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Subject: [IPTEL] Packet Switched vs Line Switched
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Hi!
I am not an expert in IP Telephony. But I have a wide technical background,
and have followed this area for some time.
When it comes to the fundamental difference between Packet Switched and Line
Switched networks, will any standards developed by the IPTEL/IETF take these
matters into account? I am especially thinking of factors like being able to
cope with loss of packets, priority over other traffic etc. In other words:
How can we assure good quality when not having a Line Switched network?
I am sorry if these questions are a bit to "wide" for this fora. I have had
a look in the archives, but haven't found much on this. Maybe someone here
can point me in the right direction for more information?
Thank you very much,
Jostein Trones
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Packet Switched vs Line Switched
Hi!
I am not an expert in IP Telephony. =
But I have a wide technical background, and have followed this area for =
some time.
When it comes to the fundamental =
difference between Packet Switched and Line Switched networks, will any =
standards developed by the IPTEL/IETF take these matters into account? =
I am especially thinking of factors like being able to cope with loss =
of packets, priority over other traffic etc. In other words: How can we =
assure good quality when not having a Line Switched network?
I am sorry if these questions are a =
bit to "wide" for this fora. I have had a look in the =
archives, but haven't found much on this. Maybe someone here can point =
me in the right direction for more information?
Thank you very much,
Jostein Trones
------_=_NextPart_001_01C0A56E.C48A2FB0--
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From iptel-admin@lists.bell-labs.com Mon Mar 5 18:29:04 2001
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Subject: [IPTEL] Call for Participation: IPtel 2001 workshop
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Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2001 18:28:07 -0500 (EST)
Call for Participation
2nd IP Telephony Workshop
April 2-3, 2001 - Columbia University, New York City
http://www.fokus.gmd.de/events/iptel2001/
Objectives
----------
Internet telephony is rapidly evolving from research to design
and deployment. The IP Telephony Workshop aims at bringing together
researchers, developers, vendors and service providers active in this
area and stimulate discussion on innovation, research, implementation,
deployment experiences and future directions.
Scope & Topics
--------------
Original technical articles related to IP telephony will be presented.
We received forty papers addressing QoS research (12), service creation
and call control (8), firewall/NAT traversal issues (3), conferencing
(3), IP interworking with PSTN and wireless (3), QoS testing and
measurement (2), instant messaging and presence (2), security (1),
administration mechanisms (1), performance analysis (1), etc. Twenty
submissions will be accepted, presented and published in the
proceedings.
Important Dates
---------------
Program published March 15th, 2001
Registration deadline March 23rd, 2001
Workshop April 2nd-3rd, 2001
iptel2001 Organizing Committee
------------------------------
Program Chair
H. Schulzrinne Columbia University
Program Committee
M. Arango Sun Microsystems
F. Baker Cisco
W. Bauerfeld T-Nova
G. Bond AT&T Research
S. Bradner Harvard University
G. Carle GMD FOKUS
J. Crowcroft UCL
C. Huitema Microsoft
G. S. Kuo National Central University, Taiwan
J. Kuthan GMD Fokus
T. Magedanz IKV++ GmbH
W. Marshall AT&T Research
D. Medhi University of Missouri-Kansas City
D. Oran Cisco
J. Ott University of Bremen
T. La Porta Bell Labs
B. Rosen Marconi
J. Rosenberg dynamicsoft
H. Sinnreich MCI WorldCom
R. Steinmetz Technical University of Darmstadt
H. Stüttgen NEC CCRLE
W. Wimmreuter Siemens
L. Wolf University of Karlsruhe
A. Wolisz Technical University of Berlin
M. Zitterbart Technical University of Braunschweig
Contact Address
---------------
Please send all your inquiries regarding iptel2001 to
iptel2001@egroups.com.
Registration
------------
The registration is now open. Participants are asked to register
in advance at
http://www.fokus.gmd.de/iptel2001/iptel2001/reg/
The registration deadline is March 23rd, 2001. See our registration
website for more details.
Accommodation
-------------
New York city offers many hotels in different price ranges. Our
accommodation web page contains pointers to some nearby hotels, however,
attendees are responsible for booking their own accommodation.
http://www.fokus.gmd.de/events/iptel2001/accommodation/
Exhibition
----------
To demonstrate how research and development become reality there will
be an exhibition co-located with the workshop. A limited number of teams
from industry as well as from academia and research will be given space to
present their software and hardware, both products and prototypes. If you
are interested in presenting your products or prototypes at iptel2001,
please send an e-mail to
iptel2001@egroups.com.
Please include a short description of what you plan to display and special
requirements if you have any. We will provide tables, power strips,
Ethernet/802.11b wireless Internet connectivity (no firewall/NAT) and
space for your booth if needed.
_______________________________________________
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From iptel-admin@lists.bell-labs.com Mon Mar 5 19:20:07 2001
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To: Jostein Trones
From: president@access.net.id
Subject: Re: [IPTEL] Packet Switched vs Line Switched
Cc: "'iptel@lists.bell-labs.com'"
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Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2001 06:55:09 +0700
Folks,
In Indonesia, My company MAHATEL, has specific license from Gov:
Fixed Network Telecom Operator Based On Packet Switched System
IP & F/R Switches incl. DataCom Network must be developed.
I am sure that it has good carrier quality voice grade as well.
Regards, -teddy
At 01:21 PM 3/5/01 +0100, Jostein Trones wrote:
<...>
In other words: How
>can we assure good quality when not having a Line Switched network? "" for
>this fora. I have had a look in the archives, but haven't found much on
>this. Maybe someone here can point me in the right direction for more
>information? Thank you very much, Jostein Trones
_______________________________________________
IPTEL mailing list
IPTEL@lists.bell-labs.com
http://lists.bell-labs.com/mailman/listinfo/iptel
From iptel-admin@lists.bell-labs.com Tue Mar 6 09:36:07 2001
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Reply-To:
From: "Alan Clark"
To: "'Jostein Trones'"
Cc:
Subject: RE: [IPTEL] Packet Switched vs Line Switched QoS
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Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2001 09:32:51 -0500
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There has been some work in ETSI TIPHON WG5 (www.etsi.org) and ANSI TIA TR41
in this area. This encompasses both design guidelines for VoIP networks and
methods for real time monitoring of call quality. I can provide more
details if you are interested.
