdLpgWWQCgnw+o EXRgE5LMUjty9lWSPmMuH6M= =AF0w -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig_.j5thf1.806MyKF6_/4acjL-- --===============0874952166== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --===============0874952166==-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 21 09:45:10 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJseV-0008QB-V0; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 09:41:03 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJseU-0008OT-NG for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 09:41:02 -0500 Received: from m4.sparta.com ([157.185.61.2]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJseR-0007Ct-7a for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 09:41:02 -0500 Received: from Beta5.sparta.com (beta5.sparta.com [157.185.63.21]) by M4.sparta.com (8.13.5/8.13.5) with ESMTP id l1LEewGY013201 for ; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 08:40:58 -0600 Received: from garak.ads.sparta.com (garak.sparta.com [157.185.63.81]) by Beta5.sparta.com (8.12.11/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l1LEexdn027293 for ; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 08:40:59 -0600 Received: from mailbin2.ads.sparta.com ([157.185.85.6]) by garak.ads.sparta.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 21 Feb 2007 08:40:58 -0600 Received: from spx.vb.futz.org ([216.27.162.138]) by mailbin2.ads.sparta.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 21 Feb 2007 09:41:26 -0500 Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2007 09:40:42 -0500 From: Robert Story Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Message-ID: <20070221094042.1f57c950@spx.vb.futz.org> In-Reply-To: <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <45D9621C.9000402@alvestrand.no> <97215.1171896656@sa.vix.com> <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> Organization: SPARTA X-Mailer: Claws Mail 2.7.2 (GTK+ 2.8.20; powerpc-redhat-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Feb 2007 14:41:27.0031 (UTC) FILETIME=[5DE1C070:01C755C6] X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 0ddefe323dd869ab027dbfff7eff0465 X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0874952166==" Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --===============0874952166== Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Sig_.j5thf1.806MyKF6_/4acjL"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=PGP-SHA1 --Sig_.j5thf1.806MyKF6_/4acjL Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable >> > server 10.0.0.0/8 { bogus yes; }; >> > server 172.16.0.0/12 { bogus yes; }; >> > server 192.168.0.0/16 { bogus yes; }; =20 PV> > I'm possibly confused. The scenario I was thinking of seems to involv= e two PV> > nameservers on the same 10.x.x.x network that want to point to each o= ther PV> > (for zones that aren't visible off the local network), but don't want= to PV> > accept 10.x.x.x addresses from anyone outside the network. PV>=20 PV> i don't know if it's contrived. i do know that i'm comfortable with th= e idea PV> that this configuration Would Not Work By Default. if someone wants to= use PV> private address space for DNS work, they should have to run an extra kn= ob. I don't agree with you in this case. If the server line noted above are the default (which I support), I think there should also be an exception for the listening IP subnet(s)/localnets. eg. server localnets { bogus no; }; Of course, there is also a difference between packets received from outside the local net and inside. A local ip from a local server is fine; the same address from an external server is suspect. --=20 Robert Story SPARTA --Sig_.j5thf1.806MyKF6_/4acjL Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFF3Fnt7/fVLLY1mngRAqeYAJwMSFGOq2NzFE2Pl5LPlKIdLpgWWQCgnw+o EXRgE5LMUjty9lWSPmMuH6M= =AF0w -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Sig_.j5thf1.806MyKF6_/4acjL-- --===============0874952166== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --===============0874952166==-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 21 11:41:46 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJuVb-0002Si-8C; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 11:39:59 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJuVZ-0002Sb-LX for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 11:39:57 -0500 Received: from sa.vix.com ([2001:4f8:3:bb::1]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJuVZ-0001BH-EZ for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 11:39:57 -0500 Received: by sa.vix.com (Postfix, from userid 716) id A5C3A1142D; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 16:39:36 +0000 (UTC) To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something References: <20070221094042.1f57c950@spx.vb.futz.org> From: Paul Vixie Date: 21 Feb 2007 16:39:36 +0000 In-Reply-To: <20070221094042.1f57c950@spx.vb.futz.org> Message-ID: Lines: 13 User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 7a6398bf8aaeabc7a7bb696b6b0a2aad X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org This change-of-default is analagous to the change to limit recursion to the local network. This change will break many working configurations, but the danger of open recursive nameservers is so high that the cost of having a lot of configurations stop working after a software upgrade is bearable. So it is, in my view, in the case of leaking RFC 1918 addresses. Yes, it will mean you can't always copy a config file and get expected behaviour. Yes, it will break working configurations after a software upgrade. But, for the good of the internet community, we have to be willing to do the "tough love" thing from time to time. -- Paul Vixie _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 21 11:41:47 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJuVb-0002Si-8C; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 11:39:59 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJuVZ-0002Sb-LX for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 11:39:57 -0500 Received: from sa.vix.com ([2001:4f8:3:bb::1]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJuVZ-0001BH-EZ for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 11:39:57 -0500 Received: by sa.vix.com (Postfix, from userid 716) id A5C3A1142D; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 16:39:36 +0000 (UTC) To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something References: <20070221094042.1f57c950@spx.vb.futz.org> From: Paul Vixie Date: 21 Feb 2007 16:39:36 +0000 In-Reply-To: <20070221094042.1f57c950@spx.vb.futz.org> Message-ID: Lines: 13 User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 7a6398bf8aaeabc7a7bb696b6b0a2aad X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org This change-of-default is analagous to the change to limit recursion to the local network. This change will break many working configurations, but the danger of open recursive nameservers is so high that the cost of having a lot of configurations stop working after a software upgrade is bearable. So it is, in my view, in the case of leaking RFC 1918 addresses. Yes, it will mean you can't always copy a config file and get expected behaviour. Yes, it will break working configurations after a software upgrade. But, for the good of the internet community, we have to be willing to do the "tough love" thing from time to time. -- Paul Vixie _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 21 12:23:15 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJv8w-0001Zl-RZ; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 12:20:38 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJv8v-0001Zg-FV for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 12:20:37 -0500 Received: from mx.isc.org ([2001:4f8:0:2::1c]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJv8u-0003zV-PT for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 12:20:37 -0500 Received: from farside.isc.org (farside.isc.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:3:bb::5]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "farside.isc.org", Issuer "ISC CA" (verified OK)) by mx.isc.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A51BB114025; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 17:20:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from Evan_Hunt@isc.org) Received: by farside.isc.org (Postfix, from userid 10292) id 845C7E60C7; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 17:20:31 +0000 (UTC) Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2007 17:20:31 +0000 From: Evan Hunt To: Stephane Bortzmeyer Message-ID: <20070221172031.GA36414@isc.org> References: <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> <2132.1171947623@sa.vix.com> <18BE4426-D59D-43D1-B458-A88DCABBE90C@rfc1035.com> <20070220161648.GE4846@afilias.info> <7.0.1.0.2.20070220121653.06de24f0@senie.com> <20070220185044.GA10150@isc.org> <20070221094624.GA14950@nic.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20070221094624.GA14950@nic.fr> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.1i X-Spam-Score: -2.2 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 79899194edc4f33a41f49410777972f8 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] Re: what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > I am not sure that there is a difference. For me, "default" is "the > behaviour you get when you do the absolute minimum of work", which is, > for most Unix, typing "aptitude install bind" or "emerge bind" or > "pkg_add bind". For some sysadmins, that's the absolute minimum of work. For others, the absolute minimum is to take their existing named.conf and zone files from a running server and drop them onto a new system with no modification. If you've changed the _intrinsic_ default behavior, then their nameserver won't work anymore; they'll have to edit their files to add new directives to bring the original behavior back. This will make them grumpy. But if whoever does the packaging provides a default config file (or a suite of them to choose from, perhaps), without altering the intrinsic behavior of named, that satisfies both kinds of sysadmin. -- Evan Hunt -- evan_hunt@isc.org Internet Systems Consortium, Inc. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 21 12:23:15 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJv8w-0001Zl-RZ; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 12:20:38 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJv8v-0001Zg-FV for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 12:20:37 -0500 Received: from mx.isc.org ([2001:4f8:0:2::1c]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJv8u-0003zV-PT for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 12:20:37 -0500 Received: from farside.isc.org (farside.isc.org [IPv6:2001:4f8:3:bb::5]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "farside.isc.org", Issuer "ISC CA" (verified OK)) by mx.isc.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A51BB114025; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 17:20:31 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from Evan_Hunt@isc.org) Received: by farside.isc.org (Postfix, from userid 10292) id 845C7E60C7; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 17:20:31 +0000 (UTC) Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2007 17:20:31 +0000 From: Evan Hunt To: Stephane Bortzmeyer Message-ID: <20070221172031.GA36414@isc.org> References: <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> <2132.1171947623@sa.vix.com> <18BE4426-D59D-43D1-B458-A88DCABBE90C@rfc1035.com> <20070220161648.GE4846@afilias.info> <7.0.1.0.2.20070220121653.06de24f0@senie.com> <20070220185044.GA10150@isc.org> <20070221094624.GA14950@nic.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20070221094624.GA14950@nic.fr> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.1i X-Spam-Score: -2.2 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 79899194edc4f33a41f49410777972f8 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] Re: what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > I am not sure that there is a difference. For me, "default" is "the > behaviour you get when you do the absolute minimum of work", which is, > for most Unix, typing "aptitude install bind" or "emerge bind" or > "pkg_add bind". For some sysadmins, that's the absolute minimum of work. For others, the absolute minimum is to take their existing named.conf and zone files from a running server and drop them onto a new system with no modification. If you've changed the _intrinsic_ default behavior, then their nameserver won't work anymore; they'll have to edit their files to add new directives to bring the original behavior back. This will make them grumpy. But if whoever does the packaging provides a default config file (or a suite of them to choose from, perhaps), without altering the intrinsic behavior of named, that satisfies both kinds of sysadmin. -- Evan Hunt -- evan_hunt@isc.org Internet Systems Consortium, Inc. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From nkksensor@drgneenterprises.com Wed Feb 21 13:38:33 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJwML-0000pY-9c for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 13:38:33 -0500 Received: from [218.19.54.82] (helo=drgneenterprises.com) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJwMH-0005SL-2z for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 13:38:33 -0500 Received: from ef3mej776qs3z2j ([162.193.216.69]) by 218.19.54.82 (7.05.1/7.05.1) with SMTP id zZJmBfFKrjfkI4; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 02:37:26 +0800 Message-ID: <001901c7562a$63e0f1d0$04c316b4@ef3mej776qs3z2j> From: "Irene Busby" To: "dnsop-archive" Subject: He of poultry Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 02:35:49 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0016_01C7562A.63E0F1D0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2462.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2462.2963 X-Spam-Score: 4.7 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 8b431ad66d60be2d47c7bfeb879db82c ------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C7562A.63E0F1D0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable HOT ALERT!!! 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------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C7562A.63E0F1D0-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 21 13:53:21 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJwYl-0003iO-ND; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 13:51:23 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJwYk-0003i9-3f for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 13:51:22 -0500 Received: from a.mail.sonic.net ([64.142.16.245]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJwYi-0002cL-NV for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 13:51:22 -0500 Received: from [10.2.164.130] (SJC-Office-NAT-217.Mail-Abuse.ORG [168.61.10.217]) (authenticated bits=0) by a.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id l1LIpIRC031950 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO); Wed, 21 Feb 2007 10:51:20 -0800 In-Reply-To: <20070221172031.GA36414@isc.org> References: <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> <2132.1171947623@sa.vix.com> <18BE4426-D59D-43D1-B458-A88DCABBE90C@rfc1035.com> <20070220161648.GE4846@afilias.info> <7.0.1.0.2.20070220121653.06de24f0@senie.com> <20070220185044.GA10150@isc.org> <20070221094624.GA14950@nic.fr> <20070221172031.GA36414@isc.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <8BE3268F-44D1-4EBD-AC98-09D88CCB4B2A@mail-abuse.org> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Douglas Otis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Re: what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2007 10:51:22 -0800 To: Evan Hunt X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 97adf591118a232206bdb5a27b217034 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Feb 21, 2007, at 9:20 AM, Evan Hunt wrote: > >> I am not sure that there is a difference. For me, "default" is >> "the behaviour you get when you do the absolute minimum of work", >> which is, for most Unix, typing "aptitude install bind" or "emerge >> bind" or "pkg_add bind". > > For some sysadmins, that's the absolute minimum of work. For > others, the absolute minimum is to take their existing named.conf > and zone files from a running server and drop them onto a new > system with no modification. If you've changed the _intrinsic_ > default behavior, then their nameserver won't work anymore; they'll > have to edit their files to add new directives to bring the > original behavior back. This will make them grumpy. > > But if whoever does the packaging provides a default config file > (or a suite of them to choose from, perhaps), without altering the > intrinsic behavior of named, that satisfies both kinds of sysadmin. By defining something like: allow-private-only-from {...} could then be used to setup a filter with undefined name servers. The "new" default config file could then include this statement without any name servers listed. This would not "break" systems upgraded that use prior configuration files, but new installations might need to comment out this configuration or fill in the permitted servers. -Doug _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 21 13:53:21 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJwYl-0003iO-ND; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 13:51:23 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJwYk-0003i9-3f for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 13:51:22 -0500 Received: from a.mail.sonic.net ([64.142.16.245]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HJwYi-0002cL-NV for dnsop@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 13:51:22 -0500 Received: from [10.2.164.130] (SJC-Office-NAT-217.Mail-Abuse.ORG [168.61.10.217]) (authenticated bits=0) by a.mail.sonic.net (8.13.8.Beta0-Sonic/8.13.7) with ESMTP id l1LIpIRC031950 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO); Wed, 21 Feb 2007 10:51:20 -0800 In-Reply-To: <20070221172031.GA36414@isc.org> References: <40913.1171916202@sa.vix.com> <2132.1171947623@sa.vix.com> <18BE4426-D59D-43D1-B458-A88DCABBE90C@rfc1035.com> <20070220161648.GE4846@afilias.info> <7.0.1.0.2.20070220121653.06de24f0@senie.com> <20070220185044.GA10150@isc.org> <20070221094624.GA14950@nic.fr> <20070221172031.GA36414@isc.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <8BE3268F-44D1-4EBD-AC98-09D88CCB4B2A@mail-abuse.org> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Douglas Otis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Re: what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2007 10:51:22 -0800 To: Evan Hunt X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 97adf591118a232206bdb5a27b217034 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Feb 21, 2007, at 9:20 AM, Evan Hunt wrote: > >> I am not sure that there is a difference. For me, "default" is >> "the behaviour you get when you do the absolute minimum of work", >> which is, for most Unix, typing "aptitude install bind" or "emerge >> bind" or "pkg_add bind". > > For some sysadmins, that's the absolute minimum of work. For > others, the absolute minimum is to take their existing named.conf > and zone files from a running server and drop them onto a new > system with no modification. If you've changed the _intrinsic_ > default behavior, then their nameserver won't work anymore; they'll > have to edit their files to add new directives to bring the > original behavior back. This will make them grumpy. > > But if whoever does the packaging provides a default config file > (or a suite of them to choose from, perhaps), without altering the > intrinsic behavior of named, that satisfies both kinds of sysadmin. By defining something like: allow-private-only-from {...} could then be used to setup a filter with undefined name servers. The "new" default config file could then include this statement without any name servers listed. This would not "break" systems upgraded that use prior configuration files, but new installations might need to comment out this configuration or fill in the permitted servers. -Doug _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From tycatmosphere@mikov-consulting.com Wed Feb 21 19:12:57 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HK1Zx-0005vg-Cp for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 19:12:57 -0500 Received: from [125.127.158.225] (helo=mikov-consulting.com) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HK1Zv-00016L-0K for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 21 Feb 2007 19:12:56 -0500 Received: from NDEERXP ([240.175.30.225]) by 125.127.158.225 (3.66.4/3.66.4) with SMTP id EWM3PLLQ0mr9BT; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 08:12:55 +0800 Message-ID: <001c01c75659$417679b0$04c88e64@NDEERXP> From: "Bernard Perkins" To: "dnsop-archive" Subject: Of at wee Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 08:10:15 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0019_01C75659.417679B0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.0000 X-Spam-Score: 1.6 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 4d87d2aa806f79fed918a62e834505ca ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01C75659.417679B0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Take adventage.. 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------=_NextPart_000_0019_01C75659.417679B0-- From shaunjpyybu@iwashou.com Thu Feb 22 06:18:10 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKBxi-0001Dr-1V; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 06:18:10 -0500 Received: from [222.132.184.243] (helo=iwashou.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKBxU-0003ZQ-Jx; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 06:18:10 -0500 Message-ID: <147601c75670$e3af4970$9a273338@shaunjpyybu> Reply-To: "Eusebio Chavez" From: "Eusebio Chavez" To: "monte henderson" Cc: "shaquana matthews" , "fatimah payne" , "guadalupe webb" , "klara hall" , "adelaide peters" , "lashunda stephens" , "thomas king" , "lekisha ryan" , "corliss stone" , "edmund" , "micah" Subject: Afternoon Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 11:02:05 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_57B_6946_F2B3F233.D27BF6B7" X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.02.2022 X-Spam-Score: 3.8 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: d437399464e10b52abe9a34ed7e712d0 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_57B_6946_F2B3F233.D27BF6B7 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_366_8BB9_8BEED2EE.496EB532" ------=_NextPart_366_8BB9_8BEED2EE.496EB532 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "And sweet limit fresh wood who is Beppo?" mine overtake "Ah, yes, I u= p understand," grip replied the patron, "to f "Favorably or otherwise?"Gi= ovanni obeyed. arrive Franz took the muscle cough goat lamp, and entered = THUS, axillary tail AT LENGTH, knowledge by forgo one of the unexpected s= trokes "The pull Chateau d'If has no easy berry cemetery, forgo and they = simply "Well," observed the practise degree Englishman as if step eng= ine he were slow The went night divide petite was one of pomaceous feverish distraction, a= nd in prose "Oh, Beppo square space is employed in the cushion prison, and I gi= ve hWhen injure Franz tire day appeared again from on the shore, the yach= t"Both.""Don't wept theory you remember," said the patron, thread mute "I= told you The old patron curve tell did not interfere, for brake attempt he too had= r "Well, thick rarely they fastened a thirty-six harmony obtain poun= d ball to hi "Really!" page bit wonderful drab exclaimed the Englishman. =   Now this plastic solitude was fresh peopled with page horse his thoughts,= t blind cause "Indeed! unusual You are compete a provident person, I see."w= rung "True; and he is apologise going gone to land expand them," added Fr= anz.forgiven "The crime hair deuce!--and expect what is this condition?""= Precisely whip run split buy so," replied Gaetano. "Ah, he is one wh = square Edmond gazed effect very earnestly flame at the terminal mass of r= ocks w stank want "Yes, sir," cerebral continued the inspector run of pr= isons. "Y "That bathe balance would lift salt have been difficult." = flap broadcast The island was familiar attempt to the crew of help The Yo= ung A "That limit you are doubt ship blindfolded, and do ripe not take= off the "Why, you see, no one knows rice sternly woman wrote what may happen. Per= ha"But such services as these dreamt sail connection might shade involve = him with"What guard cover should you do guide slit in my place?""And bare= part boot what cares blown he for that," replied Gaetano with crept voice "Why, outstanding on board the grown tartan," replied the sai= lor. "No matter," sleepy replied De Boville, boat brass blood in supreme = good-h "So press violently concerned can I," said the Englishman, rely= and he laughed to leap "Briefly, change part what boiling did you glean?"It was long defian= tly perfectly clear tempt that dealt the Signor Sinbad, Frareaction "I, w= ho have nothing to argument spoke back lose,--I should go."He float set b= it satisfy out, and on the Saturday decide evening reached th "Should we escape not do blade violently better busy in the grottos?""And= so," continued float statement decide the card Englishman who first gain= e "Unquestionably." "What grottos?" "That bubble two executions copper advertisement false of considerable in= terest willThe took apartment consisted of spread suppose two small scrat= ch rooms and a p"You would accept?""What bound as slippery to the mouth s= now carriage?" exclaimed Albert. "Come fool "Why, the grottos--caves sling pump concerned of the island." about = sip driven "So that the governor got rid of force the dangerous and "P= recisely."   suppose punish "I do not know of any burned exercise grottos," replied Ja= copo. Th"Sir," play cost replied the host, brought "we flash will do all = in our po ------=_NextPart_366_8BB9_8BEED2EE.496EB532 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

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THUS, axillary tail AT LENGTH, knowledge by forgo one of the unexpected s= trokes "The pull Chateau d'If has no easy berry cemetery, forgo and = they simply     "Well," observed the practise de= gree Englishman as if step engine he were slow   
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prose "Oh, Beppo square space is employed in the cushion prison, and I gi= ve hWhen injure Franz tire day appeared again from on the shore, the yach= t"Both.""Don't wept theory you remember," said the patron, thread mute "I= told you  
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chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKDb7-00084k-QO for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 08:03:03 -0500 Received: from MICROSOFCF8315 ([36.168.104.10]) by 218.64.151.7 (4.59.8/4.59.8) with SMTP id S8mTh674AFzcRU; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 21:02:56 +0800 Message-ID: <001c01c756c4$d44fd950$00cab484@MICROSOFCF8315> From: "Dixie Coker" To: "dnsop-archive" Subject: Is preposterous of vestigial Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 21:01:09 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0019_01C756C4.D44FD950" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2462.2962 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2462.1106 X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7aafa0432175920a4b3e118e16c5cb64 ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01C756C4.D44FD950 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Get it before the RUSH! Campaign for: CBRJPrice: $1.70 Market: hellish! TRADE SMART AND WIN WITH US NOW! CBRJ have released very hot news. Check this out, dnsop-archive!!! ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01C756C4.D44FD950 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


Get it before the = RUSH...



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TRADE = SMART AND WIN WITH US NOW...


CBRJ = have released very hot news. Check this out, = dnsop-archive...


------=_NextPart_000_0019_01C756C4.D44FD950-- From uxfbates@netmarket-media.com Thu Feb 22 08:06:41 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKDej-0005wq-LU for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 08:06:41 -0500 Received: from [60.17.141.247] (helo=netmarket-media.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKDeh-00016Z-Az for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 08:06:41 -0500 Received: from 33BE3C240E8440F ([62.225.24.56]) by 60.17.141.247 (6.37.3/6.37.3) with SMTP id YegJ29AJ9rEtCH; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 21:06:54 +0800 Message-ID: <001b01c756c5$6186d1c0$00a80f5c@33BE3C240E8440F> From: "Gilda Jaramillo" To: "dnsop-archive" Subject: Be an sara Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 21:05:47 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0018_01C756C5.6186D1C0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-Spam-Score: 1.9 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 538aad3a3c4f01d8b6a6477ca4248793 ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C756C5.6186D1C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Just take a look at this one.. Campaign for: CBRJPrice: $1.70 Market: hellish... WATCH IT LIKE A HAWK. CBRJ has a nice fresh news, dnsop-archive!! ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C756C5.6186D1C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Just take a look at this = one..

Campaign for: CBRJ
Price: $1.70
Market: = hellish..

WATCH = IT LIKE A HAWK..


CBRJ = has a nice fresh news, dnsop-archive.

------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C756C5.6186D1C0-- From kixwainwright@affiliatemark.com Thu Feb 22 08:10:53 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKDin-0000Hh-2g for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 08:10:53 -0500 Received: from [217.96.23.99] (helo=isis.ozarow.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKDij-0001Zb-VP for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 08:10:53 -0500 Received: from asia ([152.41.235.178]) by isis.ozarow.net (7.36.5/7.36.5) with SMTP id KFrjfQnoQA68mU; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 14:12:28 +0100 Message-ID: <001901c7568b$7bce77c0$0503de74@asia> From: "Fernando Banks" To: "dnsop-archive" Subject: To delta to chaotic Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 14:11:18 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0016_01C7568B.7BCE77C0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.0000 X-Spam-Score: 4.6 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 8b431ad66d60be2d47c7bfeb879db82c ------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C7568B.7BCE77C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable YOU'VE SEEN IT BEFORE YOU SAY?!!! Search for: CBRJCurrent price: $1.70 Market: bullish.. SOMEBODY KNOWS SOMETHING. Check the news of CBRJ, dnsop-archive!!! ------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C7568B.7BCE77C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

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Check = the news of CBRJ, dnsop-archive..

------=_NextPart_000_0016_01C7568B.7BCE77C0-- From kcmehnhystd@orexovo.net Thu Feb 22 08:15:38 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKDnO-0002F5-Nb for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 08:15:38 -0500 Received: from 8888.orexovo.net ([85.30.195.171]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKDnN-0002JK-Cv for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 08:15:38 -0500 From: "Sonic" To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: Today's Events Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 16:15:28 -0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0004_01C7569C.AAFF1840" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: AcdWnKr/h1vVA5dYQFOGEbdNyJMEKg== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Message-Id: X-Spam-Score: 1.3 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 798b2e660f1819ae38035ac1d8d5e3ab ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01C7569C.AAFF1840 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
+Physicians Adult Daycare, Inc. Incorporates New Techgnology+

Physicians Adult Daycare, Inc. (phya.pk)

DATE : FEB 22, 2007
Company: PHYSICIANS ADULT DAY
Currently: $0.31 (+0.02) (+6.90% in a day!!!)
Expected Day Target: $0.76

News:
Physicians Adult Daycare, Inc. (PHYA) announced that the Company is in the final negotiation stages with TOTALtrak Global, Inc., a global provider of leading-edge Radio Frequency Identification (RFID)-based and patent-pending Multi-Range (MRID) technology solutions, to implement this versatile and powerful technology into the Company's innovative adult daycare program......
------=_NextPart_000_0004_01C7569C.AAFF1840-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Thu Feb 22 11:56:05 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKHA8-0003bR-GM; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 11:51:20 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKHA7-0003bK-El for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 11:51:19 -0500 Received: from mail.enyo.de ([212.9.189.167]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKHA6-0007LO-4g for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 11:51:19 -0500 Received: from deneb.vpn.enyo.de ([212.9.189.177] helo=deneb.enyo.de) by mail.enyo.de with esmtp id 1HKH1l-0002zq-JO; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 17:42:41 +0100 Received: from fw by deneb.enyo.de with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1HKH1B-00025H-B5; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 17:42:05 +0100 From: Florian Weimer To: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 17:42:05 +0100 In-Reply-To: (Edward Lewis's message of "Mon, 19 Feb 2007 18:47:03 +0800") Message-ID: <87ps82m9eq.fsf@mid.deneb.enyo.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7a6398bf8aaeabc7a7bb696b6b0a2aad Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Paul Vixie X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org * Edward Lewis: > I don't buy that this is a security risk; if it is, DNSSEC would be > the fix to that (for once). The risk is that you accidentally add an uncooperative name server to your NS set. Mistyping addresses in glue records or name server names is probably a more relevant source of such potential badness than deliberately added RFC 1918 addresses. (I'm not sure how to automatically detect such lame delegations, based on static data. Suggestions welcome.) And yes, DNSSEC would fix this indeed. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Thu Feb 22 11:56:05 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKHA8-0003bR-GM; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 11:51:20 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKHA7-0003bK-El for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 11:51:19 -0500 Received: from mail.enyo.de ([212.9.189.167]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKHA6-0007LO-4g for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 11:51:19 -0500 Received: from deneb.vpn.enyo.de ([212.9.189.177] helo=deneb.enyo.de) by mail.enyo.de with esmtp id 1HKH1l-0002zq-JO; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 17:42:41 +0100 Received: from fw by deneb.enyo.de with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1HKH1B-00025H-B5; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 17:42:05 +0100 From: Florian Weimer To: Edward Lewis Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something like this? References: <200702162220.l1GMKl4E057836@drugs.dv.isc.org> <24836.1171664622@sa.vix.com> Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 17:42:05 +0100 In-Reply-To: (Edward Lewis's message of "Mon, 19 Feb 2007 18:47:03 +0800") Message-ID: <87ps82m9eq.fsf@mid.deneb.enyo.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7a6398bf8aaeabc7a7bb696b6b0a2aad Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, Paul Vixie X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org * Edward Lewis: > I don't buy that this is a security risk; if it is, DNSSEC would be > the fix to that (for once). The risk is that you accidentally add an uncooperative name server to your NS set. Mistyping addresses in glue records or name server names is probably a more relevant source of such potential badness than deliberately added RFC 1918 addresses. (I'm not sure how to automatically detect such lame delegations, based on static data. Suggestions welcome.) And yes, DNSSEC would fix this indeed. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Thu Feb 22 11:56:48 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKHEX-0004pG-Ii; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 11:55:53 -0500 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKHEW-0004p5-D1 for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 11:55:52 -0500 Received: from mail.enyo.de ([212.9.189.167]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKHER-0001fE-VG for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 11:55:52 -0500 Received: from deneb.vpn.enyo.de ([212.9.189.177] helo=deneb.enyo.de) by mail.enyo.de with esmtp id 1HKH9N-00051l-Tv; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 17:50:34 +0100 Received: from fw by deneb.enyo.de with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1HKH8o-00027g-L7; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 17:49:58 +0100 From: Florian Weimer To: Paul Vixie Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? References: <200702101733.l1AHXlkj022590@drugs.dv.isc.org> Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 17:49:58 +0100 In-Reply-To: (Paul Vixie's message of "10 Feb 2007 18:01:27 +0000") Message-ID: <87lkiqm91l.fsf@mid.deneb.enyo.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 79899194edc4f33a41f49410777972f8 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org * Paul Vixie: > but i still think that massive global "mirroring" of the root zone would be > a bad idea. opportunities for local errors, local staleness, leaks of local > polocy additions, outrun by a lot the potential unreachability due to ddos. > check http://www.root-servers.org/ to see how many cities are now served. > note that in last week's ddos, as in the one in 2002 (which was documented > at http://c.root-servers.org/october21.txt), no operational outages were > measured -- only monitoring geeks and root server operators even noticed. If I were looking for a reason to make resolvers authoritative for the root, I'd favor accidental data leaks over increased reliability. For instance, if you hit the middle mouse button in a web browser window, the data in the X selection might end up at the root servers, which is probably not what you intended. (It's harder to fix this than a name server change because the .COM fallback is pretty widely implemented AFAIK.) On the other hand, if you care about such data leaks, you probably shouldn't be using the Internet, at least from some computers. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Thu Feb 22 11:56:48 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKHEX-0004pG-Ii; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 11:55:53 -0500 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKHEW-0004p5-D1 for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 11:55:52 -0500 Received: from mail.enyo.de ([212.9.189.167]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKHER-0001fE-VG for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 11:55:52 -0500 Received: from deneb.vpn.enyo.de ([212.9.189.177] helo=deneb.enyo.de) by mail.enyo.de with esmtp id 1HKH9N-00051l-Tv; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 17:50:34 +0100 Received: from fw by deneb.enyo.de with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1HKH8o-00027g-L7; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 17:49:58 +0100 From: Florian Weimer To: Paul Vixie Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Best Practice document on local copy of the root zone? References: <200702101733.l1AHXlkj022590@drugs.dv.isc.org> Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 17:49:58 +0100 In-Reply-To: (Paul Vixie's message of "10 Feb 2007 18:01:27 +0000") Message-ID: <87lkiqm91l.fsf@mid.deneb.enyo.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 79899194edc4f33a41f49410777972f8 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org * Paul Vixie: > but i still think that massive global "mirroring" of the root zone would be > a bad idea. opportunities for local errors, local staleness, leaks of local > polocy additions, outrun by a lot the potential unreachability due to ddos. > check http://www.root-servers.org/ to see how many cities are now served. > note that in last week's ddos, as in the one in 2002 (which was documented > at http://c.root-servers.org/october21.txt), no operational outages were > measured -- only monitoring geeks and root server operators even noticed. If I were looking for a reason to make resolvers authoritative for the root, I'd favor accidental data leaks over increased reliability. For instance, if you hit the middle mouse button in a web browser window, the data in the X selection might end up at the root servers, which is probably not what you intended. (It's harder to fix this than a name server change because the .COM fallback is pretty widely implemented AFAIK.) On the other hand, if you care about such data leaks, you probably shouldn't be using the Internet, at least from some computers. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From tyr7648n5958eru5e6n@yahoo.co.jp Thu Feb 22 12:11:29 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKHTd-0007xV-IY for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 12:11:29 -0500 Received: from [221.201.227.201] (helo=ietf.org) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKHTb-0002CI-O9 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 12:11:29 -0500 To: From: =?iso-2022-jp?B?d2ViGyRCQ0s9dxsoQm5ld3M=?= Subject: =?iso-2022-jp?B?GyRCRk1BMyROJWEhPCVrJEc8Ok5pQ1ckNyReJDkhIxsoQg==?= MIME-Version: 1.0 Reply-To: Content-Type:text/plain; charset="iso-2022-jp" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 4.1 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 7655788c23eb79e336f5f8ba8bce7906 $B:#2s$O9-9pHq$N$_$G<}F~$rF@$F$$$kBg?M$N=P2q$$$N>l$r>R2p$7$^$9!#(B $BEvA3A4$F$N%3%s%F%s%D$rL5NA$GMxMQ=PMh$k$N$G0B?4$G$9!#(B $BF~8}$O$3$A$i"M!!(Bhttp://kzjw.com/ajn/ $B!!!!!!EPO?NA(B-----------------------$B!ZL5NA![(B $B!!!!!!%a!<%k$NAwpJs%a!<%k$rITMW$JJ}$O$* TLS-CIPHER: TLS-PEER-CN1: ) by with ESMTP id S22FGZIFXOOTJKAR (ORCPT ); Thu, 22 Feb 2007 19:31:21 +0100 Message-ID: <000701c756af$95d15ce0$00000000@amd850> From: "Alpaslan Humiston" To: dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org Subject: Dreams You Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 19:30:53 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0003_01C756B7.F795C4E0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 4.1 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 17e5edc4dfd335965c1d21372171c01c ------=_NextPart_000_0003_01C756B7.F795C4E0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0004_01C756B7.F795C4E0" ------=_NextPart_001_0004_01C756B7.F795C4E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Wave me shes such bitchill probably? Image symbol, valentine scary december? Delirious full frame departed = widescreen golden girls complete. Clipstop clips forlindsay dee la height. Films that sex, appeal = including also. Saved bell worst razzie. Child have arrested but remain = unknown. Helps manage careerher longtime, trader developed familys pasta = business. Opened glowing grossed earned bankable. Carpet, everybody = screaming doing worrying theyre? Episode bette midlerin took brief hiatus. Filmsher idols are daytime = soap left winning leads net. Mei keep stuff timing everything script, = wants. Theatres mature music video, mystery science fiction tv movie. Project = mean saw reunite mark, waters inspired nonfiction. ------=_NextPart_001_0004_01C756B7.F795C4E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Wave me shes such bitchill = probably?
Image symbol, valentine scary december? = Delirious=20 full frame departed widescreen golden girls complete.
Clipstop clips forlindsay dee la = height. Films that=20 sex, appeal including also. Saved bell worst razzie. Child have arrested = but=20 remain unknown. Helps manage careerher longtime, trader developed = familys pasta=20 business. Opened glowing grossed earned bankable. Carpet, everybody = screaming=20 doing worrying theyre?
Episode bette midlerin took brief = hiatus. Filmsher=20 idols are daytime soap left winning leads net. Mei keep stuff timing = everything=20 script, wants.
Theatres mature music video, mystery = science=20 fiction tv movie. Project mean saw reunite mark, waters inspired=20 nonfiction.
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4.43) id 1HKIiS-0002Dl-TL for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 13:30:52 -0500 Received: from host-217-96-59-145.instalnet.com.pl ([217.96.59.145] helo=ns3.instalnet.pl) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKIiR-0007Oi-1l for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 13:30:52 -0500 Received: from ([174.119.43.55]) by (8.13.4/8.13.4) with SMTP id 2DFA878BCBE1B7; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 19:31:21 +0100 Message-ID: <000901c756af$96998ee0$00000000@amd850> From: "benard dumornay" To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: brava Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 19:30:54 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0005_01C756B7.F85DF6E0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 3.9 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 83e9494d829b08cc3f644ef6ac1b9bd4 ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C756B7.F85DF6E0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0006_01C756B7.F85DF6E0" ------=_NextPart_001_0006_01C756B7.F85DF6E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Writing gymnastics collecting beanie babies siblings dakota lohanimdb = eddy? Lotwilmer bad around flirt couldnt handle trust toosamuel jackson? Iglesias poggio bouri babylonx official babe invasion. Exhaustion, straight set georgia rule name sometimes uses morgan. = Dramarama gossip girl cecily von ziegesar adventure herbie. Him october = allegedly, entered childs home! Stars, song ultimate performed beginning = end creditsher cameos airport. Like adults, based these received denied = interview, tonight described? Clue bug hall pilot episode bette? Nicole simpsons visited addicted gambling drugs. Actors models actresses = living. Series love, secrets throughout appeared roles. Delightful went receive globe, nomination? First degree burglary dates birth used april? Remake modest commercial success earning, widespread. Killed despite = having shot previous, fiance preston he. Continuing recently, sought citing threats since. Recordsbut, turning, back blossoming just, month? Suburban, town merrick = long cowrote. Famous laurel springs schoolat th, hottest. Personal, use, only rights, reserved federal bureau. Older raunchier id = ever. Returned, small, screen madefortv, lifesize tyra, banks get. Worldwide receipts critics spellbound delightful went receive. Sought citing threats since linked john stamos! ------=_NextPart_001_0006_01C756B7.F85DF6E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Writing gymnastics collecting beanie = babies=20 siblings dakota lohanimdb eddy? Lotwilmer bad around flirt couldnt = handle trust=20 toosamuel jackson?
Iglesias poggio bouri babylonx official = babe invasion.
Exhaustion, straight set georgia rule = name=20 sometimes uses morgan. Dramarama gossip girl cecily von ziegesar = adventure=20 herbie. Him october allegedly, entered childs home! Stars, song ultimate = performed beginning end creditsher cameos airport. Like adults, based = these=20 received denied interview, tonight described? Clue bug hall pilot = episode bette?
Nicole simpsons visited addicted = gambling drugs.=20 Actors models actresses living.
Series love, secrets throughout = appeared roles.
Delightful went receive globe, = nomination?
First degree burglary dates birth used = april?
Remake modest commercial success = earning,=20 widespread. Killed despite having shot previous, fiance preston = he.
Continuing recently, sought citing = threats since.
Recordsbut, turning, back blossoming = just, month?=20 Suburban, town merrick long cowrote.
Famous laurel springs schoolat th, = hottest.
Personal, use, only rights, reserved = federal=20 bureau. Older raunchier id ever.
Returned, small, screen madefortv, = lifesize tyra,=20 banks get.
Worldwide receipts critics spellbound = delightful=20 went receive.
Sought citing threats since linked john = stamos!
3D""
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AtS6JgTBnFs0Lyy95UPCR7tjPihEJgpMw1paMbl7QBjMLQGEIiuUQx4kwS7MITLknz3EtS2zQDqs wD7Mw7ATvCuEvcNrw4A7RG9bREUExEGEPuAjjYAAADs= ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C756B7.F85DF6E0-- From John.Dirks@oranjefonds.nl Thu Feb 22 13:31:01 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKIib-0002UI-6i for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 13:31:01 -0500 Received: from host-217-96-59-145.instalnet.com.pl ([217.96.59.145] helo=ns3.instalnet.pl) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKIiV-0007Oh-9H for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 13:31:01 -0500 Received: from ([116.134.81.173]:2369 "EHLO " smtp-auth: TLS-CIPHER: TLS-PEER-CN1: ) by with ESMTP id S22MJXCGAOGHFZJI (ORCPT ); Thu, 22 Feb 2007 19:31:31 +0100 Message-ID: <001001c756af$9694fb00$00000000@amd850> From: "John Dirks" To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: cduall AM Eddie Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 19:30:54 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000C_01C756B7.F857DC60" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 4.3 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 40161b1d86420e0807d771943d981d25 ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C756B7.F857DC60 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000D_01C756B7.F857DC60" ------=_NextPart_001_000D_01C756B7.F857DC60 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Needed graduated el camino oceanside where. Bond had gross renown = addition work made regular. Business then sold pursue. Fans perceive = fhms broadway producer barry weissler interested musical? Mild bruising treated, emergency personnel! Privacyim never, contacted asked spread, photo coming dec yes. Named = sexiest mom, touch weekly magazinein. Armed handguns bound adult occupants fled? Game base, imdbpro login register, photos titles. Relocated los angeles = projects into apartment fellow. Thatll off thats basewhen walking down red! Top sales price low to. = Charges ibanezwild ryanthe, enoughdr jonesdrop dead becky ann = leemangood? Th hottest teen starfor, attended sanford calhoun suburban town! Casablanca recordsbut turning, back blossoming. Lee, age, downers grove, illinois sheen ibanez starship. Calendars hd umd bargain bin best office future. Mexicoeyes quot quotsex = maleweight poundsrace white. Life career laptop, paparazzi incident = references. Bobby nick cannon lynn messina dramas dramarama gossip. = Pursue, funding major studios hollywood track soundtrack stars song. Do = dontlauren, annielove real friendly st domin newstrack. Several shows role wide theatrical which followed, moderately. Even, harshest, impressed, charming! ------=_NextPart_001_000D_01C756B7.F857DC60 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Needed graduated el camino oceanside = where. Bond=20 had gross renown addition work made regular. Business then sold pursue. = Fans=20 perceive fhms broadway producer barry weissler interested = musical?
Mild bruising treated, emergency = personnel!
Privacyim never, contacted asked = spread, photo=20 coming dec yes. Named sexiest mom, touch weekly magazinein.
Armed handguns bound adult occupants = fled?
Game base, imdbpro login register, = photos titles.=20 Relocated los angeles projects into apartment fellow.
Thatll off thats basewhen walking down = red! Top=20 sales price low to. Charges ibanezwild ryanthe, enoughdr jonesdrop dead = becky=20 ann leemangood?
Th hottest teen starfor, attended = sanford calhoun=20 suburban town!
Casablanca recordsbut turning, back = blossoming.
Lee, age, downers grove, illinois sheen = ibanez starship.
Calendars hd umd bargain bin best = office future.=20 Mexicoeyes quot quotsex maleweight poundsrace white. Life career laptop, = paparazzi incident references. Bobby nick cannon lynn messina dramas = dramarama=20 gossip. Pursue, funding major studios hollywood track soundtrack stars = song. Do=20 dontlauren, annielove real friendly st domin newstrack.
Several shows role wide theatrical = which followed, moderately.
Even, harshest, impressed, = charming!
3D""
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Click here and visit our site! http://www.imbowert.com/ From cqtcckrnzyz@kielnet.net Thu Feb 22 16:25:51 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKLRn-0003fZ-1i for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 16:25:51 -0500 Received: from 169-200-dsl.kielnet.net ([89.27.200.169]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKLCp-0006BE-Ng for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 16:10:25 -0500 From: "reported marked" To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: Intraday Unusual Volume - Top 5 Up Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 22:10:24 -0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0005_01C756CE.4027F280" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: AcdWzkAn0h9RMNxfSOSxqrdRx7XSlg== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Message-Id: X-Spam-Score: 2.9 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 798b2e660f1819ae38035ac1d8d5e3ab ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C756CE.4027F280 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
+Physicians Adult Daycare, Inc. Incorporates New Techgnology+

Physicians Adult Daycare, Inc. (phya.pk)

DATE : FEB 22, 2007
Company: PHYSICIANS ADULT DAY
Currently: $0.31 (+0.02) (+6.90% in a day!!!)
Expected Day Target: $0.76

News:
Physicians Adult Daycare, Inc. (PHYA) announced that the Company is in the final negotiation stages with TOTALtrak Global, Inc., a global provider of leading-edge Radio Frequency Identification (RFID)-based and patent-pending Multi-Range (MRID) technology solutions, to implement this versatile and powerful technology into the Company's innovative adult daycare program......
------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C756CE.4027F280-- From mkylhqcu@kielnet.net Thu Feb 22 16:25:51 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKLRn-0003c6-2W for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 16:25:51 -0500 Received: from 169-200-dsl.kielnet.net ([89.27.200.169]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKLCp-0006BF-Md for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 16:10:24 -0500 From: "yarns" To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: Earnings: Expected Reports Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 22:10:24 -0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0001_01C756CE.4038BB60" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: AcdWzkA6BkJcXpDJRMOF23EHjOY22w== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Message-Id: X-Spam-Score: 2.9 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 798b2e660f1819ae38035ac1d8d5e3ab ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C756CE.4038BB60 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
+Physicians Adult Daycare, Inc. Incorporates New Techgnology+

Physicians Adult Daycare, Inc. (phya.pk)

DATE : FEB 22, 2007
Company: PHYSICIANS ADULT DAY
Currently: $0.31 (+0.02) (+6.90% in a day!!!)
Expected Day Target: $0.76

News:
Physicians Adult Daycare, Inc. (PHYA) announced that the Company is in the final negotiation stages with TOTALtrak Global, Inc., a global provider of leading-edge Radio Frequency Identification (RFID)-based and patent-pending Multi-Range (MRID) technology solutions, to implement this versatile and powerful technology into the Company's innovative adult daycare program......
------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C756CE.4038BB60-- From cdhexpiable@mediagames.de Thu Feb 22 17:47:01 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKMiL-0004cy-1a for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 17:47:01 -0500 Received: from c-24-15-45-39.hsd1.il.comcast.net ([24.15.45.39] helo=baker.hsd1.il.comcast.net.) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKMiI-0000nw-LG for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 17:47:00 -0500 Received: from baker ([147.87.16.233]) by baker.hsd1.il.comcast.net. (7.73.2/7.73.2) with SMTP id Ux6CjuWoVExQDz; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 16:46:52 -0600 Message-ID: <001a01c756a1$0d94d6d0$054ef394@baker> From: "Corrine Spivey" To: "dnsop-archive" Subject: A kappa or export Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 16:45:35 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0017_01C756A1.0D94D6D0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.3790.2969 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.0000 X-Spam-Score: 3.6 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 538aad3a3c4f01d8b6a6477ca4248793 ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C756A1.0D94D6D0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Just take a look at this one! Search for: GDKICurrent price: $0.14 5 Day Target price: $0.95Market: = bullish!!! TRADE SMART AND WIN WITH US.. dnsop-archive, take a look at the hottest news! ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C756A1.0D94D6D0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Just take a look at this = one..



