
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 09:42:55 +0900 (JST)
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From: Glenn Mansfield <glenn@aic.co.jp>
Subject: MADMAN Reactivation
To: madman@innosoft.com
Cc: NJAIN@us.oracle.com, S.Kille@isode.com, harald.t.alvestrand@uninett.no, 
    klensin@infoods.unu.edu, kostick@qsun.att.com
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Message-id: <9510300042.AA06561@aic-wide.aic.co.jp>
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Nothing has been heard on this list about reactivating MADMAN-wg
during the past month. Could somebody enlighten us on the planned
course of action, if there is any. I guess that left like this 
MADMAN will be in a permanent freeze.

If the reactivation is stalled due to the lack of a chairperson,
I dont quite undertand why we HAVE to look for a new chair-person.
Steve has shown good initiative in bringing the MADMAN documents 
to where they are and in attempting to restart the WG. Lets get
going ...

What do others think ?

Glenn


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Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 07:32:02 -0700 (PDT)
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From: Ned Freed <NED@innosoft.com>
Subject: Re: MADMAN Reactivation
In-reply-to: "Your message dated Mon, 30 Oct 1995 09:42:55 +0900 (JST)"
 <9510300042.AA06561@aic-wide.aic.co.jp>
To: Glenn Mansfield <glenn@aic.co.jp>
Cc: madman@innosoft.com, NJAIN@us.oracle.com, S.Kille@isode.com, 
    harald.t.alvestrand@uninett.no, klensin@infoods.unu.edu, 
    kostick@qsun.att.com
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> Nothing has been heard on this list about reactivating MADMAN-wg
> during the past month. Could somebody enlighten us on the planned
> course of action, if there is any. I guess that left like this
> MADMAN will be in a permanent freeze.

There has been considerable activity behind the scenes that didn't appear
on the list.

> If the reactivation is stalled due to the lack of a chairperson,
> I dont quite undertand why we HAVE to look for a new chair-person.
> Steve has shown good initiative in bringing the MADMAN documents
> to where they are and in attempting to restart the WG. Lets get
> going ...

> What do others think ?

I agree with you. As I have already pointed out in private mail, this is just a
reactivation of a WG, not the formation of a new WG. And this group has a
proven track record of being able to reach closure and produce documents that
are acceptable to the IESG in general and the management directorate in
particular. (In fact the documents I edit were accepted with no substantive
changes of any sort.) There are plenty of other WGs that could not say any of
this.

This should be all that matters. I think it is highly inappropriate to even be
considering a change of chairs at this point. The appropriate tool for
controlling the actions of the WG, assuming they need to be controlled, is the
specification of the agenda the WG is being reactivated to address.

If the agenda for the WG needs to be tight as hell to insure timely closure,
fine. If the agenda for the WG needs to prohibit certain changes or additions
to the documents, that's fine too. I'm all for timely closure and strict
limits on changes.

				Ned


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Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 07:55:02 -0800
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From: Edward Owens <edowens@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: MADMAN Reactivation
To: Glenn Mansfield <glenn@aic.co.jp>
To: madman@innosoft.com
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Glenn,
    I agree that MADMAN-wg needs to be reactivated and concur with 
Steve continuing as the chair.  The EMA Message Management Technical 
Sub-committee has based much of its work on a continuing vital MADMAN 
and would be disappointed should MADMAN go into a state of permanent 
freeze.  I hope that a meeting in Dallas can be arranged.

        Regards,
        Ed Owens 
>
>
>Nothing has been heard on this list about reactivating MADMAN-wg
>during the past month. Could somebody enlighten us on the planned
>course of action, if there is any. I guess that left like this 
>MADMAN will be in a permanent freeze.
>
>If the reactivation is stalled due to the lack of a chairperson,
>I dont quite undertand why we HAVE to look for a new chair-person.
>Steve has shown good initiative in bringing the MADMAN documents 
>to where they are and in attempting to restart the WG. Lets get
>going ...
>
>What do others think ?
>
>Glenn
>


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Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 08:43:10 -0700 (PDT)
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From: Ned Freed <NED@innosoft.com>
Subject: Re: MADMAN Reactivation
In-reply-to: "Your message dated Mon, 30 Oct 1995 07:55:02 -0800"
 <199510301555.HAA09712@ix10.ix.netcom.com>
To: edowens@ix.netcom.com
Cc: Glenn Mansfield <glenn@aic.co.jp>, madman@innosoft.com
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>     I agree that MADMAN-wg needs to be reactivated and concur with
> Steve continuing as the chair.  The EMA Message Management Technical
> Sub-committee has based much of its work on a continuing vital MADMAN
> and would be disappointed should MADMAN go into a state of permanent
> freeze.  I hope that a meeting in Dallas can be arranged.

Just FYI, a permanent freeze is NOT an option. Standards-track documents cannot
remain at proposed status forever. They have to stay at proposed for a minumum
of six months, but there's also a maximum time of (if memory serves) two years.
If the maximum is reached the document either has to recycle at proposed, move
to draft, or get relegated to historic. We obviously don't want the latter,
and it remains to be seen whether or not changes will necessitate a recycle
at proposed. I hope any changes we make are minor enough not to require
a recycle, but its not my call to make.

				Ned


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Resent-date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 18:15:29 -0800 (PST)
Date: Mon, 30 Oct 1995 09:21:00 -0500 (EST)
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From: Brian Kress <BrianK@linkage.com>
Subject: RE: MADMAN Reactivation
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I am supportive of Steve as chair-person.
 ----------
From: ~ned+madman-errors
To: madman
Cc: NJAIN; S.Kille; harald.t.alvestrand; klensin; kostick
Subject: MADMAN Reactivation
Date: Monday, October 30, 1995 9:42AM


Nothing has been heard on this list about reactivating MADMAN-wg
during the past month. Could somebody enlighten us on the planned
course of action, if there is any. I guess that left like this
MADMAN will be in a permanent freeze.

If the reactivation is stalled due to the lack of a chairperson,
I dont quite undertand why we HAVE to look for a new chair-person.
Steve has shown good initiative in bringing the MADMAN documents
to where they are and in attempting to restart the WG. Lets get
going ...

What do others think ?

Glenn