Alan Clark
-----Original Message-----
From: iptel-admin@lists.bell-labs.com
[mailto:iptel-admin@lists.bell-labs.com]On Behalf Of
president@access.net.id
Sent: Monday, March 05, 2001 6:55 PM
To: Jostein Trones
Cc: 'iptel@lists.bell-labs.com'
Subject: Re: [IPTEL] Packet Switched vs Line Switched
Folks,
In Indonesia, My company MAHATEL, has specific license from Gov:
Fixed Network Telecom Operator Based On Packet Switched System
IP & F/R Switches incl. DataCom Network must be developed.
I am sure that it has good carrier quality voice grade as well.
Regards, -teddy
At 01:21 PM 3/5/01 +0100, Jostein Trones wrote:
<...>
In other words: How
>can we assure good quality when not having a Line Switched network? "" for
>this fora. I have had a look in the archives, but haven't found much on
>this. Maybe someone here can point me in the right direction for more
>information? Thank you very much, Jostein Trones
_______________________________________________
IPTEL mailing list
IPTEL@lists.bell-labs.com
http://lists.bell-labs.com/mailman/listinfo/iptel
_______________________________________________
IPTEL mailing list
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http://lists.bell-labs.com/mailman/listinfo/iptel
From iptel-admin@lists.bell-labs.com Tue Mar 6 20:31:06 2001
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Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2001 20:33:08 -0500
Folks,
The deadline for posting the agendas for IETF 50 is approaching. If you want
a slot at the iptel meeting, and haven't yet told me, please do so.
I'll be sending out a proposed agenda shortly.
Also, an update on CPL. CPL is currently blocked within IESG pending the
resolution of an issue with our use of iCalendar. The IESG is concerned that
the use of a subset will hurt interoperability. Specifically, a calendaring
tool that is fully compliant to rfc2445 will not be able to push its
recurrence rules for a meeting into a CPL. Doing this was a key reason we
chose iCalendar to begin with.
So, to resolve this, a few of us have started discussions on the calsch list
regarding our concerns with a complete implementation (the largest one being
the O(1) compute time requirement). Many calsch members were very
sympathetic to our concerns and issues, and list discussion was good. There
will be further discussion on the subject during the calsch meeting at IETF
50. So, if you would like to give some input on this subject, please come to
the calsch meeting. I don't think we will be discussing this during iptel,
but I'll advise if that changes.
Also, I suspect we will not need our full 2.5 hour slot. So, I have informed
the secretariat that it would be OK to move us to a one hour slot. If this
happens, I will advise the list immediately, as this will likely result in a
change in the day/time of the group meeting.
Thanks,
Jonathan R.
---
Jonathan D. Rosenberg 72 Eagle Rock Ave.
Chief Scientist First Floor
dynamicsoft East Hanover, NJ 07936
jdrosen@dynamicsoft.com FAX: (973) 952-5050
http://www.cs.columbia.edu/~jdrosen PHONE: (973) 952-5000
http://www.dynamicsoft.com
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From: Jean-Francois Mule
Reply-To: Jean-Francois Mule
To: alan@telchemy.com, "'Jostein Trones'"
Cc: iptel@lists.bell-labs.com
Subject: RE: [IPTEL] Packet Switched vs Line Switched QoS
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with or without the IPR claims? just curious...
> -----Original Message-----
> From: iptel-admin@lists.bell-labs.com
> [mailto:iptel-admin@lists.bell-labs.com]On Behalf Of Alan Clark
> Sent: Tuesday, March 06, 2001 6:33 AM
> To: 'Jostein Trones'
> Cc: iptel@lists.bell-labs.com
> Subject: RE: [IPTEL] Packet Switched vs Line Switched QoS
>
>
>
> There has been some work in ETSI TIPHON WG5 (www.etsi.org)
> and ANSI TIA TR41
> in this area. This encompasses both design guidelines for
> VoIP networks and
> methods for real time monitoring of call quality. I can provide more
> details if you are interested.
>
> Alan Clark
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: iptel-admin@lists.bell-labs.com
> [mailto:iptel-admin@lists.bell-labs.com]On Behalf Of
> president@access.net.id
> Sent: Monday, March 05, 2001 6:55 PM
> To: Jostein Trones
> Cc: 'iptel@lists.bell-labs.com'
> Subject: Re: [IPTEL] Packet Switched vs Line Switched
>
>
> Folks,
> In Indonesia, My company MAHATEL, has specific license from Gov:
> Fixed Network Telecom Operator Based On Packet Switched System
>
> IP & F/R Switches incl. DataCom Network must be developed.
> I am sure that it has good carrier quality voice grade as well.
> Regards, -teddy
>
> At 01:21 PM 3/5/01 +0100, Jostein Trones wrote:
> <...>
> In other words: How
> >can we assure good quality when not having a Line Switched
> network? "" for
> >this fora. I have had a look in the archives, but haven't
> found much on
> >this. Maybe someone here can point me in the right direction for more
> >information? Thank you very much, Jostein Trones
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> IPTEL mailing list
> IPTEL@lists.bell-labs.com
> http://lists.bell-labs.com/mailman/listinfo/iptel
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> IPTEL mailing list
> IPTEL@lists.bell-labs.com
> http://lists.bell-labs.com/mailman/listinfo/iptel
_______________________________________________
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From iptel-admin@lists.bell-labs.com Wed Mar 7 09:30:07 2001
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Reply-To:
From: "Alan Clark"
To: "'Jean-Francois Mule'" ,
"'Jostein Trones'"
Cc:
Subject: RE: [IPTEL] Packet Switched vs Line Switched QoS
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Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2001 09:26:40 -0500
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To clarify Jean-Francois' reference - as is normal practice we disclosed to
both ETSI and TIA that we have patent applications related to real-time QoS
monitoring of VoIP, and made the statements required by these organizations
(see their respective web sites). I'm sure that he is aware that PSQM, PESQ
and most of the voice and image coding algorithms are also patented - in
some cases by multiple companies.
- Alan
-----Original Message-----
From: iptel-admin@lists.bell-labs.com
[mailto:iptel-admin@lists.bell-labs.com]On Behalf Of Jean-Francois Mule
Sent: Tuesday, March 06, 2001 9:13 PM
To: alan@telchemy.com; 'Jostein Trones'
Cc: iptel@lists.bell-labs.com
Subject: RE: [IPTEL] Packet Switched vs Line Switched QoS
with or without the IPR claims? just curious...