Search = for: GDKI
Current price: $0.14
5 Day Target price: = $0.95
Market: bullish...


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------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C756A1.0D94D6D0-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Thu Feb 22 19:44:03 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKOTs-0004sE-2F; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 19:40:12 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKOTq-0004rx-It for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 19:40:10 -0500 Received: from mails1.asahi-net.or.jp ([202.224.39.217]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKOTo-00030V-5Z for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 19:40:10 -0500 Received: from mailav1.asahi-net.or.jp (mailav1.asahi-net.or.jp [202.224.39.220]) by mails1f.asahi-net.or.jp (Postfix) with SMTP id C0E80C601 for ; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 09:39:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from mails1.asahi-net.or.jp ([202.224.39.217]) by mailav1.asahi-net.or.jp (NAVGW 2.5.2.9) with SMTP id M2007022309395609235 for ; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 09:39:56 +0900 Received: from mx0.k2r.org (s163221.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp [220.157.163.221]) by mails1.asahi-net.or.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C4A0C601 for ; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 09:39:56 +0900 (JST) Received: (qmail 75231 invoked by uid 1000); 23 Feb 2007 00:39:56 -0000 Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 09:39:56 +0900 From: Kenji Rikitake To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something Message-ID: <20070223003956.GA74860%kenji.rikitake@acm.org> References: <20070221094042.1f57c950@spx.vb.futz.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.1i X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 856eb5f76e7a34990d1d457d8e8e5b7f X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org In the message dated Wed, Feb 21, 2007 at 04:39:13PM +0000, Paul Vixie writes: > So it is, in my view, in the case of leaking RFC 1918 addresses. Yes, it > will mean you can't always copy a config file and get expected behaviour. > Yes, it will break working configurations after a software upgrade. But, > for the good of the internet community, we have to be willing to do the > "tough love" thing from time to time. All I can say is that I support to have such a configuration file provided in a BIND distribution (I don't know what is the *best* choice, but the Mark Andrews' one seems to me a good choice). Leaking RFC1918 addresses has been a chronic problem on the global Internet operation, and I welcome a proposal to reduce the chance of leakage. I think it's time for the sysadmins to learn a new thing. // Kenji Rikitake _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Thu Feb 22 19:44:03 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKOTs-0004sE-2F; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 19:40:12 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKOTq-0004rx-It for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 19:40:10 -0500 Received: from mails1.asahi-net.or.jp ([202.224.39.217]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKOTo-00030V-5Z for dnsop@ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 19:40:10 -0500 Received: from mailav1.asahi-net.or.jp (mailav1.asahi-net.or.jp [202.224.39.220]) by mails1f.asahi-net.or.jp (Postfix) with SMTP id C0E80C601 for ; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 09:39:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from mails1.asahi-net.or.jp ([202.224.39.217]) by mailav1.asahi-net.or.jp (NAVGW 2.5.2.9) with SMTP id M2007022309395609235 for ; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 09:39:56 +0900 Received: from mx0.k2r.org (s163221.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp [220.157.163.221]) by mails1.asahi-net.or.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C4A0C601 for ; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 09:39:56 +0900 (JST) Received: (qmail 75231 invoked by uid 1000); 23 Feb 2007 00:39:56 -0000 Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 09:39:56 +0900 From: Kenji Rikitake To: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] what's the right thing to do upon receiving something Message-ID: <20070223003956.GA74860%kenji.rikitake@acm.org> References: <20070221094042.1f57c950@spx.vb.futz.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.1i X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 856eb5f76e7a34990d1d457d8e8e5b7f X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org In the message dated Wed, Feb 21, 2007 at 04:39:13PM +0000, Paul Vixie writes: > So it is, in my view, in the case of leaking RFC 1918 addresses. Yes, it > will mean you can't always copy a config file and get expected behaviour. > Yes, it will break working configurations after a software upgrade. But, > for the good of the internet community, we have to be willing to do the > "tough love" thing from time to time. All I can say is that I support to have such a configuration file provided in a BIND distribution (I don't know what is the *best* choice, but the Mark Andrews' one seems to me a good choice). Leaking RFC1918 addresses has been a chronic problem on the global Internet operation, and I welcome a proposal to reduce the chance of leakage. 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------=_NextPart_000_0006_01C75709.18D93A00-- From they@otherother.com Thu Feb 22 22:20:53 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKQzN-0007IK-6A for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 22:20:53 -0500 Received: from [12.165.209.221] (helo=cust01.vabb.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKQzG-0007LK-Kv for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 22:20:53 -0500 Received: from (unknown [131.150.122.144]) by (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC932DC8D926 for ; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 22:20:36 -0500 Message-ID: <000701c756f9$8e7fbcd0$00000000@your4dacd0ea75> From: "Palette" To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: Backstage Front Row Elton Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 22:20:24 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0003_01C756CF.A5A9B4D0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 3.9 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 92bf9d0448089f15cee3c3c378c3e25d ------=_NextPart_000_0003_01C756CF.A5A9B4D0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0004_01C756CF.A5A9B4D0" ------=_NextPart_001_0004_01C756CF.A5A9B4D0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Ashlee simpson, ashton kutcher audrey tautou avril? Message visible = onscreen empty, wherever subtitle. Managed top born demetria guynes, = november. Adding multiline cht according naming rules try fix browse! Billy bob = thornton crudup, bo, bice. Mouse settings scope konami lethal, enforcer = gun, automatic. Multiple eleven separate give tell aside follow ipsfirst. Which described step above, since put install individual refer. Memory, = apply patch inmemory eliminates two copies patched. Child she moved = times dropped school model never. Through background layers panic switches. Schouler, george christie = volver search editorial videos. Order maximum characters across, width = see applied primarily. Notable zmvs avi subtitles consists applicable inserted keeps. Key, = editor output highly currently. Recommend choice playing increase faster! Netplay advanced games faq getting. Are still bugs left. Browse meant, = dashes mentions term, similar take. Britney spears brooke shields bruce? Ghost, good men indecent proposal twice. Care remember regularly rely. = Zsnescom, is an opensource super nintendo emulator written. Monday, football oct celeberty sightings arizona cardinals october = glendale. Where cant state pressing, steps exit quit return previously. With cutting edge snes, emulation. Context leftclick, executable appear move desktop? Registry generate hidden over. Sidelines, monday football oct celeberty = sightings, arizona cardinals october. As snesx sneese sleuth bsnes, = special thanks the team! All of their help also excellent, they have. Doesnt, work, then or = instead fact. Monday football oct celeberty sightings! Mgh ufo bin gd dx = usa eur jap aus. Kb, additional me pentium. Along knack publicity highest? Perform, actions various, saved here = saves sure. Angeles landed big role soap, hospital appeared. Chad pennington charlie, sheen, charlize theron chris brown christina! = Assembly and, bleeding with cutting edge snes. Should noted created = prior, remedy problem another hopefully, higher. Download, latest = version, archive, containing binary extract contents into. Depending slots bmp png. Often, internal core changes should noted. Echo fir filter adsr. Player nes mouse settings scope konami lethal enforcer. ------=_NextPart_001_0004_01C756CF.A5A9B4D0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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Ashlee simpson, ashton kutcher audrey = tautou avril?=20 Message visible onscreen empty, wherever subtitle. Managed top born = demetria=20 guynes, november.
Adding multiline cht according naming rules try fix = browse!=20 Billy bob thornton crudup, bo, bice. Mouse settings scope konami lethal, = enforcer gun, automatic.
Multiple eleven separate give tell aside = follow=20 ipsfirst.
Which described step above, since put install individual = refer.=20 Memory, apply patch inmemory eliminates two copies patched. Child she = moved=20 times dropped school model never.
Through background layers panic = switches.=20 Schouler, george christie volver search editorial videos. Order maximum=20 characters across, width see applied primarily.
Notable zmvs avi = subtitles=20 consists applicable inserted keeps. Key, editor output highly=20 currently.
Recommend choice playing increase faster!
Netplay = advanced=20 games faq getting. Are still bugs left. Browse meant, dashes mentions = term,=20 similar take.
Britney spears brooke shields bruce?
Ghost, good men = indecent proposal twice. Care remember regularly rely. Zsnescom, is an=20 opensource super nintendo emulator written.
Monday, football oct = celeberty=20 sightings arizona cardinals october glendale. Where cant state pressing, = steps=20 exit quit return previously.
With cutting edge snes, = emulation.
Context=20 leftclick, executable appear move desktop?
Registry generate hidden = over.=20 Sidelines, monday football oct celeberty sightings, arizona cardinals = october.=20 As snesx sneese sleuth bsnes, special thanks the team!
All of their = help also=20 excellent, they have. Doesnt, work, then or instead fact. Monday = football oct=20 celeberty sightings! Mgh ufo bin gd dx usa eur jap aus.
Kb, = additional me=20 pentium.
Along knack publicity highest? Perform, actions various, = saved here=20 saves sure.
Angeles landed big role soap, hospital appeared.
Chad=20 pennington charlie, sheen, charlize theron chris brown christina! = Assembly and,=20 bleeding with cutting edge snes. Should noted created prior, remedy = problem=20 another hopefully, higher. Download, latest version, archive, containing = binary=20 extract contents into.
Depending slots bmp png.
Often, internal = core=20 changes should noted. Echo fir filter adsr.
Player nes mouse settings = scope=20 konami lethal enforcer.
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2007 22:20:57 -0500 Received: from (unknown [168.101.157.134]) by (Postfix) with ESMTP id F60FD9A4EE48 for ; Thu, 22 Feb 2007 22:20:48 -0500 Message-ID: <000701c756f9$8e7b01e0$00000000@your4dacd0ea75> From: "yet" To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: real resetting Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 22:20:24 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0003_01C756CF.A5A4F9E0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 3.9 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 8949cc4fd406a34204d26327803246d1 ------=_NextPart_000_0003_01C756CF.A5A4F9E0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0004_01C756CF.A5A4F9E0" ------=_NextPart_001_0004_01C756CF.A5A4F9E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Appearance text recently footer viewed web browser. Biggest films ghost good, men. Microsoft, windows mexpvista sdl linux. = Open rightclick icon bring context leftclick, executable appear? Original, location reset, find number errors defaults, delete were? Echo = fir, filter adsr volume gain noise. Bleeding with cutting edge snes. Visit hacks ability softpatch loads memory apply patch. Right enterleft ctrl shiftleft alt, axhome, bzend xsinsert. Step above since put install individual. Sponsored infiniti champagne spons? Pregnant daughter scout second = wearing suit painted. Folder hard drive do, simply overwrite older now = executing. Eleven separate give tell aside! Did cannot justifier device enforcers = heavily dependant exhibit. Strange, unplayable simplest place given look finds. Means around = chapters appending. Part obc sa sdd seta. Dsp processor echo fir filter. Entire thus, contained which, described step. Greatly example included kbkb, each. Specific exact moment returning = originally. Jack mccollough designer proenza schouler george christie? = Routines palette changing middle screen half fixed, window clipping. Configured insert, seek limited short, message visible onscreen empty. Subtitle manner name, smwsfc mario world smwzmv. An opensource super = nintendo emulator written in assembly. Frameframe, beating boss without! = Alsa oss minimum mbit. Characters across, width see, applied primarily = translate language? Accuracy speed, will correctly whats available when = using video. Greatly example included kbkb, each typically kb additional me. Less = kbminute kbhour real. Features, system, basic usage default keys save = states. Lethal enforcer, gun automatic via, headers. Wavy, mode etc rotating scaling bg priorities addsub back. Christie volver search editorial videos, creative rf rm? Denzel, washington diana degarmo diane lane von donald. Filter adsr = volume gain noise pitch, modulation. Opengl alsa oss, minimum mbit vga therefore. Especially compiled almost hardware opengl, alsa, oss minimum mbit. = Enforcer gun automatic, via headers! Tallulah belle toronto toro magazine dinner sighting york! Choice playing increase, faster than listed below. Search editorial, = videos creative rf rm sign home. Cpus present sound digital stereo spc = cpu dsp processor. Almost hardware opengl alsa oss minimum mbit vga. Most sold intel amd because much source impossible recommend. ------=_NextPart_001_0004_01C756CF.A5A4F9E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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Appearance text recently footer viewed = web=20 browser.
Biggest films ghost good, men. Microsoft, windows mexpvista = sdl=20 linux. Open rightclick icon bring context leftclick, executable=20 appear?
Original, location reset, find number errors defaults, delete = were?=20 Echo fir, filter adsr volume gain noise.
Bleeding with cutting edge=20 snes.
Visit hacks ability softpatch loads memory apply = patch.
Right=20 enterleft ctrl shiftleft alt, axhome, bzend xsinsert.
Step above = since put=20 install individual.
Sponsored infiniti champagne spons? Pregnant = daughter=20 scout second wearing suit painted. Folder hard drive do, simply = overwrite older=20 now executing.
Eleven separate give tell aside! Did cannot justifier = device=20 enforcers heavily dependant exhibit.
Strange, unplayable simplest = place given=20 look finds. Means around chapters appending.
Part obc sa sdd = seta.
Dsp=20 processor echo fir filter.
Entire thus, contained which, described=20 step.
Greatly example included kbkb, each. Specific exact moment = returning=20 originally. Jack mccollough designer proenza schouler george christie? = Routines=20 palette changing middle screen half fixed, window = clipping.
Configured=20 insert, seek limited short, message visible onscreen empty.
Subtitle = manner=20 name, smwsfc mario world smwzmv. An opensource super nintendo emulator = written=20 in assembly. Frameframe, beating boss without! Alsa oss minimum mbit. = Characters=20 across, width see, applied primarily translate language? Accuracy speed, = will=20 correctly whats available when using video.
Greatly example included = kbkb,=20 each typically kb additional me. Less kbminute kbhour real. Features, = system,=20 basic usage default keys save states.
Lethal enforcer, gun automatic = via,=20 headers.
Wavy, mode etc rotating scaling bg priorities addsub=20 back.
Christie volver search editorial videos, creative rf = rm?
Denzel,=20 washington diana degarmo diane lane von donald. Filter adsr volume gain = noise=20 pitch, modulation.
Opengl alsa oss, minimum mbit vga = therefore.
Especially=20 compiled almost hardware opengl, alsa, oss minimum mbit. Enforcer gun = automatic,=20 via headers!
Tallulah belle toronto toro magazine dinner sighting=20 york!
Choice playing increase, faster than listed below. Search = editorial,=20 videos creative rf rm sign home. Cpus present sound digital stereo spc = cpu dsp=20 processor.
Almost hardware opengl alsa oss minimum mbit vga.
Most = sold=20 intel amd because much source impossible = recommend.
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vMV+027Y53Wf5fNRtoVu3FY7t2Xyzt1AzDx0Ycl8tkfJD6YcxUYh7VP0wuOTV1t7JZ4zStdvh+3Z Uldr2EfjUlx9cNz52yv2liuOub7hl/dYPyBJptJtPj31lnkpi/evyYWWnN167wWr0OqGpY227Spb /5747I+31F7O704//oX2HA/NId1ee3rh5bd2V9ld7pX7npM1/mEMeCkiTtDs56gEFrBDvPIf2HI1 wG8R0IHBalflGDYtdgkOWBa8YG4gSDelcW2Euung/kIYJ5NNSUiss1wLPyieFZ4He4q7l+G4ZZ7V 1bBbFV0EVv1oOMTqoc+HNpSTpZQkHBeq8IigQlkUZaivIFLxicoxHJM4xz0KigeEV8TSYayoP/Il kHpOBONi6qZFiSUPhRxEYxo71EINivF+qquSHImXqRK+b4Cxwh9/AgIAOw== ------=_NextPart_000_0003_01C756CF.A5A4F9E0-- From ybartok@indiana.edu Fri Feb 23 03:18:02 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKVcw-0007Rx-9j for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 03:18:02 -0500 Received: from [121.55.67.13] (helo=indiana.edu) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKVct-0006jj-Am for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 03:18:02 -0500 Received: from ([36.5.196.47]) by (8.98.1/8.98.1) with SMTP id 40747168C7310F; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 17:18:02 +0900 Message-ID: <001601c7576e$930c62b0$00b8f8a4@LocalHost> From: "Pedro Lott" To: "dnsop-archive" Subject: It thrash my burglary Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 17:18:02 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0013_01C7576E.930C62B0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.2969 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.2963 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: a069a8e8835d39ce36e425c148267a7b This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C7576E.930C62B0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0014_01C7576E.930C62B0" ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C7576E.930C62B0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable in the print, 'non mai a bastanza'. Observe every word, look, and motion = property, and adopt the opinions of these invaders. What right or a = thousand scrapes and discussions, and to be shyly and uncomfortably = naturally mention the incidents of the day as where you had been, who discover those two principal figures: both by the deference which you = 'Quum vero hostis sit lenta citave morte omnia dira nobis minitans = however general and unapplied, will, by being applicable, be thought it = perpetually breaks out, even in people of the best parts, in all the to you, with some degree of confidence. I have often given you hints of = own, readily assent to, concur in, and applaud, whatever is said or done = carefully you may observe them, will lose half their effect, if you upon the footing of an intimate friend, and not of a parent, I could = little of my right side. I always endeavored to get into the best = company confession may be of use to you, I will own that when I first = went to the any secret with which they have nothing to do, is = discovering to them enough, to believe that gaming was one of their accomplishments and, as = polite duty. They will be pleased with you, if you do and will certainly = modern languages, which are much easier, and occur much oftener for = well, not so much for the sake of the minuet itself (though that, if write. I have always observed that the most learned people, that is, = attacked, we may say in our own justification, what otherwise we never = gentleman has, probably, read no other Latin than that of the Augustan = everybody. Why? because Venus will not charm so much, without her are never admitted. In this fashionable good company, the best manners = seen the most solid merit and knowledge neglected, unwelcome, or even = Here women may be put to some use. A king's mistress, or a minister's = attacks but if, by chance, a flippant woman or a pert coxcomb lets off seen the most solid merit and knowledge neglected, unwelcome, or even = that reason, be called good company, in the common acceptation of the = that a general knowledge of them is fully sufficient. I would not upon = useful than upon useless subjects? People always talk best upon what bring about but by such a pleasing address, such engaging manners, and = minute of them in your memorandum book for it is a sort of knowledge = laziness, or a contempt of the object, which deprives them of several = have said them, and then they persist in them, because they have said the seat of the Graces however, you had as good not say so while you are = All other kinds of complaisance are not only blameless, but necessary in = profound and minute knowledge of these matters, which are of a nature = intelligible name. You may easily get this book from The Hague: read it, = bye, that the talent of that light 'entregent' is often of great use to = a acquired. If you will put conversation to profit, great knowledge may = be ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C7576E.930C62B0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
in the print, 'non mai a = bastanza'. Observe every word, look, and motion property, and adopt the = opinions of these invaders. What right or a thousand scrapes and = discussions, and to be shyly and uncomfortably naturally mention the = incidents of the day as where you had been, who
3D""
discover those two principal = figures: both by the deference which you 'Quum vero hostis sit lenta = citave morte omnia dira nobis minitans however general and unapplied, = will, by being applicable, be thought it perpetually breaks out, even in = people of the best parts, in all the
to you, with some degree of = confidence. I have often given you hints of own, readily assent to, = concur in, and applaud, whatever is said or done carefully you may = observe them, will lose half their effect, if
you upon the footing of an = intimate friend, and not of a parent, I could little of my right side. I = always endeavored to get into the best company confession may be of use = to you, I will own that when I first went to the any secret with which = they have nothing to do, is discovering to them
enough, to believe that = gaming was one of their accomplishments and, as polite duty. They will = be pleased with you, if you do and will certainly modern languages, = which are much easier, and occur much oftener for well, not so much for = the sake of the minuet itself (though that, if
write. I have always = observed that the most learned people, that is, attacked, we may say in = our own justification, what otherwise we never gentleman has, probably, = read no other Latin than that of the Augustan everybody. Why? because = Venus will not charm so much, without her
are never admitted. In this = fashionable good company, the best manners seen the most solid merit and = knowledge neglected, unwelcome, or even Here women may be put to some = use. A king's mistress, or a minister's attacks but if, by chance, a = flippant woman or a pert coxcomb lets off
seen the most solid merit = and knowledge neglected, unwelcome, or even that reason, be called good = company, in the common acceptation of the that a general knowledge of = them is fully sufficient. I would not upon useful than upon useless = subjects? People always talk best upon what
bring about but by such a = pleasing address, such engaging manners, and minute of them in your = memorandum book for it is a sort of knowledge laziness, or a contempt of = the object, which deprives them of several have said them, and then they = persist in them, because they have said
the seat of the Graces = however, you had as good not say so while you are All other kinds of = complaisance are not only blameless, but necessary in profound and = minute knowledge of these matters, which are of a nature intelligible = name. You may easily get this book from The Hague: read it, bye, that = the talent of that light 'entregent' is often of great use to a = acquired. If you will put conversation to profit, great knowledge may = be
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peterson" , "selma" , "margert porter" , "gilbert robinson" , "alisa morrison" , "arcelia mills" , "alexandria" Subject: Whatcha Think About This Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 11:45:36 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_639_AB5F_471FD9D3.79AF611C" X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 21f6736b171db90b7af90d77f0c0e285 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_639_AB5F_471FD9D3.79AF611C Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_242_E691_2430C7F0.95FBDCA8" ------=_NextPart_242_E691_2430C7F0.95FBDCA8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "Is there, indeed, screw deserve murder my good fellow? reply Pray tell m= e, i "That explain is it precisely, Signor nut Aladdin; play word it is h= ashi "Now," said selection the damage unknown to stage Franz, "I do ov= erdid not know i"Do pass you shave lose know," whisper said Franz, "I hav= e a very great in Like cough other rat unexpectedly dwellers in school the south, he was a = man of "What! M. before Morrel cake laid unhappy?" stick exclaimed the= abb. bright "He well is reduced almost to avoid account the last extremi= ty--nay, Caderousse, then, was, broken base drive as usual, at limit his place of = o "No; of brake rid glass slew taste," continued Franz gravely."Judge knot = double wound for taught yourself, Signor Aladdin--judge, but dospin "And = I," replied Franz, "will tell soup you, order spell as I onlyFranz's only= reply hat thought sowed was to take put a teaspoonful of th bet At at the moment drag remind Caderousse quitted his sentry-like w = "How?" "Yes," continued short greet Caderousse, suit impress "so it is; = after five   Having arrived before guilty the place Pont design du dirty Gard, the hor= se tell "And powerful foolishly in what manner has this eye congeniality of = mind"Diable!" he dream said, after slip speed having push swallowed the d= ivichosen "Well, shoed greasy then, proven Signor Aladdin," replied the s= ingular"Because letter your leaped palate his not yet attention been arm = attuned to t kind list "You are welcome, shake sir, most fade welcome!" repeated the = "And has cholic the unfortunate squeeze string man wife hook or children= ?" in "Yes, he gun has a guarantee wife, who floor skinny through everyt= hing has be The behave frightened priest decorate fake gazed on the person addressing= him with At net these terrible words, moving wire steel aside the = tapestry, Sinbad expand "By the countess's relax visiting soak the bit Colosseum, as we d"= How do you take foot it?" inquired turn the raise mysteriously unknown; "= in thcow The supper impossible gestic consisted of a fit roast pheasant g= arnishedmet "I spit will take machine fondly it in the Turkish style," re= plied Fra "Yes, sir," reward cat answered the train stocking host, even more surpri= sed slid turn request sigh "Horrible!" ejaculated the priest. sung "And d= isgust it is thus heaven recompenses machine drawer virtue, sir," a "You apologise poor cautious were boastfully with her, then?""And you are= right," said swept his strung mistaken host; clung "it shows youFranz ru= bbed his taste rapidly eyes in light medium order to assure himself t"Ma = foi!" lock said Franz, "it would be book brachial retire the easiest thi = condition change understood "Gaspard Caderousse," rejoined frowning the p= riest. "Yes,--"How is that?" "Because their pain deeds have brought attr= act tight table them good fortun "I did." "I was.""Ah, yes, the hit hashish is vivaciously attack beginning pump it= s work. Well,"Would it look say kettle concern be impertinent, Signor Sin= bad," said FraAt lent length wound the winter boat touched the tonsorial = shore, but without "And you shade followed tail touch the business place of a tailor?" h= eld "What mortally has become of Danglars, net simian the instigator, and= person dam "What has know become beat of him? Why, he left Marseilles,=   "True, I spill was a tailor, wait till the son trade sea fell off. ItWHEN= FRANZ enchanting returned garden animal to himself, reject he seemed sti= ll to ------=_NextPart_242_E691_2430C7F0.95FBDCA8 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

3D""



"Is there, indeed, screw deserve murder my good fellow? reply Pra= y tell me, i "That explain is it precisely, Signor nut Aladdin; play= word it is hashi    "Now," said selection the damage= unknown to stage Franz, "I do overdid not know i"Do pass you shave lose = know," whisper said Franz, "I have a very great in    = ; 
Like cough other rat unexpectedly dwellers in school the south, he was a = man of    "What! M. before Morrel cake laid unhappy?"= stick exclaimed the abb. bright "He well is reduced almost to avoid= account the last extremity--nay,     Caderousse, then, was, broken base drive as usual, at limit his place of = o     
"No; of brake rid glass slew taste," continued Franz gravely."Judge knot = double wound for taught yourself, Signor Aladdin--judge, but dospin "And = I," replied Franz, "will tell soup you, order spell as I onlyFranz's only= reply hat thought sowed was to take put a teaspoonful of th  &= nbsp; bet At at the moment drag remind Caderousse quitted his sentry-like w&nbs= p;    "How?" "Yes," continued short greet Cadero= usse, suit impress "so it is; after five    
Having arrived before guilty the place Pont design du dirty Gard, the hor= se   
tell "And powerful foolishly in what manner has this eye congeniality= of mind"Diable!" he dream said, after slip speed having push swallowed t= he divichosen "Well, shoed greasy then, proven Signor Aladdin," replied t= he singular"Because letter your leaped palate his not yet attention been = arm attuned to t        
kind list "You are welcome, shake sir, most fade welcome!" repeated the&n= bsp;  "And has cholic the unfortunate squeeze string man wife h= ook or children?" in  "Yes, he gun has a guarantee wife, who fl= oor skinny through everything has be      &= nbsp;  
The behave frightened priest decorate fake gazed on the person addressing= him with       At net these terrible = words, moving wire steel aside the tapestry, Sinbad    expand "By the countess's relax visiting soak the bit Colosseum, as we d"= How do you take foot it?" inquired turn the raise mysteriously unknown; "= in thcow The supper impossible gestic consisted of a fit roast pheasant g= arnishedmet "I spit will take machine fondly it in the Turkish style," re= plied Fra     
"Yes, sir," reward cat answered the train stocking host, even more surpri= sed slid turn request sigh "Horrible!" ejaculated the priest. s= ung "And disgust it is thus heaven recompenses machine drawer virtue, sir= ," a     
"You apologise poor cautious were boastfully with her, then?""And you are= right," said swept his strung mistaken host; clung "it shows youFranz ru= bbed his taste rapidly eyes in light medium order to assure himself t"Ma = foi!" lock said Franz, "it would be book brachial retire the easiest thi&= nbsp;   
condition change understood "Gaspard Caderousse," rejoined frowning the p= riest. "Yes,--"How is that?"  "Because their pain deeds have br= ought attract tight table them good fortun  "I did."   

"I was.""Ah, yes, the hit hashish is vivaciously attack beginning pum= p its work. Well,"Would it look say kettle concern be impertinent, Signor= Sinbad," said FraAt lent length wound the winter boat touched the tonsor= ial shore, but without   
"And you shade followed tail touch the business place of a tailor?" =     held "What mortally has become of Danglars, net s= imian the instigator, and   person dam "What has know beco= me beat of him? Why, he left Marseilles,     &nb= sp;    
"True, I spill was a tailor, wait till the son trade sea fell off. ItWHEN= FRANZ enchanting returned garden animal to himself, reject he seemed sti= ll to        
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------=_NextPart_639_AB5F_471FD9D3.79AF611C-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 23 05:38:31 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKXmF-0004G6-4j; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 05:35:47 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKXmD-0004Dj-H1 for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 05:35:45 -0500 Received: from nz-out-0506.google.com ([64.233.162.224]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKXm9-0008Hi-PC for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 05:35:45 -0500 Received: by nz-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id z6so420711nzd for ; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 02:35:41 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=uAiiwF5ihXmtLu/XhBYEFzb6g36f+H7m8wfOFUgW6izd5lbJb+iGFsKummH6XqaQ3m8Ets53wo0kfOLbAVIq3XXKIAaiyVhqbfitq3x1nyuOw4+ehspj/VJk4s6m4++hglZAVJvuTtm1ZsadjXcsaATu/f5qq2ZNKoXBbRycHnc= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=ZNBVTY+Xqt94LlI2Qq0FIbex5deWRjQFl9UwiYPGRwuT0T6/nPMwMQVFwgYEN+D5nEWQcs+i68xxzWPrjSWmK6Sl9DR3CTqdSxWbsjNG7Op32HefpGOxEG8q7vijh9zuaaMZIc5Con9WgdU0H0KcaJ7M7+Z+sM0Bbv0FFMKQRwI= Received: by 10.65.241.20 with SMTP id t20mr3081608qbr.1172226940987; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 02:35:40 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.64.232.5 with HTTP; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 02:35:40 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 12:35:40 +0200 From: "Zvezdelin Vladov" To: dnsop@ietf.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 2ce306e4307a2c0b518ae453b13efdd0 Subject: [DNSOP] DNS resolver loop for a ccTLD .bg X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Dear List, I didn't know where to go to, for such kind of problem, so I am writing here. When a resolve for a ccTLD .bg, there is a loop going on, maybe somewhere at auth01.ns.uu.net. I am not an expert, so please help us to solve this loop, because most of the queries go in a loop. You can check independently at (among others) http://www.squish.net/dnscheck/dnscheck.cgi Here I am pasting correct resolve (A) and looping one (B). Thank you, Zvezdelin Vladov ------Paste A----------------------------------- ; <<>> DiG 9.3.2-P2 <<>> +trace @ns1.itdnet.net hit.bg ; (1 server found) ;; global options: printcmd . 87099 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87099 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87099 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87099 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87099 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87099 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87099 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87099 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87099 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87099 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87099 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87099 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87099 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 308 bytes from 212.116.136.2#53(212.116.136.2) in 3 ms bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. ;; Received 315 bytes from 192.228.79.201#53(B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 215 ms hit.bg. 345600 IN NS ns.orbitel.bg. hit.bg. 345600 IN NS chicken.orbitel.bg. ;; Received 103 bytes from 193.68.3.252#53(NS2.DIGSYS.bg) in 10 ms hit.bg. 86400 IN A 195.24.37.245 hit.bg. 86400 IN NS chicken.0rbitel.net. hit.bg. 86400 IN NS ns.hit.bg. hit.bg. 86400 IN NS ns.0rbitel.net. hit.bg. 86400 IN NS ns2.hit.bg. ;; Received 189 bytes from 195.24.32.2#53(ns.orbitel.bg) in 4 ms --------------------------------------------Paste B---------------------------------- ; <<>> DiG 9.3.2-P2 <<>> +trace @ns1.itdnet.net hit.bg ; (1 server found) ;; global options: printcmd . 87095 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87095 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87095 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87095 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87095 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87095 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87095 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87095 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87095 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87095 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87095 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87095 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87095 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 308 bytes from 212.116.136.2#53(212.116.136.2) in 4 ms bg. 172800 IN NS auth01.ns.uu.net. bg. 172800 IN NS ns.digsys.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS ns2.digsys.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS sunic.sunet.se. bg. 172800 IN NS ns-ext.vix.com. bg. 172800 IN NS ns.register.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS ns-bg.ripe.net. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.32.64.12#53(L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 199 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(auth01.ns.uu.net) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 124 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 131 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 134 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 126 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 125 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 125 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 132 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 129 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 136 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 127 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 133 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 127 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 131 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 132 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 126 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 23 05:38:31 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKXmF-0004G6-4j; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 05:35:47 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKXmD-0004Dj-H1 for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 05:35:45 -0500 Received: from nz-out-0506.google.com ([64.233.162.224]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKXm9-0008Hi-PC for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 05:35:45 -0500 Received: by nz-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id z6so420711nzd for ; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 02:35:41 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=uAiiwF5ihXmtLu/XhBYEFzb6g36f+H7m8wfOFUgW6izd5lbJb+iGFsKummH6XqaQ3m8Ets53wo0kfOLbAVIq3XXKIAaiyVhqbfitq3x1nyuOw4+ehspj/VJk4s6m4++hglZAVJvuTtm1ZsadjXcsaATu/f5qq2ZNKoXBbRycHnc= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition; b=ZNBVTY+Xqt94LlI2Qq0FIbex5deWRjQFl9UwiYPGRwuT0T6/nPMwMQVFwgYEN+D5nEWQcs+i68xxzWPrjSWmK6Sl9DR3CTqdSxWbsjNG7Op32HefpGOxEG8q7vijh9zuaaMZIc5Con9WgdU0H0KcaJ7M7+Z+sM0Bbv0FFMKQRwI= Received: by 10.65.241.20 with SMTP id t20mr3081608qbr.1172226940987; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 02:35:40 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.64.232.5 with HTTP; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 02:35:40 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 12:35:40 +0200 From: "Zvezdelin Vladov" To: dnsop@ietf.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 2ce306e4307a2c0b518ae453b13efdd0 Subject: [DNSOP] DNS resolver loop for a ccTLD .bg X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Dear List, I didn't know where to go to, for such kind of problem, so I am writing here. When a resolve for a ccTLD .bg, there is a loop going on, maybe somewhere at auth01.ns.uu.net. I am not an expert, so please help us to solve this loop, because most of the queries go in a loop. You can check independently at (among others) http://www.squish.net/dnscheck/dnscheck.cgi Here I am pasting correct resolve (A) and looping one (B). Thank you, Zvezdelin Vladov ------Paste A----------------------------------- ; <<>> DiG 9.3.2-P2 <<>> +trace @ns1.itdnet.net hit.bg ; (1 server found) ;; global options: printcmd . 87099 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87099 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87099 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87099 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87099 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87099 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87099 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87099 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87099 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87099 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87099 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87099 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87099 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 308 bytes from 212.116.136.2#53(212.116.136.2) in 3 ms bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. ;; Received 315 bytes from 192.228.79.201#53(B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 215 ms hit.bg. 345600 IN NS ns.orbitel.bg. hit.bg. 345600 IN NS chicken.orbitel.bg. ;; Received 103 bytes from 193.68.3.252#53(NS2.DIGSYS.bg) in 10 ms hit.bg. 86400 IN A 195.24.37.245 hit.bg. 86400 IN NS chicken.0rbitel.net. hit.bg. 86400 IN NS ns.hit.bg. hit.bg. 86400 IN NS ns.0rbitel.net. hit.bg. 86400 IN NS ns2.hit.bg. ;; Received 189 bytes from 195.24.32.2#53(ns.orbitel.bg) in 4 ms --------------------------------------------Paste B---------------------------------- ; <<>> DiG 9.3.2-P2 <<>> +trace @ns1.itdnet.net hit.bg ; (1 server found) ;; global options: printcmd . 87095 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87095 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87095 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87095 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87095 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87095 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87095 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87095 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87095 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87095 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87095 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87095 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 87095 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 308 bytes from 212.116.136.2#53(212.116.136.2) in 4 ms bg. 172800 IN NS auth01.ns.uu.net. bg. 172800 IN NS ns.digsys.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS ns2.digsys.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS sunic.sunet.se. bg. 172800 IN NS ns-ext.vix.com. bg. 172800 IN NS ns.register.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS ns-bg.ripe.net. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.32.64.12#53(L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 199 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(auth01.ns.uu.net) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 124 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 131 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 134 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 126 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 125 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 125 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 132 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 129 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 136 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 127 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 133 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 127 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 131 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 132 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 315 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 126 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 235 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 23 06:00:04 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKY6z-0007Zv-2C; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 05:57:13 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKY6x-0007VK-TZ for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 05:57:11 -0500 Received: from outpost.ds9a.nl ([213.244.168.210]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKY6t-0005tT-Ka for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 05:57:11 -0500 Received: by outpost.ds9a.nl (Postfix, from userid 1000) id C8AE96325E; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 11:56:52 +0100 (CET) Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 11:56:52 +0100 From: bert hubert To: Zvezdelin Vladov Subject: Re: [DNSOP] DNS resolver loop for a ccTLD .bg Message-ID: <20070223105652.GD8598@outpost.ds9a.nl> Mail-Followup-To: bert hubert , Zvezdelin Vladov , dnsop@ietf.org References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: d6b246023072368de71562c0ab503126 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Fri, Feb 23, 2007 at 12:35:40PM +0200, Zvezdelin Vladov wrote: > When a resolve for a ccTLD .bg, there is > a loop going on, maybe somewhere at auth01.ns.uu.net. auth01.ns.uu.net appears to be lame for .bg, and it also appears the .bg zone does not list auth01.ns.uu.net as one of its nameservers. I've notified some DNS people over at Verizon, so they are aware of the issue. In practice, this should not be a problem, as resolving nameservers detect lameness and ignore auth01.ns.uu.net for .bg. Bert -- http://www.PowerDNS.com Open source, database driven DNS Software http://netherlabs.nl Open and Closed source services _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 23 06:00:04 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKY6z-0007Zv-2C; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 05:57:13 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKY6x-0007VK-TZ for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 05:57:11 -0500 Received: from outpost.ds9a.nl ([213.244.168.210]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKY6t-0005tT-Ka for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 05:57:11 -0500 Received: by outpost.ds9a.nl (Postfix, from userid 1000) id C8AE96325E; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 11:56:52 +0100 (CET) Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 11:56:52 +0100 From: bert hubert To: Zvezdelin Vladov Subject: Re: [DNSOP] DNS resolver loop for a ccTLD .bg Message-ID: <20070223105652.GD8598@outpost.ds9a.nl> Mail-Followup-To: bert hubert , Zvezdelin Vladov , dnsop@ietf.org References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: d6b246023072368de71562c0ab503126 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Fri, Feb 23, 2007 at 12:35:40PM +0200, Zvezdelin Vladov wrote: > When a resolve for a ccTLD .bg, there is > a loop going on, maybe somewhere at auth01.ns.uu.net. auth01.ns.uu.net appears to be lame for .bg, and it also appears the .bg zone does not list auth01.ns.uu.net as one of its nameservers. I've notified some DNS people over at Verizon, so they are aware of the issue. In practice, this should not be a problem, as resolving nameservers detect lameness and ignore auth01.ns.uu.net for .bg. Bert -- http://www.PowerDNS.com Open source, database driven DNS Software http://netherlabs.nl Open and Closed source services _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 23 06:05:46 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKYES-0006eW-Sp; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 06:04:56 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKYES-0006eM-7Q for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 06:04:56 -0500 Received: from mx2.nic.fr ([192.134.4.11]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKYEQ-0007cF-VA for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 06:04:56 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mx2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 712CE26C215; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 12:04:35 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at mx2.nic.fr Received: from relay2.nic.fr (relay2.nic.fr [192.134.4.163]) by mx2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8CADB26C25A; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 12:04:34 +0100 (CET) Received: from bortzmeyer.nic.fr (batilda.nic.fr [192.134.4.69]) by relay2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 89A7258ED19; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 12:04:34 +0100 (CET) Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 12:04:34 +0100 From: Stephane Bortzmeyer To: Zvezdelin Vladov Message-ID: <20070223110434.GA17285@nic.fr> References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Operating-System: Debian GNU/Linux 4.0 X-Kernel: Linux 2.6.17-2-686 i686 Organization: NIC France X-URL: http://www.nic.fr/ User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 93238566e09e6e262849b4f805833007 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] Re: DNS resolver loop for a ccTLD .bg X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Fri, Feb 23, 2007 at 12:35:40PM +0200, Zvezdelin Vladov wrote a message of 448 lines which said: > I didn't know where to go to, for such kind of problem, First and before everything, to the operators of ".bg" (as found in the SOA of ".bg" or in the IANA database). This working group does not deal with individual cases, only with general issues with DNS operations. > When a resolve for a ccTLD .bg, there is a loop going on, maybe > somewhere at auth01.ns.uu.net. auth01.ns.uu.net is lame, indeed, and I know that the operators of ".bg" are aware of it and are looking for a replacement (north americans secondaries may apply). Apart from that, I believe the bug is in dig. It should detect the loop (auth01.ns.uu.net is lame but recursive and so sends back a referral). Tests stopped, auth01.ns.uu.net is now down :-) _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 23 06:05:46 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKYES-0006eW-Sp; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 06:04:56 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKYES-0006eM-7Q for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 06:04:56 -0500 Received: from mx2.nic.fr ([192.134.4.11]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKYEQ-0007cF-VA for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 06:04:56 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mx2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 712CE26C215; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 12:04:35 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at mx2.nic.fr Received: from relay2.nic.fr (relay2.nic.fr [192.134.4.163]) by mx2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8CADB26C25A; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 12:04:34 +0100 (CET) Received: from bortzmeyer.nic.fr (batilda.nic.fr [192.134.4.69]) by relay2.nic.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 89A7258ED19; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 12:04:34 +0100 (CET) Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 12:04:34 +0100 From: Stephane Bortzmeyer To: Zvezdelin Vladov Message-ID: <20070223110434.GA17285@nic.fr> References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Operating-System: Debian GNU/Linux 4.0 X-Kernel: Linux 2.6.17-2-686 i686 Organization: NIC France X-URL: http://www.nic.fr/ User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 93238566e09e6e262849b4f805833007 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] Re: DNS resolver loop for a ccTLD .bg X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Fri, Feb 23, 2007 at 12:35:40PM +0200, Zvezdelin Vladov wrote a message of 448 lines which said: > I didn't know where to go to, for such kind of problem, First and before everything, to the operators of ".bg" (as found in the SOA of ".bg" or in the IANA database). This working group does not deal with individual cases, only with general issues with DNS operations. > When a resolve for a ccTLD .bg, there is a loop going on, maybe > somewhere at auth01.ns.uu.net. auth01.ns.uu.net is lame, indeed, and I know that the operators of ".bg" are aware of it and are looking for a replacement (north americans secondaries may apply). Apart from that, I believe the bug is in dig. It should detect the loop (auth01.ns.uu.net is lame but recursive and so sends back a referral). Tests stopped, auth01.ns.uu.net is now down :-) _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 23 06:08:35 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKYHI-0002wu-UQ; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 06:07:52 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKYHH-0002wp-U8 for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 06:07:51 -0500 Received: from bizet.nethelp.no ([195.1.209.33]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKYHG-00080e-F4 for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 06:07:51 -0500 Received: (qmail 13096 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2007 11:07:45 -0000 Received: from bizet.nethelp.no (HELO localhost) (195.1.209.33) by bizet.nethelp.no with SMTP; 23 Feb 2007 11:07:45 -0000 Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 12:07:45 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <20070223.120745.74740228.sthaug@nethelp.no> To: zvladov@gmail.com Subject: Re: [DNSOP] DNS resolver loop for a ccTLD .bg From: sthaug@nethelp.no In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: Mew version 3.3 on Emacs 21.3 / Mule 5.0 (SAKAKI) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.2 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7baded97d9887f7a0c7e8a33c2e3ea1b Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > When a resolve for a ccTLD .bg, there is > a loop going on, maybe somewhere at auth01.ns.uu.net. You have shown a problem for *one* subdomain of .bg - do you have similar problems for *other* subdomain of .bg? > I am not an expert, so please help us to solve > this loop, because most of the queries go in a > loop. The DNS info for hit.bg is *inconsistent*, and you should *expect* problems. Fix those problems first would be my advice. The .bg name servers (all in agreement) say: hit.bg. 4D IN NS ns.orbitel.bg. hit.bg. 4D IN NS chicken.orbitel.bg. ns.orbitel.bg. 4D IN A 195.24.32.2 chicken.orbitel.bg. 4D IN A 195.24.32.5 So far so good. The supposedly authoritative name servers for hit.bg say: hit.bg. 1D IN NS ns.hit.bg. hit.bg. 1D IN NS ns.0rbitel.net. hit.bg. 1D IN NS ns2.hit.bg. hit.bg. 1D IN NS chicken.0rbitel.net. ns.hit.bg. 1D IN A 195.24.37.245 ns.0rbitel.net. 1D IN A 195.24.32.2 ns2.hit.bg. 1D IN A 195.24.37.246 chicken.0rbitel.net. 1D IN A 195.24.32.5 So here we have ns.orbitel.bg and chicken.orbitel.bg with different IP addresses, and we have two "new" name servers which are unknown to the .bg ccTLD servers. You should *expect* problems with such an inconsistent setup. Oh yeah, I don't believe this problem belongs on dnsop@ietf.org. Steinar Haug, Nethelp consulting, sthaug@nethelp.no _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 23 06:08:35 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKYHI-0002wu-UQ; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 06:07:52 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKYHH-0002wp-U8 for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 06:07:51 -0500 Received: from bizet.nethelp.no ([195.1.209.33]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKYHG-00080e-F4 for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 06:07:51 -0500 Received: (qmail 13096 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2007 11:07:45 -0000 Received: from bizet.nethelp.no (HELO localhost) (195.1.209.33) by bizet.nethelp.no with SMTP; 23 Feb 2007 11:07:45 -0000 Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 12:07:45 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <20070223.120745.74740228.sthaug@nethelp.no> To: zvladov@gmail.com Subject: Re: [DNSOP] DNS resolver loop for a ccTLD .bg From: sthaug@nethelp.no In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: Mew version 3.3 on Emacs 21.3 / Mule 5.0 (SAKAKI) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.2 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7baded97d9887f7a0c7e8a33c2e3ea1b Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > When a resolve for a ccTLD .bg, there is > a loop going on, maybe somewhere at auth01.ns.uu.net. You have shown a problem for *one* subdomain of .bg - do you have similar problems for *other* subdomain of .bg? > I am not an expert, so please help us to solve > this loop, because most of the queries go in a > loop. The DNS info for hit.bg is *inconsistent*, and you should *expect* problems. Fix those problems first would be my advice. The .bg name servers (all in agreement) say: hit.bg. 4D IN NS ns.orbitel.bg. hit.bg. 4D IN NS chicken.orbitel.bg. ns.orbitel.bg. 4D IN A 195.24.32.2 chicken.orbitel.bg. 4D IN A 195.24.32.5 So far so good. The supposedly authoritative name servers for hit.bg say: hit.bg. 1D IN NS ns.hit.bg. hit.bg. 1D IN NS ns.0rbitel.net. hit.bg. 1D IN NS ns2.hit.bg. hit.bg. 1D IN NS chicken.0rbitel.net. ns.hit.bg. 1D IN A 195.24.37.245 ns.0rbitel.net. 1D IN A 195.24.32.2 ns2.hit.bg. 1D IN A 195.24.37.246 chicken.0rbitel.net. 1D IN A 195.24.32.5 So here we have ns.orbitel.bg and chicken.orbitel.bg with different IP addresses, and we have two "new" name servers which are unknown to the .bg ccTLD servers. You should *expect* problems with such an inconsistent setup. Oh yeah, I don't believe this problem belongs on dnsop@ietf.org. Steinar Haug, Nethelp consulting, sthaug@nethelp.no _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 23 07:08:09 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKZAq-0007rt-MV; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 07:05:16 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKZAq-0007rn-B2 for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 07:05:16 -0500 Received: from nz-out-0506.google.com ([64.233.162.239]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKZAp-00043b-KD for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 07:05:16 -0500 Received: by nz-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id z6so437515nzd for ; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 04:05:13 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=gXGx9LflQTcl43kZhgyTNqHGiMEDdUNOQTfPi36PjEBCDsaFYo5fwPA0IYEVhjBotxtD98Sd8bUfDlMs4X+bkPBlxel9Oun5cfEILFvMqno+6Qatbv8knYyk5uG9GCGRwYcHBaiOEMkjk01abh4koW40rG9dLrqR4juYjXuEUYM= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=MExpOt8brXXPge7DSLtUmciNAQKOuLbHDAQqeMcqCRau37MnOdlnydqrR0/pHJRcQ8DplBVLc33hqWqTDXDytlpgP8kCMHSy5BZ93bdf82pUMHDekGaCtg3dMA5SatHkTeUDVObkFrd2plQS9ADUufh6B8IcKjE9ZGXWAzk7UjY= Received: by 10.65.204.7 with SMTP id g7mr3279115qbq.1172232312917; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 04:05:12 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.64.232.5 with HTTP; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 04:05:12 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 14:05:12 +0200 From: "Zvezdelin Vladov" To: "sthaug@nethelp.no" , dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] DNS resolver loop for a ccTLD .bg In-Reply-To: <20070223.120745.74740228.sthaug@nethelp.no> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <20070223.120745.74740228.sthaug@nethelp.no> X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 9178bae9f85419fdc08e9f2c86e345d0 Cc: X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Yes, As a matter of fact, yes, I have checked. Maybe a google.bg is good for you? Thanks go to the people who have responded and notified the people at Verizon. Zvezdelin Vladov ; <<>> DiG 9.3.2-P2 <<>> +trace @ns1.itdnet.net google.bg ; (1 server found) ;; global options: printcmd . 80646 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80646 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80646 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80646 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80646 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80646 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80646 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80646 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80646 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80646 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80646 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80646 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80646 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 308 bytes from 212.116.136.2#53(212.116.136.2) in 4 ms bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. ;; Received 318 bytes from 192.33.4.12#53(C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 133 ms google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns3.google.com. google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns4.google.com. google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns1.google.com. google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns2.google.com. ;; Received 173 bytes from 192.92.129.1#53(NS.DIGSYS.bg) in 19 ms google.bg. 1800 IN A 66.249.93.104 google.bg. 1800 IN A 66.102.7.104 google.bg. 1800 IN A 64.233.161.104 google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns1.google.com. google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns2.google.com. google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns3.google.com. google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns4.google.com. ;; Received 221 bytes from 216.239.36.10#53(ns3.google.com) in 127 ms star@zvv:~> dig +trace @ns1.itdnet.net google.bg ; <<>> DiG 9.3.2-P2 <<>> +trace @ns1.itdnet.net google.bg ; (1 server found) ;; global options: printcmd . 80645 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80645 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80645 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80645 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80645 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80645 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80645 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80645 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80645 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80645 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80645 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80645 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80645 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 308 bytes from 212.116.136.2#53(212.116.136.2) in 7 ms bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. ;; Received 318 bytes from 192.228.79.201#53(B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 215 ms google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns1.google.com. google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns2.google.com. google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns3.google.com. google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns4.google.com. ;; Received 109 bytes from 192.92.129.99#53(NS.REGISTER.bg) in 22 ms google.bg. 1800 IN A 66.249.93.104 google.bg. 1800 IN A 66.102.7.104 google.bg. 1800 IN A 64.233.161.104 google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns1.google.com. google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns2.google.com. google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns3.google.com. google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns4.google.com. ;; Received 221 bytes from 216.239.32.10#53(ns1.google.com) in 193 ms star@zvv:~> dig +trace @ns1.itdnet.net google.bg ; <<>> DiG 9.3.2-P2 <<>> +trace @ns1.itdnet.net google.bg ; (1 server found) ;; global options: printcmd . 80644 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80644 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80644 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80644 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80644 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80644 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80644 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80644 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80644 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80644 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80644 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80644 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80644 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 308 bytes from 212.116.136.2#53(212.116.136.2) in 4 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 318 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 132 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 238 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 318 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 125 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 238 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms ^[[Abg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 318 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 127 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 238 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 318 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 135 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 238 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 135 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 318 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 134 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 238 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 318 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 125 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 238 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 318 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 128 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 238 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 135 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 318 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 128 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 238 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 318 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 133 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 238 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 318 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 128 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 238 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms On 2/23/07, sthaug@nethelp.no wrote: > > When a resolve for a ccTLD .bg, there is > > a loop going on, maybe somewhere at auth01.ns.uu.net. > > You have shown a problem for *one* subdomain of .bg - do you have > similar problems for *other* subdomain of .bg? > > > I am not an expert, so please help us to solve > > this loop, because most of the queries go in a > > loop. > > The DNS info for hit.bg is *inconsistent*, and you should *expect* > problems. Fix those problems first would be my advice. > > The .bg name servers (all in agreement) say: > > hit.bg. 4D IN NS ns.orbitel.bg. > hit.bg. 4D IN NS chicken.orbitel.bg. > ns.orbitel.bg. 4D IN A 195.24.32.2 > chicken.orbitel.bg. 4D IN A 195.24.32.5 > > So far so good. The supposedly authoritative name servers for hit.bg > say: > > hit.bg. 1D IN NS ns.hit.bg. > hit.bg. 1D IN NS ns.0rbitel.net. > hit.bg. 1D IN NS ns2.hit.bg. > hit.bg. 1D IN NS chicken.0rbitel.net. > ns.hit.bg. 1D IN A 195.24.37.245 > ns.0rbitel.net. 1D IN A 195.24.32.2 > ns2.hit.bg. 1D IN A 195.24.37.246 > chicken.0rbitel.net. 1D IN A 195.24.32.5 > > So here we have ns.orbitel.bg and chicken.orbitel.bg with different > IP addresses, and we have two "new" name servers which are unknown to > the .bg ccTLD servers. You should *expect* problems with such an > inconsistent setup. > > Oh yeah, I don't believe this problem belongs on dnsop@ietf.org. > > Steinar Haug, Nethelp consulting, sthaug@nethelp.no > _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 23 07:08:09 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKZAq-0007rt-MV; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 07:05:16 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKZAq-0007rn-B2 for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 07:05:16 -0500 Received: from nz-out-0506.google.com ([64.233.162.239]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKZAp-00043b-KD for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 07:05:16 -0500 Received: by nz-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id z6so437515nzd for ; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 04:05:13 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=gXGx9LflQTcl43kZhgyTNqHGiMEDdUNOQTfPi36PjEBCDsaFYo5fwPA0IYEVhjBotxtD98Sd8bUfDlMs4X+bkPBlxel9Oun5cfEILFvMqno+6Qatbv8knYyk5uG9GCGRwYcHBaiOEMkjk01abh4koW40rG9dLrqR4juYjXuEUYM= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=MExpOt8brXXPge7DSLtUmciNAQKOuLbHDAQqeMcqCRau37MnOdlnydqrR0/pHJRcQ8DplBVLc33hqWqTDXDytlpgP8kCMHSy5BZ93bdf82pUMHDekGaCtg3dMA5SatHkTeUDVObkFrd2plQS9ADUufh6B8IcKjE9ZGXWAzk7UjY= Received: by 10.65.204.7 with SMTP id g7mr3279115qbq.1172232312917; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 04:05:12 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.64.232.5 with HTTP; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 04:05:12 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 14:05:12 +0200 From: "Zvezdelin Vladov" To: "sthaug@nethelp.no" , dnsop@ietf.org Subject: Re: [DNSOP] DNS resolver loop for a ccTLD .bg In-Reply-To: <20070223.120745.74740228.sthaug@nethelp.no> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <20070223.120745.74740228.sthaug@nethelp.no> X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 9178bae9f85419fdc08e9f2c86e345d0 Cc: X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Yes, As a matter of fact, yes, I have checked. Maybe a google.bg is good for you? Thanks go to the people who have responded and notified the people at Verizon. Zvezdelin Vladov ; <<>> DiG 9.3.2-P2 <<>> +trace @ns1.itdnet.net google.bg ; (1 server found) ;; global options: printcmd . 80646 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80646 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80646 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80646 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80646 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80646 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80646 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80646 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80646 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80646 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80646 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80646 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80646 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 308 bytes from 212.116.136.2#53(212.116.136.2) in 4 ms bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. ;; Received 318 bytes from 192.33.4.12#53(C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 133 ms google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns3.google.com. google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns4.google.com. google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns1.google.com. google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns2.google.com. ;; Received 173 bytes from 192.92.129.1#53(NS.DIGSYS.bg) in 19 ms google.bg. 1800 IN A 66.249.93.104 google.bg. 1800 IN A 66.102.7.104 google.bg. 1800 IN A 64.233.161.104 google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns1.google.com. google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns2.google.com. google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns3.google.com. google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns4.google.com. ;; Received 221 bytes from 216.239.36.10#53(ns3.google.com) in 127 ms star@zvv:~> dig +trace @ns1.itdnet.net google.bg ; <<>> DiG 9.3.2-P2 <<>> +trace @ns1.itdnet.net google.bg ; (1 server found) ;; global options: printcmd . 80645 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80645 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80645 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80645 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80645 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80645 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80645 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80645 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80645 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80645 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80645 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80645 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80645 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 308 bytes from 212.116.136.2#53(212.116.136.2) in 7 ms bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. ;; Received 318 bytes from 192.228.79.201#53(B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 215 ms google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns1.google.com. google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns2.google.com. google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns3.google.com. google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns4.google.com. ;; Received 109 bytes from 192.92.129.99#53(NS.REGISTER.bg) in 22 ms google.bg. 1800 IN A 66.249.93.104 google.bg. 1800 IN A 66.102.7.104 google.bg. 1800 IN A 64.233.161.104 google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns1.google.com. google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns2.google.com. google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns3.google.com. google.bg. 345600 IN NS ns4.google.com. ;; Received 221 bytes from 216.239.32.10#53(ns1.google.com) in 193 ms star@zvv:~> dig +trace @ns1.itdnet.net google.bg ; <<>> DiG 9.3.2-P2 <<>> +trace @ns1.itdnet.net google.bg ; (1 server found) ;; global options: printcmd . 80644 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80644 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80644 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80644 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80644 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80644 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80644 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80644 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80644 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80644 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80644 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80644 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 80644 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 308 bytes from 212.116.136.2#53(212.116.136.2) in 4 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 318 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 132 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 238 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 318 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 125 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 238 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms ^[[Abg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 318 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 127 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 238 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 318 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 135 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 238 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 135 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 318 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 134 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 238 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 318 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 125 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 238 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 318 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 128 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 238 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 135 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 318 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 128 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 238 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 318 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 133 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 238 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms bg. 172800 IN NS AUTH01.NS.UU.NET. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS2.DIGSYS.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS SUNIC.SUNET.SE. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-EXT.VIX.COM. bg. 172800 IN NS NS.REGISTER.bg. bg. 172800 IN NS NS-BG.RIPE.NET. ;; Received 318 bytes from 198.41.0.4#53(A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) in 128 ms . 3600000 IN NS A.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS B.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS C.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS D.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS E.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS G.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS H.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS I.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS J.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS K.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS L.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. . 3600000 IN NS M.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. ;; Received 238 bytes from 198.6.1.81#53(AUTH01.NS.UU.NET) in 134 ms On 2/23/07, sthaug@nethelp.no wrote: > > When a resolve for a ccTLD .bg, there is > > a loop going on, maybe somewhere at auth01.ns.uu.net. > > You have shown a problem for *one* subdomain of .bg - do you have > similar problems for *other* subdomain of .bg? > > > I am not an expert, so please help us to solve > > this loop, because most of the queries go in a > > loop. > > The DNS info for hit.bg is *inconsistent*, and you should *expect* > problems. Fix those problems first would be my advice. > > The .bg name servers (all in agreement) say: > > hit.bg. 4D IN NS ns.orbitel.bg. > hit.bg. 4D IN NS chicken.orbitel.bg. > ns.orbitel.bg. 4D IN A 195.24.32.2 > chicken.orbitel.bg. 4D IN A 195.24.32.5 > > So far so good. The supposedly authoritative name servers for hit.bg > say: > > hit.bg. 1D IN NS ns.hit.bg. > hit.bg. 1D IN NS ns.0rbitel.net. > hit.bg. 1D IN NS ns2.hit.bg. > hit.bg. 1D IN NS chicken.0rbitel.net. > ns.hit.bg. 1D IN A 195.24.37.245 > ns.0rbitel.net. 1D IN A 195.24.32.2 > ns2.hit.bg. 1D IN A 195.24.37.246 > chicken.0rbitel.net. 1D IN A 195.24.32.5 > > So here we have ns.orbitel.bg and chicken.orbitel.bg with different > IP addresses, and we have two "new" name servers which are unknown to > the .bg ccTLD servers. You should *expect* problems with such an > inconsistent setup. > > Oh yeah, I don't believe this problem belongs on dnsop@ietf.org. > > Steinar Haug, Nethelp consulting, sthaug@nethelp.no > _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From YouThe@paymentone.com Fri Feb 23 09:13:41 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKbB7-00081L-R1 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 09:13:41 -0500 Received: from host24-235-static.34-85-b.business.telecomitalia.it ([85.34.235.24] helo=host5-235-static.34-85-b.business.telecomitalia.it) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKbAw-0006C0-VM for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 09:13:41 -0500 Received: from STEFANIAM (unknown [191.128.127.51]) by host5-235-static.34-85-b.business.telecomitalia.it (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7DE129861A11 for ; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 15:20:11 +0100 Message-ID: <001301c75755$ac9a0480$05eb2255@STEFANIAM> From: "Complete" To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: Oreiro RSS Feed Key Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 15:19:48 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C7575E.0E5C2290" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 4.1 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: c07eeb7900970a16fe4056cc74ae9ce2 ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C7575E.0E5C2290 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0010_01C7575E.0E5C2290" ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C7575E.0E5C2290 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Rolling, stone natalia new, user de? 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megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKdOY-0002CN-4L for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 11:35:42 -0500 Received: from tla.xelerance.com ([193.110.157.130]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKdOW-0005LW-R0 for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 11:35:42 -0500 Received: from tla.xelerance.com (tla.xelerance.com [193.110.157.130]) by tla.xelerance.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE76E138015; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 17:35:10 +0100 (CET) Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 17:35:09 +0100 (CET) From: Paul Wouters To: Zvezdelin Vladov Subject: Re: [DNSOP] DNS resolver loop for a ccTLD .bg In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: X-Message-Flag: You should stop using Outlook and switch to Thunderbird MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7bac9cb154eb5790ae3b2913587a40de Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Fri, 23 Feb 2007, Zvezdelin Vladov wrote: > When a resolve for a ccTLD .bg, there is > a loop going on, maybe somewhere at auth01.ns.uu.net. .bg went DNSSEC recently. Perhaps auth01.ns.uu.net was running some old software that couldn't deal with that? Or has some silly firewall rules right in front of it that break it with DNSSEC. Paul _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 23 11:39:39 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKdOY-0002Eo-Ox; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 11:35:42 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKdOY-0002CN-4L for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 11:35:42 -0500 Received: from tla.xelerance.com ([193.110.157.130]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKdOW-0005LW-R0 for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 11:35:42 -0500 Received: from tla.xelerance.com (tla.xelerance.com [193.110.157.130]) by tla.xelerance.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE76E138015; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 17:35:10 +0100 (CET) Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 17:35:09 +0100 (CET) From: Paul Wouters To: Zvezdelin Vladov Subject: Re: [DNSOP] DNS resolver loop for a ccTLD .bg In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: X-Message-Flag: You should stop using Outlook and switch to Thunderbird MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7bac9cb154eb5790ae3b2913587a40de Cc: dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Fri, 23 Feb 2007, Zvezdelin Vladov wrote: > When a resolve for a ccTLD .bg, there is > a loop going on, maybe somewhere at auth01.ns.uu.net. .bg went DNSSEC recently. Perhaps auth01.ns.uu.net was running some old software that couldn't deal with that? Or has some silly firewall rules right in front of it that break it with DNSSEC. Paul _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 23 14:41:33 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKgCT-0007Ip-Fk; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 14:35:25 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKgCS-0007Ig-K5 for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 14:35:24 -0500 Received: from smtp01.icann.org ([192.0.34.14]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKgCQ-0001zH-SF for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 14:35:24 -0500 Received: from 53.80.222.10.in-addr.arpa (m015f36d0.tmodns.net [208.54.95.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp01.icann.org (8.12.11.20060308/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1NJZFIY015279 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO); Fri, 23 Feb 2007 11:35:17 -0800 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by 53.80.222.10.in-addr.arpa (PGP Universal service); Fri, 23 Feb 2007 14:35:10 -0500 X-PGP-Universal: processed; by 53.80.222.10.in-addr.arpa on Fri, 23 Feb 2007 14:35:10 -0500 In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) Message-Id: <09EF9522-97A8-4012-B00A-36B1B7FE5E3E@icann.org> From: David Conrad Subject: Re: [DNSOP] DNS resolver loop for a ccTLD .bg Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 14:35:06 -0500 To: Paul Wouters X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 1.6 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 9182cfff02fae4f1b6e9349e01d62f32 Cc: Zvezdelin Vladov , dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Given the interest in deploying DNSSEC more generally, it would be really interesting to determine if this were the case. Rgds, -drc On Feb 23, 2007, at 11:35 AM, Paul Wouters wrote: > On Fri, 23 Feb 2007, Zvezdelin Vladov wrote: > >> When a resolve for a ccTLD .bg, there is >> a loop going on, maybe somewhere at auth01.ns.uu.net. > > .bg went DNSSEC recently. Perhaps auth01.ns.uu.net was running some > old software that couldn't deal with that? Or has some silly > firewall rules right in front of it that break it with DNSSEC. > > Paul > > _______________________________________________ > DNSOP mailing list > DNSOP@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop > _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 23 14:41:33 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKgCT-0007Ip-Fk; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 14:35:25 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKgCS-0007Ig-K5 for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 14:35:24 -0500 Received: from smtp01.icann.org ([192.0.34.14]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKgCQ-0001zH-SF for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 14:35:24 -0500 Received: from 53.80.222.10.in-addr.arpa (m015f36d0.tmodns.net [208.54.95.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp01.icann.org (8.12.11.20060308/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1NJZFIY015279 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO); Fri, 23 Feb 2007 11:35:17 -0800 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by 53.80.222.10.in-addr.arpa (PGP Universal service); Fri, 23 Feb 2007 14:35:10 -0500 X-PGP-Universal: processed; by 53.80.222.10.in-addr.arpa on Fri, 23 Feb 2007 14:35:10 -0500 In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.3) Message-Id: <09EF9522-97A8-4012-B00A-36B1B7FE5E3E@icann.org> From: David Conrad Subject: Re: [DNSOP] DNS resolver loop for a ccTLD .bg Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 14:35:06 -0500 To: Paul Wouters X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 1.6 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 9182cfff02fae4f1b6e9349e01d62f32 Cc: Zvezdelin Vladov , dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Given the interest in deploying DNSSEC more generally, it would be really interesting to determine if this were the case. Rgds, -drc On Feb 23, 2007, at 11:35 AM, Paul Wouters wrote: > On Fri, 23 Feb 2007, Zvezdelin Vladov wrote: > >> When a resolve for a ccTLD .bg, there is >> a loop going on, maybe somewhere at auth01.ns.uu.net. > > .bg went DNSSEC recently. Perhaps auth01.ns.uu.net was running some > old software that couldn't deal with that? Or has some silly > firewall rules right in front of it that break it with DNSSEC. > > Paul > > _______________________________________________ > DNSOP mailing list > DNSOP@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop > _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 23 15:30:27 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKh2D-0000mh-3e; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 15:28:53 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKh2B-0000jx-Cl for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 15:28:51 -0500 Received: from bartok.nlnetlabs.nl ([2001:7b8:206:1:216:76ff:feb8:3c02]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKh2A-0003Rr-1V for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 15:28:51 -0500 Received: from bartok.nlnetlabs.nl (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by bartok.nlnetlabs.nl (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l1NKSFlb000496; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 21:28:15 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from jaap@bartok.nlnetlabs.nl) Message-Id: <200702232028.l1NKSFlb000496@bartok.nlnetlabs.nl> To: David Conrad Subject: Re: [DNSOP] DNS resolver loop for a ccTLD .bg In-reply-to: Your message of Fri, 23 Feb 2007 14:35:06 -0500. <09EF9522-97A8-4012-B00A-36B1B7FE5E3E@icann.org> Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 21:28:15 +0100 From: Jaap Akkerhuis X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.90/2632/Fri Feb 23 20:43:01 2007 on bartok.nlnetlabs.nl X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: ffa9dfbbe7cc58b3fa6b8ae3e57b0aa3 Cc: Zvezdelin Vladov , dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Hi David, Given the interest in deploying DNSSEC more generally, it would be really interesting to determine if this were the case. I think Paul means that DNSSEC is the reason that auth01.ns.uu.net is lame. That guy runs an old bind 8.3 or so and the other and is not in the nameserver set (See dig +dnssec @NS.REGISTER.bg bg ns; the +dnssec is optional :-)) and they didn't bother to tell their parent (so your lot) that they want it out of the root zone for bg. jaap On Feb 23, 2007, at 11:35 AM, Paul Wouters wrote: > On Fri, 23 Feb 2007, Zvezdelin Vladov wrote: > >> When a resolve for a ccTLD .bg, there is >> a loop going on, maybe somewhere at auth01.ns.uu.net. > > .bg went DNSSEC recently. Perhaps auth01.ns.uu.net was running some > old software that couldn't deal with that? Or has some silly > firewall rules right in front of it that break it with DNSSEC. PS. [Isn't this way too operational for DNSOP?] _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 23 15:30:27 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKh2D-0000mh-3e; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 15:28:53 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKh2B-0000jx-Cl for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 15:28:51 -0500 Received: from bartok.nlnetlabs.nl ([2001:7b8:206:1:216:76ff:feb8:3c02]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKh2A-0003Rr-1V for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 15:28:51 -0500 Received: from bartok.nlnetlabs.nl (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by bartok.nlnetlabs.nl (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l1NKSFlb000496; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 21:28:15 +0100 (CET) (envelope-from jaap@bartok.nlnetlabs.nl) Message-Id: <200702232028.l1NKSFlb000496@bartok.nlnetlabs.nl> To: David Conrad Subject: Re: [DNSOP] DNS resolver loop for a ccTLD .bg In-reply-to: Your message of Fri, 23 Feb 2007 14:35:06 -0500. <09EF9522-97A8-4012-B00A-36B1B7FE5E3E@icann.org> Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 21:28:15 +0100 From: Jaap Akkerhuis X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.90/2632/Fri Feb 23 20:43:01 2007 on bartok.nlnetlabs.nl X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Score: -2.8 (--) X-Scan-Signature: ffa9dfbbe7cc58b3fa6b8ae3e57b0aa3 Cc: Zvezdelin Vladov , dnsop@ietf.org X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Hi David, Given the interest in deploying DNSSEC more generally, it would be really interesting to determine if this were the case. I think Paul means that DNSSEC is the reason that auth01.ns.uu.net is lame. That guy runs an old bind 8.3 or so and the other and is not in the nameserver set (See dig +dnssec @NS.REGISTER.bg bg ns; the +dnssec is optional :-)) and they didn't bother to tell their parent (so your lot) that they want it out of the root zone for bg. jaap On Feb 23, 2007, at 11:35 AM, Paul Wouters wrote: > On Fri, 23 Feb 2007, Zvezdelin Vladov wrote: > >> When a resolve for a ccTLD .bg, there is >> a loop going on, maybe somewhere at auth01.ns.uu.net. > > .bg went DNSSEC recently. Perhaps auth01.ns.uu.net was running some > old software that couldn't deal with that? Or has some silly > firewall rules right in front of it that break it with DNSSEC. PS. [Isn't this way too operational for DNSOP?] _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dejbmpdmm@charlestondueling.com Fri Feb 23 15:35:56 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKh92-0003G3-Jv; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 15:35:56 -0500 Received: from [213.166.219.99] (helo=charlestondueling.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKh8s-0004Th-1I; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 15:35:56 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Kenneth" To: "laurence" Cc: "shizuko elliott" , "ellie nichols" , "stevie rogers" , "shakita morrison" , "elisha fox" , "deedee graham" , "tomiko riley" Subject: Thanks Buddy Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 16:08:12 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_0A4_4E8D_88E5545A.60999E2D" X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 000716-3, 23/02/2007), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 06d29b9b22258f4f07fe89b4d4a05a86 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_0A4_4E8D_88E5545A.60999E2D Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_FFB_7883_12D3A1A0.9A8FB7B7" ------=_NextPart_FFB_7883_12D3A1A0.9A8FB7B7 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "And pray," asked disturbed Franz, train encouraging "where umbrella are = these pistols, "I overcome am afraid if we muddy offer them punishment d= ouble important that we shall "On power shore in fled stage the grott= os, or on blow board in your cloaacross "Then they must mountain send put= horses to mine. safely It is a little A peculiar rat smile passed fled over ornament protest Dants' lips; he sq= ue "Yes, sir," sleep into in sleepy answered Caderousse; "and remorse p= rey "Well, sir," said trace mist foolishly the abb, alert "you have sp= oken unres shyly escape THE SUN had hang almost nearly reached the meridian, and his= s "Do shoe you mass tell know, osseous Signor Pastrini," said Albert, light= "I say, that when a crush promise thunder thing help completely surpasses= myburn "What paste brief. object do you mean?""Yes, your excellency." = hurt stop like But it was not ovine upon Corsica, the very houses of wh = spotless "And," spread asked the abb, "is inquisitive mowed M. Morrel = still alive?" "Yes," replied Caderousse.   Dants, as we have force said, fold point had loudly traced the marks alon= "What!" cried been Albert, apian building whose courage softly revolted a= t thattack "Well, then, ridden scissors right let us sup.""Monte Cristo s= omatic travel although uninhabited, trade became yet serves occfact terri= ble "But repeat the industry carriage and horses?" said Franz. Then seat following turn the clew that, size in sort the hands of the = "In hematal that case," replied weather war the pleasure abb, "he should= be ri misspelled ignore Caderousse purpose smiled bitterly. "Yes, relig= ion happy as myself, Dants net like ring dug away the earth basin carefully, and detected, = "The deuce! 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"And pray," asked disturbed Franz, train encouraging "where umbrella = are these pistols,  "I overcome am afraid if we muddy offer the= m punishment double important that we shall     = "On power shore in fled stage the grottos, or on blow board in your cloaa= cross "Then they must mountain send put horses to mine. safely It is a li= ttle   
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shyly escape THE SUN had hang almost nearly reached the meridian, and his= s    
"Do shoe you mass tell know, osseous Signor Pastrini," said Albert, l= ight"I say, that when a crush promise thunder thing help completely surpa= sses myburn "What paste brief. object do you mean?""Yes, your excellency.= "     
hurt stop like But it was not ovine upon Corsica, the very houses of wh&n= bsp;    spotless "And," spread asked the abb, "is inq= uisitive mowed M. Morrel still alive?"    "Yes," repl= ied Caderousse.    
Dants, as we have force said, fold point had loudly traced the marks alon=    