> -----Original Message-----
> From: iptel-admin@lists.bell-labs.com
> [mailto:iptel-admin@lists.bell-labs.com]On Behalf Of Alan Clark
> Sent: Tuesday, March 06, 2001 6:33 AM
> To: 'Jostein Trones'
> Cc: iptel@lists.bell-labs.com
> Subject: RE: [IPTEL] Packet Switched vs Line Switched QoS
>
>
>
> There has been some work in ETSI TIPHON WG5 (www.etsi.org)
> and ANSI TIA TR41
> in this area. This encompasses both design guidelines for
> VoIP networks and
> methods for real time monitoring of call quality. I can provide more
> details if you are interested.
>
> Alan Clark
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: iptel-admin@lists.bell-labs.com
> [mailto:iptel-admin@lists.bell-labs.com]On Behalf Of
> president@access.net.id
> Sent: Monday, March 05, 2001 6:55 PM
> To: Jostein Trones
> Cc: 'iptel@lists.bell-labs.com'
> Subject: Re: [IPTEL] Packet Switched vs Line Switched
>
>
> Folks,
> In Indonesia, My company MAHATEL, has specific license from Gov:
> Fixed Network Telecom Operator Based On Packet Switched System
>
> IP & F/R Switches incl. DataCom Network must be developed.
> I am sure that it has good carrier quality voice grade as well.
> Regards, -teddy
>
> At 01:21 PM 3/5/01 +0100, Jostein Trones wrote:
> <...>
> In other words: How
> >can we assure good quality when not having a Line Switched
> network? "" for
> >this fora. I have had a look in the archives, but haven't
> found much on
> >this. Maybe someone here can point me in the right direction for more
> >information? Thank you very much, Jostein Trones
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> IPTEL mailing list
> IPTEL@lists.bell-labs.com
> http://lists.bell-labs.com/mailman/listinfo/iptel
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> IPTEL mailing list
> IPTEL@lists.bell-labs.com
> http://lists.bell-labs.com/mailman/listinfo/iptel
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Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 02:17:29 -0500
Folks,
We are officially on the calsch agenda for discussing CPL during IETF 50.
Please feel free to attend the calsch discussions if you are interested in
contributing to these discussions.
Thanks,
Jonathan R.
---
Jonathan D. Rosenberg 72 Eagle Rock Ave.
Chief Scientist First Floor
dynamicsoft East Hanover, NJ 07936
jdrosen@dynamicsoft.com FAX: (973) 952-5050
http://www.cs.columbia.edu/~jdrosen PHONE: (973) 952-5000
http://www.dynamicsoft.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Bob Mahoney [mailto:bobmah@mit.edu]
Sent: Saturday, March 10, 2001 7:16 AM
To: agenda@ietf.org
Cc: ietf-calendar@imc.org
Subject: CALSCH Agenda for IETF 50
1. Agenda Tweaks -Bob Mahoney
The usual bashing
2. IPTEL/CALSCH issues -John Stracke
Overview of major issues
(Will also be covered in WG dinners and such)
3. CAP status -Steve Mansour/George Babics
4. CALSCH.ORG web site -Bob Mahoney
5. Have we bit off more than we can chew? -Steve Mansour
Are the sheer size of the documents & scope of effort
impeding adoption?
6. "Guide to Internet Calendaring" Last Call -Bob/George
7. RFC updates and status -TBA
7. Plans for further informal meetings during the week.
8. Adjourn.
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From iptel-admin@lists.bell-labs.com Tue Mar 13 01:15:06 2001
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Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 01:16:19 -0500
Folks,
Here is the current agenda for IETF 50:
Agenda for iptel working group
IETF 50
-------
1. Agenda Bashing [Rosenberg] - 5 mins
2. CPL Status and Update [Rosenberg] - 5 mins
3. TRIP Open Issue [Rosenberg] - 10 mins
4. Transit Network Selection [Walker] - 10 mins
5. TRIP MIB Update and Issues [Walker] - 10 mins
6. Service Codes [Peterson] - 10 mins
7. New Charter discussion [Rosenberg] - 30 mins
Comments welcome. I'll be sending out a charter proposal shortly for perusal
and comment before the meeting.
Thanks,
Jonathan R.
---
Jonathan D. Rosenberg 72 Eagle Rock Ave.
Chief Scientist First Floor
dynamicsoft East Hanover, NJ 07936
jdrosen@dynamicsoft.com FAX: (973) 952-5050
http://www.cs.columbia.edu/~jdrosen PHONE: (973) 952-5000
http://www.dynamicsoft.com
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From iptel-admin@lists.bell-labs.com Wed Mar 14 16:19:05 2001
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"Schulzrinne, Henning (E-mail)"
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Folks,
Here is the outline of the presentation John Stracke, who participates in
calsch, will be giving regarding CPL and iCalendar during the calsch
meeting.
-Jonathan R.
---
Jonathan D. Rosenberg 72 Eagle Rock Ave.
Chief Scientist First Floor
dynamicsoft East Hanover, NJ 07936
jdrosen@dynamicsoft.com FAX: (973) 952-5050
http://www.cs.columbia.edu/~jdrosen PHONE: (973) 952-5000
http://www.dynamicsoft.com
-----Original Message-----
From: John Stracke [mailto:francis@ecal.com]
Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2001 3:13 PM
To: ietf-calendar@imc.org
Subject: Re: CALSCH Agenda for IETF 50
Bob Mahoney wrote:
> 2. IPTEL/CALSCH issues -John Stracke
> Overview of major issues
> (Will also be covered in WG dinners and such)
Attached is the outline of what I'll be covering. Please let me
know if there's anything unclear, or if you think it's too long,
or something.
--
/==============================================================\
|John Stracke | http://www.ecal.com |My opinions are my own.|
|Chief Scientist |=============================================|
|eCal Corp. |"You gotta learn to dance before you learn to|
|francis@ecal.com|crawl!" -- Meatloaf, "Everything Louder than |
| |Everything Else" |
\==============================================================/
------_=_NextPart_000_01C0ACCC.AD07E31C
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name="outline.html"
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filename="outline.html"
IPTEL's use of iCalendar
IPTEL's use of iCalendar
Why IPTEL uses iCalendar
CPL (Call Processing Language) needs to know which rules apply
when.
In essence, that's a recurring event: this rule applies at
these times.
Rather than invent recurrence rules from scratch, CPL uses a
subset of iCalendar's.
Hope is that a user's CPL rules can be populated from their
calendar: "Don't call me while I'm in meetings".
What the problem is
The full iCalendar RECUR semantics are too much for CPL
CPL has to run in a telephony switch. CPU and memory are
expensive.
CPL has to run in bounded time. BYSETPOS and COUNT cannot be
evaluated in bounded time.
Also, iCalendar can specify a recurring event whose instances
overlap. Nightmare.
So CPL defines a subset of the recurrence rules
Eliminates all sub-day parameters (SECONDLY, MINUTELY,
HOURLY, BYSECOND, BYMINUTE, BYHOUR).
Eliminates BYSETPOS, COUNT.
Restricts DURATION to be less than 24 hours.
Meets CPL's needs, but cannot interoperate
A calendar user can specify recurrences which their IPTEL
switch cannot implement.
If the switch and the CS are connecting behind the scenes,
it will be difficult to give the user a good explanation.
User will wind up believing the switch just doesn't work.
Some users may not encounter the problem. This is worse,
because, sooner or later, they will; and then it'll be a
surprise.
The subset solution
iCalendar's recurrence rules are too much for calendars, too.
Possible to define extremely complex rules. Example:
occurs every 79 seconds,
also occurs at 3:15:25 PM on the 12th, 37th, and 159th days
of the year,
but does not occur unless it's 13 or 23 seconds after the minute,
and does not occur on the second Tuesday of the month.
How can UI express this clearly?
Worse, how can the user edit it?
CUA's RRULE editor will work only on a subset; no other
option.
Different CUAs will use different subsets. Might not test
features outside their subset properly. Interop nightmare.
Suggestion: define a subset.
Pare down the semantics to something manageable.
draft-stracke-calsch-rrule-subset-XX.txt defines subset from
CPL
Might conceivably need to be simplified still more, but this
is a start.
My preference: this subset should become the only set.
When we rev 2445, we should throw out the parts that don't
fit.
Otherwise, we still have interop problems, when a 2445bis CUA
gets an iCalendar from a 2445 CUA.
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From iptel-admin@lists.bell-labs.com Thu Mar 15 11:10:26 2001
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Here is the unpublished draft that John Stracke, who is involved in calsch,
and Jonathan Lennox, have co-authored. It defines the iCalendar subset
indpendently of CPL.
-Jonathan R.
---
Jonathan D. Rosenberg 72 Eagle Rock Ave.
Chief Scientist First Floor
dynamicsoft East Hanover, NJ 07936
jdrosen@dynamicsoft.com FAX: (973) 952-5050
http://www.cs.columbia.edu/~jdrosen PHONE: (973) 952-5000
http://www.dynamicsoft.com
-----Original Message-----
From: John Stracke [mailto:francis@ecal.com]
Sent: Thursday, March 15, 2001 10:17 AM
To: ietf-calendar@imc.org
Subject: Re: CALSCH Agenda for IETF 50
John Stracke wrote:
* Bob Mahoney wrote:
>
> > 2. IPTEL/CALSCH issues -John Stracke
> > Overview of major issues
> > (Will also be covered in WG dinners and such)
>
> Attached is the outline of what I'll be covering.
And here's the (unsubmitted) Draft it mentions.
--
/=================================================================\
|John Stracke | http://www.ecal.com |My opinions are my own. |
|Chief Scientist |================================================|
|eCal Corp. |I'm not imaginary. I'm ontologically challenged.|
|francis@ecal.com| |
\=================================================================/
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Internet Engineering Task Force J. Stracke
INTERNET DRAFT eCal
draft-stracke-calsch-rrule-subset-XX.txt J. Lennox
Columbia Univ.
February 2001
Expires: August 2001
A Simplified Subset of iCalendar RRULEs
1. Status of this Memo
This document is an Internet-Draft and is in full conformance with
all provisions of Section 10 of RFC2026.
Internet-Drafts are working documents of the Internet Engineering
Task Force (IETF), its areas, and its working groups. Note that
other groups may also distribute working documents as Internet-
Drafts. Internet-Drafts are draft documents valid for a maximum of
six months and may be updated, replaced, or obsoleted by other docu-
ments at any time. It is inappropriate to use Internet-Drafts as
reference material or to cite them other than as "work in progress."
The list of current Internet-Drafts can be accessed at
http://www.ietf.org/ietf/1id-abstracts.txt
The list of Internet-Draft Shadow Directories can be accessed at
http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html.
Distribution of this document is unlimited. Please send comments to
francis@ecal.com or to the ietf-calendar@imc.org discussion list
(subscription address ietf-calendar-request@imc.org; "SUBSCRIBE" or
"UNSUBSCRIBE" in the body).
2. Copyright Notice
Copyright (C) The Internet Society (2000). All Rights Reserved.
3. Abstract
This document sets forth a subset of the RRULE syntax for [iCalen-
dar]. The problem which motivated this subset is that iCalendar's
recurring-event rules are extremely complex; it is difficult to =
eval-
uate them, and well-nigh impossible to build a usable user interface
Stracke, Lennox [Page =
1]
=0C
RRULE Subset December =
2000
to edit them.
4. Introduction
[iCalendar]'s recurrence rules are extremely complex. For example,
it is possible to specify an event which:
* occurs every 79 seconds,
* also occurs at 3:15:25 PM on the 12th, 37th, and 159th days of
the year,
* but does not occur unless it's 13 or 23 seconds after the
minute,
* and does not occur on the second Tuesday of the month.
While it is certainly feasible (though difficult) to write computer
code which interprets such rules, it is extremely hard to be sure =
one
has written this code correctly. Furthermore, it is probably impos-
sible to create a user interface which can display (let alone edit)
these rules in a comprehensible fashion. (For one thing, note that
the "not unless it's 13 or 23 seconds after the minute" part con-
flicts with the "3:15:25 PM" part. It is, of course, possible to
write code which examines the rule for such conflicts; but then one
has to figure out how to explain them to the user. A proper UI pre-
vents the user from making mistakes in the first place; and that
becomes nearly impossible when the mistakes are so hard to explain.)
In order to make the user interface comprehensible, each CUA will
probably expose only a subset of the available recurrence features =
to
the user. The risk, then, is that different CUAs will expose =
differ-
ent subsets, and will not be properly tested for iCalendar objects
which stray outside those subsets. Even if they expand those =
iCalen-
dar objects correctly, they may not display the full recurrence rule
correctly, since that would require complicating the UI. If that
happens, the user will wind up seeing that the recurrence rule for
their repeating event says it occurs every Monday, but the calendar
does not show the event on every Monday; there are gaps. Confusing
the users like this effectively means that there will not be =
interop-
erability: even if the underlying iCalendar implementations under-
stand each other, the users don't.