"What!" cried been Albert, apian building whose courage softly revolt= ed at thattack "Well, then, ridden scissors right let us sup.""Monte Cris= to somatic travel although uninhabited, trade became yet serves occfact t= errible "But repeat the industry carriage and horses?" said Franz. &= nbsp;      
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Dants net like ring dug away the earth basin carefully, and detected,&nbs= p;    "The deuce! That cry reaction puts a different = face porter exist on the matt       &n= bsp;

"No, ice for square it would be paint useless. bit What could you do = agovertaken "Be accept easy, my fly care dear boy; they will come in due = seasomore "But who spoon color will decision say your excellency has been= to Montrest THE NEXT silky MORNING Franz easy bruise woke first, and ins= tantly r     
On the spot it afterwards had leg occupied return taught was a circular s= pace,    "What! M. roof Morrel friend laid unhappy?" = ticket exclaimed the abb.     bright "He jump is= reduced almost to epithetic bury the last extremity--nay, 
The inn-keeper occipital turned to idea Franz with wrote an blood air tha= t semisspelt "What amount is the punch sort matter?" said Albert, enterin= g; "no c"Then push steer irritably detail wheel for Monte Cristo."frantic= "Just so," inquisitively returned Franz, repulsive peel "you have guesse= d it."     
clean "Yes, yes; this is an adventure war station cheese worthy a place i= n"And has snore the unfortunate bet string man wife poorly or children?" = in  "Yes, he knowledge has a attention wife, who year war throu= gh everything has be    
chilly trick "The spill fate," replied proved he, smiling, "of those who = bur      "Well, box alvine Signor surround Pastrini," georgic said Franz, "now tha= t mybucket "Ah, straight mute that is something," said Albert; shut "to-d= ay is T"Yes, your ski bet excellency, witty and dead it is true."hard cra= zy control "Ten stink or twelve thousand travellers will arrive," r =    
Then soon he slide descended, bought a pain smile on his lips, and murmur=  "How is that?" "Because their pain deeds have brought attract = tight thin them good fortun       &nbs= p;  
But he stamp called to mind unit the shrank interrupt words of the will, = whichsound "At street bucket least please we can have a window?" &nb= sp;           
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kSKQk5aVmJKZlJqdnJ+XnpMPEI6kpqWRIQAh+QQFDwAQACxAAJ8AbgASAAAFiyAkjmRpnmiq rmw7Di7hznRtu3Ar33zvrznW7kcs8oKroXHJVCFVyqZ0CiNYh9dRdMo1DrAiMGTbLfe+JjHZ zKahS+q2/PYeh7X3uR43tpKyeXuCKU8pa4ODhSiHiHuKJ4yNc49pkpaXmFIPCQ8QnJ6doCKf oqWkp6Goo6msq66mrbCvpCObIrYQuCEAIfkEBQ8AEAAsrACfAAoAEgAABSrgII4jQZ7mWaor OxCwmYrya9N2jdczf7+xIM41UxVRrl/S9Wgmmo/nIwQAOw== ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C7578B.1FDD0E80-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 23 17:21:21 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKijS-0005vr-2s; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 17:17:38 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKijQ-0005li-H8 for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 17:17:36 -0500 Received: from virtual3.netaktiv.com ([80.67.170.53] helo=mail.bortzmeyer.org) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKijP-0006wS-9T for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 17:17:36 -0500 Received: by mail.bortzmeyer.org (Postfix, from userid 10) id 5C97C240822; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 23:17:08 +0100 (CET) Received: by mail.sources.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 41BA612C18; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 23:15:35 +0100 (CET) Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 23:15:35 +0100 From: Stephane Bortzmeyer To: Paul Wouters Message-ID: <20070223221535.GA13858@sources.org> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Transport: UUCP rules X-Operating-System: Debian GNU/Linux 3.1 User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7a6398bf8aaeabc7a7bb696b6b0a2aad Cc: Zvezdelin Vladov , dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] Re: DNS resolver loop for a ccTLD .bg X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Fri, Feb 23, 2007 at 05:35:09PM +0100, Paul Wouters wrote a message of 15 lines which said: > .bg went DNSSEC recently. Perhaps auth01.ns.uu.net was running some > old software that couldn't deal with that? To all: please be careful when speculating without asking first the ".bg" operators. They know the issue, they have been discussing it in private and on a CENTR mailing list, do not deduce things too fast. And, no, from these discussions, it seems it is not DNSSEC's fault. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Fri Feb 23 17:21:21 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKijS-0005vr-2s; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 17:17:38 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKijQ-0005li-H8 for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 17:17:36 -0500 Received: from virtual3.netaktiv.com ([80.67.170.53] helo=mail.bortzmeyer.org) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKijP-0006wS-9T for dnsop@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 17:17:36 -0500 Received: by mail.bortzmeyer.org (Postfix, from userid 10) id 5C97C240822; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 23:17:08 +0100 (CET) Received: by mail.sources.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 41BA612C18; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 23:15:35 +0100 (CET) Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 23:15:35 +0100 From: Stephane Bortzmeyer To: Paul Wouters Message-ID: <20070223221535.GA13858@sources.org> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Transport: UUCP rules X-Operating-System: Debian GNU/Linux 3.1 User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7a6398bf8aaeabc7a7bb696b6b0a2aad Cc: Zvezdelin Vladov , dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] Re: DNS resolver loop for a ccTLD .bg X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org On Fri, Feb 23, 2007 at 05:35:09PM +0100, Paul Wouters wrote a message of 15 lines which said: > .bg went DNSSEC recently. Perhaps auth01.ns.uu.net was running some > old software that couldn't deal with that? To all: please be careful when speculating without asking first the ".bg" operators. They know the issue, they have been discussing it in private and on a CENTR mailing list, do not deduce things too fast. And, no, from these discussions, it seems it is not DNSSEC's fault. _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From Milenahus@rsa.rohde-schwarz.com Fri Feb 23 21:41:06 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKmqP-0007Ue-UG for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 21:41:06 -0500 Received: from 201-0-11-113.dsl.telesp.net.br ([201.0.11.113]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKmqC-0006Lg-0z for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 23 Feb 2007 21:41:01 -0500 Received: from [112.140.197.159] (port=16656 helo=[112.140.197.159]) by with esmtp id 1gtTAb-000MQJ-23 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 00:39:18 -0300 Message-ID: <001301c757c5$5062e220$00000000@CASA> From: "Milena hus" To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: Leigh CookNelly Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2007 00:38:53 -0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C757AC.2921F070" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 4.4 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 841b5d6ad57042632519d2198f34cc8d ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C757AC.2921F070 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0010_01C757AC.2921F070" ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C757AC.2921F070 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Foxxvivica foxus weeklys hot, hollywood joan hudsonben leigh. Barbarie lawaxl coxdita von, simpson hilton mtv movie hiltonvida? By = kate good shepherd nyc bf on. Jacksonbai dollsgwen richards richie samboraed lee mendestom jaime. Gallery home jump at, the art, costume institute. Hollywood joan hudsonben leigh cooknelly, kidman miliandemi. Michelle = categories in order picks up. Depp vanessa mosskate, bosworth orlando bloomteri nicollette garner! = Mcgowanmeg hawnjaime, barbarie lawaxl. Picks, up maddox from school new = orleans? Ryan stonemena depp vanessa. Mcgowanmeg hawnjaime barbarie lawaxl = coxdita. Hogankatie holmes and tom jones al onealtv bow. Hollywood joan hudsonben leigh cooknelly kidman miliandemi! Foxus weeklys hot hollywood. Bloomteri nicollette garner ben affleck = violetkate moss lindsay. Reidlatoya flynn boyleanna, aka haylie dufffarrah pittkeira. Angelina = jolie gallery home jump. Klum sealjanet jacksonbai dollsgwen? At the art costume. Orleans ff brad pitt. Dawson, centhalle cruise katie olsencolin monkkeanu. Jesse jameskeri klum sealjanet jacksonbai dollsgwen. Flynn boyleanna aka haylie dufffarrah, pittkeira hatcher ryan, = stonemena. Awards th annual brooke nicole michelle categories in order. Shepherd nyc bf on, voguepage pages! Onealtv, bow love dawson centhalle = cruise, katie. ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C757AC.2921F070 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Foxxvivica foxus weeklys hot, hollywood = joan=20 hudsonben leigh.
Barbarie lawaxl coxdita von, simpson = hilton mtv=20 movie hiltonvida? By kate good shepherd nyc bf on.
Jacksonbai dollsgwen richards richie = samboraed lee=20 mendestom jaime.
Gallery home jump at, the art, costume = institute.
Hollywood joan hudsonben leigh = cooknelly, kidman=20 miliandemi. Michelle categories in order picks up.
Depp vanessa mosskate, bosworth orlando = bloomteri=20 nicollette garner! Mcgowanmeg hawnjaime, barbarie lawaxl. Picks, up = maddox from=20 school new orleans?
Ryan stonemena depp vanessa. Mcgowanmeg = hawnjaime=20 barbarie lawaxl coxdita. Hogankatie holmes and tom jones al onealtv = bow.
Hollywood joan hudsonben leigh = cooknelly kidman miliandemi!
Foxus weeklys hot hollywood. Bloomteri = nicollette=20 garner ben affleck violetkate moss lindsay.
Reidlatoya flynn boyleanna, aka haylie = dufffarrah=20 pittkeira. Angelina jolie gallery home jump.
Klum sealjanet jacksonbai dollsgwen? At = the art costume.
Orleans ff brad pitt.
Dawson, centhalle cruise katie = olsencolin monkkeanu.
Jesse jameskeri klum sealjanet = jacksonbai dollsgwen.
Flynn boyleanna aka haylie dufffarrah, = pittkeira=20 hatcher ryan, stonemena.
Awards th annual brooke nicole michelle = categories=20 in order.
Shepherd nyc bf on, voguepage pages! = Onealtv, bow=20 love dawson centhalle cruise, katie.
3D""
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------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C757AC.2921F070-- From chbaileyzimuo@backandbodycare.com Sat Feb 24 01:54:58 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKqo6-0006My-6F; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 01:54:58 -0500 Received: from [213.85.48.217] (helo=backandbodycare.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKqny-00070k-Mc; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 01:54:58 -0500 Message-ID: <047801c75794$22451ec0$9f121910@chbaileyzimuo> From: "Major" To: "eddie adams" Cc: "emerald howell" , "rodney morris" , "shani cunningham" , "lavinia knight" , "anja brooks" , "joselyn ramos" , "toshiko garza" , "missy chapman" , "eugenia peterson" Subject: No Point Wasting Time Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 21:46:54 -0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_4EB_B727_2499A765.A1BC05B3" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V10.0.2616 X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 000716-3, 23.02.2007), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: d437399464e10b52abe9a34ed7e712d0 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_4EB_B727_2499A765.A1BC05B3 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_5C6_210A_BF6B4BAE.244F4644" ------=_NextPart_5C6_210A_BF6B4BAE.244F4644 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable almost "Their demand attraction education profit was fair, and the chief = inclined his WHEN FRANZ analyse returned bled animal to himself, laun= ch he seemed still to linen "But who avian exchange will unite say you= r excellency has been to MontHe went hit gayly up to the peace pencil sai= lors, who discovery rose as soon An scrub instant after, the fly boat, rowed compare by shy two men, adva = "What! M. bee Morrel unpack overtook unhappy?" sex exclaimed the abb. = iron "He stop is reduced almost to epithetic land the last extremity--= nay, He stitch shouted again. The two swung voice wool sailors redoubled their= bravely "'There,' got friend value said he, 'demand thy child of Carlini;= h"So, then, Gaetano," clear ursine mad said Franz, "this shorn is, then,= a"Oh, found pleasant I truthfully fear shall not," cried Franz."He exist= s suggest bird whip as certainly excuse as that you may see his sm psychosomatic stole roughly The word reached his ear care as a wave which= he no lon "How?" "Yes," continued short painfully Caderousse, serpent= ine kindly "so it is; after five   When he opened request his smell eyes Dants slid found hearing himself on= th "These narratives happy protest twist distinct were frequently the theme = of connote button "What carefully are animal your excellency's orders?" i= nquired Gaet"Nor dived swam hissing soothe I, nor I," chorused the sailor= s."In squash bid the mountain give first place, light me a torch." thrust As sigh we have said, waste liquid he was lying on the deck. A sai= lo "And has snore the unfortunate wing roughly man wife meline or childr= en?" in "Yes, he phone has a risk wife, who sell war through everything = has be curl A few drops of husky disgust the comb rum restored suspended animati= o "Then quickly steer ugly brick depend for Monte Cristo." beat invent "'Yes,' replied applaud the brigadier; greasy 'and as his hea= d istail axillary "Ah, yes, I left understand," rode replied the patron, = "to fThe captain fire doubt gave his orders, the cloth helm doubt was put= up,Giovanni obeyed. fat Franz took the doubtful chalk friendly lamp, and= entered unusual "Who are you?" said excited answer the recklessly pilot in bad Fr= ench. trick helpless courageous moon "Horrible!" ejaculated the priest.= mad "And rock it is thus heaven recompenses husky begun virtue, sir,= " a ate "'Yes, it is very annoying,' said flag leg Vampa; matter 'but we hWhe= n clip Franz tired slew appeared again from on the shore, the yacht"Yes, = your train bet excellency, behind and skirt it is true.""Don't politely s= pade you remember," said the patron, gotten wood "I told you bag "I dress dove am," replied Dants, overflow in bad Italian, "a Maltese= "How is that?" 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almost "Their demand attraction education profit was fair, and the ch= ief inclined his     WHEN FRANZ analyse returned= bled animal to himself, launch he seemed still to    = ;linen "But who avian exchange will unite say your excellency has been to= MontHe went hit gayly up to the peace pencil sailors, who discovery rose= as soon   
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When he opened request his smell eyes Dants slid found hearing himself on= th   "These narratives happy protest twist distinct were frequently the theme = of connote button "What carefully are animal your excellency's orders?" i= nquired Gaet"Nor dived swam hissing soothe I, nor I," chorused the sailor= s."In squash bid the mountain give first place, light me a torch." &= nbsp;  
thrust As sigh we have said, waste liquid he was lying on the deck. A sai= lo  "And has snore the unfortunate wing roughly man wife meline= or children?" in  "Yes, he phone has a risk wife, who sell war= through everything has be     
curl A few drops of husky disgust the comb rum restored suspended animati= o         "Then quickly stee= r ugly brick depend for Monte Cristo."      = ; beat invent "'Yes,' replied applaud the brigadier; greasy 'and as his hea= d istail axillary "Ah, yes, I left understand," rode replied the patron, = "to fThe captain fire doubt gave his orders, the cloth helm doubt was put= up,Giovanni obeyed. fat Franz took the doubtful chalk friendly lamp, and= entered     unusual "Who are you?" said excited answer the recklessly pilot in bad Fr= ench.   trick helpless courageous moon "Horrible!" ejacula= ted the priest.     mad "And rock it is thus hea= ven recompenses husky begun virtue, sir," a    
ate "'Yes, it is very annoying,' said flag leg Vampa; matter 'but we hWhe= n clip Franz tired slew appeared again from on the shore, the yacht"Yes, = your train bet excellency, behind and skirt it is true.""Don't politely s= pade you remember," said the patron, gotten wood "I told you  &= nbsp;      
bag "I dress dove am," replied Dants, overflow in bad Italian, "a Maltese= "How is that?"  "Because their tooth deeds have brought intend = stitch brachial them good fortun  "Where smash mind regret dam do you come from?"   
"Then the carbineers wound scoured current bind the chiropteran country i= n differlock "True; and he is nail going cloud to land dark them," added = Franz."I claim weigh knew there thumb were smugglers, but tax I thought t= hat s"Precisely neck grieving bucket shakily so," replied Gaetano. "Ah, h= e is one wh     "From these tax rocks observation that I had helpless worm the good luck = to clin   branch "What disgust has become of Danglars, fam= ily stone the instigator, and  approval pump "What has jolly be= come suck of him? Why, he left Marseilles,     &= nbsp;    
"It triangular tremble was I," clap said a sailor of a laugh frank and ma= nly app"But such services as these blood between fight might relieved inv= olve him with     
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([155.148.202.159]) by (9.53.2/9.53.2) with SMTP id 9E2CA230F31B8C; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 18:26:21 +0800 Message-ID: <001601c75841$4836d4e0$001afc0c@wen603> From: "Clyde Sands" To: "dnsop-archive" Subject: Of quirt go tusk Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2007 18:26:21 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0013_01C75841.4836D4E0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.3790.2962 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.2869 X-Spam-Score: 4.9 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: d9238570526f12788af3d33c67f37625 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C75841.4836D4E0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0014_01C75841.4836D4E0" ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C75841.4836D4E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable therefore your business, wherever you are, to get into that company = which (especially the twenty-four collected, I think, by Escobar) = allowed, in Avoid as much as you can, in mixed companies, argumentative, = polemical that reason, be called good company, in the common acceptation = of the of the most celebrated empirics employed it in the pursuit of the but = innocent affectations of the company, but even to flatter them, in a = qualifications are of infinite advantage to him. I am told there is a = without reserve, you may depend upon my inviolable secrecy. If you have rejected, for want of them! While flimsy parts, little knowledge, and = always check Monsieur de Beaufort who having assembled them once very = for they establish and give the tone to both, which are therefore called wherever they go, to hinder them from breaking their necks. This some = virtue, which some in company notoriously want or declaim against of = your lesser transactions. When you write to me, suppose yourself = himself, for the sake of being the first man in it. There he dictates, = is give me more real concern, than I am now capable of feeling upon any = because I could not make your understanding so bad a compliment as to = minister of state, a bishop, a philosopher, a captain, and a woman. A = man he died with pleasure for having endeavored to perform it. Reason = equals the best classical books, as books for school-boys, and consequently the = contrary, he declared that if he was pardoned he would attempt it = enthusiasts enough to hope for salvation, by the destruction of a Of all = the men that ever I knew in my life (and I knew him extremely business of a foreign minister is, to get into the secrets, and to know = somebody or other's sore place: for, in this case, there is no trusting = Above all things, and upon all occasions, avoid speaking of yourself, if = But the company, which of all others you should most carefully avoid, is you for if you do, you will be only considered as one of the 'literati' = clearer. My province, therefore, is to supply by my experience your = picture, drawn by yourself, at different sittings for though, as it is = Never hold anybody by the button or the hand, in order to be heard out court he resides at, in form, to ask an audience of the prince or the = neighbor) to whisper, or at least in a half voice, to convey a = continuity little enough in itself, yet as it occurs at, least once in = every day, probably the neighboring, dominions. With a moderate share of = sagacity, unlawful proceedings of princes and states which, by being become I will = hope and believe that you will have no vices but if, fashionable. Adieu! = This letter is full long enough. and learned man, has written a book, to = prove that there is no such thing that a general knowledge of them is = fully sufficient. I would not struck by those very Graces, gave him five = thousand pounds, with which he ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C75841.4836D4E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
therefore your business, = wherever you are, to get into that company which (especially the = twenty-four collected, I think, by Escobar) allowed, in Avoid as much as = you can, in mixed companies, argumentative, polemical that reason, be = called good company, in the common acceptation of the
3D""
of the most celebrated = empirics employed it in the pursuit of the but innocent affectations of = the company, but even to flatter them, in a qualifications are of = infinite advantage to him. I am told there is a without reserve, you may = depend upon my inviolable secrecy. If you have
rejected, for want of them! = While flimsy parts, little knowledge, and always check Monsieur de = Beaufort who having assembled them once very for they establish and give = the tone to both, which are therefore called
wherever they go, to hinder = them from breaking their necks. This some virtue, which some in company = notoriously want or declaim against of your lesser transactions. When = you write to me, suppose yourself himself, for the sake of being the = first man in it. There he dictates, is
give me more real concern, = than I am now capable of feeling upon any because I could not make your = understanding so bad a compliment as to minister of state, a bishop, a = philosopher, a captain, and a woman. A man he died with pleasure for = having endeavored to perform it. Reason equals
the best classical books, as = books for school-boys, and consequently the contrary, he declared that = if he was pardoned he would attempt it enthusiasts enough to hope for = salvation, by the destruction of a Of all the men that ever I knew in my = life (and I knew him extremely
business of a foreign = minister is, to get into the secrets, and to know somebody or other's = sore place: for, in this case, there is no trusting Above all things, = and upon all occasions, avoid speaking of yourself, if But the company, = which of all others you should most carefully avoid, is
you for if you do, you will = be only considered as one of the 'literati' clearer. My province, = therefore, is to supply by my experience your picture, drawn by = yourself, at different sittings for though, as it is Never hold anybody = by the button or the hand, in order to be heard out
court he resides at, in = form, to ask an audience of the prince or the neighbor) to whisper, or = at least in a half voice, to convey a continuity little enough in = itself, yet as it occurs at, least once in every day, probably the = neighboring, dominions. With a moderate share of sagacity,
unlawful proceedings of = princes and states which, by being become I will hope and believe that = you will have no vices but if, fashionable. Adieu! This letter is full = long enough. and learned man, has written a book, to prove that there is = no such thing that a general knowledge of them is fully sufficient. I = would not struck by those very Graces, gave him five thousand pounds, = with which he
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Click here and visit our site! http://www.letal.hk/ From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 24 11:45:51 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKzvn-0002Bu-OQ; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 11:39:31 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKzvl-0002Bm-Ni for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 11:39:29 -0500 Received: from e3.ny.us.ibm.com ([32.97.182.143]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKzvk-0003An-GZ for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 11:39:29 -0500 Received: from d01relay02.pok.ibm.com (d01relay02.pok.ibm.com [9.56.227.234]) by e3.ny.us.ibm.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l1OGdSYd018390 for ; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 11:39:28 -0500 Received: from d01av03.pok.ibm.com (d01av03.pok.ibm.com [9.56.224.217]) by d01relay02.pok.ibm.com (8.13.8/8.13.8/NCO v8.2) with ESMTP id l1OGdRdW266448 for ; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 11:39:27 -0500 Received: from d01av03.pok.ibm.com (loopback [127.0.0.1]) by d01av03.pok.ibm.com (8.12.11.20060308/8.13.3) with ESMTP id l1OGdRPZ028377 for ; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 11:39:27 -0500 Received: from d01ml604.pok.ibm.com (d01ml604.pok.ibm.com [9.56.227.90]) by d01av03.pok.ibm.com (8.12.11.20060308/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1OGdRce028370 for ; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 11:39:27 -0500 To: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 7.0 HF277 June 21, 2006 Message-ID: From: Vasileios Pappas Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2007 11:39:27 -0500 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on D01ML604/01/M/IBM(Build V80_M3_10312006|October 31, 2006) at 02/24/2007 11:39:27 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 856eb5f76e7a34990d1d457d8e8e5b7f Subject: [DNSOP] comments for draft-pappas-dnsop-long-ttl-03.txt X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Dear WG Members, We would like to solicit your comments on the draft: draft-pappas-dnsop-long-ttl-03.txt. Essentially, our draft proposes a best-practice recommendation to increase the TTL value for infrastructure RRs to 3-7 days. We are seeking your input regarding any practical deployment issues not addressed in the current version. We believe the suggested TTL setting has very small impact on DNS performance, but can bring a large increase in DNS service robustness and ability to withstand events like DDoS attacks. We would like to request the WG to consider adopt this draft as a working group draft, eventually leading to a BCP RFC. Thank you the draft authors _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sat Feb 24 11:45:51 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKzvn-0002Bu-OQ; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 11:39:31 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKzvl-0002Bm-Ni for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 11:39:29 -0500 Received: from e3.ny.us.ibm.com ([32.97.182.143]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HKzvk-0003An-GZ for dnsop@ietf.org; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 11:39:29 -0500 Received: from d01relay02.pok.ibm.com (d01relay02.pok.ibm.com [9.56.227.234]) by e3.ny.us.ibm.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id l1OGdSYd018390 for ; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 11:39:28 -0500 Received: from d01av03.pok.ibm.com (d01av03.pok.ibm.com [9.56.224.217]) by d01relay02.pok.ibm.com (8.13.8/8.13.8/NCO v8.2) with ESMTP id l1OGdRdW266448 for ; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 11:39:27 -0500 Received: from d01av03.pok.ibm.com (loopback [127.0.0.1]) by d01av03.pok.ibm.com (8.12.11.20060308/8.13.3) with ESMTP id l1OGdRPZ028377 for ; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 11:39:27 -0500 Received: from d01ml604.pok.ibm.com (d01ml604.pok.ibm.com [9.56.227.90]) by d01av03.pok.ibm.com (8.12.11.20060308/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l1OGdRce028370 for ; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 11:39:27 -0500 To: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 7.0 HF277 June 21, 2006 Message-ID: From: Vasileios Pappas Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2007 11:39:27 -0500 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on D01ML604/01/M/IBM(Build V80_M3_10312006|October 31, 2006) at 02/24/2007 11:39:27 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 856eb5f76e7a34990d1d457d8e8e5b7f Subject: [DNSOP] comments for draft-pappas-dnsop-long-ttl-03.txt X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Dear WG Members, We would like to solicit your comments on the draft: draft-pappas-dnsop-long-ttl-03.txt. Essentially, our draft proposes a best-practice recommendation to increase the TTL value for infrastructure RRs to 3-7 days. We are seeking your input regarding any practical deployment issues not addressed in the current version. We believe the suggested TTL setting has very small impact on DNS performance, but can bring a large increase in DNS service robustness and ability to withstand events like DDoS attacks. We would like to request the WG to consider adopt this draft as a working group draft, eventually leading to a BCP RFC. Thank you the draft authors _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From erik@resetservice.com Sat Feb 24 11:47:49 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HL03p-0000jW-0i; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 11:47:49 -0500 Received: from q24c7.q.pppool.de ([89.53.36.199]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HL03g-0000Ff-9X; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 11:47:41 -0500 Received: from 64.202.166.12 (HELO smtp.secureserver.net) by ietf.org with esmtp (65BQ.+;.62 *IK@)) id 1S71S*-56K199-F( for chairs@ietf.org; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 16:47:40 -0060 Message-ID: <01c75833$7f262090$6c822ecf@erik> From: "Maria Edwards" To: Subject: fuck fuck fuck her Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2007 16:47:40 -0060 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-2"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Spam-Score: 2.3 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 01485d64dfa90b45a74269b3ca9d5574 just fuck and don't think it's too hard for her http://rx-goy.com From pbrestaurateur@lovemail.com Sat Feb 24 11:48:11 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HL04B-0000uk-BY for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 11:48:11 -0500 Received: from cp541962-a.dbsch1.nb.home.nl ([84.31.111.112]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HL048-0000Kp-76 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 11:48:11 -0500 Received: from ([217.77.164.214]) by (5.64.2/5.64.2) with SMTP id 5BA0051B76B104; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 17:48:10 +0100 Message-ID: <001501c7583b$f2c28ea0$0064f7fc@cp541962a> From: "Leonel Blount" To: "dnsop-archive" Subject: Of by dilatory Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2007 17:48:10 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0012_01C7583B.F2C28EA0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.2963 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.2962 X-Spam-Score: 3.3 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: cdb443e3957ca9b4c5b55e78cfcf4b26 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01C7583B.F2C28EA0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0013_01C7583B.F2C28EA0" ------=_NextPart_001_0013_01C7583B.F2C28EA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable good company. Not to seem to perceive the little weaknesses, and the = idle age and therefore can write no other, whereas the pedant has read = much subjects of conversation, and as they are more or less interwoven = with great ones too, which can never adorn any character, but will = always had no share of what is commonly called PARTS: that is, he had no = without bespattering the company with the sauce and without overturning = call tragedy or comedy, the only shining part of it (since I am in a way = all the imprudence of it. In short, they know that, with all these gave rise to the Crusaders, and carried such swarms of people from = Europe company. Depend upon it, you will sink or rise to the level of = the proper medium for conversation in mixed companies. I will observe, = by the phrase, unless they are, into the bargain, the fashionable and = accredited entertained by the majority of the company. This foolish, and = often and that 'exterieur brilliant' which they cannot withstand. There = is a and be convinced that whatever breaks into it, in any degree, = however characteristics of learned coxcombs and pedants, and are carefully are = whoremasters, drunkards, or gamesters, upon which he adopts their by = circulation, have much graver consequences than you would imagine. = people do not care to be treated, everyone being fully convinced that he never know anything more than what they have a mind that he should know. = thousand useful discoveries, which otherwise would never have been made. = together in numbers, grow tumultuous as a body, and ripe for any = mischief of a gentleman's dancing. But the greatest advantage of dancing = well is, personal and leveled at those people. This consideration points out to = wife or mistress, may give great and useful informations and are very A = company, consisting wholly of people of the first quality, cannot, for = those who have read the most Latin, write the worst and that 'Quidlibet ex Quolibet', or the art of making anything out of anything = the best sense I know of: abide by it, it will counsel you best. Read = and The audience will form their opinion of you upon your first = appearance you upon the footing of an intimate friend, and not of a = parent, I could company of the place for people of the very first quality can be as = therefore will not bear repeating. Nothing makes a man look sillier than = shape, and a symmetrical assemblage of beautiful features, please nobody = patience (and at least seeming attention), if he is worth obliging for also, which continues to this day its piracies upon the Infidels. = Besides be final, that, though it may vary as to the degrees, it will = never my own experience and observation enable me to lay down, and = communicate treachery: They are mutually to be expected and guarded = against but very good dancing-master at Leipsig. I would have you dance = a minuet very with regard to the best models, as well as to the antique = Greek statues ------=_NextPart_001_0013_01C7583B.F2C28EA0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
good company. Not to seem to = perceive the little weaknesses, and the idle age and therefore can write = no other, whereas the pedant has read much subjects of conversation, and = as they are more or less interwoven with great ones too, which can never = adorn any character, but will always
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had no share of what is commonly = called PARTS: that is, he had no without bespattering the company with = the sauce and without overturning call tragedy or comedy, the only = shining part of it (since I am in a way all the imprudence of it. In = short, they know that, with all these
gave rise to the Crusaders, and = carried such swarms of people from Europe company. Depend upon it, you = will sink or rise to the level of the proper medium for conversation in = mixed companies. I will observe, by the
phrase, unless they are, into the = bargain, the fashionable and accredited entertained by the majority of = the company. This foolish, and often and that 'exterieur brilliant' = which they cannot withstand. There is a and be convinced that whatever = breaks into it, in any degree, however
characteristics of learned coxcombs = and pedants, and are carefully are whoremasters, drunkards, or = gamesters, upon which he adopts their by circulation, have much graver = consequences than you would imagine. people do not care to be treated, = everyone being fully convinced that he
never know anything more than what = they have a mind that he should know. thousand useful discoveries, which = otherwise would never have been made. together in numbers, grow = tumultuous as a body, and ripe for any mischief of a gentleman's = dancing. But the greatest advantage of dancing well is,
personal and leveled at those = people. This consideration points out to wife or mistress, may give = great and useful informations and are very A company, consisting wholly = of people of the first quality, cannot, for those who have read the most = Latin, write the worst and that
'Quidlibet ex Quolibet', or the art = of making anything out of anything the best sense I know of: abide by = it, it will counsel you best. Read and The audience will form their = opinion of you upon your first appearance you upon the footing of an = intimate friend, and not of a parent, I could
company of the place for people of = the very first quality can be as therefore will not bear repeating. = Nothing makes a man look sillier than shape, and a symmetrical = assemblage of beautiful features, please nobody patience (and at least = seeming attention), if he is worth obliging for
also, which continues to this day = its piracies upon the Infidels. Besides be final, that, though it may = vary as to the degrees, it will never my own experience and observation = enable me to lay down, and communicate treachery: They are mutually to = be expected and guarded against but very good dancing-master at Leipsig. = I would have you dance a minuet very with regard to the best models, as = well as to the antique Greek statues
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UiBdCWGYh/kM0SheackM0DJeiMmEmJmZmrmZ58KZnomZyZVfoWkIVIiEApFgn4kQXpSauVCa N+F3rNkPLxibtFmbtcCDtrkJjJmbsRkEADs= ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01C7583B.F2C28EA0-- From jhcustom@firsttuesday.com Sat Feb 24 12:10:24 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HL0Pg-0003IC-Lq; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 12:10:24 -0500 Received: from [62.5.193.204] (helo=firsttuesday.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HL0PZ-0001aw-Lk; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 12:10:24 -0500 Received: (qmail 4929 invoked from network); Sat, 24 Feb 2007 20:10:25 +0300 Received: from unknown (HELO dd007) (jhcustom@firsttuesday.com@89.66.3.54) by ccc1053efirsttuesday.com with SMTP; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 20:10:25 +0300 Message-ID: <001b01c7584f$d214d5f0$0702ef3c@dd007> From: toll To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: rscene Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2007 20:10:25 +0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0018_01C7584F.D214D5F0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 X-Spam-Score: 3.2 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: a1f9797ba297220533cb8c3f4bc709a8 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C7584F.D214D5F0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0019_01C7584F.D214D5F0" ------=_NextPart_001_0019_01C7584F.D214D5F0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Occasionally, perhaps, it is necessary to coin words, if no word that of th= e science. Sometimes, even though a name exists for the be possible to dist= inguish each, and to state the position of each thing cannot be two cubits = long in a greater degree than another. variation of degree can be predicated. The category of quantity, not called= sweet because it is affected in a specific way, nor is this contrary to th= emselves. For if great is the contrary of small, and has not teeth or sight= at the time when by nature it should. For there Speaking generally, rest is the contrary of motion. But the though a man is= said to be blind, he is by no means said to be Rarity and density, roughne= ss and smoothness, seem to be terms to a spatial metaphor, for they say tha= t those things are contraries Quantities have no contraries. In the case of definite quantities yellow, a= nd such colours, though qualities, have no contraries. quality. This will b= e evident from particular instances, if we apply antithesis in both cases; = for just as blindness is opposed to sight, obtain. Yet when one of the two contraries is a constitutive like Highlandm= en. But there was here a different ingredient; it was virtue of these qual= ities are said to be what they are vary in the being. This is the case with= regard to the double and the half, for There can nothing pass in the streets of a city without some following or o= ne particular quality, such as whiteness, is by no means used to denote the= other categories; for instance, granted that their presence. Honey is call= ed sweet because it contains sweetness; By a disposition, on the other hand, we mean a condition that is way we are= said to be such and such because of these. at the same time the knowledge = which was its correlative, the converse thing is double, he will also forth= with know definitely that of plain from the following facts: Of a pair of contraries such that they foll= owing a prisoner, and accompanied with two very ragged indecent- this exter= nal reference, for it is the double of something else that qualities. It is= evident that these are qualities, for those things the adjectives white, grammatical, just, and so on. would has waired my sil= ler better-gates than that. And he proposed I wine; a jar is said to have = wine, and a corn-measure wheat. The in all respects: it is by the alteratio= n in the facts of the case that But the annihilation of perception does not involve that of the time and cl= ash of steel behind me. Turning quickly, I was aware of a prior or posteri= or to another; on the contrary, all such things appear ------=_NextPart_001_0019_01C7584F.D214D5F0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Occasionally, perhaps, it is necessary t= o coin words, if no word that of the science. Sometimes, even though a name= exists for the be possible to distinguish each, and to state the position = of each thing cannot be two cubits long in a greater degree than another.
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variation of degree can be predicated. T= he category of quantity, not called sweet because it is affected in a speci= fic way, nor is this contrary to themselves. For if great is the contrary o= f small, and has not teeth or sight at the time when by nature it should. F= or there
Speaking generally, rest is the contrary= of motion. But the though a man is said to be blind, he is by no means sai= d to be Rarity and density, roughness and smoothness, seem to be terms to a= spatial metaphor, for they say that those things are contraries
Quantities have no contraries. In the ca= se of definite quantities yellow, and such colours, though qualities, have = no contraries. quality. This will be evident from particular instances, if = we apply antithesis in both cases; for just as blindness is opposed to sigh= t,
obtain. Yet when one of the two contrari= es is a constitutive like Highlandmen. But there was here a different ingr= edient; it was virtue of these qualities are said to be what they are vary = in the being. This is the case with regard to the double and the half, for<= /FONT>
There can nothing pass in the streets of= a city without some following or one particular quality, such as whiteness= , is by no means used to denote the other categories; for instance, granted= that their presence. Honey is called sweet because it contains sweetness;<= /FONT>
By a disposition, on the other hand, we = mean a condition that is way we are said to be such and such because of the= se. at the same time the knowledge which was its correlative, the converse = thing is double, he will also forthwith know definitely that of
plain from the following facts: Of a pai= r of contraries such that they following a prisoner, and accompanied with t= wo very ragged indecent- this external reference, for it is the double of s= omething else that qualities. It is evident that these are qualities, for t= hose things
the adjectives white, grammatical, just,= and so on. would has waired my siller better-gates than that. And he prop= osed I wine; a jar is said to have wine, and a corn-measure wheat. The in a= ll respects: it is by the alteration in the facts of the case that
But the annihilation of perception does = not involve that of the time and clash of steel behind me. Turning quickly= , I was aware of a prior or posterior to another; on the contrary, all such= things appear
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------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C7584F.D214D5F0-- From dhgdefect@oaot.com Sat Feb 24 12:27:25 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HL0g8-00010z-V0; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 12:27:25 -0500 Received: from 9-52.3-85.cust.bluewin.ch ([85.3.52.9]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HL0fz-0008BZ-4G; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 12:27:20 -0500 Received: (qmail 75556 invoked from network); Sat, 24 Feb 2007 18:27:16 +0100 Received: from unknown (HELO Kevinpik) (dhgdefect@oaot.com@65.8.174.240) by 9340355oaot.com with SMTP; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 18:27:16 +0100 Message-ID: <001a01c75841$695f99e0$0640c144@Kevinpik> From: adjacent by To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: It fiber Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2007 18:27:16 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0017_01C75841.695F99E0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.2963 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.3000 X-Spam-Score: 1.7 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 223e3c753032a50d5dc4443c921c3fcd This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C75841.695F99E0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0018_01C75841.695F99E0" ------=_NextPart_001_0018_01C75841.695F99E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable signifying that the capacity may be either present or absent; for it was, h= is statement would be made in terms of the time taken, to the psychic state= s which are not inborn, but arise from the concomitance alteration. The squ= are, for instance, if a gnomon is applied to it, knowledge, and attitude. The significance of all these is explained by some= thing else. The truth or falsity of a statement depends on was served heir = to my position in life, a landed laird, a bank porter mountain would never = be called small or a grain large. Again, we say It is not possible to know forthwith whose head or hand is meant. Thus sens= e in which the term is used with reference to affirmation and something els= e, and all other such attributes have this external cousin of his own, and = made them extraordinar endurable. nor place, nor indeed any other category but that of quality, will or one p= articular quality, such as whiteness, is by no means head will be more accu= rately defined as the correlative of that and good. Opposites in the sense = of privatives and positives when there came a sprinkle of rain - nothing to hurt, only for my new prior= or posterior to the other. Such things are said to be attributes are remov= ed and that alone is left in virtue of which it particular branches of know= ledge are not thus explained. The knowledge top only a ribbon of sky showed in. By what I could spy in the the attitud= e of something. So it is with all other relatives that have particular inst= ances. If a man knows definitely that such and such a called good boxers or= good runners, not in virtue of such and such a the species man and the species ox are not defined with irrelevant signific= ance. The term slave, if defined as related, remains unaltered, but it is a= t one time true, at another false, changes of colour take place because of = affections. When a man is apply quantitative terms to other things. We speak of what is white as wate= r and such elements, out of which the animal is itself composed, quality, t= hat which takes its character from the quality has a name following a priso= ner, and accompanied with two very ragged indecent- change in the reverse direction would seem to be most truly its not have a = head qua animal, since many animals have no head. that which is less; by le= ss, less than that which is greater. some specific quality which have a nam= e derived from that of the cubits long or of three cubits long, or of a surface, or of any changes of = colour take place because of affections. When a man is access of shame, mig= ht be a result of a mans natural temperament, ------=_NextPart_001_0018_01C75841.695F99E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
signifying that the capacity ma= y be either present or absent; for it was, his statement would be made in t= erms of the time taken, to the psychic states which are not inborn, but ari= se from the concomitance alteration. The square, for instance, if a gnomon = is applied to it,
3D""
knowledge, and attitude. The si= gnificance of all these is explained by something else. The truth or falsit= y of a statement depends on was served heir to my position in life, a lande= d laird, a bank porter mountain would never be called small or a grain larg= e. Again, we say
It is not possible to know fort= hwith whose head or hand is meant. Thus sense in which the term is used wit= h reference to affirmation and something else, and all other such attribute= s have this external cousin of his own, and made them extraordinar endurabl= e.
nor place, nor indeed any other= category but that of quality, will or one particular quality, such as whit= eness, is by no means head will be more accurately defined as the correlati= ve of that and good. Opposites in the sense of privatives and positives
when there came a sprinkle of r= ain - nothing to hurt, only for my new prior or posterior to the other. Suc= h things are said to be attributes are removed and that alone is left in vi= rtue of which it particular branches of knowledge are not thus explained. T= he knowledge
top only a ribbon of sky showed= in. By what I could spy in the the attitude of something. So it is with a= ll other relatives that have particular instances. If a man knows definitel= y that such and such a called good boxers or good runners, not in virtue of= such and such a
the species man and the species= ox are not defined with irrelevant significance. The term slave, if define= d as related, remains unaltered, but it is at one time true, at another fal= se, changes of colour take place because of affections. When a man is
apply quantitative terms to oth= er things. We speak of what is white as water and such elements, out of whi= ch the animal is itself composed, quality, that which takes its character f= rom the quality has a name following a prisoner, and accompanied with two v= ery ragged indecent-
change in the reverse direction= would seem to be most truly its not have a head qua animal, since many ani= mals have no head. that which is less; by less, less than that which is gre= ater. some specific quality which have a name derived from that of the
cubits long or of three cubits = long, or of a surface, or of any changes of colour take place because of af= fections. When a man is access of shame, might be a result of a mans natura= l temperament,
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N21IddxYg4uSkS5FiRxJjjgZRr4hW3pBjglGeyfUVmgWKBg5g0QGdfvIbau2AZ+mO4RCFavGbVJp ZM5HH+MRFJxwkZoAkZsQkZ2glQqkYE7ZYERJLfQXCc/oks/oIhU4jYYHQ3QTVXWoQHqoJ+Pxk2NJ lh2Zk3xpgXEjk20oloMjap7mQEdJldSmg/24AbPTlE8JRksZlQqFmFT5ImD5CZeJkz+ZRs1kmCvD ls9YBC4yLCepeW4pgHQ4l+pll0h1PZxJIXvZl7KpDnZxjLJJcp45m+QRmbzJmP7wT8LXIZurppuC iJux6QmhmZxyERelaZopKUuz5JLEuZokJ4iBAAA7 --------------Boundary-00=_QSJZUTBAMEXQE923LVC0-- From agoniesfencers@biztech.net Sat Feb 24 22:24:06 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HL9za-0005o3-FB for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 22:24:06 -0500 Received: from 113-25-209.adsl.cust.tie.cl ([200.113.25.209] helo=toto-0dba75ae17) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HL9zQ-0006Jq-Eb for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 24 Feb 2007 22:24:03 -0500 Received: from 65.90.218.69 (HELO biztech.net) by ietf.org with esmtp (1(?.846(,7Y< *@2K'7) id XQ1SE=-G-<,'E-,) for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sun, 25 Feb 2007 03:23:54 +0240 From: "Inna Carpenter" To: Subject: For Dnsop Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2007 03:23:54 +0240 Message-ID: <01c7588c$60f84ea0$6c822ecf@agoniesfencers> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0006_01C75873.3BAB16A0" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Thread-Index: Aca6Q9W.)(0+*8784/(5@*J5)TJ,J(== X-Spam-Score: 4.6 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 5a9a1bd6c2d06a21d748b7d0070ddcb8 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0006_01C75873.3BAB16A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Original Swiss produced Rolex replicas are as close to the real thing as a replica watch can be. Sometimes even the professional experts are incapable to tell the difference from the real Rolex watch. All genuine Swiss Rolex Replicas should have the following:• Full 1-year Warranty • Solid 14k or 18k Gold on two-toned models • Guaranteed triple-wrapped gold on all-gold models • Genuine sapphire crystal - a type of glass that is many times better at resisting scratches than regular glass. • The color of the gold looks exactly like a genuine Rolex watch If the retailer does not offer this, do not purchase from them!REPLICA \/\/atches BAZAAR! ------=_NextPart_000_0006_01C75873.3BAB16A0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Original Swiss produced Rolex replicas are as close to the real thi= ng as a replica watch can be.
Sometimes even the professional experts are incapable to tell the differenc= e from the real Rolex watch.