Finally, evaluating these rules is highly CPU-intensive. If one =
uses
the COUNT parameter, for example, to state that the event occurs no
more than 25 times, then, every time the user wishes to see their
calendar, the CUA (Calendar User Agent) must evaluate that rule up =
to
25 times. This is sort of acceptable when it's just the CUA getting
involved; but, if the CUA is making a query against a CS (Calendar
Store) for all the user's events within a given range, that's an
Stracke, Lennox [Page =
2]
=0C
RRULE Subset December =
2000
extremely expensive request, computationally, to impose on a server.
Servers which support such queries will not scale, unless they pre-
expand their recurring events. This approach can work, but it has
its own problems; it is expensive in disk space, and may create so
many database entries that the database slows down. (Or, of course,
it may not; the point is simply that, as things stand, this approach
is the only viable one; with cheaper evaluation, we have more
options, more opportunities to find the Right Thing.)
The iptel working group, in defining their Call Processing Language
([CPL]), needed a way of specifying which processing rules apply
when. They wanted to reuse the iCalendar specification, but they
found the cost of evaluating the recurrence rules to be too high to
perform in a telephony switch. So, instead, they used a subset of
iCalendar recurrence rules, in which the switch can answer the ques-
tion "which rule applies right now?" in O(1) time. This document
lays out that subset in iCalendar terms.
5. Subset Definition
In this subset, not all of the parameters defined in [iCalendar]'s
section 4.3.10 (which defines the value type RECUR) are allowed. =
The
allowed parameters are:
* FREQ
* INTERVAL
* UNTIL
* BYDAY
* BYMONTHDAY
* BYYEARDAY
* BYWEEKNO
* BYMONTH
* WKST
In addition, the FREQ parameter is more restricted than in [iCal-
endar]; the only legal values are DAILY, WEEKLY, MONTHLY, and
YEARLY (SECONDLY, MINUTELY, and HOURLY were removed).
Finally, the event's DURATION must be less than 24 hours.
6. Subset Motivation
(This section is non-normative.)
The COUNT and BYSETPOS parameters have been removed in order to make
sure that it is possible to evaluate a rule in O(1) time; since =
COUNT
Stracke, Lennox [Page =
3]
=0C
RRULE Subset December =
2000
and BYSETPOS rely on the concept of "Nth instance of the event", =
they
require the implementation to loop through and evaluate at least the
first N instances. If necessary, similar functionality can be
obtained via UNTIL and EXDATE or RDATE.
In addition, limiting FREQ's values and removing BYSECOND, BYMINUTE,
and BYHOUR makes it impossible to specify an event which recurs more
often than once per day. Combined with the restriction that the
event's duration must be less than 24 hours, this makes sure that no
two instances of a recurring event can overlap. Overlapping
instances would complicate the evaluation algorithm and prevent it
from being O(1); and, in any case, a user interface would be hard-
pressed to display an event with overlapping instances in a coherent
fashion. It might be possible to come up with some other way of =
pre-
venting overlapping instances, but this one is simple to understand
(both for implementors and for users).
It is worth pointing out that the O(1) algorithm is not quite con-
stant time; for example, if the VEVENT contains both an RRULE and an
EXRULE, evaluation will take twice as long. If it contains N
EXDATEs, evaluation will go up by an O(N) factor (the same applies
for RDATEs, of course).
7. Conclusions
The subset specified here is much simpler to work with than the full
RECUR syntax of [iCalendar], without greatly limiting functionality;
if we modify iCalendar to be limited to this subset, it ought to be
easier to achieve full interoperability. It will also be simpler =
for
users to understand, and for implementations to evaluate.
8. Security Considerations
This document specifies a subset of [iCalendar], and accordingly
inherits all of iCalendar's security analysis. It seems intuitively
obvious (warning: handwaving ahead) that adopting this subset cannot
introduce new security risks; that any risk present in this subset =
is
also present in the original iCalendar specification.
9. An Algorithm for Resolving Time Switches
(This section is non-normative. It is taken from Appendix A of
[CPL].)
Stracke, Lennox [Page =
4]
=0C
RRULE Subset December =
2000
The following algorithm resolves, in constant time, whether a given
instant falls within a repetition of a time-switch recurrence. Open-
source Java code implementing this algorithm is available on the
world wide web at .
1. Compute the time of the call, in the timezone of the time
switch. (No step after this needs to consider time zones --
all calculations are done using continuously-running standard
Gregorian time.)
2. If the call time is earlier than dtstart, fail NOMATCH.
3. If the call time is less than duration after dtstart, succeed
MATCH.
4. Determine the smallest unit specified in a byxxx rule or by
the freq. Call this the Minimum Unit. Determine the previous
instant (before the call time) when all the time units =
smaller
than the minimum unit are the same as those of dtstart. (For
all minimum units, the time-of-day must be the same as
dtstart. If the minimum unit is a week, the day-of-the-week
must be the same as dtstart. If the minimum unit is a month,
the day-of-the-month must be the same as dtstart. If the =
mini-
mum unit is a year, the month and day-of-month must both be
the same as dtstart. (Note that this means it may be =
necessary
to roll back more than one minimum unit -- if the minimum =
unit
is a month, then some months do not have a 31st (or 30th or
29th) day; if the minimum unit is a year, then some years do
not have a February 29th. In the Gregorian calendar, it is
never necessary to roll back more than two months, or eight
years (four years between 1904 and 2096).)
Call this instant the Candidate Start Time.
5. If the time between the candidate start time and the call =
time
is more than the duration, fail NOMATCH.
6. If the candidate start time is later than the until parameter
of the recurrence, fail NOMATCH.
7. Call the unit of the freq parameter of the recurrence the =
Fre-
quency Unit. Determine the frequency unit enclosing the Can-
didate Start Time, and that enclosing dtstart. Calculate the
number of frequency units that have passed between these two
times. If this is not a multiple of the interval parameter,
fail NOMATCH.
Stracke, Lennox [Page =
5]
=0C
RRULE Subset December =
2000
8. For every byxxx rule, confirm that the candidate start time
matches one of the options specified by that byxxx rule. If
not, fail NOMATCH.
9. Succeed MATCH.
10. Authors' Addresses:
John Stracke
Chief Scientist
eCal Corp.
Email: francis@ecal.com
Jonathan Lennox
Dept. of Computer Science
Columbia University
1214 Amsterdam Avenue, MC 0401
New York, NY 10027
USA
Email: lennox@cs.columbia.edu
11. References
[iCAL] Dawson, Stenerson, "Internet Calendaring and Scheduling Core
Object Specification (iCalendar)", RFC 2445, November 1998.
[CPL] Lennox, Schulzrinne, "CPL: A Language for User Control of =
Internet
Telephony Services", draft-ietf-iptel-cpl-04.txt, November 2000. Work
in progress.
Stracke, Lennox [Page =
6]
=0C
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From: James Undery
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Subject: Re: [IPTEL] FW: CALSCH Agenda for IETF 50
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Jonathan Rosenberg wrote:
> Here is the unpublished draft that John Stracke, who is involved in calsch,
> and Jonathan Lennox, have co-authored. It defines the iCalendar subset
> indpendently of CPL.
The obvious comment is that in section 5, DURATION must also be positive.
James Undery
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Subject: [IPTEL] help for a service in CPL
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Hello all!
I'm trying to develop a service of user location using CPL in a =
networking architecture SIP. I'm not expert in CPL and for this reason I =
need help to correct a script for the xml code.
The service of intelligent user location has, such as final goal, to =
give the user the posibility of others users to localize him/her in =
different places depending of the hours during the day, for example, in =
the case Mary wants to be localized since 00:00:00 hours until 06:00:00 =
in the Mary@IBM.com location and since 18:00:00 until 12:00:00 in the =
Mary12@Epson.com location.=20
The explanation of my design is as follow:
The first address-switch asks for the host where reside the service. If =
the domain is ITEC-telecom.com.co, to pass second address-switch, =
otherwise the call is reject.=20
The second address-switch asks for the user. If the user is Mary, the =
call reach to the first time switch, otherwise the call is reject.
The first time switch indicate that the user will be localized since the =
00:00:00 hours until 6 hours after in the Mary@IBM.com location.=20
If the local time is not accord with the time established in the =
time-switch, the call will reach the second time-switch.
The second time-switch indicate that the user will be localized since =
the 06:00:00 hours until 12:00:00 hours. If the local time is accord =
with this interval, the user will be localized in the Mary12@Epson.com =
location, otherwise the call will be reject.
The proxy action signalling has three outputs. The busy and failure =
outputs correspond to the events: response 486 and 3xx respectively in =
the SIP protocol, the noanswer output go to a subaction called Mail, =
that contains a location node and a redirect action signalling.
The cpl diagram and the xml code with its respective dtd are attached.
I need to know if this design and if the xml code are right.
Thanks in advance
Katherine Morera Olarte
Research Division
ITEC-TELECOM
Bogot=E1 Colombia
------=_NextPart_001_031D_01C0ADFC.DE8FE530
Content-Type: text/html;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hello all!
I'm trying to develop a service of =
user=20
location using CPL in a networking architecture SIP. I'm not expert in =
CPL and=20
for this reason I need help to correct a script for the xml =
code.
The service of intelligent user =
location has, such=20
as final goal, to give the user the posibility of others users to =
localize=20
him/her in different places depending of the hours during the day, for =
example,=20
in the case Mary wants to be localized since 00:00:00 hours until =
06:00:00 in=20
the Mary@IBM.com location and since =
18:00:00=20
until 12:00:00 in the Mary12@Epson.com=20
location.
The explanation of my design is as=20
follow:
The first address-switch asks for the =
host where=20
reside the service. If the domain is ITEC-telecom.com.co, to pass second =
address-switch, otherwise the call is reject.
The second address-switch asks for the =
user. If the=20
user is Mary, the call reach to the first time switch, otherwise the =
call is=20
reject.
The first time switch indicate that the =
user will=20
be localized since the 00:00:00 hours until 6 hours after in the Mary@IBM.com location.
If the local time is not accord =
with the time=20
established in the time-switch, the call will reach the second=20
time-switch.
The second time-switch indicate that =
the user will=20
be localized since the 06:00:00 hours until 12:00:00 hours. If the local time is accord with this interval, =
the user will=20
be localized in the Mary12@Epson.com=20
location, otherwise the call will be reject.
The proxy action signalling has three =
outputs. The=20
busy and failure outputs correspond to the events: response 486 and 3xx=20
respectively in the SIP protocol, the noanswer output go to a subaction =
called=20
Mail, that contains a location node and a redirect action=20
signalling.
The cpl diagram and the xml code with =
its=20
respective dtd are attached.
I need to know if this design and if =
the xml code=20
are right.
Thanks in advance
Katherine Morera Olarte
Research =
Division ITEC-TELECOM Bogot=E1=20
Colombia
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From: "Katherine"
To: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Juan_Carlos_Monta=F1a?= ,
=?iso-8859-1?Q?Mauricio_Bola=F1os?= ,
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Subject: [IPTEL] Help of a service in cpl
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Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 11:05:19 -0500
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
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Hello all!
I'm trying to develop a service of user location using CPL in a =
networking architecture SIP. I'm not expert in CPL and for this reason I =
need help to correct a script for the xml code.
The service of intelligent user location has, such as final goal, to =
give the user the posibility of others users to localize him/her in =
different places depending of the hours during the day, for example, in =
the case Mary wants to be localized since 00:00:00 hours until 06:00:00 =
in the Mary@IBM.com location and since 18:00:00 until 12:00:00 in the =
Mary12@Epson.com location.=20
The explanation of my design is as follow:
The first address-switch asks for the host where reside the service. If =
the domain is ITEC-telecom.com.co, to pass second address-switch, =
otherwise the call is reject.=20
=20
The second address-switch asks for the user. If the user is Mary, the =
call reach to the first time switch, otherwise the call is reject.
The first time switch indicate that the user will be localized since the =
00:00:00 hours until 6 hours after in the Mary@IBM.com location.=20
If the local time is not accord with the time established in the =
time-switch, the call will reach the second time-switch.
The second time-switch indicate that the user will be localized since =
the 06:00:00 hours until 12:00:00 hours. If the local time is accord =
with this interval, the user will be localized in the Mary12@Epson.com =
location, otherwise the call will be reject.
The proxy action signalling has three outputs. The busy and failure =
outputs correspond to the events: response 486 and 3xx respectively in =
the SIP protocol, the noanswer output go to a subaction called Mail, =
that contains a location node and a redirect action signalling.