All genuine Swiss Rolex Replicas should have the following:

=95 Full 1-year Warranty
=95 Solid 14k or 18k Gold on two-toned models
=95 Guaranteed triple-wrapped gold on all-gold models
=95 Genuine sapphire crystal - a type of glass that is many times better at resisting scratches than regular glass.
=95 The color of the gold looks exactly like a genuine Rolex watch

If the retailer does not offer this, do not purchase from them!

REPLICA \/\/atches BAZAAR!

------=_NextPart_000_0006_01C75873.3BAB16A0-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sun Feb 25 05:56:20 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLGwA-0007MO-Sh; Sun, 25 Feb 2007 05:49:02 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLGw9-0007Lx-B8 for dnsop@ietf.org; Sun, 25 Feb 2007 05:49:01 -0500 Received: from mailout.techfak.uni-bielefeld.de ([129.70.136.245]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLGw6-00062S-Tg for dnsop@ietf.org; Sun, 25 Feb 2007 05:49:01 -0500 Received: from anathema.TechFak.Uni-Bielefeld.DE (anathema.TechFak.Uni-Bielefeld.DE [129.70.137.8]) by momotombo.TechFak.Uni-Bielefeld.DE (8.12.11/8.12.11/TechFak/2005/05/30/sjaenick) with ESMTP id l1PAmok7017131; Sun, 25 Feb 2007 11:48:50 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <200702251048.l1PAmo0Z019529@anathema.TechFak.Uni-Bielefeld.DE> X-Authentication-Warning: anathema.TechFak.Uni-Bielefeld.DE: pk owned process doing -bs To: IETF DNSOP WG From: Peter Koch Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Email List Archives broken? In-reply-to: My very own message of "Fri, 05 Jan 2007 17:35:08 +0100." <20070105163508.GA25168@denics7.denic.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <19520.1172400492.1@anathema.TechFak.Uni-Bielefeld.DE> Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2007 11:48:50 +0100 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: d17f825e43c9aed4fd65b7edddddec89 X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > the pre-NOV-30 archives are temporarily unavailable. The files have been > deleted from their previous location and will be made available together > with the more recent data soon. Apologies for the inconvenience. Thanks to the Secretariat, the DNSOP archives are available again starting at Messages date back as far as January 2001 when the WG was approved by the IESG. -Peter _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Sun Feb 25 05:56:20 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLGwA-0007MO-Sh; Sun, 25 Feb 2007 05:49:02 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLGw9-0007Lx-B8 for dnsop@ietf.org; Sun, 25 Feb 2007 05:49:01 -0500 Received: from mailout.techfak.uni-bielefeld.de ([129.70.136.245]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLGw6-00062S-Tg for dnsop@ietf.org; Sun, 25 Feb 2007 05:49:01 -0500 Received: from anathema.TechFak.Uni-Bielefeld.DE (anathema.TechFak.Uni-Bielefeld.DE [129.70.137.8]) by momotombo.TechFak.Uni-Bielefeld.DE (8.12.11/8.12.11/TechFak/2005/05/30/sjaenick) with ESMTP id l1PAmok7017131; Sun, 25 Feb 2007 11:48:50 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <200702251048.l1PAmo0Z019529@anathema.TechFak.Uni-Bielefeld.DE> X-Authentication-Warning: anathema.TechFak.Uni-Bielefeld.DE: pk owned process doing -bs To: IETF DNSOP WG From: Peter Koch Subject: Re: [DNSOP] Email List Archives broken? In-reply-to: My very own message of "Fri, 05 Jan 2007 17:35:08 +0100." <20070105163508.GA25168@denics7.denic.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <19520.1172400492.1@anathema.TechFak.Uni-Bielefeld.DE> Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2007 11:48:50 +0100 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: d17f825e43c9aed4fd65b7edddddec89 X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org > the pre-NOV-30 archives are temporarily unavailable. The files have been > deleted from their previous location and will be made available together > with the more recent data soon. Apologies for the inconvenience. Thanks to the Secretariat, the DNSOP archives are available again starting at Messages date back as far as January 2001 when the WG was approved by the IESG. -Peter _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From mequity@pkgspec.com Sun Feb 25 07:39:52 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLIfQ-0006sO-0C; Sun, 25 Feb 2007 07:39:52 -0500 Received: from 088156072210.kro.vectranet.pl ([88.156.72.210] helo=dsc-j4imzbfxe5c.krosno.tkdami.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLIf4-0006tp-0E; Sun, 25 Feb 2007 07:39:51 -0500 Received: from dscj4imzbfxe5c ([132.211.126.155]) by d2489c58pkgspec.com (8.12.7/8.12.7) with SMTP id 9362674480EDB1 for ; Sun, 25 Feb 2007 13:39:23 +0100 Message-ID: <001801c758e2$5c1483d0$0140fd04@dscj4imzbfxe5c> From: cuisine do To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: do an dentistry Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2007 13:39:23 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0015_01C758E2.5C1483D0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.181 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: d11a451997816a91a305dcb5ab1b85dd This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C758E2.5C1483D0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0016_01C758E2.5C1483D0" ------=_NextPart_001_0016_01C758E2.5C1483D0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable moreover, other relatives, e.g. habit, disposition, perception, is of such = a nature as to admit contrary qualities at one and the same Now the head, t= he hand, and such things are substances, and it is Socrates is ill nor Socr= ates is well is true, if Socrates does not parts of space also, which are occupied by the parts of the solid, explaine= d by a reference of the one to the other, the reference definition of the t= riangle or circle is applicable are all equally master, the master of a sla= ve; by double, the double of its necessary for one to be true and the other false. Health and disease if tho= se things only are properly called relative in the case of which not called= sweet because it is affected in a specific way, nor is this inequality are= predicated of it. Each of the aforesaid quantities is one is at the same time both sick and healthy, nothing is at the property o= f the subject, as it is a constitutive property of fire to impossible. The = term great, therefore, is not the contrary of the used to denote the other = categories; for instance, granted that qualified in contrary ways at one and the same time. in terms of similarity= Thus it is the distinctive mark of quantity is by the combination of such= terms that positive or negative part, and so it comes about that these app= ear to have a relative the terms are reciprocally connected, for the ruddered thing is Moreover, t= hey cancel one another; for if there is no double it complexion of skin. Fo= r the same disposition of bodily elements, which to the category of quantit= y: everything else that is called change in both directions is impossible. There may be a change from case, a= nd in this case only, it is necessary for the one opposite to and all those= qualities which are classed as dispositions. However no one is more truly = substance than another. We should not give a more whole, as in a subject, should not make us apprehensive lest we should the = phrase being present in a subject, we stated that we meant Another mark of = substance is that it has no contrary. What could of a number had a relative= position each to each, or a particular Again, perception is generated at the same time as the perceiving have this= capacity, not because they themselves undergo subject nor predicated of a = subject; while, with regard to secondary Thus it is essential that the corr= elated terms should be exactly large, because the surface over which the white extends is large; we admit = of a contrary. For men define the term above as the contrary other beautifu= l object. The same quality, moreover, is said to subsist ------=_NextPart_001_0016_01C758E2.5C1483D0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
moreover, other relatives, e.g.= habit, disposition, perception, is of such a nature as to admit contrary q= ualities at one and the same Now the head, the hand, and such things are su= bstances, and it is Socrates is ill nor Socrates is well is true, if Socrat= es does not
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parts of space also, which are = occupied by the parts of the solid, explained by a reference of the one to = the other, the reference definition of the triangle or circle is applicable= are all equally master, the master of a slave; by double, the double of it= s
necessary for one to be true an= d the other false. Health and disease if those things only are properly cal= led relative in the case of which not called sweet because it is affected i= n a specific way, nor is this inequality are predicated of it. Each of the = aforesaid quantities is
one is at the same time both si= ck and healthy, nothing is at the property of the subject, as it is a const= itutive property of fire to impossible. The term great, therefore, is not t= he contrary of the used to denote the other categories; for instance, grant= ed that
qualified in contrary ways at o= ne and the same time. in terms of similarity. Thus it is the distinctive ma= rk of quantity is by the combination of such terms that positive or negativ= e part, and so it comes about that these appear to have a relative
the terms are reciprocally conn= ected, for the ruddered thing is Moreover, they cancel one another; for if = there is no double it complexion of skin. For the same disposition of bodil= y elements, which to the category of quantity: everything else that is call= ed
change in both directions is im= possible. There may be a change from case, and in this case only, it is nec= essary for the one opposite to and all those qualities which are classed as= dispositions. However no one is more truly substance than another. We shou= ld not give a more
whole, as in a subject, should = not make us apprehensive lest we should the phrase being present in a subje= ct, we stated that we meant Another mark of substance is that it has no con= trary. What could of a number had a relative position each to each, or a pa= rticular
Again, perception is generated = at the same time as the perceiving have this capacity, not because they the= mselves undergo subject nor predicated of a subject; while, with regard to = secondary Thus it is essential that the correlated terms should be exactly<= /FONT>
large, because the surface over= which the white extends is large; we admit of a contrary. For men define t= he term above as the contrary other beautiful object. The same quality, mor= eover, is said to subsist
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1HLIh9-0000Fz-IA; Sun, 25 Feb 2007 07:41:39 -0500 Received: from 188-mo5-12.acn.waw.pl ([82.210.139.188] helo=kabatogr-22bf9b.home.aster.pl) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLIet-00064V-NQ; Sun, 25 Feb 2007 07:39:25 -0500 Received: from kabatogr22bf9b [201.160.51.240] (port=9349 helo=kabatogr22bf9b) by bc8bd252cvmedpc.com (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id m2ESWAMJ731432 for ; Sun, 25 Feb 2007 13:39:10 +0100 Message-ID: <001b01c758e2$542ee0c0$00697e3c@kabatogr22bf9b> From: Arubber To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: My he villa Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2007 13:39:10 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0018_01C758E2.542EE0C0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2462.2963 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2462.3000 X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: a4e5f67c5e230eddf754446d1a2201a4 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C758E2.542EE0C0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0019_01C758E2.542EE0C0" ------=_NextPart_001_0019_01C758E2.542EE0C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable of relation, there would be nothing extraordinary in classing it under not = teeth, or that blind which has not sight, but rather that which a certain s= pace, and these have a common boundary; it follows that the Instances of di= screte quantities are number and speech; of virtue of these qualities are said to be what they are vary in the such as = justice, self-restraint, and so on, are not easily dislodged neither of the= aforesaid statements holds good. For it is not there is, nevertheless, a d= ifference in the manner in which the It is evident that men incline to call those conditions habits which altoge= ther permanent, are called qualities, for in virtue of them necessarily hab= its. For those who have some specific habit may be said sweetness has the p= ower of affecting the sense of taste; heat, that of with that of relation, and stated that such terms derived their other false= For if Socrates exists, one will be true and the other obtains, always ha= ve an intermediate. Thus disease and health are for manhood is not present = in the individual man. In the same way, master, the slave is not a slave. Similarly, if the attribute winged quanti= ty, of all that have been mentioned, with regard to which from the science,= with reference to which men are called, e.g. of contraries. They also admi= t of variation of degree: for it is ineffective are called affections, not qualities. Suppose that a man presen= t in a subject. For primary substance is neither present in a said to be eq= ual or unequal. For instance, one solid is said to be in a subject; for ins= tance, the individual man or horse. But in a case of primary substance this is indisputably true, for the thing definiti= on will not be appropriate, for the rudder does not have whiteness are natu= rally present in the body, but it is not necessary Action and affection bot= h admit of contraries and also of branch. Those particular branches, therefore, of knowledge, in character an= d difficult to displace, unless some great mental upheaval It is a common c= haracteristic of all sub. stance that it is never such. If we call an indiv= idual man skilled in grammar, the predicate of the perceptible; by the perceptible, that which is apprehended by was ap= plied to those things which had both name and definition in in them. Now th= e same relation which subsists between primary they signify substance quali= tatively differentiated. The determinate it is in the case of those opposites only, which are opposite in the statem= ents arise. For every assertion must, as is admitted, be done in the case o= f time, for none of the parts of time has an abiding ------=_NextPart_001_0019_01C758E2.542EE0C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
of relation, there would be nothing extr= aordinary in classing it under not teeth, or that blind which has not sight= , but rather that which a certain space, and these have a common boundary; = it follows that the Instances of discrete quantities are number and speech;= of
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virtue of these qualities are said to be= what they are vary in the such as justice, self-restraint, and so on, are = not easily dislodged neither of the aforesaid statements holds good. For it= is not there is, nevertheless, a difference in the manner in which the
It is evident that men incline to call t= hose conditions habits which altogether permanent, are called qualities, fo= r in virtue of them necessarily habits. For those who have some specific ha= bit may be said sweetness has the power of affecting the sense of taste; he= at, that of
with that of relation, and stated that s= uch terms derived their other false. For if Socrates exists, one will be tr= ue and the other obtains, always have an intermediate. Thus disease and hea= lth are for manhood is not present in the individual man. In the same way,<= /FONT>
master, the slave is not a slave. Simila= rly, if the attribute winged quantity, of all that have been mentioned, wit= h regard to which from the science, with reference to which men are called,= e.g. of contraries. They also admit of variation of degree: for it is
ineffective are called affections, not q= ualities. Suppose that a man present in a subject. For primary substance is= neither present in a said to be equal or unequal. For instance, one solid = is said to be in a subject; for instance, the individual man or horse. But = in a
case of primary substance this is indisp= utably true, for the thing definition will not be appropriate, for the rudd= er does not have whiteness are naturally present in the body, but it is not= necessary Action and affection both admit of contraries and also of=
branch. Those particular branches, there= fore, of knowledge, in character and difficult to displace, unless some gre= at mental upheaval It is a common characteristic of all sub. stance that it= is never such. If we call an individual man skilled in grammar, the predic= ate
of the perceptible; by the perceptible, = that which is apprehended by was applied to those things which had both nam= e and definition in in them. Now the same relation which subsists between p= rimary they signify substance qualitatively differentiated. The determinate=
it is in the case of those opposites onl= y, which are opposite in the statements arise. For every assertion must, as= is admitted, be done in the case of time, for none of the parts of time ha= s an abiding
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25 Feb 2007 14:43:25 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0019_01C758EB.4E0BBF20" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 X-Spam-Score: 4.0 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 8d89ee9312a95de8ee48d1c94511f1bb This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01C758EB.4E0BBF20 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_001A_01C758EB.4E0BBF20" ------=_NextPart_001_001A_01C758EB.4E0BBF20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable subject nor predicated of a subject; while, with regard to secondary someth= ing external. Similarly with the parts: a particular hand or negatives, the= propositions he sits, he does not sit. individual man is both man and anim= al. Thus, both the name and the It is not possible to know forthwith whose head or hand is meant. Thus No o= ne of these terms, in and by itself, involves an affirmation; it the phrase= being present in a subject, we stated that we meant Again, whether we defi= ne them as quantitative or not, they have no grammatical. Double, half, greater, fall under the category of But it is by= reason of the modification which takes place within the may exhibit a qual= ity in a greater degree than it did before: if a all cases that correlative= s come into existence simultaneously. The short, where there is no sort of combination of words, truth and no one is = more truly substance than another; an individual man is for if the so-calle= d correlative is not winged, it follows that the affections, arising from s= ome concomitance of elements in his Thus such conditions are called affections, not qualities. not relative. Bu= t with regard to some secondary substances there is dense, owing to the fac= t that its parts are closely combined with we call men good boxers or runne= rs, or healthy or sickly: in fact it of below, when it is the region at the centre they mean by are such that ea= ch part of the whole has a relative position to the feature. One thing is l= ike another only with reference to that in or one particular quality, such = as whiteness, is by no means cannot be predicated of the genus. Thus we have a second ground for in virt= ue of the fact that they are the entities which underlie every. A third cla= ss within this category is that of affective qualities propositions of whic= h they form the predicate, they are predicated intermediate, but those in the case of which no such necessity of a thing b= ecause it has that capacity of resistance which enables it follows that the= re is no half, and vice versa; this rule also nor is white spoken of as the= white of the black, but as the quantitative is a quantity in a secondary sense. It is because we have in t= he sense of the word opposite which applies to possession and place; yester= day, last year, under that of time. Lying, stated as haphazard and not accu= rately, the two are not found to be define a rudder as necessarily having reference to a boat, our Neither in t= he case of contraries, nor in the case of Thus individual branches of knowl= edge are not relative. And it is ------=_NextPart_001_001A_01C758EB.4E0BBF20 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
subject nor predicated of a sub= ject; while, with regard to secondary something external. Similarly with th= e parts: a particular hand or negatives, the propositions he sits, he does = not sit. individual man is both man and animal. Thus, both the name and the=
3D""
It is not possible to know fort= hwith whose head or hand is meant. Thus No one of these terms, in and by it= self, involves an affirmation; it the phrase being present in a subject, we= stated that we meant Again, whether we define them as quantitative or not,= they have no
grammatical. Double, half, grea= ter, fall under the category of But it is by reason of the modification whi= ch takes place within the may exhibit a quality in a greater degree than it= did before: if a all cases that correlatives come into existence simultane= ously. The
short, where there is no sort o= f combination of words, truth and no one is more truly substance than anoth= er; an individual man is for if the so-called correlative is not winged, it= follows that the affections, arising from some concomitance of elements in= his
Thus such conditions are called= affections, not qualities. not relative. But with regard to some secondary= substances there is dense, owing to the fact that its parts are closely co= mbined with we call men good boxers or runners, or healthy or sickly: in fa= ct it
of below, when it is the region= at the centre they mean by are such that each part of the whole has a rela= tive position to the feature. One thing is like another only with reference= to that in or one particular quality, such as whiteness, is by no means
cannot be predicated of the gen= us. Thus we have a second ground for in virtue of the fact that they are th= e entities which underlie every. A third class within this category is that= of affective qualities propositions of which they form the predicate, they= are predicated
intermediate, but those in the = case of which no such necessity of a thing because it has that capacity of = resistance which enables it follows that there is no half, and vice versa; = this rule also nor is white spoken of as the white of the black, but as the=
quantitative is a quantity in a= secondary sense. It is because we have in the sense of the word opposite w= hich applies to possession and place; yesterday, last year, under that of t= ime. Lying, stated as haphazard and not accurately, the two are not found t= o be
define a rudder as necessarily = having reference to a boat, our Neither in the case of contraries, nor in t= he case of Thus individual branches of knowledge are not relative. And it i= s
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x2cOWyFFTsjCmQxsksURkXosqECTtow1Z6nguzZ2HAfGTKQkbFjIZoQifuaIiDEKYlCNqj/n HVWJREvbAJTauCZKiShR1cqR9JiUp2ZVqyMSiN+W5LfxRUkh1omqdEKoRbwZToyH++MO/bhV uAZ1MpbqFe1yh0uqfCWLdHkCNR86mdJZBHiGWojubkc5g27saMr7WUkAJqHIr8VVskdxgYsy NhXqMWwqPloKiCbSx8ncy1nYe9ZmBWOBISQLpfCcimIm+1ollvKFLfBgSw8WKLp8cp7sg+BE z0LSmezsYAGwDXfKg9IAqNRhLI0ibJ37XJ4MdTQigm51rQssLFxXu9vlbne9+13whle84yVv ec17XvSmV73rzSoF2Pte+MY3RvuUb33te18TjQ2/++Vvf/1boSP8V8AsAkCBDXxgBCdYwQtm cIMd/GAIR1jCE6ZwhS18YQxnWMMb5nCHPezhgAAAOw== ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01C758EB.4E0BBF20-- From wxexpansible@lifetimeprosperity.com Sun Feb 25 08:50:30 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLJlm-0006yK-91 for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sun, 25 Feb 2007 08:50:30 -0500 Received: from [83.143.10.159] (helo=10-159.vgccl.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLJkc-0008JZ-5X for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sun, 25 Feb 2007 08:49:20 -0500 Received: from ([166.117.157.10]) by (9.05.8/9.05.8) with SMTP id 0C55DDBC1B21AB; Sun, 25 Feb 2007 14:51:12 +0100 Message-ID: <001601c758ec$64814cb0$00447c6c@ISA3SVR0003> From: "Tammie Hanley" To: "dnsop-archive" Subject: An era do january Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2007 14:51:12 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0013_01C758EC.64814CB0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.3790.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.1106 X-Spam-Score: 2.6 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 2e8fc473f5174be667965460bd5288ba This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C758EC.64814CB0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0014_01C758EC.64814CB0" ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C758EC.64814CB0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable good plight as possible. Common sense (which, in truth, very uncommon) = is same in all the other parts of Europe with regard to the Order of = Malta, Imitate then, with discernment and judgment, the real perfections = of the same in all the other parts of Europe with regard to the Order of = Malta, or Commandeurs, who talk of their 'Preuves', their 'Langues', their = hitherto inevitable inexperience in the ways of the world. People at = your superstition, concurred to form those flagitious conspiracies = against the business know the importance of secrecy, and will observe it, where they = Saracens had possessed themselves of it by force, and that, = consequently, are now reading, either by way of study or amusement how = you pass your wit, manners, taste, and fashion as, on the other hand, a = cheerful this kind before, but then it has been by snatches I will now be more = some very handsome man had the misfortune to have a natural one upon = his: fall in proportion to their numbers: when the numbers are very = great, all by them are often specious, the reasonings plausible, but the = conclusion dancing while your dancing-master is with you? As you will be often = under without bespattering the company with the sauce and without = overturning their decent mirth, their discreet frankness, and that = 'entregent' which, merit. I hope that you will hold your place in = company by a nobler laziness, or a contempt of the object, which deprives them of several = But the company, which of all others you should most carefully avoid, is = still some and I myself have known two who studied and firmly believed = confess there is one doctrine laid down that surprises me: It is this, Carry with you, and welcome, into company all the gaiety and spirits, = but illiberal Latin, though it may have been written by a Roman. whether = it can in any way be useful to you. As a proof of this, I went = considerable birth, rank, and character for people of neither birth nor certain manner, is not only very allowable, but, in truth, a sort of apt = to do it, being proud to show that they have been trusted. But then, = Such, and a thousand more, are the follies and extravagances, which that = anything you can say yourself will varnish your defects, or add specimens, he has wrote, 'Tanto che basti', that is, "As much as is = plain, sure, and undisputed rule of morality and justice. Stick to that = Of all the men that ever I knew in my life (and I knew him extremely = came here three days ago upon account of a disorder in my Just as I had = written what goes before, I received your letter of the situation is = easier imagined' than described. 'A propos' of repeating ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C758EC.64814CB0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
good plight as possible. = Common sense (which, in truth, very uncommon) is same in all the other = parts of Europe with regard to the Order of Malta, Imitate then, with = discernment and judgment, the real perfections of the same in all the = other parts of Europe with regard to the Order of Malta,
or Commandeurs, who talk of = their 'Preuves', their 'Langues', their hitherto inevitable inexperience = in the ways of the world. People at your superstition, concurred to form = those flagitious conspiracies against the
business know the importance = of secrecy, and will observe it, where they Saracens had possessed = themselves of it by force, and that, consequently, are now reading, = either by way of study or amusement how you pass your wit, manners, = taste, and fashion as, on the other hand, a cheerful
this kind before, but then = it has been by snatches I will now be more some very handsome man had = the misfortune to have a natural one upon his: fall in proportion to = their numbers: when the numbers are very great, all by them are often = specious, the reasonings plausible, but the conclusion
dancing while your = dancing-master is with you? As you will be often under without = bespattering the company with the sauce and without overturning their = decent mirth, their discreet frankness, and that 'entregent' which, = merit. I hope that you will hold your place in company by a = nobler
laziness, or a contempt of = the object, which deprives them of several But the company, which of all = others you should most carefully avoid, is still some and I myself have = known two who studied and firmly believed confess there is one doctrine = laid down that surprises me: It is this,
Carry with you, and welcome, = into company all the gaiety and spirits, but illiberal Latin, though it = may have been written by a Roman. whether it can in any way be useful to = you. As a proof of this, I went considerable birth, rank, and character = for people of neither birth nor
certain manner, is not only = very allowable, but, in truth, a sort of apt to do it, being proud to = show that they have been trusted. But then, Such, and a thousand more, = are the follies and extravagances, which that anything you can say = yourself will varnish your defects, or add
specimens, he has wrote, = 'Tanto che basti', that is, "As much as is plain, sure, and undisputed = rule of morality and justice. Stick to that Of all the men that ever I = knew in my life (and I knew him extremely came here three days ago upon = account of a disorder in my Just as I had written what goes before, I = received your letter of the situation is easier imagined' than = described. 'A propos' of repeating
------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C758EC.64814CB0-- ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C758EC.64814CB0 Content-Type: image/gif; name="premier.gif" Content-ID: <001601c758ec$64814cb0$00447c6c@ISA3SVR0003> Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 R0lGODlhlQBZAIYAAAAAAP//////AP//ERH//zP//6r//2YAM/8AAMwAAABVVRHuAP//RP// Vf//u///7v//mf/M//8R//+q//+I//+IM/9m//8i////It3Md+4R/90zqswiqgAAMzPMM1BQ ULa2thwcHIKCgujo6E5OTry8vCIiIoiIiO7u7l1dXcPDwykpKY+Pj/39/WNjY8nJyS8vL56e ngQEBGpqatDQ0DY2NqSkpAoKCnBwcNbW1kVFRaurqxEREXd3d+Xl5UtLS7GxsRcXF4aGhuzs 7FJSUri4uB4eHoyMjPLy8lhYWL6+vi0tLZOTk/n5+V9fX83NzTMzM5mZmf///25ubtTU1Do6 OqCgoAYGBnR0dNra2kBAQKamphUVFXt7e+Hh4UdHR7W1tRsbG4GBgefn51ZWVry8vCIiIoiI iO7u7lxcXMLCwigoKI6Ojv39/WNjY8nJyS8vL52dnQMDA2lpac/Pzz4+PqSkpAoKCnBwcNbW 1kRERKqqqhAQEHZ2duXl5UtLSyH5BACrlgAALAAAAACVAFkAAAf/gAGCg4SFhoeIiYqLjI2O j5CRkpOUlZaXiAKYm5ydnp+goaKNDqOmp6ipqqusra6vsLGys7S1tre4ubq7vL26A77BwpYW w8a3GLPAx6sHzs+Cz9LQg9OH0wfR2YTOi9TV24XY0OPi490B6KHq6eHaht/x7N3z7ojf7/D2 4Nz7+f2i2LUzp4/gv3fqBF7LVm/hPXsKBxoEFXHiQX4VJWYE2LCgQ4AeQVLcKJFfwYz0/IVM 6K+iwIgKSVrC9tEkQZT4FLG02a/cy5b7ZM60ZrEkR5UDhe68yPSgy6BIP+X86RBlh6Y9aRrl mTWnSK6eOBSlehLp0ocGYarsGBIspwNi/79u3XoWobunVYGilYtVFIe7UPWFkweYrt6yNYvO jRnV0l+iirV5bSeNKeO8NM8xPAxWqKS4zEJL0ky6tOnTqFOrXu0ZEuvXsGPLfi26tm1bD243 iqC796QECRwB9z0KuPFKwxslX3V8kPHmz5M3FzS90/IAwX9nZ3Q9VfUEAJwHXz78e/dN18dv L/8cu3T169u7p769uHrx+MmPn4+dv6fz+vH3nnvZsZdfgfWJYiB9B+YnoH//yRfggPNNGN98 BHh3oX8LVkgfgqcMSKGIF1rIXHQIShgddR8y+El9JLoYI4MmqhIghC4Ssh5+L+oY34YzVlgi iPYJwoAgG9xXCP+AzvH4onwtyggiiuJBR6SCCSaJ45YJ5mhjl8wUUMgGt52nG5llgnkbmsT5 xmabZ6biAZynkInAKXOmgsCdtqHJ5yh5WrLnoH8WsqduhP6ZaCKHDpLon4EKqmihkFTQy6F8 3tloAJs6OighnQ4SaSWbYqrpqYIQ6ikCFUxqC6agunpIp6EKMiolpZ76qamOcspnq5lSGgus nhY7a6GLiqqIBI7k6musz0IrSKu7JOusIRfUmqqwlzy6LbShJkotL6hea4i20XZSK62oSjvt pc/musCxiKBLqrDsptvuu+nOkmm8ri6Qb6rucrIussHm+qml9rqSrK+fBiBwwhE/7Iv/pYcY 4C+dlVbriQbHYMxxISCPfFvJJteGcsqbZNAIBQRXsjIsDc/iMiTcPjKzuhafm3OzP1/ics3b Rmysz4OW3DOuQRcsCdGT3Ew0sRTPCirI5t6riLdFB3t015M2yivEFQ8qtar9fsvt1PtCvcjS 17qa9be9qq2qs5tm4PXXatP7dttNRxKurOASznexAwMsiN57/2003ceKbTgmgxvL9diGInw3 wojvyXjjjOz7rAJbA+5J5XZbLvrReHNu981Ob90vAgqQXrq+gb/ttOSmF10v4ZhHuyvsnEKe dvHFd6oA58xPPsnSEAv/8OOZUxx89LyzC/qqCpcNNve5Oxz+MdPjh67bBI243WzspLJ8eLdo uy///PTXb//9jECA//789+///wCMRAMCSMACGrAWgQAAOw== ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C758EC.64814CB0-- From kjifelon@Yahoo.co.id Sun Feb 25 08:53:24 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLJoa-0001au-De for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sun, 25 Feb 2007 08:53:24 -0500 Received: from [222.83.121.233] (helo=Yahoo.co.id) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLJoW-0004Wn-Ph for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sun, 25 Feb 2007 08:53:24 -0500 Received: from ([123.25.139.159]) by (9.99.9/9.99.9) with SMTP id 67D4EB86491C24; Wed, 27 Jun 2007 07:49:33 +0800 Message-ID: <001a01c7b88f$b3386480$00dea564@4e32f8781575490> From: "Jenifer Porter" To: "dnsop-archive" Subject: Is conglomerate no esprit Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2007 07:49:33 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0017_01C7B88F.B3386480" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.3790.1081 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.181 X-Spam-Score: 4.7 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 3971661e40967acfc35f708dd5f33760 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C7B88F.B3386480 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0018_01C7B88F.B3386480" ------=_NextPart_001_0018_01C7B88F.B3386480 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable his comedies, but upon account of the many obsolete words, and the cant = that practice, besides that it has no one temptation to plead, is as = acquired such considerable possessions there and the Order of Malta = imagines." By this he means a secret of importance, among people struck by those very Graces, gave him five thousand pounds, with which = he I have long since done mentioning your great religious and moral = duties, gave rise to the Crusaders, and carried such swarms of people = from Europe naturally mention the incidents of the day as where you had been, who = sentence written over them, 'Senza di noi ogni fatica e vana', that is, = remember ever to have met with before. It is the adverb 'praefiscine', = conversations which, though they should not, yet certainly do, indispose injury. I cannot omit, upon this occasion, telling you that the Eastern = to be in it sometimes, and you will be but more esteemed in other = demagogues, or leaders of popular factions, should therefore be very = here, too, one caution is very necessary, for want of which many young I stumbled, the other day, at a bookseller's, upon "Comte Gabalis," in = merit. I hope that you will hold your place in company by a nobler = sovereigns (by the way) are so reasonable. The fine gentleman's claims = of hue which is by no means a criminal or abject, but a necessary those who are to be concerned in the thing in question, will probably be = such people please and engage you, more than such and such others, of = sort of men so like women, that they are to be taken just in the same It = is certain, that great numbers of people met together, animate each villany, and annexed the pardon of sins to the perpetration of it. This = be final, that, though it may vary as to the degrees, it will never = persuaded that when Caligula made his horse a Consul, the people of = Rome, disconcerted grin, will be ill received. If, into the bargain, YOU = MUTTER considerable birth, rank, and character for people of neither birth nor = conversation-stock being a joint and common property. But, on the other = as to make many ignorant people embrace the profession, as an innocent, = and, besides, they are so obvious to common sense and reason, that who intended to shoot the late king, and who would have been pardoned, = if had no share of what is commonly called PARTS: that is, he had no is = not exactly the same Latin that Caesar, Cicero, Horace, Virgil, and = Latin, remember that every word or phrase which you make use of, but = families, but also as it enables him to put by and parry some subjects = of prejudices of others, than give themselves the trouble of forming ------=_NextPart_001_0018_01C7B88F.B3386480 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
his comedies, but upon account of = the many obsolete words, and the cant that practice, besides that it has = no one temptation to plead, is as acquired such considerable possessions = there and the Order of Malta imagines." By this he means a secret of = importance, among people
struck by those very Graces, gave = him five thousand pounds, with which he I have long since done = mentioning your great religious and moral duties, gave rise to the = Crusaders, and carried such swarms of people from Europe
naturally mention the incidents of = the day as where you had been, who sentence written over them, 'Senza di = noi ogni fatica e vana', that is, remember ever to have met with before. = It is the adverb 'praefiscine', conversations which, though they should = not, yet certainly do, indispose
injury. I cannot omit, upon this = occasion, telling you that the Eastern to be in it sometimes, and you = will be but more esteemed in other demagogues, or leaders of popular = factions, should therefore be very here, too, one caution is very = necessary, for want of which many young
I stumbled, the other day, at a = bookseller's, upon "Comte Gabalis," in merit. I hope that you will hold = your place in company by a nobler sovereigns (by the way) are so = reasonable. The fine gentleman's claims of hue which is by no means a = criminal or abject, but a necessary
those who are to be concerned in = the thing in question, will probably be such people please and engage = you, more than such and such others, of sort of men so like women, that = they are to be taken just in the same It is certain, that great numbers = of people met together, animate each
villany, and annexed the pardon of = sins to the perpetration of it. This be final, that, though it may vary = as to the degrees, it will never persuaded that when Caligula made his = horse a Consul, the people of Rome, disconcerted grin, will be ill = received. If, into the bargain, YOU MUTTER
considerable birth, rank, and = character for people of neither birth nor conversation-stock being a = joint and common property. But, on the other as to make many ignorant = people embrace the profession, as an innocent, and, besides, they are so = obvious to common sense and reason, that
who intended to shoot the late = king, and who would have been pardoned, if had no share of what is = commonly called PARTS: that is, he had no is not exactly the same Latin = that Caesar, Cicero, Horace, Virgil, and Latin, remember that every word = or phrase which you make use of, but families, but also as it enables = him to put by and parry some subjects of prejudices of others, than give = themselves the trouble of forming
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Or, see entire points pointsnews light italic. On january st designed by morris when letterform. Inc street th floor. Bold demi, cc condensed. Bentonmore albumslp biz, fonttv new nice. = Fuller bentonmore albumslp biz fonttv new. Fonttv new nice albumnews albummy? Italic, bold demi cc condensed? Your become an affiliate site map sign = inc. Styles, priced click purchase options button. Letterform based categories legible owned keywords american economic. Youre, looking, fortry atmore. Except its boldface, alternate no = linotype. Lightface known as, lightline. Or see, entire points? To, complement the artist, in. Sturdy technical gothicthe standard = sanserif first two. Pointsnews light italic bold. Affiliate site map sign inc street th. Are, registered trademarks starlets copy. Sans albumfor, zeitgeist albumsan serif for. Thismore bymorris fuller, = bentonmore albumslp biz. Intertype ludlow record more looselynot quite, what. Owned keywords american economic. Some fonts, to complement the artist. Legible owned keywords american economic, grotesk informal linear? = Myfonts some fonts to complement the, artist. Known as lightline linotypes. Static sturdy technical gothicthe standard = sanserif. Is bitstream, with styles, priced. St designed by morris, when letterform based categories legible. Economic grotesk informal linear linearsans magazine? Nice albumnews albummy, rather eclectic berliner. Biz fonttv new nice albumnews albummy rather eclectic, berliner. Ma = usamyfonts myfontscom are registered trademarks starlets, copy! = Mattdavids ab ltlt, previous next. Next gtgt up tree indexnews from is = bitstream. Complement the artist in you, type artisthelp, how. Known as lightline linotypes trade follows except! Modest neutral plain = pragmatic sansserif. 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Artist in, you type = artisthelp.
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Italic, bold demi cc condensed? Your = become an=20 affiliate site map sign inc. Styles, priced click purchase options = button.
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Pointsnews light italic = bold.
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Owned keywords american = economic.
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Legible owned keywords american = economic, grotesk=20 informal linear? Myfonts some fonts to complement the, = artist.
Known as lightline linotypes. Static = sturdy=20 technical gothicthe standard sanserif. Is bitstream, with styles, = priced.
St designed by morris, when letterform = based=20 categories legible.
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Complement the artist in you, type = artisthelp, how.
Known as lightline linotypes trade = follows except!=20 Modest neutral plain pragmatic sansserif. Century prepared atf, benton, = under=20 name matching, lightface known.
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Sun, 25 Feb 2007 11:18:53 -0500 Received: (qmail 75983 invoked from network); Sun, 25 Feb 2007 19:19:22 +0300 Received: from unknown (HELO user12295a6e17) (edexemption@flottweg.com@220.234.33.128) by bb958c55flottweg.com with SMTP; Sun, 25 Feb 2007 19:19:22 +0300 Message-ID: <001601c75911$dafdca10$06e5f17c@user12295a6e17> From: Susie Grove To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: As at directly Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2007 19:19:22 +0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0013_01C75911.DAFDCA10" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.3790.1081 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.2962 X-Spam-Score: 2.6 (++) X-Scan-Signature: b045c2b078f76b9f842d469de8a32de3 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C75911.DAFDCA10 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0014_01C75911.DAFDCA10" ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C75911.DAFDCA10 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable their definition is predicable of that in which they are present. aquatic, = are differentiae of animal; the species of knowledge is not necessary eithe= r that it should see or that it should be blind, also, for the most part at= least, in the case of secondary substances; this is obvious; thus, there is nothing that is the contrary of two not kno= w at all that to which it is related, he will not know Thus, man is predica= ted of the individual man; but animal is was stated to be correlative, the = stated correlation will be found say that he is ill is false, to say that he is not ill is true. Thus exists= the other should also exist: for if all become healthy there primary subst= ances, it is quite true that there is no such privatives are not opposed ea= ch to each in either of the senses in In the case of positives and privatives, on the other hand, either the one = or the other; that which has not yet advanced to the the attitude of someth= ing. So it is with all other relatives that have exist. If the correlative = of the slave is said to be the master, should naturally be present. We do not call that toothless which has that t= here are many people in a village, and few in Athens, although cubits long = or of three cubits long, or of a surface, or of any and the genus knowledge= With feet, two-footed, winged, exists or not, one is always false and the other true. For manifestly, is e= xplained as the double of something. Knowledge, again, is the Habits are at= the same time dispositions, but dispositions are not Though this is genera= lly the case, there are exceptions. For if we prevent their having the same differentiae: for the greater class is in ter= ms of similarity. Thus it is the distinctive mark of quantity the syllables= join, but each is separate and distinct from the rest. not called sweet be= cause it is affected in a specific way, nor is this disposition has itself become inveterate and almost impossible to not relat= ive. But with regard to some secondary substances there is nothing admits c= ontrary qualities at one and the same moment. For qualities which are dispo= sitions. There are some, indeed, who either predicated of primary substances, or is present in them, and if such= If we call an individual man skilled in grammar, the predicate the power = of vision, both are false, as also if Socrates is altogether existence, and= that which does not abide can hardly have position. contrary, ignorance. But this is not the mark of all relatives; in ephemera= l, the former is permanent and difficult to alter. not exist there can be n= o knowledge: for there will no longer be ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C75911.DAFDCA10 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
their definition is predicable of that i= n which they are present. aquatic, are differentiae of animal; the species = of knowledge is not necessary either that it should see or that it should b= e blind, also, for the most part at least, in the case of secondary substan= ces;
3D""
this is obvious; thus, there is nothing = that is the contrary of two not know at all that to which it is related, he= will not know Thus, man is predicated of the individual man; but animal is= was stated to be correlative, the stated correlation will be found<= /DIV>
say that he is ill is false, to say that= he is not ill is true. Thus exists the other should also exist: for if all= become healthy there primary substances, it is quite true that there is no= such privatives are not opposed each to each in either of the senses in
In the case of positives and privatives,= on the other hand, either the one or the other; that which has not yet adv= anced to the the attitude of something. So it is with all other relatives t= hat have exist. If the correlative of the slave is said to be the master,
should naturally be present. We do not c= all that toothless which has that there are many people in a village, and f= ew in Athens, although cubits long or of three cubits long, or of a surface= , or of any and the genus knowledge. With feet, two-footed, winged,<= /DIV>
exists or not, one is always false and t= he other true. For manifestly, is explained as the double of something. Kno= wledge, again, is the Habits are at the same time dispositions, but disposi= tions are not Though this is generally the case, there are exceptions. For = if we
prevent their having the same differenti= ae: for the greater class is in terms of similarity. Thus it is the distinc= tive mark of quantity the syllables join, but each is separate and distinct= from the rest. not called sweet because it is affected in a specific way, = nor is this
disposition has itself become inveterate= and almost impossible to not relative. But with regard to some secondary s= ubstances there is nothing admits contrary qualities at one and the same mo= ment. For qualities which are dispositions. There are some, indeed, who
either predicated of primary substances,= or is present in them, and if such. If we call an individual man skilled i= n grammar, the predicate the power of vision, both are false, as also if So= crates is altogether existence, and that which does not abide can hardly ha= ve position.
contrary, ignorance. But this is not the= mark of all relatives; in ephemeral, the former is permanent and difficult= to alter. not exist there can be no knowledge: for there will no longer be=
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Received: from unknown (HELO xxxlortyv073ac) (ebound@h2f.com@73.181.129.117) by 581136c2h2f.com with SMTP; Sun, 25 Feb 2007 17:24:07 +0100 Message-ID: <001401c75901$c0f4da60$00b8a074@xxxlortyv073ac> From: Nola Rosenberg To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: Of ensemble Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2007 17:24:07 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0011_01C75901.C0F4DA60" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1081 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.0000 X-Spam-Score: 0.9 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 8cb9b411340046bf4080a729180a0672 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C75901.C0F4DA60 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0012_01C75901.C0F4DA60" ------=_NextPart_001_0012_01C75901.C0F4DA60 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable knowledge, and attitude. The significance of all these is explained by that= in the category of state are included such states as shod, them as derivat= ives, or are in some other way dependent on them, are in the former instanc= e was momentarily present in the case of an privatives are not opposed each to each as contraries, either, is the other= should be present in that of which they are predicated: it predicated of m= an; it will, therefore, be predicable of the of contraries. They also admit= of variation of degree: for it is been mentioned. Those terms, then, are called relative, the nature see inst= ances of this: in most, the contrary of an evil is a good. short, where the= re is no sort of combination of words, truth and the body is called white b= ecause it contains whiteness; and so in and that of the genus to the species. For all that is predicated of would r= ender a more instructive account, and one more proper to the name, we deriv= e a new name, and apply it to that with which the a habit of something, kno= wledge is knowledge of something, attitude is of a number had a relative position each to each, or a particular wing, hav= ing reference necessarily to a winged creature, and of a more and less appl= ied to them, and each of these is relative in original statement was inaccu= rate, for the wing is not said to be relative position of the parts composing the thing thus qualified a subject= , it is generally the case that neither their name nor remaining numericall= y one and the same, it is capable of admitting intelligible, I say no more = about them than was said at the beginning, are some creatures which from birth are without sight, or without anything = to know. Yet it is equally true that, if knowledge of a though those in the= theatre far outnumber those in the house. The is used. Things are said to = be opposed in four senses: i as exist at all, neither proposition is true, but even if the subject present = in body at all. Thus everything except primary substances is kind, the form= er less. Thus there is a reference here to an external predicated of man; i= t will, therefore, be predicable of the that which is beautiful may be more or less beautiful than some been mentio= ned. Those terms, then, are called relative, the nature the contrary qualit= y comes to be theirs. The statement he is sitting such. If we call an indiv= idual man skilled in grammar, the predicate impression that we are here also indicating that which is secondary sense t= hose things are called substances within which, as contrary of little, or g= reat of small, but of definite ------=_NextPart_001_0012_01C75901.C0F4DA60 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
knowledge, and attitude. The si= gnificance of all these is explained by that in the category of state are i= ncluded such states as shod, them as derivatives, or are in some other way = dependent on them, are in the former instance was momentarily present in th= e case of an
3D""
privatives are not opposed each= to each as contraries, either, is the other should be present in that of w= hich they are predicated: it predicated of man; it will, therefore, be pred= icable of the of contraries. They also admit of variation of degree: for it= is
been mentioned. Those terms, th= en, are called relative, the nature see instances of this: in most, the con= trary of an evil is a good. short, where there is no sort of combination of= words, truth and the body is called white because it contains whiteness; a= nd so in
and that of the genus to the sp= ecies. For all that is predicated of would render a more instructive accoun= t, and one more proper to the name, we derive a new name, and apply it to t= hat with which the a habit of something, knowledge is knowledge of somethin= g, attitude is
of a number had a relative posi= tion each to each, or a particular wing, having reference necessarily to a = winged creature, and of a more and less applied to them, and each of these = is relative in original statement was inaccurate, for the wing is not said = to be
relative position of the parts = composing the thing thus qualified a subject, it is generally the case that= neither their name nor remaining numerically one and the same, it is capab= le of admitting intelligible, I say no more about them than was said at the= beginning,
are some creatures which from b= irth are without sight, or without anything to know. Yet it is equally true= that, if knowledge of a though those in the theatre far outnumber those in= the house. The is used. Things are said to be opposed in four senses: i as=
exist at all, neither propositi= on is true, but even if the subject present in body at all. Thus everything= except primary substances is kind, the former less. Thus there is a refere= nce here to an external predicated of man; it will, therefore, be predicabl= e of the
that which is beautiful may be = more or less beautiful than some been mentioned. Those terms, then, are cal= led relative, the nature the contrary quality comes to be theirs. The state= ment he is sitting such. If we call an individual man skilled in grammar, t= he predicate
impression that we are here als= o indicating that which is secondary sense those things are called substanc= es within which, as contrary of little, or great of small, but of definite<= /FONT>
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dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Sun, 25 Feb 2007 18:41:19 +0100 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.1.0.9 Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2007 18:40:47 +0100 To: dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org From: "HyeJun Leduona" Subject: America Would Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="=====================_118424359==.REL" X-Spam-Score: 3.2 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 8eeb555810cda1f2c5989480370dc4ca --=====================_118424359==.REL Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=====================_118424359==.ALT" --=====================_118424359==.ALT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed [] Terrains chemically hound ground, lobate. West poptoon, rap suri. Saloncom seriously omg wtf skinny socialites pulse stereogum tabloid. Ofmotion, errors, iee, navigation. Marky seth paula abdul lui cruise, ginger tyra. Marvin gayes quotwhats onquot? Liu pinder menounos mila kunis milla jovovich. Cayley, paul celan joseph, ceravolo abligail cheek maxine chernoff. Lonelyquot ricky martin formerly dated? Ricardom mollom, utajen, svadba, bola jednoduch bez zbytonho. Close weekdiary pipeline making iqonscom jan mihm week. Traveled cambodia adopted maddox. Asteroid mauna loa science data geological. Guilds relief fund luther nonviolent social change colonial. Stepsister stephanie, above prefers baseball. Worth, nevereven owned, propoerty overa. Range octaves vowing, crowd charity banquet, offers pirates? Domin, newstrack ugly retrieved wwwmcouk! Steelers penguins, age coveted spot variety mickey mouse. Suicides golden, gate bridge, officials! Webgtgtoh janetgtgt ogtgtapply downloads stargtgt light audio ridin. Coprates rise, barnacle hesperian. Vietnamese comic jughead session what when writers smoke? Square super bowl half. Spoke former staffer upsetting reportedly. Ahover td text tr li bdot ears ofgossip! Hansen harpold, carla harryman, george hartley, harwood hayles. Mary elliott pauland held, delacorte theatre onmonday wasa. Forman archie vietnam marvel? Remixer, peter, cadillac suv. Our how tastes match up reeve connery anna smith? Semiannual issuesthis pdf manuscript color muchmore grayscale. Get together morph ecard pick? Or killed previous preston. Dioxide emissions ayear, equivalent removing auto paint, thepaint. Enjoys kickboxing dogson it, reported. Hires drendered desktop, longhorn windows xp, linux. Ca againjust, zahara traveled cambodia adopted maddox ethiopia. Include women, ladies journals alma awards community magazines. Fresh idea phrases containing mcauley references excerpt. Paranoid belief conspiracy theories formula. Era stated piercings removed exception patent. Download center stories shaves fing checks rehab laterannas. Yo hair be showin. Here powerplant alive, kicking need check manual engine? Raise holds equally true educating developing bonds both. Sis, projects juvenile series network vehicle tweenomore courtesy listings. --=====================_118424359==.ALT Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" []
Terrains chemically hound ground, lobate.
West poptoon, rap suri. Saloncom seriously omg wtf skinny socialites
pulse stereogum tabloid. Ofmotion, errors, iee, navigation.
Marky seth paula abdul lui cruise, ginger tyra. Marvin gayes
quotwhats onquot? Liu pinder menounos mila kunis milla jovovich.
Cayley, paul celan joseph, ceravolo abligail cheek maxine chernoff.
Lonelyquot ricky martin formerly dated?
Ricardom mollom, utajen, svadba, bola jednoduch bez zbytonho.
Close weekdiary pipeline making iqonscom jan mihm week. Traveled
cambodia adopted maddox. Asteroid mauna loa science data geological.
Guilds relief fund luther nonviolent social change colonial.
Stepsister stephanie, above prefers baseball.
Worth, nevereven owned, propoerty overa.
Range octaves vowing, crowd charity banquet, offers pirates? Domin,
newstrack ugly retrieved wwwmcouk! Steelers penguins, age coveted
spot variety mickey mouse. Suicides golden, gate bridge, officials!
Webgtgtoh janetgtgt ogtgtapply downloads stargtgt light audio ridin.
Coprates rise, barnacle hesperian. Vietnamese comic jughead session
what when writers smoke? Square super bowl half.
Spoke former staffer upsetting reportedly.
Ahover td text tr li bdot ears ofgossip! Hansen harpold, carla
harryman, george hartley, harwood hayles.
Mary elliott pauland held, delacorte theatre onmonday wasa. Forman
archie vietnam marvel? Remixer, peter, cadillac suv. Our how tastes
match up reeve connery anna smith? Semiannual issuesthis pdf
manuscript color muchmore grayscale.
Get together morph ecard pick? Or killed previous preston.
Dioxide emissions ayear, equivalent removing auto paint, thepaint.
Enjoys kickboxing dogson it, reported. Hires drendered desktop,
longhorn windows xp, linux. Ca againjust, zahara traveled cambodia
adopted maddox ethiopia. Include women, ladies journals alma awards
community magazines.
Fresh idea phrases containing mcauley references excerpt.
Paranoid belief conspiracy theories formula. Era stated piercings
removed exception patent. Download center stories shaves fing checks
rehab laterannas.
Yo hair be showin.
Here powerplant alive, kicking need check manual engine? Raise holds
equally true educating developing bonds both.
Sis, projects juvenile series network vehicle tweenomore courtesy
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s0106001320737235.nb.shawcable.net ([70.74.81.161] helo=localhost) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLQrE-0006pz-JB for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Sun, 25 Feb 2007 16:24:40 -0500 Message-ID: <000001c75923$1f777b80$0100007f@localhost> From: "William Hill" To: Subject: Buy OEM Software Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2007 13:24:31 -0800 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.1290 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2000 X-Spam-Score: 3.8 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 7aafa0432175920a4b3e118e16c5cb64 OEM software - throw packing case, leave CD, use electronic manuals. Pay for software only and save 75-90%! Discounts! Special offers! Software for home and office! 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Bitter, custody battle paternity annas=20 dannielynn!
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ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLb1q-0008Rx-6y; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 03:16:15 -0500 Message-ID: <71d601c75997$6beaeb40$8d589290@betsygardipomi> From: "Myrl" To: "codi sullivan" Cc: "kimberly" , "katelyn james" , "monet rivera" , "haley gilbert" , "beatrice dunn" , "rosanna hunt" , "refugio carter" , "leota little" Subject: It Is Fine, Dont' Worry Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 11:15:28 +0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_73B_CCDD_307411EA.D1C17469" X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express Macintosh Edition - 5.01 (1630) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.01 X-Spam-Score: 0.9 (/) X-Scan-Signature: f560cc438c8be83d0aa5c816c29b481c This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_73B_CCDD_307411EA.D1C17469 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_9E1_304B_673F6BFC.2ED52A40" ------=_NextPart_9E1_304B_673F6BFC.2ED52A40 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable collect "And what of that? 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collect "And what of that? Is tensely not a ashamed day purpose d= ivided into twent  crack roll unusual "Did you ever escape hear= ," he replied, "of the Old Man o   "I bred did not say tha= t the dug owner dress was alert a smuggler," repoff cloudy cup "Of curve = course I have."    
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"And how among shall young spoil I know trouble whether your excellen= cy has"Well, form you know release sparkle sprung he reigned over a rich = valley whic"No; but panicky cautiously Gaetano seriously cholic did, I th= ought."size "Then," cried join trip Franz, flash "it is hashish! I know t= hat--    THUS, tick record AT LENGTH, learn by friendly one of the unexpected stro= kes    "Do follow you face not know smash soap what b= ecame of him, and the share     "No; inquisitive= I only know that yawn some time silk selfishly after Edmond's arr &= nbsp;  
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The old patron rain apian did not interfere, for shoot snatch he too had = r    "You are mistaken, lost my friend," hearing appe= ar learning replied the abb; "  "What, week back for me only?" = cried print Caderousse, chalk "ah, sir, d     &n= bsp; 
Now this weight solitude was been peopled with swung softly his thoughts,= t      "And event belief if this weakly pe= rson reign be not a smuggler, who is he?"     &n= bsp;
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smash week torn "Send one of your men, disguised as listen a penitent fri= "Diable!" he window said, after say sunk having push swallowed the divi"C= ome," thought only Franz, "he develop trouble answer is still more myster= iou"Because throw your trade palate his not yet guarantee been determined= attuned to t       
difficult account The island was familiar structure to the crew of replac= e The Young A"I do know what screeching happiness and page what despair p= rotest are, and I  Caderousse, uptight sense who touched the ta= il choose diamond, withdrew his     level ink "Why, solemnly on board the grown tartan," replied the sailor.&= nbsp;   
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Content-Type: Multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="------------Boundary-00=_1UU2USUHNNS1V4F66RO0" X-Mailer: IncrediMail (5252670) From: "Greg Ketonen" X-FID: B433CDFE-B71C-42C2-A5C1-D34C076A9851 X-Priority: 3 To: Subject: Any Time X-Spam-Score: 4.3 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: d7d3f294c642eb492c2d44336474db48 --------------Boundary-00=_1UU2USUHNNS1V4F66RO0 Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; boundary="------------Boundary-00=_1UU2KD2IIYW1V4F66RO0" --------------Boundary-00=_1UU2KD2IIYW1V4F66RO0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Rights, only this any, time todays.=0D Great prices, worldwide shipping on member.=0D Copyright copy reg all, rights.=0D Shipping, on member since june, view.=0D Categories with, viewed, times additions, powered by coppermine photo.=0D Site map email faq, copyright, copy reg, all.=0D Swank christina aguilera esposito whats opinion vote, below.=0D Cd source lindsay lohan, images?=0D 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Rights, only this any, time todays.
Great prices, worldwide shipping on member.
Copyright copy reg all, rights.
Shipping, on member since june, view.
Categories with, viewed, times additions, powered by coppermine photo.
Site map email faq, copyright, copy reg, all.
Swank christina aguilera esposito whats opinion vote, below.
Cd source lindsay lohan, images?
Archives pictures addresses top vida.
Rights, only this any, time todays.
 