The cpl diagram and the xml code with its respective dtd are attached.
I need to know if this design and if the xml code are right.
=20
Thanks in advance
=20
Katherine Morera Olarte
Research Division
ITEC-TELECOM
Bogot=E1 Colombia
http://itec.telecom-co.net
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charset="iso-8859-1"
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Hello all!
I'm trying to develop a service of =
user=20
location using CPL in a networking architecture SIP. I'm not expert in =
CPL and=20
for this reason I need help to correct a script for the xml =
code.
The service of intelligent user =
location has, such=20
as final goal, to give the user the posibility of others users to =
localize=20
him/her in different places depending of the hours during the day, for =
example,=20
in the case Mary wants to be localized since 00:00:00 hours until =
06:00:00 in=20
the Mary@IBM.com location and since =
18:00:00=20
until 12:00:00 in the Mary12@Epson.com=20
location.
The explanation of my design is as=20
follow:
The first address-switch asks for the =
host where=20
reside the service. If the domain is ITEC-telecom.com.co, to pass second =
address-switch, otherwise the call is reject.
The second address-switch asks for the =
user. If the=20
user is Mary, the call reach to the first time switch, otherwise the =
call is=20
reject.
The first time switch indicate that the =
user will=20
be localized since the 00:00:00 hours until 6 hours after in the Mary@IBM.com location.
If the local time is not accord =
with the time=20
established in the time-switch, the call will reach the second=20
time-switch.
The second time-switch indicate that =
the user will=20
be localized since the 06:00:00 hours until 12:00:00 hours. If the local time is accord with this interval, =
the user will=20
be localized in the Mary12@Epson.com=20
location, otherwise the call will be reject.
The proxy action signalling has three =
outputs. The=20
busy and failure outputs correspond to the events: response 486 and 3xx=20
respectively in the SIP protocol, the noanswer output go to a subaction =
called=20
Mail, that contains a location node and a redirect action=20
signalling.
The cpl diagram and the xml code with =
its=20
respective dtd are attached.
I need to know if this design and if =
the xml code=20
are right.
Thanks in advance
Katherine Morera Olarte
Research =
Division ITEC-TELECOM Bogot=E1=20
Colombia
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From iptel-admin@lists.bell-labs.com Sat Mar 17 18:33:04 2001
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Subject: [IPTEL] draft of new charter proposal
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Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2001 18:34:25 -0500
Folks,
One of the items on our agenda Monday is the discussion of the new charter.
To facilitate the discussion, the proposed charter is enclosed here for your
perusal. Comments received from some folks who saw an early version of this
was that there was interest in owning the tel URL, and specifying some
extensions to it (James' LNP and freephone extensions), and moving it to
draft.
Comments welcome.
Thanks,
JOnathan R.
IP Telephony (iptel) Working Group
Chair:
Jonathan Rosenberg
Transport Area Directors:
Scott Bradner
Allison Mankin
Transport Area Advisor:
Scott Bradner
Description
The focus of the IP Telephony (iptel) group is on the problems related
to propagation of routing information for VoIP
protocols. Specifically, both SIP and H.323 have the notion of
signaling intermediaries (proxies in SIP and gatekeepers in
H.323). When these devices receive call establishment messages, they
must make a routing decision on where to forward the call setup
messages.
The iptel group has already defined a protocol, Telephony Routing over
IP (TRIP), which solves one aspect of this problem. Specifically, it
handles the case where calls need to be routed between providers. It
allows for the exchange of routing information between these
providers, so that policies can be applied to the resulting data to
create a forwarding information base.
However, this protocol does not address all the scenarios of route
information exchange between servers. The group will therefore
generate several additional documents that cover cases that are not
handled by TRIP. The first document is an informational framework and
requirements RFC that discusses these various route exchange cases -
specifically, intra-domain route propagation, gateway to server route
exchange (also known as gateway registrations), and service
routing. This document will discuss a framework for how these pieces
fit together, and fit with the existing TRIP framework, and will also
define requirements for protocols to address these additional
cases. An analysis of the security requirements for these scenarios
will also be part of the document.
The group will also specify a standards track protocol (most likely a
set of new attributes and usage case for TRIP) for the gateway
registration scenario. This case is the most well understood and also
in the most urgent need of standardization; proprietary solutions are
beginning to get deployed, and these solutions are both
architecturally unsound and not interoperable.
The group will generate a
MIB document for TRIP, and will generate a guidelines document that
elaborates on typical configuration and policy setups for proper usage
of TRIP. Note that the group is not working on elevating TRIP to Draft
Standard at this time.
Deliverables:
1. A Proposed Standard TRIP MIB specification, based heavily on the
existing BGP-4 MIB documents.
2. A TRIP Usage Guidelines BCP RFC
3. A VoIP Route Exchange Framework and Requirements document, to be
published as an Informational RFC
4. A proposed standard RFC for gateway to server route exchange.
Milestones:
Sep 01 : Gateway to Server Route Exchange document submitted to IESG
for consideration as proposed standard.
Sep 01: VoIP Route Exchange Framework and Requirements document
submitted to IESG for consideration as Informational RFC
Dec 01: TRIP MIB Document submitted to IESG for consideration as
proposed standard
Feb 02: TRIP Usage Guidelines Document submitted to IESG for consideration
as BCP
---
Jonathan D. Rosenberg 72 Eagle Rock Ave.
Chief Scientist First Floor
dynamicsoft East Hanover, NJ 07936
jdrosen@dynamicsoft.com FAX: (973) 952-5050
http://www.cs.columbia.edu/~jdrosen PHONE: (973) 952-5000
http://www.dynamicsoft.com
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From iptel-admin@lists.bell-labs.com Sun Mar 18 10:41:34 2001
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Subject: [IPTEL] Call for Participation: Internet Telephony Workshop 2001 April 2/3
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Date: Sun, 18 Mar 2001 10:38:09 -0500 (EST)
Call for Participation
2nd IP Telephony Workshop
April 2-3, 2001 - Columbia University, New York City
http://www.fokus.gmd.de/events/iptel2001/
Objectives
----------
Internet telephony is rapidly evolving from research to design
and deployment. The IP Telephony Workshop aims at bringing together
researchers, developers, vendors and service providers active in this
area and stimulate discussion on innovation, research, implementation,
deployment experiences and future directions.