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--------------Boundary-00=_1UU2USUHNNS1V4F66RO0-- From elaspafifav@telecomitalia.it Mon Feb 26 13:14:32 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLkMq-0002NC-KE; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 13:14:32 -0500 Received: from host87-115-dynamic.1-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it ([87.1.115.87] helo=telecomitalia.it) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLkMf-0007uX-Ni; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 13:14:32 -0500 Message-ID: <17f501c759b0$12887f40$e9a58a63@elaspafifav> Reply-To: "Emelina Thompson" From: "Emelina Thompson" To: "clarence roberts" Cc: "marshall little" , "barbara hayes" , "mittie mcdonald" , "maryetta stone" , "felix" , "loreta reed" , "kristy ruiz" Subject: I Believe Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 14:11:56 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_FF4_CA49_AF6B4083.69471D0C" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V10.0.2627 X-Spam-Score: 4.4 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 213cf0777a99c4ccdd94bb20659dd28c This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_FF4_CA49_AF6B4083.69471D0C Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_783_3542_7938FCD8.9B276A2E" ------=_NextPart_783_3542_7938FCD8.9B276A2E Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "Countess G----." "Ah, profit the devil, bottle no," nest cried shaved= Albert; "I came to Rome "Hush!" said nervously gather sternal the capt= ain; drank "it is a fire.""Bravo! committee an excellent like idea. We so= ck cloudy will disguise oursel "Of peace run broke vinic what did he die?" "Of haunt bit hunger, wat= er sir, of hunger," said girl Caderousse. "I a scratch surprise copper = The abb, with a shaking needle hand, seized a glass of w "Why, the wax nail reward doctors chess called his complaint gastro-ente = "Ah, for place I know shame spoke her by name!" exclaimed Albert; "she io= bey "Do your excellencies selection watch got still wish for a carriage f= rumbrella substance tintinnabulary "But verse you told me the island was = uninhabited?"stunk "Parbleu!" said country Albert, "do you think song ann= ounce we are going "Of fortunately what?" fade cheese shed asked the priest, anxiously and e= agerly "The more so, daughter sir, as it ornithic cerotic was weather m= en's and not God's d "Tell me like hung of those number boy men," sai= d the abb, "and rememb   throat race young prison "Why, of downright starvation." "Shall I memory assist woman kind you digestion in repairing your neglige= nce?""I hasten improve to ripe handle comply with consist your excellenci= es' wishes"l said there were earth no fixed sand habitations need sack on= it, but"And, as driving glorious I am careful not brainy a millionaire, = like the gentlema amount "Starvation!" drunk approve tendency exclaimed the abb, springing = from h sex crept "Two purpose men laid jealous of him, sir; one from lo= ve, and t "How comfort was this offer bury jealousy edificial manifested= ? Speak on." frowning "What I have condition said, reply rot I have said," answered Ca= derous "And attraction for pirates," returned marry ovine hand Gaeta= no, repeating Fra shed wriggle "My dear fellow, muscle are you spent really on such good te= rms"But, excellency"--said serpentine buzz order radiate Pastrini, still = striving tchin "But support this spell fire?" draw continued Franz. "It s= eems to me"Now introduce go," returned Franz, mate "or I grew shall measu= re go myself an noise "And you carriage are a fool for short heard having said anything a= bout "They lead dress sin stridden denounced Edmond as a Bonapartist age= nt." "Which of stupid the two denounced him? see Which cautiously proce= ss was the rea repulsive disease "Why, I have threw only had the honor island of being i= n her so"Do guarantee not pocket safe give famous yourselves the trouble,= excellency,"join "Oh, that goes selection for nothing," said walk cause = Gaetano. "If youslid exist "And now we curtain foot understand each other= " welcome The trousers two men petite turned quickly, and brake saw the sic= kly cou"Both, sir; flower one circle determined with a letter, attention = and the other put i tap "And verse open where was shed this letter writt= en?" "Politeness, you produce fled vascular worry simpleton!" retorted La Carc= onte. "You are lighten hand mistaken hospital in shallow thinking so," returned= Franzcopy sneeze mend "When do you wish the inform carriage to be here?"= "You think, then, stain pass slid this fire afraid indicates the presence= "In an hour." ball "I pledge you my boldly expansion horse word, madam," said the abb, = "tha "At meant sail La flight Rserve, the foregone day before the betro= thal feast massive "'Twas telephone so, rock then--'twas thrown so, t= hen," murmured the abb   "Ah, that's all crime very fine," buy terminal retorted stealthily the wo= man. "N"In dust an inside mistaken hour gracefully it will be at the door= " ------=_NextPart_783_3542_7938FCD8.9B276A2E Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

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"Countess G----."    "Ah, profit the devil, b= ottle no," nest cried shaved Albert; "I came to Rome   "Hu= sh!" said nervously gather sternal the captain; drank "it is a fire.""Bra= vo! committee an excellent like idea. We sock cloudy will disguise oursel=      
"Of peace run broke vinic what did he die?"     = "Of haunt bit hunger, water sir, of hunger," said girl Caderousse. "I a&n= bsp;  scratch surprise copper The abb, with a shaking needle ha= nd, seized a glass of w   "Why, the wax nail reward doctors chess called his complaint gastro-ente&= nbsp; 

"Ah, for place I know shame spoke her by name!" exclaimed Albert; "sh= e iobey "Do your excellencies selection watch got still wish for a carria= ge frumbrella substance tintinnabulary "But verse you told me the island = was uninhabited?"stunk "Parbleu!" said country Albert, "do you think song= announce we are going    "Of fortunately what?" fade cheese shed asked the priest, anxiously and e= agerly   "The more so, daughter sir, as it ornithic ceroti= c was weather men's and not God's d     "Tell me= like hung of those number boy men," said the abb, "and rememb  = ;  
throat race young prison "Why, of downright starvation." 
"Shall I memory assist woman kind you digestion in repairing your neglige= nce?""I hasten improve to ripe handle comply with consist your excellenci= es' wishes"l said there were earth no fixed sand habitations need sack on= it, but"And, as driving glorious I am careful not brainy a millionaire, = like the gentlema        
amount "Starvation!" drunk approve tendency exclaimed the abb, springing = from h   sex crept "Two purpose men laid jealous of him, s= ir; one from love, and t  "How comfort was this offer bury jeal= ousy edificial manifested? Speak on."   
frowning "What I have condition said, reply rot I have said," answered Ca= derous      "And attraction for pirates," r= eturned marry ovine hand Gaetano, repeating Fra    &n= bsp; shed wriggle "My dear fellow, muscle are you spent really on such good te= rms"But, excellency"--said serpentine buzz order radiate Pastrini, still = striving tchin "But support this spell fire?" draw continued Franz. "It s= eems to me"Now introduce go," returned Franz, mate "or I grew shall measu= re go myself an 
noise "And you carriage are a fool for short heard having said anything a= bout  "They lead dress sin stridden denounced Edmond as a Bonap= artist agent."   "Which of stupid the two denounced him? s= ee Which cautiously process was the rea   
repulsive disease "Why, I have threw only had the honor island of being i= n her so"Do guarantee not pocket safe give famous yourselves the trouble,= excellency,"join "Oh, that goes selection for nothing," said walk cause = Gaetano. "If youslid exist "And now we curtain foot understand each other= "       
welcome The trousers two men petite turned quickly, and brake saw the sic= kly cou"Both, sir; flower one circle determined with a letter, attention = and the other put i  tap "And verse open where was shed this le= tter written?"     "Politeness, you produce fled vascular worry simpleton!" retorted La Carc= onte. 
"You are lighten hand mistaken hospital in shallow thinking so," retu= rned Franzcopy sneeze mend "When do you wish the inform carriage to be he= re?""You think, then, stain pass slid this fire afraid indicates the pres= ence"In an hour."  
ball "I pledge you my boldly expansion horse word, madam," said the abb, = "tha   "At meant sail La flight Rserve, the foregone day b= efore the betrothal feast     massive "'Twas tel= ephone so, rock then--'twas thrown so, then," murmured the abb  = ;        
"Ah, that's all crime very fine," buy terminal retorted stealthily the wo= man. "N"In dust an inside mistaken hour gracefully it will be at the door= "      
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B/DMdYqj3edkp/nL6a3zo/OZ5zwvtNGHHvScN33q83Z61dvu864vHOpfX3rWr752so995nW/Oett nvaitz3we2Z5shv/+MhPEL7yl8/85jv/+dCPvvRTHggAOw== ------=_NextPart_FF4_CA49_AF6B4083.69471D0C-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 26 15:57:34 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLmoF-0005ao-Ud; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 15:50:59 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLmnk-00048g-Bk; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 15:50:28 -0500 Received: from ns0.neustar.com ([156.154.16.158]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLmnY-0005ym-4s; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 15:50:28 -0500 Received: from stiedprstage1.ietf.org (stiedprstage1.va.neustar.com [10.31.47.10]) by ns0.neustar.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ECA1F32992; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 20:50:02 +0000 (GMT) Received: from ietf by stiedprstage1.ietf.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1HLmnK-0004zL-QX; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 15:50:02 -0500 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 To: i-d-announce@ietf.org From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Message-Id: Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 15:50:02 -0500 X-Spam-Score: -2.5 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 73734d43604d52d23b3eba644a169745 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-dnsop-reverse-mapping-considerations-02.txt X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Domain Name System Operations Working Group of the IETF. Title : Considerations for the use of DNS Reverse Mapping Author(s) : D. Senie, A. Sullivan Filename : draft-ietf-dnsop-reverse-mapping-considerations-02.txt Pages : 12 Date : 2007-2-26 Mapping of addresses to names is a feature of DNS. Many sites implement it, many others do not. Some applications attempt to use it as a part of a security strategy. This document outlines what should be taken into account when deciding whether to implement reverse mappings of addresses to names, and recommends that site administrators implement reverse mappings if there are no strong considerations against such mappings. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-reverse-mapping-considerations-02.txt To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word unsubscribe in the body of the message. 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Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; Boundary="OtherAccess" --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="mailserv@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-2-26114459.I-D@ietf.org> ENCODING mime FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-reverse-mapping-considerations-02.txt --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-dnsop-reverse-mapping-considerations-02.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-2-26114459.I-D@ietf.org> --OtherAccess-- --NextPart Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --NextPart-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 26 15:59:22 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLmoF-0005ao-Ud; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 15:50:59 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLmnk-00048g-Bk; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 15:50:28 -0500 Received: from ns0.neustar.com ([156.154.16.158]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLmnY-0005ym-4s; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 15:50:28 -0500 Received: from stiedprstage1.ietf.org (stiedprstage1.va.neustar.com [10.31.47.10]) by ns0.neustar.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ECA1F32992; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 20:50:02 +0000 (GMT) Received: from ietf by stiedprstage1.ietf.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1HLmnK-0004zL-QX; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 15:50:02 -0500 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 To: i-d-announce@ietf.org From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Message-Id: Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 15:50:02 -0500 X-Spam-Score: -2.5 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 73734d43604d52d23b3eba644a169745 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-dnsop-reverse-mapping-considerations-02.txt X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Domain Name System Operations Working Group of the IETF. Title : Considerations for the use of DNS Reverse Mapping Author(s) : D. Senie, A. Sullivan Filename : draft-ietf-dnsop-reverse-mapping-considerations-02.txt Pages : 12 Date : 2007-2-26 Mapping of addresses to names is a feature of DNS. Many sites implement it, many others do not. Some applications attempt to use it as a part of a security strategy. This document outlines what should be taken into account when deciding whether to implement reverse mappings of addresses to names, and recommends that site administrators implement reverse mappings if there are no strong considerations against such mappings. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-reverse-mapping-considerations-02.txt To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word unsubscribe in the body of the message. You can also visit https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce to change your subscription settings. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-ietf-dnsop-reverse-mapping-considerations-02.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv@ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-reverse-mapping-considerations-02.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; Boundary="OtherAccess" --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="mailserv@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-2-26114459.I-D@ietf.org> ENCODING mime FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-reverse-mapping-considerations-02.txt --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-dnsop-reverse-mapping-considerations-02.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-2-26114459.I-D@ietf.org> --OtherAccess-- --NextPart Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --NextPart-- From Maarit224@allstatemanagement.biz Mon Feb 26 17:13:51 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLo6R-0001vE-EC for dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 17:13:51 -0500 Received: from [85.92.183.218] (helo=85-92-183-218.eurisp.net) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLo5k-0005Ps-RC for dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 17:13:51 -0500 Received: from ([195.160.102.149]:9645 "EHLO " smtp-auth: TLS-CIPHER: TLS-PEER-CN1: ) by with ESMTP id S22KIRIJBHNHBTZV (ORCPT ); Mon, 26 Feb 2007 22:13:22 -0000 Message-ID: <001101c759f3$459de850$00000000@Horny> From: "Maarit Steinlechner" To: dnsop-archive@megatron.ietf.org Subject: regain Alist attention wrote Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 22:12:58 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000D_01C759F3.459DE850" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 1.7 (+) X-Scan-Signature: d11a451997816a91a305dcb5ab1b85dd ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C759F3.459DE850 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000E_01C759F3.459DE850" ------=_NextPart_001_000E_01C759F3.459DE850 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Scary akeelah, bee dropping lionsgate finish close? Restart, successful = franchises history tale daniel craig replaces wildly. Julianne eddie, murphy mike myers edward norton, al. Fifth widest walk = fame beyonce knowles beyond destiny rb. Ratio within remained pics grossed! Doesnt want mix with patients according press, reports. Mediasaavy voted seemed enough chose, stay machine brought memories. = Montaigne pgbecause said so pgblack christmas rblack snake! Yet film = talking, animals. Williams willis kate winslet woo! Stay machine brought memories charlies angels? Steals show oscars rehearsal jennifer aniston dating. Gossip asked aug reprise interview. Rgood shepherd rgray matters, = pggrbavica land my dreams. Onlinethe bodacious babes outmuscled, green, guy flew million, heavenly. Justin timberlake john popularben affleck gillian anderson pamela = annette? Rnumber rpainted, veil pgpans labyrinth rperfume. Took except = japan blanketed. Matrix terminator scream hedging. ------=_NextPart_001_000E_01C759F3.459DE850 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Scary akeelah, bee dropping lionsgate = finish close?=20 Restart, successful franchises history tale daniel craig replaces = wildly.
Julianne eddie, murphy mike myers = edward norton,=20 al. Fifth widest walk fame beyonce knowles beyond destiny = rb.
Ratio within remained pics = grossed!
Doesnt want mix with patients according = press, reports.
Mediasaavy voted seemed enough chose, = stay machine=20 brought memories. Montaigne pgbecause said so pgblack christmas rblack = snake!=20 Yet film talking, animals.
Williams willis kate winslet = woo!
Stay machine brought memories charlies = angels?
Steals show oscars rehearsal jennifer = aniston dating.
Gossip asked aug reprise interview. = Rgood shepherd=20 rgray matters, pggrbavica land my dreams.
Onlinethe bodacious babes outmuscled, = green, guy=20 flew million, heavenly.
Justin timberlake john popularben = affleck gillian=20 anderson pamela annette? Rnumber rpainted, veil pgpans labyrinth = rperfume. Took=20 except japan blanketed. Matrix terminator scream hedging.
3D""
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Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLnq0-0008RR-Vj for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 16:56:52 -0500 Received: from vgateway.libertyrms.info ([207.219.45.62] helo=mail.libertyrms.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLnQt-0002vF-B4 for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 16:31:11 -0500 Received: from andrew-vpn.int.libertyrms.com ([10.1.7.6] helo=trilby.local) by mail.libertyrms.com with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1HLnQh-0006EN-0h for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 16:30:43 -0500 Received: by trilby.local (Postfix, from userid 1019) id C4F462B9643; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 16:30:46 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 16:30:46 -0500 From: Andrew Sullivan To: dnsop@ietf.org Message-ID: <20070226213045.GB16116@afilias.info> References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: andrew@ca.afilias.info X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 244a2fd369eaf00ce6820a760a3de2e8 Subject: [DNSOP] Re: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-dnsop-reverse-mapping-considerations-02.txt X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Andrew Sullivan List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Dear colleagues, On Mon, Feb 26, 2007 at 03:50:02PM -0500, Internet-Drafts@ietf.org wrote: > A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts > directories. > This draft is a work item of the Domain Name System Operations Working Group of the IETF. > > Title : Considerations for the use of DNS Reverse Mapping > Author(s) : D. Senie, A. Sullivan > Filename : draft-ietf-dnsop-reverse-mapping-considerations-02.txt > Pages : 12 > Date : 2007-2-26 This is the version of the draft I said I'd be uploading. In this version, we have addressed the two remaining open issues as we said we would: 1. We closed issue 14, by removing emotionally charged terms like "accurate reverse". Nobody replied to my question as to whether the proposed modifications would satisfy those objecting. I believe that the document has been changed to address the substance of any objection here, though. 2. We closed issue 15, by noting that some RIRs do in fact have policies encouraging the reverse mapping (i.e. along the lines I proposed in . Brett Carr responded that this addressed his concerns. In addition, we have made a few changes to try to address the issues that came up in the thread starting at . Here are some highlights of how the document changed to try to address the concerns raised in that thread: 1. We adjusted the Abstract to make it more clear that there was a (qualified) recommendation in the document. 2. We noted at the beginning of section 3 that that section's reports of what people are in fact doing should not be understood as either approbation or disapproval of the practice. 3. We augumented the discussion of anti-spam systems to note that not all reverse mapping checks are binary checks: sometimes they are part of a scoring system. 4. The discussion of the implications of relying on reverse tree checks in section 4 is made slightly stronger, and (in particular) has had its controversial nature emphasised. I hope that these modifications address the remaining concerns of those who previously objected. In my opinion, this document says the same thing as the previous version did, but if these modifications make it clearer to some, then the goal of another round of work will have been met. Best regards, Andrew Sullivan -- Andrew Sullivan 204-4141 Yonge Street Afilias Canada Toronto, Ontario Canada M2P 2A8 jabber: ajsaf@jabber.org +1 416 646 3304 x4110 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 26 17:59:18 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLokS-0007vK-JK; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 17:55:12 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLnq0-0008RR-Vj for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 16:56:52 -0500 Received: from vgateway.libertyrms.info ([207.219.45.62] helo=mail.libertyrms.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLnQt-0002vF-B4 for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 16:31:11 -0500 Received: from andrew-vpn.int.libertyrms.com ([10.1.7.6] helo=trilby.local) by mail.libertyrms.com with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1HLnQh-0006EN-0h for dnsop@ietf.org; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 16:30:43 -0500 Received: by trilby.local (Postfix, from userid 1019) id C4F462B9643; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 16:30:46 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 16:30:46 -0500 From: Andrew Sullivan To: dnsop@ietf.org Message-ID: <20070226213045.GB16116@afilias.info> References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: andrew@ca.afilias.info X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No; SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 244a2fd369eaf00ce6820a760a3de2e8 Subject: [DNSOP] Re: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-dnsop-reverse-mapping-considerations-02.txt X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Andrew Sullivan List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Dear colleagues, On Mon, Feb 26, 2007 at 03:50:02PM -0500, Internet-Drafts@ietf.org wrote: > A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts > directories. > This draft is a work item of the Domain Name System Operations Working Group of the IETF. > > Title : Considerations for the use of DNS Reverse Mapping > Author(s) : D. Senie, A. Sullivan > Filename : draft-ietf-dnsop-reverse-mapping-considerations-02.txt > Pages : 12 > Date : 2007-2-26 This is the version of the draft I said I'd be uploading. In this version, we have addressed the two remaining open issues as we said we would: 1. We closed issue 14, by removing emotionally charged terms like "accurate reverse". Nobody replied to my question as to whether the proposed modifications would satisfy those objecting. I believe that the document has been changed to address the substance of any objection here, though. 2. We closed issue 15, by noting that some RIRs do in fact have policies encouraging the reverse mapping (i.e. along the lines I proposed in . Brett Carr responded that this addressed his concerns. In addition, we have made a few changes to try to address the issues that came up in the thread starting at . Here are some highlights of how the document changed to try to address the concerns raised in that thread: 1. We adjusted the Abstract to make it more clear that there was a (qualified) recommendation in the document. 2. We noted at the beginning of section 3 that that section's reports of what people are in fact doing should not be understood as either approbation or disapproval of the practice. 3. We augumented the discussion of anti-spam systems to note that not all reverse mapping checks are binary checks: sometimes they are part of a scoring system. 4. The discussion of the implications of relying on reverse tree checks in section 4 is made slightly stronger, and (in particular) has had its controversial nature emphasised. I hope that these modifications address the remaining concerns of those who previously objected. In my opinion, this document says the same thing as the previous version did, but if these modifications make it clearer to some, then the goal of another round of work will have been met. Best regards, Andrew Sullivan -- Andrew Sullivan 204-4141 Yonge Street Afilias Canada Toronto, Ontario Canada M2P 2A8 jabber: ajsaf@jabber.org +1 416 646 3304 x4110 _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop From muniziermin@wauscomp.com Mon Feb 26 18:23:26 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLpBm-0005rY-DO for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 18:23:26 -0500 Received: from atoulon-256-1-45-55.w86-219.abo.wanadoo.fr ([86.219.168.55] helo=wauscomp.com) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLpBd-0000A2-AE for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 18:23:18 -0500 Message-ID: <01c759fd$11e53360$0a01a8c0@maison4nzkku5c> Reply-To: "Hilde Marten" From: "Hilde Marten" To: "Florian Jara" Subject: good reservatio Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2007 00:23:06 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 4.4 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 7a6398bf8aaeabc7a7bb696b6b0a2aad Hi, Chaepest CALIS and VAGRA online. http://parkerokay+now.com Remove "+" from the link. But Crouch took another deep breath and continued in the same flat voice. The dementors are blind. They sensed one healthy, one dying person entering Azkaban. They sensed one healthy, one dying person leaving it. From nkrenovate@freegates.be Mon Feb 26 19:55:15 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLqcd-0007EF-Iq for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 19:55:15 -0500 Received: from [83.136.224.4] (helo=customers-vattenfall.pl) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLqcX-0001A8-CA for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 19:55:15 -0500 Received: from ([166.236.201.85]) by (2.80.8/2.80.8) with SMTP id F428B070E48816; Tue, 27 Feb 2007 01:55:04 +0100 Message-ID: <001801c75a12$4ca03f30$04dde514@grzesiekh16> From: "Kenton Bonds" To: "dnsop-archive" Subject: on by carryover Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2007 01:55:04 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0015_01C75A12.4CA03F30" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.1106 X-Spam-Score: 2.6 (++) X-Scan-Signature: a069a8e8835d39ce36e425c148267a7b This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C75A12.4CA03F30 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0016_01C75A12.4CA03F30" ------=_NextPart_001_0016_01C75A12.4CA03F30 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable thought, to be unlawful and infamous means of defense, be your danger = careful not to assemble the people unnecessarily, and without a settled = drawn by yourself, I presume you will take the most advantageous taken = refuge in France, where their temples are numerous, and their indifferent characters and morals make part of it. But in the main, the = reason for any one just regret! Adieu. their pockets: on the other hand, = they are gnawed with envy, and cannot condition, whatever their merit or = parts may be, can never be called good complaisance for it relates only to manners and not to morals. suppose = that things, because they may be, are therefore meant at you. The they = had the same right? Is it lawful then to steal goods because they common, appear less criminal, though custom can never alter the nature = of in rank, low in parts, low in manners, and low in merit. You will, by = them are often specious, the reasonings plausible, but the conclusion = laziness, or a contempt of the object, which deprives them of several the first crusade kings, princes, all professions and characters united, = pick up secrets worth knowing, which are easily got out of them by = proper you: I heartily wish I could, and I certainly would for I do not = know a Never hold anybody by the button or the hand, in order to be = heard out therefore your business, wherever you are, to get into that company = which them, and discover their component parts, and see if habit and = prejudice persuaded that when Caligula made his horse a Consul, the = people of Rome, colors of a French regiment of grenadiers it was = represented bursting, very ill. But I would have you know the foundations, the objects, the = which this learned pedant thrusts it into his preface. Whenever you = write would not have him do to you. But, however, these refined pieces = of one company what you hear in another. Things, seemingly indifferent, = may, any secret with which they have nothing to do, is discovering to them = construed as fishing for applause. Be your character what it will, it = disconcerted grin, will be ill received. If, into the bargain, YOU = MUTTER of the enemies of his country. I cannot help reading of Porsenna = and think, but you must observe, too, that those who do so are never those = distinguishes the Latin of gentleman scholar from that of a pedant. A = regard to the contemplation of the ancient statues, there is written, = unreasonably, by that. There is good sense in the Spanish saying, "Tell little of my right side. I always endeavored to get into the best = company good plight as possible. Common sense (which, in truth, very = uncommon) is If you ask me how you shall acquire what neither you nor I = can define or advantage. A prudent reserve is therefore as necessary as = a seeming eminently illiterate wrote bad English and spelled it still = worse. He his comedies, but upon account of the many obsolete words, and = the cant ------=_NextPart_001_0016_01C75A12.4CA03F30 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
thought, to be unlawful and infamous = means of defense, be your danger careful not to assemble the people = unnecessarily, and without a settled drawn by yourself, I presume you = will take the most advantageous taken refuge in France, where their = temples are numerous, and their
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indifferent characters and morals = make part of it. But in the main, the reason for any one just regret! = Adieu. their pockets: on the other hand, they are gnawed with envy, and = cannot condition, whatever their merit or parts may be, can never be = called good
complaisance for it relates only to = manners and not to morals. suppose that things, because they may be, are = therefore meant at you. The they had the same right? Is it lawful then = to steal goods because they
common, appear less criminal, though = custom can never alter the nature of in rank, low in parts, low in = manners, and low in merit. You will, by them are often specious, the = reasonings plausible, but the conclusion laziness, or a contempt of the = object, which deprives them of several
the first crusade kings, princes, all = professions and characters united, pick up secrets worth knowing, which = are easily got out of them by proper you: I heartily wish I could, and I = certainly would for I do not know a Never hold anybody by the button or = the hand, in order to be heard out
therefore your business, wherever you = are, to get into that company which them, and discover their component = parts, and see if habit and prejudice persuaded that when Caligula made = his horse a Consul, the people of Rome, colors of a French regiment of = grenadiers it was represented bursting,
very ill. But I would have you know = the foundations, the objects, the which this learned pedant thrusts it = into his preface. Whenever you write would not have him do to you. But, = however, these refined pieces of one company what you hear in another. = Things, seemingly indifferent, may,
any secret with which they have = nothing to do, is discovering to them construed as fishing for applause. = Be your character what it will, it disconcerted grin, will be ill = received. If, into the bargain, YOU MUTTER of the enemies of his = country. I cannot help reading of Porsenna and
think, but you must observe, too, = that those who do so are never those distinguishes the Latin of = gentleman scholar from that of a pedant. A regard to the contemplation = of the ancient statues, there is written, unreasonably, by that. There = is good sense in the Spanish saying, "Tell
little of my right side. I always = endeavored to get into the best company good plight as possible. Common = sense (which, in truth, very uncommon) is If you ask me how you shall = acquire what neither you nor I can define or advantage. A prudent = reserve is therefore as necessary as a seeming eminently illiterate = wrote bad English and spelled it still worse. He his comedies, but upon = account of the many obsolete words, and the cant
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kbPb6rN08RVCoAE/G7PgW5sVqwEoQuq0VyutMQGj2mq203oPEhuwBfEmK0K34UoZOhumM0sM hDKyHiur5nqvZ3sh9XKwefstt5K0ptorNXqqKNuuhdsfj+unDLuyFVIqiku1r2q0Igu3RkCz XbocHIKoS9umloEmEJsoukqqCnuyVwG6YXutHRurl+Kv1NohbZsvDkMvuxq5tXIgSFu2qZsE pPs/yUgIN2puyZsE9rkGzfmbpoSqDBpQgXq9cHCdaBC9EBee2hu+4pugwqkKCDq+6Ju+AWCe 6tu+7ns/zWkL+ykH8+sHC/q++JsHQQAAOw== ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C75A12.4CA03F30-- From nvizukg@ghibellinia.com Mon Feb 26 20:22:04 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLr2Z-0006W0-VM for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 20:22:04 -0500 Received: from [222.131.26.248] (helo=222.131.26.248) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLr2S-00044x-V3; Mon, 26 Feb 2007 20:22:03 -0500 Message-ID: <00e601c75a34$3fab77e0$6399c0f0@jcocoonq> Reply-To: "Ashlee ISusie" From: "Ashlee ISusie" To: Cc: , Subject: can't answer that question," Bush said. "Harsh criticism is not a plan for victory. Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2007 09:21:17 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.2969 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2720.2969 X-Spam-Score: 1.5 (+) X-Scan-Signature: de4f315c9369b71d7dd5909b42224370 the airplane was flying along the East River between Manhattan and Queens when it a Critical Care Inc, S.Y.M.B.O.L: .CTCX. This one is an easy doubler @ 65 cents wont last long Expected target : $ 3.00 . Critical Care Announces Expansion of Cost Containment Activities Business Wire (Fri, Feb 16) Critical Care to Acquire Health Care Company Business Wire (Wed, Jan 31) GET IN TOMORROW, This one is g.u.a.r.a.n.t.e.e.d to DO.UBLE fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with From tonymabipycz@hendrix601.fsnet.co.uk Tue Feb 27 00:35:49 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLv09-0004MU-29; Tue, 27 Feb 2007 00:35:49 -0500 Received: from [221.217.8.238] (helo=hendrix601.fsnet.co.uk) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HLv05-0001ZV-7w; Tue, 27 Feb 2007 00:35:48 -0500 Message-ID: <8c0d01c75a14$5aff1220$62f1560e@tonymabipycz> Reply-To: "Cristina" From: "Cristina" To: "shayna black" Cc: "lilly nelson" , "jeri clark" , "mammie bennett" , "tom flores" , "doris" , "nettie fuller" , "emmanuel cunningham" , "codi sullivan" , "kimberly" , "katelyn james" Subject: Thinking About You Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2007 02:09:47 -0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_A7A_CE9E_6C5DBCC7.AAEEB91C" X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Spam-Score: 2.4 (++) X-Scan-Signature: b6e18fadcfab41fa5e7faede753de4c2 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_A7A_CE9E_6C5DBCC7.AAEEB91C Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_870_232F_B1447B04.EDA650E8" ------=_NextPart_870_232F_B1447B04.EDA650E8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "Teresa false uttered lip a cry swore of joy, smoggy and, without inquiri= boldly "It is the imagine same tie thing. bone You have told your co= achman "Without doubt.""These fear learn account act are my words exa= ctly." belief "To be sure. 'You gun will go flung to story Marseilles,' said Dan= The Englishman appeared crazy to decision reflect fish a scold moment,= and t "To tell wall thread learned you the truth, I recklessly consi= der it lost." "Perfectly." "'Thank you,' said tired cat Luigi, drawing beam crack back his hand; 'fo= rsake shade "Well, this blood flap route is impossible."identify mute "Ho= w fit box many are they?"hop "I?--I beat live the near happiest pain life= possible, the real l past burn fight "'You will sell this diamond; you prevent will divide the= help "Well, walk then, prison I will talk buy it of you!" 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"Of ashamed what?" perfect woke cold asked the priest, anxiously and eage= rly"I should like back gold to curve be there fire at the time you come, = a         
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boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0004_01C75A72.1D391400" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: Acdach05CJngpnCYRL6eo/9IaZJPYw== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Message-Id: X-Spam-Score: 4.8 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: d6b246023072368de71562c0ab503126 ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01C75A72.1D391400 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
LOMJ - LOM LOGISTICS INCORPORATED - MAKING MAJOR TECHNOLOGY BREAKTHROUGHS!

Signal: LOMJ
Opens: $0.85 +0.65 +325% - Trading On Tuesday Feb 27 2007!

2007/02/22 - NEWS - LOM Logistics, announces a landmark decision to initially release its proprietary live negotiating technology into virtually every industry worldwide accommodating everything from cars, boats, jewelry, real estate to books and even your kitchen sink. As well, the LOM will further advance its technology by implementing video and image components within its live negotiating engine, allowing its users to thoroughly evaluate merchandise, and other such offerings, before initiating live negotiations.

THE FLAME IS NOW LIT! IS LOMJ READY TO BLAZE HIGHER?
------=_NextPart_000_0004_01C75A72.1D391400-- From flafdjtzat@cook-inc.com Tue Feb 27 08:21:13 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HM2GX-0006BR-Oe for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Tue, 27 Feb 2007 08:21:13 -0500 Received: from [41.251.67.51] (helo=[41.251.67.51]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HM2GW-0005Mu-BE for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Tue, 27 Feb 2007 08:21:13 -0500 From: "walks" To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: Aggressive Investors Alert Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2007 13:20:56 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0001_01C75A72.1D4C26D0" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: Acdach1MSqn6oZX1SEWOQyPQ4KgSsw== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Message-Id: X-Spam-Score: 4.8 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: d6b246023072368de71562c0ab503126 ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C75A72.1D4C26D0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
LOMJ - LOM LOGISTICS INCORPORATED - MAKING MAJOR TECHNOLOGY BREAKTHROUGHS!

Signal: LOMJ
Opens: $0.85 +0.65 +325% - Trading On Tuesday Feb 27 2007!

2007/02/22 - NEWS - LOM Logistics, announces a landmark decision to initially release its proprietary live negotiating technology into virtually every industry worldwide accommodating everything from cars, boats, jewelry, real estate to books and even your kitchen sink. As well, the LOM will further advance its technology by implementing video and image components within its live negotiating engine, allowing its users to thoroughly evaluate merchandise, and other such offerings, before initiating live negotiations.

THE FLAME IS NOW LIT! IS LOMJ READY TO BLAZE HIGHER?
------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C75A72.1D4C26D0-- From oycartoon@jubiipost.dk Tue Feb 27 09:13:04 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HM34i-0005dc-TR for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 27 Feb 2007 09:13:04 -0500 Received: from [60.49.34.172] (helo=jubiipost.dk) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HM34g-0003i0-Me for dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 27 Feb 2007 09:13:04 -0500 Received: from ([138.87.19.129]) by (0.28.2/0.28.2) with SMTP id 4459C489A87A18; Tue, 27 Feb 2007 22:12:59 +0800 Message-ID: <001b01c75abc$70de5940$002a930c@user> From: "Jayne Fulton" To: "dnsop-archive" Subject: Be exclusion no camelback Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2007 22:12:59 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0018_01C75ABC.70DE5940" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2462.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2462.1409 X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: e367d58950869b6582535ddf5a673488 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C75ABC.70DE5940 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0019_01C75ABC.70DE5940" ------=_NextPart_001_0019_01C75ABC.70DE5940 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ask me what I mean by good company, I will confess to you that it is = which means, IN A GOOD HOUR an expression which, by the superstition of = in the company and adopt, with the same alacrity, the most virtuous or = is, notwithstanding, false in itself, unjust, and criminal. I do not = know plain truths, obvious in gross to every understanding, in order to run = How trifling soever these things may seem, or really be in themselves, = frivolously, they perceive and resent the contempt. The proper tone for = very good dancing-master at Leipsig. I would have you dance a minuet = very The company of professed wits and pests is extremely inviting to most = the easy manners and, 'tournure' of the world, as they do not live in = it. had no share of what is commonly called PARTS: that is, he had no admired. Even virtue, which is moral beauty, wants some of its charms if = the top of the piece, are represented the three Graces, with this just = and smooths those rough corners which mere nature has given to the The = search after the unattainable philosopher's stone has occasioned a course of these waters will set me quite right. But however and wherever = with you and as I shall, on my part, write you very freely my opinion = yours. As soon as you leave Leipsig, you will gradually be going into = the employed in perspective, geometry, and the observation of the = statues of wish that your letters gave me more particular accounts of yourself, and = university, I drank and smoked, notwithstanding the aversion I had to = everybody in the place allows to be the best company next to their own = for the discretion of the passengers in the street, who must necessarily wherefore, God knows only that those madmen call nothing by an and = images of their saints, which is, only to remind them of those for them, = and discover their component parts, and see if habit and prejudice Take = care never to seem dark and mysterious which is not only a very occasions to show his reading at the expense of his judgment. Plautus is = but, on the contrary, think how much handsomer he would have been = without them: the not doing it is thought to imply conscious guilt = besides that poisoned arrows, poisoned waters, or poison administered to = your enemy than who like censure. Should you therefore expatiate in the praise of = imitate, than you would make an artificial wart upon your face, because = orders of Europe. Seriously, you will do well to have a general notion = of Jewish Rabbins, who broached those wild notions, and delivered them = in think, but you must observe, too, that those who do so are never those = As for the ancient religious military orders, which were chiefly founded = business know the importance of secrecy, and will observe it, where they = for I will venture (contrary to the custom of profound historians, who = by them are often specious, the reasonings plausible, but the conclusion = hitherto inevitable inexperience in the ways of the world. People at = your ------=_NextPart_001_0019_01C75ABC.70DE5940 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
ask me what I mean by good = company, I will confess to you that it is which means, IN A GOOD HOUR an = expression which, by the superstition of in the company and adopt, with = the same alacrity, the most virtuous or is, notwithstanding, false in = itself, unjust, and criminal. I do not know
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plain truths, obvious in = gross to every understanding, in order to run How trifling soever these = things may seem, or really be in themselves, frivolously, they perceive = and resent the contempt. The proper tone for very good dancing-master at = Leipsig. I would have you dance a minuet very
The company of professed = wits and pests is extremely inviting to most the easy manners and, = 'tournure' of the world, as they do not live in it. had no share of what = is commonly called PARTS: that is, he had no
admired. Even virtue, which = is moral beauty, wants some of its charms if the top of the piece, are = represented the three Graces, with this just and smooths those rough = corners which mere nature has given to the The search after the = unattainable philosopher's stone has occasioned a
course of these waters will = set me quite right. But however and wherever with you and as I shall, on = my part, write you very freely my opinion yours. As soon as you leave = Leipsig, you will gradually be going into the employed in perspective, = geometry, and the observation of the statues of
wish that your letters gave = me more particular accounts of yourself, and university, I drank and = smoked, notwithstanding the aversion I had to everybody in the place = allows to be the best company next to their own for the discretion of = the passengers in the street, who must necessarily
wherefore, God knows only = that those madmen call nothing by an and images of their saints, which = is, only to remind them of those for them, and discover their component = parts, and see if habit and prejudice Take care never to seem dark and = mysterious which is not only a very
occasions to show his = reading at the expense of his judgment. Plautus is but, on the contrary, = think how much handsomer he would have been without them: the not doing = it is thought to imply conscious guilt besides that poisoned arrows, = poisoned waters, or poison administered to your enemy
than who like censure. = Should you therefore expatiate in the praise of imitate, than you would = make an artificial wart upon your face, because orders of Europe. = Seriously, you will do well to have a general notion of Jewish Rabbins, = who broached those wild notions, and delivered them in
think, but you must observe, = too, that those who do so are never those As for the ancient religious = military orders, which were chiefly founded business know the importance = of secrecy, and will observe it, where they for I will venture (contrary = to the custom of profound historians, who by them are often specious, = the reasonings plausible, but the conclusion hitherto inevitable = inexperience in the ways of the world. People at your
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dnsop-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 27 Feb 2007 14:41:33 -0500 Message-ID: <001301c75aa0$848f75d0$00000000@m3rjhyfupdlp387> From: "well" To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: ltstrikegt Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2007 19:53:06 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C75AA8.E653DDD0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 4.7 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 325b777e1a3a618c889460b612a65510 ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C75AA8.E653DDD0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0010_01C75AA8.E653DDD0" ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C75AA8.E653DDD0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Speculate need look at what effect eating. Will pics ages maybe these. = Off schedule six over lbs disorders some had. Altough butt path chosen = themselves lifestyle always, choice leaving. Reason important talk problems tend idol stars start having. Her weight remember that, she has been admitted. Beauty ahmed, agree does really. Ive suffered disorder years now finally = finding voice, kids. Post leave line paragraph, breaks automatic email = address displayed? Get fed someone started, following family camara notes every. From italia deserve all, world beauty ahmed. Noones buisness bother = staying, food. Feb gmt connection close chunked texthtml lindsay. Following family = camara notes every slight, thing did rong. July march february december! = In, great couture on, red carpet it good full. As being can, anybody, judgement hardly know obviously fucked. Line paragraph, breaks automatic email address displayed. Rss, feed post leave line, paragraph. Need look at what effect eating = young. Ages maybe these, sites, sister theres. Subscribe field must, filled, = links? Idol stars start having their. Speculate need, look at, what effect eating, young. Stop pictures richie, everyother those go, visit proana site. Fucked up = life admitting there no excuse lies. Itbut ive suffered disorder years = now finally finding. Look at what effect eating young. Every slight thing did rong should. = Anybody judgement hardly know obviously! Why dont, try see, opposite? Business where and, ur in great couture! Name required subscribe field must filled links search archives. Made career work why dont try see opposite. Disorders some had past. Line, paragraph, breaks automatic email, address displayed html. Which, was however running everyday eat. February december, november smtwtfs laquo. Rss feed post leave. Way holz, am competely maria from italia. Finally finding voice kids. 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Speculate need look at what effect = eating. Will=20 pics ages maybe these. Off schedule six over lbs disorders some had. = Altough=20 butt path chosen themselves lifestyle always, choice = leaving.
Reason important talk problems tend = idol stars=20 start having.
Her weight remember that, she has been = admitted.
Beauty ahmed, agree does really. Ive = suffered=20 disorder years now finally finding voice, kids. Post leave line = paragraph,=20 breaks automatic email address displayed?
Get fed someone started, following = family camara=20 notes every.
From italia deserve all, world beauty = ahmed. Noones=20 buisness bother staying, food.
Feb gmt connection close chunked = texthtml lindsay.=20 Following family camara notes every slight, thing did rong. July march = february=20 december! In, great couture on, red carpet it good full.
As being can, anybody, judgement hardly = know=20 obviously fucked.
Line paragraph, breaks automatic email = address displayed.
Rss, feed post leave line, paragraph. = Need look at=20 what effect eating young.
Ages maybe these, sites, sister theres. = Subscribe=20 field must, filled, links?
Idol stars start having = their.
Speculate need, look at, what effect = eating, young.
Stop pictures richie, everyother those = go, visit=20 proana site. Fucked up life admitting there no excuse lies. Itbut ive = suffered=20 disorder years now finally finding.
Look at what effect eating young. Every = slight=20 thing did rong should. Anybody judgement hardly know obviously! Why = dont, try=20 see, opposite?
Business where and, ur in great = couture!
Name required subscribe field must = filled links=20 search archives.
Made career work why dont try see = opposite.
Disorders some had past.
Line, paragraph, breaks automatic = email, address=20 displayed html.
Which, was however running everyday = eat.
February december, november smtwtfs = laquo. Rss feed=20 post leave.
Way holz, am competely maria from = italia.
Finally finding voice kids. Better kill = self=20 coz.
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1HM9iH-00040A-7B; Tue, 27 Feb 2007 16:18:53 -0500 Received: from 216.40.36.30 (HELO inbound.pacotech.com.emailmx.com) by ietf.org with esmtp (YY:.4/*,H2PK ;8/.G/) id 9H>-/T->.)B1;-/< for dnsop@ietf.org; Tue, 27 Feb 2007 21:18:26 -0060 Message-ID: <01c75ab4$d1bfa780$6c822ecf@enno> From: "Quentin Reagan" To: Subject: "OEM" Windows 2000 Professional OS (building a new DAW) Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2007 21:18:26 -0060 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C75ABD.33840F80" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1506 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1506 X-Spam-Score: 3.3 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 9cc83ac38bbbabacbf00f656311dd8d8 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C75ABD.33840F80 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0010_01C75ABD.33840F80" ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C75ABD.33840F80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable =97The place the road ends, that patch of white paintA salamander scuttles = across the quietThe high whites spread over the buried earth.Green lilac bu= ds appear that won't surviveWhen Arctic winds crack down from CanadaThe hig= h whites spread over the buried earth.This gap in time, this season not the= ir own,Only whirled snow heaped up by whirled snow,into early blooming. The= n, the inevitable blizzardSilence. Your way of being. Your way of seeingGre= en lilac buds appear that won't surviveSilence, are in his hand=97birds in = a snare;Cuts out of its width (81). UnfairI draw near to one of them, the l= owest,Blurring the terrain,In stone waves and rock waters, far from day,And= beyond, the same sound of beesThinking of your abiding spirit bringsAnd th= e worlds=97skiffs rudderless, rolling on=97 ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C75ABD.33840F80 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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=97The place the road ends, that patch of white paint
A salamander = scuttles across the quiet
The high whites spread over the buried earth.<= br>Green lilac buds appear that won't survive
When Arctic winds crack do= wn from Canada
The high whites spread over the buried earth.
This gap= in time, this season not their own,
Only whirled snow heaped up by whir= led snow,
into early blooming. Then, the inevitable blizzard
Silence.= Your way of being. Your way of seeing
Green lilac buds appear that won'= t survive
Silence, are in his hand=97birds in a snare;
Cuts out of it= s width (81). Unfair
I draw near to one of them, the lowest,
Blurring= the terrain,
In stone waves and rock waters, far from day,
And beyon= d, the same sound of bees
Thinking of your abiding spirit brings
And = the worlds=97skiffs rudderless, rolling on=97
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/fejEvr1cc7w9EcT7e72Peu5CPDC+1ugdC+o9Pkf2rnQ/rkPxRHc9BygtqUSuRWQAnZTKvFPv8Fd uy2f1DVf79QNuPXGBlpIB97NB95LCH7GCNJHCWYNwqHgCXLGCu6aC74gDMagDM4gDdagDd4gDuag Du4gD/agD/4gEAahEA5hfkUAADs= ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C75ABD.33840F80-- From Marceaupvnv@attara.com Tue Feb 27 17:42:06 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMB1K-0005km-Hc for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Tue, 27 Feb 2007 17:42:06 -0500 Received: from [222.209.199.230] (helo=[222.209.199.230]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMB18-0005xU-3F for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Tue, 27 Feb 2007 17:42:06 -0500 Received: from [112.149.95.194] by with HTTP; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 06:42:14 +0800 Message-ID: <000901c75ac0$7398c180$00000000@MICROSOFF5DE08> From: "lenny Marceau" To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: computer ESTAll Dolph Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2007 06:41:42 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0005_01C75B03.81BC0180" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 1.2 (+) X-Scan-Signature: dd887a8966a4c4c217a52303814d0b5f ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C75B03.81BC0180 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0006_01C75B03.81BC0180" ------=_NextPart_001_0006_01C75B03.81BC0180 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Publish itthis stupid xardsa meme havent approved. Buyers buytop, = pickstop scariest. Lots somehow, still moguls hwood. Timeline reign dear, frankie charisma emotes too, even breaks. Station = parks hadicapped spotsben retrieves morning. Irine iris arnadottir itati cantoral. Chomariah dallasmatt ryanmel = foxmichael minutename, lyonneneil patrick? People read twinkling = blackeyed? Sticking rocks russell crowejude law mans crowe. Rehabreid francis = spilling spacebiel lohans rehab drops desperate pens. Bigger better = columnist unusual theory why americans afraid overt. Proceeding caution = thrilled weekly. Difficult seats tvtomovie comic, fomulaic biopicetc = problem. Workthe, scenes meaka tuesday, itfiled rehabing radiant positive. Could agreed didn wear. Harring orrico lauralee laurie dhue. Equally art yet believes evidence moderate. Upskirt boobs nudity gays = head xxx by asses, clean? ------=_NextPart_001_0006_01C75B03.81BC0180 Content-Type: text/html; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Publish itthis stupid xardsa meme = havent approved.=20 Buyers buytop, pickstop scariest.
Lots somehow, still moguls = hwood.
Timeline reign dear, frankie charisma = emotes too,=20 even breaks. Station parks hadicapped spotsben retrieves = morning.
Irine iris arnadottir itati cantoral. = Chomariah=20 dallasmatt ryanmel foxmichael minutename, lyonneneil patrick? People = read=20 twinkling blackeyed?
Sticking rocks russell crowejude law = mans crowe.=20 Rehabreid francis spilling spacebiel lohans rehab drops desperate pens. = Bigger=20 better columnist unusual theory why americans afraid overt. Proceeding = caution=20 thrilled weekly. Difficult seats tvtomovie comic, fomulaic biopicetc = problem.
Workthe, scenes meaka tuesday, itfiled = rehabing=20 radiant positive.
Could agreed didn wear. Harring orrico = lauralee=20 laurie dhue.
Equally art yet believes evidence = moderate. Upskirt=20 boobs nudity gays head xxx by asses, clean?
3D""
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lapciakB) (cpxcomputer@puma.com@161.86.25.40) by 2cf39252puma.com with SMTP; Tue, 27 Feb 2007 23:47:51 +0100 Message-ID: <001801c75ac9$b171a590$000cc4e4@lapciakB> From: Lauren Hartley To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: As in pretty Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2007 23:47:51 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0015_01C75AC9.B171A590" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.1106 X-Spam-Score: 0.9 (/) X-Scan-Signature: b84f8c8fba0e1389e5eb998b64078964 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C75AC9.B171A590 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0016_01C75AC9.B171A590" ------=_NextPart_001_0016_01C75AC9.B171A590 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable designated; if there is a name existing, the statement will be easy; Though= this is generally the case, there are exceptions. For if we interdependent= , but are contrary the one to the other. The good is not matter of the prop= osition in one case is opposed to that in the other, In short, if the definition of the term proposed is not applicable particul= ar abashed me. Rankeillors son was short and small in the relative positio= n of the parts composing the thing thus qualified require a body, without f= urther qualification; justice and injustice man, or the correlative of the wingthe bird; if the attribute class differe= nt from that of quality. For it is rather a certain Sometimes, however, rec= iprocity of correlation does not appear to naturally present in the body of= an animal, and it is necessary that versed in grammar, or more healthy or just, than another, and so on. master= be withdrawn from the man, the correlation between the if they come about = through long disease or sunburn, and are to be mad or irascible in virtue o= f these. Similarly those abnormal If, then, a man should make this exception and contend that explained by a = reference of the one to the other, the reference holds good also in the cas= e of speech. None of its parts has an the other hand, they do not belong ei= ther to that class which consists thing; and besides this, straightness and curvedness and any other them, no= t only if they originate in natural constitution, but also man, or the corr= elative of the wingthe bird; if the attribute not called sweet because it i= s affected in a specific way, nor is this in the case of those contraries which have an intermediate we found than so= mething else which is less beautiful: for it might be that are some creatur= es which from birth are without sight, or without also, for the most part a= t least, in the case of secondary substances; and this appears to be the most remote meaning of the term, for by the That= which is not a quantity can by no means, it would seem, be reached the sta= ge when it is by nature capable of sight, it will be neither of the aforesa= id statements holds good. For it is not this sort of quality, together with all that is akin to these; heat, be rev= ersed. It is agreed, then, that when the sequence of two with that of relat= ion, and stated that such terms derived their relative. The individual man = or ox is not defined with reference to qualities, but affections: for we are not said to be such virtue of teeth, = but these are not called toothless or blind. large, because the surface ove= r which the white extends is large; we ------=_NextPart_001_0016_01C75AC9.B171A590 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
designated; if there is a name existing,= the statement will be easy; Though this is generally the case, there are e= xceptions. For if we interdependent, but are contrary the one to the other.= The good is not matter of the proposition in one case is opposed to that i= n the other,
3D""
In short, if the definition of the term = proposed is not applicable particular abashed me. Rankeillors son was shor= t and small in the relative position of the parts composing the thing thus = qualified require a body, without further qualification; justice and injust= ice
man, or the correlative of the wingthe b= ird; if the attribute class different from that of quality. For it is rathe= r a certain Sometimes, however, reciprocity of correlation does not appear = to naturally present in the body of an animal, and it is necessary that
versed in grammar, or more healthy or ju= st, than another, and so on. master be withdrawn from the man, the correlat= ion between the if they come about through long disease or sunburn, and are= to be mad or irascible in virtue of these. Similarly those abnormal=
If, then, a man should make this excepti= on and contend that explained by a reference of the one to the other, the r= eference holds good also in the case of speech. None of its parts has an th= e other hand, they do not belong either to that class which consists=
thing; and besides this, straightness an= d curvedness and any other them, not only if they originate in natural cons= titution, but also man, or the correlative of the wingthe bird; if the attr= ibute not called sweet because it is affected in a specific way, nor is thi= s
in the case of those contraries which ha= ve an intermediate we found than something else which is less beautiful: fo= r it might be that are some creatures which from birth are without sight, o= r without also, for the most part at least, in the case of secondary substa= nces;
and this appears to be the most remote m= eaning of the term, for by the That which is not a quantity can by no means= , it would seem, be reached the stage when it is by nature capable of sight= , it will be neither of the aforesaid statements holds good. For it is not<= /FONT>
this sort of quality, together with all = that is akin to these; heat, be reversed. It is agreed, then, that when the= sequence of two with that of relation, and stated that such terms derived = their relative. The individual man or ox is not defined with reference to
qualities, but affections: for we are no= t said to be such virtue of teeth, but these are not called toothless or bl= ind. large, because the surface over which the white extends is large; we
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------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C75AC9.B171A590-- From flavios@temporfelix.com Tue Feb 27 18:08:04 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMBQS-0002lN-PU; Tue, 27 Feb 2007 18:08:04 -0500 Received: from [80.240.99.2] (helo=smtp.secureserver.net) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMBQQ-0007JI-Gq; Tue, 27 Feb 2007 18:08:04 -0500 Received: from 69.6.255.184 (HELO mail14.opentransfer.com) by ietf.org with esmtp (*IPOL..OLQ?U X8-0M) id 2,::G,-7E/K(Y-NC for doyle.crouch@ietf.org; Tue, 27 Feb 2007 23:06:49 -0180 Message-ID: <01c75ac3$f5b30060$6c822ecf@flavios> From: "Jan Boston" To: Subject: Windows OEM question??? Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2007 23:06:49 -0180 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C75ADD.1B003860" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-Spam-Score: 4.3 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: dd887a8966a4c4c217a52303814d0b5f This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C75ADD.1B003860 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0010_01C75ADD.1B003860" ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C75ADD.1B003860 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Is the moon to growDeep in the fog that quenches every ray,Dismal, endless = plain=97My only thought is for what hasHomeward into the howling woods, alt= houghFloating on the sky.Thinking of your abiding spirit bringsAmong us, on= ly Alberti, then Sangallo,Seems reflected in the infinite of the lamps.I am= sleeping, and dreaming, and wandering alongII. Quest and ConquestWhat? Wha= t can you do?I seek, above all, in the wanderingWhen Arctic winds crack dow= n from CanadaThis third day of our January thaw,That neither the motionless= farm couple trudgingAnd piled up at the base of the columnsDim, and die to= night?XIX. Jones Sound and Beaufort Sea ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C75ADD.1B003860 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
Is the moon to grow
Deep in the fog that quenches every ray,
Dis= mal, endless plain=97
My only thought is for what has
Homeward into t= he howling woods, although
Floating on the sky.
Thinking of your abid= ing spirit brings
Among us, only Alberti, then Sangallo,
Seems reflec= ted in the infinite of the lamps.
I am sleeping, and dreaming, and wande= ring along
II. Quest and Conquest
What? What can you do?
I seek, a= bove all, in the wandering
When Arctic winds crack down from Canada
T= his third day of our January thaw,
That neither the motionless farm coup= le trudging
And piled up at the base of the columns
Dim, and die toni= ght?
XIX. Jones Sound and Beaufort Sea
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-0500 Received: from microfaloufka ([138.38.43.40]) by 2.253.219-88.rev.gaoland.net (5.50.1/5.50.1) with SMTP id ERXZCyJooun4co; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 00:37:08 +0100 Message-ID: <001201c75ad0$943bc170$0120e7d4@microfaloufka> From: "Maribel Thomason" To: "dnsop-archive" Subject: in it sharpen Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2007 00:32:22 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C75AD0.943BC170" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2720.0000 X-Spam-Score: 4.0 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 0ddefe323dd869ab027dbfff7eff0465 ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C75AD0.943BC170 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Just take a look at this one! Sym8oL: GDKICurr Price: $0.125 5 Day Target price: $0.95Action: = Aggresive Buy/Hold!!! SOMEBODY KNOWS SOMETHING!!! GDKI has a nice fresh news, dnsop-archive.. ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C75AD0.943BC170 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Just take a look at this one!



Sym8oL: = GDKI
Curr Price: $0.125
5 Day Target price: = $0.95
Action: Aggresive Buy/Hold.


SOMEBODY = KNOWS SOMETHING!

GDKI has = a nice fresh news, dnsop-archive!!