Scope & Topics
--------------
Original technical articles related to IP telephony will be presented,
on topics ranging from quality of service, voice measurements,
deployment experiences, accounting, security, service and feature
interaction. The keynote address will be given by Prof. Dave Farber
from the University of Pennsylvania.
Important Dates
---------------
Registration deadline March 23rd, 2001
Workshop April 2nd-3rd, 2001
iptel2001 Organizing Committee
------------------------------
Program Chair
H. Schulzrinne Columbia University
Program Committee
M. Arango Sun Microsystems
F. Baker Cisco
W. Bauerfeld T-Nova
G. Bond AT&T Research
S. Bradner Harvard University
G. Carle GMD FOKUS
J. Crowcroft UCL
C. Huitema Microsoft
G. S. Kuo National Central University, Taiwan
J. Kuthan GMD Fokus
T. Magedanz IKV++ GmbH
W. Marshall AT&T Research
D. Medhi University of Missouri-Kansas City
D. Oran Cisco
J. Ott University of Bremen
T. La Porta Bell Labs
B. Rosen Marconi
J. Rosenberg dynamicsoft
H. Sinnreich MCI WorldCom
R. Steinmetz Technical University of Darmstadt
H. Stüttgen NEC CCRLE
W. Wimmreuter Siemens
L. Wolf University of Karlsruhe
A. Wolisz Technical University of Berlin
Contact Address
---------------
Please send all your inquiries regarding iptel2001 to
iptel2001@egroups.com.
Registration
------------
The registration is now open. Participants are asked to register
in advance at
http://www.fokus.gmd.de/iptel2001/iptel2001/reg/
The registration deadline is March 23rd, 2001. See our registration
website for more details.
Accommodation
-------------
New York city offers many hotels in different price ranges. Our
accommodation web page contains pointers to some nearby hotels, however,
attendees are responsible for booking their own accommodation.
http://www.fokus.gmd.de/events/iptel2001/accommodation/
Exhibition
----------
To demonstrate how research and development become reality there will
be an exhibition co-located with the workshop. A limited number of teams
from industry as well as from academia and research will be given space to
present their software and hardware, both products and prototypes. If you
are interested in presenting your products or prototypes at iptel2001,
please send an e-mail to
iptel2001@egroups.com.
Please include a short description of what you plan to display and special
requirements if you have any. We will provide tables, power strips,
Ethernet/802.11b wireless Internet connectivity (no firewall/NAT) and
space for your booth if needed.
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From iptel-admin@lists.bell-labs.com Tue Mar 20 09:39:08 2001
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Subject: [IPTEL] Current thinking on CPL/iCalendar
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We talked about the CPL/iCalendar issue at the calsch dinner
tonight. The outcome (such as it is):
* Some of us, at least, like the idea of cutting back
iCalendar's RECUR semantics to match the CPL semantics (as I
described in the informal Draft I posted last Monday).
* The changes:
o In order to prevent overlapping instances, which
complicate evaluation:
+ Recurring events cannot have a DURATION over 24
hours.
+ The interval between instances must be less than
24 hours.
+ All the RECUR parameters for sub-day values (e.g.,
BYSEC, BYMIN, BYHOUR) are removed.
o COUNT and BYSETPOS are removed, so that you don't have
to step through the instances linearly in order to
evaluate the rule.
* Possible impact on existing (or potential) applications:
o No overlapping instances--can anybody provide a
plausible scenario where you'd want them?
o Unable to schedule sub-day recurrences--is this a
problem? They were apparently put in for people who
wanted to schedule bandwidth allocation at a very fine
granularity; is anybody still interested in this?
o COUNT can be replaced with UNTIL.
o BYSETPOS can be replaced with EXDATEs.
So. Please think it over so we can discuss it in the meeting
Wednesday. (If you're not here, it'd be helpful if you can post
before the meeting.)
--
/==============================================================\
|John Stracke | http://www.ecal.com |My opinions are my own.|
|Chief Scientist |=============================================|
|eCal Corp. |This space intentionally not left blank. |
|francis@ecal.com| |
\==============================================================/
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From iptel-admin@lists.bell-labs.com Tue Mar 20 09:42:19 2001
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From: David Madeo
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Organization: Morgan Stanley Dean Witter & Co.
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Subject: [IPTEL] Re: Current thinking on CPL/iCalendar
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John Stracke wrote:
> We talked about the CPL/iCalendar issue at the calsch dinner
> tonight. The outcome (such as it is):
>
> + The interval between instances must be less than
> 24 hours.
I'm assuming this is reversed and should be "more". Otherwise my
weekly meetings are going to be a bit difficult.
A counter example would be the pill that I have to take every four
hours.
> * Possible impact on existing (or potential) applications:
> o No overlapping instances--can anybody provide a
> plausible scenario where you'd want them?
Our training dept schedules multiple instances of the "same" class
which sometimes overlap. I could easily be swayed by the argument
that there should be multiple "threads" on a per instructor basis, or
perhaps by room. Just pointing out one possibility.
> o Unable to schedule sub-day recurrences--is this a
> problem? They were apparently put in for people who
> wanted to schedule bandwidth allocation at a very fine
> granularity; is anybody still interested in this?
My pill example
Wish I could be there...
dmadeo
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To: David Madeo , John Stracke
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Subject: [IPTEL] Re: Current thinking on CPL/iCalendar
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At 08.01 -0500 01-03-20, David Madeo wrote:
>John Stracke wrote:
>
>> We talked about the CPL/iCalendar issue at the calsch dinner
>> tonight. The outcome (such as it is):
>>
>> + The interval between instances must be less than
>> 24 hours.
>
>I'm assuming this is reversed and should be "more". Otherwise my
>weekly meetings are going to be a bit difficult.
>A counter example would be the pill that I have to take every four
>hours.
Question: Is not the requirement for O(1) that the interval between
events have to be longer than the length of the event itself?
I.e. removing support for sub-24h recurrances seems too arbitrary if
not really needed.
> > * Possible impact on existing (or potential) applications:
>> o No overlapping instances--can anybody provide a
>> plausible scenario where you'd want them?
>
>Our training dept schedules multiple instances of the "same" class
>which sometimes overlap. I could easily be swayed by the argument
>that there should be multiple "threads" on a per instructor basis, or
>perhaps by room. Just pointing out one possibility.
The need for non-overlapping events is the largest requirement for
O(1) isn't it?
Because of this I think it should be stated as the main goal for these changes.
paf
--
Patrik Fältström Internet Engineering Task Force
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From: Henning Schulzrinne