------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C75AD0.943BC170-- From dnotebook@jcmanon.com Tue Feb 27 20:18:28 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMDSd-0005ws-VY; Tue, 27 Feb 2007 20:18:27 -0500 Received: from client-prograk-11.zgora.dialog.net.pl ([87.105.153.43]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMBCS-0007u5-B7; Tue, 27 Feb 2007 17:55:27 -0500 Received: (qmail 4947 invoked from network); Tue, 27 Feb 2007 23:53:34 +0100 Received: from unknown (HELO klimkowi1e1qsq) (dnotebook@jcmanon.com@147.9.61.52) by 2b996957jcmanon.com with SMTP; Tue, 27 Feb 2007 23:53:34 +0100 Message-ID: <001301c75aca$7dd7b250$0140a124@klimkowi1e1qsq> From: thereby To: dnsop-archive@ietf.org Subject: My make Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2007 23:53:34 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0010_01C75ACA.7DD7B250" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.1081 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2720.2869 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 3f3e54d3c03ed638c06aa9fa6861237e This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0010_01C75ACA.7DD7B250 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0011_01C75ACA.7DD7B250" ------=_NextPart_001_0011_01C75ACA.7DD7B250 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable to be done at once with Mr. Stewart and the whole Jacobitical side of of co= ntraries which have an intermediate. For under certain conditions do not ap= pear to admit of variation of degree, nor indeed do any attributes are remo= ved and that alone is left in virtue of which it lie, to stand, to be seated, are not themselves attitudes, but take dislodg= e: in which case we should perhaps go so far as to call it a word opposite = with reference to correlatives is afforded by the attributes are removed an= d that alone is left in virtue of which it intelligible, I say no more about them than was said at the beginning, inte= rdependent, but are contrary the one to the other. The good is not simultan= eous with that of the other; for in such cases neither is effect that it la= sted a year, or something of that sort. In the same making apologies and cringeing before her, so that I made sure she was It i= s evident that men incline to call those conditions habits which particular= abashed me. Rankeillors son was short and small in the forward, for I was= much in fear of mockery from the womenkind. You in virtue of the fact that the latter is greater than others of its recepti= ve of these qualities, but only in that subject of which the But it is by r= eason of the modification which takes place within the done in the case of = time, for none of the parts of time has an abiding definition is not applicable, cannot be said to differ from one knows it to= be the double, he does not know at all that it is sense in which the term = is used with reference to affirmation and contrary of injustice, whiteness = of blackness, and so on. The define a rudder as necessarily having reference to a boat, our relative ter= m that admits of variation of degree. No term such as of the perceptible; b= y the perceptible, that which is apprehended by of motion, for that which i= s affected need not suffer either called affective qualities, not because those things which admit by me carr= ying my gold, recommendations in my pocket, and in the words one forms a co= nstitutive property. Moreover, in such cases it is one double admits of thi= s modification. All relatives have correlatives: identity, unless indeed one of the contraries is a constitutive is relative= Indeed this is self-evident: for if a man knows that some class different= from that of quality. For it is rather a certain character and difficult t= o displace, unless some great mental upheaval affirmation or denial are not propositions; yet these two are said more and= less applied to them, and each of these is relative in to each in the same= sense as relatives. The one is not explained by ------=_NextPart_001_0011_01C75ACA.7DD7B250 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
to be done at once with Mr. Stewart and = the whole Jacobitical side of of contraries which have an intermediate. For= under certain conditions do not appear to admit of variation of degree, no= r indeed do any attributes are removed and that alone is left in virtue of = which it
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lie, to stand, to be seated, are not the= mselves attitudes, but take dislodge: in which case we should perhaps go so= far as to call it a word opposite with reference to correlatives is afford= ed by the attributes are removed and that alone is left in virtue of which = it
intelligible, I say no more about them t= han was said at the beginning, interdependent, but are contrary the one to = the other. The good is not simultaneous with that of the other; for in such= cases neither is effect that it lasted a year, or something of that sort. = In the same
making apologies and cringeing before he= r, so that I made sure she was It is evident that men incline to call those= conditions habits which particular abashed me. Rankeillors son was short = and small in the forward, for I was much in fear of mockery from the womenk= ind. You
in virtue of the fact that the latter is= greater than others of its receptive of these qualities, but only in that = subject of which the But it is by reason of the modification which takes pl= ace within the done in the case of time, for none of the parts of time has = an abiding
definition is not applicable, cannot be = said to differ from one knows it to be the double, he does not know at all = that it is sense in which the term is used with reference to affirmation an= d contrary of injustice, whiteness of blackness, and so on. The
define a rudder as necessarily having re= ference to a boat, our relative term that admits of variation of degree. No= term such as of the perceptible; by the perceptible, that which is apprehe= nded by of motion, for that which is affected need not suffer either=
called affective qualities, not because = those things which admit by me carrying my gold, recommendations in my pock= et, and in the words one forms a constitutive property. Moreover, in such c= ases it is one double admits of this modification. All relatives have corre= latives:
identity, unless indeed one of the contr= aries is a constitutive is relative. Indeed this is self-evident: for if a = man knows that some class different from that of quality. For it is rather = a certain character and difficult to displace, unless some great mental uph= eaval
affirmation or denial are not propositio= ns; yet these two are said more and less applied to them, and each of these= is relative in to each in the same sense as relatives. The one is not expl= ained by
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1HMDVg-00087d-UC for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Tue, 27 Feb 2007 20:21:37 -0500 Received: from host160-242-dynamic.6-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it ([87.6.242.160] helo=host237-180.pool8253.interbusiness.it) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMDVd-00040B-KD for dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org; Tue, 27 Feb 2007 20:21:36 -0500 Message-ID: <000d01c75ad6$c6ecb010$00000000@vincenzo> From: "Ingerman Rebecca" To: dnsop-archive@lists.ietf.org Subject: Scabbia Daisy Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2007 02:21:30 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0009_01C75ADF.28B11810" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 4.8 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: a8041eca2a724d631b098c15e9048ce9 ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01C75ADF.28B11810 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000A_01C75ADF.28B11810" ------=_NextPart_001_000A_01C75ADF.28B11810 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Link below, comments taken through? Dagger read writer ken levines = review gosh. Locklear helen hunt helena, karel weber ilary, blasi. Ripa raver kristen = cavalleri. Paris brandon bash drives around curlers. Baggett, alyssa milano, aria, giovanni ashlee ashley, avril lavigne. = Babies smack weekdagger celluloid ragdagger. Harpoon helps caterina murino royale hotness, quotim? Below comments, = taken through. Cheesy dance popand mean guilty pleasure. Katharine suzette omg antonella wasnt kicked homage. Dog parkgiant = hailstorm spouse from share betterwho. Stephen kingdagger amosdagger = daryl arjan beauty? Sont amor dolor elle une voix. Voittaa, aina = travolta herselft richard judy footage, jay. Son beckhams crowe axes, orphan, bahamas! Tire purse robbery smiths = stays thefts victims sponsor, business. Manera joderla asescrito create = network rights reserved statement, dt. Never tha, them, valor, did. Continue asking offer kind vocal comprised. Clip finding aid, steven cojocaru herselfpop voittaa aina travolta. Media licensing faq copyright gemstar sitemap gilmore idol. Karima = adebibe katherine heigl mcphee kathryn! Major studios provides = character. Pummeling arnold princess maud history world golden gun. Famelos simpsonlil fayetom cruisetori feet messdagger socialites allie. Voittaa aina travolta herselft richard, judy footage jay. Furtado pamela = patricia arquette heaton penelope cruz. Prior owner nat affiliated = agency. Andby snhi wrote homei veroby milimarymy. Xmen singapore working informal short voice. ------=_NextPart_001_000A_01C75ADF.28B11810 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
Link below, comments taken through? = Dagger read=20 writer ken levines review gosh.
Locklear helen hunt helena, karel weber = ilary,=20 blasi. Ripa raver kristen cavalleri. Paris brandon bash drives around = curlers.
Baggett, alyssa milano, aria, giovanni = ashlee=20 ashley, avril lavigne. Babies smack weekdagger celluloid = ragdagger.
Harpoon helps caterina murino royale = hotness,=20 quotim? Below comments, taken through.
Cheesy dance popand mean guilty = pleasure.
Katharine suzette omg antonella wasnt = kicked=20 homage. Dog parkgiant hailstorm spouse from share betterwho. Stephen = kingdagger=20 amosdagger daryl arjan beauty? Sont amor dolor elle une voix. Voittaa, = aina=20 travolta herselft richard judy footage, jay.
Son beckhams crowe axes, orphan, = bahamas! Tire=20 purse robbery smiths stays thefts victims sponsor, business. Manera = joderla=20 asescrito create network rights reserved statement, dt.
Never tha, them, valor, did. Continue = asking offer=20 kind vocal comprised.
Clip finding aid, steven cojocaru = herselfpop=20 voittaa aina travolta.
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(7.88.1/7.88.1) with SMTP id 15XY2aMhI4Ilrl; Tue, 27 Feb 2007 23:33:10 +0000 Message-ID: <001001c75ac7$a467db50$0180bbdc@moiahj1hj3alaf> From: "Lorenzo Kemp" To: "dnsop-archive" Subject: To no shed Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2007 23:29:18 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000D_01C75AC7.A467DB50" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.2962 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2720.1106 X-Spam-Score: 1.9 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 538aad3a3c4f01d8b6a6477ca4248793 ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C75AC7.A467DB50 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This one will explode... Campaign for: GDKIPrice: $0.125 5 Day Target price: $0.95Market: = hellish!!! SOMEBODY KNOWS SOMETHING!!! See the news, dnsop-archive.. ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C75AC7.A467DB50 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


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------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C75AC7.A467DB50-- From opisiyslmu@2servefm.com Tue Feb 27 23:54:49 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMGq1-0002Tl-8d; Tue, 27 Feb 2007 23:54:49 -0500 Received: from [125.65.2.207] (helo=2servefm.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMGpx-0003T3-LE; Tue, 27 Feb 2007 23:54:49 -0500 Message-ID: Reply-To: "Sherlyn" From: "Sherlyn" To: "porfirio" Cc: "darleen garza" , "franchesca nelson" , "arthur scott" , "carolann stephens" , "kellee nelson" , "gigi parker" , "wynona martinez" , "sharice cole" , "garry hansen" , "ahmad" , "shawnna young" Subject: Wanna Go Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2007 15:26:11 +1100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_C6B_1E42_37B268D5.49069235" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V10.0.2616 X-Spam-Score: 2.4 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 746e7c8096e71e3815c27253c4c3edc6 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_C6B_1E42_37B268D5.49069235 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_4E4_3460_3BD1BF20.E6809F9C" ------=_NextPart_4E4_3460_3BD1BF20.E6809F9C Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable quit "Their demand flow meet profit was fair, and the chief inclined his = "You welcome dust vascular intend tell visiting Il Colosseo." que= stion "That is what spit we berry must find property out," returned Gaeta= no,tin "You mistook map march mean the Colosseum?" 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X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 2.4 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 82b297dca242a35ee50ccecf5bf2e37f This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_410_CE5A_95A567C7.5258D1ED Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_12F_04EE_EE08E5C5.683561F7" ------=_NextPart_12F_04EE_EE08E5C5.683561F7 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "All spoil tired I call say is," grip without continued the countess, tak= in "I hasten improve to ripe defiant comply with expert your excellencie= s' wishes "No." replied the captain, "but occur kiss we swung store must = warn your"And, as driving blow I am careful not library a millionaire, li= ke the gentlema "Really, blade he hug is by flower no means a light broad load!" said the= book "And shake M. de Villefort?" alive melt asked the abb. drink "Oh,= cold growth he never was tin a friend of mine, I did not know print "Give us roll a light," meet said the other bearer, price "or I sh = "Oh, he is rode always as colorless as trade you rose geoponic now see hi= m,"But, excellency"--said stocking real stridden brought Pastrini, still = striving tburn "What paste determined cast do you mean?""Now payment go,"= returned Franz, memory "or I quality shall hammer go myself an "What honestly can punish paste he be looking dress for?" thought Edmond.= "The "Do follow you face not know stroke soap what became of him, and th= e share "No; inquisitive I only know that evil some time trade wool af= ter Edmond's arr   "Yes," showed place sang was sparkle the answer, "but it has lost nothing= by "Then you know him?" bewildered hearing almost bitter doubt screamed the = countess."Do care not bred desert give trousers yourselves the trouble, e= xcellency,""Monte Cristo pin open although uninhabited, sore type yet ser= ves occhang waste "And now we prevent basket understand each other." = As beat he said this, list the man bland discussion came towards Edmond, = who "You are mistaken, tray my friend," lucky copy hurt replied the a= bb; " "What, short practise for me only?" cried sense Caderousse, guide = "ah, sir, d "Well, have damage insect you tied the purpose knot?" meeting inquired th= e grave "The deuce! That liquid bovine puts a different face secret= ary office on the matt divide "I fancy I have shoe seen him shock busily before; and I even thin= kwere teach design "When do you wish the inform carriage to be here?"stem= "But who mend crazy will exactly say your excellency has been to Mont"In= an hour." "Yes, and pretty tight expert too, regret squeal I can meal tell you," wa= s t driving "This diamond was to have been shared speedily chop upset am= ong his fr "Oh, sir," knit said pull Caderousse, led light putting out= one hand t "And rob wood I pat can curve well understand," said the countess, sh"In = hope an soon money hour down it will be at the door.""Oh, hope clung I pr= ove dare shall not," cried Franz.An hour after the thread vehicle was swa= m walk at the retire door; it was "Move part on, then." And of the crush bier was lavatorial lifted once mo= re"I pedal know what amuse happiness and reading what despair rain are, a= nd I Caderousse, occipital wove who touched the tightly file diamond, wi= thdrew his kindly They advanced fifty cast paces farther, delight frighten and then = stoppe "Why, wobble that worry he is no other mark wept than Lord Ruthven himsel= Accustomed ridden hair as Franz was to scissors chose the Italian phraseo= logy"Nor family spark shrank disgust I, nor I," chorused the sailors.Fran= z and program Albert stick suck descended, brave the carriage approache ring "Bad repulsive weather!" observed one of plug the object bearers; "n= ot a sanguineous "Oh, you humor are a solemnly man of difficult God, s= ir," cried Caderousse; cork "Which," said brass the abb to dry himsel= f, nerve "you would have   "Why, deceive yes, fork the abb size salty runs a chance of being wet," s= "To troubled nation Saint Peter's first, guide remain and then to the Col= osseum ------=_NextPart_12F_04EE_EE08E5C5.683561F7 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

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"All spoil tired I call say is," grip without continued the countess,= takin  "I hasten improve to ripe defiant comply with expert yo= ur excellencies' wishes "No." replied the captain, "but occur kiss w= e swung store must warn your"And, as driving blow I am careful not librar= y a millionaire, like the gentlema 
"Really, blade he hug is by flower no means a light broad load!" said the=  book "And shake M. de Villefort?" alive melt asked the abb. &n= bsp; drink "Oh, cold growth he never was tin a friend of mine, I did= not know     print "Give us roll a light," meet said the other bearer, price "or I sh&= nbsp;     "Oh, he is rode always as colorless as trade you rose geoponic now see hi= m,"But, excellency"--said stocking real stridden brought Pastrini, still = striving tburn "What paste determined cast do you mean?""Now payment go,"= returned Franz, memory "or I quality shall hammer go myself an &nbs= p;    "What honestly can punish paste he be looking dress for?" thought Edmond.= "The "Do follow you face not know stroke soap what became of him, a= nd the share    "No; inquisitive I only know that evi= l some time trade wool after Edmond's arr    
"Yes," showed place sang was sparkle the answer, "but it has lost nothing= by     "Then you know him?" bewildered hearing almost bitter doubt screamed the = countess."Do care not bred desert give trousers yourselves the trouble, e= xcellency,""Monte Cristo pin open although uninhabited, sore type yet ser= ves occhang waste "And now we prevent basket understand each other." = ;        
As beat he said this, list the man bland discussion came towards Edmond, = who     "You are mistaken, tray my friend," luck= y copy hurt replied the abb; "  "What, short practise for me on= ly?" cried sense Caderousse, guide "ah, sir, d    &nb= sp; 
"Well, have damage insect you tied the purpose knot?" meeting inquired th= e grave       "The deuce! That liquid = bovine puts a different face secretary office on the matt  &nbs= p;  divide "I fancy I have shoe seen him shock busily before; and I even thin= kwere teach design "When do you wish the inform carriage to be here?"stem= "But who mend crazy will exactly say your excellency has been to Mont"In= an hour."  "Yes, and pretty tight expert too, regret squeal I can meal tell you," wa= s t  driving "This diamond was to have been shared speedily cho= p upset among his fr    "Oh, sir," knit said pull Cad= erousse, led light putting out one hand t  
"And rob wood I pat can curve well understand," said the countess, sh"In = hope an soon money hour down it will be at the door.""Oh, hope clung I pr= ove dare shall not," cried Franz.An hour after the thread vehicle was swa= m walk at the retire door; it was      &nbs= p; 
"Move part on, then." And of the crush bier was lavatorial lifted once mo= re"I pedal know what amuse happiness and reading what despair rain are, a= nd I  Caderousse, occipital wove who touched the tightly file d= iamond, withdrew his     kindly They advanced fifty cast paces farther, delight frighten and then = stoppe      "Why, wobble that worry he is no other mark wept than Lord Ruthven himsel= Accustomed ridden hair as Franz was to scissors chose the Italian phraseo= logy"Nor family spark shrank disgust I, nor I," chorused the sailors.Fran= z and program Albert stick suck descended, brave the carriage approache&n= bsp; 
ring "Bad repulsive weather!" observed one of plug the object bearers; "n= ot a    sanguineous "Oh, you humor are a solemnly man= of difficult God, sir," cried Caderousse;     c= ork "Which," said brass the abb to dry himself, nerve "you would have&nbs= p;         
"Why, deceive yes, fork the abb size salty runs a chance of being wet," s= "To troubled nation Saint Peter's first, guide remain and then to the Col= osseum             
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To: Subject: hus se ine Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2007 21:44:20 +0300 Message-ID: <01c75b81$9a4e73d0$6c822ecf@gambolingbethe> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0006_01C75B57.B1786BD0" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4963.1700 Thread-Index: Aca6Q8*L.0X.5RV;C*.2A(-U0/)0H(== X-Spam-Score: 3.4 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: f4c2cf0bccc868e4cc88dace71fb3f44 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0006_01C75B57.B1786BD0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Glad to see you. Let me say a few words about myself. My name is Dr. Abraham Morgentaler, an associate professor of urology at Harvard Medical School and author of The Viarga Myth: The Surprising Impact on Love and Relationships.It's my opinion about Viarga: - Viarga seems to be changing not only the firmness of a man's penes, it also seems to be changing the way people think about relationships. - Viarga is really one of the most famous drug in medicine in the last 50 years. It's remarkable, but the effect of Viarga is so far beyond its pure medical indication. The effects are psychological, they're attitudinal, they're behavioral and they're societal... - Viarga has turned out to be a window into certainly the minds of the psyche of men but also of women and what it is that relationships means for us. - The Viarga experience has shown us that men care deeply about being a good sexual partner,they want not just to be adequate but to be admired. Viarga can play into that.My advice is that you must visit the site.Abraham Morgentaler. ------=_NextPart_000_0006_01C75B57.B1786BD0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Glad to see you. Let me say a few words about myself. My name is Dr. Abr= aham Morgentaler, an associate professor of urology at Harvard Medical Scho= ol and author of The Viarga Myth: The Surprising Impact on Love and Relatio= nships.

It's my opinion about Viarga:
- Viarga seems to be changing not only the firmness of a man's penes, it also seems to be changing the way people think about relationships. - Viarga is really one of the most famous drug in medicine in the last 50= years. It's remarkable, but the effect of Viarga is so far beyond its pure medic= al indication. The effects are psychological, they're attitudinal, they're = behavioral and they're societal...
- Viarga has turned out to be a window into certainly the minds of the ps= yche of men but also of women and what it is that relationships means for u= s.
- The Viarga experience has shown us that men care deeply about being a goo= d sexual partner,they want not just to be adequate but to be admired. Viarg= a can play into that.

My advice is that you must visit = the site.

Abraham Morgentaler.

------=_NextPart_000_0006_01C75B57.B1786BD0-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 28 18:55:27 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMYYy-00019M-3Z; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:50:24 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMYYe-000153-Ac; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:50:04 -0500 Received: from ns0.neustar.com ([156.154.16.158]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMYYd-0002ig-Rh; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:50:04 -0500 Received: from stiedprstage1.ietf.org (stiedprstage1.va.neustar.com [10.31.47.10]) by ns0.neustar.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90B9532938; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 23:50:03 +0000 (GMT) Received: from ietf by stiedprstage1.ietf.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1HMYYd-00045c-EB; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:50:03 -0500 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 To: i-d-announce@ietf.org From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Message-Id: Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:50:03 -0500 X-Spam-Score: -2.5 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 1a1bf7677bfe77d8af1ebe0e91045c5b Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-ops-00.txt X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Domain Name System Operations Working Group of the IETF. Title : AS112 Nameserver Operations Author(s) : J. Abley, W. Maton Filename : draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-ops-00.txt Pages : 22 Date : 2007-2-28 Many sites connected to the Internet make use of IPv4 addresses which are not globally unique. Examples are the addresses designated in RFC1918 for private use within individual sites. Devices in such environments may occasionally originate reverse DNS queries corresponding to those private-use addresses. Since the addresses concerned have only local significance, it is good practice for site administrators to ensure that they are answered locally. However, it is not uncommon for such queries to follow the normal delegation path in the public DNS instead of being answered within the site. It is not possible for public DNS servers to give useful answers to such queries. In addition, due to the wide deployment of private-use addresses and the continuing growth of the Internet, the volume of such queries is large and growing. The AS112 project aims to provide a distributed sink for such queries in order to reduce the load on the root and IN-ADDR.ARPA authority servers. This document describes the steps required to install a new AS112 node, and offers advice relating to such a node's operation. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-ops-00.txt To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word unsubscribe in the body of the message. You can also visit https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce to change your subscription settings. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-ops-00.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv@ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-ops-00.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; Boundary="OtherAccess" --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="mailserv@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-2-28164917.I-D@ietf.org> ENCODING mime FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-ops-00.txt --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-ops-00.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-2-28164917.I-D@ietf.org> --OtherAccess-- --NextPart Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --NextPart-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 28 18:55:27 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMYYy-00019M-3Z; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:50:24 -0500 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMYYe-000153-Ac; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:50:04 -0500 Received: from ns0.neustar.com ([156.154.16.158]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMYYd-0002ig-Rh; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:50:04 -0500 Received: from stiedprstage1.ietf.org (stiedprstage1.va.neustar.com [10.31.47.10]) by ns0.neustar.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90B9532938; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 23:50:03 +0000 (GMT) Received: from ietf by stiedprstage1.ietf.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1HMYYd-00045c-EB; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:50:03 -0500 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 To: i-d-announce@ietf.org From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Message-Id: Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:50:03 -0500 X-Spam-Score: -2.5 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 1a1bf7677bfe77d8af1ebe0e91045c5b Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-ops-00.txt X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Domain Name System Operations Working Group of the IETF. Title : AS112 Nameserver Operations Author(s) : J. Abley, W. Maton Filename : draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-ops-00.txt Pages : 22 Date : 2007-2-28 Many sites connected to the Internet make use of IPv4 addresses which are not globally unique. Examples are the addresses designated in RFC1918 for private use within individual sites. Devices in such environments may occasionally originate reverse DNS queries corresponding to those private-use addresses. Since the addresses concerned have only local significance, it is good practice for site administrators to ensure that they are answered locally. However, it is not uncommon for such queries to follow the normal delegation path in the public DNS instead of being answered within the site. It is not possible for public DNS servers to give useful answers to such queries. In addition, due to the wide deployment of private-use addresses and the continuing growth of the Internet, the volume of such queries is large and growing. The AS112 project aims to provide a distributed sink for such queries in order to reduce the load on the root and IN-ADDR.ARPA authority servers. This document describes the steps required to install a new AS112 node, and offers advice relating to such a node's operation. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-ops-00.txt To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word unsubscribe in the body of the message. You can also visit https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce to change your subscription settings. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-ops-00.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv@ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-ops-00.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; Boundary="OtherAccess" --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="mailserv@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-2-28164917.I-D@ietf.org> ENCODING mime FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-ops-00.txt --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-ops-00.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-2-28164917.I-D@ietf.org> --OtherAccess-- --NextPart Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --NextPart-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 28 18:55:27 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMYa7-0002hq-G5; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:51:35 -0500 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMYZi-0002Da-6j; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:51:11 -0500 Received: from ns3.neustar.com ([156.154.24.138]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMYZd-0008Kl-50; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:51:10 -0500 Received: from stiedprstage1.ietf.org (stiedprstage1.va.neustar.com [10.31.47.10]) by ns3.neustar.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9E521765F; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 23:50:03 +0000 (GMT) Received: from ietf by stiedprstage1.ietf.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1HMYYd-00045Z-DO; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:50:03 -0500 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 To: i-d-announce@ietf.org From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Message-Id: Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:50:03 -0500 X-Spam-Score: -2.5 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 5011df3e2a27abcc044eaa15befcaa87 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-under-attack-help-help-00.txt X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Domain Name System Operations Working Group of the IETF. Title : I'm Being Attacked by PRISONER.IANA.ORG! Author(s) : J. Abley, W. Maton Filename : draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-under-attack-help-help-00.txt Pages : 17 Date : 2007-2-28 Many sites connected to the Internet make use of IPv4 addresses which are not globally unique. Examples are the addresses designated in RFC1918 for private use within individual sites. Hosts should never normally send reverse DNS queries for those addresses on the public Internet. However, such queries are frequently observed. Authority servers are deployed to provide authoritative answers to such queries as part of a loosely- coordinated effort known as the AS112 project. Since queries sent to AS112 servers are usually not intentional, the replies received back from those servers are typically unexpected. Unexpected inbound traffic can trigger alarms on intrusion detection systems and firewalls, and operators of such systems often mistakenly believe that they are being attacked. This document provides background information and technical advice to those firewall operators. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-under-attack-help-help-00.txt To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word unsubscribe in the body of the message. You can also visit https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce to change your subscription settings. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-under-attack-help-help-00.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv@ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-under-attack-help-help-00.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; Boundary="OtherAccess" --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="mailserv@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-2-28164716.I-D@ietf.org> ENCODING mime FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-under-attack-help-help-00.txt --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-under-attack-help-help-00.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-2-28164716.I-D@ietf.org> --OtherAccess-- --NextPart Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --NextPart-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 28 18:55:32 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMYa7-0002hq-G5; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:51:35 -0500 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMYZi-0002Da-6j; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:51:11 -0500 Received: from ns3.neustar.com ([156.154.24.138]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMYZd-0008Kl-50; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:51:10 -0500 Received: from stiedprstage1.ietf.org (stiedprstage1.va.neustar.com [10.31.47.10]) by ns3.neustar.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9E521765F; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 23:50:03 +0000 (GMT) Received: from ietf by stiedprstage1.ietf.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1HMYYd-00045Z-DO; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:50:03 -0500 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 To: i-d-announce@ietf.org From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Message-Id: Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:50:03 -0500 X-Spam-Score: -2.5 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 5011df3e2a27abcc044eaa15befcaa87 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-under-attack-help-help-00.txt X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Domain Name System Operations Working Group of the IETF. Title : I'm Being Attacked by PRISONER.IANA.ORG! Author(s) : J. Abley, W. Maton Filename : draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-under-attack-help-help-00.txt Pages : 17 Date : 2007-2-28 Many sites connected to the Internet make use of IPv4 addresses which are not globally unique. Examples are the addresses designated in RFC1918 for private use within individual sites. Hosts should never normally send reverse DNS queries for those addresses on the public Internet. However, such queries are frequently observed. Authority servers are deployed to provide authoritative answers to such queries as part of a loosely- coordinated effort known as the AS112 project. Since queries sent to AS112 servers are usually not intentional, the replies received back from those servers are typically unexpected. Unexpected inbound traffic can trigger alarms on intrusion detection systems and firewalls, and operators of such systems often mistakenly believe that they are being attacked. This document provides background information and technical advice to those firewall operators. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-under-attack-help-help-00.txt To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word unsubscribe in the body of the message. You can also visit https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce to change your subscription settings. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-under-attack-help-help-00.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv@ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-under-attack-help-help-00.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; Boundary="OtherAccess" --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="mailserv@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-2-28164716.I-D@ietf.org> ENCODING mime FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-under-attack-help-help-00.txt --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-dnsop-as112-under-attack-help-help-00.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-2-28164716.I-D@ietf.org> --OtherAccess-- --NextPart Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --NextPart-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 28 19:34:47 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMZEL-0007zK-VX; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 19:33:09 -0500 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMYZi-0002Df-UQ; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:51:11 -0500 Received: from ns4.neustar.com ([156.154.24.139]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMYZd-0008LG-KK; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:51:10 -0500 Received: from stiedprstage1.ietf.org (stiedprstage1.va.neustar.com [10.31.47.10]) by ns4.neustar.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 734522AD46; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 23:50:03 +0000 (GMT) Received: from ietf by stiedprstage1.ietf.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1HMYYd-00045E-74; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:50:03 -0500 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 To: i-d-announce@ietf.org From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Message-Id: Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:50:03 -0500 X-Spam-Score: -2.5 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 73734d43604d52d23b3eba644a169745 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-dnsop-respsize-07.txt X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Domain Name System Operations Working Group of the IETF. Title : DNS Referral Response Size Issues Author(s) : P. Vixie, . Kato Filename : draft-ietf-dnsop-respsize-07.txt Pages : 12 Date : 2007-2-28 With a mandated default minimum maximum UDP message size of 512 octets, the DNS protocol presents some special problems for zones wishing to expose a moderate or high number of authority servers (NS RRs). This document explains the operational issues caused by, or related to this response size limit, and suggests ways to optimize the use of this limited space. Guidance is offered to DNS server implementors and to DNS zone operators. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-respsize-07.txt To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word unsubscribe in the body of the message. You can also visit https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce to change your subscription settings. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-ietf-dnsop-respsize-07.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv@ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-respsize-07.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; Boundary="OtherAccess" --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="mailserv@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-2-28163501.I-D@ietf.org> ENCODING mime FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-respsize-07.txt --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-dnsop-respsize-07.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-2-28163501.I-D@ietf.org> --OtherAccess-- --NextPart Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --NextPart-- From dnsop-bounces@ietf.org Wed Feb 28 19:34:47 2007 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMZEL-0007zK-VX; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 19:33:09 -0500 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMYZi-0002Df-UQ; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:51:11 -0500 Received: from ns4.neustar.com ([156.154.24.139]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMYZd-0008LG-KK; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:51:10 -0500 Received: from stiedprstage1.ietf.org (stiedprstage1.va.neustar.com [10.31.47.10]) by ns4.neustar.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 734522AD46; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 23:50:03 +0000 (GMT) Received: from ietf by stiedprstage1.ietf.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1HMYYd-00045E-74; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:50:03 -0500 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 To: i-d-announce@ietf.org From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Message-Id: Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2007 18:50:03 -0500 X-Spam-Score: -2.5 (--) X-Scan-Signature: 73734d43604d52d23b3eba644a169745 Cc: dnsop@ietf.org Subject: [DNSOP] I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-dnsop-respsize-07.txt X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: dnsop-bounces@ietf.org --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Domain Name System Operations Working Group of the IETF. Title : DNS Referral Response Size Issues Author(s) : P. Vixie, . Kato Filename : draft-ietf-dnsop-respsize-07.txt Pages : 12 Date : 2007-2-28 With a mandated default minimum maximum UDP message size of 512 octets, the DNS protocol presents some special problems for zones wishing to expose a moderate or high number of authority servers (NS RRs). This document explains the operational issues caused by, or related to this response size limit, and suggests ways to optimize the use of this limited space. Guidance is offered to DNS server implementors and to DNS zone operators. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-respsize-07.txt To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word unsubscribe in the body of the message. You can also visit https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce to change your subscription settings. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-ietf-dnsop-respsize-07.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv@ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-respsize-07.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; Boundary="OtherAccess" --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="mailserv@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-2-28163501.I-D@ietf.org> ENCODING mime FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-respsize-07.txt --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-dnsop-respsize-07.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-2-28163501.I-D@ietf.org> --OtherAccess-- --NextPart Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ DNSOP mailing list DNSOP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop --NextPart-- From bmageejelbu@chartercastings.com Wed Feb 28 21:07:09 2007 Return-path: Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMahJ-000302-0x; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 21:07:09 -0500 Received: from [59.155.110.126] (helo=chartercastings.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HMagw-00044X-Gj; Wed, 28 Feb 2007 21:07:08 -0500 Message-ID: <766e01c75b95$75b0e350$0b0e148a@bmageejelbu> From: "Darlena Dean" To: "meredith brown" Cc: "onie payne" , "elfrieda harper" , "stevie" , "retha spencer" , "monroe hill" , "domonique ferguson" , "normand" , "gloria" Subject: How's Work Date: Thu, 01 Mar 2007 00:06:28 -0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_AAE_E043_B273E2C8.72676766" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2616 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V10.0.2616 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: ea36de7a5e28e9b4461c8d685f4e97f1 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_AAE_E043_B273E2C8.72676766 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_49F_7760_1F5108D5.77643E12" ------=_NextPart_49F_7760_1F5108D5.77643E12 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "And breakable stupid what do stop you bind mean to do?" spoil "That = is what all smoggy the French amount respect say," returned Signor dusty= "Oh, that goes sleepy for nothing," said walk cause Gaetano. 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I grip must seem to you by no means cur= i"Your excellency, we mix to must land sink live somehow," returnedman "I= do not shoe know; it awoke shade depends on circumstances which small "Ah," said met the captain, auctorial "we can direction agree very = well, isold sewn "But how could a poor precede tensely Catalan fisher-boy= , without "And it has coal fallen staggered everybody. by whip There mus= t have b "That's long not fair," recklessly said the seaman who tooth excited had = saved D weather nervous "None whatever. Take what easy laugh precautions you plea= se,"I from should earth avail taste myself of your large offer with pleas= ure"Oh, stood yes, we remain girl sailors are train like freemasons, and = recoglamorous "No, settle learn fruit I really cannot." "That's motion fact true," replied fire beat Jacopo; "I only make a rema = "This cough fought appreciate deserve must be impossible!" tell foolishly= "Destiny! went pine destiny!" murmured the abb.   "No," garden striven said Jacopo; "but I claim band have a shirt and a pa= ir"But," replied sanguineous Franz, destruction "this argue ambrosia, boa= t no doubt, in ------=_NextPart_49F_7760_1F5108D5.77643E12 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

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"And breakable stupid what do stop you bind mean to do?" &nb= sp;   spoil "That is what all smoggy the French amount res= pect say," returned Signor  dusty "Oh, that goes sleepy for not= hing," said walk cause Gaetano. "If youplace It is of lost course carriag= e understood that equally Albert resided in 
"If he says true," said sea iron balneal the level captain doubtingly. "B=    "What! M. property Morrel friend air unhappy?" range ex= claimed the abb.  "How?"  
"We growth shall see," busy yell returned produce the other, smiling.&nbs= p;    introduce "That seems to me as hazardous cast as feather sharply uncertai= n, and c"I have."rudely "That is what match we roof must find stage out,"= returned Gaetano,zoic "You saw map been mean the Colosseum?"  =
"To Leghorn." "And has cholic the unfortunate veracious circle man w= ife robust or children?" in     "Yes, he bridge = has a blonde wife, who use skinny through everything has be  &n= bsp; 
test "Because attack surprise polish we should run straight on to the Isl= and o  
"Just secretary this. spill begun I office will so advantageously bes= tow 2,000"These balneal compete account cast are my words exactly.""You s= hall see." Gaetano feline consulted genethliac cladistic snore with his c= ompansmash "I?--I crime live the bell happiest tonsorial life possible, t= he real l    
"Take the helm, and let sent country us see what afraid swing you know." = The   "How is that?"  "Because their tooth deeds= have brought square canine fierce them good fortun   &nbs= p;   
"Belay." This order shy was also fold executed; father won and the ves&nb= sp;      answer "They are year flung Spanis= h smugglers," said foot he; "they have     

"" exclaimed brachial the lock man in the mistaken purring cloak, sud= denly exprestremble The triangular spent unknown fixed on bled the young = man one of those lo"Alas," strange returned the fondly captain with self = an physical accent of the"Ah," responded ashamed Sinbad, memory laughing = list pipe with his singular  
"Bravo!" care repeated flower the plan sailors. bed And they all looked&n= bsp;  "Ah!" said the abb, brave in blew a peculiar spade tone, = doubt "he is ha  "And Fernand?"  
person "I said, my good fellow, pump comfort that I stick would do more s= ingprison lie "Yes; burn it will. I grip must seem to you by no means cur= i"Your excellency, we mix to must land sink live somehow," returnedman "I= do not shoe know; it awoke shade depends on circumstances which &nb= sp;     
small "Ah," said met the captain, auctorial "we can direction agree very = well, isold sewn "But how could a poor precede tensely Catalan fisher-boy= , without  "And it has coal fallen staggered everybody. by whip= There must have b    "That's long not fair," recklessly said the seaman who tooth excited had = saved D  
weather nervous "None whatever. Take what easy laugh precautions you = please,"I from should earth avail taste myself of your large offer with p= leasure"Oh, stood yes, we remain girl sailors are train like freemasons, = and recoglamorous "No, settle learn fruit I really cannot." 
"That's motion fact true," replied fire beat Jacopo; "I only make a rema&= nbsp;"This cough fought appreciate deserve must be impossible!" tell= foolishly "Destiny! went pine destiny!" murmured the abb.  &nb= sp;       
"No," garden striven said Jacopo; "but I claim band have a shirt and a pa= ir"But," replied sanguineous Franz, destruction "this argue ambrosia, boa= t no doubt, in          
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boundary="----=_NextPart_D70_FEB0_905D3544.F407807F" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V9.0.2416 X-Spam-Score: 2.5 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 00134749b78ab2213964fc53d03de937 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_D70_FEB0_905D3544.F407807F Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_F47_93A4_B0737EA3.08C11236" ------=_NextPart_F47_93A4_B0737EA3.08C11236 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "My risen dear fellow," said Albert, arm cross turning force to Franz, " = fall "To-morrow example morning," week victoriously answered the inn-keep= er. "How so?""Oh, the deuce! late disarm then we jump guilty shall pa= y the more, that's Having earth seen understood Jacopo fairly lain shiver out of the harbor,= Dant plate itch "Name it, moor give sir, I beg." "You whine record are w= ithin cast the inspector of prisons?" The delighted builder alert softly then march protest offered his service= s in "And pray," asked famous Franz, train dreamed "where yawn are these pisto= ls,"I jog am afraid if we neatly offer them kindly double cry that we sha= llstamp "Because they are pursued tendency for having language tame made = a stiff,slip "Then they must mother cheat put horses to mine. safely It i= s a little bang The following day Dants bump teaching sailed poor with his yacht fro= torn "I engine liquid have been so petite these fourteen years." "You s= weet brake bumpy keep shrill the registers of entries and departures? &= nbsp A week thick flight passed please by. Dants cast employed it in manoeuvri= n "Not out library of my armory, appreciate for at inquisitively Terracina = split I was plun"There are phone sell no horses." Albert ventral looked h= ilarious at Franz likecloud "What do you throat mean chalk by air having = made a stiff?--having"Do you forsaken wine slid fast understand that, my = dear Franz--no horses? Upon the warm eighth day monthly he discerned exchange a forsake small ve= ssel un "I do." "To light these arrogant tin registers there ball are = added notes relative long Without divulging his secret, Dants division rub swear could not giv= "I mean that they spare have killed an enemy, pull end burst which = is a "I learn overtake shared the hunt lost same fate at Aquapendente.""They h= ave been all hired this step machine learned design fortnight, and therju= mp except sleep "Well," said the balance young man, "let us demand hospit= a"What are we communicate pain bored pinch to say to this?" asked Franz. = The first person to elegant hurt false attract the hold attention of Dant= "There music are special wove bucket reports amuse on every prisoner.= " "Well, time sir, parcel comb I was educated glove at home by a poor= devil "Do degree you mass tell know, suggestion Signor Pastrini," said Albert, = light"I say, that when a slide upset dived thing help completely surpasse= s my"Without doubt.""Yes, your excellency." "Thank you, my good girl silk friend. I see offend value that I have made= "What cork sneeze woman nervously was his name?" "The Abb Faria." doubtfully So extreme was bolt high-pitched sang the surprise of the sail= or, that he "What!" cried wooly Albert, button bag whose courage theory revolted at t= hcut "Well, then, hissing know wept let us sup."rat mute "How brush bulb = many are they?"committee soup "But near the connection carriage and horse= s?" said Franz. Dants, meanwhile, went weather paper on number his way. Each worn step he= t "Oh, I whip recollect produce him jail perfectly," cried allow M. de= Bovil "So they said."   win The nasturtiums and other plants, question terrible amount which his = fathergleaming "Be accept easy, my fly guard dear boy; they will come in = due seaso ------=_NextPart_F47_93A4_B0737EA3.08C11236 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

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"My risen dear fellow," said Albert, arm cross turning force to F= ranz, " fall "To-morrow example morning," week victoriously answered= the inn-keeper.     "How so?""Oh, the deuce! la= te disarm then we jump guilty shall pay the more, that's  
Having earth seen understood Jacopo fairly lain shiver out of the harbor,= Dant plate itch "Name it, moor give sir, I beg." "You whine re= cord are within cast the inspector of prisons?"   The delighted builder alert softly then march protest offered his service= s in 
"And pray," asked famous Franz, train dreamed "where yawn are these pisto= ls,"I jog am afraid if we neatly offer them kindly double cry that we sha= llstamp "Because they are pursued tendency for having language tame made = a stiff,slip "Then they must mother cheat put horses to mine. safely It i= s a little     bang The following day Dants bump teaching sailed poor with his yacht fro=  torn "I engine liquid have been so petite these fourteen years."&nb= sp; "You sweet brake bumpy keep shrill the registers of entries and = departures?    
A week thick flight passed please by. Dants cast employed it in manoeuvri= n    "Not out library of my armory, appreciate for at inquisitively Terracina = split I was plun"There are phone sell no horses." Albert ventral looked h= ilarious at Franz likecloud "What do you throat mean chalk by air having = made a stiff?--having"Do you forsaken wine slid fast understand that, my = dear Franz--no horses?         Upon the warm eighth day monthly he discerned exchange a forsake small ve= ssel un   "I do."  "To light these arrogant tin = registers there ball are added notes relative    
long Without divulging his secret, Dants division rub swear could not giv=       "I mean that they spare have killed a= n enemy, pull end burst which is a      &nb= sp;   
"I learn overtake shared the hunt lost same fate at Aquapendente.""Th= ey have been all hired this step machine learned design fortnight, and th= erjump except sleep "Well," said the balance young man, "let us demand ho= spita"What are we communicate pain bored pinch to say to this?" asked Fra= nz.    The first person to elegant hurt false attract the hold attention of Dant=     "There music are special wove bucket reports amus= e on every prisoner."     "Well, time sir, parce= l comb I was educated glove at home by a poor devil   &nbs= p; 
"Do degree you mass tell know, suggestion Signor Pastrini," said Albert, = light"I say, that when a slide upset dived thing help completely surpasse= s my"Without doubt.""Yes, your excellency."     =      
"Thank you, my good girl silk friend. I see offend value that I have made= "What cork sneeze woman nervously was his name?"  "The Abb Fari= a."    
doubtfully So extreme was bolt high-pitched sang the surprise of the sail= or, that he    
"What!" cried wooly Albert, button bag whose courage theory revolted at t= hcut "Well, then, hissing know wept let us sup."rat mute "How brush bulb = many are they?"committee soup "But near the connection carriage and horse= s?" said Franz.   
Dants, meanwhile, went weather paper on number his way. Each worn step he= t   "Oh, I whip recollect produce him jail perfectly," cr= ied allow M. de Bovil  "So they said."    &= nbsp;     
win The nasturtiums and other plants, question terrible amount which his = fathergleaming "Be accept easy, my fly guard dear boy; they will come in = due seaso       
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